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Letting a team put up 70 and losing to the Patriots just means the coaching is getting out coached....

So Sean Payton gets zero blame huh?

The Broncos approached Russell wanting him to waive his injury clause and told him if he didn’t they’d bench him. Apparently he told them no on the clause

For one, Sean Payton has made some bad coaching decisions that has cost Denver games. Second, Denver's defense is not good. They have lost many games because of the defense. ALL teams need good defenses to win. Third, Denver's offensive line is not good. Russell is always running for his life. So, to say that it's all Russell Wilson's fault that Denver is losing is just crazy.

Russ wasn’t playing D when they gave up 70. At least I don’t think.

The problem in Denver is they overvalued the talent around Russ for years they talked about they were a QB away but in reality they aren’t that close just look at the fact they gave up 70 points on defense

I literally couldn’t understand why Sean Peyton called that time out last week and now I know why he was tanking to get rid of Russ

Russ hasn’t been the problem but he also hasn’t been the solution.

Russell is being blamed for Sean Payton's mistakes. The latter is an overated coach.

Russ will probably be better off without Payton... Dude comes off as a grumpy old man who blames others because his system is outdated for today's NFL

Even if Russ isn’t the long term solution, outright benching him is a terrible idea. If you can find a young QB in the draft to sit behind him, you can bench him when that new QB is ready. You don’t bench a QB who clearly can win games unless you have someone worth starting already on the team.

In todays NFL, you can’t just have a good QB and expect a SB. Everyone talks about how Russ is overrated. His “QB away from SB team” was massively overrated. Dude has one offensive weapon and his defense isn’t put together as a good unit. If you get paid that much, teams are always going to scapegoat the QB, but it’s their fault for over valuing the QB position. Props to Russ for getting his bag and I respect the work he’s always put in.

Russell Wilson isn’t the problem. Sean Payton should’ve stayed retired

They bench him because of one game? The Patriots loss was bad but did they forget the Texans game? It was close. I think the only reason why he's getting benched is because Payton and Russ don't see eye to eye.

Payton already planned to replace Wilson. He showed that when he was screaming at him on the sideline last week. He is using Wilson as a scapegoat. He should have been asked why he didn't contest the call on the possible touchdown two plays earlier.

That’s why wins isn’t a qb stat bruh this the ultimate team game

So Joy is basically saying Russ gotta play like he's the whole offense 🤣🤣🤣

Sean Payton is the problem in Denver. Not Russ. Make Payton accountable for all of his failures this season. Russ is on defense that gave up 70 points to Miami. I have never been a fan of this dude. He's not the answer for the Broncos...

Did she just said Broncos has a really..really good defense, they gave up 70 pts, and can't stop the New England LMAO.

VERY DISRESPECTFUL!!! I FEEL FOR RUSS. HE DID NOT DESERVE THIS!!! SEAN NEVER LIKED RUSS. HE KNEW HE WANTED OUT BEFORE THE SEASON STARTED. THIS MOVE WILL COMEBACK AND HAUNT SEAN.

joy is talking like tua in miami is killing the league but he not ,russ is fine sean payton needs a scargoat because his defense cant stop a cold

Definitely disrespectful he the reason they won the games

Let’s see what Payton shows in these last two games without Wilson…and then we can decide if it has been the Coaching that’s the main issue with the Broncos

Joy basically calling Russell Wilson a game manager I wonder if anybody going to come at her like they did Cam Newton 😂

Why should Russ play for a coach who isn't for him. If i was him i would be glad to sit the bench and let Payton try to win and finally take some blame

No one is making the same argument as Purdy . Russ won a ring

Obviously broncos weren't as good as they thought when they brought him in, they weren't a QB away. This whole thing with Russ was done wrong. I do think he played a lot better than a bunch of QBs this year. Honestly was impressed with what he did, it's a shame but the organization is shifting and wants to win again, and frankly I think the owners are probably power hungry

Sean Payton wanted the Chargers job, but when they stuck with Staley, the Broncos were really the only team that was interested in him. He was never high on Russell since the day he got there.

