Should Congress Stop Funding the War in Ukraine?

Рет қаралды 30,224

Ай бұрын

Since the beginning of Russia’s invasion of Ukraine, the United States has provided more than $75 billion in aid to Ukraine, which has been directed toward military operations, economic support, and humanitarian assistance. As the war has gone on, members of Congress have questioned whether we have done enough to help the country and if continuing funding is sustainable. Those who want to continue funding Ukraine say the U.S. has a moral obligation to support the country in its time of need, it sustains alliances while serving strategic interests, and it demonstrates the U.S.’s support of democratic values and sovereignty. Those arguing it’s time to end the funding say that it diverts necessary resources that could go toward domestic and foreign priorities. They also question whether the funds are being used efficiently, whether the war is winnable, and whether providing military aid is genuinely contributing to a path toward peace.
With this crucial background, we debate the question: Should Congress Stop Funding the War in Ukraine?
Arguing Yes: John Mearsheimer, Political Science Professor at the University of Chicago and
Daniel L. Davis, Retired Lieutenant Colonel, Senior Fellow and Military Expert at Defense Priorities
Arguing No: Heather Conley, President of German Marshall Fund of the United States and Paula Dobriansky, Former Under Secretary of State for Global Affairs; Senior Fellow at Harvard Kennedy School’s Belfer Center for Science and International Affairs; Vice Chair, Atlantic Council Scowcroft Center for Strategy & Security
Emmy award-winning journalist John Donvan moderates
This debate was recorded live for an invite-only audience at the Council on Foreign Relations in New York City. @cfr partnership.
#opentodebate #debate #Russia #Ukraine #Congress #humanitarianassistance #military
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@OpentoDebate Ай бұрын

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@wanderlust0120 27 күн бұрын

The men : ukraine is losing The women : the war benefits us

@barumbadum 21 күн бұрын

😂😂😂

@bambajirekla6820 19 күн бұрын

it is crazy

@vd9866 13 күн бұрын

The men: Ukrainian men are better alive living under Putin than being killed in a unwinnable war The women: Ukrainian men are better dead than being a part of Russian workforce

@curiosity1818 Ай бұрын

It is horrifying how the audience is laughing at the people who want peace, and clapping for those who want to see the war continue. Deeply disturbing and dystopian.

@Ombitsman Ай бұрын

Terrible 😢

@freeingtone 25 күн бұрын

I do agree

@nefmot 25 күн бұрын

What are ye saying? Ukrainians are fighting for their homeland. They don't "want to fight". They have no choice but to fight. They didn't ask for this war. People suggesting that they should settle with Russia by giving them 20% of their territory and people.. that's ridiculously stupid and naive. Would America give away 20% of it's territory in settlement of a war it didn't start and a war where it has lost 100s of thousands of it's best men and in a war where 100s of thousands of it's children were stolen? No way, and they shouldn't. So why do Americans think Ukrainians are being unreasonable for not wanting to either? Ukraine has no choice but to fight this brutal regime. The GOP in America really has lost its way now. It has lost all credibility. It has sided with Putin and Trump instead of it's own country. What a bunch of traitors. The Democratic party should be going hard after this. They should be highlighting how trump is such a traitor and how he hates America and is always running it down and badmouthing it. What a fu#@king loser he is. All of us outside the USA look on in disbelief at how anyone could think that loser Trump would make a good leader, nevermind that it's nearly half the population. Wtf?? What's even more baffling is that most of the American population (not just republican voters) believe he's better for the economy. Wtf? I bet they can't point to one piece of legislation that he enacted that had a positive effect on their economy, yet for some reason they "feel" he's better. Omg.

@leyzei7745 24 күн бұрын

horrible, truly horrible

@hirotofy7653 22 күн бұрын

Ukraine can't be neutral. If Ukraine be neutral country new president of Ukraine will be pro-russian and corrupted

@SJ-lt6yf Ай бұрын

These two women out of their minds

@arak1973 Ай бұрын

These two women are pure idiots and know nothing. They sitting in their offices their whole life doing nothing and now discussing war with two people actually been in long wars and have huge fighting experience. No, Ukrainians dont want to die, maybe you need to go to front to show them how to fight? She is sick mentally saying that they are dying and not us and helping us modernizing our arm industry.

@mattf9899 Ай бұрын

Yeah and Mearsheimer was really salient when he compared trench warfare to insurgencies in vietnam and afghanistan as a reason why our 60:1 economic advantage wont help us to make artillerty tubes in overwhelming capacity. Really stellar argument you ruskis have, lets roll over.

@istvandarvas3372 Ай бұрын

There were two men with military backgrounds who were arguing for a diplomatic solution, advocating for a ceasefire and peace. On the other side, there were two women with diplomatic backgrounds who were arguing for a military solution. I can't say who's right, but it was really a strange situation.

@TDH_1962 Ай бұрын

I can... and it's clear

@clarkisaac6372 Ай бұрын

I'm willing to tell you the answer and the situation wasn't strange Men know military victory is unachievable for Urakine, but diplomatic. Women support the military option because they have no idea about what it is and how it works, and their diplomatic tracks are primarily about money. Most people criticize the two ladies because there would always be trouble if we put people in business or politics in charge of decision-making in such incidents.

@billusher2265 Ай бұрын

It’s establishment vs out of establishment. Mearsheimer and the other guy are independent, those two women aren’t. If you find outside of establishment diplomats and within establishment military personnel to debate it would be reversed perspectives.

@wojteks4712 Ай бұрын

Guys are establishment,but wrong - so out of decisive circles. That's why they go on debating. Marscheimer was crushed at Mink debate by Sikorski and US diplomat, he is no practitioner, he is just spewing his theories with no consequences...

@susanraby-dunne8180 Ай бұрын

I can, it's not these two unconscionable idiots talking about the "return on investment," about the deaths of more than half a million men.

@richardchuanqin Ай бұрын

“Those dead Ukrainians are enriching our weapon makers. We must continue doing that.” That’s effectively what that two women have said.

@leyzei7745 24 күн бұрын

yes, what a shame, what a cynical position. and they were also talking about "values"....

@fjalics 21 күн бұрын

We can't make Ukraine fight, but we should help them if they want to, with a lot more, so they can win. They have had a 7-10 to 1 ratio in artillary. Let's even that up and see what happens. And the US has a much bigger economy and production capacity than russia. We absolutely can match and exceed them. Also, a lot of that money is going to upgrade US military equipment. We send the old one, and use the cash to build a new one for the army.

