appreciate you! a lot of work goes into this type of stuff by so many people not just me, just knowing some ppl like it is huge!

You mean the ones doing less and less dps that no1 will play rite? :D

appreciate the comment! I literally added it at the end as a hey I wanna remind you because a lot of hunters either don't know or forgot this!

@@Naturetvz sharpening over shadow oil??

@@BiggZigg your offhand deals 50% of its dmg baseline. that is increased to 75% of baseline with dw rune. sharpening stone is subject to the dmg reduction of that offhand and also ofc to the reductions of high armor targets. shadow oil doesnt suffer many of these disadvantages and thus comes ahead in gnomer.

this is true, great comment.

great question, you can parse at least a 90 w/ wsg Revere'd wpns as your main hand, although the change normalizes for raptor strike, a slower main hand is still amazing for other reasons like your flanking strike. make sure as melee on single target you prio, RS then FS then Wing clip, but you must have other things like Windfury to actually parse as melee - also make sure you're BM spec like in the guide and have your pet w/ top tank skills and attacking when you do. one of the biggest mistakes I see w/ this question is hunters using shaprening stone or other buffs on their main hand which cancels out windfury or strikes buffs for melee - if for some reason this info does not help link logs and i'll deep dive it1

@@Naturetvz thanks for the info. I think my issue is not spamming raptor strike enough. You think it’s worth getting WSG main hand over UltraSonic Vibroblade?

only LB

Does this factor in the debuff from MH fist and druid/shaman aswell?

Yes. However I then turned off both the fist debuff and druid's dreamstate, while still keeping all armor debuffs (so all WS advantages gone, all Cat advantages On) the WS still deals more damage to Mech bosses, this time +7.3dps instead of +25dps. That translates to +1.3% total dmg, so it would still be the best choice for the raid, altough by so little that now it's truly up to preference, given you don't have epic fist or a shaman or a druid. @@minalaminala141

​@@minalaminala141Yes im pretty sure its only better if you have those buffs

yes there are sims out for all of these scenarios wowsims.github.io/sod/hunter/

great comment this is so true! my video was based on avg dps and avg armor values. - hunters take note if you really want to top parse the high armor bosses WS would outshine.

WS actually engages slower bc it only has dive one. You still want windserpent to go immediately into melee to start to get melee attacks as well as the lbs.

Sorry for the confusion. There is a 20 dps difference because the 2nd build your not using a pet and using lone wolf and carve. The 2nd build is more dps but requires another hunter or pally to provide you with lion/kings

@@LilNaturez i know. Tho the first representation of the SV builds we're without the runes thats why i'm confused. I'm aware of the dps difference between the runes but that was not my point. Anyway, thanks for the response and keep up the good work, peace!

The pets AP scales of your own ranged AP, thats why you would want to use Aspect of the hawk. But the points in talent does nothing other then up your own crit chance on ranged attacks, wich in Gnomer does not really make any dps difference as you never leave melee on bosses.

well for pve as a melee hunter there's no other points in the first two tiers that would add more dmg. there is a window where you may need to do ranged and it may proc. it's rare and for a melee hunter not that important, but it's more dmg than 0 even for a melee hunter while the other talents are 0 hopefully this helps! great comment.

@Naturetvz as a melee hunter, I find it beneficial to just dump 5 tp into increasing my pets health for the fact that when I do pew pew, it's to kill off running mobs/foes and won't go ranged for anything else. But for the weapon MH, go sword of omen now?

@emilmotren9797 is it a hidden mechanic? When I go into the aspect of the hawk in the pet tab, I see no increase in dmg. I'll test the dps with and without it. Been running as monkey.

@@jsoska88 if you have wild strikes or windfury, you still want a big hitter mainhand with large top end. if you dont, i guess you dont. go crazy. buy that 1.7 mainhand epic from the ah that lowers targets armor by an additional 100 and prevents invis. I dont know if thats a good idea, but someone has to try it out, why not you.

Claw, bite, dash and growl for solo

You want Bite / Claw / Dash active on cat Technically pre casting dash 5 seconds before a pull is BiS while priority casting Bite then only doing claw to dump the Xtra focus is BiS the dmg increase is very minimal so Most hunters just have all 3 on auto cast

And have a boomy in raid to increase its nature dmg.

this is true, now in my video i was basing off BIS which had me using the fist weapons, but should be noted for sure. GREAT comment

no, it is not, as the entire point of the changes that happened right before this video is to normalize weapon speed. Electrocutioners now hits as if its speed were 2.4, and so does vanquishers. ALL that matters now is the dps/stats. electrocutioners is far higher dps, and the proc equates to about the dps of the stats on vanqs. so electrocutioners is far better, and it doesnt matter which hand you have which weapon in anymore really. (only very slightly matters for flanking), but thats pretty negligent.

