"What a pity that Bilbo didn't kill that vile creature when he had the chance!" Gandalf in 2001: "Pity? It was pity that stayed Bilbo's hand! Many that live deserve death, and some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them, Frodo? ... Do not be to eager to deal in death and judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends. My heart tells me that Gollum has some part to play, yet. For good or ill, before this is all over, the pity of Bilbo may rule the fate of many." Gandalf in 1978: "Yeah. Sucks."

Completely with you! 2 very iconic quotes of gandalf reduced to nothing of significance

​@@dalewatson9334did you even read the book??

@@revolutionishere He's talking about how the book lines werent delivered in the '78 show

@@revolutionishere Yes

Oh man, that’s hilarious 😂👏

7:13

Still beats Sean Astins Sam, kept slipping into American

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

you didn't have to do Sam dirty like that, he's got enough problems. Thanks for the laugh though.

Why did Ralph Bakshi hate Sam so much?

​@@Strideo1 I read somewhere apparently he planned a character arc for Sam in a sense, like he's a bumbling fool in the first movie, but he grows more in the next movie, it would probably be different tbh if he could complete the project

@@alexandersmith4731Ah yes, the Neville Longbottom arc

@@InquisitiveEngineer Sorta yea 😂

Would have been nice to over dub him with Astin on top of the music.

Like Bilbo in that one scene

I loved that as a kid, made me laugth everytime i see it 🤣

Voldemort esque 😂

more like "oogie boogie!!!"

​@TheRuddster95 right with that finger and hand movements

It's exactly what any of us would do after spending two minutes with this version of Sam. 😂

@@coalcreekdefense8106 omg thats so true. It would be criminal not to take advantage wouldnt it!?

You guys are hilarious! Gandalf has those lengthy set that he wiggled at Sam, calling it a jumpscare is perfect!😂😂

Poor Sam 😭

The intrusive thoughts won

meme-worthy

He was all “BE STILL! FOOL OF A WIZARD!”.

@@commandercaptain4664 q

The faces are all strange... you can see so much of the whites of Gandalf's eyes, he just looks mad

that shit killed me

🤣

Such a great detail and strange relationship that I don't think is a thing at all in the live-action version, it couldn't be I guess.

Well dude would not shut up about all the Thick Elves he was about to encounter and how damn exciting that was going to be for him. Its all the guy wanted to talk about through the entire scene. How many elves? am I on my knees when the elves enter the chamber? How thick an elf will we be dealing with here just for a reference? I mean Sam goes on for a while he really does. That is not the last of his questions about the elves.

@marcussmith4913 Than they get to Mordor, and JRRT goes on and on about pebbles and leaves and trees that don’t move or talk. 😴💀

Making him seem....special?

Yeah....real "special" and with bad dental to boot.

@@sigmus1475 They just wanted to make him more familiar with the folk of Tolkien's homeland

Oh my...Oh hurraaaayyy.

I feel that Sam deserved better. If comedy was needed, then Merry and Pippin could fit the bill just fine in their own way.

It's a gesture that anyone who remembers the little person actor Billy Barty will be familiar with.

​@@ogremark5 I must've forgotten he did the rotoscoped acting for that. Bilbo too. You can really see it at times with their mannerisms and with Bilbo's design and expressions. I guess that's maybe part of Sam's strange appearance - is they couldn't trace Billy's face for both characters, so they went with something *definitely* different that ignored the actor's face entirely.

Dude did not know what he was getting himself in to…

Eleventy-one likes, and I ruined it by adding one more 🥲

@@ogremark5 Holy shit that's Billy Barty?? Incredible!

The facial expressions in this film are totally wild. And all the gesticulating that doesn’t fit with the voice acting. I love it

@@ZeroCiero The dialogue: "And he has heard of Hobbits at last. And of the Shire." The hands: 🖐👈👐👇🤏👋👉👆👇

Frodo is like “Um, bro are you okay?…what a freak…”

The Jackson Trilogy has aged so well, absolute classics

@@Alex-pk1iy Well is the understatement of the century

Come on man, you don't have to hit me with that...

y u do dis?

Oh my gosh, imagine watching it in theatres ahhhh that is so cool

"Don't let him turn me into anything unnatural!" Ron ejaculated loudly.

And Frodo’s expression… was so like calm down dude!

@@vangelina09 Geez, man, it was just an idea, chill...

@@Sephiroth144 😂😂

Wait, this is supposed to be at night?

