No, All of the Dune Sequels do NOT Suck...But Are They For You?

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Mike responds to all of the comments he has been getting since the release of Dune Part Two that claim all of the Dune Sequels books suck.
ℙ𝕦𝕣𝕔𝕙𝕒𝕤𝕖 𝕓𝕠𝕠𝕜𝕤 𝕞𝕖𝕟𝕥𝕚𝕠𝕟𝕖𝕕 𝕚𝕟 𝕥𝕙𝕚𝕤 𝕧𝕚𝕕𝕖𝕠:
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𝕎𝕒𝕟𝕥 𝕥𝕠 𝕤𝕖𝕟𝕕 𝕄𝕚𝕜𝕖 𝕤𝕠𝕞𝕖𝕥𝕙𝕚𝕟𝕘? 𝕐𝕠𝕦 𝕔𝕒𝕟 𝕕𝕠 𝕤𝕠 𝕥𝕠 𝕥𝕙𝕖 𝕓𝕖𝕝𝕠𝕨 𝕒𝕕𝕕𝕣𝕖𝕤𝕤:
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0:00 Introduction
0:33 Background Info
4:08 Why They're Good
7:35 Why They're Bad
10:28 Final Thoughts
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#MikesBookReviews #Dune #DunePartTwo

Пікірлер: 414

@ryhmetravila8085 3 ай бұрын

Basically I look at it this way. Paul is the main character of the first book, but the main character of the series is the planet arrakis itself.

@skywatcheradept 3 ай бұрын

The main character of the series is Duncan Idaho which is anticlimactic af.

@ryhmetravila8085 3 ай бұрын

@@skywatcheradept Duncan Idaho is one of the most fascinating characters to me personally. I mean leto the second kind of treats him like a favorite dog that he just refuses to let die.

@Nick-oo5lh 3 ай бұрын

@@ryhmetravila8085how is a favorite dog fascinating 😂

@ryhmetravila8085 3 ай бұрын

Because he's not a dog. He's a person, who is being treated as if he's someone else's personal property, and watching how he deals with that as he slowly comes to realize that is the case, is to me an interesting character study. It really is a horrible fate, living the same life as a glorified slave, again and again, coming to realize your own servitude, coming to realize that you are a clone, that the original person you think of as yourself died thousands of years ago. Again and again

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

Well said.

@JokerJon00 3 ай бұрын

Dune Messiah is required reading, in my opinion.

@TheSpotlessMind93 3 ай бұрын

Yes, thank you! I can't understand how people just stop after Dune. Dune Messiah is a more satisfying stopping point and drives home Frank Herbert's message.

@JokerJon00 3 ай бұрын

@@TheSpotlessMind93 absolutely. I tell everyone that if you are going to read Dune, then you also need to read Messiah.

@mastersal4644 3 ай бұрын

💯 - but I think it makes the message more complex and I can see some people liking the simpler good vs evil / hero’s journey interpretation

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

The more I see how many people think of Paul as a Luke Skywalker/Joseph Campbell archetype the more I start to think Messiah MUST be read.

@Gronmin 3 ай бұрын

@@mikesbookreviews Paul mostly is a Skywalker type character. There is just an added under tone of how he knows the bad things that will happen as a result of him winning. As a ruler outside of the jihad it does seem that he's at least as good as the emperor and better than the Harkonnen's. But it also has the significant downside of the jihad. The story is about how the momentum of movements created by people to achieve their initial cause which may be good going out of control afterwards and being swept up in it (and so not truely having a choice afterwards). I've also only read the first 2 Dune books but the second felt much longer overall and very boring in parts. The style of material was a very natural sequel (in that X is the enemy etc) it just didn't feel like it was written as well. I've been meaning to go back to 3, but I needed to take a break after 2 felt like pulling teeth with some of it's writing.

@ryhmetravila8085 3 ай бұрын

One of if not my favorite book of all time is a dune sequel. God emperor of dune is amazing

@angelaholmes8888 3 ай бұрын

I really enjoyed that book

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

Folks seem to love it or hate it.

@thefilmeffect6089 3 ай бұрын

It’s still my favorite sequel. It’s so unlike anything I have read to this day. I’d rank them God Emperor, Messiah, Heretics, Children, then Chapterhouse. I found that Heretics feels like the closest sequel to the first book. It’s had more action, less psychological musings, and the world building kicks into overdrive. I really wish we would’ve gotten that last book.

@hsffaudioblog 3 ай бұрын

God Emperor is where the science-fiction really starts.

@chrisw6164 3 ай бұрын

Dune through God Emperor of Dune are essential (IMO). The final two Heretics and Chapterhouse were the start of something new. There are strong ties to the earlier saga, but it’s really its own thing, so your mileage may vary. Yes Dune can be read as a standalone novel if you choose. If you’ve only read Dune, then you already know that it DOES have a proper ending. So it’s readers choice if you want to move on to the (incredible) books in the original quartet.

