www.squarespace.com/rogue to save 10% off your first purchase of a website or domain using code ROGUE ⸺ chapters ⸺⸺⸺⸺⸺⸺⸺⸺ 0:00 - The Callous Daoboys grace us! 0:58 - Mathcore = Math rock + hardcore 1:56 - 4/4 and 3/4 times 3:56 - Changing time signatures mid-song 5:17 - Visualizing 4/4 6:21 - 5/4 and 6/4 times 7:44 - 7/8 time 9:23 - "People wanna hear s*** that sounds cool" 10:20 - Changing times and 9/8 12:35 - Quiz! "Blackberry DeLorean" 15:05 - Quiz! "Beautiful Dude Missile" 16:47 - What album should people start with? 18:05 - squarespace.com/rogue for 10% off 18:56 - cta + bonus clip "normal music, huh?" ⸺ support us ⸺⸺⸺⸺⸺⸺⸺⸺ Directly fund the show through our Patreon! patreon.com/modernrogue You can also get Modern Rogue shirts through our shop. scamstuff.com/products/mr-shirts Need a new computer? You can get a discount by getting one from Doghouse Systems and it helps us too! doghousesystems.com/rogue Use promo code “ROGUE” and get a free 500gb SSD now! See the full credits and links in the description.
@1218Draco Жыл бұрын
Favorite mathematic rock song is “Frame by Frame” by King Crimson. The guitar riff is done by two players, one in 7/8 the other in 13/8, so it’s like a delaying echo as they go around and then synchronize.
@TheCorruptionKing Жыл бұрын
Episode idea...find "The anarchist cook book". An episode about it, and then yall could try some ideas from the book.
@NeverDieAloneMusic Жыл бұрын
15 years?! Has it really been that long since Scam School?! Damn I'm old lol.
@ephemeric8937 Жыл бұрын
Daoboys been putting out banger after banger for years now. I'm surprised and glad you got them on the show
@ModernRogue Жыл бұрын
Daoboys are amazing!!
@NateFrisk Жыл бұрын
As a musician, hearing Brian say "3/3 time" was viscerally painful
@timg335 Жыл бұрын
3 third notes...
@Ramonatho Жыл бұрын
Alternative you can subdivide it as 12 sublets per 3 quarter notes if you wanna get really stupid with it
@Aksel27 Жыл бұрын
I guess it would just be measure of triplets? Sorry, "third notes".
@josephrumbaugh671 Жыл бұрын
Wow thanks for the disclaimer lmaoooo
@thisiscait Жыл бұрын
As a fellow muso and composer... I don't care! Enjoy it. Anyone who doesn't play or create music doesn't really need to know.
@gapingshanus Жыл бұрын
Mathcore is jazz for metal heads. Edit: didn't know they were gonna reference jazz in the video, but right on
@killerkonnat Жыл бұрын
Anything "core" is not for metalheads.
@spartansquid5931 Жыл бұрын
@@killerkonnat Bull, there's some good core stuff that's pretty heavy. Bleed From Within for example.
@f6773911 ай бұрын
most people who listen to metal also listen to hardcore you goof stop acting like they're exclusive clubs lmao@@killerkonnat
@hereticdeth79863 ай бұрын
This genre is more like jazz for hardcore kids
@anotherstupidhipster3551 Жыл бұрын
This wasn't the crossover I expected, but I'm so happy for it.
@The_Other_Ghost Жыл бұрын
I was assuming that this was a tech gadget or something named after the type of music.
@freshtildeathproductions3718 Жыл бұрын
I thought I was a fever dream when I came across it in the middle of the night.
@SaltNBattery Жыл бұрын
Oh... This is what happens when hipsters gentrify hardcore?.. Interesting. I was more into the Norma Jean, Comback Kid, ETID, AILD, The Warriors, Donnybrook early to mid 2000’s hardcore. I guess the "ironic hardcore" came after my time?
