Moral Ambiguity | The Secret to Complex Character Development

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Күн бұрын

Moral Ambiguity and moral greyness in fiction are not only amazing tools for writing complex characters and creating intriguing fictional scenarios but their exploration on-page also helps us become better people and come to terms with our own morality and flaws which just come with being human.
We hold a mirror up to ourselves every day, examining our own morality and ethics and dilemmas, but fiction holds a mirror up to not only humanity as a whole, but individuals with variables that differ vastly from our own. This data, once untangled, helps us find which variables our negatively impacting our own morality (or perception of it) which can help us become happier people. From video games to books to tv to films. From Game of Thrones to Bioshock to Ender's Game to Better Call Saul. Audiences of all types love exploring morality through complex characters.
As always these are my personal takes, writing is art and art can be whatever you want it to be. there are no real rules
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Пікірлер: 79

@CloudKitten 4 жыл бұрын

I think Tyrion is my favorite. To be honest I still haven't watched seasons 5-8, but I currently rewatching the whole series to get to them (I dropped off in the wait between seasons). But as of now (season 4) I think Tyrion and Arya are tied for my favorites. I mean, don't get me wrong, Ser Pounce is a contender, but I just don't feel like he's given enough screen time to truly shine.

@uncleanunicorn4571 4 жыл бұрын

On honor in war, Jaavik from Mass Effect has a good quote: "Stand among the ashes of a trillion dead souls and ask them if honor matters? The silence is your answer."

@c.e.e.443 3 жыл бұрын

You put a lot of research into this video. I am impressed. This deserves way more likes than it currently has. My favourite GOT Character is totally Tyrion. Witty man. My second would be Jaqen H'ghar, for the reasons stated in this video.

@sahrahierbenikdan5088 3 жыл бұрын

I came to write this exact comment, thus I upvote you!

@5my9other93half 3 жыл бұрын

To me, the best example of a morally grey character in recent memory is Teresa in The Maze Runner series. Her motivation is to find a cure to the Flare...at any cost. This causes her to side with WCKD which is an organization willing to sacrifice immune children to produce a viable cure to save humanity. She hates watching her friends go through these absolutely traumatizing trials to become the cure, but not so much that she's willing to stop putting them through it. Because as she sees it, there will be a lot more lives lost if they don't find the cure. An unbreakable commitment to the "greater good" that causes her to do plenty of "bad" in order to achieve it. I love it.

@CloudKitten 3 жыл бұрын

oooh this is a really good example! I especially loved to see how they played the books vs the tv show to focus on that greyness in different ways. Death Cure movie vs book was especially interesting.

@elisa4620 3 жыл бұрын

That was VERY interesting. Lots of informations and ideas to ponder. I'll need to watch this video some more times to fully absorb all of this. Thank you.

@CloudKitten 3 жыл бұрын

Yeah this one was pretty dense lol. On some of these I feel like I myself have to come rewatch them a month later because it's so much info to try to retain lol

@MJ-li7fo 9 ай бұрын

I just found your channel today. Watched a few videos and now I'm already at the point where I hit like before the video even starts. I just know it's gonna be good.

@CloudKitten 9 ай бұрын

Thank you! That's so nice to hear, and I really appreciate you taking the time to leave a comment

@peterkalyabe7553 2 жыл бұрын

Thank you for the research you put in for this video. I have visited many "complex character' videos and this for me ranks top. Thanks.

@CloudKitten 2 жыл бұрын

Thank you so much for this lovely comment! It makes all the work worth it to know it's helped someone out. I really had a lot of fun making this one.

@Jason-yw2ow 3 жыл бұрын

man, this was great! good job

@gotogi83 3 жыл бұрын

You did your homework so good, A+. I'm subscribing.

@sathepine 4 жыл бұрын

Tyrion and Arya are my favorites too (and I believe GRRM's as well). Jaime Lannister is a contender. Another excellent video as always! I really love this topic, as I love morally grey characters in general. I love Aletheia! I love the grey characters in Aletheia, but aside from that, the worldbuilding and the action. I cannot wait for Red River!

@pseudonym9466 3 жыл бұрын

First vid - can’t wait to binge all your others!

@CloudKitten 3 жыл бұрын

That's awesome! I hope you find them helpful

@ramyfili1434 4 жыл бұрын

I still like really Tyrion. Dany and Sansa are cool too (I read the books lol)

@CloudKitten 4 жыл бұрын

I think Tyrion is my favorite. To be honest I still haven't watched seasons 5-8, but I currently rewatching the whole series to get to them. But as of now (season 4) I think Tyrion and Arya are tied for my fava

@sayuriwickramasingha1560 Жыл бұрын

a great review ❤

@GeeDimitrakis94 3 жыл бұрын

Great video! Very informative, thank you.

