You're 100% correct, Sam. A brand new loco should not be faulty, regardless of the purchase price

Sam you are a good honest reviewer . That is why I like and trust your reviews. I would honestly like to know what is going on with Hornby . They raised their prices and lowered their quality. I do not think this is isolated instances . It has been happening to often now I have seen it on other reviewers. It is a beautiful engine but I would send it back if I were you. Good luck with it.

Hi Sam! I think you should: 1. Put the DCC tender on it, just to see how much lipstick can help the pig. Because science. 2. Get the airbrush and masking tape out and have a go at giving it a bit more of a modern shine with some satin/gloss varnish depending on how daring you are. 3. Make another step towards finding the perfect aliexpress generic motor for our needs and get it installed.

Honestly, seeing another Faulty loco from Hornby, it makes me glad that I'm buying locos from other companies. While not perfect, at least I know those ones can run quite well with a load behind them.

I second another comment made, although they are relatively expensive it would be cool if you did a couple of oo9 reviews and maybe make a new track for them with their narrow turning circles it could be interesting

Actually there was one Great Western engine larger than the King, namely a one-off 4-6-2 'Pacific' built in 1908. She was No. 111 'The Great Bear', and ended up being rebuilt as a Castle in 1924. I don't think my Dad would be happy with this model; the Kings are his favourite Great Western engines (though mine are the 72xx class 2-8-2T).

When seeing the worm gear at 18:34 I was concerned with the distance between the worm gear and the gear underneath, it looked as if the teeth weren't meshing at all. I would check to see if the teeth are making good contact because I wonder if they are slipping, that would explain the clicking sound at low speeds.

This is just the sort of thing I meant when I commented on your previous video about the 'better running' of modern models. Sadly, this sort of thing seems to be all too common with purchases of new models. I've certainly experienced a number myself that were defective right out of the box - not necessarily exactly like this, but not properly functioning. And this is why, if anything, I feel more confident buying a used quality model from well in the past than I do buying a brand new recent release. As a general suggestion, given how committed you are to fully and accurately reviewing the models that you purchase, I would suggest that you incorporate a multi-meter into your reviews, so that you can actually see how much current the loco is drawing. I'm pretty sure that you'd find that the current draw for faulty models like the B12 and this King would be unacceptably high for a modern model (though, of course, you would also find that much older models would routinely draw rather more power).

Hold up… if it’s against the law to not disclose the item as faulty, and this continues to happen, you might need to report this to the consumer commission, or whoever regulates this stuff. If this keeps happening, somebody knows they are faulty, which means they are not disclosing this information, and if that’s true, somebody will need to report this

There is no way a new locomotive should perform like this on analogue. It is faulty so return it for a full refund. A locomotive that does not run properly is no bargain.

I recently bought a Hornby Star class very cheaply, £62 & it was exactly the same on crawl. I released the motor from its mount & held it vertically while i applied a little oil on the motor spindle as it exits its casing. I then applied power for a while still holding the motor vertically. The result was a completely different loco, able to crawl very slowly & very smoothly.

Hi Sam. I purchased one of these from Hattons a while ago. (Early2020) and I had a brilliant experience with it. Ran nicely and no strange sounds. I don’t focus on performance a lot as I am happy just to see a rake behind it but I didn’t have any problems. Ultimately I had no issues and was very pleased with my purchase. But I do admit hornby quality for the last quarter of last year to now have definitely dropped off slightly. I blame the seagulls blocking all those drains and flooding the production floor haha

Hi Sam, I'd do a video on sending it back and getting a replacement to show quality control and customer service.

Huh… another faulty one? At a reduced price? Somebody knows something they aren’t telling us. I know manufacturing costs have gone up, but this is the same price range as the upgraded A1, and that had a die cast plate and firebox glow, so that definitely does not make any sense. Hornby are in a very strange place right now

I see Hornby have out done themselves again Sam! Thanks for an honest and informative video as always👍

Hi Sam. Send it back to Hornby and get them to fix it, doing whatever it takes to make it a good runner. Then, make another video to take a look at what they did to it to get it working properly. I think it will be interesting to find out what they did.

