Otto is the one who suggested that Viserys make Rheanyra his heir after the baby died because he didn't want Daemon to be King. Then he whored out his own daughter to Viserys resulting in a marriage & male heirs who could contest Rhaenyra's claim. He is absolutely culpable for the current conflict.

Okay -- Jason can see the history of old Valyria IN THE TAPESTRY while the rest of us are still marveling at the needlework -- clearly the right people are in charge of this podcast ♥

Olivia and Phia join in at 35:02

they both have beautiful voices, wonderfully casted for such a tragic story to portray

31:00 I think Daemon told them a son for a son, when asked if they couldn't find Aemond.

35:02 Olivia Cooke and Phia Saban segment begins

I wish they show the video recording too

Daemon doesn't get sad--he gets mad & then he gets even.

Kinda disturbing how many people are complaining the murder of a child wasn't graphic or shocking enough

Love Olivia's take on the Alicent/Cole relationship - grief doing strange things to them, sex being the opposite of death. And you know what? Good for her, she deserves some good sex after almost 20 years with Viserys!

That ending line went so hard "they killed the boy" 😮😮😮

Way I took the Daemon scene with Blood and Cheese is that he said “son for a son”, if they couldn’t find aemond. No one said “son for a son” until Blood said it and no reason for him to make that up. Also it’s the name of the episode. So yes and no, Daemon didn’t say kill the kid, but bring him the head of “a son”. Which is essentially the same thing since in the show Aegon only has one son when the books he has 2.

they both have beautiful voices

Aemond is about to f*** s*** up.

Brilliant start to the second season! I will ask… not all of us have read the books so please be more careful of spoilers. You kind of hinted at a future event in this podcast, so maybe use other modal verbs instead of “will”, like “might” or “may”.

38:00 I liked the book version better, with her choosing the baby Maelor. And how that affects her psychological.

42:21 "mother sees her children as an extension of herself" okaaaaay Queen Cersei

Great podcast!!! Keep up the awesome work!!!!

The new Queen said she didn’t want her son to be King and Aegon still took him to Council. She definitely wasn’t going to punish her Daughter. She is now safe. Son Never was!

We knew the story…personally I was relieved they were more discrete!

Helaena is gonna have a sad ending. Cant wait for more drama.

Not brunch 😭😭😭

I feel like Aegon is the same dude. He just finds it entertaining to play the role of a good king.

Alicent getting some is so hypocritical because she's doing the very thing she hated Rhaenyra for. I felt bad for Helaena because she's innocent but what did the Greens (Aemond and Aegon) think would happen, that they could kill a member of team black and that none of them would be harmed back?!

I wasn't that struck by the final event of the episode. With exception to the beheading of Ned Stark it's not like GoT to do violence and gore offscreen. I saw a somewhat emotionless Helaena immediately point to her son when asked and then grab her daughter and flee. So to me, the heart-wrenchingness people are referring to is only from projecting one's one emotion onto what it would be like to have one's child murdered in front of them-- not from the actual execution of the scene.

GOT !!!!!

I’m sure the BINGO card will be full by episode 4 lol

I think Daemon processes grief as a soldier/ warrior. I mean his job is taking out others who are his enemy. He sees death all the time. Also, the son that died wasn't his by blood, so he didn't maybe care as much. He would want his child to be heir before another man's/Strong by blood. Princess Rhaenys as a mother who has lost her children and grandchildren has more empathy for her. As even Alicent does by lighting the candle for Lucerys.

