Thanks Flodnahv. there is also Luke 12: 35-48 very clear, you need to be ready because Jesus could come back at any moment.

@@RobertFurrow you used Matthew 24:44 on your other video to prove that rapture can happen at any moment but when we say it's after the tribulation in verse 29 then you'll say it's not about the rapture.😂

@@RobertFurrow we need to be ready because we can die at any moment not because Jesus can come back at any moment, we’re told VERY clearly in 2 Thessalonians 2:3 that Jesus can not come back at any moment and there’s a few things that need to happen first. We’re also warned not to be deceived that Jesus comes back before these things. In Matthew 24 Jesus tells us not to be deceived but this is the main thing the church is somehow deceived on…

Matthew 24 is Jesus talking to his disciples about events during the Tribulation. It's about Israel, not the church or the rapture. When Jesus was instructing the disciples on where to go preach, he told them in Matthew 10:6 NOT to go to the Gentiles, but RATHER go preach to the lost house of Israel. Jesus knew he would reach the Gentiles later through Paul. Matthew 24, Luke 21 and Mark 13 all match Revelation 6. Nothing in Paul's letters to the Church match Revelation 6. Daniel 9:24 "Seventy weeks are determined for THY people" Who were Daniel's people? Jews. The church didn't exist then and none of the Old Testament prophets knew God was planning to share himself in the future with those pagan Gentiles. We were a secret kept from them (Colossans 1:26 and Romans 16:25)

kzfaq.info/get/bejne/r86Tm9yftdvcqGg.html

Right!

Escape what? The wrath of God. The tribulation is not the wrath of God. Like we have told you guys thousands of times. It is the wrath of Satan against the church.

@PlowsharesintoSwords I shall be caught up. You shall not escape

@@jamescole3152 Might I remind you that the gates of hell shall not prevail against the church. Matthew 16:18

@PlowsharesintoSwords Lol

I appreciate your passion, and understand that I am well aware of the content of the passages you cite. I simply disagree with your interpretation and understanding of prophecy. My concern is with your view that those who believe in a pre-tribulational rapture are somehow delusional. Likewise, there is no reason to think that those who hold my view are not prepared. In fact, the urging is to live for Christ daily, with the understanding that he may return at any moment for his church.

AMEN brother!!!!!! It seems so obvious when you read it all!!

All of the evidence says you are correct.

The saints who died in the tribulation will reign the 1000 year millennial then Those that remain will be called up

It seems weird to have "Said with Love, Honest" in the same paragraph as, "You can keep your delusion, just don't sell it to others, please." Just wanted to point that out... With all that said, I think there are several major flaws with the post-Trib view that, even now, I still haven't heard fully rebutted - one of them being, the impossibility of the Gog/Magog war. If all Scripture must be fulfilled, then the Gog/Magog war of Rev. 20 must happen. And yet, if you hold to the post-Trib view, and you believe that the Rapture happens right before the Millennium Kingdom entrance, then there's no opportunity for a war because 1.) everyone entering the Kingdom would have been a believer in Christ that's eternally sealed (1st Thess. 4:17) and 2.) everyone entering the Kingdom would have been a spiritual being and unable to procreate (Matt. 22:28-30). If you hold to the post-Trib view, then there's no one for Satan to deceive - thus the Gog/Magog prophecy an impossibility.

Nice

Agreed, so many fight over items like this, the rapture, when no one is promised a tomorrow, meaning, our end time views really are not worth arguing because chances are, our end may be at any time.

When the GT comes and there's no pre-trib rapture, I'm pretty sure all of the post-tribbers are going to help you pre-tribbers get through it so you won't fall away. That is true love for the body of Christ right there.

You kinda mis quoted there. Combined two verses. Love God and love neighbor is all the law and prophets.

I'm glad you brought up that point. One of my reason for answering and talking about the rapture on You Tube is I believe that a lot of pretrib believers will give up their faith when they see its not happening the way they were taught. When God gave me my first revelation that the pretrib doctrine was based on scripture verses that do not exist in the entire bible; I wrote my first article and handed it out in my former church. [I moved away] a prominent member and teacher in that church came to me and told me God had showed him the pretrib doctrine was wrong when he was 15 years old.. He was convinced the church fathers had lied to him about this doctrine and he quit church. [Of course God got him back into church] He was and is an excellent bible teacher. I asked him why he didn't tell his class what God showed him. He said, "They don't want to hear about suffering, and won't listen." I said to myself I will never be quiet on what God has shown me. But he was so right. I rarely get someone to listen and have very few who changed their view. A college professor I had said it so correctly. He said, "A man convinced against his will, is of the same opinion still." In other words, don't confuse me with facts. We must not give up explaining what God has shown us.

I Don't know it that is good evidence agent the post-trip Position, But some holding the position can be mean ;-)

I have never come across hateful post trib believers.

@Alyssa Beale No offense, sister, but that is a very shallow and biased response. There are plenty of loving people on both sides of the arguments (and in fact there are more than 2 views).

I noticed that too! A lot of them are borderline foul mouthed when talking down on pre trib!

I've heard pretrib preachers say those who don't believe in pretrib and teach otherwise are Satanic!

Thanks, that is so true

@@RobertFurrow To add to this Truth 1Cor. 15:23 tells us there is a order of resurrections . Christ being the firstfruit- meaning the very first to resurrect and never die again. Second group is those who are Christ at His Coming ( Rapture) the Church. OT Saints are resurrected at end of the Trubulation period(Dan 12:2)(Isa 26:19) The Martyred Tribulation Saints are resurrected before going into the Millennium Kingdom (Rev 20:6) The Living Saints both Jews & Gentiles will go into the Millennium Kingdom in their Natural bodies and repopulate the earth.(Mat.25:31-34)

Prove a divided body in the New Teatament.

@@losgoodmusicmandrell8371 actually the OT saints are in Heaven. Its in the Bible

Yes, and they also don't understand the purpose of the 7-year Tribulation. They don't realize it's an appointed time for Israel from Daniel 9:24 & 27. That's where we get the length from: 7-years.

You're very welcome!

@@RobertFurrow You do a good job on here. I totally disagree with you, but you keep the comments open, so good on you.

kzfaq.info/get/bejne/r86Tm9yftdvcqGg.html

Glad it was helpful!

Look up Zions Hope Ministry, or Nelson Waters KZfaq videos the rapture they are very insightful as to the rapture. The ranks prewrath not pretrib.

We will be here for the tribulation.

@@jayrodriguez84 Amen❤👍 God hates cowards

Kat, its a huge encoded handbook, CODED with the Old Testament, I can explain the whole book and its Chronological Order, Prophecy was my calling 37 years ago, but I only started getting it in full 5 or 6 years ago when the holy spirit answered jy prayer asking why the church was so confused in these end ties by saying *Ron, you guys already know it all* LOL, that was a shocker. Men's traditions BLOCK God's truths.

I think this is a good position. be ready He Could come at any moment, so be Ready

Prepare yourselves.... make your own personal choice at John 3:16-18 God bless!

This is actually a bad stance to take because there is more evidence in the Bible for a post-tribulation than a pre-tribulation. Therefore, if you ONLY prepare for a pre-tribulation rapture, but it doesn't happen you will lose your faith because God didn't do what you believed He would do. My suggestion is to really study scripture about it and prepare yourself for a post-tribulation rapture and IF God raptures the church before the tribulation than that will be another blessing from God

@@saltandlight316 Agreed. I would err on the side of caution (post-trib) and also look at this from the motivations of Satan in his final days. He will want to capture as many souls as possible in those last days, and many of those who were convinced of pre-trib, if in fact it winds up being post-trib, will find themselves in a position of a loss of faith, perhaps feeling as though they are not among the elect. That will make for easy pickings for Satan.

We are raptured by faith - Hebrews 11

Thanks Divac777, The saints beheaded are the people of Israel who have now received the messiah and tribulation saints who were saved after the rapture of the church.

these are the saints that convert and repent during the tribulation period.

Daniel 11:24 He shall enter peaceably. The 1st 3 1/2 he shows himself as good keeping the covenant with Israel and then breaking the covenant mid trib. SO then that would indicate to me, that the church will be able to identify him pre-rapture and before the signing of the 7 year peace deal, we are gone. Just my theory.

Don’t rewrite the Scriptures, they say the Day of the Lord ( which means His coming & His gathering of the Saints will take place before the man of sin be revealed. I know the Pre Trib is hard to accept but it’s the truth.,,,,,

@@losgoodmusicmandrell8371 What? The verse says the exact opposite. It says that day wont happen until the man of sin is revealed, which is midway through the final 7 years

thanks dfwnorthwest, consider the the day of the Lord is a time of Jacobs truble Jeremiah 30:7

Thanks for watching and for sharing your view. God bless!

kzfaq.info/get/bejne/r86Tm9yftdvcqGg.html

Glad it was helpful!

Rapture explained in 10 minutes at The Lord's Day Ministry.

kzfaq.info/get/bejne/r86Tm9yftdvcqGg.html

yes really christians will go in the rapture no matter when it happens ;-)

I say this in love when I say this, The Rapture and Second Coming are the same event it is Immediately After The Tribulation, Mathew 24 vs 29. If they are indeed Separate Events then compare 1 Thessalonians 4 vs 15-18 with Revalation 20 vs 4-6. Both mention a resurrection Revalation says the first Resurrection. If 1 Thessalonians 4 vs 15-18 is describing the Rapture then what is Revalation 20 vs 4-6 describing if it is the Rapture then it suggests a post-trib Rapture since it says those who were beheaded for the witness of Jesus and who had not received the mark nor worshiped the Beast nor his image take part in the Resurrection. If it describes the Second Coming then we have a problem because the Resurrection it mentions is the First Resurrection which again it suggests those who take part in said Resurrection do so for refusing the Mark and Worshipping the Beast. Any objections is welcome let's discuss further

@@justinevans9662 There are a hand full of words for Resurrection and Harpozo is only one...I wish all the words for Resurrection were taught. I noticed that I could not find script for seven years of missing Believers, so I studied Matthew 24, 1&2 Corinthians, and Revelation. I then studied these text and more on Resurrection and found that Resurrection is first. Thank you for sharing.

