Refuse to Be a Control Freak: The Royal Navy's Failure at Jutland - James Holmes

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National WWI Museum and Memorial

National WWI Museum and Memorial

Күн бұрын

The Royal Navy faced no serious challenger until the rise of the German Kaiser's High Seas Fleet around the turn of the 20th century. With no potential foe to keep them sharp, British naval commanders fell into all manner of bad habits. In particular, they took to choreographing fleet movements in minute detail-denying ship captains the liberty to act independently in battle. In short, they sapped initiative from the British fleet, leaving it ill-equipped for the chaos of combat at Jutland (1916). No script for military action survives first contact with the enemy, and the Royal Navy forgot that basic fact.
The U.S. Navy has enjoyed a long calm lee of its own, having fought its last major fleet battle at Leyte Gulf in 1944. U.S. naval leaders have succumbed to similar vices. The naval service thus has much to learn from World War I at sea as it returns to great-power strategic competition-competition that could involve future Jutlands.
Dr. James Holmes, J. C. Wylie Chair of Maritime Strategy at the Naval War College
Lecture given as part of the National WWI Museum and Memorial's 2018 Symposium, 1918: Crucible of War.
Symposium presenting sponsor: Pritzker Military Museum & Library - www.pritzkermilitary.org
For more information visit theworldwar.org

