Thanks for watching, cheers!

Hi, a class Z 0-8-0 replica would be ideal, 8 were built, 30950-7

Nice day weather wise do slipping should not have occurred. Sandboxes if filled didn't help. Initially I thought it was lack of vacuum in brake system but csme round to your view ..... eventually!

'ere what's the name of that engine?.........Don't tell him Pike

Which 50 do you remember?

@@isleofthanet 026 at the 2012 diesel gala. Failed right before the plate bridge

Same with the climb to exeter central from st davids. Brutal! How they were ever diagrammed for that route with that ascent and curve 200yds into the london bound journey beats me. Perhaps they were banking on the GWR's Goodwill - literally 🤣

@@captainboing The SR provided up to 3 banking (tank) locomotives to assist with the climb. They hung around the environs of St. David's until they were needed. If I remember rightly, SR even provided a massive "Z" tank for the task at one point.

Oil baths had nothing to do with slipping or fires, none of the oil from it can get to the wheels for a start. It's just down to how it is driven. Had many rides on Bulleids in the wet and dry, and the crews have managed to keep the locos from slipping. seeing a spam slip on a very heavy Pullman on a steep climb out of Vic is somehow a problem? Not bad railhead condiitons or it being overloaded ?

@@shipsarerubbish What an aggressive reply! Oil baths (and leaks from them) have been the problem since they were built and it is extremely well documented in the many books on the subject of Bulleid Pacifics. If you are saying that all the authors (that includes ex-SR Crew) are wrong then you are on the wrong planet. As for Victoria, who is calling it a "problem"? The video I was referring to was on a perfectly dry day; the Pacific slipped - I didn't exclaim anything, just accepted it as I have seen it happen on many occasions in the past at many different locations.

It's well documented to be rubbish. Oil got onto the wheels from the axle box keeps and not from the bath. If the bath's leaked (and did leak that much) it would just end up on the sleepers and ballast, not wheels. This has been vairfied by the Eastleigh Works Foreman and Eastleigh firmen. Ask Bob Cartwright(ex Eastleigh Cleaner and Fireman) to confirm this. You said the slipping at Vic was highligting the "problem" which there isn't. It's just the way pacifics start or how difficalt is to start out of VIc. @@MrTudwud

A few years ago, one wet evening I watched an S15 whisk a heavy train out of Salisbury towards London with not a hint of a slip. Great mixed traffic engines.

As an ex Salisbury driver it was possibly my ex workmates on the footplate when you were watching them. Makes me wonder how they coped getting up the bank from Sherborne to Buckhorn Weston (Gillingham) tunnel. They had bankers going up Honiton bank of course if necessary.

@@kristinajendesen7111 With the benefits of hindsight one wonders if the Light Pacifics would not have been better as a 4-6-0? I have heard that the Nelsons were unpopular with fireman. Is Honiton bank the stretch of track before the tunnel where westbound trains are grind away up the hill? The 159s seem to be struggling.

@@physiocrat7143 Yes, you could tell if you had a good unit if they got anywhere near 70mph at the tunnel entrance. Average was about 60 to 65 and a poor one 55mph. I think the 50s flew up there. I haven't heard that about the Nelsons but my DI (driving instructor), said he liked the WR Granges which sometimes appeared on shed. I imagine that if you are right handed it would make it easier firing too with the driver being on the right hand side. Another DI loved the T9s.

There were of course the small wheeled S11 class for the hills. The ultimate 4-6-0 would have the 3 -cylinders and valve gear and 6ft 3ib drivers of the Duke of Gloucester and the LMS 2A boiler as fitted to the rebuilt Scots. That would leave anything else standing.

Sounds good to me! Thanks!

Where else would Jowett have tested their cars then!

Cheers, have also subd’!

City of wells is very well set up and is very sure footed, even for a bullied. The axle loading is very carefully done to be as perfect as possible. The curve out of Keighley is pretty tight and steep.

And the 8fs have four axles not three and the wheels are a foot and a half less diameter.

Cheers!

They handle steep gradients as well as any other pacific, better in some cases. I love how everyone just ignores the times when these locos flatten banks and just pick on the odd occasion when the track conditions have let them down. Tangmere has put some rockering performances on the main line. E.G. Upwey bank and Hemerdon.

@@shipsarerubbish Hemerdon and Upwey are on the mainline. I agree they are very steep and Tangmere has indeed put in good performances on it. But this video was on a very tight bend, up a steel gradient and from a standing start. Hemerdon and Upwey are relatively straight, and they have the opportunity for a bit of a run up. My point was, they are not suited to branch lines.