@@margiechism In the Bible it talks about an event called the Rapture, I believe the Rapture is a biblical Doctrine, however most believe it is an event separate from the Second Coming of Christ and that it takes place 7 years prior to the Second Coming, but let us see what the Bible actually says about Christ's Coming. John 14:1‭-‬4 NKJV “Let not your heart be troubled; you believe in God, believe also in Me. In My Father’s house are many mansions; if it were not so, I would have told you. I go to prepare a place for you. And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and receive you to Myself; that where I am, there you may be also. And where I go you know, and the way you know.” In this passage Jesus promises that after he leaves he will come again and receive his followers to Himself, it also mentions that he will take his followers to be were he is which is heaven. The passage does not say how his followers will meet him nor does it say when. It only suggests that when Christ comes again his followers will be received onto Christ himself and he will take them to be with him in Heaven. I Corinthians 15:51‭-‬54 NKJV Behold, I tell you a mystery: We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed- in a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trumpet. For the trumpet will sound, and the dead will be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal must put on immortality. So when this corruptible has put on incorruption, and this mortal has put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written: “Death is swallowed up in victory.” This passage describes an interesting event that takes. The Resurrection of the righteous, and the living along with the righteous receiving their glorified bodies. Most believe that this describes a Pre-Tribulation Rapture and that it takes place in the twinkling of an eye, but that is not what the passage says. First off it says "we shall all be changed in a moment" this means the change or receiving of the Glorified bodies is what happens in a moment not the Rapture. Second it takes place at the Last Trumpet, a Pre-Tribulation Rapture would suggest the First Trumpet. I Thessalonians 3:13 NKJV so that He may establish your hearts blameless in holiness before our God and Father at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all His saints. This passage says that at Jesus' coming he will come with his saints. Most believe that the Saints it refers to is The Church but what they fail to realize is that it is possible that it is referring to the Angels. A simple and carefully look at this passage will give a hint as to who these Saints are that accompany Christ at his coming. First let's look at this portion of this passage "so that He may establish your hearts blameless in holiness before our God and Father" if the Church were to accompany Christ at his coming the vesre would not say "so that he may establish" but rather 'has established'. The next portion, "at the coming of our Lord Jesus Christ with all His saints", if the Saints it's referring to is the Church then the text would likely say something along the lines of 'with our fellow Saints'. At the end of the day this is just one view, at Christ's coming he will be accompanied by his Saints, let us therefore use scripture to give us more details as to which set of Saints accompany Christ at his coming. 1 Thessalonians 4:16‭-‬17 NKJV For the Lord Himself will descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of an archangel, and with the trumpet of God. And the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. And thus we shall always be with the Lord. This passage most used to support the Rapture whether Pre-Trib, Mid-Trib or Post-Trib, does not say when this Event happens but it does give some details as to what will happen when Jesus returns. When Jesus returns he will give a commanding shout comparable to the voice of an archangel and the trumpet of God, this shout that Christ gives is certainly commanding as it urges those who have died in Christ to rise from the dead. Those who are alive to witness this event if they are Christ's will be caught up together with those who just rose from the dead and they will all meet Jesus in the air at the same time. So when Jesus returns his followers both dead and alive will meet Jesus in the air. I Thessalonians 5:2‭-‬4 NKJV For you yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so comes as a thief in the night. For when they say, “Peace and safety!” then sudden destruction comes upon them, as labor pains upon a pregnant woman. And they shall not escape. But you, brethren, are not in darkness, so that this Day should overtake you as a thief. In this passage it talks about the Day that Jesus returns and compares it to a thief in the night, when the people of the world declare peace and safety then Sudden Destruction comes upon them. Which suggests that when Jesus returns the world will experience a sudden destruction. Will the world survive this destruction and life continue to exist or is it a complete destruction leaving no survivors? II Thessalonians 1:7‭-‬10 NKJV 'and to give you who are troubledl rest with us when the Lord Jesus is revealed from heaven with His mighty angels, in flaming fire taking vengeance on those who do not know God, and on those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. These shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His power, when He comes, in that Day, to be glorified in His saints and to be admired among all those who believe, because our testimony among you was believed.' This passage suggests that when Jesus returns he will come with his Angels and will take vengeance on those who do not know God nor obeyed the Gospel. These individuals will be punished with everlasting destruction, Jesus will also be glorified in his Saints and they will admire him because they held their faith and believed. II Peter 3:10 NKJV But the day of the Lord will come as a thief in the night, in which the heavens will pass away with a great noise, and the elements will melt with fervent heat; both the earth and the works that are in it will be burned up. This passage compares the Day of Christ's coming to a thief in the night it also suggests that when Christ comes again the heavens with pass away with a great noise, this passage however isn't specific with what that noise is. It also mentions the elements melting the things on the earth and the earth itself burning up, suggesting that the Earth is being destroyed. Let us now piece together the puzzle that is Christ's Coming and see what events will transpire; 1. Jesus will come for his followers and take them to Heaven 2. He will be accompanied by his Angels 3. He will Shout with the Voice of an Arch Angel and with the Trumpet of God this Trumpet will be the Last Trumpet 4. There will be a Resurrection 5. Jesus' followers both dead and alive will meet him in the air 6. The Earth will be destroyed This is just a few pieces which gives us not the full picture but a clear enough picture as to the Events that happen at Christ's Return.

@@justinevans9662 I have a trumpet in my closet! My neighbor also played the trumpet in grade school. Could there be different trumpets that aren't necessarily related? Paul said at the last trumpet we'll be raised, but you assume he's talking about the trumpet in Revelation. Is it possible that there is simply a trumpet that is blown in heaven to announce the Rapture, that has nothing to do with a different trumpet in Revelation??

My pleasure!

Thank you

Alicein, You could say I'm going to be there on the last day. what last day do you mea? The last day of a trip? the last day of a week? Will there never be anther trumpet after the rapture of the church? Jesus Said Be ready because you don'e know when He is coming Back. Which means he could come back at any moment. I Hope this helps.

Its is at the last trump not trumpet like most bible teach.

The last trumpet happens toward the end of the tribulation. The church will be here during the tribulation.

@vic paul say Then WE which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them(the dead in Christ) in the cloud. 1thes. 4:17

@@vicvaldez6749 Right. Every believer is raised on the last day.

I see that

God allows babies to die horrible deaths anyway according to your logic. This is not a good argument.

@@bronzemv4440 Well, if a child dies before the age of accountability, he goes to Heaven, a child who takes the mark of the beast goes to Hell.

@@gymguy25 Where does one find the age of accountability in scripture please?

@@caroleevandyk5544 The passage that is used to prove this is usually 2 Samuel 12:23 where God said that David's child from and illegal union would die but David says "I shall go to him, but he shall not return to me", meaning that David, who knew he was going to Heaven (Psalm 23:6), knew he was going to see his child again or "go to him". I guess the words aren't specifically said but this seems to imply that children who die before a certain age don't go to Hell.

Good question. The 7th trumpet of Revelation 11 seems to be different than the trumpet of 1 Thessalonians 4 and 1 Corinthians 15. For example, the trumpet of 1 Thess. and 1 Cor. is referred to as the trumpet of God, and leads to the church being caught up, changed, and ascending to the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. In contrast, the 7th trumpet of Revelation 11 is surrounded by the context of God's judgment being poured out on the earth. Therefore, we understand that the trumpet of Revelation 11 to come after the trumpet of 1 Thess. 4 and 1 Cor. 15.

Thanks Anson, You too

I will need to listen to It again, I can add a video correction for the right reference thanks for letting me know. I will be adding a video, 7 Foundations of the pre-tribulation rapture that may help. Did you watch the video we have, Why I believe in the Pre-tribulation Rapture here is the link kzfaq.info/get/bejne/qNOYhM6cmd2memQ.html Thanks. Ok, I listened to it and I do give the wrong reference I meant Revelation 3:10 not Romans 3:20 lol, like I said I can make a video correction thanks for the catch!

@@RobertFurrow Thank you kindly for your quick response. I will watch the video link you shared with me and look forward to the 7 Foundations video you will be adding. Thank you again and God bless you and your family

@@RobertFurrow you can always add a note on the video for anything that needs corrected. It's somewhere in the video settings. That way you don't have to do a re-upload.

Your attitude is very godly. Oh that we all would just have the heart to love others, proclaim Jesus' salvation, and stay vigilant with our lamps filled with oil and waiting for the return of our King!

You are wise to be questioning the Pre Trib rapture. The video link below shows many problems with the Pre Trib belief and the correct biblical viewpoint from a PreMil prospective. Kinda long at 2hr 15 min but easily viewed in 7 chucks as you’ll see. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/rt2IorB_1bXMn6c.html&feature=emb_logo

I attend a church where the core belief is the pre trib but it never quite made sense to me from when I was a new Christian in terms of the timeline in scripture, I have studied this now and I know that it will not be a pre tribulation rapture based on my study of Matthew 24 and Revelations, I have found no scripture that explicitly says there will be a secret rapture prior to the return of our Lord. I have found after studying despite much preaching on pre trib, that Jesus only speaks of His second coming and returning for His church as one event, scripture clearly states we will meet Him in the air when this happens. I have not found anywhere that says otherwise apart from interpretations that seem to be forced to fit the "left behind" doctrine. The problem however, is my church sees the belief in a post tribulation rapture as false doctrine and if you are found to discuss this with others then you could be asked to leave. I've been part of the church for nearly 20 yrs and I love my church but I always wondered what the objections are on the pre trib rapture. It's a shame my church it's not open to discussing the different views. They always show left behind films to new believers but if you start think otherwise you are not allowed to discuss it.

