Ancient Mycenaean texts: “Zagreus, highest among the gods” Supergiant Games: *write that down, write that down!*

“Alexander the pretty alright” I’m fucking dying.

The cult of Dionysus was especially known for feeling devious, looking glamorous, getting mischievous, and polyamorous.

So, fun fact I just learned, apparently Dionysus is associated with the first recorded "He's right behind me, isn't he?" joke in history. In one of the many plays about Dionysus, there's a bit where Dionysus and a friend travel through the underworld and they talk about all the horrible monsters they could encounter. At one point, Dionysus's friend is describing a particularly horrible monster he doesn't want to meet and Dionysus starts acting like he's afraid of something off stage and the friend is like, "Oh, no! Please don't tell me that the monster is just over there now!"

Hera: "You, sir, are a drunkard." Dionysus: "And you, Hera, are unhappily married. But in the morning I'll be sober!"

"what does feral wildlife and crippling insanity have to do with a fine chardonnay?" Well, someone's *clearly* not going to the right parties

honestly, a characterization of dionysus where he is an outgoing party animal who's super chill most of the time but absolutely reminds you why he is technically a god of death and also of hallucinations when you fuck up sounds incredible. not only do you get a three dimensional character with a sense of mystery proper of a god, it also works as a reminder of both sides of drinking and partying.

Athena: Welcome to the Esoteric Birth Club! We got Aphrodite! Dionysus: Uh...where's everyone else? Athena: They were born the old fashioned way.

I kinda like the idea that Dionysus is still a god of death, madness, going to overthrow Zeus, all that stuff, BUT, he's drunk/hungover all the time and all the other Gods/Goddesses conspire to keep him that way because they're terrified of what he might be capable of if he ever sobered up.

"Also, Dionysus was a major cutie." Literally every male character you draw is.

I'm just imagining Dionysus sitting in camp half-blood, drinking diet coke and remembering the good old days where he had a literally insane cult

Another intriguing thing about Dionysus is his relationship with Ariadne. Whether he threatened Theseus to abandon her on Naxos or he just found her after Theseus abandoned her of his own volition (everyone has their own interpretation), one constant with retellings of how they met is that Dionysus absolutely _loved_ this girl. He loved her so much that it appears that this hedonistic god _became monogamous_ when he married her. He loved her so much that when she died (whether it be suicide or murder, again based on interpretation) that he refused to let her stay dead. As in he went to the Underworld basically saying “Eff you, I’m taking my wife home” and just up and left with her. Oh, and he took his mom home with him for good measure too, and had them both turned into goddesses. Pretty heartwarming stuff.

"Alexander The Pretty Alright", that has to be the best comparable name ever.

So Dionysus is like snails or lobster: mostly for the poor people until someone rich and powerful noticed and wanted in

Fun fact: The game Hades actually acknowledges the connection between Zagreus and Dionysus by making it a joke that Zagreus and Dionysus play on Orpheus

i want a show with the three versions of dionysus as roommates. helenic dionysus as happy go lucky party boy, orphic dionysus as chaotic unhinged trickster, and mycenaean dionysus as a vaguely creepy but laid back dude.

Our theater teacher gave us 3 words to remember this guy: The God of Sex, Drugs, and Rock n Roll

He’s feeling devious he’s looking glamorous

Dionysus: *casually turns his kidnappers insane via loud flutes and snakes* Also dionysus: "this grape juice is very strong"

One of my favorite Dionysus quotes is from PJO, when he tries to pour himself a glass of wine but it turns into water mid-pour, as an effect of his exile from Olympus to CHB. He says “y’know, the Christians have a guy that can do this in reverse. Now THATS A god!”

Also, just to add that Dionysus, god of wine, madness and parties still has a more loving and functional marriage than Zeus. 😌

I like to think that Dionysus was raised by all those gods/titans/mortals you mentioned, and they had to keep passing him around because Hera was constantly going door to door looking for him. I picture it like a screwball comedy where he's always just barely ahead of her.