Upwey, climbs stright out of Weymouth and this not an issuse of the gradient or the locomotive type. You seem to forget that 34092 was based at the Worth Valley from restoration, it's started away many many times on this climb, with no issue. Just on this occasion, there seems to be a brake problem. This climb or others really are not an issue for Bulleids, as been proven many times in the past. @@justandy333

Four or five coaches is standard on the Worth Valley, with perhaps six on busy days. Even a class 2 (e.g. 41241 or 78022) can take four up the line with no difficulty, and class 4 locos take five in the usual course of events. A class 7P6F loco should have no difficulty.

Cheers!

Not an expert, but I suspected stuck brakes too. The shuddering of the coaches looked to me like what happens when power is applied but the wheels are not rotating. Perhaps a more powerful locomotive would have been able to pull it along regardless, but that would risk creating flat spots on the frozen wheels.

Poor sanding, American locomotives have sanders on each drive wheel

Slipping because of the UK weather.

Agreed and I just posted the same, just that short push was a bit mean?

Thank you!

But no harm done so no issue. In the old days, health and safety was not as mad as it is nowadays!

I think around 2018? Cheers!

Also due to Bulleid's idiotic design of putting the valve gear in an oil bath, which constantly leaked oil over the wheels and brake blocks. Sometimes, enough was thrown up into the boiler cladding that it was set on fire by sparks thrown up from the brake blocks . . . You can't blame it all on the axle loading (16 tons), as the Merchant Navies were pretty much the same, and their axle loading was 21 tons.

​@@jackx4311ah, good to see the same old rubbish about the oil baths is still propagate around. You do realise that the in preservation era, the valve gear has proven itself to work perfectly well. Wells is a perfect case for showing it's reliability and performance. For fact of the matter, the oil baths only leaked a small in service and if they did, it would just drop straight onto the ballast and sleepers. There's no way that oil would be able to get to the wheels. The source of the oil getting onto the wheels was traced back to the cap oil trays that feed various parts of the engine, including the axle box keeps. If the wicks were left in by crews when they were finished, the oil would keep flowing and over spill onto the wheels, then eventually thrown up once underway. The fires were started by this oil building up and under heavy braking, the sparks from the blocks would set it off. Once this was discovered, the brake blocks were changed to a less spark throwing type and crews were reminded to remove the wicks. As you've noticed, there's been no fires in preservation nor major issues with the oil baths. Even the rebuilt locomotives "slipped" the same as the originals, showing that is was nothing to do with the oil baths, but the fact is all Pacific loco's have a tendency to slip as the load transfers weight off the driving axles. City of Wells and Tangmere have put on phenomenal performances on the mainline, really showing how well they work. I get that you seem to have an irrational dislike of Bulleid's, but keep spreading lies about them👍

The weight of the train should be determined by the adhesive weight of the loco. 16 tons x 3 axles = 48 tons adhesive weight. This means a total weight of train in passenger service should not exceed 480 tons on straight, level and dry track. Of course the weight of the train has to decrease as soon as curves, grades and slippery rail enter in to the equation.

I wasn't on the train, as I assume you weren't, so I don't know, but there may well have been a member of staff on the train informing passengers of the situation. It's easy to throw brickbats when not in full possession of the facts. I'm just very grateful to all the volunteers who keep heritage railways operating for my, and millions of other peoples, pleasure.

It's an enthusiast line, I can't imagine for one second any one of those passengers was anything less than interested and excited at the unfolding drama. It's a talking point hence us all here now and to have witnessed it firsthand must have been great

Please say your just joking 🤨

@2018 cheers.

🤔

About 2018, (my memory is not that good anymore!) cheers!

we do , all steam engines Have sanders that I know of maybe they ran out

@@tomlawson8216 I am aware that due to steam loco's in England not have air brakes they used steam to clean the track which also collected & discharged the sand as well ,I knew an ex BR Fireman here who told me they used steam as a sander, I noticed on this video steam appearing around the front driving wheel, so I did a bit of investigation & you are correct the loco's do have sand box, so it was ever empty or the sand had became wet & caused a blockage in the delivery pipe.

I think your comment is a bit harsh.

I never found out, I presume it would have been sticky brakes. Cheers!

A far more likely reason is damp sand even in summer it can be an issue, coming out of the curve on platform 4 at the K&WVR is not easy and sanding really helps traction.

Maintenance work. Should reopen today Saturday 2 March.