@@EBB505 Read 1 Corinthians 15:51-55 . “I SHEW YOU A MYSTERY”

@@quantv8708 I have read this scripture many times and I believe this will happen, as I do believe the church will be raptured at the return of Jesus. However, I don't see evidence of how this is a different event (a secret rapture) from the Second coming of Jesus. 1 Thess 4 v13-18 is a parallel to this scripture but also speaks of the resurrection of the dead in Christ which is also mentioned in Revelation 20 v 4-6. The saints are resurrected at this "first resurrection" and there is no other resurrection for saints after this. It also coincides with the saints reigning with Jesus for a 1000 years after this. My question is, if the church is removed before tribulation and the dead in Christ are also resurrected at that moment. Who are those resurrected in the first resurrection in Rev 20 and why is it called the first resurrection as it also is before the millenial reign. If you believe it is those martyred in the tribulation then why it is not the second resurrection. As Rev 20 shows the dead in Christ are raised before the 1000 years and the rest of the dead are not raised until the Day of Judgement. If you can show me a scripture that specifically shows a rapture of the church is a different event to the first resurrection described in Revelation 20, I will look into it. Otherwise I cannot see how the church is not the saints mentioned throughout Revelation as the term tribulation saints is not actually in the Bible.

In John chapters 13-17, Jesus is first preparing his disciples then praying for his disciples to be his witnesses on the earth. Likewise, we ought to pray for the Lord to strengthen us through trials we may face. There is a difference, however, between standing strong against the influence of evil and the Great Tribulation, which is a time of divine judgment on the earth. In response to opponents who say that Jesus doesn't want his followers to be "raptured", the question is whether or not the Bible teaches the rapture of the church. I believe it clearly teaches the rapture (1 Thess. 4), and my understanding of Scripture is that the rapture of the church will occur prior to the Great Tribulation. The phrase "caught up" in 1 These. 4 has been translated from Greek to Latin as "rapio" and the English transliteration of "rapio" is our word "rapture."

@@RobertFurrow If I say Jesus is A way to be save, that would mean that there could be another way to be saved. But if I say Jesus is THE WAY to be saved that would mean there isn't another way . So I guess what I'm asking is do you believe Jesus is A way or The way ? Now does the bible say there is A coming or does it say The coming ? 1 Thessalonians 4:15 says. For this we say unto you , by the word of the of the Lord, that we we which are alive and remain unto THE coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep . Now the subject here is the coming of the Lord, then Paul goes on to tell what will happen at the coming of the Lord , which are, the Lord descends with a shout , with voice of archangel, which is the Trump of God, after this the dead in Christ rise from the dead, then alive believers are caught up in the clouds with the dead, then the dead and the one's remain alive meet the Lord in the air, and shall be with the Lord forever. So we have the dead resurrected, live believers changed , all believers caught up together to meet the Lord . It's like this say this Person we know , we will call him Jim so I tell you Jim is having a birthday party, and he is going to have a barbecue, swimming in his pool, and the taken his guest on a air balloon ride , well a guest shows up and says I came to the barbecue party, another shows up says I came to the swimming party, then another shows up and says I came to the air balloon ride party, now was this Jim's party or one of other 3 things that was happening at Jim's party? Now that's what is happening with people calling THE COMING of the Lord a rapture, caught up is only one of the things that happens at THE COMING.

Thank you 🙌

Yes, it still dose not mean it's not the point in revelation where we see the rapture.

@@RobertFurrow I just corrected your "mis-reading" of the passage. I think it wasn't done by mistake.

@@RobertFurrow so in thinking of Rev. 4 what is you stand point on Jesus missing and unworthy to open scroll until Rev. 5:5? Is not Rev. 4 a perfect example of things past, like John was told to write? After all, if John went up in 4:1 and this too is when the rapture of the church happened, how can Christ not be worthy to open the scroll and not be in heaven?

@@RobertFurrow So where in heaven is the church in revelation 4 and 5?

@@realdeal5649 there is no church in heaven in revelation 4 and 5, church in heaven is shown in chapter 7 after 6th seal has been broken

Thanks

@Me Funny if its such a lie then why are you here listening to it?

@@Jewel084 To be fair, I think​ that many people are "tuning in" not because they necessarily believe in it, but because they are learning or even believe otherwise, and want to hear what the opposing argument believes, either to strengthen or perhaps even refute their own belief, if they happen to have missed something (because it is a large debate covering many verses, so you learn something new each time something is presented). I myself used to simply "accept" the pretrib argument as "fact", but then some very good people who I know and respect started to say things like, "I used to believe in pretrib rapture, but no longer." One for example, is a missionary friend of mine -- on the field for 40 years teaching a pre trib rapture, who changed his view. I know another who also held to the pre-trib position for about as long, and changed his position. This should make someone think. How can they do that? They are so learned. They are teachers of the word." Well, the truth of the matter is, it is not as clear as you may think. To be perfectly fair and above board, I think you should be aware that many people who teach a pretrib rapture (such as the man who has put out this video --- my respect to him for his demeanor which seems gentle) -- well, many people like him (and himself included) are in the "unfortunate" (at best) or even potentially "compromising position" (at worst) of being part of a group of churches who will either shun, look down, ostracize you, or even potentially kick you out from being able to teach within their group should you teach anything other than a pre-trib rapture. _"One of Calvary Chapel’s core values is an eager anticipation of Jesus’ soon return for His Church. We look for the rapture! The “Pre-trib rapture” of the Church has been a _*_lynchpin_*_ in Calvary Chapel’s history, and it will also be a key to our destiny."_ (www.calvarychapeldeepsouth.com/core-values-pre-tribulation-rapture/) Thus, the topic at hand is "non-negotiable" in the eyes of the pastor. He would have to give up his entire pastorate should he decide to teach otherwise. This makes it very unlikely that he will ever consider teaching another view -- since the personal cost to him would be so huge! Sarah, I once went to buy a pizza. I asked the owner, which should I buy? The more expensive or the less expensive? He said, "The more expensive. It's better!" I then paid for the more expensive pizza, because the owner said it was "better." After paying, and as he was preparing the pizza in front of me, he said with a loud voice, "It's better ... for me!" True enough. He had just made more money. While I am not imputing bad motives onto the pastor for his teaching, I cannot help but say and warn you, as a concerned brother in the Lord, be careful about embracing these pre-trib rapture teachings without being very diligent to check out the opposing arguments. Please remember the above quote, which basically "corners" the pastor and literally forces him to teach a pre-trib rapture, otherwise, he pretty well has to kiss his pastorate within the Calvary Chapel movement goodbye. "The “Pre-trib rapture” of the Church has been a *lynchpin* in Calvary Chapel’s history, and it will also be a key to our destiny." (www.calvarychapeldeepsouth.com/core-values-pre-tribulation-rapture/) This should make you think that it would be at least wise of you to consider an opposing argument. Here is one opposing argument you may want to consider. I have found it helpful. It is called, "4 Reasons We Don't Believe in a Pretribulation Rapture-Dalton Thomas (MARANATHA GLOBAL BIBLE STUDY)" kzfaq.info/get/bejne/b8-WppecrNLNYJs.html Have a wonderful day.

except this isn't it

You're Welcome

Same to you!

Amen!

You are correct , this is not a matter of salvation but it is a matter of truth and rightfully dividing the word of GOD

@Sonny Bruschetta Same to you , always a pleasure when Saints can decipher the Truth.

if someone who believes in pre trib and is completely unprepared when persecution comes , he or she might deny jesus and lose his or her salvation. so it is potentially a matter of salvation.

@@spiderjump The Bible does talk about a great falling away so that will definitely happen; The most important thing is to stay grounded in The Lord Jesus Christ no matter what.

Wonderful!

@@RobertFurrowI say this in love when I say this, The Rapture and Second Coming are the same event it is Immediately After The Tribulation, Mathew 24 vs 29. If they are indeed Separate Events then compare 1 Thessalonians 4 vs 15-18 with Revalation 20 vs 4-6. Both mention a resurrection Revalation says the first Resurrection. If 1 Thessalonians 4 vs 15-18 is describing the Rapture then what is Revalation 20 vs 4-6 describing if it is the Rapture then it suggests a post-trib Rapture since it says those who were beheaded for the witness of Jesus and who had not received the mark nor worshiped the Beast nor his image take part in the Resurrection. If it describes the Second Coming then we have a problem because the Resurrection it mentions is the First Resurrection which again it suggests those who take part in said Resurrection do so for refusing the Mark and Worshipping the Beast. Any objections is welcome let's discuss further