@dpo8bwee 3 ай бұрын

Heretics completely blew me away! I still need to read Chapterhouse, but my tactic has been to read the entire series through to get to the new book, so I have to reread the first five before I tackle the last. I've been savoring the series since 2010. (My earlier attempt to read Dune in the 80s failed)

@ForgeofAule 2 ай бұрын

@@dpo8bwee I just finished Chapterhouse and you are definitely in for a treat! After it ends, there is an afternote about his wife that was beautiful and I recommend reading it when you finish

@MinecraftPigSniper 2 ай бұрын

100% 1-4 are mandatory reads. If you loved those then keep reading, otherwise you can jump off happy enough I guess, but honestly heretics is such a unique and interesting read.

@tuffguy0134 3 ай бұрын

Dune is my favorite book of all time also. When I read Messiah for the 1st time, I was surprised. The ending to Messiah was sad, but understandable.

@dustinneely 3 ай бұрын

I read all 6 of Frank's books and I was conflicted on my feelings for CoD & GEoD at first. However I've grown to love all 6. I think Heretics & Chapterhouse are underrated. Miles Teg is a bad@$$.

@hunterkat 3 ай бұрын

Miles Teg is the only good thing about Heretics and Chapterhouse

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

I've often thought I'm old enough now to try them again and maybe I'll feel differently. I just never have.

@dustinneely 3 ай бұрын

@@hunterkat I disagree. The message from Leto II left for the Bene Gesserit in the future was pretty epic. There is some cool stuff in the books if you are willing to let go of the past.

@hunterkat 3 ай бұрын

@@dustinneely I’m allowed to have my own opinion, and my opinion is that the sexual imprinting stuff was ridiculous and I did not like the other group like the Bene Gesserit with their alternate spice, I thought their motivations were hard to read at best- I don’t even remember what they were supposed to be doing, except trying to take over planets with sexual imprinting which as I said is ridiculous. I also don’t know why Duncan Idaho had to be brought back so many times, he should’ve stopped being a character after God Emperor. Miles Teg was the only interesting part of it, and the rest was either tedious or extremely ridiculous. I don’t mind weird, I read and enjoyed Children of Dune and God Emperor. But there’s definitely a limit. I did like the plot line of spice being scarce and trying to recreate Arrakis. I’m not saying they’re irredeemably bad or anything. I just don’t care for them, even with some good elements.

@dustinneely 3 ай бұрын

@@hunterkat I'm allowed to have my own opinion too.

@Surllio 3 ай бұрын

I nicknamed Heretics and Chapterhouse the "Old Pervert Herbert" books. I didn't hate them, and my nickname is mostly a joke. But I tell everyone it's the story of multiple factions struggling for the breeding control of 2 youths. It's a little weird, but he WAS going somewhere with it. What Anderson and Brian did, as much as they swear it's based on notes, flies against the very idea that Frank stressee in all his books, including a massive misread of what the Butlarian Jihad is.

@giantsizegeek 3 ай бұрын

Yes, their attempt at concluding the story was extremely lame. Bringing back all the dead characters & then not doing much with them, very bad.

@dpeady78 3 ай бұрын

Just finished Messiah this morning - first read since I was a teen and I really didn’t get it then … Definitely works better with age and experience

@user-cy6ep2iy9t 3 ай бұрын

Dune is one of my favorite books I’ve ever read. Yet God Emperor of Dune remains strong in my mind. The questions it asks, the things we ponder on, the reflections of past events. Damn… God Emperor may not be my favorite but it was a book that truly left an impression on me for the rest of my life. 🤯

@Tim_with_Tomes_and_Tales 3 ай бұрын

I just watched Brian Lee Durfee's video yesterday praising House Harkkonen. Things are subjective, I guess. I know Kevin J Anderson wrote many of those Star Wars EU books. I agree that Messiah and Children should be read together.

@cloudbloom 3 ай бұрын

Book 4 was one of the most thought provoking books i ever read when i was a teenager, i always encourage new readers to at least read the first 4

@Paul_McSeol 3 ай бұрын

I loved the Dune books, so much so that I did read the KJA/BH books all because I wanted to keep inhabiting the universe. It was not awesome. The completely retroactively changed the end of chapter house to give us a cardboard thin plot with a feud ex machine ending that was a gross disappointment.

@Paul_McSeol 3 ай бұрын

Ok, how does auto correct change deus to feud?

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

I read about 70 pages into Hunters of Dune and got so mad. I still can't believe I finished that damn book.

@TheAdoringFan 3 ай бұрын

Mike I love your channel! Book tube is blessed to have you

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

Wow, thanks so much!

@jacrsherb 3 ай бұрын

I read the first 3 books around the time the first Denis V film came out. Loved all 3 and have been interested but warned about continuing. I might get 4 and go back through then see how I feel. Thanks for the recommendation

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

My pleasure!

@sl8rsmith 3 ай бұрын

I think my favorite was Children of Dune, it felt tighter and more precise, it explored a lot of the same themes as the first book but expanded upon to the nth degree. I liked God emperor and appreciate its weirdness but after Children I didnt think it was THAT weird, but I'll say God Emperor was the one I struggled through because it didn't have the same level of suspense that the others had.

@waalex11 3 ай бұрын

I'm so curious about this, but will wait to watch this after I watch Dune Messiah. Then either hope the rest gets adapted, or continue to never care to read the books, but I appreciate every info I get from the ones who have read it. You included. Thank you.