Yeah of course Joy just gonna discredit how he won games for his team this year lol

Sean Payton trying to keep a job - Payton big part of the problem

This is by far the best qb year for denver since 2014 and it's still not enough dang

They let the tight end go and a running back. This is Russ at 32 not 25 . Denver did him a disservice. The defense went backwards too

all these sportscasters and national media for some reason scared to say peyton is the problem

Joy is being ridiculous here. The Broncos don't need the 2013 Seahawks D, they just need a competent D. The Broncos defensive front can't get pressure or stop the run, they're like bottom 5 in both categories. Also of note, Russ leads the league in both 4th qtr comebacks and game-winning drives this season. This benching decision is all about money.

Best version of the "Russ Scrutiny" I've seen. So well-balanced. Way to go, guys. Bottom line is all these discussions come back to the contract. The false narrative was, "he only has to be in the Top 12". No, not so. Not with that contract no matter how you discuss the numbers and games played against good teams, even with next to no depth at OL/DL/WR. Even if he/they beat NE, the wave of next year's contract would still hammer down saying you're not Peyton Manning. And it's a poorly written contract if he gets the year paid automatically if injured. Wow. Wilson can almost thank Paton for running him out of town.

They're not being disrespectful they are being irresponsible. I get it if the production isn't there but you've already invested the money. Figure it out. I'm a Raiders fan I would love to have Russell Wilson as our starter for a few years while we find our future franchise quarterback. And I'm sure he would love to go to a team in the same division we call that motivation. As the saying goes one man's trash is another man's treasure.

Atlanta Falcons could use him if they don't get Justin Fields

I hope the Broncos do get rid of him. As a Steelers fan I'd welcome him with open arms. With the weapons we have on offense, a solid defense, and what should be the DPOY every year doing what he does best Pittsburgh would be very dangerous. I don't know if he'd be the old Russ but I would much rather roll the dice with this Russ than what we have now.

The bottom line is this.. Coaches and Gm's should make the best decision for the team.. Treating Russell like this and putting Stidum in, is not making it best for the TEAM.

Speaking as a Niners fan myself, we used to play against Russ when he was in Seattle twice... and sometimes 3 times a year. And let me tell you.. Russ is a very special QB and a true difference maker. Payton/Wilson marriage was just a bad marriage from the start and it was never going to work.

Joy really dislikes Russ like he cares.

Russ is being scapegoated had many game winning drives this season

Russell Wilson… Can Move On..!!! To A Team that Will be Glad to have Him..🤷🏾

Give Russ some better weapons outside of Courtland Sutton and see his numbers improve vastly from this season

Jones got SOL GLO in his beard😂

Russ was never the man. He was a QB on a Super Bowl winning team. Not a QB that wins you the Super Bowl

I love the dynamic of this crew. Great segment guys & gal.

Russ has had a hurt Sutton, a hurt Judy, hurt RB's. He moved from one city to another team that was worse than the team he left. He is just trying to make a connection in timing with his Receivers and a new offense. Is there anyone on the panel that thought Denver was going to the Superbowl in two years with this injured team? All the skill positions have been injured over these two years. He's the one constant.

No joy .. you heard what the other men in the panel said . They are not holding on to the old Russ

After last year, a new coach came in on the theme of making players accountable. People were crying for Russ's blood. And now he's going to sacrifice Wilson on that altar to protect himself.

This is the best ive heard from you guys. Good stuff

I absolutely hate how Russ has taken the blame since arriving at Denver. What a joke of a team to allow it

It's weird how they want to disagree with her but not one of these guys stand up to her. Instead they put their heads down

What are people actually expecting here though? I get russ hasn't been great, but no qb this year has been lights out. Also, the teams with winning records either have great talent surrounding their QB, an amazing defense, or both. All of which aren't at Russell's disposal. It also doesn't help that Payton has shown no interest in creating plays to russ's benefit.