@The_Other_Ghost Жыл бұрын
@@SaltNBattery Or just people like Botch trying to make it harder to dance to (If I remember correctly) or something.Who cares where they get their coffee, it's music. I've met all sorts of people in the HC scene, it's people who are gatekeepers that can kill the mood, don't be that guy.
@anotherstupidhipster3551 Жыл бұрын
@@SaltNBattery I've got all those bands t-shirts too, dude. Been in this game since I was a little little kid. Don't be an old-head, embrace change.
@noesunyoutuber7680 Жыл бұрын
The Modern Rogue and The Callous Daoboys is not a crossover I expected to happen. As someone who's generally not a maker of improvised weapons or avid survivalist, I'm not used to TMR talking about things I actually have some prior knowledge about.
@sorandom081 Жыл бұрын
It's a crime how you two don't pop up on my front page anymore! I thought that you guys stopped making videos or something! Now I know to come directly to the source! Keep up the great work guys!
@ModernRogue Жыл бұрын
Thanks man! -Brian
@jamesmccann8506 Жыл бұрын
@@ModernRogue Yeah, that's been happening to me to, and not just for you guys. Seems my subscriptions are just spamming me with shorts - i see plenty of them on my feed, but i prefer the longer videos to be honest.
@rexromana Жыл бұрын
Same, had too look em up
@jetardeshna3449 Жыл бұрын
Never expected Danny Carey and Hatebreed on a Modern Rogue show. Absolutely love it. Do more!
@channtasticАй бұрын
Hatebreed is S tier
@Motsham Жыл бұрын
Correction: The dude said Hardcore was a subgenre of metal but it is in fact a subgenre of punk. Two completely different things.
@peterptchronic9696 Жыл бұрын
Yep, mathcore was more born out of metalcore, so I think that's where the confusion sometimes comes in.
@Motsham Жыл бұрын
@@peterptchronic9696 Correct!!
@xskycamefalling64553 ай бұрын
How did it come from metalcore were both not coming up around the same time. Influence from punk/hardcore/metal. Thinking like roarsach etc. they blossomed around the same time
@eldritchbutter4411 ай бұрын
These guys picked up where DEP left off and I love them. ❤❤❤
@The_Other_Ghost Жыл бұрын
Dillinger Escape Plan, Botch, Vein, Seeyouspacecowboy, Drowningman, Every Time I die, and Converge are bands worth checking out. Hardcore isn't metal (though that is the easiest way to describe it for outsiders), it's either a type of punk or a fusion genre of hardcore punk and metal (heavy hardcore). That said, bring them back in the future.
@notreally-sf3df7 ай бұрын
actually neck
@oddblood-7 ай бұрын
The number twelve looks like you... and Heavyheavylowlow are two other bands I would highly recommend listening to.
@The_Other_Ghost7 ай бұрын
@@notreally-sf3df I've just met too many bands.
@Rusted_Empire4 ай бұрын
Botch and TDEP are GOATED
@terremoto66632 ай бұрын
The Hirsch effect (German Band), pupil slicer (British band) are amazing to me as an old DEP-head.
@ticklord Жыл бұрын
People should definitely give "IWrestledABearOnce" a listen as another mathcore band
@hdonahue01 Жыл бұрын
Their former lead singer, Courtney LaPlante, is now in another awesome band called Spiritbox. Highly recommend them.
@muradinstormforge Жыл бұрын
I saw them at a concert in Atlanta. We asked them to go to Waffle House with us, but they said no and we just went with Miss May I instead... Still cool as shit.
@SaltNBattery Жыл бұрын
Oh... This is what happens when hipsters gentrify hardcore.. Interesting. I was more into the Norma Jean, Comback Kid, ETID, AILD, The Warriors, Donnybrook. I guess the "ironic hardcore" came after my time?