@@greglaslo6371 There are stars in the sky :P

Yeah I had the same thought. I was watching the first half wondering “Is the joke that removing the score made the scene more atmospheric and dark and serious? Because this is good stuff.” I feel like the musical score kind of hurts the scene a bit and doesn’t quite match the tone and mood as well.

@@geovaughan8261 This concept got pointed out a lot in the tail end of the 2010s, where the people directing and editing movies are so afraid that an audience can't read a scene, that you have to triple down on every cue to tell them what they need to feel. No room to breath and internalize it.... just moving from one cue to another. Oh, and if something is serious, you need a comedy bit every 12 seconds to break it up. Because music does a really good job of invoking certain emotional beats, its become overused in movie productions like rapid cuts in action scenes, and statements of observation, as they don't trust a scene to work on its own merits. Don't get me wrong. Good music can totally elevate a scene. But now its doing more heavy lifting, to make up for deficiencies in other areas of the production. Writing especially. I noticed while watching the video that I stopped thinking about whats being said, and that my mood was completely set by the music. ..... and when I noticed it started to feel really weird. "Lets go on an adventure!!!.... wait.... wtf?".

@@freelancerthe2561extremely well put. I really wish more movies were scoreless. It would hopefully be an antidote to our overstimulated overcaffeinated brains.

😂

That's one of the odd things about this film, how the animation is so out of step with the dialog, and the fact that none of the characters can stop gesturing.

Swag Frodo smoke pipeweed every day

My man is SWAGGERING

@@Durwood71noooo my cartoon characters are too cartoony!!!

Suspiciously American

Yeah I know. Like, why NOT use the original text?

I'm not sure that's what was intended by that part of the conversation's wording. The actual response was, "And now, Frodo, the decision lies with you. What will you do with the one ring?" I think Gandalf is just trying to get Frodo to stop whining and return to the main point, regardless of what Frodo thinks about Bilbo's handling of Gollum. The question is, "What will you do with the ring?", not, "What will you do with Gollum?"

There was no implication "so make sure you don't miss your chance to kill him" in Gandalf's speech in this cartoon, but it is in your imagination.

No. "Will you have pity? Will you show mercy?". Your take is horribly twisted.

I think Gandalf “cast a spell.”

😂

I have no idea what that expression is supposed to convey.

​@@Durwood71it looks to me like disgust at Merlin's weakness, but really Merlin was right to admit that he couldn't be trusted. If he hadn't been honest and vulnerable, all would be lost.

@@UltimateDorito Merlin?

The "S" is silent. 😆

I read somewhere that the producer or Bakshi himself thought Saruman sounded too much like Sauron, so they called him Haruman instead. I first saw this movie in French though and he was called "Saroumane". That's how they spell it in the French translation of the books.

@@Xerxes2005 And sometimes they still call him Saruman…this film is such a great mess, I love it

@@warlordofbritanniait’s even worse because in the scene where Saruman captures Gandalf, Gandalf is yelling BOTH pronunciations!

I always thought he said arrowman. Strange name for a wizard 😂

Yeah, and look at how pleased Frodo looks when Gandalf is happy about his decision to go away - like he's fishing for approval. Odd. I wonder if the artists weren't given full context of the scene.

_Editor was smokin' crack._

I don't know why, I've heard others say this also, but I never interpreted it this way. I always saw him look with a bit of shock and surprise. Maybe it's just less clear as a result of the rotoscoping.

Hobbits don't think like us

@@ruskerdax5547yeah, I see it more as “Jesus, what the F, I thought you were wise and stuff and you’re scared of the ring? Chill out”

That's because they were actually actors shoot and then rotoscoped. Exactly like Disney used to do.

@@stefanocrespi5424 That's what I predicted

I think that's a bit harsh. The animation in these movies was groundbreaking at the time.

​@@joeyn985groundbreaking, yes. But very poorly done. The characters' movements speed up and slow down strangely. It looks natural one second and then suddenly bizarre and impossible.

@@bbgun061 2D animation is very time consuming and I bet they didn’t have that nor the money to hire talent. That being said, yeah I agree with you the animation could have been better but I’m sure they did the best they could given the circumstances.

ya :p

Always remember watching this when i was 8 and thinking that ended weirdly lol

It is finished, just not by Hackshi.

