History of the Big Four - London Midland & Scottish Railway

Рет қаралды 38,068

Күн бұрын

Hello, and welcome to Part 3 of my 4 part series looking at the Four Great Railways of Britain that existed between 1923 and 1948, the LMS, the LNER, the Great Western and the Southern, companies that were formed, and dissolved, through acts of Parliament to try and rationalise the 120 individual railway firms into something more manageable, but even though these operators only lasted a mere 25 years, during that time they left an indelible mark on the face of not only British railway history, but the art-deco culture of the period that continues to resonate globally even to this day.
Part 3 focuses on the London Midland & Scottish Railway, by far the largest of the Big Four, which contained within its boundaries a network that stretched from the south coast of Dorset and the eastern Essex resorts to Thurso in the far north of Scotland, and Londonderry in Northern Ireland, but despite its size, and its slew of art-deco steam engines that rivalled the likes of the LNER, the LMS was a company left struggling financially due to its dependence on freight contracts, and would spend more of its existence teetering on bankruptcy than it did making a genuine profit.
All video content and images in this production have been provided with permission wherever possible. While I endeavour to ensure that all accreditations properly name the original creator, some of my sources do not list them as they are usually provided by other, unrelated KZfaqrs. Therefore, if I have mistakenly put the accreditation of 'Unknown', and you are aware of the original creator, please send me a personal message at my Gmail (this is more effective than comments as I am often unable to read all of them): rorymacveigh@gmail.com
The views and opinions expressed in this video are my personal appraisal and are not the views and opinions of any of these individuals or bodies who have kindly supplied me with footage and images.
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Thanks again, everyone, and enjoy! :D
References:
- Railway Wonders of the World (and their respective sources)
- Wikipedia (and its respective references)

Пікірлер: 106

@greyfox8194 11 ай бұрын

new train video wooooo lets goo

@TheHylianBatman 11 ай бұрын

I knew that the LMS had been important in the 30's, with Stanier and all, but I had no idea that the LMS had been the largest railway in the country. That's very interesting to know. The things forgotten by history, I suppose.

@PercyPruneMHDOIFandBars 3 ай бұрын

It was also the largest company of any type at the time. It was a serious ship-owner too!

@lukegreen5341 11 ай бұрын

0:30 Happy 100th Birthday The London Midland And Scottish Railway. 1923 - 2023. 100 Years. X

@Clivestravelandtrains 11 ай бұрын

Ha! Last week I travelled from London to Edinburgh first class on an LNER train, and the menu was printed with a celebration of "100 years of the LNER", forgetting to mention a few gaps and failed operators in between!

@lukegreen5341 4 ай бұрын

@@Clivestravelandtrains How Did You Do That. X

@Clivestravelandtrains 4 ай бұрын

@@lukegreen5341 I bought a ticket and boarded the train!

@robinforrest7680 11 ай бұрын

Excellent as always Ruairidh. Thankyou. You deserve many more than the106k subscribers you have.

@sniper.93c14 10 ай бұрын

One thing I noticed is that in all the videos the LMS has kept with early 1900s freight practices - small 4-wheel wagons and small locomotives, when they should’ve invested their money into bigger bogie wagons, large locomotives like 2-8-2s or 4-8-4s as well as upgrading track to heavier loads this would’ve saved huge amounts in labour on both running costs and transshipment of goods as well as hell make the system profitable

@DynamicDuo795 Ай бұрын

It's crazy to think that England, being a small island country, had so many different railroads operating in it, plus the enormous amounts of different locomotives that each of those different railroads had. I don't think we here in the US had as many railroads as you guys did, and we are a huge country. Keep the videos coming. I subbed.

@1951GL 11 ай бұрын

Very good - Horwich did tend to specialize in strong class 4 and 5 mixed traffic locos, the 2-60 Crab and the Ivatt equivalent post war, which operated to the end of steam. Drivers and firemen loved them. Both derived from L&Y requirements, uphill power with frequent stops. Stanier's Princesses were elegance on wheels.

@Laticity 11 ай бұрын

Thank you. Very enjoyable. A tough company to summarise!

@Tom-Lahaye 11 ай бұрын

Forgot to mention the rebuilding of the Fowler Royal Scot and Patriot locomotives by Stanier, making both classes almost identical and strong performers. Otherwise good as always, just the sheer flow of numbers is something I can't save on my harddisk 😄

@lkbergen 11 ай бұрын

That was good little edit there; both starting and ending shot filmed at Penrith.

@thisisdashers 11 ай бұрын

Amazing as always ❤

@roygardiner2229 2 ай бұрын

Splendid!