@haterfsАй бұрын
@@SaltNBatterydawg what are you on
@SaltNBatteryАй бұрын
@@haterfs Did you just respond to a year old comment expecting anyone to know what you're talking about? What are YOU on weirdo?
@tazmon122 Жыл бұрын
i love that the first hardcore band Carson threw out was Have Heart! Tool is sorta the big infection starter on mathcore. they use math to influence the music, so it's approachable. beyond them, anything by either of the Kinsella brothers (American Football, Owen, Cap'n' Jazz, Joan Of Arc, a few other small projects) is a great start on where it starts to venture away from math influencing the art into how can non traditional guitar tunings and time signatures be used in an artistic way. also getting a hang of the general sound of hardcore (Have Heart is a GREAT example). one of the biggest bands in this style is Converge.
@Chancechancechancechancechance Жыл бұрын
I'm super happy to see more music content! Also picking a subgenre that's not palatable to mainstream audiences made little ol' metalhead me happy.
@0odles0fBrutals Жыл бұрын
love daoboys never expected to see them on this channel
@lykonic1763 Жыл бұрын
I can't believe Brian doesn't think Core is STP's greatest album. I'm 21 and it was the album that made me fall in love with them like 5 years ago when my mom put it on *cassette* when I helped her clean the basement one day and we found it.
@greglane3347 ай бұрын
This is hilarious. This is basically every time I've tried to explain mathcore to someone
@Consumeros Жыл бұрын
Common Daoboys W
@joeykapral4118 Жыл бұрын
Never would have expected this lol. Just saw them a couple months ago, super sick band!
@wiredweird Жыл бұрын
wow! 😲😲
@SanskarWagley Жыл бұрын
What an unexpected collab!
@drew9092 Жыл бұрын
This is the silliest thing I've ever anticipated.
@hexxed4245 Жыл бұрын
Literally
@HoodKombo Жыл бұрын
How anyone could have possibly anticipated this crossover is unreal 😅
@GreyFoxPancake Жыл бұрын
"Can I swear on this, or no?" Heavy pause. Meanwhile, Brian, just a few minutes prior: "Get the fuckin' rhythm! Get the fuckin' rhythm!"
@Bearorgan Жыл бұрын
I've been in 2 mathcore bands it's fun but god damn it's practice is brutal. If you're interested listen to bands like this try: "The Number 12 Looks Like You" or "Heavy Heavy Low Low" if you're looking for a heavy rock version with little to no screaming try: "Tera Melos" or "Disheveled Cuss" or "Melt Banana"
@noesunyoutuber7680 Жыл бұрын
The Fall of Troy is a good fairly popular band that kinda splits the difference.
@Bearorgan Жыл бұрын
@@noesunyoutuber7680 love The Fall of Troy their definitely a mix. they have albums were over half the songs are in a standard melody then with their latest release they made 2 versions of each song on the record each in different timings. crazy stuff.
@PatLund Жыл бұрын
Those are all terrible band names.
@LISTEDGames Жыл бұрын
So basically metal music with weird rhythm and beats. Aka Animals as Leaders, Meshuggah, The Dillinger Escape Plan and Nickelback ! :) Animals As Leaders - An Infinite Regression from 1:45 in the song. Enjoy figuring out the beat. You're welcome !
@noesunyoutuber7680 Жыл бұрын
I'd say Meshuggah and Animals as Leaders are more closely related to Progressive Metal, they're Mathcore-adjacent. Dillinger, though, they're textbook Mathcore.
