it was the writer duh for doing that

@@thetruewisegamer This is true from a Doylist perspective. But even from a Watsonian one, the blame is still not on Donna.

I’m really sorry.

I'm sorry to hear about that. Your daughter is in a far better place now.

My condolences, sir. I lost family members myself, so I empathize with you.

So how would i shoot accurately using one arm and my teeth?

Yes, but he could also learn how to work around that, adjusting his grip and coordination. It's be basically re-learning that ability, but given how important that is to him, I'm sure Roy could just work around it.

Is that why Green Arrow in Dark Knight Returns wasn't utter garbage in helping Bruce with his fight?

So true. High five for that clever word-play man. *highfive*

Igarappappa And I'm not from England.

williamhowe1 Didn't assume. XD

Igarappappa I know just letting folks know.

They might be talking about *this* specific Roy...

They brought her back in Convergence

+Jake Bryant (The Rouge Owl) But sadly remains lost unless the Rebirth saga has Mia, Bart, Cassie, & Connor turning up with her like how Wally did to Barry and the other Titans (minus Vic, Gar, Raven, and Starfire)

Hmmm, recent Green Arrow comics show that Roy and Cheshire had a relationship at some point. Perhaps Lian exists once again, albeit without Roy's knowledge for now? Could be another thing Rebirth has fixed.

Hope that, if they do, they don't bring Lian back as some sort of trained ninja-assassin-thief-evil-evil kid, I'll admit, as a Marvel fan, Rebirth has been very good (so far), but it only takes one bad call... and we'll have ourselves another GAY for JUSTICE - errr, I mean, CRY for JUSTICE.

Eh, they already kind of have that in the new Red Arrow, Emi. And Robin. So I don't think so. But it's possible.

+Posey Roy was awesome as a loving supportive Father! Far better then being an "anti-villain" who does drugs! >:(

Posey let’s do hypothetical like when jason todd was possibly slated to die originally (which he did) and say lian survives albeit barely and roy is still as he is: why not have a storyline having roy dealing with havin to get him and his daughter to recover while tryin not to do hero work since it would interfere with recovering and such. Its just a barebones and not very good, sure but it is far better than what is done here.

Roy gets a hook prosthetic and puts on a eyepatch to play pirate with Lian

@@redjirachi1 I would've minded that. Arsenal playing pirate with his daughter, maybe Ollie can join in on his spare time.

He called himself “Speedy.” Of course he does drugs!

foxman105 not all hospitals...depends on how they are designed and their budget...I worked at three of them and are all different...two had too much security while the third barely had any at all...

What's the bad news?

That's one heck of a story. O_O

A huge fan of your videos, dude. :)

I was too expecting her to kick his ass hard-core. Donna too. He keeps asking for it.

Yeah. We need a comic version of the Young Justice TV series that keeps running if season 5 never happens. Most of what I love about DC is in that show.

@@LaineMann I do not like their version of Superboy, though. I prefer the SUperboy from Reign of the Supermen. But that version is never going to be seen ever again...

laz kar They do seem to think broody themes are more marketable these days. Which irritates me to no end.

laz kar Indeed, Dark Knight was a GREAT Superhero film. Most terrifying live action Joker in years. It's just frustrating that so many writers think the "alone and brooding" theme is the only way to write superheros in this day and age.

+laz kar I think it's partly to do with comic companies just not getting their audience. Comic companies have a rather narrow scope believing that their audience is ONLY teenage boys. As such they cater their comics to what they think teenage boys want to read and can relate to. Thus no marriages, no families, lots of relationship problems, and lot's and lots of angst.

+laz kar Oh I agree. Hell i read Spider-man as a teen during JMS's run and I liked MJ. Largely i think because I'd been introduced to the character by the animated series. So I'd seen Peter grow into a married adult. And ya, you probably did. Though I think the Marvel movies might be changing that. I've heard a lot of kids, around 5-10, say Captain America is their favorite superhero.

laz kar One of my favorite moments was Dr. Doom dropping his change in the till before going through the metal detector at the airport. That was gold. I never thought much on the 'mystic spider' concept but at least JMS never flat out said Peter was destined to be Spider-man. I always took it that there was a mystic spider legacy, but that Peter became part of it by accident. Though it's been a while since i read those issues. I was also really moved by his 9/11 issue. That issue was so touching.

+David Spring So a little girl version of Doctor Who? Somewhat? Shut up and take my money!

islamroks11 more like a little girl version of that story they did with Batman when everyone thought he was dead. But your idea is also good.