Christmas 2016 Hattons brochure has the R3384TTS King George I at £166. Doesn't say the list price because it isn't under the bargains. Autumn 2017 shows the non-TTS kings (R3408/09/10, as here) with RRP £181.99 reduced to £109, so this model is not new at all in terms of release. The Kings were the most powerful 4-6-0s, but the LMS Princess Coronations were certainly more powerful. The front bogie is designed like that because the inside cylinders wouldve fouled the inside frames at the front of the bogie, but the outside cylinders wouldve fouled the outside frames at the back of the bogie. As much as I like GWR locos, I've only got a 1980s tender drive King, a hornby dublo Castle, and 2 00s ringfield loco drive Castles. I could do with getting more modern versions, and a Star and a Hall too. This loco is the most juddery I've ever seen. And this is why I have trust issues with Hornby at the moment, why I haven't ordered a W1 or preordered Turbomotive.

Finally - a 'King' that looks like a 'King'; though why nobody has made the inside-to outside linkages work is a mystery. We've had 'Stars', 'Castles' and 'Kings', and yet nobody has made these essential features of the GW four-cylinder locomotive actually move! Had these been from a continental manufacturer, they would almost certainly be operational. Seeing a 'King' slip is an odd sight - the prototypes were incredibly sure-footed machines.

I would like you to test the model thoroughly to see if it does get better with time. Then I would appreciate you seeing if you can defintely trace the problem to the motor or something else. What is significant is that the model number is R3408 and thus it dates from about 5 or 6 years ago. Hence, it is as if at this time Hornby had a really bad period of bad motors: the same period as the S15, just before the H class and a similar time as the B12. I thought that the B12 was so cheap owing to the unpopular livery, but which I like!

best Kings class i got was from the Cornish Riviera set a fair few years ago, 'King Charles 1' number 6010. I still have it, and it works great. Seems like I was wise to stick with it and not get a newer one ;) Thanks for the review

I got mine last Christmas and it runs just fine

Great review as always Sam, and sorry you got a dud. I got a BR green one (6029) a couple of years ago when they were discounted, and the performance is very similar to yours at a crawl with the cogging/rattling sound. Weirdly, mine doesn’t have the torque issues though. Hope you get it sorted 👍🏻

Sam a great review as always. You could put the naysayers to rest and fit a DCC chip and prove that DCC doesn't solve the issues. It looks like that Hornby has fired their QC staff!

I'd definitely be curious to see a video on replacing the motor. It sounded like there was a grinding sound at the low speed, could something else in the mechanism be making that sound?

I'd say try replacing the motor for a more powerful upgrade... It'll be interesting how cheaply it can be improved over Hornby's attempt. I agree with the paintwork... Hornby have a knack of making paintwork look dull and dim.

I bought the King George with TTS on board and it was and still is, Brilliant. My select controller went into the bin and I now use Digitrax. I totally agree with you regards purchase, Unless something is marked up specifically as faulty. Then it should WORK PROPERLY. Suggestion, Put a load of about 12 coaches behind it and run it at full whack for an hour.See if it gets any better, it looks to me as though it is a mechanical drive problem. Then if it doesn't improve. bin it or send it back.

Maybe you could do a review of DCC systems seeing which is the best in terms of price, ease of use and setup, and how the loco’s act on each system.

There is nothing more disappointing than buying something that doesn't work. If it's bought as "seconds" or used then you can expect it sometimes, but not from new items. The quality control on model rolling stock from most manufacturers seems to be seriously inadequate. Having said that, the model looks nice and I'd take a gamble on one at the price you paid. I live in Australia so would have to fix it myself as postage is so costly, but I'm comfortable with that.

Conspiracy time! Hornby are selling faulty models for cheap to retailers and keeping good ones back. The retailers sell the engines at a discount to customers. Hornby then hope that this puts people off retailers and gets them more direct sales at their price. Or I’ve had to much caffeine today.-Das Mann

I purchased a king after watching your first review (the same one in this video but a couple of years ago) of the king and was very happy that it run just like in your video. The Hornby models from a couple of years ago run much better than the newer ones. They seem to be very hit or miss of late. Have you ever considered doing a video on why some locos are built with certain mechanical features like for example fly wheels (one, two or none), bearings or no bearings as an example. As a starting hobbyist, I am perplexed why some locomotives are cheaper but have great mechanical features while an expensive model lacks from the same manufacture (example Hornby). Thanks for the reviews they are so helpful.