@CloudKitten 3 жыл бұрын

Very welcome!

@ramblinwriter4987 4 жыл бұрын

I'M ALWAYS LOST

@Bennett-wj9vg 5 ай бұрын

Cool new channel I found. You give valid and fun points. I hope you don't mind i'm using you good advice for my Ben 10 fanfiction.

@mursefed5532 4 жыл бұрын

I like to write about superheroes and so at first the title of this video was a turn off for me, but I watched anyway. Wow! You put a lot of work into this and I learned a lot. Superheroes in the real-world would be more grey than I usually see them. I don't watch Game of Thrones but I do own the books (I bought them on Google long ago). I'll have to sit down and read those. Thanks for making a great video with awesome information that had me laughing in places (like the trolley car).

@CloudKitten 4 жыл бұрын

I defenitely think black and white characters have benefits and have a strong place in fiction, and superhero stories can do that really well. Have you seen The Boys on Amazon? It only has one season out so far but it portrays superheroes in a gritty, realistic and very grey way that I found fascinating. Not a very inspiring story but it was interesting to see superheroes portrayed in such a dark light. But traditional more dark vs light hero stories are cool too. I personally love ones like Guardians of the Galaxy where there's a bit of silver grey. Game of thrones didn't grip me a ton the first time but this second watch through I find myself more interested. Last time I watched as a viewer though and this time I think I'm watching more as a creator which may be why, the added angle means there's a bit more to unpack and look for

@AlexBrown230 4 жыл бұрын

True, Superman can do the right thing because he's in a world where doing the right thing is easy and has no repercussions. He never actively has to make a choice between what is right and what is necessary and live with it. It's easy to do good when there's no repercussions. He also never had to make the active choice of choosing to save people and condemn anyone to die. He never had to choose to actively let 5000 die to save 10000 or to try and save those people a the cost of others and had to live with it. Superman can save everyone and any blame is passed off, it was never his fault he couldn't save one group of people over another, it's always indirect and he is never seen actively choosing. he never has to let people die and live with the guilt of making the difficult choice. He also lacks a spine, he has all that power without the spine to use it, so he either actively ignores it, willfully chooses not to act and is therefore directly or indirectly complicit for inaction. There was a 1969 Justice League issue in which he refused to end the Vietnam War because it wasn't "Clear cut". For someone with his abilities if he knows about a massacre happening and refuses to step in to take sides it makes him impotent or spineless. If superheoes exist they would be shades of grey.

@AlexBrown230 4 жыл бұрын

It's like having an omelet without the ugliness of breaking the eggs to make them.

@mariopichardo376 3 жыл бұрын

Good video.

@alfrogiguess 2 ай бұрын

Not even watched the video but seeing Joffrey Baratheon in the thumbnail of a video on moral ambiguity got me PISSED off

@user-ti6ix5tn2o 3 жыл бұрын

YOU NEED MORE VIEWS

@CloudKitten 3 жыл бұрын

This comment made my morning ❤ it's going right into the folder that I dip into when I need help getting through the long editing sessions

@chuckwieser7622 2 жыл бұрын

Love the channel. What kind of cat is the grey kitten in the beginning?

@CloudKitten 2 жыл бұрын

It is a Catus of the Felis genus, and this specific cat is formally referred to as a _ Stock Footage Cat_. All jokes aside I have lived with cats all my life and have a BS in biology, and to this day I only accept and recognize 3 cat breeds: 1) Squish Nose Cat 2) Naked Cat and 3) Savannah Cat, informally known as the I-Have-Made-A-Grave-Error-But-Regret-Nothing Cat

@gaz0428 Жыл бұрын

This is something that confuses me all the time. No good character is all good or bad (for the most part) I'm writing about vampires, and not sure if my characters are gray or just evil.

@PartridgeQuill 4 жыл бұрын

I agree with your analysis of Zuko.

@andimichaella5947 4 жыл бұрын

Great and Informative video! I will get inspo out of this cuz I am currently writing for a VtM Char and I want it to have complexity, flaws, and spice to it. I was just looking up for how to make a good and humane character who's developing in my story hehehe..