@Rebbolucion 12 күн бұрын

@@fjalics The US does not have a larger production capacity right now. Russia is ahead by miles when it comes to conventional weapons. We would never be able to catch up to Russia in artillery production. You're living in a pipe dream. America makes expensive weapons that are just that, expensive and nothing else. We would have to shift our whole economy to making weapons to be able to match Russia. That's not gonna happen. Get real.

@fjalics 12 күн бұрын

@@Rebbolucion There are lots of weapons systems that make things go boom. We don't have the same mix that the russians have. For example, we have a lot of aircraft. Those can carry bombs. We have lots of them. We have ramped artillery production, and with more cash, we could ramp it more. We also have a lot more ground vehicles, many of which we want to replace.

@mirceasamuelvoicu7174 Ай бұрын

If you put this ladies in power we can get WW3. She is speaking about sending Nato troops in Ukraine and she is smiling... Now i see that we have others Victoria Nulands.

@karlharrison2449 Ай бұрын

The two women are misinformed or lying. Either way they are delusional.

@andrekeefer2034 Ай бұрын

They are stubbornly indoctrinated.They are an integral part of the Deep State.

@shadowreaver1851 Ай бұрын

They are too educated and tied into the Blob to be misinformed. I think they are just evil. Like Vicky Nuland handling out cookies to the mostly peaceful protestors in Ukraine who overthrow a democratically elected government so we could install a corrupt puppet regime that does our bidding.

@Victoria-dc5uc Ай бұрын

Those women are clueless all they care about is their own pockets which they indirectly admitted... very painful to watch

@V12F1Demon Ай бұрын

Well said....they sounded nuts

@martin.rodgers Ай бұрын

Was about to write the same thing! These women that have absolutely no clue as to what it means to be on the front lines. Seems Russia will have to nuke people before sanity prevails.

@copingsin1 Ай бұрын

So true!

@chankane Ай бұрын

These "women" have no morals... or, their morals are must twisted!

@dimoraphotographer Ай бұрын

What can you expect from a DUO Karen

@akap_987 Ай бұрын

Oh God, the ladies had no arguments just emotional hysteria. They refused to listen and respond, bar one time. Painful to watch and very disturbing that such people are in positions where they are making decisions that is destroying our collective future

@GreenGoblinDK Ай бұрын

Thank you Putin is destroying our peaceful future. Finally somebody gets it.

@shadowreaver1851 Ай бұрын

That seems to be a recuring theme these days by anyone who still supports Ukraine. They rarely cite any facts but just make an emotional argument. More often then not they simply act as trolls and pick fights with anyone critical of funding Ukraine and call those who raise real solid points Putin supporters or Pro Russian. Typical of the NAFO side. They don't have an argument they have a belief system and attack anyone who doesn't agree with them. It just shows they lost the argument.

@ixco4732 Ай бұрын

2 men debating 2 women what do you expect?

@akap_987 Ай бұрын

@@ixco4732 Hey hey, I am a woman. There are many intelligent, level headed women!😉

@ixco4732 Ай бұрын

@@akap_987 I would never say there aren't. I mean in general. Women make emotional decisions and men logical. But to be fair I think these women in the video were just reading American politics talking points because that's just their job.

@andytwentyman9573 Ай бұрын

These ladies can't seem to realize that sometimes what you want and what you can achieve aren't in alignment. They just can't stop from trying to damage Putin even though all they've done is make him stronger.

@turquoiseowl Ай бұрын

it's petulance

@shadowreaver1851 Ай бұрын

What's worse is they don't seem to care what happens to Ukraine. I think they know Ukraine can't win but don't care as long as it damages Russia. Even if that were true it would still be wrong and evil but of course the end result will be a militarized Russia and half a million dead Ukrainians along with a totally destroyed country.

@davids.tavadian2603 Ай бұрын

Thank you John M. and Daniel Davis for your courage to speak the truth, rather than work for the lobbyists. How can anyone use expressions like “it’s a great bargain” or “it’s a good investment” or “what does it cost us” when hundreds of thousands of people are dying ?! How immoral are these women ?!

@GreenGoblinDK Ай бұрын

That doesn't sound like the truth to me.

@jenniferlawrence2701 Ай бұрын

It's especially galling when it involves forcibly conscripted soldiers.

@shadowreaver1851 Ай бұрын

@@GreenGoblinDK You wouldn't recognize truth if it was staring you in the face. When Zelensky is helicoptered out of Ukraine and the Ukraine Army turns it's guns on the regime your still going to be telling everyone Ukraine is winning and When Russian tanks are in Kiev your still going to be saying Ukraine can still win and needs more taxpayer money!

@harshitsingh1600 Ай бұрын

Because dollars rules America baby !!!

@leyzei7745 24 күн бұрын

completely immoral

@ChathurkaMadhushan Ай бұрын

The main argument these two women had written on that piece of paper is that the money is going to the military industrial complex. 🤦🤦

@morrgash Ай бұрын

Exactly lol

@arak1973 Ай бұрын

They are corrupt and mentally sick to the core.

@michaeldodson8810 Ай бұрын

Excellent point by Dr. Mearsheimer about the 21,000 additional Americans who died in Vietnam, because we continued to fight after loss was certain. Human life is precious, regardless of citizenship. People are suffering and dying in the Ukraine War. Their families and loved ones are devastated by their losses. We ponder highly advanced, extraterrestrial civilizations visiting Earth, and we hope they are peaceful. Stop the killing.

@intelligence_123 Ай бұрын

The argument that possession of a vagina is possession of intelligence died in the first few minutes of the debate.

@yoramgt Ай бұрын

But, freedom, democracy and all that is good and decent.

@mrtopcat2 Ай бұрын

I was talking about the casualties to someone, who I always thought highly of and when I have mentioned that (at that time) likely about half a million people died already in this war, his response (to my dismay) was "but most of them were Russian". As if them and their sacrifice would somehow not count.

@Jotnar837 Ай бұрын

Let the fascist imperialists win? How'd that go in history?

@Jotnar837 Ай бұрын

Excellent, except Ukraine is vietnam in this analogy.