Пікірлер: 44
@ifox33
@ifox33 4 жыл бұрын
If you're looking for information on the Battle at Jutland, this is not the video for you. If you're looking for an overly macho professor to spend 30 minutes using boxing analogies to complain about military complacency, then enjoy.
@PaulfromChicago
@PaulfromChicago 5 жыл бұрын
I'm not sure the Beatty Thomas-Hughes relationship is the best example of an RN that was overly controlled by the top. The night before Trafalgar, Nelson, in person, explained his plans to his band of brothers. Beatty couldn't be bothered to meet with Thomas-Hughes, despite them both being in the same bay for two months. Conflict after action management reduces system complexity, but water-cooler sociability greases the system. Beatty and Seymour are a bad example of anything except leadership failures. (You can't tell me that every one of those battlecruisers uninstalled vital safety features without Beatty or his command staff knowing. That's not how human systems operate. Beatty knew the interlocks were disabled, because he required it be done.) A better example might be when Churchill basically murdered Admiral Craddock through Admiralty orders and mischief before Coronel. Or the Admiralty interfering with the chase of SMS Goebens. Or the buffoonery that went on with "leadership" of intelligence in Room 40.
@michaelsnyder3871
@michaelsnyder3871 10 ай бұрын
An Admiralty inquiry found both Jellicoe and Beatty negligent in ignoring ammunition handling regulations. But government and naval politics squashed the inquiry's findings and sent the Admiral who chaired it off to command the China Squadron. Then the whole thing was put under the Official Secrets Act and everybody blamed the DNC and the designers for something they had no control over for fifty years.
@LJD442
@LJD442 Жыл бұрын
Watching for my second time it feels very relevant right now.
@augnkn93043
@augnkn93043 5 жыл бұрын
Almost one minute talking about Jutland.
@mikelake1306
@mikelake1306 4 жыл бұрын
He was too busy endlessly iterating that having enemies to fight is essential, because otherwise how can you fight enemies?
@thomasjamison2050
@thomasjamison2050 4 жыл бұрын
He has a point. During the cold war, the Navy ran some games to test out their model of carrier based battle groups. The commander that did best was the one that broke up his unit completely to get it to where he was supposed to go. Broken up, it wasn't spotted by satelite.
@michaelsnyder3871
@michaelsnyder3871 10 ай бұрын
I would love to read the AAR on that, given how much risk that commander took deconstructing his defensive depth and capabilities. The CBG is an integrated defensive and offensive force. 1. Soviet detection of CBGs and the CVs inside them did not just depend on NAVRECSATs with radar and IR. There was intel picked up at the base, a world-wide network of electronic intercept stations, the surface "tell-tales" that tailed the CV to provide last second targeting data. There were ESM subs and aircraft on the outskirts of the CBG and then the big acquisition radars of the Tu-16 and Tu-95 conversions. 2. Defense of the CVN started with "Outlaw Shark" and similar programs to provide situational awareness outside the systems available to the TG commander. On the threat axis at the Outer Defense Zone would be the E-2 with ESM and active radar controlling flights of F-14 fighters. The intermediate zones would be covered by shipboard sensors and by area SAMs. Finally, the internal zone would be active jamming and point defense. Pull the ships out of position and the whole thing collapses. The USN did things like put SPS-48 and SPS-49 on all ships so the CVN couldn't be found through its active radar signature. There were blip enhancers on helicopters. There were radar enhanced targets and jammers and chaff/IR rockets. Each ship was linked and integrated through Link 11 (LINK 4 to the E-2 and F-14) which was LoS and NTDS. ASW defense relied on SSNs acting outside a specified area of the CBGs to prevent "friendly fire". Then there was an outer zone of S-3s using ESM and passive sonars with buoys integrated with ship passive sonar, especially towed sonar. The inner defense zone consisted of SH-2 & SH-3 and later SH-60 choppers and the active sonars of escorts and their ASW weapons. Again, pull the formation apart and the whole thing collapses. Single or small groups of ships couldn't replicate the effectiveness of these systems. For example, the CVN's SH-3s and the escorts' SH-2s and SH-60s were carried in sufficient numbers to maintain maximum numbers on station, compared to an isolated escort with only 2 or so SH-2s and SH-60s. Add in that USN CBGs exercised radar and comm silence (except for SAT transmissions) for as long as possible and could sustain 20 knots for four to eight hours and be far enough away from an initial SAT report to force the Soviets to crank up their recon systems all over again.
@gandydancer9710
@gandydancer9710 Жыл бұрын
Fair Warning: I kept waiting, but there's very little here about the battle off Jutland.
@Dav1Gv
@Dav1Gv 2 жыл бұрын
Not sure that the example of turning the 5th Battle Squadron is a very good one. Beatty's signalling, by his own admission after the war, was appalling but he never bothered to sort it out, perhaps because he liked his Flag Lieutenant. Surely this is an example of a poor commander rather than a system. Not that I would argue with his point that the navy went backward in the 19th century, gunnery gave way to cleaning the ship etc etc.
@tommckinnell2001
@tommckinnell2001 2 жыл бұрын
Surely the malaise in the USN occured a touch before the post war period? Honda Point Disaster is presumably a closer analogue to the HMSs Victoria/Camperdown collision.
@michaelsnyder3871
@michaelsnyder3871 10 ай бұрын
Honda Point was a result of squadron tactics where the flagship navigator determined the direction and speed of travel and the squadron commander approved it. The ships of the squadron did what command and control theory demanded they do. It's not like they had high-resolution navigation radar.
@Dav1Gv
@Dav1Gv 2 жыл бұрын
I doubt if the fighting off Guadalcanal in Ironbottom Sound confirms the speaker's view of Admrial King's methods (or of the intelliegence of US Admirals until they got to grips with the war).