Evil sounds Good Sam. No only kidding try one of your new motor Jobbies. Great Video Sam show them what needs to be done. We are with you all the way. Bill Western Australia

ALso, in earlier reviews you state, 'I must consider value based on the RRP price, to be consistent and have a level playing field.' Now you are doing a verbal tap dance... 'oh, at the price I paid.... it was a deal..." No. You can't have it both ways. At the Hornby price, the value is 2 stars, and NOT 3.5 stars! Be consistent.

Thats sad to see that the running was faulty I remember seeing your review of the king about 5 ish years ago and purchased 2 of them 1 dcc and 1 in a train pack. They both run tremendously well on although the dcc one's decoder burned up and I had to convert it to dc

Does anyone know, are all of Hornby's King class liveries detailed the same? I'm considering purchasing a King Henry III No. 6025 in the lighter blue livery to go with a rake of Pullmans, but I'm worried about making a mistake or purchasing the wrong one (this will be my first purchase (excluding railroad box sets from when I was young))

It's really sad how the consumer is being conditioned nowadays to almost expect faulty products when it's not supposed to be that way at all. Those people that said well if it's heavily discounted it must be bad didn't see your GG1 video where it was quite heavily discounted and was one of your top ten models for that year. I agree wholeheartedly that anything bend new should work flawlessly right out of the box and give you enjoyment at least initially and ideally for years to come. If faults pop up over time it's frustrating but not inspected but not right out of the box. At some point the manufacturers are going to have to realize they can't rely on their reputation for very long and can't just keep screwing over the customer forever we do have a limit on forgiving faulty models. Sorry for long comment ill get off my soap box now.

An attempted repair or motor swap could be a beneficial learning experience for your viewers. I wish sellers would warn customers about the reason bargain locos are selling at a discount. Novices to the hobby or people buying a present for someone else would not know of problems when ordering online, while those in the hobby would be aware of reasons for discounts.

I think you should return it and see if it was just a one off fault. Great reviews Sam 👌

Good review, get Hornby to rectify the fault and give you a full report on what was wrong and how they repaired it., and then show it ruining correctly. Yes a new loco should work correctly.

judging by the clicking, I don't think that's cogging in the motor, I think it has some part that's malformed, and is having mechanical interference. Try running it for several hours, and compare before and after performance. I think it just needs a REALLY long running in, to wear in whatever malformed part is clicking, probably one of the gears. Alternatively, take it apart fully and look at the gears, and if you find one that's messed up, try 3d printing a replacement part. I really do think one of the gears has a messed up tooth or something that's creating a lot of resistance.

Well said. Unless something as sold and described as "Poor runner" or "Performance issues" or something along the lines, it shouldn't have performance issues. No amount of a discount matters if it doesn't work. I don't know how anyone can disagree. They might as well be saying you should be able to smash a model against the floor, sell it for a fiver and be doing nothing wrong. Just madness.

The green shade is so off on this it reminds me of the 70s model. When I bought one I went for the blue livery as it has a much better finish.

Yes, this is eight months ago, and no, I haven't read every one of the 421 comments on here, so there's a possibility I might be repeating what someone else has already said, but I think there's a really big clue in the detailing pack which might explain what's gone on here. With all the locos I've ever bought, either brand new from the manufacturer or a retailer, or from that well-known auction site but described as new, the detailing pack has been *sealed*, and the same goes for etched nameplates, headboards and the like. This supposedly new King class has an accessories bag, but as Sam says, it's a *resealable* one, and not only that, the etched cabside numbers are floating about loose in it, rather than being protected in a separate bag, as they would normally be. Now all this says to me the loco isn't brand new - it seems highly likely that someone's had it before Sam, tried it out, found it was a rubbish runner and sent it back, then the retailer has resold it (either knowingly or unknowingly) "as new", at a heavily discounted price. The crucial thing here I think is that the previous owner opened the detailing pack, and before returning the loco, resealed its contents in a new bag. I may be wrong, but every time I've seen a resealable detailing pack, I know someone's had the loco before me and it's not brand new. Anyway, that's my theory and I'm sticking to it !