@mohabarts Ай бұрын

Imagine if those two ladies ruled the world what would happen. They don't care about Ukrainian youths dying every single day

@shadowreaver1851 Ай бұрын

Actually they kind of do. The Biden Administration is full of people like that. They infest every administration. The CFR which hosted this debate regularly supplies advisors to every administration and one could argue the CFR really runs our country. After all Biden is super old and not really there so who's really making the decisions? His advisors, most of whom are CFR people like these two "ladies".

@Kaizala1933 Ай бұрын

Two buffoons

@deadpelicanguy Ай бұрын

She is saying that Putin violated the Minsk agreement? What? The Minsk agreement was never implemented. And it's because the regime in Kiev ignored it and never implemented it. Nothing to do with Putin.

@seeker2118 Ай бұрын

Poroshenko the president of Ukraine at the time, Francois Hollande president of France and Angela Merkel president of Germany at the time all signatories and guarantees to the Minsk accord have openly stated, "Minsk was never meant to be implemented, It was meant to buy time for the Ukrainians to build up forces for war with Russia".

@deadpelicanguy Ай бұрын

@@seeker2118 Exactly. The woman in the video blames Putin for the Minsk failure. That is absolutely ludicrous.

@GreenGoblinDK Ай бұрын

@deadpelicanguy thank you for making stuff up!

@IliyaOsnovikov Ай бұрын

@@GreenGoblinDK Do you enjoy being on the wrong side of history?

@Reflection_N Ай бұрын

I thought I've misheard it. Thank you for confirming. So, she doesn't even know what she is talking about.

@chriswong9158 Ай бұрын

Henry Kissinger Quote: “To be an enemy of America can be dangerous, but to be a friend is fatal.” This time, it's Ukraine

@TheTeeProd Ай бұрын

Amazing. Depends what friend means also. If you're friend is a bloodsucking vampire then yes

@Rdeki Ай бұрын

All the stupid kitchen warriors comment this phare. You are a moron

@chankane Ай бұрын

Someone once tried to prove me wrong with Israel.... ha.... okay, let's see how much corruption (lobbying) can go....

@tnitty9317 Ай бұрын

If it wasn't for America, Russia would take over everything over there. Instead it'll just be Ukraine.

@user-wm5rt9pw5l Ай бұрын

Dude, Kissinger is a practicioner of political realism. One of prophets of this conception was side of this debate. You definitely not very smart.

@rezzob Ай бұрын

and we thought women would be the kind peace loving less aggressive ones

@turquoiseowl Ай бұрын

mothers

@GreenGoblinDK Ай бұрын

You don't want angry mothers defending their sons against you.

@shadowreaver1851 Ай бұрын

To be fair I think a lot of these creepy elite institutions like the CFR and WEF use women to pitch their disastrous policies. I don't think these two women represent all women in the West. But they know people tend to be more sympathetic to women are more likely to take their side. It is ironic that a military man is a proponent of peace and these two "civilian" women advocate for more war and death and destruction. There's no doubt US foreign policy has a lot of slick messaging and tries to play on your emotions. But most people see through it. I am very heartened by most of the comments. It's clear public opinion is shifting on Ukraine and US foreign policy in general. Unfortuely the governments don't care.

@venpul244 Ай бұрын

Those two ladies need to come back and watch the recording in another 3-4 years to see the what they argued and what the ground reality is.. more lives and land lost.. person with minimum common sense can foresee what is going on...

@IliyaOsnovikov Ай бұрын

You are asking for too much.

@catalincarceanu7991 Ай бұрын

Yes,but this help given to Ukraine , 90% remain in USA to benefit the US economy and US workers. I do imagine those workers as new ,modern kind of canibals,feeding their kids with human flesh and calming their thirst with human blood.

@christopheryellman533 Ай бұрын

They don't have minimum common sense.

@SegzWithTedCruz Ай бұрын

I swear if I see someone make the "good value cause its other people dying" argument I am going to throw up

@paulmitchell2916 Ай бұрын

You see this same failure to connect in a lot of debates.. One side gives reasons that we should desire or wish for something to be the case, the other side gives reasons for why something actually is the case. The yes side could have done more to preempt this line by saying "Yes, we admire Zelensky and the Ukrainians, Yes, we acknowledge their moral claim vis a vis Russia, and yes, we wish we lived in a world where such considerations could be determinative. Sadly, we don't.

@lassel1344 Ай бұрын

A neutral Ukraine would be good for all of Europe, as it was before the coup d'état in 2014 that the NATO countries financed and organized with Victoria Nuland.

@iskandera1783 Ай бұрын

Perfect example is Austria

@player276 Ай бұрын

2014 coup is Russian propaganda that has never provided any evidence. There are multiple videos on youtube of Girkin and other Russians boasting about being the sole reason war in Donbas started.

@cantacann Ай бұрын

You spewing propaganda here. Victoria Nuland funded what? Grants for Ukrainian people to study in USA universities? Or money given to cultura centers studying English? This is the level of disinformatia and Propaganda that you spew, shame on you. At least use sources that can be proven if you want to debate on this.

@bhunji1850 Ай бұрын

The American Military-industrial complex doesn't make billions and billions of Dollars in profit if the war in Ukraine doesn't happen. That's what it's all about for the US. Everyone in politics and the media knows that Russia does not wish to conquer and permanently occupy Western-Ukraine, Poland and other parts of Europe. Politicians in Washington and powerful people in the media might be stupid but they are not THAT stupid.

@martin.rodgers Ай бұрын

This is what happens when you let women make certain decisions. You get fuck all, and emotionally based outcomes that, as we know, never turn out well...

@couponnation Ай бұрын

Stop funding this mess.

@wojteks4712 Ай бұрын

It's not a messits a war of.aggresion. Lose all your credibility and see how all hell breaks lose if you give up on helping democracies...

@terjeoseberg990 28 күн бұрын

Putin is a menace.

@terjeoseberg990 28 күн бұрын

A tyrant.

@terjeoseberg990 28 күн бұрын

A terrorist.

@terjeoseberg990 28 күн бұрын

Putin is a tyrant.

@ravenkorr8167 29 күн бұрын

Hearing the closing statements I've gained a deep sense of respect to this John Mersheimer.

@ShangDaiNagaland Ай бұрын

John Meirsheimer ✅. Two Arrogant ladies ❌.