@gerarddip Жыл бұрын
One letter away from being the Caillous
@mad_juggernaut_3547 Жыл бұрын
We needed a chalkboard
@upinarms79 Жыл бұрын
Time signature is always multiples two on the bottom, which tells you the note values in a measure. Brian is not actually wrong in that there can be signatures like 3/3. Those are called irrational signatures, and while they do exist, they're mostly used just because some composer is screwing around and wants to write something out in some fancy, unique way because there's going to be a way to write the same thing using a rational time signature. A lot of time signatures overlap and sound exactly the same to an untrained ear anyway, and are mostly just for the musicians reading the score to know what the piece is supposed to sound like. I was a band geek in high school and learned a lot about music, but I got into punk rock and hardcore in my later teen years because I wanted to get away from that kind of structure because it was stifling to me, which was really more the environment than music itself. I wanted nothing to do with music that needed to be notated for a long time. Then I got into math rock in my 30s and I love it. I'm not so much into the "mathcore" bands, but there are some I enjoy. Tera Melos, Tik Code, Don Caballero, Ghosts and Vodka; those are more my kind of jam. Sadly, math rock was already sort of declining by the time I got into it but there's still good bands around with more coming into the scene on occasion, especially on the international side of things. I think the reason being that it's a lot of work that requires a lot of passion for not much monetary return with only a small, niche fanbase.
@manreeque5887 Жыл бұрын
strange choice of topic but im all for it this is awesome
@creeser7775 ай бұрын
Carson’s face on “3/3 time”😂
@Icynova5 ай бұрын
Oh my god I started laughing so hard when Brian was trying to count Blackberry DeLorean 😂 fantastic
@tinkerjae Жыл бұрын
THIS IS SUCH A COOL COMBO, I LOVE MATHROCK
@jackjackson753711 ай бұрын
Love the Callous Daoboys. Really love watching their development on their records.
@Fragger-1 Жыл бұрын
I wasn't expecting this to ever happen, much like the Walcom videos, but once again, I am happy it did, especially as a metal head. It's cool to see how this stuff evolves over time, from seeing Justin Robert Young wearing a Callous Daoboys shirt and saying "that's neat", to "holy sh*t they did a video together, why didn't anyone tell me?" We've seen Ouija and mystical episodes, we've seen a rock/metal episode, we've had video game episodes, now we just the DnD and satanic ritual episode to complete the full 80's/90's satanic panic arc of Modern Rogue
@TheSidwysDrftr Жыл бұрын
In high school band, we were able to play some grade 4.5 (max 6 grades) music. Often 7/8 time is sub divided by (12+12+123) or (123+12+12). 9/8 would be (123+123+123).
@noimkat Жыл бұрын
i LOVE the callous daoboys i clicked this so fast
@ronanjenkins2323 Жыл бұрын
Celebrity therapist is incredible, one of my favourite albums from 2022.
@ilichiregius2884 Жыл бұрын
I recently got into POLYPHIA who also call themselves MATHCORE.. I will definitely be going down this rabbit hole.
@seniledad6489 Жыл бұрын
Check out "The Dillinger Escape Plan"
@jakeison2968 Жыл бұрын
If you just got into Polyphia, do NOT sleep on their first 2 projects "Inspire" and "Resurrection" the latter of which is only available on youtube. Very different from what they do now, but equally amazing. Oh, and Resurrection actually has vocals :)
@bkofford Жыл бұрын
How can you discuss 5/4 without mentioning the original Mission Impossible theme and how they destroyed it for the movies by making it 4/4.
@AskAScreenwriter Жыл бұрын
You'll find a lot of unusual time signatures in prog rock, too, which Brian and Jason may be more familiar with. One of my favorites is "Turn It On Again" from Genesis.
@secret12392 Жыл бұрын
Iirc, in high school, one of the songs we performed (Tiger, Tiger) chnaged time signature nearly every measure, between 3/4, 4/4, and 5/4
The most amazing part of this video for me was that Jason has heard of Wembley Stadium
@TwoToneSoldier Жыл бұрын
I used to go to shows and one of the members of a band had a paint pen/big sharpie. It was progessive death metal and he would do artwork TO the music, jump in the pit with his canvas, the entire thing. It was great. I wish I could remember which band it was my 13-15 year old days of heavy metal shows blend together a bit sometimes because it was shows at small clubs every weekend but this sort of weird depth to music reminded me of those guys
@PrinceGrey Жыл бұрын
As a new fan of mathrock and a fan of metal I will definitely check out this band
@The_Other_Ghost Жыл бұрын
Check out Botch's We Are The Romans.