+islamroks11 you know, if Big Finish made an audio series about a little Time Lady, they would make it work. For those who don't know what Big Finish is, just listen to 'Spare Parts'. It only costs a few dollars from the official website, and in my opinion, it's the best 'Doctor Who' story ever. It's the origin story of the original Mondasian Cybermen, and was later partially adapted into the origin story of the new Cybermen, 'Rise of the Cybermen'/'Age of Steel'. It's a dark, haunting story that shows the true horror of the Cybermen, and the tragedy of their existence. Thanks to the fact that it's aimed at an adult audience, it shows you the Cybermen as they were always meant to be seen.

David Spring Bruce should’ve stayed dead

I was think more Quantum Leap.

And then to make her an even worser mother then Talia al Ghul. When they Retcon Lian death, Jade was nice enough to leave her daughter with amnesia in an orphanage.....IN GOTHAM FUCKING CITY! Now they seem to be turning Lian into a version of her mother now! Seriously it's sad abit what they did to Cheshire/Jade where she had some honorable traits, now she's an arrogant kung fu girl who has such a chronic backstabbing disorder that villains trust her about as much as they trust the Joker, she blew up a country with a Nuke, pretty much assuring EVERYONE Good and Bad are out for her blood with no bright plan for how she benefited from it afterwards and oh yes assuring her Iron Butt Monkey status anytime Gail Simone gets her hands on her (Gail has pretty much stated after the nuke, Cheshire/Jade is now in the irredeemable bin Joker has strangely dodged! But that's likely because he was built by design as what he is! While Jade is now a character that deserves to be made a fool of and get hurt ALOT!), I mean Jade was stupid enough to go after AQUAMAN thinking he was the easiest Justice League member to take down.....what makes this dumber is she fights him over WATER, and doesn't take into mind his enhanced strength, endurance and the fact he's a skilled fighter! Arthur/Orin promptly drowns her into unconsciousness PISSED he got underestimated AGAIN (Oh and Jade brought up the stupid Superfriends "Doesn't he just talk to fish" meme, not surprised Arthur is pissed off about that. Dude gets no respect from idiots who don't do their research on him. Jade becomes even more stupid when your reminded other villains DO their research on Aquaman, putting her on the list of idiot villains who go at him assuming he can only "talk to fish!") I mean lets not forget when Roy broke up with her, she had Liam simply to blackmail and hurt Roy for the breakup with the knowledge he has a daughter out there, but will likely never see her (Not a surprise Liam is fucking ashamed of her as her mother, even in her "single digit" age! Meaning she's aware of her mother's shitty actions!). Says something when Catman realized he and Jade were TERRIBLE parental figures and gave his son up so he'd have a better life (and doing to her what she originally tried to do to Roy, except while she did it maliciously, Catman did it for the kid's sake and never planned to hurt Cheshire with the knowledge her kids out of reach or blackmail! Seriously why is it that Women will have a kid to emotionally blackmail, but the Man will almost even if a POS give up the kid for a better life away from the "Life!" in fiction! I'm referring to Villains in this regard!) I have to say Young Justice the show did Jade/Cheshire better then the comics where they seem to not know what to do with her or whatever she's a damaged individual or just a bitch (Or Gail Simone Iron Butt Monkey's her!), not being an overall shitty person! Feels like her shitter actions/shitty parental behavior are pushed on her father Sportsmaster and she's more "complicated!" out of fairness in Young Justice she does have abit more traits of her original appearance in the comic where she was far more honorable and tend to avoid those who are not her main target being causalities. But then I think they're doing the same to Deathstroke as well, retconning and changing alot of his shitter actions, especially with Terra 1 back in the ORIGINAL Judas Contract and his relationship with his kids specifically Rose/Ravanger! Likely cause it makes it hard to keep him in "gray" territory like the other Assassins such as Deadshot! By Gray, I mean their still remorseless killers! But they do what their paid for, targets can be just as much evil folk as they go after good folk, and have standards! Basically redeemable things so they can stay in Anti-Hero/Anti-Villain Territory! Instead of full blown villain!

And that’s STILL a better story than this shit.

There is no “thankfully” before the death of a child

@@Cdr2002 Their kid didn't die in this story. Also turned out the threat was a lie to manipulate them. But the end result is the same, Cheshire should not be in charge of a child.

@@Igarappappa DC can you write competent parents thanks 💀

Jake Bryant also explains the “fist of morality”

even bruce will be sad if a child die. remember Jason Todd....yep

@@ryahmib2452 Bruce doesn't get sad, he gets angry.

@@RabblesTheBinx That's dumb. Bruce is sad a lot. If anything its his default emotion when he gets flanderized from being a kind father figure of many children, a pretty good friend, and one of the smartest detectives in the world. But yeah, being a random hot head works too I guess.

Shut up! Your valid logic has no place here in Rise of Arsenal!

Coec_15324 to be fair they are probably trying to make it so that he has enough arm to work cybernetic's(probably shouldn't be there first concern but whatever)

I got the impression is was spreading so first they needed to contain it to one area, which they did. Dr. Midnight talks about stabilizing the nanites, which told me they found a way to prevent it from spreading anymore.