@andrekeefer2034 Ай бұрын

Two Deep State highly indoctrinated ladies.

@leyzei7745 24 күн бұрын

Colonel Davis

@DenOmaniaDK Ай бұрын

my god listening to the 2 ladies made my head hurt 😑all emotions no facts why where they even there ? i had to stop this video so many times and go outside and cool down 🤬pure incompetence from the side that wants to keep funding

@paulmitchell2916 Ай бұрын

A really cynical view would be that they know darn well Mearsheimer is right and they just don't care.

@jov7733 Ай бұрын

@@paulmitchell2916 Maybe. More likely is that they truly are ignorant, they seem very caught up in propaganda and deranged.

@4l-frankomedo853 Ай бұрын

😂😂😂I've been skipping their parts their just repeating some useless points

@jov7733 Ай бұрын

@@4l-frankomedo853 No, you have to watch it all and understand the magnitude of this problem. Where immature women start to like industrial scale artillery fire and field rabbits living in human carcasses. This is how it ends. lol

@diegobaca9453 Ай бұрын

I get you man.

@OpentoDebate Ай бұрын

Timestamps (02:36) Professor John Mearsheimer's statement against continuing funding (06:07) Ambassador Paula Dobriansky's statement for continuing funding (09:43) Retired Lieutenant Colonel Daniel Davis's Statement against continuing funding (12:43) President of the German Marshall Fund of the USA Heather Conley's Statement for continuing funding (17:45) How does morality play into the arguments? (22:24) Can Ukraine win? (27:30) Will Putin get an appetite for expansion if he gets Ukraine? (35:20) How does the Ukraine conflict relate to China's ambitions? (38:17) What is the evidence that Putin is trustworthy? (41:31) Can Ukraine go back to being neutral? (56:21) Closing statements begin

@badomen9057 Ай бұрын

This is painful to watch, the two ladies are completely clueless.

@yoramgt Ай бұрын

Not clueless. Ruthless.

@Max_Da_G Ай бұрын

They aren't ladies.

@user-up5du3mf5v Ай бұрын

But still some 🤡 are callping for them

@DukeLitoAurelius Ай бұрын

Wow, Conley and Dobriansky need to join Disney as writers where these fictitious narratives have a perfect home. The amount of gaslighting is breathtaking.

@skippys8322 Ай бұрын

Arguing against the uniblob in DC will get you cancelled. The sick logic that we need to fund war to increase shareholder value for Raytheon is perverse. 14:50

@WilhelmDrake 25 күн бұрын

The fact is that it is the West that hasn't kept its word with Russia. The Minsk Accords being a primary example.

@wanderlust0120 27 күн бұрын

How are they getting away with saying that the Russians broke the Minsk agreement 😞

@alexanderpepkin4110 6 күн бұрын

@wanderlust0120 Anything goes… who will go read the agreement and think?

@yuglesstube Ай бұрын

This isnt a debate. Its a walkover. Davis and Mearsheimer have totally demolished the other side. And the other side make some outrageous claims and prognostications.

@maximgolberg Ай бұрын

The argument about funding this conflict further is better for us is sick and ridiculous. First, it's borrowed money, at a point when the interest we pay on national debt is inching towards a trillion per quarter. Second, if you pump in money to buy more shells without expanding capacity, it merely increases the profit margin for the company owners, instead of growing jobs. Third, that money could be spent Ii n better ways at home for current needs of the tax payer. Fourth, the fact industries are making money of off a conflict where people are dying is sick. Also a neutral state between NATO and Russia is in the benefit of both, as having them border to each other increases tensions and any false alarms do not have necessary time to be examined before taking action. This war needs to stop for everyone's benefit. Russia does not look like the losing side, so negotiations is the best move at this time. It saves lives, resources, and prevents further escalation between NATO and Rusaia, which should be avoided at all costs.

@adamblack267 Ай бұрын

That is the logical solution. But these powerful people don't understand logic. They will continue to fight the Russians to the last Ukrainian.

@galileo_rs 24 күн бұрын

There are no shell to buy, Russia is producing 7x more shells than all of NATO.

@magnarkringlenervik8349 Ай бұрын

“Tell that to the Baltic states, tell that to Poland, tell that to Romania and all the other countries of Europe in this case. Sorry, they are very concerned and actually we have kind of unanimity of purpose because of the concern about the threat.” Amb. Paula J. Dobriansky responding to Daniel L. Davis laying out the impossibility of a Russian invasion of NATO. I am a Norwegian citizen living in Norway, a country that borders Russia. I am in full agreement with both Daniel L. Davis and Prof. John Mearsheimer. Paula is no spokesperson for me.

@bud1239 Ай бұрын

Also, Columbia Professor Jeffery Sachs also makes similar arguments to those of Professor Mearsheimer. I think peace negotiations need to take place but my government (the US) opposes any peace negotiations to end the war as they have an all or nothing mentality in Ukraine, which could lead to the destruction of the Ukrainian state and/or them to lose more territory. If they stop now and the lines stay as they are now, then we can do a negotiation for peace deal to end the war

@magnarkringlenervik8349 Ай бұрын

@@bud1239 I fully agree. I often watch prof. Sachs in Judge Napolitano’s podcast.

@jenniferlawrence2701 Ай бұрын

Remember when they were expanding NATO the argument they always used was that Russia and NATO countries could never fight directly because of the fear of nuclear escalation. Now they contradict that argument and say that Russia is likely to invade NATO countries. It can't be both.

@alexejv86 Ай бұрын

Going by the same logic, let me also point out you do not speak for Norway.

@sababugs1125 Ай бұрын

yeah dawg , Oslo isn't really under threat but Tartu is

@broswater9359 Ай бұрын

When your first argument is that it's okay that people die in a foreign country because it funds the Military Industrial Complex you've lost.

@arak1973 Ай бұрын

That was the only point of the two corrupt idiots.

@undercoverinsomniac5179 24 күн бұрын

They couldn’t care any less about Ukrainians. One of the ladies even mentioned how it’s not US troops that are dying, as if to say we shouldn’t care as much

@MrGolov-te5eb 28 күн бұрын

This is what evil looks like wrapped into educated quasi-intellectual women.

@solvarmsten8822 Ай бұрын

The participants in the discussion should declare if they have any conflicts of interests, for example any ties to the "defence" industry, investments or other ties.