@666Jakemetal Жыл бұрын
Wait until they find out about power violence
@colemcleod9416 ай бұрын
That's it, I'm going to get a tattoo across my chest that says; I Never Say No to the Oboe
@lambda6736 Жыл бұрын
"221" is a sneaky amazing one liner. What a rad video.
@aspennnnnn11235 Жыл бұрын
3:32 aaaaaaaa I was so fricken happy to hear a tool reference
@TheZotmeister Жыл бұрын
Shout-out to the bug in the studio on the blue background at 15:30 - I thought it was a smudge on my monitor at first XD You can see it fly away at 15:47 and it looks like Brian thought he saw something move right after.
@wiredweird Жыл бұрын
came to love this band after you guys introduced me to the genre 👌👌 current obsession. Celebrity Therapist is already top 10 albums of my year so far...
@mr.martinii36088 ай бұрын
Who knew the guy I was learning magic tricks from at 8 years old would be interviewing this band. Life’s a trip lol
@Zelmel Жыл бұрын
"That's hip hop" SO TRUE AND ALSO BRUTAL!
@colemcleod9416 ай бұрын
Carson's face at the 4:45 mark; "33 time"... from his Expressions alone you just know he's a funny guy.
@aidenlosh9518 Жыл бұрын
If you want a lot of time changes, listen to Circumstances by Rush
@Dragobot7 Жыл бұрын
Or most things by Tool or everything from Dream Theater
@The_Other_Ghost Жыл бұрын
You should check out the Canadian band Counterparts. Do they do lots of time changes? Not sure. Are they a Canadian hardcore band thought to be a Rush tribute band? Yes.
@CameronPrice2Ай бұрын
This is not a collab that I expected.
@setandcollect Жыл бұрын
5/4 is the time scale used for the mission impossible theme
@nosch43 Жыл бұрын
shocked and appalled that the fall of troy was not mentioned.
@CannibalWHORE229 ай бұрын
I met Amber from this band. Super nice woman, also the band is amazing live.
@ozh5896 Жыл бұрын
knowing Brandt uses REAPER makes me very happy
@gears1302 Жыл бұрын
I certainly had my mathcore phase (animals as leaders, polyphia, etc.) but now I like to play a more dreamy, easy listening math rock style. I'd recommend bands like covet, chon, or floral for some "softer" stuff.
@rocketskatesninja10 ай бұрын
This is the vid that got my sub. Thanks!
@Ezraph2001 Жыл бұрын
The Callous Daoboys
@graysonmusic. Жыл бұрын
hahaha I've been into mathcore for a couple years now. It's my favorite heavy music. Listen to 'The Number Twelve Looks Like You"
@IronGoldDiamond Жыл бұрын
Grandfather RIPS.
@graysonmusic. Жыл бұрын
@@IronGoldDiamond fuck yea
@NicolaSelenu Жыл бұрын
ok, this was fantastic and I wasn't expecting this ;-)
@macbro1245 Жыл бұрын
A really good song that uses 7/8 time is a song called "Kinetic Dances". I played it in high school, and the way I learned to play it was "1 2; 1 2; 1 2 3" A tricky time signature, but a fun one nonetheless
@nmcgunagle Жыл бұрын
I love how perplexed they looked when asked if he coukd swear.
@mattdunn7434 Жыл бұрын
Descending into the metal rabbit hole is not what I expected but is very welcome. Would love to see Brian's head explode listening to Car Bomb
@DrakeBergman Жыл бұрын
Looking through my subscriptions and did not expect to see this one in the slightest.