"He 17-27 in his last 44 starts" . . . . *Silence* . . . . 17 AND 27 ?!?!?! lmaooo love joy taylor

It's crazy to me how Sean tried to come out and say well I would have benched him if it was about the money. But then he came to Russell after the Chiefs game about the money. And there's a report out there that the money was the reason why they started having arguments. And even though the running backs weren't getting touchdowns he was blaming Russell because he already was fed up with Russell. He had a lack of respect for Russell from day one and Russell did everything he said. Everybody knows that Sean Payton made this a running team and Russell bought into that where he sacrificed his numbers. Sean Payton offense could not get us rushing touchdowns had nothing to do with russell. They just don't want to pay him his money and the NFL should look into this. Because everything was fine when we had chances to go to the playoffs right after we lost the Patriots game Sean did this

Teams I currently would not want to work for. Arizona, New York, Green Bay, Atlanta, Carolina, Denver, and LA Chargers.

I agree with acho lowkey

Some random 2023 week 17 comparisons: J. Goff 28 td's - 12 int's / P. Mahomes 27 td's - 14 int's / J. Allen 27 td's - 16 int's / J. Hurts 23 td's - 14 int's /// Russell Wilson 26 tds's - 8 int's

Joy doesn't know how to agree to disagree

Broncos offense isn’t good and they’re scape goating russ. Look at the chiefs, they are terrible on offense as well due to limited offensive talent. People will blame mahomes’ supporting cast though and not russ’. Crazy

Pointing the finger at Wilson is dirty asf

I love this debate!

For the Russ Argument - This Russ is not the running threat he was in 2013/2014 - Look at the amount he contributed to the rushing attack, and how much more dynamic the Russ of 2013/2014 was - It's not even close. He had 850 yards rushing in one of those seasons.

3K Yards 26 TDs 8Ints He'll be Comeback Player of the Year, just like I said before Week 1 started. Russ has been the scapegoat since he got to Denver.

They need a plan....(long pause). They may have a plan...(long pause).

If they are being disrespectful to Russ, I wish someone would disrespect me with that kind of guaranteed deal!

You think Joy does any research? Acho saving this show😂

This was a great debate from both sides with great facts & analysis from each side. Great job!

We talking bout a TEAM GAME. It ain’t just on Russ, using him as a scapegoat is bs

Sean payton is the problem more than wilson. Russell doesn't call the defensive or even the offensive plays. He just does what he is told.

Great discussion

2019 Russ threw for 4000 yards, 31 TDs 5INT. Russ been playing well his whole career minus last year. Yall not telling the whole story. 2020 he threw for 40 TDs and 13 INT along with 4200 yrds

They have no running game and defense sucks. Can’t blame him need to cut defensive players if that’s the case

Not Joy Wilson is not the problem having good players and coaches matter. He can't win by himself

I hate that they are sayin Wins and losses is a QB stat

They really did it because they didn’t want Russ to get injured and have to pay him an extra 37 million

why does it have to be a high draft for a good QB?