They can still cut off more until it gets to his armpit.

That would be needlessly overboard.

"Surprise Kill" I now have this wonderful image of the Grim Reaper crashing through the window yelling "SURPRISE, BITCH!"

I've come to that conclusion a while ago

Darkseid Is gonna buy some comics

the judge had a hard on for pinning green arrow and Green Arrow willingly turned himself in. Plus it's not like he stopped Prometheus everything already happened Green Arrow just killed him out of revenge when he could have simply captured him again. You're not helping anyone by killing a villain after you let him go in exchange of bringing the cities back you just make it clear for the new terrorist that they must never listen to the heroes

Yeah, but this is comic books, he'd just escape from prison.

Green Arrow was Acquitted in Fall of Green Arrow. But then the judge banished him from Star City, which judges really don't have the authority to do in the event of a not guilty verdict. So it doesn't make sense. But for completely different reasons.

@@Sewblon And who the hell was that Judge? Was he a character in the Green Arrow comics/mythos? Cuz having a character just be an arse with no interesting backstory or having any "character" is good. It's just a force narrative to drive things along with no reason to reflect upon: like walking over a plot hole and ignoring it forever.

@@battlion507 I don't know the Green Arrow Mythos well enough to say. But even if he was a character in the Mythos. He still had no authority to do what he did. Its still forced.

I mean, he already lost the arm, what's a little snip here and there?

He brought it up in Blue Skying. Simply put, he partied hard.

William Stuart His release is probably waaaay off. I had so much trouble with that before i got a trigger release.

Not entirely true, considering the nanny was supposed to be there for Lian when she was killed, it's understandable why he was angry at her, what is not understandable is the way he treated the other women, I get that the writers were trying to get across the emotional trauma caused by the loss of both his daughter and his arm, but the writers did not execute it well

I can't describe how this story came off. It is kind of like a 90s hyper masculine character that can't figure out how to deal- considering this story was apparently published five years ago! I can definitely sympathize with a character that lost a loved one, I've read comics like that for years. Heck, I am a fan of Black Manta whose retconned origins still allow room for him to be human, even when he is a murderer. This story seemed like the writer just wanted to complete a task, and that was to get Roy Harper to become Arsenal again as well as be a 'badarse' archer -because no powers etc. Lian and the women in the story were used as tools for plot rather than driving a story and I just don't enjoy that.

Decembirth I agree with your points, this comic along with Cry for Justice shouldn't have been made

Wade Leppien As Linkara points out there was no conceivable way she could have saved Lian so he's just lashing out.

Igarappappa True, but it's still understandable that Roy would lash out on the person responsible for Lian when it happened, though I feel like if he stopped right there with his anger instead of lashing out against everyone who tried to comfort him, (plus giving it a while before he confronts her again and apologizes) we could take this portrayal of Roy seriously, though it's still a stupid move to kill Lian in the first place

DC: YUP! I mean, why would we stop at METAPHORICALLY "Beating a Dead Horse". You love these characters? Don't worry, we'll just get some BOLD, CONTROVERSIAL and EDGEY writers to make the biggest change by being an event... and then getting the Editor in Chief to have the main writer write THEIR STORY instead!

Marvel did screw up a lot lately - _Secret Empire_ comes to mind... They're still better off than DC though.

That was legitimately funny. Well done.

@@ilovehertodeath I don't get it.

Cody Hines I believe they killed Roy in the 3rd season before he could have a kid.

@@trevordavis6830 ...No they didn't... they faked his death and shipped him off to another city under a new name. We even see Thea visiting him as a mechanic.

@@trevordavis6830 Since then he's appeared in Season 4 as a hostage of the Calculator and is slated to return as a regular cast member again in season 7.

"It's like the 90s never ended." We wish!

***** Yeah, seriously, 80s and 90s comics were the best.

well the 90s was a top time

I miss a lot of things about the 90s; the comics are not among them.

For DC, they didn't end until Dan DiDio left the company in 2020

Glad to see Fry working for DC Comics.

This is kind of the reason why Linkara says he DOESN'T want to completely retcon One More Day. There is always the chance to write an amazing story to cancel a piece-of-shit decision made in a previous storyline, it just takes a talented writer and a good idea.

And, you know, NO f**king editorial mandates.

Exactly. Can you imagine how amazing Spider-Man vs. the forces of Hell would be? One man, using everything at his disposal and calling on allies like Doctor Strange and Doctor Doom and maybe even the deceased Logan and Doc Ock, to fight to darkest forces of evil in order to get back the life and love that was taken from him.