I did not see the Episode, just listening to the Podcast. From this, I hear, that Alicent and Ser Criston have an affair. So two questions: WHY the f...k everyone went nuts about Rhaenyra wanting and had Sex with Ser Criston. She took all the blame of literally everyone that had an opionion on it, whatever that was. With all understanding for Alicent and the reasons mentioned here, on why she agreed to it, she is none of that, she wanted to see herself. In the end, Rhaenyra was absolutely about right, when she said to her, that "now they see you, as you are". And Ser Criston Cole, who blamed Rhyaenyra, she wants to make him a whore, became one. Actually, I would go a step forward and say, that Rhaenyra was in Love with him; he wasn't fun or pleasure for her. And if Ser Criston was honest, she wasn't too. But, there we go. One for the last: I had that slight feeling that there was something already between Alicent and SCC on the Episode with the funeral scene of Laena. That one short, brisk moment, when Lord Commander Westerling asked about who should stand watch, and Viserys looked at Alicent and SCC, and said no, it doesn't have to be the latter. Rhyaenyra was so about right, when she chose her heritance over a Ser Criston Cole. Lord Commander Westerling had all my sympathy for leaving the small council, actually doing, what Ser Criston Cole could have done. I bet, he knew it that moment, when Westerling left the room.

Brunch! Nice

Now we all know why jon snow kept saying "she is my queen"

Blood and Cheese came and they were brutal, they further escalated the bad blood between the Greens and the Blacks. It's now in the hands of the dragons, sadly 😥

I am loving this show and think the scene was horrifying enough without the extra dialouge etc from the books. I truly do not think anything more was necessary because it was disturbing enough and accomplished officially starting the war.

I know it’s funny Crispin and Alicent being together, but for a podcast that discusses stuff, y’all are not discussing their hypocrisy? They shamed and made Rhaenya’s life miserable for brunching around outside of wedlock, only to turn around and do the same themselves 😂 that would be funny to talk about as well

Otto is out of his depth now. He assumes he can still call the shots but the new generation of royals is unhinged.

Team Black

Two things I’m NOT looking forward to is Helaena jumping and the Gullet because it means we lose my 2 favorite characters. Thank you for being awesome EVERYONE on HOTD. (Even Rhys ifans who plays a very despicable character)

42:25 Olivia is so correct here, how many parents deny that their child is "unusual" in any way. So many people are coming out with stories that their parents knew they're autistic or have ADHD or depressive tendencies or are queer or intersex and they just refuse it and never tell their kids and just let them struggle most of their lives because they just have that much of a blind spot

I saw the burning Aaron hall Megor, the cruel The division of the house of green yeah was nice very different

Team Black !!.

9:05 I only remember reading about Alysanne's mount not flying over the Wall. I don't remember Vermithor (king Jaehaerys' dragon) being mentioned even trying to fly over. The show writers made a mistake in that episode, I think. Might be wrong, it's been a long time since I've read it.

We Love Aegon ❤

I'm the originator of the following theory and I think it should be done! I believe they may have added in the adsence of Maelor as a storyline. Hear me out Maelor being unborn at this time, then Aegon flying to Rooks Rest and what we believe happens to him actually happens; significantly weakens his claim. In turn this will create an issue in the line of succession. As people may speculate that Aegon will be able to produce no more heirs leading to the same problem occurring all over again. People speculate that Aemond is the father of Jhaerys, what if they've done this to show that Maelor is the son of Aemond. He will step in 'do his duty' as he claimed he would on Driftmark and father Maelor on Helena to strengthen the claim to the throne. I think they might do this though, as people have been speculating and it will be a magnificent addition and add the element of show don't tell. I hope this makes some semblance of sense. To add to this, It will also go to show how the Greens only see women as brooding mares and not to be placed in the line of succession. I've struck gold and if the writers have done this to intentionally set this up then they did it well. If not they should do this because I'm clearly a better writer. HA! Agree? Credit This Bitch!

They played Daemon telling B&C to specifically kill Aemond and asked whether he wanted to the young prince killed. No! B&C are just too stupid and came to the conclusion that any prince will do.

44:56 for my alicole girlies

completely ruined it. It's not even about the gruesomeness that makes blood and cheese impactful in the book but the dynamics and that little bit of dialogue that makes it such a psychological horror leading to the character development for Alicent and Helena

Does no one else see what’s happening to Cole as a form of r*pe? The women he’s bedded since taking his oaths (like what, 18 years ago?-does the man not age?!?) all of those women have been the women directly giving him orders. The ones he’s sworn to obey. He literally cannot tell them “no”. I feel a little bad for him. Apparently, he could leave, as Ser Westerling did- but where would he go? We have seen him as a suicidal youth, saved by the Queen, and then perhaps he felt obligated to give his whole life to her- as he had previously done with Rhaenerya. However, when he was young and with the Princess, he refused to be anything but her husband, demanding that she give up all of her duty, family, etc and run away to marry him after she had sex with him ONCE. Now, many years later, he seems to know his place, and not be able to find the courage to leave and find his own happiness.. but, it’s nuanced, because then he is breaking his vows…. Idk. It’s a lot.