And what they did to Sam…and the Balrog…and by severing abridging the story…and the funky facial expressions on Gandalf in particular…ok maybe this was never meant to be a masterpiece but it could’ve been very good! 😂

@@jbrisbyYou shall not speak of Bakshi in this manner again, heretic

The Fascinating thing about this movie is how You watch the budget fall apart minute by minute

Hey Joe! That's fantastic! Which Bakshi film did you work on? I love his stuff, and the fact that they didn't finish this project kills me to this day.... And yes, the score for the 78 LOTR is great too, I agree.

@@JackBeddows "Cool World", his last feature, in Burbank, a short walk down the hill from where I lived then. Ralph was/is a ball of energy, and would enthusiastically hire artists he met everywhere, and I knew maybe a dozen guys who had gotten their starts in the business on LOTR, "in-betweening orc hairs". I have a nice framed cel of Frodo and Sam, close-up in night colors, hanging in my office. I still love this film and its score, which I have on a Japanese CD from the nineties. Bought the tie-in book, painted the little metal figures, all when I was thirteen.

It's a truly a terrific movie. Animation let the book come alive on screen, and the rotoscoping let's it transcend animation into a beautiful blend of fantasy and reality, which is the perfect tone for the book. The mattes are fantastic too. Some character design and some of the dialogue and staging are a bit questionable, but all-in-all it's amazing. To be honest... I think Frodo in this scene is better than about any point in PJ's. Of course, I think everyone who really watches it wishes there was a RotK, but the one by Rankin & Bass has some bright spots in it. However, I love how Bakshi worked around the issues. If you ignore your knowledge of RotK, the movie concludes perfectly. It set up this idea of the end of mankind, and Helm's Deep encapsulates that well. Bakshi's LotR is epic poetry. You worked with a legend, and I mean, as an animator you brought such works to life. That's really an awesome story, being enthralled by a movie then going to work for that same director who helped inspire you. Those are the best cinema stories imo.

@SurferJoe1 I totally agree about Ralph finishing it. His version of LOTR is still my favourite and I wish he had had his chance to complete the story.

The hobbits hiding under the tree roots, Aragorn, Legolas, and Gimli running sequence are the two things I can name off the top of my head as almost copy-pasted. Scenes and designs - movies borrow a lot. I'd even go as far as calling them a reboot, rather than an original work (so to speak). What Jackson brought to the table was beautiful landscapes of New Zealand... Which he did because of his previous projects in NZ. When you think about it, it's not THAT special. Just like Star Wars, if you've seen films of that period. I mean, R2 is a fleshed out bot from Silent Running.

I bet you think that was terribly clever !

@@AliciaB. 😜

Nice

But the other composer knew how to put “rose in, man”… dangit, puns is tough.

He admitted that he was

Peter Jackson said he got into LotR because of this movie

Yeah I actually thought they put the movie's dialog on top of the animation because this Frodo sounds so much like Elijah Wood.

i was struck by that, too. though the whole time i was thinking "Oh, Sean... they did your character dirty." it seemed like they were trying to make him a bit... mentally not all there. and more than a bit simple. there was a cartoon i'm sort of thinking of but can't recall enough details -- "Tell me about the _____s, George". fak. can't get more than this half remembered quote. but they made that character kinda hurr durr. wish i could remember the word used as that'd help an ID. pretty sure they were animal characters?

​@@lurklingX"Tell me about the rabbits, George." That was Lenny from Of Mice and Men.

Frodo: He won't hurt you. Much.

Yeah the music really doesn't fit here. It breaks the intended mood and distracts from the dialogue.

Agreed

Eh, disagree. There are times for silence. Other scenes are elevated by music and imo this was one of those scenes.

❤

You are in such a minority here, it's cute. XD

I grew up reading the books, and for me this depiction of Sam captures his heart and personality - his roots, as it were - better than Sean Astin’s portrayal. Astin’s acting is too…refined. His mannerisms and movements are not those of a hobbit who’s been a gardener most of his life. He also doesn’t LOOK like someone who spends most of his time outside.

@@kennethdickinson2591 True, but to Astin's credit, he doesn't portray Sam as a complete buffoon.

i feel like the frodos have a lot in common actually. and no, this sam will never be mentioned again. fffffGAH.

Definitely a better Aragorn in this older movie. I like him a lot more than the newer one. As for Frodo, the older version speaks a lot more naturally.