Matthew 24 29-30 KJV

@@justinevans9662 amen

Thanks David

Deception can only be decerned by the Spirit of Truth( the Holy Spirit). Deception sound so true, and so easy, and so comforting. Deception doesn't even sound like lies at all, and that is why it is called deception. Why do people take the m@rk? It is written that they took it because they were deceived. How? Because the love of the truth was not in them. If you are saved in Christ, then you will not be appointed to the Wrath of God. That is what it means to be saved. However, as Christians in this world, we are going to have *tribulations.* Deception can't reach you as long as you stand on The Rock(Jesus)? Some say this proves that it will be a secret rapture; " A thief in the night." But that is wrong, the return of the Lord, and the gathering together of the saints to Him in the air, is *not* a quiet and secretive event. A thief in the night refers to the unsaved, because they are not looking for Christ. They don't even believe in Him. They are living their sinful lives as usual. So to them His return is unexpected, like a thief in the night. We who are looking for Christ's return, know that when we see all those things, mentioned in Matthew, to know that Salvation(Christ) is near. I believe what Jesus said in Matthew. Do you? Some say the great falling away is speaking of the rapture. They are wrong. The Falling away is falling away from Christ, who is the Way, the Truth, and Life.The Holy Spirit is removed from those who allowed Him to be removed. When that happens, Christians fall away from Christ who is the Truth. God the Father, His Word( Christ), and the Holy Spirit are One. The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Truth. You cannot be deceived if the Holy Spirit is with you, it will not be possible to deceive the elect. The Restrainer is The Holy Spirit who teaches all truths, convicts, holds back and restrains the full power of evil, and the spirit of lies(satan). The Holy Spirit is God. Only God is more powerful than the devil. If the Holy Spirit is removed you'll have no Holy Spirit protection, you are at the unholy spirits' disposal. Mental illness, and Schizophrenia are on the rise, increase since a certain thing was man-dated; lawlessness abounds, because demonic possessions will increase. You think it's the church that is preventing the evil one to have it's way? No. God is Who restrains and sets boundaries. The Holy Spirit is God. Will you recognize truth, when you hear it? People are getting confused with troubles/great troubles. Tribulation means trouble. Have you ever been mocked, scoffed at, slandered, hated without a cause, betrayed, scorned, or rejected? Those are part of our tribulation walk in Christ, those are part of being persecuted. The world hates Christ, therefore it will hate His children. We are not greater than our Mastor. As true Christians we are often rejected by children of this world. If you are blending in with the world, something is wrong. Christianity is not a popularity walk, it involves picking up our cross, dying to self, enduring tribulations for our faith, even unto death. It is not about being tolerant to the world's demands. It is about what is right, Holy, and pleasing to God. We must obey God, rather than man. Tribulation is not wrath. The tribulation of mankind started in the Garden of Eden with satan's deception, leading to the fall of mankind. The continued persecutions(tribulations) of the Children of God has been happening throughout history. Look how Cain( the unrighteous one), killed his brother, Abel( the righteous one). This persecution(tribulation) will get greater as times get more wicked, as evil is less restrained. Look what happened to Christians during the peak of the Roman Empire; they went through great tribulations; being thrown to lions to be ripped alive and eaten, burnt at the stake, beheaded, thrown into fires, ripped apart alive, nailed to cross, beaten mercilessly, etc. The tribulation is not God’s wrath. It is satan's rule, and he hates God/Christ, and he hates all who follows God/Christ. God is in control. However, the devil has dominion over Earth, through decieving Adam(man) in the Garden of Eden. His dominion ends when Christ sets up His Eternal Kingdom. So, as Christians we all have tribulations( troubles/persecutions) in this world. *There is no secret, private rapture before tribulations. Read Matthew; Christ is telling you what the Day of His coming will be like. For some reason, most people prefer another Gospel, and because they reject the truth, they fall into deception. I know people/ pastors personally who believe in pretribulation rapture, so everything that is happening now cannot be of the beast because they have not been raptured; They are steadfast on rapture first before tribulations; And you know what? They encourage all they know to take the jabs. They have been deceived by another gospel. Wasn't that what satan did in Eden? He preached another gospel to Eve. God told them don't, or you shall surely die. What was the devil's gospel? You shall not surely die, your eyes will be opened, you will be like God, knowing good and evil. *The Lord returns after the tribulation.* Here is what Christ said about His return: *It is written in Matthew 24: 29 -31, KJV.* *This is Christ telling you .* *29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. *31 And He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.* You can read the rest on your own. All verses point to the gathering of the saints and the return of Christ as the same day, not separate times. Repent all who have taken the jabs, all jabs. Please!

We will have a video on the age of accountability

Amen, and you are absolutely correct my friend. I have been studying biblical prophecy for years and have look into this subject throughly. Let me tell you people who reject the pre trib, reject the doctrine of eternal security. Also your view of Israel as a nation and as a people in God’s prophetic timeline will determine your viewpoint of biblical prophecy. Biblical prophecy has always centered around Israel as a nation and as a people. Jesus first coming primarily to the nation of Israel then to the gentiles and likewise the end times will also primarily be about Israel and it will definitely affect the entire world.

@@order-sol0414 Thank you brother, we're blessed with eyes to see, and ears to hear. The Holy Ghost our teacher Jesus always with us. LORD bless you, and yes LORD bless Israel, blessed be the name of the LORD.

You may be right

You may be right

If someone got “saved” 5 years ago and since then has stopped living for Christ and has started sinning until the Return of Christ and never repented by judgement day, would they still be saved?

Do you believe God is going to keep his promises to Israel?

@@RobertFurrow God said he will return to them. Romans 11:27-28 shows this will happen, but not until the rapture. Our differences lie in the timing of this resurrection. The connecting point for me is Matthew 24:29 with Rev 6:12. If these two are the same, then there is no reason to believe in the Jews being saved before the trib is over. The big flaw is believing these 144K are witnessing to the world, but the Bible does not say that at all. They are the ones being witnessed to, by the 2, Rev 11:3. If the Jews were saved before the rapture then they would go in it. That is true on both accounts of pre or post-trib. But you see, Rev 6:12 must happen first, then we see the Jews with Jesus, Rev 7:3, but Rev 6:12 must be after trib, so we must look to see where trib is in the text. That would be Rev 6:5 as the Abomination and the mark as the saints suffer, Rev 6:8, and more toward the end of it, Rev 6:9-11. Rev 6:12-17 is our gathering, as Matthew 24:31 convoys, then as Luke 26:26 describes things coming after these signs which things are the hurting of the earth in Rev 7:1, but are depicted in Rev 8:5-13. With Love, Brother. God Bless.

@@ronniemurphy2124 that's right Sir!. Keep on going! We need to save more people, and completely obliterate this False doctrine. Especially in the end of days.

@@zacharymasters587 Way too many are putting their hopes in a lie because it is easy to believe, but in the end, they will suffer more just because they believed the Bridegroom would come before midnight and even before dusk, Matthew 25:1-13. They will not be ready for the night. They deny Matthew 24 as pertaining to them and say it is for the Jews and they forget about Matthew 25 and accept it for themselves full-heartedly. Do they not know it is the same sermon in both chapters. It's just people taking what they desire and give the rest away because they don't want God's word when it gets hard. The Jews did the same thing. It seems some just don't ever learn.

@@ronniemurphy2124 Wait so if the Lord is on his way down, and we are on our way up at the same time, do we pass him and wave! Good luck down there Jesus, it's pretty messy!

Definitely an interesting verse. I'm assuming that your question about the last trumpet relates to harmonizing the passage with the seventh trumpet of Revelation 11? There are several qualitative distinctions between the two passages. 1 Corinthians 15 (and 1 Thessalonians 4:16) refers to the trumpet of God and ushers in the departure of the church from this earth, to meet the Lord in the air. It is a trumpet that culminates in life. In contrast, the trumpet of Revelation is not referred to as the trumpet of God, but of the angel. And following the trumpet sounded by the angel in Revelation 11, continued judgment on earth follows. In the chronology of Revelation, the church is viewed in heaven as early as chapter 4, whereas the "last trumpet" of places the church on earth, and ascending to heaven. Let me know if you had a different question in mind.

@@RobertFurrow thank you for the insight! Very helpful

You will not find one scripture for a secret Rature, all scriptures speak of trumpets lightnings e.t.c the whole world will will know at once Christ has come back for his people in the twinkling of an eye and then the day of the Lord begins. GOD BLESS ALL.

You welcome!

pre

@@senaidacarrasco805 if you’re saying pre then that would mean there’s two appearings of Jesus: 1.) The rapture of the church pre-tribulation, and 2.) at the end of the 7 year tribulation (2nd coming at the mount of olives) Jesus would the rapture those that have given their lives to Him. Because there will be people that time that will receive salvation during that time. So they will need to be raptured/resurrected or whatever you want to call it at that time.

Thanks, I will do a Hot Topic on the Last Trumpet.

@@RobertFurrow thank you sir! I see how the last trump could very well represent the Feast of Trumpets, the last trump, well nobody’s knows exactly what day that should be either, but the term last Trump 100% definitely is associated with the rapture of the church. The last trump in feasts of Trumpets could be the fulfillment of the 7th trumpet. But in that same festival, the first trump is the alarm (possibly be representing the onset of the tribulation). You know .. deep down I truly hope we don’t have to go through the tribulation. I pray for a Pre-Tribulation rapture, it’s just hard to see that in the scripture. Anyway, God bless you and thank you for your channel.

The trumpet mentioned in Thessalonians and Corinthians is NOT the last trumpet judgement. The Bible is clear on this.

Thanks Jake, There can be several parts to the first Resurrection. I am planing a Hot Topic on Resurrections. :-)

The dead in Christ that are lifted before the tribulation as well as the tribulation saints mentioned in revelation are all apart of the first resurrection. The 2nd resurrection is the one for non believers which happens after the 1000 millennial reign.

@@RobertFurrow That in a moment, in a twinkling of an eye will happen AT the last or 7th trumpet. It only means that the Rapture will take place ONCE.

@@steelers8ful Please, so me some biblical proof of this.

@@steelers8ful The first resurrection, literally, happens right before the thousand year reign, and after the antichrist is destroyed, which is why the first resurrection includes people that die due to rejecting the beast. "And I saw thrones, and they sat upon them: and I saw the souls of them that were beheaded for the witness of Jesus, and for the word of God, and which had not worshiped the beast, neither his image, neither had received his mark upon their foreheads, or in their hands; and they lived and reigned a thousand years. But the rest of the dead lived not again until the thousand years were finished. THIS IS THE FIRST RESURRECTION. (Revelation 20:4-5). 1 Corinthians 15 is NOT focusing on a "rapture", but on the RESURRECTION. The "twinkling of an eye" is talking about the resurrected being changed into an immortal, not people being raptured up. It literally says this. "In the moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the DEAD shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. (1 Corinthians 15:52). When the dead are raised Christ has come, they will be resurrected immortal, and those that are alive will then be caught up and changed as well. That is a far cry from happening multiple times.

Thank you kindly

Thank you

You are welcome!