@Del-bm 11 ай бұрын

Very informative thanks for sharing this wisdom

@chesapeakedproductions3009 11 ай бұрын

Should I be sleeping at 2 in the morning? Damn right I should. Should I watch a new documentary the moment it's dropped? Damn right I should

@heidirabenau511 11 ай бұрын

What is one to do?

@chesapeakedproductions3009 11 ай бұрын

Watch the new documentary of course. Sleep can wait lmao

@heidirabenau511 11 ай бұрын

@@chesapeakedproductions3009True...

@Hascienda27 11 ай бұрын

Beautiful

@leightonolsson4846 11 ай бұрын

The original Royal Scot class suffered from having cylinder piston heads that did not utilise split rings to ensure steam tightness, a silly mistake for a modern locomotive of the period. The BR rebuilds definitely were needed! Astonishing the difference the CME could make - Stainer was brilliant, steam turbines are not a good fit for locomotives, but the 'Turbomotive' was one of the few real successes in the application of the technology.

@joelwatkins 11 ай бұрын

Looking forward to the LNER video whenever it's ready

@marvwatkins7029 11 ай бұрын

Another fine MH production.

@sjaakmcd1804 11 ай бұрын

Brilliant as usual. The only bit you missed was the friendly collaboration between the Lancashire and Yorkshire Railway and the LNWR which was a going to see the 2 merge.

@JanicefromKansas 11 ай бұрын

hello from Kansas🇺🇸

@robertbalazslorincz8218 11 ай бұрын

'Non-stop from Euston to Glasgow' *needs to stop at Carlisle for crew change*

@rottenroads1982 10 ай бұрын

Aster, he is one of my Thomas & Friends OC’s. His basis is an LMS Garratt. My canon for him is that when he was First Built, he was plagued with the horrible axle boxes. But latter, he got those Axel Boxes replaced with better ones that actually help him work how the LMS Garratts should. He is painted Black, with Grey lining and Boiler Banding.

@mudgetheexpendable 11 ай бұрын

Your channel keeps my brain busy thinking about the what-might-have-beens of infrastructure for days and days after each episode. Thank you.

@daystatesniper01 10 ай бұрын

Wow incredible rare colour footage of Garrats

@johnkeepin7527 11 ай бұрын

Although there is a lot of coverage of the rolling stock and locomotives content, there were similar issues related to the signalling equipment, along with the related organisations. Geographically separate offices - such as London, Crewe, and Derby - were more or less independent, even after the creation of the London Midland Region after nationalisation. Eventually, they transferred a lot of work to a new building in Birmingham, called “Stanier house” after the old CME, in line with the policy of moving work outside of London. With regard to the Midland line upgrades that are mentioned (admittedly much more recent than the LMS), it might have been worth mentioning the St Pancras - Bedford electrification (the Bedpan project) along with the new rolling stock that was to be operated “driver only” in the mid 1980s.

@Riogrande1964 Ай бұрын

May I suggest that you group these as a playlist?

@howardmiao5150 11 ай бұрын

Partial closure of the Midland Main Line did come to pass though, primarily between Matlock and Chinley and between Swinton and Normanton, with other significant sections seeing no InterCity service, but the former Lancashire and Yorkshire Railway was worse affected by closures.

@PeterYeadon-js7ou 11 ай бұрын

Interestingly it's back on the cards to reopen the line through the Peak District again. It should never have been shut, like many others.

@howardmiao5150 11 ай бұрын

@@PeterYeadon-js7ou 1 main line for the price of 3 with Woodhead and Miller’s Dale closed. We saw Piccadilly - Euston services reduced by 75% last year. Imagine the capacity of the WCML, MML AND HS2 as equal main lines. Such a small proportion of distance closed makes the entire main line unusable. My newest analysis shows many lines reduced from 4 tracks to 2 or even 1 are as good as closed, with no more of the possible journey opportunities or freight capacity than a line closed and lifted entirely.

@PeterYeadon-js7ou 11 ай бұрын

@@howardmiao5150 I really couldn't agree more. Typical of this country, very short sighted. The Great Central was constructed with a cross channel tunnel in mind. The APT, would of worked so well on such a well thought out railway.

@macjim 11 ай бұрын

The best product from the LMS was the ubiquitous Black 5.

@Alex-cw3rz 11 ай бұрын

Also the 8F

@geoffreyking4515 11 ай бұрын

Don't forget the handsome jubilees

@robinforrest7680 11 ай бұрын

Love the Black Five but I have to agree with macjim, the 8F is really something else! The UK were hoping to supply SNCF with 8F’s, unfortunately (or fortunately depending who’s side you’re on) the USA got in quicker with the 141R. Amazing machines too it must be admitted.