I've always liked most of the portrayals in this version (I grew up on this and the Rankin Bass Hobbit and RotK) The one that I just can't understand from the Bakshi film is Roman Senator Elrond. Such a bizarre choice

It’s motion capture now. I used to want to be an animator but if you’re talking about this form of media, motion capture is the new form of roto-scoping, not to say roto-scoping is a dead artform, just a different form of art form. But when it comes to more accurately animated character’s body movements in 2D or 3D it’s motion capture. Gif knows how animation will evolve in the future now that we have A.I.

Rotoscoping for animation? Yes. Otherwise, rotoscoping for matting out actors and objects in a movie shot on film? No. Absolutely not.

Joel Haver uses a form of rotoscoping for his animations.

Another great example is AMERICAN POP.

You think this looks *good*?

This is well said. I've done my share of ragging on the Bakshi version. But I find in retrospect, it has its own charm. Either I've mellowed out or am more perceptive to the good stuff. And the other shows you mention... The Lion, The Witch, And The Wardrobe...the 1977 version of The Hobbit is actually superior in certain ways to the Peter Jackson: certainly less cluttered. I mention other shows where the animated is superior to the live action. Ghost In The Shell. Avatar The Last Airbender. The Disney original animated compared to the live action remakes. But I'm just gabbing away at this point.

I was only disappointed that Bakshi's movie ended where it did and was never continued. Wizards and Fire & Ice were great, too, but LotR remaining incomplete, as it is, is still disappointing. What bothers me about the Peter Jackson version is that, as well-made as it is, he chose particular artists' visions that I didn't always think were the best of how artists had imagined Tolkien's world over the years, particularly the dark creatures. Now, Jackson's choices seem to be locked in for good with anything Tolkien-related going forward. Also, I hate to say it, but Jackson's version Hobbit is more bad than good.

@@crimsonmask3819 I'd say that problem has more to do with lazy producers like Amazon than Peter Jackson though. Peter got people who'd been known for their Tolkien art long before he started the film to do work on it. And a limitation of live action films is that painting and drawing can be more symbolic and capture the underlying feeling and wonder, and can allow the viewer to interact with their own take, while photography locks it into the action on the screen. Personally, I prefer the more 70s aesthetic the animated films drew from.

@@rb1691 The Hobbit is certainly a bloated film that became a rush job due to studio interference. I will always wonder what del Toro, or Jackson if he was given more time to plan after taking over, would have produced.

@@jschap712 I always say I'm happy that Jackson did the Hobbit, everything else would have ended *worse*

Those dead eyes though.

The movie seemed to run out of budget halfway through and eventually they just stopped rotoscoping the actors lol

This film is such a hot mess, you can’t help but love it 😂

Somehow I don't remember that happening. When was that?

@@BeefJerkey kzfaq.info/get/bejne/a7Fzf8d51bXGcnk.html there you go dude

Cinematographer: Aragorn tripped over his sword. Ralph, should we do another take? Ralph Bakshi: Naaah. It'll be fine.

did he break his toe when he tripped?

@@headecas Lol

Not to mention the fact that none of the humans wear pants

@@Catherine_Longstaff People didn't have pants back then--even in the 1700s men wore breeches, not pants--they went down to your knee, and your socks covered your lower legs. Pants weren't a thing until the 1800s. Any pants before then in film are an anachronism.

Definitely agree with you on the rank and bass version

Haven't seen either of those but having recently re-read the books I feel that Frodo's thunder was stolen as the senior hobbit in the Jackson films. In this short segment Frodi does look taller and more mature than Sam.

I had seen the Bakshi version so many times as a kid and had the soundtrack on cassette and then CD to play while reading the books. I can bring up that specific tune in my mind as a read a certain section or chapter now. Leonard was a fantastic composer, RIP!

Oh mark my words Peter Jackson definatley was inspired by this movie

I also don't think it's sufficiently edited to fit this scene here. The mood feels weird and clashing with the way the scene is cut as compared to Shore's music. Even if you actually asked Howard Shore himself to go back to do a score for the Bakshi film, he would do it differently from the Peter Jackson trilogy because the feel and flow is just different!

@@HawkOfGPYeah, they just took the first track from the ROTK soundtrack and stuck it under the film. It would’ve worked better with some editing.

57th st?

@@baxpiz1289 - Yes.

I read that they decided to change Saruman to Aruman because they felt the names of Sauron and Saruman were too similar

@@Aenimus12 That’s most likely true but oh so disappointing. 🤦‍♂️ “Hi, we’re the filmmakers. We have no trust in Tolkien’s knowledge of languages and names, and no faith in the audience.”Surprised they didn’t change “Aragorn son of Arathorn” to “Aragorn son of Fred.”

