[Panel] How does the line finder work?

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Connections Museum

Connections Museum

Күн бұрын

Okay, I started this video to talk about bringing up a new line finder/district selector, but then it turned into a long description of how the line finder is actually set up. Timestamps below:
0:00 Start
3:00 Where do the wires go?
5:00 Bank cleaning tool
10:30 Lets get into the details and theory of the frame

Пікірлер: 76
@NillKitty
@NillKitty 4 жыл бұрын
Please never stop making these. You are incredibly awesome
@dorianjudah5429
@dorianjudah5429 2 жыл бұрын
I know Im randomly asking but does any of you know of a method to log back into an Instagram account? I stupidly lost the account password. I would love any help you can offer me.
@bodefinn9672
@bodefinn9672 2 жыл бұрын
@Dorian Judah Instablaster ;)
@mspysu79
@mspysu79 4 жыл бұрын
I'm Sarah and I say we need to use the whole thing :) Best attitude for a museum, run it all and demonstrate it ALL! That panel switch is an amazing machine, they were so lucky to have been able to save it!
@ds99
@ds99 4 жыл бұрын
There is so much architecture that was designed in such a thoughtful and solid manner. It is mind blowing to think this was all achieved mechanically with motors, electromagnets, and wires. In many ways it reminds me of how computers work, only you can see this machine in action. You can’t really see what a computer is doing. That’s what is so jaw dropping about it. It was invented so long shop by some very brilliant people. The Leonardo DaVinci of telephone switches people. Not many people could have figured this out. They were special people.
@RaymondHng
@RaymondHng 4 жыл бұрын
You will have to look at an electro-mechanical computer built from relays. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/rLyXlpuc2NnYqZs.html kzfaq.info/get/bejne/ldBlZ5d2scfZpac.html kzfaq.info/get/bejne/pJmng6WU0rnGYok.html
@TradieTrev
@TradieTrev 4 ай бұрын
For some odd reason I'd really love to work on this gear. That loom wiring is impressive along with Sarah's knowledge. I wouldn't want to be touching it without her help!
@Glenn08CRF
@Glenn08CRF 4 жыл бұрын
Cool video Sarah, thanks! I worked for Bell Canada...we changed X-Bar and a Step Office to Nortel DMS-100 in one exchange in the city of Windsor, over the course of three weeks and every week I went down to check progress, it got quieter and quieter until the total cutover... I just heard cooling fans and no switches. Very eerie...and it was the end of an era. Thanks to a museum like yours, we won't forget. Sad, as these switches were pretty reliable for how they were made. Real workhorses!
@Glenn08CRF
@Glenn08CRF 4 жыл бұрын
@Kevin Krostosky Yes! lol
@Glenn08CRF
@Glenn08CRF 4 жыл бұрын
Hi Kevin, I was on test board as well! I will never forget the: CALRS> Prompt. ESS came in when custom calling features came, then we logged right into the DMS itself. I remember seeing CPB on my buddies line and saying just testing the line lol...
@deanberglund2332
@deanberglund2332 4 жыл бұрын
Very cool that there is someone around that still understands some of the older technology of communications. Thank you so much for showing this. Really interesting. I wish I knew you personally. I'd love to see this first hand.
@ssbohio
@ssbohio 4 жыл бұрын
What amazes me is how much the panel office is an electrical analog to what operators would have done in a manual office.
@ConnectionsMuseum
@ConnectionsMuseum 4 жыл бұрын
YES! That was the whole point! They were really trying to build a robot operator, and that's exactly what they did. :D
@ssbohio
@ssbohio 4 жыл бұрын
@@ConnectionsMuseum So, an operator would look for the lamp or the drop to know which line to plug into. How does the panel switch know where to send the line finder? They're not constantly moving, looking for off-hook telephones, so how do they know where to go? That could be a whole 'nother video.
@ConnectionsMuseum
@ConnectionsMuseum 4 жыл бұрын
ssbohio it definitely could be a whole new video. Basically when you go off hook, a special relay that’s in series with your phone line operates. This is called the (L) relay. The (L) relay causes a whole big chain of events to happen, eventually starting a line finder moving upward. It continues upward until it finds battery (-48v) on a special “hunt” terminal on the bank. Once it sees that, it knows that it’s found your line, and stops.
