I bought my own modem, then got service with AT&T. I told them I don't need their rental modem since I have my own. They said ok. 2 years later when I switched service, they charged me $120 fee for not returning "their modem". I didn't pay it.

Bought a modem when I started service from Wave. I paid about $100 to avoid a $10/mo rental fee. after about 18 months we moved out of Wave coverage area so I sold the modem for $60. Better, faster modem than the rental, used my own high-end wireless router and ended up saving about $140. Pretty much a no-brainer.

Ive had a modem for qbout 10 years and it still works just fine, i saved myself around 900 dollars

It's interesting how internet connections differ between the US/Canada and the UK. In the UK, most ISPs rely on the infrastructure of one company. Most ISPs will also give you a free router/modem/Wireless AP combo box. But should you wish to set up your own kit (eg. shove an Edgerouter in) then you can get a modem to handle the DSL connection from anywhere and just plug it in. Draytek ones are recommended, but you can buy the official model that the infrastructure company (Openreach) give out for as little as £15

Thank you for delivering great knowledge in concise and interesting ways! I always come for one answer to a question and leave with more information than I was initially seeking!

why would you rent a MODEM?

A few years ago, I bought my own DOCICS 3.0 cable modem and a high end Netgear wireless AC dual band router w/ 1000MBS Ethernet. I am not sure what the rental fee for the modem from Time Warner/ Spectrim was, but more than 8, lets say $10. So in 10 months I got my money back, and now am saving that fee. Also another benefit that Linus did not mention is that you never know who had the Modem before you, did they take care of it? Or did they smoke around it, drop it, throw it, have bugs in the house who made the Modem their home, etc???

They rent modems?

*Buy it because they over-price the rent shite!*

My last modem and router cost about $60 each and lasted for about 5 years. Comcast charges $10 a month so we've probably saved around $500. This year we got a shiny new modem / router for $80 each and it's been great. 32 channels does help. Before you buy your own stuff, it's important to know what speeds your ISP is giving you for your package. Comcast tried to call us a few times claiming we needed to upgrade our modem (despite the fact that our plan was not above it's max download speed at the time.) Also, keep receipts as proof that you do in fact own your own equipment. I've never had an issue, but other people claim Comcast charged them rental fees when they owned their own router / modem.

Biggest issue with a non-rented modem is some companies will ALWAYS try to blame it for connection issues. Took months to actually get a tech who knew what he was doing (identified that wiring causing the line to pick up interference from a radio station) and then finally send a tech to fix it.

updates to your video from an actual Docsis Engineer who has worked on hundreds of ISP's networks throughout the US and Canada. 1) Typically the modems they offer/support come down to cost (how expensive is it for me to obtain these), can i get support for them (small isp's wont care but big isp's like to be able to get vendor support when needed and big isp's will only allow modems that they can actually get firmware updates for as THEY have to push it to your modem. You can't update your modems own firmware ), extra features, and are they actually good modems (some modems have lots of security vulnerabilities or just simply aren't as good as they might be 3rd party or something). 2) Modem router combo's aren't bad. For example the standard combo box offered by Comcast is amazing. You cant buy it as its offered only to Comcast.. so in turn the vendor has customer firmware specifically for them making it operate better than your average modem that's open to the market. its dual channel and supports 802.11ac and lots of other stuff. It will be cheaper in the long run to own your own though.. 3) Linux, your info on 3.1 is wrong. Docsis 3.1 is 10 gigs down and about 1.5 gigs up.. FULL DUPLEX docsis is 10gigs down and 10gigs up(nobody is planning to go full docsis so dont get your hopes up. The big isp's are already in process of moving away from cable modems.) there are many isp's that support 3.1 and are currently using it. Comcast for example already pushes docsis3.1 in their markets. 3.0 is not very good for gigabit speed.. its one of those best case scenario type of situations. in order for you to get 1 gig on 3.0 you literally have to use over 50% of all 32 downstream channels (if your isp even has 32 channels).. not including what bandwidth other customers are using. SO 3.1 is actually way better for gigabit speed.. as it uses an OFDM channel. So if your isp has 3.1 and you want speeds faster than id say 500 megs.. id highly recommend a 3.1 modem if supported. 4) finally, (and not sure if that was a joke or not but) Comcast does not suck. there are isps' in the united states who still have a single T1 line for their connection to the rest of the world.. so their hundred of so customers.. have to share that 1.5 megs of traffic.. There are ISP's who have congestion issues that can easily be fixed and simply wont and have known about it for years. There are ISP's who get hit by DOS attacks on a weekly basis because they wont secure their network. And after having worked with Comcast all i can say is.. NICE! They definatley know what their doing.