The fact Dionysus had a femboy phase is probably my absolute favorite detail in all the greek mythology

01:21 It's so funny to imagine Dionysus and Athena bonding over the fact that both of them were born from one of Zeus body parts

Hellenized Dionysus: Adorable babbu; must protect. Desire to cuddle. Orphic Dionysus: Hot damn, take me now. 10/10 would let do horrible things to me

So,basically,he was a good child,went through an emo phase,and is now a hippie? Sweet

"Closing Time" is actually PERFECT for Dionysus because although it's ostensibly a song about drunk people leaving a bar, it's actually a metaphor for birth. Lines such as "time for you to go out to the places you will be from," and "every new beginning comes from some other beginning's end," imply that the bar patrons are children going out into the real world for the first time.

I feel like this should make Zagreus and Dionysus total bros. I feel like that's a promising friendship, the extreme extrovert who loves partying and the quiet kid who doesn't know how to handle gatherings larger than just him and his parents and also their trusty dog Spot.

I like to think Dionysus is just as angry and powerful as he always has been, but only when he's sober.

"Orphic Dionysus is the son of Persephone and Zeus" Throws up in mouth.

I like to think that if Dionysus' title of God of Madness was more renowned than God of Wine, he might have taken up that scary villain image that Hades was popular for. I mean when you think about him in the Bacchae, he desires his place of worship, makes certain people insane, and has them gruesomely tear his offender apart. And his art of making wine could have also been adapted as the art of chemistry in the area of hallucinogenic drugs. And he did not originally have a place in the Pantheon. He could have been Disney's Hercules' villain rather than Hades.

This actually made me appreciate Percy Jackson even MORE. I had always thought of him as Wine first with some cool madness wild cuz parties. It didn't really occur to me that the insanity and vindictive nature came first, then the wine. Which if you read the PJO books, Mr D comes across as a being who's really very spiteful with hints of true and unsettling power, but then it comes back to him not being able to drink anymore. It's the difference between "party god is grumpy cuz no party anymore" and "someone who is very capable of being vindictive, brutal, and unpredictable but is mostly just grumpy these days because of the universe's worst hangover"

Okay but is he feeling devious, looking glamorous, and getting mischievous and polyamorous???

So basically Dionysus grew backwards, from "mature looking" edgy and moody teenager with destructive powers to "young looking" chill and party animal adult with destructive powers.

I like how HADES not only jokes about Zagreus and Dionysus being the same person, but also establishes the two as different aspects of the myths. Dionysus is just the god of wine but Zagreus is the one who becomes the god of rebirth

One more thing I fucking love how you're against painting a "one true' narrative. Its so refreshing and informative. The idea of a bunch of different narratives syncretizing and evolving and branching is so much more interesting anyways dont you think.

Damn, Dionysus aged like fine wine. He progressively kept getting younger than his previous selves

Headcanon: Mycenaean Dionysus dies, becomes Orphic Dionysus. Orphic Dionysus dies, becomes Hellenistic Dionysus. Fits with his whole death/rebirth thang.

Things I learned from this video 1. Zagreus in the game Hades is actually based of something and wasnt made up for the game. 2. Dionysus' portrayal in PJO is hilarious. It makes sense hes a grumpy old man given that in the series, the gods appearance represents their mental state, but still.

Dionysus is the Greek ‘Crouching Moron, Hidden Badass’ trope which I think is very neat

I would love to see a modern take on Dionysus that leans more into him being a terrifying god of madness and insanity.

This makes me recall this one moment in the Percy Jackson books where Percy says something really antagonistic to Dionysus and the god turns around, there’s purple fire in his eyes and Percy sees visions that make him suddenly remember that Dionysus’ trait as a god of madness is a lot scarier than the trait of grumpy alcoholic that Percy has been envisioning him as for three books.

Dionysus often went far afield, or as it is also referred to, he had a tendency to Zigreus when he should Zagreus.