@billhammett174 Ай бұрын

ESPECIALLY the German Marshall Fund...

@jnfunvufb Ай бұрын

@@billhammett174 German Marshall Fund is not a fund by Marshall industry of Germany. It's the US fund given to post ww2 Germany for war recovery. This kinds of fund is also given to Japan and Europe too.

@123axel123 Ай бұрын

Like your father is Ukrainian

@terjeoseberg990 28 күн бұрын

And how much they’re being paid by the Kremlin.

@terjeoseberg990 28 күн бұрын

@@jnfunvufb, “Given to Germany and Japan” ??? Shouldn’t Germany and Japan be paying for all the damage they caused?

@alvinliao09 Ай бұрын

The two ladies are no match to real scholars like Dr Mearsheimer. They just cannot figure out their own rationale.

@christopheryellman533 Ай бұрын

They couldn't think their way out of a wet paper bag.

@AlexKaehler-qc8kd Ай бұрын

His argument breaks down pretty promptly after he dismantled theirs, which he did in fact to do. Ukraine absolutely needs to negotiate, but not with Russia. That's pointless. Ukraine needs to negotiate with at least one of the nuclear states of NATO to attain a mutual defense treaty, even on a bilateral basis only, to secure what is left of Ukraine if it agrees to give up what it has lost. That can be accomplished with zero input from the Kremlin. It would also squarely put the ball back in Russia's court if it wants to continue fighting and, in effect, start a new conflict with these stakes dramatically raised

@IliyaOsnovikov Ай бұрын

They are just paid imperial propagandists.

@jamestodd8147 Ай бұрын

The 2 ladies are living in a fantasy world.

@alvinliao09 Ай бұрын

@@jamestodd8147 We call people like these ladies high school girls.

@armanshaghi Ай бұрын

Interesting debate, thank you for hosting it.

@morrgash Ай бұрын

She threw the possibility of Nato troops in Ukraine like it was nothing, scary that those kind of people are in charge, let alone the fact that most of their arguments where about the Economy of the war which is insane when people are dying!

@craiczhang 9 күн бұрын

As Chinese, I am so happy to see United States having government politicians / advisors like those two ladies who are even more influential than Mr. Mearsheimer🤣 Well done, keep going.

@andrekeefer2034 Ай бұрын

Nobody had any objections in the West when Nikita Khrushchev gifted Crimea to Ukraine in 1958.

@mingzhang4200 Ай бұрын

The two women learned all knowledge about wars from CNN

@user-ky8pj1bj9o Ай бұрын

The two ladies have made it clear in their arguments that Ukraine is fighting a proxy war on behalf of the West, which is why the US should continue to fund the war. The continued loss of Ukrainian lives is not a problem, because Ukrainians want to fight. That's an attitude that sickens Mearsheimer. The ladies did not make a serious argument as to how Ukraine can win the war with only material support while Ukraine is running out of soldiers to fight. The only way for Ukraine to win is if NATO joins the fight against Russia, except that will lead to nuclear war and no western leader will support. Mearsheimer's prediction in the closing argument is likely to pan out. More Ukrainian and Russian soldiers will die before the war ends, and Ukraine will be in a much worse position than it is now.

@reginaldpoofta5 23 күн бұрын

And the Ukrainian government officials were stupid enough to believe Nuland will save all of them. They were foolish enough to brainwash their citizens to hate on Russia and to make them want to go to war against Russians. This is going to end very badly for the Ukrainian leaders when people will realize their sons brothers and fathers died for ambitions of corrupt officials.

@alexchao1205 28 күн бұрын

that's bizarre. women supporting wars

@galileo_rs 24 күн бұрын

What's so bizarre about it, Killary Clinton and Madeleine Albright were/are unrelenting war mongers.

@dannyferguson9415 Ай бұрын

Thank you Open to Debate for showing the true motives of the CFR.

@dannyfergusson3243 Ай бұрын

nice name dude

@abrambadal8997 Ай бұрын

This was clearly going on since after 2014 or before , since 2005 when Georgia and Ukraine were invited to join NATO ! Ukraine is the bigger catastrophy as seen in Georgia and Armenia now !

@samatwood6425 Ай бұрын

“Ukraine is a laboratory right now”😧

@user-hc1el3jo9h Ай бұрын

Amazingly they're being very frank about their host industry's goals 😅

@CK-jo9im Ай бұрын

A Lab, that's what it has always been.

@11111ven Ай бұрын

Came from ladies in quite contempt fashion, they more looks like witches to me

@ebb_ Ай бұрын

Ukraine has pushed the Russian Black Sea fleet back to Georgia? 😂😂😂 OMG what’s the woman smoking?

@JamesSmith-je7vf Ай бұрын

Excellently organized debate and respectful participants.

@El_Camino_Que_Recorres_Solo Ай бұрын

The ladies, with all due respect where abhorrent, revolting, and they almost succeed in making you believe you are watching fiction.

@IliyaOsnovikov Ай бұрын

"Democratic Ukraine" - is one of those shortest jokes.

@dfsdffvdsvsdfdsfsdf Ай бұрын

Ukraine has had elections in 2019, 2014, 2010... Unlike Russia, they didn't have to kill their opponents. Most of their corruption was linked with Russia.

@GreenGoblinDK Ай бұрын

Democratic Russia is a far better joke.:

@IliyaOsnovikov Ай бұрын

@@GreenGoblinDK I've noticed that dispite your supposed Scandinavian name you are mostly acting like a typical predictable Ukrainian Troll.

@Maria_Makr Ай бұрын

If you have no presidential elections, clearly you are democracy)))

@GreenGoblinDK Ай бұрын

@@Maria_Makr Haha. Just like in Russia? That is just cute. Russia is a trashbin democracy. Stop invading Ukraine and they can have an election. Maybe you should have a look at your own "election" ?

@handlerbind1477 Ай бұрын

Because of this two women this feels like watching a Monty Python sketch.

@jov7733 Ай бұрын

They did have kind of an "onion news" feel to them. Is this shit real??

@raymondwu9483 Ай бұрын

She debates in her spare time. But seriously, I agree.

@chriswong9158 Ай бұрын

@@raymondwu9483 650,000 Ukrainians dead thanks to USA support since 2022 April/May She would think twice if her children was in the fight...