@CloudKitten 4 жыл бұрын

I'm so happy you found the video helpful!! I love grey characters to no end and really do think the flaws add a lot of spice to them. Good luck with your characters and story ❤

@andimichaella5947 4 жыл бұрын

I really also find this video amusing and Im really glad I found this! With all the editing and clips added, HAHAHA it makes me feel entertained, laugh, and cheerful.. 24 mins of this video was so awesome! Way to go! I got a lot from this better than my Philosophy class lmaoo

@Jaime.Lannister 3 жыл бұрын

Jaime lannister: "Hold my 🍺"

@crowhamill Жыл бұрын

I need that alignment chart 🤣🤣

@notester5860 3 жыл бұрын

Tyrion, Arya and Sam... always

@bilalkhares9337 2 жыл бұрын

For morality there is also divind command theory and natural law

@CloudKitten 2 жыл бұрын

I'll have to look these up. Thanks for mentioning them!

@hunacean 2 жыл бұрын

I think Martin dosen't understand Lord of the Rings. It in fact perfectly fits into your description. You have the paragons of Goodness Aragorn and Gandalf and evil Incarnate Sauron. They are there, as you said, to measure against, while every, and I do mean every charcter is some shade of grey between them. Frodo obviously struglles, but even Sam, our dear Sam isn't perfect. His name is Samwise which comes from semi-wise, bacuase he is almost perfect, but simply can't emphisze with Smeagol, preventing (togheter with Faramir) his redemption. On the other end even the Witch King of Angmar was once a good Númenórian who got dragged into this by the Valar.

@barbershopbible 2 жыл бұрын

And then there's biblical good vs evil. Those fall into having a covenant relationship with Jesus (loving, depending on, and serving)- vs the absence of relationship with Jesus. Darkness being the absence or obstruction of light. So then everything we naturally do is evil under this belief.

@billyalarie929 3 жыл бұрын

this was fucking phenomenal. sub'd. bell smashed.

@CloudKitten 3 жыл бұрын

Sub AND bell??? You are my new favorite

@billyalarie929 3 жыл бұрын

@@CloudKitten mine too! i initially watched Shaelin's video (as you do...) on morally ambiguous characters (for the 50392482471th time (...yeah i said 1th, what of it?)) and i was like "hmm, who else has what to say about this?" and after a couple of really dumb and basic b versions of this discussion, i came across yours and i was like W E L P.

@thebraxtonater8466 4 жыл бұрын

First!

@arkhie9883 2 жыл бұрын

If that Altruism is genuine intrinsically then it must be true.

@midnightlemon4255 3 жыл бұрын

So I'm actually going to take a different stance on this. Not that anything you said was wrong, just personal preference. I prefer when the protagonist/hero of a story is a morally white character by the climactic moment where their morality is tested. The character can start in a place of gray morality, but I like when they end up solidly good at the end. If the antagonist/villain is morally gray, fine. If several of the people and factions the main character has to deal with are morally gray, great. But I don't prefer that for my hero most of the time. You said that we like morally gray characters because we relate to them more, and that may be true, but I'm not necessarily looking for the protagonist who is the most relatable they can possibly be. Instead, I want to see characters who are BETTER than me, whose trials and revelations drive them to selflessly make the right decision when I don't know if I could have in the same situation. I can still relate very well to the character who struggles through their issues and the things the plot throws at them to ultimately become a morally pure character, even though they might be better than I am. It's a different sort of wish fulfillment, I guess. Also, I refuse to accept that everyone wants morally gray characters when Brandon Sanderson is as ridiculously popular as he is. Still enjoyed the video a lot! I'm intending to write a handful of morally gray people into my manuscript, with one of the primary antagonists as one of them--just not my heroes :)

@elisa4620 3 жыл бұрын

While, generally speaking, I do prefer when a show explores moral ambiguity through grey characters (with different shades of gray, I guess). I do prefer when the hero is on the lighter side of this scale. I don't think I could truly root for a villain protagonist. But I still prefer when ethics and morals are chllenged, including/especially by the protagonists and heroes. I think it brings a lot of external and internal conflict when they are faced with hard choices to make, or with bad decisions, they made, etc. and have to deal with it and accept this part of themselves. That they are not perfect. And I agree that I don't think the majority of people do. Many (most?) people will look at a story with a "righteous" white and black morality. Just look at how everything gray character is quickly and blindly condemned and hated ...

@bilalkhares9337 2 жыл бұрын

Zuko wasn't ever quite 100% evil, if he were he would have killed Aang when he Captured him in Siege of The North.