@dpbreviews1513 3 ай бұрын

My humble opinion is that Dune is a great stand alone story, Kind’ve like what a New Hope is to Star Wars. I definitely agree that one needs to treat Dune Messiah and Children of Dune as one book. I think that both are great. At this present time I’ve only read Dune Messiah and Children of Dune once, but plan on reading them again. I first read the Dune trilogy as one huge paperback format (The Great Dune Trilogy), although once I got it was a bit overwhelming at first because of the physical size of the book, it did though give me the opportunity to literally turn the page over to start C.O.D as soon as I finished D.M, which may have helped my reading experience. I do also own each book as seperate paperbacks also now as well as the ACE hardback special editions of the trilogy, because I love the series so much. One could end it after C.O.D, but I would also encourage to read God Empereror of Dune if you’ve got that far to explore the Golden Path more, though it does get weirder. The Heretics and Chapterhouse books I’m really glad I read and own. I thought they were good also, probably not as strong as the first 3/4, but maybe that’s because I’m more attached to the characters in those books. Though Miles Teg I thought was really cool, especially one particular scene action wise was great! Frank Herbert definitely took a risk at the end of Heretics that I thought was an interesting one to explore.

@gunmayhem1106 3 ай бұрын

I hope one day you may reread Heretics and Chapterhouse, because like you said with Paul and books 2 and 3 and how important they are to know the characters and it's motivations, Leto II does not end at book 4. Also I am a little biased since Heretics is my favourite dune book even as a standalone, without Chapterhouse, and I hope one day to watch it as a cyberpunk tv or streaming series.

@zn12914 3 ай бұрын

Very unpopular opinion but I wasn’t a big fan of Dune! However i’ve loved the movies, and now that I know that a Dune Messiah movie has been greenlit, I plan on picking it up. Excited to give the series another chance!

@Gehrber Ай бұрын

Just finished Dune and Dune Messiah due to me also loving the movies. And honestly, dune is an okayish book, Messiah sucks for 75%, although I liked the ending.

@Gehrber Ай бұрын

Just finished Dune and Dune Messiah due to me also loving the movies. And honestly, dune is an okayish book, Messiah straight out sucks for 75%. Admittedly, I liked the ending of messiah.

@Gehrber Ай бұрын

Just finished Dune and Dune Messiah due to me also loving the movies. And honestly, dune is an okayish book, Messiah straight out sucks for 75%. Admittedly, I liked the ending of messiah.

@johnwong8146 3 ай бұрын

I found Heretics and CH to be really entertaining. You get to learn a lot about the Bene Gesserit. Of all 6 books, my favorite was Children of Dune as the characters and plot lines were amazing.

@michaelsamerdyke108 3 ай бұрын

A very good talk. Enjoyed what you said about Srar Wars.

@user-oe9ke7zs6b 3 ай бұрын

Random question but does anybody know what bookshelves he has? I'm trying to find a nice dark shelving

@Fianna1775 3 ай бұрын

I’m so very glad to see this video! I adore Messiah and Children though they are a bit wonky and really should be reread. I plan on re listening to God Emperor soon. I think these books are the ones that make the series special and define the themes Frank set up in the original book. I believe Frank took some inspiration, amongst many other things, Greek tragedies particularly the Oresteia, with the Atreides being descended from Agamemnon. Mike, I know you like to remain as positive as possible for which you have my respect. But would you consider doing a little short on why you don’t like the toilet paper books? Brian Herbert as a person irritated me because he whines. So I’m not buying them. But you allusions to the distain you feel interests me. Happy reading!

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

Agreed!

@jeremyabrahamson2872 3 ай бұрын

I personally consider them a tad higher quality than their reputation suggests, but all of their faults Mike described accurately. Its probably more fair to compare them to... say... The Drizzit Saga to LOTR. They're fun candy but they absolutely dont belong in Dune, for a plethora of thematic, tonal, continuity, and mechanical issues with the main saga, and the shift is so radical its poverty insulting and rightly so.

@jaredschmidt8440 3 ай бұрын

If you’ve read Hyperion, which I know you have, something about books 5 and 6 in the Dune Saga are reminiscent of Dan Simmons ideas surrounding the Shrike and that whole slowing down time effect/perception. It seems like Herbert was way ahead of his time and offered all of today’s best ideas which inevitably made themselves into movies. Herbert had an incredible mind.

@EricMcLuen 3 ай бұрын

I might have enjoyed Fall of Hyperion more if half of it was just a condensed version of the the later Dune Books.

@calebmauer1751 3 ай бұрын

@@EricMcLuen Fall at least wrapped things up and provided explanations for everything...then he ruined it in the Endymion books with retconning that makes Fall of Hyperion make no sense.

@TheCrazyCanuck420 3 ай бұрын

A little off topic, does anyone have recommendations on audio book versions of Dune (and sequels) that they recommend? I almost bought the audible version that has a bunch of voice actors, but the reviews are all over the place. Or should Dune be just read and audio books based on it be avoided in general?