@UmHmm328
@UmHmm328 4 жыл бұрын
John Mearsheimer wrote Tragedy of Great Power Politics mentioned around 11:25 mark.
@OceanHedgehog
@OceanHedgehog 2 жыл бұрын
I think the best modern example of a Nelsonian admiral was Spruance. He would give very detailed plans to all fleet commanders and captains, with contingency plans, so they knew the overall tactical or strategic goal if something unexpected occurred, so they could respond accordingly. This meant that Spruance would not have to micromanage, and the fleet could operate in his absence. One time, his flagship was bombed and the fleet continued to fight effectively without Spruance around to give commands; Spruance was later found assisting the fire teams to put out a fire. Contrast this to Halsey who eschewed detailed plans, and consequently his subcommanders often did not know how to respond, most notably when Taffy 5 was attacked.
@michaelsnyder3871
@michaelsnyder3871 10 ай бұрын
Any TG commander that pulled out of place without orders from Spruance or Halsey on his own initiative to support Taffy 5 would have been relieved, especially as Nimitz had told Halsey the IJN carriers were THE primary target and nobody in Third Fleet was in any position once the warnings came in to get anywhere near the fight before it was over. If the IJN had actually had strike groups aboard those carriers, it could have been a disaster if the TG commanders were allowed to run off on their own and they were caught with the IJN carriers to their back. The USN did not know how badly they had shredded the IJNAS at the Philippine Sea.
@rud1gga155
@rud1gga155 2 жыл бұрын
This accent is worth. No one d have ever guessed wäre hes from.
@jthunders
@jthunders 2 жыл бұрын
Where is he from
@michaelsnyder3871
@michaelsnyder3871 10 ай бұрын
I have to disagree. Look at communications, command and situational awareness capabilities. Ships had one, at most two, wireless telegraphs. Communications had to be manually encrypted and decrypted from Morse code. There were range and weather limitations. There was no high-resolution surface search radar or Link 11, E-2 or a CIC to manage situational awareness. All Jellicoe had was an admiral's bridge with a staff marking locations, bearings and speed of formation based on visual reports from subordinate commanders. Visual situational awareness was repeatedly degraded by fog, weather and smoke. There was no Blue Force Tracker, not even night recognition lights. The only ship keeping a plot evidently was the Grand Fleet flagship. A more flexible command arrangement would have failed just as badly or worse than Battlecruiser Squadron. Beatty never kept Jellicoe in the loop or provided systematic reports that elucidated the situation. Nor did many of the light cruiser squadrons that were operating semi-independently. Reports would often give the bearing and speed of an enemy formation but not its relationship or the relationship and position of the reporting element from the flagship. British commanders were not trained for more flexible tactics nor was there time once the war started for Jellicoe to make a change. He fully recognized that fact, but he was never given the time or resources to make changes until AFTER Jutland. The Fifth Division (the Fast Wing) got detached from Battlecruiser Squadron as it couldn't keep up and then found itself in between the Grand Fleet and the High Seas Fleet. The whole thing could have broken down like Friday the Thirteenth off Savo Island in Ironbottom Sound, with British capital ships shooting at each other. As it was, Jellicoe brought the battleships into a position across the German path, shook out into a battle line and then crossed the German "T". And did it twice. It's easy to criticize in hindsight, but Jellicoe really was the man who could lose the war in an afternoon. Nelson could have taken heavy losses and still driven the French-Spanish fleet back into Cadiz. There was still two other fleets in or near the Channel. The British could have had 50% of Nelson's ships go down and still be able to put to sea a Navy with twice as many operational ships of the line, with better captains and crews than the French and Spanish. Nelson could take risks within the technological-tactical framework of early 19th century naval combat. Jellicoe could not.
@davidwright7193
@davidwright7193 2 жыл бұрын
Why does someone giving a lecture on navel strategy feel the need to spend 2 minutes explaining the term “lee”?
@cpawp
@cpawp 5 жыл бұрын
Sry to say - there is no 'Battle of Jutland'. The British lost, in men and/ or ships, and since when does the losing side name a battle..? It is the 'Battle of Skagerrak', as the Germans titled it.
@PaulfromChicago
@PaulfromChicago 5 жыл бұрын
The Germans ran away. The British won.
@michaelsommers2356
@michaelsommers2356 5 жыл бұрын
One does not determine who "won" a battle (to the extent that that notion makes sense) by simply counting losses. Which fleet at Jutland ran away the moment it encountered the enemy? Which fleet spent the rest of the war in port?
@alganhar1
@alganhar1 5 жыл бұрын
The German Grand Fleet never again left port. As Micheal Sommers said, you do not count who won a battle by just losses, but by who held the Operational and Strategic upper hand after the battle. In that, the Grand Fleet most definitively LOST. The next time the mighty German Grand Fleet left Harbour was to surrender at Scapa Flow.
@Sodbusterrod
@Sodbusterrod 5 жыл бұрын
Michael Sommers Both fleets went to their home ports and both fleets later sallied from those ports. August 18, 1916 both fleets again came out. October 18, 1916 the High Seas Fleet sallied again. On an operation off of Denmark November 3, 1916 Grosser Kurfürst and Kronprinz were both torpedoed. November 17, 1917 elements of both battle cruiser fleets were out, in the Bight supporting operations. October 23, 1918 the High Seas Fleet was out supporting an attack on a convoy off of Bergen, Norway. There were various operations in the Baltic and off of Finland.
@Sodbusterrod
@Sodbusterrod 5 жыл бұрын
alganhar1 Maybe you mean the High Seas Fleet. Take a look at my comment on this thread about the various German fleet operations.
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