On the contrary; even Bulleid's 'Merchant Navy' class engines were notorious for slipping to a stand, and his 'West Country/Battle of Britain' class was even worse. They had a toxic combination of two problems, BOTH down to Bulleid's ego-tripping; first, that bloody awful 'valve gear in an oilbath' set-up, which constantly leaked oil over the wheels and brake blocks; second, his even worse 'chain driven valve gear', which was tricky enough to deal with, even brand new, but was a hair-trigger disaster as soon as it had any wear. Suffice it to say that Bulleid contacted Renold's Chains to enquire about using chains to drive the valve gear, as was and is done in many car and truck engines. Part way through the conversation, Renold's man realised the chains would have to work in both directions, and assured Bulleid that it would NEVER work accurately. But Bulleid knew best (as always) and fitted it anyway. In a very short time, Renold's man was proved right, so what did Bulleid do? He went and built *hundreds MORE* of the bloody things, all with the same faults! Not without reason did a senior loco manager on the Southern Railway refer to those classes as "the Chief Mechanical Engineer's clockwork mice!"

@@jackx4311 I am certain I agree with what you say. I am certainly no fan of Bulleid’s unmodified 4-6-2s, but in support of the design I should say that I once had a conversation with the chief mechanical engineer at the York National Rail Museum and he said that, in theory, Bullied’s design of valve gear and the oil both were both excellent ideas. It was putting them into practice that caused the problems! What I was referring to in my original comment when I said the loco should have had no problem starting the train away from Keighley was that it was only hauling five carriages. A medium sized tank engine would have handled that load with no problem. What we don’t know is were the brakes dragging, was the driver inexperienced in handling a Bullied Pacific, was the loco priming? The situation seems to have been cause by two problems. First, the loco may have been stopped in ‘dead centre’ (inexperienced driver?), and then when it was given a push it developed a serious slipping problem.

I'm with both Jackx and Gareth on SR Pacific's never know how they ever kept time 😂😂😂 But just quickly on your point Gareth, I'm almost 99.9% certain that a 3 cyl can't stop at T.D.C. unlike 2 cyls engines.

Well then, here’s me thinking it was because it was a Saturday that caused all the issues!🤪😜🤣😂 Seriously, I bow to all you chaps with the knowledge! Me? Not a clue about any of it, it’s probably cos I’m short, but I do my best!!!!!

You are right. I had't thought about that! @@Geo46115

👍

Is that just a comment from ignorance or just jealousy? Tangmere has out perfomed all of the Western locos, on Western terrtory. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/jNmRlZSAza-uk5c.htmlfeature=shared

A 9F would have shifted anything

Don't talk BOLLOX. You mean typical *BULLEID* locos.

​@@jackx4311you mean absolutely bollocks, as it a Pacific loco thing, not just Bulleids.

The fact is that this class of loco is notorious for slipping! Why deny reality? And it was nicknamed the volcano due to the prodigious quantities of clag (i.e. unburnt fuel) that it emitted.

@@andrewhotston983 only notorious by people who ignore all the other Pacific's. Yes it did get it's nickname by producing spectacular exhaust plumes, which it did climbing over the S&C. Wells had no trouble on the NYMR with the heavy Dining train. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/ecdzh7Zm2ae5gWQ.htmlsi=uqCpORQIEGMz3RVM People really have it in for Bulleids, for absolutely no reason.

@@04clemea So all the other comments, books etc are wrong, just because you found one KZfaq video of a Light Pacific climbing a gradient without slipping? Hmmm...

@@andrewhotston983 🤣🤣🤣 Yeah, there's a lot of people playing to the stereotype that all Bulleids slip constantly and can't climb hills. When it's been clearly demonstrated multiple times, buy Wells or Tangmere or Clan Line or British India Line or Taw Valley, that they are no different to other Pacific's. A quick dig through archive footage of King's Cross and you'll see A1's, A2's, A3's, A4's, Brits..etc. slipping. Generally speaking from personal opinion, I think it's the fact that we have so many Bulleids running in preservation, that you would find it easier to point out that they slip "more". It's not because they do, but because there's more of them to point out. Here's a great example of Tangmere having a small slip as it takes the load, then it's gets clean departure and accelerating without slipping at all. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/pZ58bJthu7ioe6M.htmlsi=poSWAmsci3CNAQYZ Was riding behind Manston the other week at the Mid Hants and climbing the 1in60 gradients no trouble what so ever and in the middle of a massive rain storm.

Typical Bulleid Pacific. When hauling a load, some of the weight is transferred to the rear non-driving axle under the firebox. This reduces adhesion. A 4-6-0 would have a better grip. It's why the GWR did not have Pacifics.

"fat ladies " - what about the fat blokes?

Oh, so that's why the 600t pullman train is in the hands of a Bulleid Pacific then?