My dear cook, consider this one. When our Lord died and conquered death, he came back, hung out for 40 days then went home to Father. BAM, this is the start of the end times, 2000 years ago. Think about it, since the beginning of the church there has been tribulation, really bad first 300 years, 1 million hunted, starved, beaten, tortured, killed by gladiators, eaten by lions, burned on crosses, etc. AND over the centuries since then, millions more have died martyrs for Christ, (recently over 1 million in China between 1967-1974 alone) not to mention all that is going on today. THE BIBLE SAYS THIS ABOUT HIS RETURN, one event, not two. (Isaiah 13:6-11 / Joel 3:1-16 / Matthew 24:3-31 / Mark 13:5-27 / Luke 21:8-31 / 1 Thessalonians 4:13-18 / 1 Thessalonians 5:1-11 / 2 Thessalonians 2:1-11) really stop and read them!!! According to OUR Lord; A. the falling away will began. B. the man of LAWLESSNESS will arrive. C. the sun and moon go dark, (not eclipse) and then, BAM, he's coming back, BUT, we don't know the day or hour, (STOP LISTENING TO ME, and read those verses real quick). They are the words of your God. YOU SEE, not one mention of this extra event/EARLY RAPTURE. Not ONE verse clearly confirming an EARLY rapture. Not ONE teaching by Prophet or Apostle about the last generations to join the church AND ONLY the last generations, get a free pass on suffering, no testing, trial, tribulation, but a free trip to a party instead, (get real). Not one mention of this in the Bible, ONLY BY MAN CAN YOU LEARN THIS BALONEY!!!!!! It's just a carefully crafted story we all wish was true. It's not supported by the Bible. The RAPTURE will come at the 7th Trumpet not before. Like you, I was TAUGHT, the pre-tribulation rapture and never thought to question it. So many well intentioned, good people say the same thing. Then I started reading my Bible myself and that made all the difference. SO, remember what Christ said to us, he said, the evil one is coming NEXT. And that happens when Michael throws Lucy and his gang out of heaven, (Isaiah 14:12/Revelation 12:9/Revelation 12:13) AT FIRST, he will DECIEVE most of the pre-tribulation/EARLY rapture believers, (Matthew 24:24) and about 3.5 years here on earth, he'll turn SUPER nasty, (remember he will be here in the flesh, not just spirit) and start hunting Gods children and killing so many that Jesus said himself said, (Mark 13:20/Matthew 24:22) no flesh would be alive, NONE, nada, zip if he didn't cut that time short! AND when God is ready to deliver his bowls of WRATH, Christ says the angels will protect us and not harm us, (Revelation 9:4). Just like God ALWAYS does, (the Hebrews in Egypt, Daniel in Lions den, Shadrach, Meshach and Abednego in the furnace, Lot in Sodom, Noah and the flood, etc. ALL of them suffering tribulation BUT saved from Gods wrath)! GOD DOES NOT CHANGE. NOW, IS THE TIME TO READ YOUR BIBLE and stop trusting the teachings of man! God loves you and so do I, enough, I would gladly Bible study with you and go through ALL 2400 verses related to Christs return, (email on channel). NO WORDS OF MAN, opinions, understandings, interpretations or alternate doctrines JUST Gods words, cool? And before you argue timing with me, use ONLY your Bible and find me just one verse that confirms your early rapture, just one! No words of man! Your Brother in Christ, Honest.

Thanks for sharing, I certainly don't agree with you.

You're welcome

Thanks and welcome

Sorry, I disagree, as stated in the Video.

@@RobertFurrow You can disagree all you want but you are still in error and need to repent.

@@RobertFurrow There is no pre-trib. in The revelation of Jesus Christ. John gives the description of the Lord Jesus coming in chapter 1 of the Revelation of Jesus Christ, to the seven churches, in which Philadelphia is one of those seven, so they are expecting His coming, to be like this and this is a direct parallel, of the same description, Jesus gave in Mat. 24, which is after the tribulation and not before or as pre-trib. falsely says it will happen.) Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and THEN shall ALL the TRIBES of the earth MOURN, and they shall SEE the Son of man COMING in the CLOUDS of heaven with power and great glory. Rev 1:4 John TO THE SEVEN churches which are in Asia: Grace be unto you, and peace, from him which is, and which was, and which is TO COME; and from the seven Spirits which are before his throne; Rev 1:7 Behold, HE COMETH with CLOUDS; and EVERY eye shall SEE HIM, and they also which pierced him: and ALL KINDREDS of the earth shall WAIL, because of him. Even so, Amen.

It's unfair to say he hasn't given any proof. He's given as much as you have in your response to him - you just interpret the events and passages differently. Be charitable enough to recognize that at least, knowing that even if you believe he is wrong, that he just as equally believes you are wrong.

@@AliceinJapanaland He as not given proof but reads his false interpretation into scripture ,which is false teaching called Eisegesis

Thank you Marius

Thank you Yacob, Your very kind

Dear saint, be encouraged! You're missing the best parts. The harvest of the crops is before his return. We are his body, and we will return with our Lord. The Lord does not want you to go down into the bed of tribulation. His bridal remnant will speak to warn the church and the world but will be rejected by all. The Lord warns his saints to let no man take thy crown. Mans doctrines will steal many crowns! The church has the opportunity to not go down into the tribulation period, but their doctrines are going to take them there. They should have had crowns, but now they are holding palm branches. Revelation 3:11 [11]Behold, I come quickly: hold that fast which thou hast, that no man take thy crown. Know this....if there is a LAST TRUMP, there is a FIRST TRUMP. If there is a HIGH CALLING, there is a LESSER CALLING. A remnant will be SEATED in the MIDST OF THE THRONE, wearing CROWNS. Other believers will be STANDING BEFORE THE THRONE, holding PALMS. There are 3 companies of believers that will be taken out of here by ranks before the middle of the week of tribulation. I hope you can hear the truth so you can depart with the first call at pretrib. The LORD DOES COME AFTER TRIBULATION, but what you can't see or you have never been taught.... WE COME WITH HIM. The whole church is already in heaven by the middle of tribulation, dear believer! I am going to show you some verses to give you a FULL VIEW, and maybe your eyes can receive spiritual understanding. Let's go! Matthew 24:28-31 [28]For wheresoever the carcass is, there will the eagles be gathered together. The eagles are the FULL OVERCOMERS that departed into heaven at pretrib. These are the Philadelphian Eagle Saints that were kept out of the hour of temptation. Revelation 3:10 [10]Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. WHERE IS THE CARCASS AND WHO IS THE CARCASS?!?!? The answer is Jesus, and he is seated on his throne in heaven. Revelation 5:6 [6]And I beheld, and, lo, in the midst of the throne and of the four beasts, and in the midst of the elders, stood a LAMB AS IT HAD BEEN SLAIN, having seven horns and seven eyes, which are the seven Spirits of God sent forth into all the earth. The EAGLE SAINTS ARE FOUND IN THE MIDST OF THE THRONE WITH THEIR BRIDEGROOM, THEY ARE WITH THE LAMB WHO WAS SLAIN. NOW.....Let's talk about when these full overcomers eagle saints were caught up to heaven. The book of John represents the EAGLE. John is representing the full overcomers, the Philadelphia eagle saints. They were CAUGHT UP ALIVE through the open door, directly into the throne room, at pretrib, on the morning of the day of the Lord! Read the verse below, my friend. The FIRST VOICE IS THE FIRST TRUMP! The Lord shouts to John the eagle, "COME UP HERE!" Revelation 4:1-2 [1]After this I looked, and, behold, a door was opened in heaven: and the FIRST VOICE which I heard was as it were of a TRUMPET (((THE FIRST TRUMPET CALL))) talking with me; which said, Come up hither, and I will shew thee things which must be hereafter. [2]And immediately I was in the spirit: and, behold, a throne was set in heaven, and one sat on the throne. OK, as I have proved through scripture that it is there. The eagles are already in the midst of the throne before we get to the next verse. [29]Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: [30]And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. [31]And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. ****In verse 31, his elect are gathered FROM HEAVEN, not the earth.**** Furthermore, the verses used in 2 Thessalonians are scriptures to comfort those believers left behind. I Thessalonians was written to those believers who laid hold of the high and heavenly bridal call.

Thank you very much!

Thanks J Frier, as time goes on the tribulation intensifies the wrath was started when the first seal was opened. The interaction with those saints on earth are the people of Israel and new believer that got saved after the Rapture. Hope this helps we will do a video soon on the pre-wrath position thanks.

Thank you kindly

Thanks, Not much, We at Calvary Chapel are not full dispensationalist. only in the broad sense that God Worked with Israel before Christ then they were blinded in part until the fulness of the Gentiles comes in. As it says in the follow passage. Hope this helps! “For I do not desire, brethren, that you should be ignorant of this mystery, lest you should be wise in your own opinion, that blindness in part has happened to Israel until the fullness of the Gentiles has come in. And so all Israel will be saved, as it is written: “The Deliverer will come out of Zion, And He will turn away ungodliness from Jacob;” ‭‭Romans‬ ‭11‬:‭25‬-‭26‬ ‭NKJV‬‬

He said be ready you don't know when the Son of Man will return.

@@RobertFurrow But Peter didn't expect him at anytime. So when he says you don't know the day its obviously referring to matt 24 after the tribulation as that's where those statements are found. Peter didn't expect Jesus to return in his life time. Jesus told him he would die. John 21:18 “I tell you the truth, when you were young, you were able to do as you liked; you dressed yourself and went wherever you wanted to go. But when you are old, you will stretch out your hands, and others[f] will dress you and take you where you don’t want to go.” 19 Jesus said this to let him know by what kind of death he would glorify God. Then Jesus told him, “Follow me.” Peter confirms this to the church - 2 Peter 1:14 For our Lord Jesus Christ has shown me that I must soon leave this earthly life, 15 so I will work hard to make sure you always remember these things after I am gone. So it's clear the early church never expected Jesus at anytime they were to expect him after the signs he said would come before his coming in Matt 24.