Sam, I recently bought a loco with a very strange quirk. if you turn the power up slowly, it runs fine. If you turn the power up quickly from stopped though, it'll make a "Pop" sound, then wheelslip violently until it gains traction. And if you turn the power down while it's wheelslipping, it instantly dies. I think there's something wrong with the jankily wired DCC system.

Could review a narrow gauge train like the "prince" made by peco

It's not just Hornby. In the last 15 months I have bought six new locomotives and three of them have been damaged, one due to poor assembly and the other two down to courier transit from the retailer. I have two further locos on pre-order and fully expect one of them to be damaged. How can this have happened, especially when you consider how much more we are paying for our models? Another excellent review Sam....................send it back.

I bought a Hornby King Class recent at a heavily discounted prices and it does cog a tiny bit but it's only on the very slowest speeds and otherwise a fabulous model that will creep around at a scale walking pace. It is DCC and fitted with a home made stay alive however. I'm very pleased with it apart from a slight tendancy to wiggle its nose as it runs but it only shows fom the front. It is now sprayed gloss and lightly weathered too and looks truly stunning. Such an iconic design! I feel this 'discounted for a reason' shenanigans is becoming a thing with Hornby. I bought a Hornby B17 heavily discounted recently and it turned out to be an awful runner. After some investigation I found the metal weight block inside the tender was screwed down onto the tender pickup electrics and intermittently short circuiting it. A tiny bit of insulation tape later to fix a poor design and it is truly an amazing locomotive. Im fairly confident an otherwise excellent model is so discounted as Hornby know they have quality control issues. Hornby know how to make great models when they try and keep an eye on quality and not just money.

Hi Sam, didn’t you hear that at slow speeds this model doubles as a Geiger Counter? Listen to it again!

that motor is definately experiencing bad contact on one of more of the poles could just be old stock thats been kept in a humid environment for a long while some deoxit sprayed into the commutator/brush housing and some run in afterward should fix the problem

Hi Sam good video thanks. I just bought a King class today King Edward the v111 eighth no problem whatsoever perfect slow starter and runner you must have had a faulty locomotive. Thanks Sam Bryan

Totally correct, goods sold as working ought to work regardless of cost. But the audacity suggest anything more than a token fiver is cheap and you get what you pay for is insane. We recognise where the retail price comes from, but ultimately the material cost is double digits, not treble, and if it’s only fit to be a desk ornament, it might as well be £20 and come with a magazine of oft repeated myths and legends of the railways.

With all the complaints being generated about Hornby pricing, Hornby quality, Hornby service perhaps a blanket ban on publishing anything regarding their products until they improve everything that is so obviously wrong with that company and its current direction. More attention should be paid to those companies trying to do a worthwhile job, that respects its customer base, should see more air time.

My Brother has a Hornby King. Displaying the same symptoms as yours. Even on DCC it is a very poor performer at slow speeds. Although we are not experiencing the torque issues. Even after an hour in each direction it’s still not 100%.

Send it back. I had a problem with an LGB wagon that I bought from Rails. It was described as used but not faulty, and certainly not missing a vital part of a mechanism. They have refused to refund me and have only offered a ten pound credit note.

Hi Sam. I bought a Hornby loco, from Hornby at Margate, very expensive. It also the Duchess of Kent it arrived minus the chimney. For the last 2 weeks they sent me a New one Alas after putting it on the track it didn't even start. I phoned Hornby they replaced it with another new one. It didn't even start again. So after 5 weeks I am now waiting to get my money back. Bryan

I'll stick with my 1970's Hornby GWR King Class I bought as "non-functional," though all she needed was a bit of cleaning and adjustments.

If it were me I would return it via the dealer you bought it from, although the last time I did that it took hornby about 6 months to fix it.😊

My King runs well on my rickety DC layout. I agree unless an item is described as faulty we should expect it to work properly irrespective of the price. Regards Paul.

