Mordhau-ing my own head for HEMA Science

Рет қаралды 1,127

22 күн бұрын

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Пікірлер: 40

@Pedro_Guerrero 20 күн бұрын

Gf: He must be thinking about other women The guy:

@dequitem 19 күн бұрын

Very cool test. I hope your fine!

@HEMA_Fight_Breakdowns 19 күн бұрын

I am, no bruises or concussion symptoms

@wardmatthew42 20 күн бұрын

This kinda reenforces my thought from the hand video. My thoughts were using it to tweak the neck and transferring the damage to that part.The jaw and teeth part I hadn't entirely considered but does make a lot of sense. I think it's also extremely important to say that this shouldn't be done with typical fencing mask, because they won't hold up to those types of blows and the damage to them could be catastrophic.

@WinnipegKnightlyArts 20 күн бұрын

A major difference between a strike to the head and the test you did with the hand is that letting your hand get moved without resistance allows you to negate all the damage, but if you do that with your head you still get your brain/everything else jostled. As you have more inertia on a target, it can displace less easily and absorbs more of the force directly into it.

@MartinFabian 20 күн бұрын

RE: target areas the very last couplet from Lichtenauer's verse in Kampffechten says - "Des voderñ fuess mit slegen dw huetten müest" which means "you must protect your front foot from strikes". It advises to target the knee or joints in general whilst holding the sword with both hands on the blade, which makes more sense than hitting the head.

@Rocknoob49 20 күн бұрын

Not educated on the translations, but German. "mit" in modern German means with. So i always read that as "guard your front foot with your hews", describing to lead with the sword, not the foot for a safe advance.

@MartinFabian 20 күн бұрын

@@Rocknoob49 the commentary is very clear: Glosa merck der schlahent ort das ist der swertz knopff do mit soltu ÿm slahen zw seinen vorgesatzten gliden der soltu gar [71v.1] eben remen das dw Im die do mit recht treffest vnd die sleg soltu also zw wege pringen halt dein swert in der öberñ hu°t vber dem haubt vnd thue als dw im dar aus in das gesicht wöllest stechñ oder an setzen mit dem las dein swert varñ aus der rechten hant vnd chüm do mit der lincken hant zw hilff mitten in die klingen vnd slach ym mit dem knopf zw dem knÿe seines vor gesetztñ fuess oder zw seiner vorgesetzten hant do er das swert in der mitt mit heldet Auch magstu im zu° dem haubt oder zw dem elpogen oder zw der achsel do mit slahen wenn es dir eben ist ~

@dequitem 19 күн бұрын

@@Rocknoob49 Indeed this part is about defending with strikes, not about strikes to the knee. If you are armored at the knee it make absolutly no sense to strike their joints if you dont want to hook him, you will not hurt them or dislocating them. You will not penetrate hardened plate armor! Also greetings from a German!

@ArmourArtist 19 күн бұрын

Good on you for testing it and not just thought experimenting it. yer that was what I expected your results would be. not a kill but if you landed a full force hit to the side of the head it might buy you time for a follow up. I had also thought about aiming for the shoulder against armours that have a gap there tho they dont always. maybe if they are running spaulders and bessagues, and you want to get up and over the bessague. Attacking angles that you cant thrust at. might be worth a test against mail.

@notyetidentified9720 20 күн бұрын

Generally I agree with your assesment of mordhau's viability/effectiveness, there are "buts" though - the mordhaus your partner was performing were not that good. In order to generate reasonable force you want both hands close to the pivot point and hands together, that way you really get the "mace" effect. He hendled it too much like a proper poleaxe and that generates far less force, a stiffer sword (not a bendy feder) would also change a lot. Even implementing those changes to the test I don't think it would change the general assesment of mordhau as an "opening" or "opportunity" technique, but I think it would make it feel more effective, than what you experienced. You somewhat addressed it in the video, but what Im mostly pointing out is that a stiffer blade combined with a better technique would change the situation. From my own experience of doing mordhaus with a feder - they feel really bad when performed properly (hands together) because of how floppy the blade is. Btw, those jaw strikes with a pommel, darn, I just imagined getting hit with something like that in a blossfechten situation.

@nevisysbryd7450 20 күн бұрын

Similar take here. If we compare it to the infamous John Clements incident, that blow used held the hands together near the back, with a stiffer blade, and landed pretty much optimally-perpendicular to the armor face, minimizing any force lost-and was swung with both more wind-up and struck with the pommel, maximizing the speed due to the fulcrum mechanics. I think these things are better approached swung like a flail than a pollaxe. Notably, _with_ all of that, it was still not necessarily immediately incapacitating, although it did inflict permanent injury on the recipient. I think the primary point (or lack thereof, technically) is that while striking with the sword as a bludgeon has an inferior effect, it is less reduced in effectiveness than the point or edges are outside of heavily specialized specimens in specific contexts.

@snakeoveer1046 20 күн бұрын

The illustrations show the hands far apart. I believe swinging for the fences like you recommend is not great since it leaves you wide open if you miss or don't hurt the other guy.

@krystofcisar469 18 күн бұрын

it wouldnt be any different if that guy wnated to kill him. I had seen too many guys taking crazy swings with halberd (obviously blunt one) and shake it off :D if you think reverse gripsword will do better, thin kabout it again.