@Brink801 3 ай бұрын

I personally love the audible version of Dune. I’ve listened to it while working 3 different times through. The voice acting and subtle sounds take an audio book to the next level imo.

@jam406 2 ай бұрын

The ones narrated by Scott Brick are fantastic!

@GholaMuadDib 3 ай бұрын

I loved all six books. Mid way through God Emperor, the Ghola became my favorite character. Hence my name here. My favorite book is Messiah. I like how everyone is suddenly against Paul. All the people plotting to take him down. The four or five conspirators is pretty standard. Because I’m a Howard fan, I bring everything back to Conan. It does remind me of Hour of the Dragon or Phoenix on the Sword. You have your Barbarian King, in this case Paul, who takes the throne by force. Suddenly everyone is plotting against him. Even old friends and the people freed from the previous King or Emperor are against him. I love that Messiah is such a downer. I also liked picking out everything Lucas took for Star Wars. Even into the later books for the prequels. Right down to the Sith.

@jakobwetzel7065 3 ай бұрын

I’ll be reading Messiah and children this year. Very excited to continue. I was planning on stopping after that but I’ll probably read God emperor on your recommendation to complete the golden path!

@esteban7143- 2 ай бұрын

I’m at the end of children of dune, and with every turn of the page I want to read god emperor more and more.

@halifirien 3 ай бұрын

Heretics and Chapterhouse are my favorites of the series because I love the Bene Gesserit. Comparing them to the Aes Sedai is how my friend got me to read The Wheel of Time.

@loringmsuess 3 ай бұрын

I loved the way the Bene Gesserit Grew and learned purpose. Miles Teg and Darwi Odrade were among my top favorite characters.

@procurement3681 2 ай бұрын

I was really getting into Herbert's prose, the way he wrote was very evocative. I love books that aren't mysteries per se, but that have a lot of mysteries that slowly unfold and these books are great for that. A true shame he passed before writing many more books in the series. What Brian Herbert did was like watching a great painter's kid doing finger painting, just an absolute waste of time.

@Magicman1625 3 ай бұрын

I have read Dune three times now which felt necessary to fully understand it for me. Dune Messiah i was initially turned off by but im glad i made myself keep going because that ending was perfect! Currently reading Children of Dune and am loving the characters so far! I plan to finish God Emperor next and stop there. In the first two books Alia was definitely my favorite character! Who is yours?

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

I've read the original 13 times and I pick up new things each trip.

@Denz-El Ай бұрын

Thanks for the tips! 😊👍I'm a fan of "Hero's Journey" stories, so I guess the end of book 1 would be my jumping off point if I ever get around to reading it.

@Lion0fTheDesert 2 ай бұрын

Thank you, very clear, helped me solidify that I want to read the first 3 at least if not 4. I will say that it is possible for extra material to work. I attribute my love for Star Wars more to the Knights of the Old Republic I played as a kid. Like you said is the story needs to be compelling.

@flotilha935 3 ай бұрын

My ranking is: 1- God Emperor 2- Dune 3- Heretics 4- Children 5- Chapterhouse 6- Messiah

@Jordblitz 2 ай бұрын

As somebody who likes the world building and geopolitical lore side of dune more than the philosophical insights of Herbert, all of the books after Children are a travesty.

@flotilha935 2 ай бұрын

@@Jordblitz no

@Jordblitz 2 ай бұрын

@@flotilha935 um, objectively yes 😂

@flotilha935 2 ай бұрын

@@Jordblitz“The truth always carries the ambiguity of the words used to express it.”

@Jordblitz 2 ай бұрын

@@flotilha935 this is literally the exact thing the books after Children get bogged down in instead of crafting a realistic and dynamic universe 😂

@ppowerman5000 3 ай бұрын

I like Brian/KevinJ works on Dune😅. But I do love more GodEmperor,Heretics and Chapterhouse. For me, those last 3 books are fantastic! 😅

@aquabotstudios4444 3 ай бұрын

no need to sweat after every sentence, it'll be alright😂

@governorbreck2205 2 ай бұрын

I agree with your take on the first four Dune novels, but also liked 'Heretics of Dune' and 'Chapterhouse Dune' more than you apparently did. I kind of liked the Honored Matres and their inversion of Bene Gesserit disciplines. Alas, 'Chapterhouse Dune' didn't exactly end on a cliffhanger, but it felt woefully... incomplete. I wish Frank Herbert had managed to wrap up the Honored Matres story. I also generally agree that the books by Brian Herbert and Kevin J Anderson aren't in the same league as Frank Herbert's original series-- and I haven't read them all-- but I quite liked 'Paul of Dune.' I think 'Paul of Dune' is worth reading between 'Dune' and 'Dune Messiah,' with the understanding that it doesn't live up to either of those novels, because I do think it adds to the overall setting.

@jakeremmert6643 3 ай бұрын

I personally still really enjoyed Heretics and Chapterhouse, although quite a bit less than books 1-4. I thought Teg was awesome but the main attraction to me was getting a lot more of the bene gesserit which is one of my favorite things about the entire series! Overall, I think stopping after Messiah, Children, or God Emperor are all very reasonable recommendations for people. To me, God Emperor feels like the most complete ending to the story, but it's definitely not something everyone will enjoy.