Thanks and Amen!

thanks

I have done' that is called "Why I believe in the Pre-Trib Rapture"

Amen!

Thanks Daniel

@@RobertFurrow You're welcome.

Thanks Cathy, blessings!

Amen Cathy! Deception can only be decerned by the Spirit of Truth( the Holy Spirit). Deception sound so true, and so easy, and so comforting. Deception doesn't even sound like lies at all, and that is why it is called deception. Why do people take the m@rk? It is written that they took it because they were deceived. How? Because the love of the truth was not in them. If you are saved in Christ, then you will not be appointed to the Wrath of God. That is what it means to be saved. However, as Christians in this world, we are going to have *tribulations.* Deception can't reach you as long as you stand on The Rock(Jesus)? Some say this proves that it will be a secret rapture; " A thief in the night." But that is wrong, the return of the Lord, and the gathering together of the saints to Him in the air, is *not* a quiet and secretive event. A thief in the night refers to the unsaved, because they are not looking for Christ. They don't even believe in Him. They are living their sinful lives as usual. So to them His return is unexpected, like a thief in the night. We who are looking for Christ's return, know that when we see all those things, mentioned in Matthew, to know that Salvation(Christ) is near. I believe what Jesus said in Matthew. Do you? Some say the great falling away is speaking of the rapture. They are wrong. The Falling away is falling away from Christ, who is the Way, the Truth, and Life.The Holy Spirit is removed from those who allowed Him to be removed. When that happens, Christians fall away from Christ who is the Truth. God the Father, His Word( Christ), and the Holy Spirit are One. The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Truth. You cannot be deceived if the Holy Spirit is with you, it will not be possible to deceive the elect. The Restrainer is The Holy Spirit who teaches all truths, convicts, holds back and restrains the full power of evil, and the spirit of lies(satan). The Holy Spirit is God. Only God is more powerful than the devil. If the Holy Spirit is removed you'll have no Holy Spirit protection, you are at the unholy spirits' disposal. Mental illness, and Schizophrenia are on the rise, increase since a certain thing was man-dated; lawlessness abounds, because demonic possessions will increase. You think it's the church that is preventing the evil one to have it's way? No. God is Who restrains and sets boundaries. The Holy Spirit is God. Will you recognize truth, when you hear it? People are getting confused with troubles/great troubles. Tribulation means trouble. Have you ever been mocked, scoffed at, slandered, hated without a cause, betrayed, scorned, or rejected? Those are part of our tribulation walk in Christ, those are part of being persecuted. The world hates Christ, therefore it will hate His children. We are not greater than our Mastor. As true Christians we are often rejected by children of this world. If you are blending in with the world, something is wrong. Christianity is not a popularity walk, it involves picking up our cross, dying to self, enduring tribulations for our faith, even unto death. It is not about being tolerant to the world's demands. It is about what is right, Holy, and pleasing to God. We must obey God, rather than man. Tribulation is not wrath. The tribulation of mankind started in the Garden of Eden with satan's deception, leading to the fall of mankind. The continued persecutions(tribulations) of the Children of God has been happening throughout history. Look how Cain( the unrighteous one), killed his brother, Abel( the righteous one). This persecution(tribulation) will get greater as times get more wicked, as evil is less restrained. Look what happened to Christians during the peak of the Roman Empire; they went through great tribulations; being thrown to lions to be ripped alive and eaten, burnt at the stake, beheaded, thrown into fires, ripped apart alive, nailed to cross, beaten mercilessly, etc. The tribulation is not God’s wrath. It is satan's rule, and he hates God/Christ, and he hates all who follows God/Christ. God is in control. However, the devil has dominion over Earth, through decieving Adam(man) in the Garden of Eden. His dominion ends when Christ sets up His Eternal Kingdom. So, as Christians we all have tribulations( troubles/persecutions) in this world. *There is no secret, private rapture before tribulations. Read Matthew; Christ is telling you what the Day of His coming will be like. For some reason, most people prefer another Gospel, and because they reject the truth, they fall into deception. I know people/ pastors personally who believe in pretribulation rapture, so everything that is happening now cannot be of the beast because they have not been raptured; They are steadfast on rapture first before tribulations; And you know what? They encourage all they know to take the jabs. They have been deceived by another gospel. Wasn't that what satan did in Eden? He preached another gospel to Eve. God told them don't, or you shall surely die. What was the devil's gospel? You shall not surely die, your eyes will be opened, you will be like God, knowing good and evil. *The Lord returns after the tribulation.* Here is what Christ said about His return: *It is written in Matthew 24: 29 -31, KJV.* *This is Christ telling you .* *29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. *31 And He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.* You can read the rest on your own. All verses point to the gathering of the saints and the return of Christ as the same day, not separate times. Repent all who have taken the jabs, all jabs. Please!

You are very welcome

Are you referring to a specific comment that I made?

@@RobertFurrow yes, sir!

Amen

@@RobertFurrow so many Christians I know ... when they read about JACOB'S trouble, they equate that with the Church

Thanks for the suggestion! We'll certainly give it consideration. God bless!

My question is what are you DOING to advance the kingdom of God. Are you daily seeking the door in prayer and in His Word? Why do you care what Chris White says? Is it unsettling for you and why? I'd recommend that you read Pilgrims Progress, I think you'll find a description of yourself in one of the characters who is obsessed with talking and debating the Bible. Audiobook versions are available on KZfaq.

You need to ask God what is correct and what is error. I did and he shocked me right out of my socks with his answers. God loves honest questions; and he WILL answer your questions. The only thing this Christian pastor has right is Jesus is coming back. When the foundation you build on is wrong, then everything you build on top of it is wrong as well. Evangelicals believe the bible is self interpreting and needs no outside source to explain its contents. The bible is its own source for explaining doctrine. With that belief that I'm sure Pastor Furrow believes I want you to find support for the 7 church history theory and just one verse that says Laodicea is the last church age. That is an extrabiblical doctrine and with that error the pretrib believers make REV. Ch. 4 say 100% things it absolutely does not say. SO, find one verse that says there will be an invisible rapture. One verse that says Christ is making two trips to planet earth. One verse that says we go to heaven for 7 years. One verse that says there is two resurrections of the saints. That theory absolutely goes against 1st Corinthians 15:22-24. His interpretation of Matthew Ch.24&25 is totally wrong and he and you will never see it till you become a literalist in reading scripture. That means you believe what each page says without reading into it what it does not say. You ask God your questions and you will get the correct rendering of scripture.

@@wolfgangk1 I'm curious...which of those characters is most like you! Also, I'm not seeking any door... I'm not sure what you're into but, no thanks!

@@shermanmace3773 I do ask God. I don't believe in a pretribulation rapture. I believe in a prewrath rapture. Thanks though.

Thanks, I'm working of a video just about that passage.

@@RobertFurrow Great! Im definitely watching it. It's been a bit of a tug of war for me when it comes to this topic. So I'm excited to see what you have say!

If you read the bible in a literal interpretation and rightly divide the Word the pre trib rapture is the only option. All others you have to interpret it differently. Simple but not simplistic. 👍✌❤

You're welcome

I will refer you to Titus now. Prayers to get the gospel out in these last days. Amen and amen. Look and live.

I will not engage in useless debates. I will stand against heresy. This is not that. I am more concerned with the gospel reaching the lost. I will not engage anymore. Good day.🙏✌❤

Sigh...smh. I am sorry you do not understand my position. I should not assume that you understand the pre trib view. I have an illness that I deal with. I can refer you to Robert's archives. Also John Miller, Scott Richards....good day.

Great job capturing the heart of the discussion. God bless!

I agree.

There is a great falling away before Jesus comes back and a lot of post tribbers think it's at the time when pre-tribbers are expecting to be raptured. When the pre-tribulation rapture doesn't happen, it will challenge the faith of a lot of pre-tribbers. Just make sure you're not one of those that fall away. Learn from the post-tribbers how to keep your faith strong through the tribulation. They will have spiritually prepared for this.

Watch Pastor Joe Schimmel from Good Fight Ministries. He’ll clear it all up real fast :)

Love this reply! You capture the heart behind the conversation. God bless you!

What is it that you disagree with what the Pastor has said. Scripture, Doctrine or what?

@@losgoodmusicmandrell8371 I disagree with the pre-tribulation rapture, but I appreciate this pastors heart in discussing it.

@@alancain5853 I don’t see how you disagree with over flowing evidence to the Pre Trib Rapture but I’m ok with it. It’s so easy to see and defend by scripture, but I understand that’s me

Amen

Nice!

nice indeed, since the flood was the wrath of God, not some anti-Christ maniac

A lot to think about

I can answer that with my personal opinion. I think in the new heaven and new earth, since we will be a perfect civilization under God we will also be either a type 5 or type X civilization due to how great God’s power is and how he will allow us to colonize other planets. I also wouldn’t be surprised if God only has his civilization stay on the new earth and new heaven- but we’ll have to see. I personally think God will somehow prevent man from reaching mars and eventually Jupiter and (though Saturn’s moon) Titan before the rapture and the tribulation.

The question should be: What type civilization will we be AFTER judgment day and once the New Earth is completed. We could be in a new solar system as a whole- let alone a new universe since God will create new heavens.

Amen

Rapture explained in 10 minutes at The Lord's Day Ministry.

Let me clarify this to you, Matthew 24:31 is not his return to earth, and nowhere does it say such a thing. This verse is the rapture and he takes us to heaven. If it were his coming to earth, then Rev 6:12 would be wrong, but it's not wrong. You see Rev 6:12 is Matthew 24:29, which plainly states is after trib. So if trib is over at Rev 6:12 then what are the saints doing in heaven with Christ in Rev 7:14. Christ is coming to stay, we are coming back with him to stay and reign over the nations. Matthew 24:31 can not be his return to earth for these reasons and there is no proof otherwise.