@CloudKitten 2 жыл бұрын

You don't have to be on the most evil extreme or on the best extreme to not be morally grey. The moral greyness comes from overlapping of contradictory motives and execution, and the blending of the good and the bad. IE doing evil things for pure reasons, or pure things for evil reasons, or in the true chaotic fashion, doing some pure and some evil depending on the moment or day. Zuko's actions rarely (if ever) had blending within the action, moment, or mind-set itself, but rather started on one side of the spectrum and jumped to the other, which makes him black and white.

@laosasalazar407 4 жыл бұрын

So they are multi-dimensional

@deathandroses3861 2 жыл бұрын

This hurts my brain

@CloudKitten 2 жыл бұрын

In a good way I hope

@chuckwieser7622 Жыл бұрын

Kant = k'a'nt as in b'a'll or Ball 🏀🏈

@r.i.p.4485 3 жыл бұрын

In the trolley problem, I would choose to do nothing. Why? If I choose, then I have made a conscious decision to murder one, or five, people. By not choosing, I have left it up to fate. How's that for morally grey?

@CloudKitten 3 жыл бұрын

But chosing to do nothing is a choice . . . The trolley problem in its traditional version is that the trolley is headed towards 5 people and there's a lever you can pull to redirect it towards one. You have two options, do nothing or pull the lever. You would choose to do nothing which isn't wrong (there's no objective right or wrong in this problem) but it is a decision that has implications. Both options are morally grey and there are only two options.

@darlalathan6143 2 жыл бұрын

@@CloudKitten There is always the choice of pushing everybody off both tracks! Then, everybody lives and a normal human could easily yell "Look out! Trolley's coming!!"

@lilydrannen4489 2 жыл бұрын

Cloud Kitten! I've got a scenario for you. So I am writing a story in which there is a deity that was locked away long ago due to a prophecy saying this deity is destined to eat the world because of its overwhelming hunger. One mortal is tasked with feeding this deity to keep it at bay from destroying the world. My protagonist kills the person feeding this deity due to vengeful motivations, unaware of this person's responsibilities to this deity, and must now take up the mantle of the feeder. They kill bad people, and they take enjoyment in it (this is evident through the fact that these bad people are responsible for killing the protagonist's family, but they also keep the heads of the people they kill as trophies). How would you categorize my protagonist in terms of moral greyness? On one hand, they're killing people, but those people are "bad" and killing them prevents the end of the world. I'm very curious to hear your take on this

@lilydrannen4489 2 жыл бұрын

I forgot to mention that this deity feeds off of human life and that is why my protagonist is killing these people, they are feeding them to this deity

@CloudKitten 2 жыл бұрын

Hmm, that's a tricky one. I think it would really come down to presentation and how you explore their thoughts on the matter. Morality is almost always a spectrum in characters, so I'd say they have some greyness. But where it is on the spectrum between charcoal and a lighter grey would come down to their thoughts on the situation. For example, would they be killing these people if they hadn't needed to take the mantel of feeder? Is the task all joy, or is there some sacrifice to it? If they would be doing the killings in the absence of the diety and or threat posed by these bad people, then their motives are somewhat selfish and they fall mostly on the side of villany, but if they are motivated in some part by the lives they'll save, that makes them more grey. Really moral greyness (in my opinion) is all about the character's actions, motives, and what they hope to achieve. It isn't about setup or outcome, but rather, what they decide to do in the space between. So where this character falls on the spectrum will be entirely dependent on how your portray their handling of this complex situation. Ps: your premise sounds interesting!

@lilydrannen4489 2 жыл бұрын

@@CloudKitten Thank you! I’m in the early phases of developing this story, and I’m still a little insecure to even share it. Thank you so much for your feedback! I love the opinions of fellow writers and lovers of intriguing stories and characters

@laosasalazar407 4 жыл бұрын

Ok here Bc my class I don’t know nothing

@CloudKitten 4 жыл бұрын

That's awesome! What class if you don't mind me asking? Did the teacher send you the link to the video? Hopefully you found it helpful and at least a little entertaining

@sdprz7893 4 жыл бұрын

Never expected you to be a pewdiepie fan loool

@CloudKitten 4 жыл бұрын

I like to watch all types of KZfaq videos so I can try to keep my editing style unique and fresh, from Unnus Annus to Film Theory to Film Riot to Hello Future me. Not always consistently, but I sort of spiral around. But my husband has been following Pewds since back before he was big so I end up exposed to a lot of his content that way because it's playing in the background lol Is math related to science? Only if butt is legs.

@sdprz7893 4 жыл бұрын

@@CloudKitten Seems like everyone on youtube is like that. Don't really watch pewds content myself just really like the guy