@enojelly9452
@enojelly9452 Жыл бұрын
This is so interesting, I'm so glad of having found this channel. I knew nothing about how telephone networks worked, old or new, and now I'm glued to those videos.
@cnvogel
@cnvogel 4 жыл бұрын
This is crazy technology, thanks for sharing all this stuff with us!
@jt1122
@jt1122 4 жыл бұрын
Seriously some of the coolest stuff on the internet. Awesome job!
@TomStorey96
@TomStorey96 3 жыл бұрын
You are awesome, Sarah. One day I hope to make it to this museum, it looks incredible.
@deanberglund2332
@deanberglund2332 4 жыл бұрын
I think you would make a good teacher. You put things in a way that can be understood. Excellent.
@aatheus
@aatheus Жыл бұрын
Really cool deep dive. Your knowledge and enthusiasm is so infectious
@TheSonicfrog
@TheSonicfrog Жыл бұрын
Great description. Basically this line finder is a processor built using binary logic and do-while-loops, processing input bits and pulses according to state machines, along with some timers, driving output bits and pulses. Quite fundamental yet when you stack everything up it is an extremely complex system.
@disgruntledgoat
@disgruntledgoat 4 жыл бұрын
I love watching people work on something they very obviously love. Superb :-)
@jonathanbecker6373
@jonathanbecker6373 4 жыл бұрын
Loving these videos. I don't travel much but to visit family; your museum is where I'd venture first.
@tcpnetworks
@tcpnetworks Жыл бұрын
Watching your videos.... Makes me happy :)
@shaunbarton-collins1180
@shaunbarton-collins1180 4 жыл бұрын
Great Video Sarah....... Well explained....Massively cool machine.
@cowboyfrankspersonalvideos8869
@cowboyfrankspersonalvideos8869 4 жыл бұрын
Wow. With this one video you have answered several questions I've never understood since I worked for Ma Bell back in the early 70's. Despite me being the webmaster for TCI, my own BellsyStemPractices.org/ website, and all the switchers I know, I've never gotten an understandable answer as to what exactly a line finder does. It finds the "subscribers line" when their phone goes off hook. I had always pictured it as something to do with locating a trunk line, which didn't make since considering where it is in the circuit. That's something that seems to be so obvious to those in the know, that it never occurs to them to explain that to the layman or museum visitor. I remember seeing those rotary step switches you explained in this video back when I worked in the old materials receiving dock in the Western Electric plant in Arlington VA. I could tell they weren't part of a SxS 'mail box' switch because they were too big. Now I know what they were used for. I could never understand how the vertical cross bar switches worked or what they did before now. I am continually amazed at the geniuses of Bell Labs and Western Electric. Most brilliant folks of their time. Sara is getting much better with her videos. Keep up the good work Sara. You're teaching an old phone nut new things.
@plaibach
@plaibach Жыл бұрын
I've been wondering these things for decades!
@thunderdrums6551
@thunderdrums6551 3 жыл бұрын
You are so talented!! This is art!!
@toshihitsu1989
@toshihitsu1989 4 жыл бұрын
this seems so archaic compared to today digital switch. still love it from where we came from when phones still relayed on maniacal systems to connect calls
@plaibach
@plaibach Жыл бұрын
Can anybody explain how a telephony anomaly that i was part of (back in the late 1970s or early 1980s) could have happened? When I was much younger, our rural communities were served by the small, independent Red Hook Telephone Company in upstate Dutchess County, NY (sold first to Continental, then to Frontier, as best as I can recall). One evening, I picked up the phone to find many other people already in conversation. Apparently, anybody that went off hook was just joined together in one big "party line" scenario. This party was well under way before I joined and overall lasted at least several hours. Folks just dropped in and out just by picking up their receivers. (I have friends who still recall that day, so it wasn't just the fevered dream of a young telephone phreak.) I'd been in the CO a few years before and at that time they had an ancient frame type system - lots of moving parts. I'm not sure if that was still in place when this event occured. Any ideas how this could have happened and on what type of equipment?
@kenunix1863
@kenunix1863 4 жыл бұрын
Great video. I'm an old Panel switchman.
@johnmabbott7420
@johnmabbott7420 Жыл бұрын
Amazing Stuff! please keep up the work on these amazing old things :-)
@billylowe9631
@billylowe9631 4 жыл бұрын
Nice Video. Good job. I'm a long time XB5 Switchman. All I know about a panel switch is they work by magic. However if you need help in wiring a XB5 marker route relay please contact me.