@@ronniemurphy2124 let us all wait for Him😃🙏

@@nicholaschuma6304 Yes, but let us be ready to wait for him, Mathew 25:1-13, for they all waited, but some were not ready for the night. Prepare for the night and then we can endure it to see Jesus come. Those that left to go buy, had to take the mark, causing them to be cursed, Rev 14:9-11, and miss the Lord's coming.

@@ronniemurphy2124 Matthew 24: 30 is talking about 2nd coming. 31 is the rapture. 29 talks about tribulation of those days which is the 1st half of tribulation. The the great tribulation happens between abomination and the next 45 days. Then comes God's wrath in the 7th seal.

Thanks Byron, The day of the Lord is a broad term that often relies on context.

Deception can only be decerned by the Spirit of Truth( the Holy Spirit). Deception sound so true, and so easy, and so comforting. Deception doesn't even sound like lies at all, and that is why it is called deception. Why do people take the m@rk? It is written that they took it because they were deceived. How? Because the love of the truth was not in them. If you are saved in Christ, then you will not be appointed to the Wrath of God. That is what it means to be saved. However, as Christians in this world, we are going to have *tribulations.* Deception can't reach you as long as you stand on The Rock(Jesus)? Some say this proves that it will be a secret rapture; " A thief in the night." But that is wrong, the return of the Lord, and the gathering together of the saints to Him in the air, is *not* a quiet and secretive event. A thief in the night refers to the unsaved, because they are not looking for Christ. They don't even believe in Him. They are living their sinful lives as usual. So to them His return is unexpected, like a thief in the night. We who are looking for Christ's return, know that when we see all those things, mentioned in Matthew, to know that Salvation(Christ) is near. I believe what Jesus said in Matthew. Do you? Some say the great falling away is speaking of the rapture. They are wrong. The Falling away is falling away from Christ, who is the Way, the Truth, and Life.The Holy Spirit is removed from those who allowed Him to be removed. When that happens, Christians fall away from Christ who is the Truth. God the Father, His Word( Christ), and the Holy Spirit are One. The Holy Spirit is the Spirit of Truth. You cannot be deceived if the Holy Spirit is with you, it will not be possible to deceive the elect. The Restrainer is The Holy Spirit who teaches all truths, convicts, holds back and restrains the full power of evil, and the spirit of lies(satan). The Holy Spirit is God. Only God is more powerful than the devil. If the Holy Spirit is removed you'll have no Holy Spirit protection, you are at the unholy spirits' disposal. Mental illness, and Schizophrenia are on the rise, increase since a certain thing was man-dated; lawlessness abounds, because demonic possessions will increase. You think it's the church that is preventing the evil one to have it's way? No. God is Who restrains and sets boundaries. The Holy Spirit is God. Will you recognize truth, when you hear it? People are getting confused with troubles/great troubles. Tribulation means trouble. Have you ever been mocked, scoffed at, slandered, hated without a cause, betrayed, scorned, or rejected? Those are part of our tribulation walk in Christ, those are part of being persecuted. The world hates Christ, therefore it will hate His children. We are not greater than our Mastor. As true Christians we are often rejected by children of this world. If you are blending in with the world, something is wrong. Christianity is not a popularity walk, it involves picking up our cross, dying to self, enduring tribulations for our faith, even unto death. It is not about being tolerant to the world's demands. It is about what is right, Holy, and pleasing to God. We must obey God, rather than man. Tribulation is not wrath. The tribulation of mankind started in the Garden of Eden with satan's deception, leading to the fall of mankind. The continued persecutions(tribulations) of the Children of God has been happening throughout history. Look how Cain( the unrighteous one), killed his brother, Abel( the righteous one). This persecution(tribulation) will get greater as times get more wicked, as evil is less restrained. Look what happened to Christians during the peak of the Roman Empire; they went through great tribulations; being thrown to lions to be ripped alive and eaten, burnt at the stake, beheaded, thrown into fires, ripped apart alive, nailed to cross, beaten mercilessly, etc. The tribulation is not God’s wrath. It is satan's rule, and he hates God/Christ, and he hates all who follows God/Christ. God is in control. However, the devil has dominion over Earth, through decieving Adam(man) in the Garden of Eden. His dominion ends when Christ sets up His Eternal Kingdom. So, as Christians we all have tribulations( troubles/persecutions) in this world. *There is no secret, private rapture before tribulations. Read Matthew; Christ is telling you what the Day of His coming will be like. For some reason, most people prefer another Gospel, and because they reject the truth, they fall into deception. I know people/ pastors personally who believe in pretribulation rapture, so everything that is happening now cannot be of the beast because they have not been raptured; They are steadfast on rapture first before tribulations; And you know what? They encourage all they know to take the jabs. They have been deceived by another gospel. Wasn't that what satan did in Eden? He preached another gospel to Eve. God told them don't, or you shall surely die. What was the devil's gospel? You shall not surely die, your eyes will be opened, you will be like God, knowing good and evil. *The Lord returns after the tribulation.* Here is what Christ said about His return: *It is written in Matthew 24: 29 -31, KJV.* *This is Christ telling you .* *29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: 30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. *31 And He shall send His angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.* You can read the rest on your own. All verses point to the gathering of the saints and the return of Christ as the same day, not separate times. Repent all who have taken the jabs, all jabs. Please!

Thanks

@@unibokk What else do you think they were preaching? Grandma's apple pie recipe!? Get real, man. What I wrote is backed by Scripture and common sense

@@unibokk Very well. Then tell me, backed with your understanding of Scriptures, what the 2 witnesses are preaching. It seems to be very disturbing for the Antichrist to finally kill them and the world rejoicing.

@@unibokk Then, I suppose you must be right .. But I have a favor to ask. I have 2 dogs and feel really bad about leaving them to go through the tribulation unattended. So, when it does begin, could you take care of them and I'd pick them up in 7 years? Thanks buddy!

@@unibokk 70 weeks have been determined upon your people (Israel). Not 69.5

We can do that at a Question and Answer

Thanks, why do you think this and what scriptures do you have to support it?

Hi Tito, thanks for sharing a part of your story. I'm persuaded that the Bible teaches the pre-tribulational rapture, and I respect that others have a different view. I care most that the gospel of Jesus is preached. God bless!

Can we all be honest and say that ALL of us (that's "US", plural), have presuppositions? While some people may not be as firm as a rock as to what they believe, we ALL come to the table with some assumptions. But hey...what is a key passage of scripture that "sealed the deal" for you so to speak and makes what it is you believe irrefutable?

They say the day of the Lord and his wrath is the Tribulation period but quite rightly it starts when the Sun, Moon the and the stars do not give their light, the stars will appear to fall from Heaven. This scenario is in many books of the Bible and is always when the Wrath of God begins. GOD BLESS.

Mat 24:29 Immediately after the tribulation of those days shall the sun be darkened, and the moon shall not give her light, and the stars shall fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens shall be shaken: Rev 6:12 And I beheld when he had opened the sixth seal, and, lo, there was a great earthquake; and the sun became black as sackcloth of hair, and the moon became as blood; Rev 6:13 And the stars of heaven fell unto the earth, even as a fig tree casteth her untimely figs, when she is shaken of a mighty wind. these versus talk about the same thing. ill continue Mat 24:30 And then shall appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven: and then shall all the tribes of the earth mourn, and they shall see the Son of man coming in the clouds of heaven with power and great glory. Rev 6:15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains; Rev 6:16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb: Seal 6 is the Rapture of the church, Jew and Greek it doesn't matter we are all under the new Covenant Faith not works. what is the next verse in Rev 6? 17 and it says: For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand? Wrath to come........ 1Th 5:9 For God hath not appointed us to wrath, but to obtain salvation by our Lord Jesus Christ. The church doesn't go thru God Wrath, but the Church will go thru the tribulation. the falling away is the church, some say it society but that's not true how can one fall away that was never standing for the truth. people say Noah and Lot are examples of a pre-trib rapture and use them as an anchor for an argument, when in reality Noah and Lot where saved from Gods WRATH just as we will bi in 1Th 5:9 the 7th seal opens the scroll and begins Gods judgement on the unbelieving,