Exactly Sam not listed as faulty or factory seconds it's listed as brand new even at the discount price you expect your model to work as intended. The juddering almost sounds as if the motor cradle is broken its a heck of noise whatever it is.

I picked up a King Class from Kernow for 114 pounds. The only thing wrong with it was the the fall-plate was in the packaging, something that is rather commonplace for me since I live overseas. I tend to get my big tender engines at bargain prices since shipping is an absolute money sucker. The only problems I have with them are usually cosmetic - loose buffers, broken decals, etc. I've never had running issues from bargain locos.

I remember asking you about a year ago if you would still rate this 10/10, I guess not!

Awesome video today Sam beautiful modle I think you should try and see what the fault is

Picked up one of these in BR Express Blue a year or two ago and haven't had any issues with it.

And you’re spot on. Regardless of price, no loco out of the box should be faulty! For yourself, it’s probably not the end of the world, as you have the resources and ability to fix some issues. but for the average modeller it is going to be impossible to repair!

even though you bought the model at a discounted price could you not sent it back to manufacturer for a replacement?

Hey Sam! Good video showing differences in DCC vs. Analog running. If you are looking for a more reliable DCC system, I'd personally recommend the NCE Power cab. You can buy boosters for more power later but for running few engines the basic power cab system should be enough. I do believe they make a UK power pack for it. :)

what has happened to Hornby at this point?

I think it could do with a upgrade a 5 pole motor and flywheel, would be funny to see it converted into a tender drive loco perhaps then it would work better!

I love your videos, they are very informative and will be of use if I dive in OO modeling as I'm thinking of starting with OO9 models, either built to run or maybe a shape ways body on a Z or OO9 scale chassis

I have a 2 year old King Charles II and although not as bad as yours does cog a bit when starting even with a DCC decoder installed and fine tuned BEMF. I don’t know why they used such an unreliable motor in these as compared to the really nice 5 pole motor in the Bulleid light and heavy pacifics and the A4s which run beautifully.

Hi Sam, I enjoy your reviews. Interestingly, I purchased this loco, King Edward II at a very good price of $220.00 AUD. I DCC fitted it, with a DCC Concepts decoder, which I rate as very good performers. Mine runs beautifully at all speeds, hauling decent loads. Perhaps your one is just faulty.

If you wanted to try some other motors I would love to see you some how fit an athearn motor into it. You can get them used somewhat cheap on eBay and they're great motors usually they come with a nice pair a flywheels. I've been hooked on them since my first athearn loco.

Changing the motor would be interesting. I agree with you - a discounted model should still work properly - you're not buying it to sit in its box or on a shelf.

3:03 - You unlocked 8 peanut buttered sandwiches. I prefer eight pencils.

I bought the same model, and another King at the same time, both discounted. I run on dcc and both have the same cogging at slow speed problem. I bought two replacement Hornby motors to see if I could improve the crawl, but it made little difference - one improved very slightly but not enough, and the other made no difference. Torque seems ok, but my layout it fairly level. The old saying is "once is happenstance, twice is coincidence, but three times is enemy action". There is too much evidence of these discounted models being faulty for it to be a coincidence.

It is such a shame. My King Edward II was purchased at a similar bargain, and I would call that a 5 star performer. So sad that you got a faulty example. I don't think you shpuld do an experiment witth it. Would be a shame with such a gorgeous engine.

I'm wondering whether these locos are bargains because not many people have bought one soon after manufacturer. Therefore they were manufactured at the same time and Hornby had a bad batch of motors. Was it the same motor in the B12? Are there better motors than Hornby's standard ones which fit?

Send it to Accurascale and let them make a proper one!

Hi Sam, sorry to see you have got another bad one. That's a very odd fault. Two things come to mind. Lose DCC blanking plug or dry joints on the PCB, can you have a look and let us know? Otherwise it sounds like a gear issue, but why not at higher speeds. My money's on the bad electrical connection. Good luck mate. Mike

I have one fitted with a DCC decoder and it still cogs at low speeds, but not as bad as your new one. Gotta be the motor, could it be 3 pole? Anyway, can you possiblly find a better motor for it?