@Dylan13Collins 3 ай бұрын

I haven't read the third book yet. But after reading 1 and 2, I think book 2 is actually more of what I was wanting and hoping for from this series. Heavy is the head that holds the crown. I'm excited to start 3 soon!

@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy 3 ай бұрын

Excellent video, Mike! I will finally read beyond Dune to at least Dune Messiah and Children of Dune. I'm not sure about crazy town . . . But never say never!

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

Dude it’s full on philosophical batshit. You’ll love it.

@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy 3 ай бұрын

@@mikesbookreviews Ha ha! 😂

@Stitchman3875 2 ай бұрын

I read the the six. The sequels were really good for me but I can understand how they feel. Personally I like God Emperor of Dune best. It felt like it was the answer to the main issue of the series. First time I read them I viewed Paul as the hero. But as I recently started reading again and saw all the interviews gave me a different perspective. The Dune books are books that you need to read a few times to catch more of the ideas.

@fallenhero3130 3 ай бұрын

Would you consider making a video just explaining why the Brian Herbert books are considered so controversial and polarizing to the fanbase? I'm genuinely curious what the deal is with them, speaking as an outsider to the series.

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

It really wouldn’t take a full video. He isn’t a good writer, has no respect for the rules his father set up, and he has constant continuity errors. It was just a case of a paycheck for him. Still is.

@emanimal728 3 ай бұрын

@@mikesbookreviews I agree that the Brian and Kevin books are just estate authorized fan fiction. Poetry (Frank) vs. prose (Brian). Singing (Frank) vs. local news report or book report (Brian). I did give them a chance, though. They continued to disappoint with no reason to expect improvement.

@Thecatladybooknook_PennyD 3 ай бұрын

Thanks for making this! I read Dune before the Part1 came out and loved both the book and the movie. Then i decided earlier this week that i really want to reread Dune and this video convinced me to make reading Dune Messiah a priority as well as to see Part 2. I just got back from the movie and I'm HYPED to read at least the 4 books!🎉🎉

@mrt9043 3 ай бұрын

I read Dune for the first time when I was 13 (1983) so I can really relate to a lot of your story. I was really surprised by how much I loved and gobbled up Heretics and Chapterhouse. God Emperor took a few tries. In the end I went back and read the Brian/Anderson Prelude books, which I actually enjoyed, although they pale in comparison to Dune. Then, I just kept going all the way through Chapterhouse. Didn't make it past page 1 of the other Brian Herbert stuff that followed. Have you picked up any other of Frank Herbert's work? I enjoyed Soul Catcher. I'm about to watch Dune 2, and only recently saw Dune 1, and gearing up to read them all again, it's been about 15 years.

@mrt9043 3 ай бұрын

I felt depressed at the end of Chapterhouse partly because there wasn't going to ever be any more. It felt like stopping a book with 2 chapters to go. Wouldn't it be amazing if a Ghola of Frank could continue the story.

@catmanduu66 Ай бұрын

I agree with you. Loved the trilogy, liked God Emperor and was super confused with the last two. I tell everyone if they've only seen the movie they might not like the book since the movies were made from the throw away lines in the book. I feel if they do another movie it will be about the Jihad and they'll skim over the rest of the book. What I never saw coming is the guy who is the connecting character, no spoilers, to all the books. That was kind of wild to me. If he is the next one at least people love the actor and would love seeing him some more. The way he'll be portrayed if they stick to the book, considering who it is, might make some people very confused.

@royalt8318 Ай бұрын

So I watched this review before I started any of the Dune books, I just re-watched it after finishing God Emperor and it makes so much more sense now and I have to agree with him on just about everything. He said I’m not sure if I’m going to read more after this, but I’m definitely going to reread the series with the knowledge gain from God Emperor and I think that will completely change book one. Just thoughts before I dig back in

@bertiebrown581 3 ай бұрын

I need a begrudging explainer of the Brian Herbert Dune-iverse 😂

@guerrillagorilla6537 2 ай бұрын

I came to this video thinking “Wow, someone is actually going to defend the books his son wrote, this should be interesting.” Seriously, who says the official sequels suck? God Emperor is dynamite.

@TheSpotlessMind93 3 ай бұрын

I myself stopped at God Emperor, which I found to be a bit of a slog. I am happy stopping there as the conclusion of The Golden Path. I read the plot summaries of the last two books and they sound so utterly distant from the original story. It just doesn't interest me with the original characters all gone (not counting the gholas). I think the first 3 books worked better as a conclusive trilogy, but Leto's transformation makes God Emperor required reading even though I wasn't a huge fan of it.

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

It's definitely the best stopping point.

@jozefstreicher 3 ай бұрын

Hm, I don't think the Golden path is concluded in the 4th book. As I see it, the golden path continues and all the events of Heretics and Chapterhouse are direct consequences of the golden path (and the stupidity of Bene Gesserit, too). Also, the Atreides family lives on - Miles Teg, Darwi Odrade are both Atreides. And we can count Duncan Idaho as Atreides too, who is revived as ghola again and again and again...

@CodyMapping 2 ай бұрын

Sheeana is also from the Siona and Duncan line, so she's also an Atreides. Same goes for Lucilla.