Have her travel through time and grow up having to fend for herself and become a skilled archer in her own right, taking after her dad until she comes back to the present time. If that happened and she came back older DC would probably just make her and Roy fuck, though. Something garish like that

Alexander Sigstad All this needs is some semi-clever play off of "One More Day" for the title and it's good to go. In all honesty, this legitimately seems like something that would be big enough to serve as an overblown "event", and even if it does end up underwhelming as those events always do, we still get to see Spider-Man PUNCH THE DEVIL IN THE FACE, so it's still pretty awesome.

MTdaBlacking basically, if it’s in black, it’s funeral wear.

I mean Dinahs wearing fishnets to a funeral for gods sake.

You should've ripped the fucker apart

@@SuperWolsey who are you talking about?

+MrGMoney1944 Spoiler! The twist is: linkara is actually the player!... the watcher i mean... no not that watcher!

+MrGMoney1944 You are going to Hell for saying that I am going to hell for laughing at it

Chaos inc. It's alright you're already a demon.

pipo berber Shit I've been discovered

Thats what a phantom pain is, the feeling of pain or other sensations in limbs you no longer have.

Literally everything about this is fucking stupid but you do you

This is still kind of convoluted and mean-spirited imo. Also, Bane actually had a pretty rough childhood, I for one don’t think he’d be so eager to take a child away from her family like he was taken from his. Most villains are people to.

Which was less a reboot and more bringing back the previous continuity.

China Cat. LOTS of it.

MrPlayer890 Dammit! You beat me to the joke. lol

My thoughts exactly. After 70 years they've done just about everything you can do with Batman. Far better to explore the idea of Batman acting as a retired mentor like in Batman Beyond.

Well to play devil's advocate, one could argue that he didn't want kids to get the idea that becoming a teen dad is cool... but I doubt he's that smart.

Adam Sherman With how he wrote Cassie in Teen Titans (routinely sneaking away from her mother to see her boyfriend in a motel) I don't think Lobdell cares about setting a good example for kids.

***** Fair enough.

***** If its any consolation we may actually get to see her come back on Convergence. Although I'm not holding my breath. Point is, the chance to bring Lian back was squandered and you know why? Because DC seriously botched their relaunch. It's only now actually starting to settle down in terms of competent writing and even then there are still plenty of rough patches to go over. It's seriously taking them way too long in my opinion to get the universe back on track. I almost feel like Convergence was chosen as a story idea during the move just because they wanted to feed off nostalgia. Whatever, I get my old universe back for a few months, I'll deal.

FNGLHR Well with Lodbell in charge of Roy's character who know how he would have wrote Roy and Lian's relationship. He probably would have made him a deadbeat dad. But yeah I'm looking forward to convergence and the wedding between Dick Grayson and Barbara Gordon. Which reminds me has Linkara ever mentioned anything about their relationship and the fact it was ruined due to the New 52?

That's actually pretty common in mainstream comics, but that doesn't make it okay.

linkara, is that you?

yes it is.

Not necessarily these days. Plus, as I keep discovering, not everyone watches every episode of the show.

right

That's not really the point.

+kadindarklord does Brute Force suck? sure, it's BAD, but it doesn't SUCK!!!

also there have been cases where the comics are good like when deadpool teamed up wit brute force

Well the Jeff Lemire run was awesome.

Lian. And yes. Also, DC has actually wiped YJ out of existence, as Earth-16 (the Earth YJ took place on) is now the Bronze Age Earth that was supposed to already exist but wasn't previously identified.

Lynn Green Jokes on you YJ season 3, CONFIRMED

Yep, that baby was indeed Lian. Young Justice was pretty damn awesome ^^ I particularly love how they handled Roy Harper; I didn't know much of anything about Speedy/Red Arrow/Arsenal before being hooked on AT4W, but knowing more about him now, I love how he was handled in Young Justice, having two Roy Harpers: one to be the responsible single father, and the other the robot-armed anti-hero. A great way of having your cake and eating it too.

@@Gyarretto7Really though, what's the point of having cake if you can't eat it?

@@JaelinBezel it's actually a mistranslated saying from French which should be "eating your cake and having it to", as in you want to eat your cake but then still have it.

definitely. even better Lian was still alive.

It's cartoon, Everyone gets paired

Danny Caracciolo I liked their relationship in Injustice Gods Among Us.

+Dylan Baldwin It's a sad truth.

***** damn you!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! why! you maniacs! you ruined it all!

Xiu Greyson There is a petition going around to get it continued on Netflix.

***** www.change.org/p/netflix-netflix-please-acquire-rights-to-produce-more-seasons-of-young-justice-and-green-lantern-the-animated-series Not sure if it'll work, but it has a lot of support and I'd love to see it succeed. So share away. XD

Um, Cyborg? Have you considered SURGERY for attaching the prosthetic to one of your best friends?

I know your comment is old but I'll still say this: it wouldn't surprise me if they did dislike Roy. I like Kyle Rayner but I recall that some folks at DC dislike the dude.