Good episode but the blood and cheese change was not a good one. Having Helena choose which on of her kids to be killed, and having the one chosen live and know that his mother picked him to die is a lot more impactful for everyone as opposed to what we saw tonight.

If Dany was in Rhaenys position there was no argument that she would jump on Drogon and flee with Daemon to KL.These people all talking about the politics, the realm, the people and in the end we know how it is end's.Trully indecisiveness of all this peoples in right time and right target caused they downfall.Only empty talks and disasters after disasters while they talk.

Really like the podcast but Jason's voice. It's hard to listen to at times.

Alicent is a big ol 304 hypocrite.

Hweeppppuuh whaaaaaaawwwwwww...

0:10 hoary, not whorey Vhagar

Oh, and one more: eveyone went nuts, Rhaenyra having Sex with Ser Criston Cole. I wonder, how this relationship between Alicent and Crispy Creme, as it is one, will be looked upon. It's the same situation as with Rhaenyra: he is Alicent's sworn protector; he shouldn't have Sex with her. So, I am just curious to know, what is the reason that gives approval in this case? Understanding for Alicent's biography? A lot have mocked about Rhaenyra being the daughter of the king and in a powerful position, to have misused this; but what about now? It only proves, that people want to see, what they want to see. That people WANT to see the glam, the shiny, the nice, the countable; everything that goes beyond it, the dark, the own fears, the own disgusts, the own inner horror-shows, that is not wanted. So people still prefer nice and shiny and glamour and nice smells over things they are afraid of, they are trying to hide and run away. It is so much easier, isn't it? And by this, they are able to literally isolate and let those other ones die. All this because people still rather follow and take the easy way instead of to use what they have to move forward. But cry out when things start to go wrong. I said it once and it seems, I was not so wrong about it: Rhaenyra went on this path only because of the promise she gave to her father. Unfortunately she did not have much choice with Otto's terms after the coronation; once you run, you are always on the run. If she wasn't the heir and there was no prophecy (which in the end turned to be about right), it would have been interesting to see, what kind of ruler Aegon would have been. Team Black, for sure. They have dignity, something Team Green misses.

criston cole doing it with alicent makes NO sense for his character. he did NOT want love conducted in hiding, uncleanly and without honour. alicent offered him what rhaenyra had supposedly taken away with her “spidery” guiles: his unsoiled white cloak, his honour. for crying out loud!

Seriously, the writers ruined blood and cheese. It was written so badly and underwhelming and had almost zero emotional impact. All that happened before the event was good, but why the hell did you have to destroy such an impactful moment of the books? It felt almost boring to watch. No guards in the castle, no one getting caught, not showing the brutal death (not that I like to see something like this, but come on, brutal and disturbing scenes always fit into this world. In the books it was an red wedding-moment, but here it was just lame.), the queen almost seems emotionless. WTF? You didn't do the show a favor when hiring these writers. And what comes to my mind: The man murdered the king's son coldblooded but didn't dare to verify who's the boy or the girl? And instead of bonding the queen they just let her escape? It was written so poorly and extremely lowered my expectations for the following episodes. HotD is not not half as good written as Game of Thrones was.