@shadowreaver1851 Ай бұрын

Ukraine is basically like that knight who had both his legs cut off and still keeps fighting. Arguing Ukraine can sill win is like waging a bet that guy who lost his limbs can still beat the other guy.

@bhunji1850 Ай бұрын

They are stereotypical career women that do not really care about anything. Of course they are all in on the Ukraine-train.

@MrR40388 Ай бұрын

America first. We don't need to be involved in this bs.

@primovid Ай бұрын

Painful to watch. I have been against the U.S. involvement in this war from the beginning

@Jotnar837 Ай бұрын

Russia will just keep pushing the boundaries of NATO if you let them. Untill you need US boots on the ground.

@watain990 20 күн бұрын

Oh, she says that Ukraine is a laboratory for the US companies to observe how their arms working on the battlefield. That some unreachable level of cynicism, I don't know how you guys in USA baring such politicians.

@user-yi1qp1ch7s Ай бұрын

Ukraine has been blaming everybody for not supporting them enough. While some people in the West agree, most others just find it shocking. It's like it's the world's fault when they can't defend themselves. When the mujahedeen fought the Russians, they just tried to make do with whatever they were given. When the Vietnamese fought the French and the Americans, they just thanked for whatever given, shut up and fought. They understood it was their business, and nobody else. The former advisor to president of Ukraine, i don't remember his name, has commented that his compatriots are arrogantly entitled and i can't agree more. Before the war, Ukrainians had 30 years to build their own nation. And what had they done with it? They elected corrupt presidents in exchange for sweet empty promises. They repeatedly threatened to stop the gas to Europe to ask for more money from Russia on top of what had been contractually agreed. Then they applied to EU because they think the West will miraculously bring wealth to them so they don't have to do anything. They applied to NATO because they think the West will miraculously protect them and they won't have to do anything. The Ukrainian mindset always seems to be "someone has to do something for us".

@anton1713 Ай бұрын

I wouldn't blame Ukrainians so much for this. They knew how to satisfy both Russia and the west. Yes, lots of corruption, but what made the situation untenable is that the west didn't want Ukraine to stay neutral. Every escalation that followed had this agenda at its core.

@cheeto8960 Ай бұрын

The country became destroyed rapidly like russia in the 1990s but didn't have a strong leader to control the oligarchs from plundering everything, until the US took control of it in 2014 made it into a client state

@shadowreaver1851 Ай бұрын

I don't blame them for advocating for their country or cause. What I find repugnant is how many people are being drafted against their will in Ukraine to fight and all those Pro Ukraine bots out there who support it. Every time I hear them talk about Ukraine fighting for freedom and democracy I think of the 30 year old Ukrainian who tried to flee the country got captured and sent to the front and is now dead. And yet I don't know any Pro Ukraine person who's moving to Ukraine to enlist to fight the Russians they just want to use the Ukrainians as cannon fodder and then pat themselves on the back and think they are morally superior because of it.

@jay-shakeli9761 Ай бұрын

You shall take into consideration the role of US, esp. CIA in the policy of Ukraine.

@abramibra3208 Ай бұрын

Dad to his son: "You can't go out now, it's dark outside and there are a lot of thugs around." Mom : "Let him go out and have fun." Dad : "No, he's not going out." Mom : "Yes, he's going out, he's my son too.

@zanebrimson7777 Ай бұрын

A model of civilized discussion. Sad it doesn’t have more views, as we can all learn from this excellent panel.

@2ez4rtzGOD Ай бұрын

Mearsheimer’s intellectually honest and objective in his assessment. The other pair can’t see through the fog of “WEST IS BEST” and have no grip on the realities. It’s just tough pointing and empty propaganda which sounds nice to rally around, but it’s uneducated nonsense. They genuinely can’t accept that the West might be responsible for provoking Russia, and that other parts of the world don’t share their worldview, so shockingly, repercussions follow. All the accusations in the world can be thrown Putin’s way, but it doesn’t matter. The strategic reality is that Ukraine’s GOING to lose this war, and stalling it to further push America’s own interests is a horrible tragedy. These fools continue to push a horrible, horrible strategy and it’ll cost many more lives. They don’t care, though - their mental gymnastics and blindness won’t ever let them see their own culpability. Truly sickening.

@christopheryellman533 Ай бұрын

Sickening. Yes, that is what Mearsheimer said, and I have never seen him say it more emphatically.

@jungleboy1 Ай бұрын

how can you convince the general public when all the media is encouraging the war to continue?

@IliyaOsnovikov Ай бұрын

Every time when they say how great is to fight Russians with no loss of American lives they have to be reminded of Ukrainian blood on their hands.

@GreenGoblinDK Ай бұрын

Can M explain what is the value of freedom and independence? How much would the US be willing to pay not to be occupied by a foreign nation?

@christopheryellman533 Ай бұрын

@@GreenGoblinDK GG, all freedoms come with responsibility, a lesson that should be learned early in life. In the case of Ukraine, Russia was willing for Ukraine to remain an intact and free nation if it agreed not to join NATO, but instead to remain neutral. There you have it: freedom in return for responsibility in strategic affairs. The United States, my country, is willing to pay a lot to support their concept of freedom. Let's see: 3 million dead in Korea, 3 million in Vietnam, 200,000 in Afghanistan, 300,000 in Iraq, 500,000 in Syria, 30,000 in Libya, perhaps 500,000 in Ukraine, 32,000 so far in Gaza. We are willing to pay with the lives of other people and the destruction of their nations. How many of those wars were successful in promoting freedom or democracy?

@08gani Ай бұрын

This is not a debate. This is a waste of time for John and the viewers. It clearly has audiences who are against John.

@alen3109 Ай бұрын

It took me almost no time to know which side has the more intellect & knowledge of the real situation of the war. The gentlemen has facts while the other side were reading from a piece of paper parroting lies that their masters wrote..😢😢😢

@Jotnar837 Ай бұрын

while he other side is parroting foreign masters

@kathirko Ай бұрын

Do those two ladies know what they are talking about ?

@BTD1000 Ай бұрын

Most of our Generals have never served in combat but Danny has to those of you that don’t think his rank was high enough.

@shadowforce345 Ай бұрын

Wow got em…. And you are??? A 5 star general? What makes you so qualified to judge that behind your screen and keyboard? Next time try to argue that guys points and if you can’t then just move along instead of trying to dunk with those weak one liners.