Flanking strike as an ability causes your pet to do an extra melee attack, a melee attack on a slower pet does more dmg than on a faster pet. Although pet attack speed is also normalized, the free attack from flanking strike currently is not.

great question, in our BIS rotation we are standing behing a mob and it is not targeting us so we should never be able to dodge to proc mongoose. There's a rare exception if we have multiple mobs and one of the mobs is hitting us while we target another, then u could use mongoose if it proc's however it's only 20 more dmg than Wing Clip anyway... So in reality you're just hitting wing clip since you shouldn't have mongoose up and the only reason you wing clip is as a filler, so why not it's xtra, and it could proc wind fury.

pet damage scales with your ranged attack power. So increasing that makes it so your pet does more damage

Per sims in his gear they would be wrong Bonk gloves are 1 dps more in full bis key word though you do need bis which has both fist weapons

@LilNaturez 1DPS? Damn that's nothing. Heard alot of people saying Machinists are the go to after the nerf idk. Guess the hunter discord was wrong.

I'm assuming it's if you need to flex to ranged. I personally just spend those points to make my pet tankier

Please tell me you're not using viper full time

😂 u gimping your damage by 10% if u using viper none stop use hawk to get a few more ap for your pet worth the global to get the damage and if u do have to shoot something u get more damage. The boss that throws static on you for example u can get away from melee and still do dps

Beast although rare are present in Gnomer for example the first boss with potential cleave. Since none of the other talent points add any dps value while monster slaying adds more than 0 that’s what makes it BiS

yeah when raptor strike is SO good, it absolutely makes sense to have improved raptor strike however at lvl 40 we sacrifice the end talents which are basically waited to be super strong. Great comment!

You might be able to item restore it

There is a restore feature for deleted or vendored items, I believe within 30 days.

Just get the shank from Uldaman.

interesting, can you show logs to confirm this?

ive heard 4/5 not 3/5

clearly that would be dependend on the atk speed of the pet. slower pets would require more points, faster pets less points. 2.0 is the meta because of FS, so i guess a 4/5 is the minimum.

Here’s the thing there’s no other talent points that add dmg at all. So you go 5/5 in order to reduce RNG and potential downtime especially on pull. Since 5/5 although only adds a very small amount of Dps it’s more than 0 while any other talents add 0 dps it makes it bis for PvE

I actually went over this in my last guide it’s literally just something hunters like to say to feel smart while actually it is a guaranteed Net DpS loss

pendulum of doom is great, w/ the raptor strike nerf it will be normalized to 3.3 AS for raptor strike however with something like flanking strike this item hits hard AF

Because dw raptor strike do 2 raptor strike for each hand, the total dmg of one dw rs is mh dmg + 80+ oh dmg + 60. And 2h rs is 2h dmg +80. So as long as mh dmg + oh dmg +60>2h dmg, it always be dw rs with more dmg. Only difference is flanking strike hits harder with a 2h. I can crit fs for 500 with ravager.

this is true, am I personally picking Pendulum over let's say WSG revered sword + Vanquishers sword, no@@tokopaaisen2927

@@tokopaaisen2927 its not that simple ... you use a rune slot more with dw you have a fire trap filler every 15 sec and wf + flanking hits harder with 2h some sims say 2h is actually on same lvl as dw

@@ItVex it’s really depends on rng. I have wsg + rfd swords, if I use ravager it’s like 1000dmg less within 15sec window assume no off cd proc. With p doom, it gets very close. Like 100dmg less than dw. But I only did an estimation, didnt go to detail

Hawk. This gives ranged AP which gives your pet more dmg.

how does this give ur pet more damage? It's ranged attack and even if it procs and I check my pet AP it doesn't increase I never understand this@@LilNaturez

Yes I calculated it myself using the top hunter's damage on WCL at the time (raptor strike 52% of his overall damage) so on say 500dps 500/100 = 5 * 52 = 260dps by raptor, 260/100 = 2.6, 2.6 * 30 = 78, 78:500*100 = (78*100):500 = 7800:500 = 15.6% dps loss

Although he was playing survival when I think about it so raptor will be a lower % of a BM hunter's damage.

please see, 12:15 in the video, I explain BM is currently top DPS post nerfs + that it's 20-40 dps over SV builds

it's a weird space in classic, ranged hunters have such a massive toolkit for pvp so if ranged hunters are viable in pve it's a space where other classes will need massive toolkit additions to be competative in pvp. - i'd assume as higher phases when other classes "catch up" you'll see ranged hunters also catch up. with that being said it's again a weird space and there has to be mechanics that make ranged hunters really really strong in pve that don't make them broken OP in pvp. Great comment, upvoted.

Hunters need to be reworked. Everything from gear to runes is a mess.

Yeah I'd much rather get the gun and MM honestly..

swingtimers live rent free in my mind. i hope melee is here to stay, but i also hope they bring lock n loaded for ranged sv or make mm better for the og hunter feel to please those players. im happy we are number 1 into the 70th %even after nerf. might be the last time. beign mid tier mm dps all of classic sucked tbh

Melee is the most fun I've had on a hunter in classic. Any proc based spec, dopamine hit when you get 3 raptor strikes while at 3 stacks. Feels good.

This is true it’s just not that relevant for Melee hunters since we should always have the 50 str proc bow equipped

So just play range. Nothing is stopping you. Range pumps good if you have the gnomer gun.

Range pump good Lol we are not playing the same version of the game. Maybe you are talking about WOTLK

​@@lfgubrs Range doesn't pump shit

Melee is really fun

Dude, bad fuckin' form on your part. If you have issues with this video, talk about the issues. But don't throw someone else's channel out there as an alternative. That's fucked up.