As someone who has Dionysus as a profile picture, I am a large fan of the bisexual grape man. Also, good for Dionysus taking out unsavory sailors.

I love how someone said they like to think Dionysus was raised by a big group of gods. I can just imagine Hades being like "But he's so cute and funny! Can't we keep him for another century?" and Persephone just sighs like "No, Hades. I know he's adorable, but Hera is literally fighting Cerberus as we speak-"

"God of Wine" seems more like an honorary title so that Zeus doesn't have to admit Dionysus is essentially the ultimate town drunk who won't leave.

Quick note: I'm sure you've heard the phrase "dead drunk." That's the cthonic connection. Blackouts are super scary. And since death=scary, that would be the reason that Dionysus/Zagreus wasn't really so much worshiped as dreaded in early times, so you just didn't talk about it. Or write it down. Still, there's the whole tune in/turn on/drop out thing going on throughout this era, and a bunch of people ignoring social norms and getting together to get drunk and talk about stuff during mystery rites, so I can kind of see "dude, what if Dionysus is actually this, like, really cool guy who gets drunk and parties instead of this super scary god of life, sacrifice and rebirth stuff!" Of course, since the kids are continuing to shake up the status quo, every priest and his brother attempts to quell the cult, but the party doesn't stop, and here we are with Dionysus today.

I find it strangely tempting to re-interpret Dionysus as a lovecraftian being. "Then the liberated Old Ones would teach them new ways to shout and kill and revel and enjoy themselves, and all the earth would flame with a holocaust of ecstasy and freedom."

I’m feeling devious, You’re looking glamorous, Let’s get mischievous, And polyamorous. Wine and women and wonderful vices, Welcome to the cult of Dionysus

"Dumb War God- Smart War God" *Athena is just Ares but with braincells change my mind*

Other Olympians: *having a serious discussion about Olympian stuff* Dionysus: *stumbling in drunk and high as hell, while also recovering from a hangover the night before*

I really like the Bacchae Dionysus for some reason. He’s chaotic, powerful, and has horns, but also is young. I also like the madness stuff.

"Why did he transition so late?" Oh honey, it happens to the best of us

Nobody is goona talk about how DIONYSUS IS A FAITHFUL HUSBAND?? TO ARIADNE?? AFTER UPSETTING HER?? THAT ALL OF THE OFFSPRING HE HAS MAJORITY CAME FROM HER??

Poesidon became a great example of "boss when you have to fight them" and "boss when they become playable"

Can’t believe Dionysus was a Lovecraftian deity this whole time

“Woah, Dionysus, the ‘70’s called, they want to know if they can borrow some of your stash.” I imagine you might want to specify which ‘70’s you’re referring to, Dionysus has probably experienced hundreds of 7th decades at this point.

SCP Foundation: “Oh man there’s no canon it’s sooo cool and unique!” Greek Theologians: “Hold my wine.”

I love that when she brings up Alexander the Great, she says “Alexander the pretty alright.” I just love her spirit. 😂

Persephone: (Has a son with her dad) This feels wrong for some reason. Also Persephone: (Has a son with her uncle) Ooh, that's better.

Learning that Zagreus isn't an OC and the people behind the game Hades did their homework. The whole death and rebirth associated with Zagreus/Orphic Dionysus works so well in a roguelike

The entire thing about the wine cult likely being as old as wine itself is interesting, but I love how this could be interpreted as the MINUTE that wine is revealed to get people CRAZY drunk they decided "hey, we could make a religion out of this!" And thus Dionysus' cult was born

Somewhat terrified at the thought of a "progression" of the Greek Mythology where Zeus IS overthrown by his children, like a power play team up by Dionysus and Athena, and the new King of the Gods is lord of Madness, Death and just kick ass booze. Like, Greece would have devolved into a drunk orgy.