@bucktis9 7 күн бұрын

SHOULD STOP FUNDING ? YES THEY SHOULD! WILL THEY STOP FUNDING PROBABLY NOT!!!!!!!

@WilhelmDrake 25 күн бұрын

The rewriting of history on the pro-funding side is despicable.

@thrashertm Ай бұрын

The No side are awfully generous with other people's lives and money. They should enlist in the Ukranian army and serve at the front if they are so bold. Chickenhawks

@BloodyPandas 26 күн бұрын

Putin said "There are no historical arguments to justify the claim that a separate Ukrainian nation existed prior to the Soviet period" According to the lady, it is interprated as Ukrainian never existed as a country?

@klemen_1981 Ай бұрын

It is sad that both women talk mainly how this additional funds would help American economy and military industrial complex and at the same time forget about thousands of dead people and their families. It is such a sick argument, talking about that as an investment while people are dying because of that...

@NADARAJAH18 Ай бұрын

This ladies are warmongering

@Jotnar837 Ай бұрын

The gentlemen are enabling fascist imperialists

@pingkai 15 күн бұрын

Army General and Politics Prof: Please end the war Two old women: The war must continue. What a strange world we are in.

@allansmythe5822 Ай бұрын

19:42 is she mimicking him? they really aren't serious are they.

@jov7733 Ай бұрын

Snarky buthurt high school girls arguing in favor of continued industrial scale trench warfare. Wow, I couldn't have imagined this.

@dwl3006 Ай бұрын

She is casting a curse on him.

@bobjones-ns4bv Ай бұрын

If no-one believes a war is lost, is it still lost?

@warzy01 25 күн бұрын

Who said that men were warmonger

@user-fw2dd2cy3c Ай бұрын

I was doing something else simultaneously, and couldn't pay close attention to this. But seemed to me that the worst argument on the pro-funding side was "Ukraine is so innovative rn!" That seems true. But they're innovative because they have to be; they don't have the men or materiel to win this. And innovation is hard. I'd rather have a massive numerical advantage than be outnumbered and innovative. Innovation only goes so far, and I don't see any reason to think there'll be enough for UKR to win.

@dadEwarbucks 28 күн бұрын

Who can tell? American advisors, NGOs helping Ukrs invent. Such mixture since the Gold revolution. Aside from that rating a proxy country on innovation is pretty funny.

@bobanmarjanovicfpn Ай бұрын

What is interesting to me is that these ladies prior to the debate have probably prepared themselves from the John Mearsheimer's academic papers and studied from his work. Because he is the authority for the Great Powers politics subject.

@dougjones1074 Ай бұрын

Imagine paying for these womens "thoughts"

@billusher2265 Ай бұрын

Ukraine flag in bios are all emotion and no logic. She brings up Taiwan are 36 min. Yeah, that’s another reason NOT to pay for this, you aren’t making Taiwan more secure by losing resources and making Russia more dependent on China. The other lady also said we should approach war with a “winning mindset”. That is what we do and it is a disaster lmao. We thought we’d win all these past wars and our recent history has been failure after failure. It’s like they think making a moral argument (a pretty bizarre one given that it was the US that pushed to end Ukrainian neutrality to begin with) somehow makes up for a lack of a actual logical strategy to achieve objectives in reality.

@andytwentyman9573 Ай бұрын

Very well said. 👊 She's right that it's not good for us to be humiliated in front of the world. She doesn't seem to consider that it's for those sort of reasons we shouldn't pick fights we can't win or triple down on a losing cause. They just can't get past their hatred of Putin.

@oldi184 Ай бұрын

This debate blew my mind with the fact that two women - a gender that is supposed to be for peace and love argue for war and two men - a gender that waged wars for millennia argue for peace. Wow! It's truly incredible. Women are for war and men are for peace. Women can be as hawkish and war-loving gender as men if not more. That's truly incredible. I wonder how the world would look like if women were those who declare wars. Perhaps we would have 4 or 5 world wars instead of two.

@thrashertm Ай бұрын

whatever their sexes, the men seem to comprehend the human cost of war. the side arguing "No" just coldy analyze and spend other people's lives in futility.

@Flaakk Ай бұрын

@@thrashertm I strongly disagree. Paula and Heather are not making any kind of analysis, cold or otherwise. They're repeating State Department talking points, almost word for word, without engaging with any of their opponents' arguments. I believe they truly believe what they're saying - they care about democracy, liberal values, and the theory that American hegemony, on average, brings stability and peace to the world. They're arguing out of pure ideology, not analysis.

@shadowreaver1851 Ай бұрын

It's a beard. The Blob uses women to push their Great Reset agenda. They don't represent all women though. They just count on emotion to sway the public because they know emotion can override reason and cause people to support things they shouldn't like how Hitler used emotion to stir up German Nationalism. Notice these women didn't spend a lot of time articulating how Ukraine can win but just relied on emotion, it's a strategy to sell a war not convince you because they know if they were to try to pursued people to support Ukraine based on rational and reasonable grounds nobody would buy it because they have no reasonable argument.

@ixco4732 Ай бұрын

I just realized this after reading. This should be a model for men logic vs women emotions

@galileo_rs 24 күн бұрын

2 names: Madeleine Albright, Hillary Clinton.

@scottbuchanan9426 24 күн бұрын

I find the argument that supporting Ukraine means supporting US jobs, defence manufacturing, etc. to be a little ghoulish.

@itsaboutwhatsfair1532 Ай бұрын

Mic drop moment from mr mearsheimer 58:00 🥶🥶🔥🔥🔥 exposing their moral depravity

@mark_2 Ай бұрын

Yes and that actually exposes the foundation of the entire DC think tank military industrial complex

@NJ-wb1cz Ай бұрын

And then the two ladies continue hammering the benefits of dy ing Ukrainians to the US. Two psychopaths

@Houtont Ай бұрын

Somebody dropped a mic on his head when he was a child.

@user-hc1el3jo9h Ай бұрын

@@Houtontwhy do you enjoy looking at dead children

@scottbuchanan9426 24 күн бұрын

@@Houtont Hahahahaha....hohohoho...oh, what wit! I'm still drying the tears from my eyes!

@iehoa1982 Ай бұрын

These women are just Victoria Nuland clones lol they are so souless, is actually amusing.