@rileyblack5621 Жыл бұрын
The "sometimes its good enough" part had me cackling
@DarleneLesmana Жыл бұрын
people: music nowadays are too simple music nowadays: polyrhythms galore baybeee
@michaelparham1328 Жыл бұрын
Like this if you agree: I'd like to see a multipart series on small scale home agriculture. Answer questions like how small can a garden be, while also being effective. Or how much it might cost getting started. Maybe how to build a cheap but effective greenhouse. Or if your'e doing it outside, how to protect from the enviroment. Learn how, when, and where to plant and harvest certain crops. What's aesthetically pleasing and utilitarian. How to preserve your yield. It's a topic of infinite discussion, and a timeless bit of knowledge to have if you need it.
@JudithOpdebeeck Жыл бұрын
it can only be incredibly nerdy and i love it already
@BlackHaloMan86911 ай бұрын
Carson got the Halo drip
@MikeTVest Жыл бұрын
Everyone at their concerts looking like the Julia Roberts math equations gif.
@weedfreer Жыл бұрын
15/16s...HELLO! Did somebody say Rush? 😂
@mattmarder4390 Жыл бұрын
This is... painful to watch 😂 Props to Daoboys for trying. God damn.
@TylerOath Жыл бұрын
Oh shoot!! Freaking CARSON WITH MODERN ROGUE… never thought I’d see the day.
@TardyMoments Жыл бұрын
Never thought I’d hear Danny Carey or Tool mentioned in a MR video! Very happy about this!
@slipkorn667 Жыл бұрын
Nice episode but I'm more interested in how Jason doesn't smell while he's on ice, perhaps you should make that your next video. Cheers Cobs
@joshuajhoyt10 ай бұрын
Awe yes . The callous are so daoboys.
@dallasrockwell10 ай бұрын
The title of this interview should be “Trying to Explain Basic Music Theory to Non-Musicians.”
@VelvetTeacake Жыл бұрын
Love the little Wikipedia jingle 😆
@GrizzlyHillman Жыл бұрын
7/8 is so fun to play in
@lilkoolaidbro Жыл бұрын
yo. Checked this band out - they're absolutely INSANE. Big recommend!
@leppeppel6 ай бұрын
My drummer/nerd friend has a button that's a bass clef and pi/4. Get on his level. ;)
@2gla_2gla63 Жыл бұрын
As a Stone Temple Pilots fan, I very much appreciate that end bit
@user-fk8zw5js2p Жыл бұрын
Stick around to the end. You'll be glad u did.
@aettic Жыл бұрын
This was fun. I was caught off-gauard by Jason's random Danny Carey / Tool and King Crimson references. Definitely some of my favorite bands. King Crimson is jazz - well, okay, it's rock, but it may as well be jazz. Careful, don't fall into the prog rabbit hole, you'll never come out.
@yvan2218 Жыл бұрын
its a fun exercise to try and count out the rhythms of songs like these as well, until you give up 30 seconds later and just vibe
@Qaos Жыл бұрын
i once made a piece that a music friend said was in 29/16, which i still find funny to this day
@shellbournian Жыл бұрын
I would like to know why TF the KZfaq algorithm hid a MR video about mathcore from me. Looking at the stats... this got buried...
@ModernRogue Жыл бұрын
There's only one defense: Turn on the "Play all the episodes" playlist and leave your computer running, playing the videos all day.
@hollenfeuer1 Жыл бұрын
I love Interstate Love Song too, don't worry
@MrSchism Жыл бұрын
You can set a metarhythm by making a pattern of changing time signatures.
@ftlPhysicsGuy Жыл бұрын
A fairly well known example of 5/4 in classical music is Mars from the Planets by Holst.
@unhappyro9887 Жыл бұрын
Awesome
@The_Other_Ghost Жыл бұрын
"That's hiphop" Well answered.
@curtishoffmann6956 Жыл бұрын
How many people figured out the joke in the band's name without having it explained to them?
@TheZotmeister Жыл бұрын
Reverend Spooner's football team is mathcore band (7,7)