@chuckgudgel2566
@chuckgudgel2566 2 жыл бұрын
COOL HOW THSE WERE EGINNEERED MECHANICALLY BEFORE DIGITAL FRAMES
@ALSutton
@ALSutton 2 жыл бұрын
I like this human. Very entertaining!
@campbellmorrison8540
@campbellmorrison8540 2 жыл бұрын
Excellent, really good to see young guys picking up this knowledge, most of the people who worked on this stuff are well gone not to mention the gear.
@ds99
@ds99 4 жыл бұрын
Thank you Sarah. This line finder contraption is part of the step-by-step exchange is it? Great video. You’re excellent at explaining/teaching.
@thecooldude9999
@thecooldude9999 4 жыл бұрын
It's part of the panel exchange.
@ds99
@ds99 4 жыл бұрын
thecooldude9999 Oh I am not familiar with a panel exchange. Only Step and Crossbar. Very cool stuff.
@user2C47
@user2C47 3 жыл бұрын
Line finders in Step use a similar concept with a line relay that triggers a selector to start moving, but uses step switches (with a special set of contacts for vertical hunting) instead of panel selectors.
@travishafsaas8309
@travishafsaas8309 Жыл бұрын
Interesting connections
@PositionLight
@PositionLight 3 жыл бұрын
What is a line switch and does your fact about first line finders include step switch line finders?
@barryyoung6159
@barryyoung6159 Жыл бұрын
Awesome 😁
@spaceman7832
@spaceman7832 4 жыл бұрын
Love your videos Sarah, you are awesome!! Question: How does the line finder detect an off-hook condition? An off-hook condition applies a short between the tip and ring (48v and Gnd.) so the line finder has to detect this condition somehow. I installed ESS equipment for Western Electric. Ferrod sensors were scanned to detect off-hook in the line switch frame, but this thing obviously had its own thing. Thanks
@ConnectionsMuseum
@ConnectionsMuseum 4 жыл бұрын
Well, its almost like a ferrod sensor, but more low-tech. Every subscriber has their very own pair of (L) and (CO) relays. The (L)ine relay is in series with your phone, so when the off-hook short happens, it operates the (L) relay. When the line finder has found your line, the (L) relay releases, and the (CO) relay operates which grounds your sleeve lead so your line is marked busy to anyone who tries to call it.
@spaceman7832
@spaceman7832 4 жыл бұрын
@@ConnectionsMuseum Good job Sarah. Thanks.
@emolatur
@emolatur 7 ай бұрын
ya know what I haven't ever seen anywhere... is an explanation of the circuit of how the line finder even knows there's an active line to find.
@nikoniko1965
@nikoniko1965 Жыл бұрын
I can’t wrap my mind around how much physical space a phone call used to take. Are the subscribers wire hooked up to more than one line finder poll? So if one was in use a different poll would activate? Or would everyone wired to the same poll just need to wait for someone else to finish their call?
@lohphat
@lohphat 2 жыл бұрын
Sooo...unless I missed it (very possible) each subscriber is wired across each column in its bank to potentially engage each vertical LF. My mind is still blown how calls are handled in the CO to subscribers in the same CO. How is each subscriber line split when it enters the CO into outbound and inbound routing? It seems there's so much extra copper to handle that and the redundancy that there must be some esoteric DC capacitance and impedance issues.
@ConnectionsMuseum
@ConnectionsMuseum 2 жыл бұрын
Yes, the linefinder banks are like a big long sandwich. Each subscriber appears in front of all of the rods (well, half of them in this frame, since its cut in the middle). This way, any line finder can hunt for the subscriber by moving vertically. The subscriber line is split at the MDF when it enters the CO from the outside. Three leads (T,R,S) go to the line finder, and the final frame. The run is so short (only a few hundred feet) that there really aren't too many weird issues. This is how it was done in city manual exchanges for years before the panel switch. Subscriber lines were wired to the "A" board for origination and to the "B" board for termination. What really gets weird is the signaling loop on the trunks between offices. The panel senders use DC signaling to communicate to other offices miles away. (Think like a giant telegraph circuit). So there is a speed limit on that circuit because capacitance and inductance on the wires can make signaling impossible over distances greater than 20 miles or so.