I loveeeee the Lady perception and her Analysis of this Ordeal. NEW SUBSCRIBER!❤

18 million a year for a coach😂😂😂 is he living up to his contract?? 🤔

To me it is crazy that joy has gone to the extreme of saying Russ's numbers for the last 44 games which is about this season and last season which were obviously washes new coach another new coach only difference is Sean Payton is a credible good coach and now when the defense plays decent you can see they can rely on rest to win games and the difference between Russ on the broncos and Russ on the Seahawks is yes Seahawks had a great running game and defense but Russell Wilson is still special. I guess the point I'm trying to make is they ain't jumping on Patrick mahomes all of a sudden when his defense ain't playing like they have been last year and to their full potential this year Patrick mahone's is getting let down by Kelce and really has no other help on the offense Patrick Mahone can't do it all by himself and it's showing which is why they're losing games and then once they get behind it's forcing him to throw forcing him to throw bad passes forcing him to make mistakes because it's not an option anymore it's pressed pressure but they ain't talking about Patrick the way they talk about Russ, pat might have one more super bowl win than Russ but that all came down to one decision from Pete Carroll deciding to throw the ball at the 1 yd line instead of running it in with Marshall and Lynch then they would have the same amount of rings so to me the comparisons from Russell Wilson that they're making are crazy because you're seeing it right now with Patrick mahones that obviously you need some help a quarterback is the most valuable player on the team but if you don't got no body else around either on the defense or the offensive side to make plays then you're going to have an average to slight average team with a great quarterback.

So no one’s talking about how Russ as far as number is still pro bowl worthy? He was among the best QBs without any legit WR, TE, or RB. DEN still has a chance to make the playoffs. The NFL isn’t like MLB or NBA, you just have to be the best team for 1 game in the post season.

I am a broncos fan and I do believe it's not only Russell Wilson 's fault it's whole team ,coaches including Sean payton as well,it's a big mistake

Fair is for ferris wheels and fried oreos... I'm totally using that line going forward, lol

It’s Sean Payton and not Russ and if Denver don’t get them to work on the same page they have a big problem as a coach he should know and see that o line is trash 🗑️ and players dropping balls when needed most smh

Russ is 26 TD and 8 INT That’s actually top 10 QB ratings…so benching him is abit silly…

So just blame Wilson for everything. If Sutton would have been in the game Wilson would have kept them in the game.

I appreciate the well-balanced argument. Thank you so very much. I think it’s fair to point out in the Patriots loss that the defense gave up two touchdowns in six seconds.

The problem is Russ isn’t playing as a 45-50m QB. Everyone is judging his play off his play last year, which of course he will play better but Russ is not the guy from Seattle. Big picture is Russ not winning Denver a Super Bowl so why pay a overpriced QB

Joy is the one who sees the big picture. Russ’ play last year was so bad that anything short of an MVP season was not going to be good enough for the new regime. With context he wasn’t the reason they were winning, some of the games he’d barely have 200 passing yards. This is only crazy because the new contract doesn’t even start yet and the Broncos are willing to eat that dead cap hit. This was the worst trade in modern NFL history

Win and loses are a Qb stat When it's someone like Wilson except if it's Josh Allen or Justin Hubert

In the beginning of the season it was pretty bad but lately he's been doing pretty good and he turned it around.

Y’all can’t blame Russ bc he drive that whole team down the field also y’all need blame our special teams kicker he miss a field don’t forget that too also the guy on the Broncos fumble the 🏈 that what really hurt us tho but Russ can’t take bad sack tho for the team scramble or throw it away no🧢

So do we still owe Russ an apology or….

We just forgetting that russ threw 40 touchdowns in 2019 and was voted number 2 best player in the league on NFL top 100

I think what's going on with Russ has more of a 'narrative' that others paint of you. One bad play away from having 2 Super Bowls. I don't think anyone associated with that has recovered( Legion of boom, Marshawn, Pete Carroll, and even Russ, himself). So when Sean Payton comes in and uses Russ as a scapegoat, everyone should see it. Russ isn't the type of person to say anything derogatory and that works against you when you allow people to paint you the way They want to.

Great show guys. Everyone made great points. I’ve been a Russ supporter n it’s so frustrating to go from controlling our playoffs chances to Russ getting benched. This move might backfire idk, we’ll see… What if Stidham struggles so bad that they have to put Russ in?!🤔 Go Broncos!!!!

Joy has such an intense hatred for Russ and lets it cloud her opinion, and her yelling doesn't make her right. The guy has put up a nice season despite a team with subpar talent, and he is literally responsible for throwing some of the lowest expected to be completed TD's this season.

Sean Payton will be the next Bill Bellichick. Both are as good as their HOF QB.