@felipe-vibor Ай бұрын

To Americans it's business as usual, not the deaths, mayhem and destruction. That speaks volumes. Profits over life.

@jamesbeadenkopf5429 Ай бұрын

"Well war crimes tend to get negative press" Except when its Israel doing the war crimes...

@andreyd8116 Ай бұрын

Exactly. Then they are not the clear war crimes but concerning events that the US government want a thorough investigation to be done (by Israel, of course).

@meshzzizk Ай бұрын

1:03:46 we know from archival sources that the japanese themselves understood they could not defeat a fully mobilized US military, but they were desperate and rolled the dice at pearl harbor. nice flat out misrepresentation of history tho

@kharkanas6779 Ай бұрын

Next, they should host Putin and Biden.

@badthad7427 29 күн бұрын

More of this please 👍

@munnychinni5386 Ай бұрын

War mongers 😂😂😂

@tocreatee3585 Ай бұрын

this should be 3 hour 2 part debate.

@tonybento7199 23 күн бұрын

Ukraine actually has no need for Crimea. Crimea was a Russian gift to Ukraine with understanding that it would not become a military base for the Anglo adversaries. Both Britain and US desperately need Crimea because it would be a perfect place for our nuclear submarines.

@Weissssse Ай бұрын

She doesn’t care how many Ukes die propping up her neocon fantasy world

@psblbl Ай бұрын

It is unfortunate Professor Mearsheimer didnt have a better debate partner -- Stephen Walt or Barry Posen? -- the Lt Colonel's closing about the poker game was embarrassing ... why not the let JM close with his poignant VN "story". Would interested in where the two ladies were on the Iraq War. Also "If you believe with near 100% certainly, Putin will continue to march West, are you in favor of US/NATO boots in Ukraine? Surely we want to fight the war there and not in Poland?" Alternatively throw down a $1000 bet for where things will be in 2-3yrs ... put your money where your mouth claims "Russian cant continue the War Spend." The argument of "Ukraine war funding is great for American Jobs" was breqth taking ... and should have been called out as immoral. JM was obviously by far the only debater of class here, but it just wasnt a great debate ... perhaps because of the agreed to format? Dramatic contrast to the Munk debate a couple of yrs ago.

@psblbl Ай бұрын

Also the out-of-the blue "bootlicking paen" to American / "Democrat Party" traitor JLIEBERMAN was kinda amazing. Says something about your judgment and values.

@123axel123 Ай бұрын

I thought the poker analogy was excellent. Why didn't you like it? You have a bad hand. You can go all-in in the hope to win. The other side has a good hand and is not likely to fold. Isn't that exactly the situation?

@psblbl Ай бұрын

@@123axel123 I think it came off as frivolous ... it puts the listener in the mind of games, soldiers as chips etc.I just dont feel he had gravitas. Contrast that to JM's "28,000 names wouldnt be on that wall" ... and everyone immediately sees the Maya Lin Memorial in their mind's eye.

@shadowreaver1851 Ай бұрын

They should have had Colonel McGregor on. He would have wiped the floor with them. Can you imagine Mearsheimer and McGregor tag teaming in a debate over Ukraine. That would be way to much truth for the CFR to handle.

@shadowreaver1851 Ай бұрын

@@psblbl She forgot to mention Joe Lieberman supported the Iraq War. I'm guessing this woman supported every war and military misadventure America ever waged.

@magma3525 19 күн бұрын

I would never trust a politician over a scholar with such calibre and honesty as Prof. John Mearsheimer.

@Paulusmus Ай бұрын

Daniel will be proven wrong...I believe his opinion is not purely his and his finances should bw investigated.

@galileo_rs 24 күн бұрын

When the truth hurts your feelings you scream Russian puppet. How typical.

@eliasgetaneh1760 Ай бұрын

This is what I love about America. Open debate and exchange of ideas.

@shadowreaver1851 Ай бұрын

It's nice. Too bad the US Government never debates foreign policy, they just make decisions and inform us afterward.

@jov7733 Ай бұрын

1:04:55. She thinks the mobilized men are "choosing" that outcome? Oh dear, that is a profoundly problematic frame of mind.

@stephensuddick1896 Ай бұрын

They already did, to their everlasting shame.

@jerrymann646 Ай бұрын

End this disgraceful spectacle.

@quetzalcube Ай бұрын

Mearsheimer, the master of the room. What remarkable patience Mearsheimer has, patiently listening to these woamns spouting nonsense and ignoring the hard facts and logic of his arguments. At 52:16, it's priceless to see him shake his head.

@Jotnar837 Ай бұрын

i've heard no such thing. Just a russian apologist

@rattleeric Ай бұрын

GOOD people are courageous people who speak the truth. WICKED people are cowardly people who go along with the lies.

@bangthingneng9433 Ай бұрын

This is where the danger lies. Little did the world knew how injudicious & morally ignominious when a country at war ( Ukraine) was actually a pawn for jobs creations & supports the US economic. That's ignoble. Clearly, as quoted by embasador Paula that proudly said " US is only supply aid & not fighting " in Ukraine war & 68 billions of aids represent a meagre less than 4% of the total US defence budget & not even a high price & it supports over 90% of American workers & factories , economic growth especially in jobs creations. This is very dangerous & little did Ukrainian knew they may be pawned for Economic developments in US. This would also tell the world that the war that may happen in Indo Pacific regions may actually driven by the same objectives ( Economic developements in US ) . In another words, some countries in the Pacific region may contrue that they would also be a pawn for that purposes. Wow ! Congratulation on countries that would be pawned for scarification in US economic ritual . Also, the longer the war , the larger the war, means the better it is as it can support even greater & longer economic growth in US. Didn't that also means pawn the American life as well. That is not sustainable as it is more of a self deception/ignifatuus. This is no different to say that, if one is in a bad shape, one will become robbers & robbing all over. Similarly what had happened during covid shutdown in which groups of youth attacking the high end shops & rampaging & looting. The culture of easy ways out. Ukraine war clearly shows no way Ukraine could achieve triumphant but only to sustain US economic needs & the possibility that the needs would be prolong or extended in indo pacific region. For Ukraine, most probably, applying or subcribed to the principle of ' plodder ' , slow & steady & hard work may achieve its goal. How long would it be then ?. For better world Disclaimer - For the purpose of academic, debate & enlightenment only.