@thebrummierailenthusiasts5329 11 ай бұрын

Alright the LMS locos

@davidcrook5511 10 ай бұрын

And at long last I've come to this one! Of course, I was expecting this to be good because it is on the Ruairidh MacVeigh channel!!! 😀

@jonistan9268 9 ай бұрын

Glasgow to London in five and a half hours? I think that's how long that trip took me with Avanti West Coast in 2022 (I went the other way but still). That train however wasn't non-stop of course, stopping at six stations on the way.

@willhovell9019 9 ай бұрын

The LMS was known as the 'Ell of Mess' according to Kenneth Williams😂

@robredz 11 ай бұрын

Didn't the ex LNWR footplate crews due to the Midland railway initially dominating the group with Midland practices nickname it the 'ell of a mess? Superb video Ruairidh

@Korschtal 7 ай бұрын

My understanding is that this was largely because the Midland dominated locomotive policy and thus smaller 4-4-0 types were built. these were underpowered in the Midlands, let alone places like Shap.

@robredz 7 ай бұрын

@@Korschtal Yes that's spot on, Midland running practices and weight limits were imposed so a George Fifth would have a limit of roughly the same as a Midland Compound as would a Prince of Wales. Midland operated frequent smaller trains rather than the heavy trains LNWR locomotives would pull up and over Shap in a manner alien to the Midland. That's not to say the Midland Compounds were bad, they were decent locomotives in their own right but not up to what a Claughton or George could do.

@mikerichards6065 11 ай бұрын

A shame that British Rail didn't immediately order a fleet of mainline diesels based on the successful LMS 10000 and 10001, but instead went down the path of the ruinous Modernisation Pilot Scheme which lost years and millions of Pounds in hopeless designs. And what a tragedy neither of these pioneering machines were saved for a museum.

@malbecmikegrey996 11 ай бұрын

Your comments on wholly-new track being built for TGVs and Shinkansen - unlike in the UK - omit one important difference; the original Japanese lines were narrow-gauge. and unsuitable for high speed use. Excellent video - thanks for all your hard work.

@robinforrest7680 11 ай бұрын

The advantage of the TGV is of course it’s ability to use the classic network and get into city centres using the ordinary network.

@gerogyzurkov2259 11 ай бұрын

@@robinforrest7680 Isn't the ICE doing that too?

@muhammadfadhiil5992 11 ай бұрын

Will you discuss about the big four's CMEs?

@robinforrest7680 11 ай бұрын

Great idea! A CME series. Plenty to choose from! Churchward, Collett, Hawksworth, Raven, Fowler, Gresley, Stanier, Peppercorn, Thompson, Urie, Bullied, Riddles, the two Ivatt’s… to name but a few…

@MicahtheDrumCorpsPseudoboomer 11 ай бұрын

Pardon me, what are CMEs?

@muhammadfadhiil5992 11 ай бұрын

@@MicahtheDrumCorpsPseudoboomer Chief Mechanical Engineer

@MicahtheDrumCorpsPseudoboomer 11 ай бұрын

@@muhammadfadhiil5992 oh, ok, thanks!

@robinforrest7680 11 ай бұрын

@@MicahtheDrumCorpsPseudoboomer Sorry, Chief Mechanical Engineer.

@Shark30006 9 ай бұрын

LMS Princess Coronation No. 6220 Coronation could have been a candidate for preservation along with Duchess of Hamilton and Duchess of Sutherland for breaking 114 mph.

@joshslater2426 11 ай бұрын

I’m not a huge LMS fan to be honest. They’re ok, but they swallowed up a lot of my favourite pre-grouping companies. They made a lot of the boring standard designs you see everywhere in preservation, yet also a few beautiful designs such as the streamlined Duchess Pacifics and Hughes Crabs.

@ohareport 11 ай бұрын

my body is ready

@denisharty20 11 ай бұрын

Great video as usual but, the Irish film section depicted Great Southern Railway / C.I.E. trains including former Tralee and Dingle lines and GSR 4-6-0s and 101 class 0-6-0s, none of which were part of the LMS NCC.

@bobbymcloughlin3452 10 ай бұрын

Company Sets of England Great Regional Railways of England GNR (Great Northern Railway) GSR (Great Southern Railway) GER (Great Eastern Railway) GWR (Great Western Railway) NER (North Eastern Railway) SER (South Eastern Railway) NWR (North Western Railway) SWR (South Western Railway) English Regional Railways (NR, SR, ER, WR) London Regional Railways (LNR, LSR, LER (Cockney Railway), LWR) LNER LNWR LSER LSWR London Midland | Celtrail (Celtic Railways) = LMC LMS (London Midland | Scotrail or Sudrian Railway) LMW (London Midland | Welsh Railway) LMC (London Midland | Cornish Railway) LMI (London Midland | Irish Railways) Celtic Railways Cornish Railways Welsh Railways Sudrian Railways Scottish Railways Manx Railways Irish Railway of England (Coming Soon) Gælic Railways Goidelic Railway Britain's Great Rail Co. Quartet One of England's Great Regional Railways: Western (GWR) One of England's Regional Railways: Southern (SR) One of The London Regional Railways: North Eastern (LNER) One of The London Midland Celtrail Companies: Scottish (LMS)

@Alex-cw3rz 11 ай бұрын

Keeping the common carriers act seems like such an obvious piece of corruption. Although it probably doesn't get into the top 10 of collusion and corruption between the interests in road transport and the government.