@darren_16 3 ай бұрын

As someone who's always wanted to read dune (but has heard that the sequels weren't very good) this video was exactly what I needed. Will be reading at least the first 4 now

@flipjohnstone6618 3 ай бұрын

I would hardly call the original ones page turners, to be frank. I am not a fan of Frank Herbert's writing style. He seems like he was quite a fascinating accomplished fellow though, outside of his writing.

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

I would never describe Dune books as page turners, I agree

@IamSedrik 3 ай бұрын

I read all Herbert books a few years back. 1-4 are great, 5 and 6 where a slow, slow slog until the end of them both where something did happen. My favorites are 3-4, really like the story about the god emperor and what he goes through.

@rhahnabunaid 3 ай бұрын

I never read past God Emperor myself because it was just getting way too weird and, like you said, not what I had expected. Good to hear that, apparently, I haven't missed much by ignoring the last two.

@chrisw6164 3 ай бұрын

It becomes a more standard space opera in book 5, so the super-weirdness of God Emperor or Dune ends with that book.

@barkingmadenvsci 3 ай бұрын

Dune Messiah is my favourite of the sequels. I think Heretics and Chapterhouse (if finished) could of been a great sequel trilogy to Paul/Leto's golden path story. Although they are a continuation, and important in Herberts vision they are almost like a spinoff series.

@Cathartesaurea Ай бұрын

The main character of the Dune series is humanity itself and nothing less. I can't imagine not reading the first three, they tell the full story and are inseparable, imnsho. God Emperor was more of an acquired taste for me but I have come to treasure it. Put together, the first 4 books are one of the great achievements in all of literature, for the ideas and philosophy alone. Heretics and Chapterhouse are enjoyable but not "great". Btw, Paul is not a hero, nor an anti-hero. He's a human, meaning he's both, like we all are. Same with Leto II.

@bigaldoesbooktube1097 3 ай бұрын

This is great stuff to hear. I am now really looking forward to reading at least the first three sequels 👍

@cosmic_kid2868 3 ай бұрын

I might be wrong but Frank finished Heretics and Chapterhouse before he passed but the two books were supposed to be a new trilogy and he never finished the 7th book. Brian and Kevin ended up supplementing books 5 and 6 with Hunters and Sandworms of Dune.

@BenjaminKreis 3 ай бұрын

"Challenging the reader" is a lost art. It really saddens me that our culture has lost an appreciation for it. My favorite book of all time would have to be Lord of the Rings. And there are parts in that book that have been painfully dull for me. But as I've read and reread it, I've come to realize they aren't by accident. Tolkien is intentional in what he's doing. If a reader is willing to put in the work, he will be rewarded.

@KindlesandKicks 3 ай бұрын

Good to know the sequels can be enjoyable reads, if you go in with the right expectations.

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

Absolutely.

@jasonthedave6140 26 күн бұрын

Also, I'm so glad there's Dune fans out there who feel the same way about the BH/KJA fan fiction.

@focusrelax8838 3 ай бұрын

1:10 books from high school are not Worn at all 😂 they seem to be in a really “well care taken” throughout the years! Good job! However I don’t see them close up only at what you display them at and they look great! I prefer the older versions better! Great video! I got the first book! Read some threads and decide I will stop at book 1.

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

Well my copy of the original broke in half. And yeah I try to take care of my books as much as possible.

@aureliananghel7236 3 ай бұрын

So you do have Glen Cook in your library!

@ChadZaugg 3 ай бұрын

Did Frank Herbert finish writing Chapterhouse himself? Chapterhouse is one of favorites. I think that I’ve read all of the abomination books to date. Obviously they’re no one’s favorites. I just wish that I could read all of Frank’s notes. After I read one of his write ups for Dune, I now see the abominations a little differently. Not good, but I think his son probably followed his notes more closely than he himself would have. I also kinda think that the Dune written without Beverly isn’t entirely Dune.

@jeremyabrahamson2872 3 ай бұрын

My buddies and I typically make the split after Messiah. Messiah and Chapterhouse both have the most concrete endings in the series, even if the golden path never resolves, and if you start from Children you might as well stick around for Chapterhouse (which is a fantastic book, if nowhere the tier of GE or D1.) The third arc (heretics/Chapterhouse) is pretty self contained in those two books, so they dont leave their own story open, and they develop and flesh out a lot of the golden path, without much its difficult to fully understand GE.

@patrickwilson1459 27 күн бұрын

I just finished reading the first trilogy and despite my vague interest in reading books and this franchise I’ve decided to just stick with the first trilogy. Still pretty good recommendation, and how the books are better than the movies. Someday if I get a chance I’ll check out the 2000 3 part miniseries as well as the sequel from 2003.

@DragonWarrior976 2 ай бұрын

Change is always welcomed Brother! As change is the only permanent which exists. Blake Crouch is one of my favorites too. Haven’t read Lonesome Dove or Sun Eater so you are leading the pack by miles. 😊. God speed. My positive vibes are with Brian. Hope is makes it out hail and hearty. Authors are a precious community who help us dream with eyes open.