4 years later and still hoping we get that Bacchae video. As a huge Dionysus fan and theatre major, the Bacchae needs more coverage!! No rush tho, it wouldn’t matter if it doesn’t have your passion in it

"Turns men into Dolphins" You know.... after hearing how bad dolphins can be, I'm not surprised the Greeks thought this.

Dionysus born from Zeus leg Athena: Welcome to the club baby bro

Honestly, for as long as I knew about Dionysus, I never thought of him as just "the wine dude". I think it has a lot to do with the fact that I was introduced to Dionysus through Percy Jackson, which went out of its way to provide a more faithful portrayal of the gods, and as a result, included a lot of the lesser known elements of Dionysus' mythology, including the madness and the dolphins. That said, when Dionysus appears in Heroes of Olympus in his Roman form of Bacchus, he's much more the chill, hippie, party dude described here... which makes sense given the timeline of Greece to Rome.

So, uh, fun fact. In Ancient Greece, phallic wounds were tactfully referred to as “leg wounds” in public. So there is a non-zero chance that Zeus put fetus Dionysus there instead.

Soooo basically, he's actually not so much a god of drunkenness, and more a god of insanity, connected to wine through... well, the effects of being drunk or high. About right?

"I bet Frigg doesn't need to put up with this.." That, Hera, is one of the perks of being married to an absolute nerd

It occurs to me that there's another myth about Dionysus that lends even more Orphic connotations. When Ariadne dies, (and the stories vary as to how she does: in one version she's turned to stone by Perseus via Medusa's severed head and then shattered, in the Odyssey [book 11] it's said Artemis kills her, and there's also a story where she hangs herself, which has some spillover with Arachne and invokes some possible preponderance of weaving figure/goddess = suicide by hanging symbolism in Greek and related mythologies) Dionysus heads down into the Underworld, retrieves both her and Semele and makes them both Goddesses. I think there's even one version where Hades bids Dionysus to give something he truly loves if he really wants them back, and he obliges with a grapevine.

You know, the way hades looks at baby zagreus is just adorable.

Zeus: has affair with woman literally every other god: "oh lord, not again"

Holy fricking shiet. So Dionysus used to be a full blown lovecraftian god of madness, death, rebirth and intoxication to ascend to a higher state of existence. And eventually became the cute drunkard boy who would occassionally cause mass chaos and insanity. I didn't expect this, wow.

13:39 Dionysus' thinking: they don't believe I'm a God-?! Time to make some b*tches see sounds and hear colors We love Dionysus

Hades's exploding from baby cuteness face never fails to make my day

Hermes, raising Dionysus: I'm about to start this kid's whole career.

"Do you like men or woman?" Athena: "I like war!" "Ya but what turns you on?" Athena: "Battle!" "Right but what does it take to get under your toga?" Athena: "Victory..."

It's interesting to think Dionysus, in some form, was son of Persephone, since both of them are deities wich control plants.

Speaking about that Frigg line yes Odin has had many affairs with other women but she seems to treat their marriage as open since Frigg herself is said to have affairs when her husband is away. She never goes after her stepchildren including Thor who is her husband's most famous child, but then again Thor was from a former marriage but the others were from affairs he had after they married. Seriously, I could see Frigg react to Hera's outrage on her husband's bastards as being overboard saying everybody has their needs as long as it's consensual. She even talks about times she's banged including her own brother in laws. Although I do think she would raise an eyebrow about Hera punishing those raped by Zeus, because in contrast the Norse pantheon punished Odin when he resorted to rape to conceive a child that would avenge Baldur. You know as much as Frigg and Hera are supposed to be counterparts they really could be so opposite. The only time she's vengeful is if you messed with her child like Loki did but she also showed a cruel streak by taking it out on his youngest sons, Vali and Narvi.

There's a game called Hades where you play as the God Zagreus, and a hilarious nod to the Zag/Diyonsus lack of continuity where you can actually trick the court musician Orpheus into thinking the two gods were one and the same. Lol

"STOP THAT THIS INSTANT" "SHAN'T" this just looks like the perfect drunk response. Don't know why. It just does.