A missed opportunity with Blood/Cheese, so many elements of what made that moment a MOMENT weren't present: • Helaena's impossible CHOICE. If the writer's thought infanticide was the "shock value" of the Blood/Cheese moment, they're wrong & showing they don't understand the source material. It was more about Helaena's choice, an impossible one for a MOTHER to make, but she's forced to do it, even after pleading for them to take 𝘩𝘦𝘳 life instead (something Show Helaena doesn't even offer to do??). Even without Maelor, as the "spare", this moment as the show did it with just the twins could've hit harder if Helaena was forced to choose which one to sacrifice VS just point out which one is the boy 🙃 • I know it's been forever ago & most of us are blocking out GOT, but GOT had a scene with a mother/baby getting unalived. When Joffrey ordered all of Robert's bastards to be killed & one was a baby. They cut the scene, just showed us the mother's horrified reaction... NO ONE in the fandom wants to actually see a child/baby unalived or beheaded. What's not seen is sometimes more powerful, same here. & I'm just pointing out GOT show has done this before. I get that we're going with Helaena is "different" or on the spectrum & she hasn't had a "normal" response to ANYTHING, if you watch her in S1...but still weird to not have her be more panicked or something. • Alicent not being present. This one is more minor overall. But it would've been the better call to have her gagged/bound & watching this unfold, helpless to stop it, as in the book. Alicent already feels uneasy, guilty & helpless over what Aemond did & this is a clear act of vengeance for it. It just reinforces for her all the "doom" she's complicit in bc she crowned Aegon. Having her get dicked down by Criston instead feels disassociated from everything else going on. Overall the episode was a 6.5/10, but it could've been a solid 8-9/10, if we had raised the stakes & stuck closer to the book/lore. ALL of ASOIAF books pull zero punches with its characters & events, it's a shame/disappointing the show does.

这种改编，还不如不改编

I'm sure Jason is a nice guy but my god that voice... Ooof

Is a disappointment The lack of nuance, i wanted to see when their last thread of restraint finally snapped or something, And what a waste of two beautiful actors like Olivia Cooke and Fabien Frankel, who had amazing chemistry, and they only got 10 seconds. The scene with Rhys was about 5 minutes! Where is the struggle...

How do you not even have Helaena offer her life for her children? Blood and Cheese was laid out plainly in the book, and you threw it out for no reason.

Condal should be nowhere near this show. Pure fanfiction nonsense - Alicent and Cole have no romantic relationship in the book, let's turn Blood and Cheese from the harrowing psychological horror it was to slapstick comedy, JUST to shift the blame onto the Greens for being hypocritical and negligent. ANYTHING they could do to steer your attention away from Daemon and Rhaenyra plotting child murder (including a random dog being kicked, they knew normies would be enraged) they did. Aemond was never the target in the book, it was always one of the children. Haelaena's choice, the rape threats, your mama wants you dead, Alicent tied up in the corner, her handmaids slain... all cut. Condal is an absolute D&D tier hack.

55:30 That deserves a dislike just for recognizing that bird app as "X" 💀

you screwed Blood and Choose so badly.

Blood & Cheese scene was incredibly disappointing. Not because they didn’t show “it” happen but because it written like crap. Reading the scene in the book had more emotional & dramatic than what they did in the show.

They messed up the blood and cheese scene. It was supposed to be traumatizing.

They missed a HUGE opportunity with B&C. It was watered down and it lost it's impact.

Incredibly wasted potential Blood and Cheese could have been so much better, Alicent and Cole was super dumb (what happened to their duty, decency, sacrifice spiel from Season 1?) no different than what he did with Rhaenerya in episode 4 Season 1. Most egregious of all was Balerion's skull is somehow on Dragonstone now. Should have also had Jeyne Arryn instead of Cregan and save him for episode 3 or something so he'd be interrupted from his mission after getting the Vale's support with Jeyne's speech from Fire and Blood

How these 2 got anywhere in journalism is depressing. Nepo babys probs. And the actors have zero insight and are seemingly quite simple. Not listening to this agen what a waste of time

How disappointing, after two years waiting for the premiere episode of season two, and then we get This! No action and lots of talking. What a Hugh let Down! And please don’t anyone say they are just setting it up for the rest of the Series, We heard that all of season one. It’s time for some action,”Let’s Go” My Rating on season two episode one. “5” out of 10. Sorry🙁🇺🇸

meh ep 1...should have shown everything !!! head off and all that

Most of the episode are fine even good. But the B&C part just ruined.(Phia is amazing.🩵 The plot changes are suck 😢