@AuthorJohnADouglas 3 ай бұрын

Man, everybody hates those Brian/Kevin books.

@BigmanDogs 3 ай бұрын

I think the problem is that the things I fell in love with when it came to dune where not necessarily the things that the author was the most interested in, and knowing what happened in the later books actually diminished my enjoyment of the original. I didnt spoil myself on purpose. Like, I figured things would end really poorly for Paul, but I was personally mostly interested in the political intrigue and the societies and cultural institutions. I personally did not find his philosophical discussions as profound as he himself found it. Especially from the perspective of political science. Most of it is very entry level theorizing described with very flowery and self-important language. And the later books seemingly contain more and more of that. I think thats probably why some people say the later books are "bad". They focus shifts/becomes more apparent. I enjoyed Dune Messiah and Children of Dune on an intellectual level, but I wasnt emotionally invested by that point. God emperor dune is kind of the opposite in that I actually was emotionally invested again, but I stopped being intellectually invested as I kind of stopped looking at him as a highly intelligent author, I know that sounds mean but it is what it is.

@ryu_street_fighter561 3 ай бұрын

God Emperor of Dune is hands down the best book!

@DavidArcuri 3 ай бұрын

Wow, those were the editions I read 35 years ago also. Checked out from the library though, not purchased. :D

@darkclaw3296 3 ай бұрын

God Emperor is my favorite in the series, and LetoII is actually my dream role! I would love to play that character on screen!

@simonduran9376 3 ай бұрын

One of the things I don't like about the series in general is how certain characters feel underdeveloped for me, squandered even. I wanted more from Jessica, Irulan, Chani, Ghanima and the Fenrings (where the hell did they go lol), but for some reason, Frank Herbert didn't deliver that much imho. I haven't started God Emperor yet, but I'm curious to see if this trend is gonna be repeated there and beyond.

@RebelWithoutABoss 3 ай бұрын

Messiah's my favorite out the bunch

@tysmith1742 24 күн бұрын

What would you say to me … if I said heretics and chapterhouse were my favorite books of the series?…🤔

@CodyMapping 2 ай бұрын

Once the Atreides story is over. Miles Teg, Darwi Odrade, Sheeana and to a certain point Duncan: Are we a joke to you?

@RedFuryBooks 3 ай бұрын

Nobody show this video to Brian Herbert! 🤣 This video makes me happy because I generally recommend the first four and then stop, so I'm glad to have the same view as a lifelong fan of these books!

@brewster_4 3 ай бұрын

For a second I thought you were talking about the Brian Herbert sequels and got really confused

@neilthehermit4655 2 ай бұрын

The six written by Frank are great, the ones written by the 'inheritors' are... variable in quality, and could stand as a separate series. Not as good but if you hadn't read the original they are acceptable. Not great, but acceptable.

@Trygvar13 3 ай бұрын

God Emperor is by far my favourite Dune novel. Then Chapterhouse, Dune, Heretics, of Dune, Dune Messiah and far behind Children of Dune. I never really liked that one. The Atreides story is not over after God Emperor. Miles Teg is Atreides. Darwi Odrade is Atreides. And it was clear that the Enemy was the Face Dancers... not the bloody thinking machines.

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

Fair enough.

@Ecusu 3 ай бұрын

"Not the bloody thinking machines" I doubt that the thinking machines coming back would be handled the way Brian Herbert did it, but if you think Frank was not also going in that direction, you might want to give God Emperor a re-read. Siona and Leto have a prescient vision of hunter machines when Siona is tripping balls.

@Nixicated 3 ай бұрын

I just read Dune for the first time today and I LOOOVED IT! Thank you so much for this video. I also heard that the other books suck and I almost didn't pick them up. But now, I'll start reading Messiah tonight. Already loaded on my phone.

@bobc538 3 ай бұрын

Hey Mike, I tried to read book 2 and I could only do a couple of pages. Too much politics for me. I did read two of the prequel. House Atredides and House Harkkonen

@zenster1097 3 ай бұрын

As a non-book reader and lover of the show, should Dennis make Children? He seems to only want to go to Messiah. I thought Children was supposed to be crazy too, but it sounds like from you it's still filmable. What do you think?

@new_mercury5367 3 ай бұрын

I read Dune many years ago and never got around to the sequels. About 6 years ago, I re-read Dune and then read Messiah and Children but I've had God Emperor sat on my shelf for a few years now but I haven't had the urge to read it yet..... maybe soon

@haplozetetic9519 3 ай бұрын

I can see why some don't like the story, but it was a perfect fit for me after having read some other serious sci-fi, including a number of P. K. Dick's short stories before I got to Dune. I was also in my early teens at the time. It's still my second favorite book series after Wheel of Time and just above Lord of the Rings.

@KALtheHighstorm117 3 ай бұрын

I've heard about how bad the Brian Herbert books are, but I don't know any of the details. What makes them so bad?

@penvzila Ай бұрын

I thought you were talking about the prequels there for a minute and I was about to write something that would get me banned lol

@WordsinTime 3 ай бұрын

I’ve only read Dune but I plan to pick up Dune Messiah in the next couple of months!