@superted6960 11 ай бұрын

Govt meddling in the price of something that should be subject to market forces. What could possibly go wrong...

@Alex-cw3rz 11 ай бұрын

@@superted6960 this isn't black and white it depends on what the issue is.

@johnmehaffey9953 10 ай бұрын

Wow did you just see that a train moving with snow on the tracks

@cykablyatman6242 11 ай бұрын

could you do the american big 4 railroads? (C&O, N&W, SOU, UP)

@tankmicr00man 11 ай бұрын

7506 at 0.28 was an ex-North London Railway class 75 of 1879 vintage- anyone know if there's been a RTR version?

@dylangranger9129 10 ай бұрын

I think what railway he’ll talk about next

@macjim 11 ай бұрын

9:17 is that St Enoch Station?

@duncancurtis5108 11 ай бұрын

In the thrashin Thirties Crewe must've been busy all hours with steam steam steam.😊

@jaysontatum2336 11 ай бұрын

My favorite of the big four

@steffenrosmus9177 11 ай бұрын

Would t it be easier to show the trackage and locations on maps instead of reading it ?

@user-qp9cd5ng3w Ай бұрын

What a fascinating insight into the history of the London Midland & Scottish Railway! It's incredible to learn about the extensive network and the challenges faced by such a significant company. Thanks for sharing this informative video. For those interested in further exploration of railway history, I highly recommend checking out the related video of the History of the Big Four. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/o6-hbKWopqmnY5c.html

@maryvanderriet7973 11 ай бұрын

Do one on South African Railways and Harbours as South Africa rail heritage often goes unoticed!!!!!!!

@davidpnewton 11 ай бұрын

The Midland Railway's small engine policy is one of the most stupid sets of decisions in early 20th century railway history. It demonstrably led to higher operating costs. It demonstrably led to a higher failure rate for trains as two independent locomotives of a given type hauling a train are axiomatically more likely to experience a failure than a single locomotive of that type hauling a train if their mechanical condition is the same. The only justification for such a policy is where axle load limits preclude using a single, bigger class. That wasn't the case for LNWR mainlines and I don't think it was the case for Midland Railway mainlines either. Yet they continued the policy. In short Fowler and his supporters were idiots in this respect.

@gilbertporter4992 11 ай бұрын

New to the subject but what was the context of this "Small Engine Policy" that had bad effects later on?

@JenniferinIllinois 11 ай бұрын

More British trains.🇬🇧🚂

@ashleyjiscool 11 ай бұрын

The one that had the unfortunate rebuilds after it died

@CathodeRayNipplez 11 ай бұрын

The more I learn about the history of Britain's railways and underground the more I think everyone was off their face smoking crack. Fascinating history of corruption, politics (same thing really), power, and shonky money narcissists. Here in Au we have bugger all rail by comparison.

@nmccw3245 11 ай бұрын

Railroad investment was a huge bubble. Everyone thought they would become rich. Most lost money. Britain ended up with an expansive rail network that formed the backbone of the Industrial Revolution.

@CathodeRayNipplez 11 ай бұрын

@@nmccw3245 I'm amazed how much has been ripped up too. The number of abandoned stations is in the hundreds.

@pressure609 11 ай бұрын

Im gonna call everyone shonky from now on

@CathodeRayNipplez 11 ай бұрын

@@pressure609 You would probably be more right than wrong most times. Sadly.

@neiloflongbeck5705 11 ай бұрын

@@CathodeRayNipplezthat's because of two main reasons. One, the opening of rail lines that served places with insufficient populations and, two, the opening of duplicating routes like GCR's London Extension that duplicated the routes of the LNWR and MR for Manchester and through the east Midlands.

@heidirabenau511 11 ай бұрын

Its the big boy.

@AndrewG1989 11 ай бұрын

How times have changed when steam trains were replaced by diesel trains and soon diesel trains will be phased out by new electric and battery powered trains as the UK is to reduce the pollution. And to cut down on dirty fuel for cleaner alternative including hydrogen that hydrogen powered trains will one day run on most railway lines in the UK. A lot is still changing as we move forward towards dealing with global warming.