You know, despite you talking about the Greek Gods and their heinous acts, you drawing them like that is surprisingly wholesome. Like I can't stop smiling.

funny thing i like: in hades there’s a little subplot with orpheus where zagreus keeps telling him more and more outrageous stories to sing about. first one is a prank thought up by Dionysus where zag tells orpheus that he and dionysus are actually related - maybe even the same god entirely! i thought that was funny as hell considering the possible connection between the two irl

I’d like to think that Dionysus was raised from being fostered by Rea, Hermes, AND Persephone + Hades because he’s a good husband. Persephone gets him from Monday-Wednesday, Hermes gets him for the rest of the weekdays and Rea takes him in for the weekend. Having godly connections would be lit as your local illegitimate child.

It's also worth mentioning that Dionysus spared one of the dudes on the boat because he immediately realized he was a god and was trying to get the other crewmen to set him free.

I know it's very after the fact at this point, but coming into this video after playing Hades and learning about the evolution of Dionysus, I LOVE how Supergiant was able to tie Zagreus and Dionysus together by playing on their confusing origin stories but ALSO by playing on the parallels of wine and blood. And the "Dionysus as a god of death and rebirth" coinciding with Zagreus' being reborn from a pool of blood every time he respawns just evokes the same image of Dionysus waking up in a pool of wine. It's just wonderfully evocative, and everything you go into here with Zagreus as a potential origin point of Dionysus just plays perfectly with the game's portrayal of the divide between the chthonic and Olympian gods. I'm just a huge fan of what you're doing. ^_^

The whole, ‘a society ostracizes a specific religion due to them appealing to other ostracized peoples before fully embracing said religion and causing it to spread like wild fire’ concept draws a weird connection between Christianity in Rome and Dionysus’s Cult in Greece that I didn’t realize until now

From terrifying monster to cute party guy... Dionysus was just the vampire of ancient times

Can we just take a moment to admire how beautiful and aesthetically pleasing Orphic Dionysus's design is?

I love how they drew hades as excited about his kid.

7:05 This really explains the song Hymn to Zagerus that we hear Orpheus sing in the Hades game. The line "Born to Zeus has a serpent" would refer to the fact that Zeus once slept with Persephone as a serpent (resulting in the birth of Orphic Dionysus). Zagerus (the protagonist) is the son of Hades and Persephone. Either way, Hera doesn't approve wich ties in with the lines "In spite of Queen Hera, Zagreus came" "Torn to shreds by the Titans, devoured in pieces, from his heart aflame the seed of Dionysus grew, the God of wine and feast anew" would also tie in nicely with Hera's revenge plot and the heart thing.

Persephone’s reactions are priceless, also hades geeking out over being a new dad is adorable

Hellenized Dionysus: "I'll have her home by 8.00, sir!" Orphic Dionysus: "You're daughter calls me Daddy, now." 🤣

Istg explaining greek mythology sometimes feels like a breakdown of the differences in characters across peoples fanfics of them. "In this one hes more emo whereas here hes got no mullet. This one however sucks because it doesn't even feel like the same character, the writer did an awful job encapsulating his essence"

Another interesting thing about Orphism is that orphism included a belief in reincarnation: if you did certain things and performed certain rights, you could reincarnate into a chosen form and return to the land of the living instead of going to a bleak underworld or being made to reincarnate into a form that was undesired. Dionysus has the epitaph "twice born": he died and came back to life after being ritually shreaded by the titans.

Is it just me or are the older versions of Dionysus with horns, madness power and underworld connection a lot cooler than drunk, party-animal Dionysus

Sheogorath: CHEESE! FOR EVERYONE! Dionysus: WINE! FOR EVERYONE! they look at each other and hug:

No need to worry about the song during the end credits, I actually like the chill vibe you created with it, even if it was unintentional.

Why do I love the idea of a god being older than its widely known mythology It makes me sad (because we might never know the extremely true and original version/origin) but it’s also so fascinating