She was a Stafford road loco at one point saw on box Wolverhampton I live 5 mins away from the site of the old shed

Well really you should return it . However you have the capability to dissect it and find out what the matter is , much as you did with the B12 . Maybe try a new motor to see if it is any different. Of course you really don’t need to do it but it might show Hornby they really need to get act together and improve quality .

What does "ROP"mean? That's not an abbreviation used in the U.S.. We would use "MSRP" for Manufacturers Suggested Retail Price.

Sam: “If you buy a product and it does not do what it expects, it’s wrong. That’s not up for discussion, it’s law.” Also Sam: 30: 15 *Apologizes to passengers for the ride not being what they expected before King Edward V rams into the train at 50% speed, snapping half the passenger’s necks instantaneously.*

Here's the thing I don't get. why doesn't a company just sell the shells - you know, the fancy, highly decorated, intricate detail pieces - and then the end user just builds the rest of the model themselves? heck, make a modular chassis for use for such things. it'd be cheaper, and eliminate duds like this ( or in the case of companies, probably increased profit margins )

Me got a king class its fine.mines a lima tender drive. Love Stephen.

I have seen models of the King class fitted with the incorrect tender. This should be checked

Maybe try putting a flywheel in it and I would say check if the gears are clogging up because of the lube

Shame about the motor cos it's a great looking loco. What's the biggest, most powerful motor you could fit into it?

I haven't had a lot of luck with "Kings" . My first one, "King William" , suffers incurable wheel slip on the axles. The newer one, "King James 1", works well enough, but doesn't have nearly the power of my "Castles". For a model of the GWR's most powerful loco, I cannot understand why Hornby would give it an under-powered motor. Adding insult to injury when they turn out to be faulty. Is it really so difficult to source suitable motors? Hornby products are not the only brand where superb models are let down in this regard, as your reviews attest.

Hi Sam, I think you should replace the motor. If you exchange it you could end up in the same boat. Hornby need to get it together, for the ridiculous prices they charge. Carl.

have things improved at all in the last year for Hornby?

You're right Sam, even if the price of the engine is not of a high quality model you still payed for it and it should work normally.

i have had issues with some of the new hornby loco,s seems the blanking chips in tender are a bit on dodgy side seem suffer voltage drop i replaced a couple loco then ran fine

I just got one of those on Ebay for 50pownds earlier release but same engine . Cheap as chips

The worm gear is not meshed correcty with the drive sprocket. Adjust the worm gear.

Thanks for your review Sam. What to do with it? If it was mine then a straight return - Hornby will not learn or improve if people do not do so?

How were the other 5,365,228 takes?

Interesting, never seen anyone have issues with a Hornby King before, and as you say it's been around for a while as a great model- suggests Hornby's quality control is on the slide, rather than the actual design?

I like the idea of "EVIL EXPERIMENT" but that just me evil muwahahahaha

I hope I am not right but Hornby strikes me as a firm struggling to survive. Having worked in industry all my life it appears they are falling over all the obvious things, quality is suspect, they don't seem to carry over the good bits of design between models. It seems that each loco is individually designed without say sticking to tried and tested parts (eg) motors. Then there is their part numbering, quite often parts are the same between models, even though it is the same part but they label them as different parts making production difficult. Then some parts they use the same part number even though the part has changed (A3 tender chassis with and without sound). I wanted to put the decoder in the tender on an A3 as with DCC it is really difficult to get the body on, so the last thing you want is a load of wires to worry about. So I needed a new tender chassis to take the socket, on EBay the sound chassis had the same part number as the non sound part, I eventually had to mail the Seller to check that the photograph was correct. It reminds me of the automotive industry in the 70's, fortunately for them the Japanese forced them to get their act together to compete. Trouble is their locos are too expensive, ok you could say I am tight but I compare their prices with other makes. Most of the other makes are substantially cheaper and even Rails special versions which should cost more as they are small volume runs, generally cost the same or less. Good video though, I like your reviews, if the loco is suspect you highlight it. Trouble is with preorders by the time you get the loco and find it is a dog, it is too late.