I believe that I know what the last trump is from verse. 1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed. after the trump is sounded we will be raptured up, but it is at the 6th seal. this gets a little complicated but you'll see how it makes sense. follow along here. god works in 7`s right 7 churches 70 weeks of years and so on. remember that i mentioned 7 churches. lets look at this verse first. Rev 1:20 The mystery of the seven stars which thou sawest in my right hand, and the seven golden candlesticks. The seven stars are the angels of the seven churches: and the seven candlesticks which thou sawest are the seven churches. next look at this verse. this follows Mathew 24: 29-30 which happens right before the rapture, then verse Mat 24:31 And he shall send his angels with a great sound of a trumpet, and they shall gather together his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other. what the verse says is he shall send his ( ANGELS ) plural more than one. follow the sequence. i will put these in order as i see them. and remember that there will be 7 angels. Mat 24:14 And this gospel of the kingdom shall be preached in all the world for a witness unto all nations; and then shall the end come. Rev 14:6 And I saw another angel 1st fly in the midst of heaven, having the everlasting gospel to preach unto them that dwell on the earth, and to every nation, and kindred, and tongue, and people, Rev 14:7 Saying with a loud voice, Fear God, and give glory to him; for the hour of his judgment is come: and worship him that made heaven, and earth, and the sea, and the fountains of waters. Rev 14:8 And there followed another angel, 2nd saying, Babylon is fallen, is fallen, that great city, because she made all nations drink of the wine of the wrath of her fornication. Rev 14:9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand, notice the chapter we are in, this relates to the rapture and notice we are at the 3rd angel 4 more to come!!! this verse even calls him the 3rd angel 14:9 the you see Jesus come down with more angles Rev 14:14 And I looked, and behold a white cloud, and upon the cloud one sat like unto the Son of man, having on his head a golden crown, and in his hand a sharp sickle. Rev 14:15 And (another angel) 4th came out of the temple, crying with a loud voice to him that sat on the cloud, Thrust in thy sickle, and reap: for the time is come for thee to reap; for the harvest of the earth is ripe. Rev 14:16 And he that sat on the cloud thrust in his sickle on the earth; and the earth was reaped. Rev 14:17 And another angel 5th came out of the temple which is in heaven, he also having a sharp sickle. Rev 14:18 And another angel 6th came out from the altar, which had power over fire; and cried with a loud cry to him that had the sharp sickle, saying, Thrust in thy sharp sickle, and gather the clusters of the vine of the earth; for her grapes are fully ripe. each angel i believe will come with there own trumpet call. so when you see this last angel read the verse carefully and you`ll see how this plays out in my opinion as i see it in the bible this is scriptural you can see I'm using versus right out of the bible I'm not adding in my thoughts. this verse comes out of Chapter 10 of Revelation, I believe that chapter 10 is all about the rapture in detail....... go and read the entire chapter but this verse in particular. Rev 10:7 But in the days of the voice of the seventh angel, when he shall begin to sound, the mystery of God should be finished, as he hath declared to his servants the prophets. he is the 7th angel he will be the last trump. 1Co 15:52 In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound. there are 7 mystery's in the bible 1 being the rapture. Rev 10:7 talks about the little book? the little book is the book of life, it little because so few find it. Mat 7:14 Because strait is the gate, and narrow is the way, which leadeth unto life, and few there be that find it. I believe that the rapture will be seen by ALL Believers will know Jesus has come Unbelievers will not but believe the lie told to them by the powers that be.

Thanks big country, compare and contrast the two different events or Matthew 24 29-31 and 1 these 4:13-19 and you can easily see they are different events.

Thanks Michael, not sure what point you're making.

Thanks Apronia

Do you believe in replacement Theology?

@@RobertFurrow No, we are grafted in but some of the original branches still exist. God will return to Israel but not until the saints are raptured This is in Rev 7:1 & 3. before hurting the earth with God's wrath, Rev 6:17, Rev 8:5-13.

We believe that Scripture teaches the Church will be raptured prior to the Great Tribulation, and that during the Tribulation, by God's grace many more will put their faith in Christ for salvation.

@@RobertFurrow What makes them special than the saints that go through tribulation?

There is "tribulation" in general, and then there is *THE* tribulation. The rapture brings an end to the church age & God focuses on the Jewish people. Not that Gentiles still won't come to Christ during the tribulation, but "THE" tribulation is God's last attempt to reach them. *Matt 24* makes it clear that it is the angels that gather the Jews who come to faith during that time. Look closely to what *Vs 31* says and see how it is prophesy being fulfilled from *Isaiah 43:5,6…* *=====>* “Fear not: for I am with thee: I will bring thy seed from the *EAST* and gather thee from the *WEST;* I will say to the *NORTH* give up; and to the *SOUTH,* Keep not back: bring my sons from *FAR,* and my daughters from the *ENDS OF THE EARTH”* Remember Christ saying this in *Matt 23* just one chpt prior to what was said in *Matt 24?* He said in *Vs 27...* *=====>* “O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have GATHERED thy children together, even as a hen GATHERETH her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!" Well you see this "GATHERING" taking place at the end of the tribulation.

@@Reilyle The saints going through tribulation are people that didn't believe in Jesus christ and were left behind. During the tribulation they realized they were wrong and put their faith in him. They become saints during the tribulation. The people raptured believed in Jesus before the tribulation therefore they didn't have to go through it. That's the thought process for it.

thanks Tangle, I don't see that

He is coming like a thief in the night to the ones asleep 😴 we that are awake will be changed in a blink of an eye 👁 Jesus is coming soon!!

thanks

Thanks Mauricio, Interesting Theory

Thanks Will

Amen

Thank you

Thanks

Thanks Turbo

First is the rapture of the church. After the rapture is the Tribulation. Those on earth will know that the Tribulation on earth has started because the antichrist will be revealed. I'm not sure where the confusion is.

Right

Thanks

Thanks Dahelmang, Yes I believe I can help. Two things, context is very important, this passage is telling us this is the first resurrection after the tribulation. There will be a second resurrection after the Tribulation That is "the rest of the dead". This does not mean there were no resurrection before the tribulation period. for example you could have the first day of the week or the first day of a year or the first day of a life, not all the days are the same. It depends on context, those who try to make this point ignore the context. Second we are told in the text who takes part in this first resurrection "Then I saw the souls of those who had been beheaded for their witness to Jesus and for the word of God, who had not worshiped the beast or his image, and had not received his mark on their foreheads or on their hands." This is very specific it dose not speak of saints of all time. Those who use this passage to say this, ignore who is said to be resurrected. hope this helps

@@RobertFurrow those both seem like enormous stretches to me. The post trib interpretation just seems more reasonable. Thank you though!

Thanks for providing a great outline on the differences between the rapture and second coming. God bless!

@@RobertFurrow thank it's exhausting tell people the scriptures I get called so many names everyday but it's ok. I'm telling the scriptures...

@@cokefishtail Good job .

You say 1 Thes is not referring to the 2nd coming and that it is a secret rapture scripture. Read this scripture again and again. It describes Jesus coming openly at his 2nd coming to rapture his saints. It has the rapture ocuring after the 1st resurrection of those who have fallen asleep.

@@maryscheel8564 Thessalonians 4:17 "Then we which are alive [and] remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord." Although the word Rapture does not occur in the English Bible (the Latin Bible uses the verb here from which rapture derives), the idea is expressed in the words “caught up.” The Rapture is the first phase of Christ’s return, involving every Christian alive at the time. These Christians will be caught up to meet Him in the clouds, instantaneously receiving glorified bodies. “Caught up”: After the dead come forth, their spirits, already with the Lord (2 Cor. 5:8; Phil. 1:23), are now being joined to resurrected new bodies; the living Christians will be raptured, literally snatched away (John 10:28; Acts 8:39). This passage, along with (John 14:1-3), and (1 Cor. 15:51-52), forms the biblical basis for “the Rapture” of the church. The time for the Rapture cannot be conclusively determined from this passage alone. However, when other texts such as (Rev. 3:10 and John 14:3), are consulted and compared to the texts about Christ’s coming in judgment (Matt. 13:34-50; 24:29-44; Rev. 19:11-21), at the end of a 7 year tribulation, it has to be noted that there is a clear difference between the character of the “Rapture” in that there is no mention of any judgment, while the other texts feature judgment. So then, it is best to understand that the Rapture occurs at a time different from the coming of Christ of Christ in judgment. Thus, the Rapture has been described as pre-tribulational, before the wrath of God unfolded in the judgments of (Rev 6-19). This event includes complete transformation (1 Cor. 15:51-52; Phil. 3:20-21), and union with the Lord Jesus Christ that never ends. All those who have died “in Christ” will be resurrected; those who are alive and saved at the time of the Rapture will be caught up with Christ before the start of the “Seventieth Week of Daniel.” That is, the Great Tribulation. There are many reasons to believe that the Rapture precedes the Tribulation, but fundamentally this view is consistent with a historical-grammatical interpretation of the Scriptures. A close examination of the prophetic Scriptures reveals a distinction between the Rapture (which relates to the church), and the revelation of Christ in power and glory (which relates more to Israel). "We which are alive" is speaking of the Christians alive at the coming of Christ who will be changed in the twinkling of an eye. 1 Corinthians 15:51-54 "Behold, I shew you a mystery; We shall not all sleep, but we shall all be changed, " "In a moment, in the twinkling of an eye, at the last trump: for the trumpet shall sound, and the dead shall be raised incorruptible, and we shall be changed." "For this corruptible must put on incorruption, and this mortal [must] put on immortality." "So when this corruptible shall have put on incorruption, and this mortal shall have put on immortality, then shall be brought to pass the saying that is written, Death is swallowed up in victory."

We all want to be prepared. Not sure how increasing birth pangs provide any evidence against the pre-tribulational rapture.

@@RobertFurrow Well, you're right of course, we all want to be prepared! To your second point, there seems to be a general attitude among God's people (I'm not suggesting you think this way necessarily) that the birth pangs will be challenging, but not overwhelming. That's not true. The Pangs lead directly into the Great Tribulation - there's no hitting the pause button. As these Pangs intensify, they'll expose the degree to which we're unprepared. There's a falling away during the Pangs, so they clearly will become intense. We've not seen anything yet, and honestly this Covid has been pretty bad. I submit to you that as many pre trib believing brothers and sisters really begin to feel the heat, and they will, they'll realize they're not prepared, and start looking for churches/ministries that can help them understand how to become prepared as people around them (both saved and unsaved) begin to freak out.

Thank you for a respectful dialogue. I agree that the Church must be prepared for any trials we face, and like the early church prayed for the Lord to give them strength and courage to continue preaching Jesus, so too we will stand with courage for the gospel message. I see Scripture teaching a pre-tribulational rapture of the Church, and I do believe the Church can be prepared to stand when we are fully committed to Christ and fully trusting in the power of His Spirit. God bless.

Sorry big Country, you are just wrong the early church taught all kinds of things, and Jesus returning at any moment to get his Church was one of them. I love how people wrap up what the early church taught like they have studied the thousand of writings of the early church and over 100's of years and then declare what they taught. and is the early church your authority now? Are you going to do only the things the early church taught. This is a christian myth.

Thanks Bill, Amen!!!!!

Thanks KZfaq, I'll look up those passages ;-)

@@RobertFurrow no problem. Zac chapters 12-14 are also talking about the second coming specially in 14:1-6. and how israel will react when they see their true Messiah.