@WheeledWarrior69 3 ай бұрын

I read all 6 books when I was a teenager as well. I remember struggling with all of them-especially the first 4 books. There is ALOT of philosophy in them that went way over my head at that age (and still does to be honest). I agree with Mike that Dune Messiah and Children of Dune should be read together and I feel are actually 1 whole book. I still enjoyed Heretics and Chapterhouse and even though they are quite different than the other 4 books Frank still wrote them and I attribute the differences to age and time (I think he wrote Chapterhouse about 20 years after Dune). People change in 20 years. They are still good books. I will take exception to Mike's thoughts on Brian's and MJA's prequels and sequels. I enjoy them very much. I don't consider them "bastardizations" of the original. I think they give a more complete story of the Dune Universe. In my opinion they do tend to be a little long-winded but the stories are interesting and still thought-provoking. Albeit not as much so as with Frank's books. I haven't read all of the sequels but what I have I've enjoyed very much. Some might consider them "fan fiction" but I do not. I highly suggest fans of Frank's works to read the prequels and sequels. Sure they're written in a different style (different writers have different styles after all) but they doesn't mean they aren't well-written and a lot of fun to read.

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

Indeed. That's why I wonder if Heretics and Chapterhouse would work better for me at this age than at 16.

@WheeledWarrior69 3 ай бұрын

@@mikesbookreviews I'm not sure. To be honest, a few years ago (even before I knew they were remaking "Dune" I reread Dune, Dune Messiah, Children of Dune and God Emperor of Dune. I used to have all 6 books but somehow lost Heretics and Chapterhouse. It would be interesting reread those now. As I said in my original comment, Frank wrote those books approximately 20 years after "Dune" so even though there was a lot of the same ideas/themes from the original book he matured as a writer and probably in his thoughts on different subjects so those later books had a different tone to them. Much more mentally digestible in my recollection. By the way, I've also read the "Pandora Sequence" books and you can see inklings of "Dune" in there but they are far inferior (even though they were done after "Dune). They were a slog for me and I almost didn't finish them. Not because dense themes but because of bad writing.

@wassr1956 3 ай бұрын

Edgar Rice Burroughs Mars(Barsoom) series influence all Sci fi after it, especially Star Wars, Flash Gordon,writers like Jack Vance, Jack McDevitt, Asimov, Ruocchio, Greg Bear, E.C Tubb etc, etc.

@samofWinterfell 3 ай бұрын

Thanks Mike I’m obsessed with the first book and the world of Dune now.

@mikesbookreviews 3 ай бұрын

Welcome!

@dianaayt 3 ай бұрын

I read Dune 2 years ago. A lot flew through my head. I liked it but I didn't loved it. Decided to read the 2nd one now, finished it yesterday and I actually like this one much more. But I don't understand how there can be even more books. If the ending of the last book is "undone" I will be mad haha

@nivekleveb8872 3 ай бұрын

I like Dune Messiah and God Emperor of Dune more than Dune, particularly the latter which is one of my favorite novels. The only Dune sequel that I have some problems with is Children of Dune, which I just feel needs to be tightened up in places, specifically Leto's odyssey. I like how weird stuff gets after the Scattering with the Honored Matres, Futars, Miles Teg, etc (if far future epic SF doesn't occasionally make you uncomfortable, it's not trying very hard imo) and while I would've liked to see where Frank Herbert was going with the story, I've come to see Chapterhouse as a fine ending.

@Ariana.333 3 ай бұрын

I'm on God Emperor Of Dune almost done with it very good in my opinion. I'm loving the series so far.

@Griffnix 3 ай бұрын

I enjoyed Dune. Read it before the movie but I thought the characters were weak. Recently finished Messiah and liked where it went and am interested in reading children but I don't think I'll read it anytime soon. I already know the craziness that happens in the sequels and part of me wants to read God Emperor to see how it all plays out. And yeah I think I'll stop there, especially reading that Herbert wanted Heretics to be the start of a new trilogy and it sadly didn't get concluded by him.

@malafakka8530 Ай бұрын

I think Dune Messiah is the perfect ending for Paul's story, at least. Sure, some things are left unanswered, but as far as the tragedy of it all is concerned, I couldn't be more satisfied with it. I think you can stop at any of the first four books and be okay with it. Books 5 and 6 are interesting, but I found it it very difficult to get through them. I don't think that I will ever bother with the books by Brian Herbert. I am just not interested.

@Chingon81s 3 ай бұрын

The sequels are dense as far as content, not length. The Golden Path is still something I still don’t completely understand, however, I agree that books 1-3 and 4 as an epilogue are essential. I enjoyed Heretics and am currently on Chapterhouse.

@olahedberg8613 18 күн бұрын

I just finished heretics, and it just didnt do it for me. Loved them up until this one though. Loved God emperor.

@jasonthedave6140 26 күн бұрын

I love all 6 of them. Heretics is one of my favorite of the series.

@lv-426paradise3 3 ай бұрын

I liked the first three (although it did take forty years to reread Dune after a few false starts, then read the next two). God, Emperor was really weird, Heretics wasn’t bad. I have Chapterhouse left to finish the series, but now I’m almost afraid to read it.