@stuartking84able 15 күн бұрын

Actually, I believe the dude in the John Clements incident said the mordhau didn't do much and it was all editing. They got him to sprint around in the armour, so the bits when he had to sit down was him just out of breath. They edited it after the mordhau to look like he was concussed.

@polyommata 21 күн бұрын

i said it on the last vid and ill say it now, mordhau is definitely about swining the cross guard into the gaps and helmet eye holes and use the mass of the pommel behind it to swing harder than just presenting point to gaps would. but also im just like, bro we know they sometimes sharpened quillons and obvi swinging the crossguard into gaps and eye slits will deliver more force than presenting point to gaps in the armor. there are historical mace heads around the same size as some longsword pommels, but with shorter handles than a longsword blade. so like u can do a bonk as strong as a mace, or swing for eye slits and gaps eith a pointy bit of metal. wonderful. what more are we learning from all of these micro concussions? 😭😭 editted to add: i dont mean to talk shit or insult anyone btw. JW's a really great guy, I've reffed for him and with him at many tournaments. i just have such a pet peeve for this kind of flawed experiment in the hema scene because there are plenty of safer ways to come to better data and conclusions, and ppl risking bodily harm never adds anything worthwhile to the conversation.

@snakeoveer1046 20 күн бұрын

You must be a god of accuracy to put the crossguard in the eyeslit with a mordhau against someone who fights back. You would have a much better chance halfswording.

@krystofcisar469 18 күн бұрын

You wont shit with crossguard, and especially not gaps in armour especially not the eyeslits :D i mean you will tear up piece of hauberk at max.

@ArmourArtist 19 күн бұрын

I'm an armour guy not a hema guy but isn't this move shown as "If you have no armour and your fighting someone in full plate" tho I have seen it with spiked pommels. I kind of thought it was obviously a way to distract or disorientate someone to close the gap.

@AlexanderRobocop 20 күн бұрын

On the vertical cross guard it almost slipped into your visor. How close is that to your eyes and nose? Would that pose a risk to your person or maybe ripping the visor off? Just before 6:11

@superiorhema 20 күн бұрын

Gave your body to science! I assumed you couldn't knock anyone out with that. Just hit to follow up. I'm curious why you decided only the top of the head. Most of the things that have hurt me have been the side of the head. I'll maybe test it myself lol, see if it has less or more impact.

@HEMA_Fight_Breakdowns 20 күн бұрын

If we tried to swing a feder any more horizontally the bend would make it difficult to aim

@superiorhema 20 күн бұрын

@@HEMA_Fight_Breakdowns Ah ok, we have access to a bunch of stiffer feders, And blunts. But can see that downside with a Sigi

@SteelOsprei 20 күн бұрын

Based on the pommel strike to the face it does seem like swinging sideways would do way more damage. Maybe if the blade was held even closer to the cross guard the flex wouldn't matter as much? I definitely wouldn't want to test that on a person though.

@danielwhitman2255 20 күн бұрын

How much padding is in this helmet? Modern day hema helmets have so much more padding than historical helmets. This would stop historical warriors from getting too hot and it would remove weight and make it a bit cheaper to make but that wasnt a problem for the rich people though

@krystofcisar469 18 күн бұрын

its not that if you add thicker padding in helmet that it becomes hotter - its already insulated so you are cooking your head on your own. more padding makes it more insulated hence more protected from ouside heat :D

@danielwhitman2255 18 күн бұрын

@krystofcisar469 yeah but your head generates heat which gets trapped

@sinisterswordsman25 20 күн бұрын

Interesting... what about a type XV? The size of the pommel on one of those bad boys must give it a little bit more pep? Good point about the shoulder and neck target. I know people who have broken their collarbone and guess what, it sucks Great video man 🤘💀 respect for being the crash test dummy lol

@daaaah_whoosh 20 күн бұрын

To me this makes me start to question what we can do to fencing masks to make them better for 'unarmored' HEMA, if you can take hits like that in a "real" helmet and be fine.

@shutinalley 19 күн бұрын

just the tip along the nose in that eyeslot. done done. just the tip 😉

@AlexTheSwordGuy 20 күн бұрын

What material is your helmet?

@HEMA_Fight_Breakdowns 20 күн бұрын

Heat treated steel

@beroulga 20 күн бұрын

this test was done by a fellow with far fewer scruples in the past and it injured his student. Also not a one blow knock out, but it wasn't great. I found some of the video still up. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/rM9naJpenL6oaWg.html

@nevisysbryd7450 19 күн бұрын

Clements? Yeah, that incident left the recipient with permanent injuries. While certainly a lot less potent than getting stabbed or cut, still very undesirable.

@krystofcisar469 18 күн бұрын

Anybody thought that strike with pommel in helmet would do any harm? I had seen guys in lighter armour (maybe even worse quality) take multiple halberd strikes on head and still walk it off - i was also that guys sometimes :D but serioulsy i think this strike would work if it was more like baseball bat swing from the side which would mroe likely off balance opponent while you take some position fromwhen you can really do some harm. frontal strike on helmet wouldnt do much even with way stronger strikes.