THAT WAS THE SS-STUDIOS FAULT

The eagles aren't more powerful than the ents, or the elves. They're servants of Manwe, but they keep mostly to themselves. Gandalf is a maia, not a vala; valar are the equivalent to archangels, like Manwe, Varda, and Orome. You're confusing Galadriel with Luthien--her mother was a maia, so she was 1/2 angel, half elf...which makes all her descendants (Elrond, Elros, Arwen, Aragorn, etc.) a touch of maia as well.

@@rikk319 Exactly. Galadriel is not descended from the Maiar, and Gandalf "unveiled" is definitely more powerful than she is. I don't read it as the Ring corrupts the powerful more quickly than the weak (the resiliency of Hobbits is something separate), but rather a question of how much "damage" the person could do if corrupted. For example, Gollum/Smeagol is basically entirely corrupted by the Ring... but he doesn't become a dark lord, a Power, he uses it to sneak up on goblins and eat them. Sam's great temptation while Ringbearer is to use the Ring to... create a really big, really awesome garden. THAT's why it's far too dangerous to have Gandalf or Galadriel keep the Ring. They would not be able to resist using it to "put everything right" but as they became corrupted, the enormous power they wield would inevitably be used to do terrible things.

Trying to remember here. Galadriel was second in power compared to Feanor, but much wiser. Let’s suppose that some of Galadriel power can be applied to combat. Gandalf the Grey barely manage to win a battle against a Balrog. Feanor ate Balrogs for breakfast. If Galadriel is somewhere in between, I believe could beat Gandalf the Grey in power. Now now, Galadriel choose not to fight, therefore lack in experience. So in combat I trust Gandalf experience first. And then Glorfindel 😅

@@tandersan Tolkien himself said of Galadriel, in the First Age: "She was then of Amazon disposition and bound up her hair as a crown when taking part in athletic feats." Her name was Artanis Nerwen, "The Man-maiden". Until in Doriath, around 60 First Age, her husband Celeborn gave her a new name: 'Galadriel'. She loved this name so much she decided to go on with this name the rest of her life. Still...she was literally named by Tolkien as a broad-shouldered amazon type.

The Srongest Elf ever was weaker than the weakest Maia in inherent power.

Spying on his crush.

🤣

He was waiting in the bushes of love

Eavesdropping. Or maybe sneakin'.

I actually did 13 minutes of the film and instantly got blocked by copyright claim. If the day ever comes I can put the whole shebang on my channel I'll do the rest in a heartbeat.

The og soundtrack to the movie is really good tho

Reminds me of an observation my fam made watching the behind-the-scenes to Peter Jackson's; particularly the rough cut to the council of Elrond sequence. With the awkward pauses at the end of each take left in, and the total lack of music or sound effects; the acting _feels worse._ Made me appreciate the value of good editing. That last tightening up of all the pieces and finding the rhythm of the edit makes everything register better and you stop thinking about the actors and the stage. The KZfaqr "This Guy Edits" did a great video where he took a crack at improving a scene from a Niel Breen movie. Notoriously stilted and hammy material, the guy was able to tighten things up and even rearranged some lines to recontextualize a character being stupid and needing the same information repeated twice, to them being panicked and "not listening", making the repeated line a dramatic emphasis "hey, focus" rather than aimless repetition.

@@ZVEB this scene is totally ruined by the LotR movie music. It doesn't need a score. the story was conveyed well by the actors and the visual. there was a reason the dirctor of the animated version didn't used music, so leave it that way.

Any chance you could complete the script, animation & score for the Return of the King?

29 seconds. You see the bush move and can hear the sound of Sam's shears.

Yeah, there’s pretty much no indication other than a small shake of a bush.

Still better than Sean Astins sam

I don't know about that. Sam does look like a simpleton in The Fellowship of the Ring, especially in the beginning. It is really in The Return of the King that he starts to shine. Too bad Bakshi didn't get to complete the story. I would have liked to see what he would have done with Sam's story ark.

Aruman

I would be happy to see an edit of the Peter Jackson films with 1/3 the music... it's like every time you see a hobbit, the Hobbiton theme blares in "DA DAAA DAA DA DA DA". I don't know why they had to do that. The Rankin Bass film gets this much better.