@bradwilmot5066
@bradwilmot5066 2 жыл бұрын
I'm curious, what happens if you go off hook and there are no selectors on the linefinder available? (We were served out of a step office when I was growing up, and that never seemed like it was an issue in stepworld...)
@ethangibson8645
@ethangibson8645 Ай бұрын
I'm a year late but I remember another museum showing off an "equipment busy" tone. I imagine if the company you used had one of those tone generators this would be the situation where that tone would play.
@jlwilliams
@jlwilliams Жыл бұрын
2:56 I would like to know why there's a twin-lens reflex camera mounted sideways to the panel, just to the right of the dial and below the ammeter. It is pointing to the right and doesn't look as if it could photograph anything, since most TLRs wouldn't focus closer than 1 meter.
@ConnectionsMuseum
@ConnectionsMuseum Жыл бұрын
It’s there because i like it there :)
@garymckee8857
@garymckee8857 3 жыл бұрын
What is this an old central office that never got took apart?
@HelloKittyFanMan.
@HelloKittyFanMan. Жыл бұрын
That LF hasn't worked since I was born? Holy cow!
@matthewmiller6068
@matthewmiller6068 5 ай бұрын
So what were the constraints on these - like does that mean the total number of subscribers who could make phone calls at once is the quantity of rods that exist in the selector? That seems like a really tiny number of rods to select calls for 300 subscribers?
@stephanieweil583
@stephanieweil583 4 жыл бұрын
Sarah, IT DIDN'T WORRRK! :D
@Rayzermatic
@Rayzermatic 3 жыл бұрын
what tells the line finder which line to find?
@ConnectionsMuseum
@ConnectionsMuseum 3 жыл бұрын
When you pick up your phone, battery (-48V) is placed on one of the terminals corresponding to your line. When the brush touches that terminal, a relay operates, which stops the upward motion of the brush. Then the battery is removed from the terminal for the rest of the call.
@user2C47
@user2C47 3 жыл бұрын
There is also a common trigger circuit that basically says "Someone within this line finder needs a connection." This is operated by the line relay, and the cutoff relay prevents it from being constantly powered. A similar system is found in Step, not sure about XB. There's a good video about line finders in Step that explains how the system works, but I don't remember the title.
@CryptoTonight9393
@CryptoTonight9393 3 жыл бұрын
It looks like you read my mind. The whole thing should be working and you guys should simulate mothersday or something lol
@thewhitefalcon8539
@thewhitefalcon8539 Жыл бұрын
The point of a line finder is economy of scale, but you wonder how much economy of scale they are really getting by adding all these flip-overs and special logic and ... Are they all controlled in common? So there's only one logic circuit that selects one line at a time, using whichever rod is available but only one at a time until that one is done and then finding the next call with a different rod?
@ConnectionsMuseum
@ConnectionsMuseum Жыл бұрын
Yep, one main controller circuit per side of the frame. That makes 2 per frame, times however many line finders you have...usually 10-20 frames worth.
@thewhitefalcon8539
@thewhitefalcon8539 Жыл бұрын
@@ConnectionsMuseum The split line finder is just 2 line finders in one big package, as I understand it, so I'd still call it 1 control circuit per line finder. I was wondering if there were "race conditions" where two selectors could find the same line at the same time, or something like that - but if there's only one control circuit, that can't happen.
@ladams00
@ladams00 4 жыл бұрын
Moar panel videos please Sarah! :-)
@stevenbennett3805
@stevenbennett3805 4 жыл бұрын
Where is this place and why?
@HelloKittyFanMan.
@HelloKittyFanMan. Жыл бұрын
"I'm not smart..." Oh, stop it, ya are too! You're smarter than me about this stuff!"
@ElectricEvan
@ElectricEvan Жыл бұрын
Huh... I was expecting counter weights instead of springs. I guess that was a space/weight issue.
@HelloKittyFanMan.
@HelloKittyFanMan. Жыл бұрын
"...In a new office...." Well... in a new _panel_ office, that is.
@calbob750
@calbob750 3 жыл бұрын
Need to hire a retired Apparatusman to clean the cork rolls.
@ConnectionsMuseum
@ConnectionsMuseum 3 жыл бұрын
Now I just get to do it all. Apparatus, switching, relays, wiring, oil and grease, testing...the list goes on!
@Julianacan
@Julianacan Жыл бұрын
UwU?
All calls are failing in the Panel office!
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