My internet provider gave me the modem for free. I just pay for the internet, the modem is either included in the internet price or it's free.

Ok Google, what my wifi password?

I'd recommend buying your own router/modem without a doubt. The stuff your ISP gives you is crap, and you can probably get faster WiFi by buying your own awesome router!

My ISP (Shaw) offered a deal where the cable (w/router incorporated) modem rental fee ($5) is waived. In other words, it's already built into the price, which by the way increases b a couple of bucks twice a year or so. Before I had my own router and purchased the modem (from them). That was several years ago. The router started to malfunction and was due for a change. The modem upgrade was required so to access the higher tier speeds available.

If 40 mb/s is slow by today's standards, I must be living in the stone age with my 10 mb/s down.

Me: oh a new tech KZfaqr Also Me: oh wait it’s Linus

Linus looks very young

Time Warner had a featured where you can connect to various public Wi-Fi around town if you install their app on your phone. I thought this was awesome. Then I looked at the map to see where these Wi-Fi routers were. Many of them were in residential areas. Turns out if you use their provided modem, not only do you pay a monthly fee on your bill for the equipment, but you also are providing Wi-Fi to mobile devices connecting to your router via the app. I immediately returned their equipment and purchased my own. My signal coverage is so much better now.

since two years in Germany there is the so called "routerfreiheit" (routerfreedom) meaning the isp's can't force you to use their crappy modem and have to make sure that every normal router is supported.

I bought my own modem after getting tired Spectrum was charging me a "rental" fee. I grabbed a name brand modem from their list of compatible ones. They decided to double my speed for free and I was not getting that said speed. I call and they gave me the line, "Sir, it is your modem." Wow. Oldest support trick in the book. They offered me a free modem, so I took it and sure enough it was fine. How ironic that they told me which model to buy and then stopped supporting it when they double my speed. Come on Google Fiber. Please get to my neighborhood so I can end my misery with Spectrum.

Interesting video. The ISP, I use provided a modem router combo as part of the service. I am not complaining. (:

Here in the US, Verizon have this ONT Modem installed in your house since they use fiber optic cable and on that ONT there is a Ethernet port. You can call customer service to remotely switch on the Ethernet port and basically you can use any WiFi router via Ethernet instead of cable. That what I did with mine and I never have any problem since. But I do have an distaste of their ethics of throttling firefighter's internet and being one of two only ISP around my area.....

Hey, It would be cool to do a follow up video: "Should you rent your Router?" FiOS, for instance, likes to rent you your router, and benefits of buying one are obvious, but the drawbacks are a little different. If you have FiOS TV, the STBs need to talk to the FiOS Router via MoCA, for instance. So you still need their router in the chain, but could get a used one, or a MoCA->Ethernet adapter. Could be a neat TQ in the future.

Remember -if you do buy your own modem and use Xfinity,keep the receipt till the end of time. i had a modem that they kept charging me for and I could not prove it was mine,so i returned it to them(not even theirs) just to save the fee. i had only paid 5 bucks for it used and it full well could have been theirs originally.

I like the little chuckle your staff gave right before the sponsor pitch. 😂😂

I am a big fan of LTT and this is a very good video that pretty much hits everything on the nose. I work for a major ISP, and the trend of personally owned equipment has become a lot more prevalent which I absolutely support. There is one small factor though that I personally feel was overlooked. Your ISP will not support your personal equipment, and what I mean by that is that if something goes wrong with it you cannot call your ISP for help. This is something that was overlooked not just in the video but by the FAST majority of consumers that use third party equipment. They will call in explaining their wifi is slow, or their range is poor, or that devices are not staying connected. All I can respond with is: well, the signal levels into your home look good and you have personal equipment, call your OEM. It is not just the hurdle of installing said equipment, it is peoples lack of knowledge of their equipment including a lot of time good solid support from the manufacturer that is a problem. I understand this might seem like a small point to a lot of people here, the answers are simple! Learn about the equipment, take the time to figure out how to configure it properly and make sure you understand the limits of wifi - what will cause interference, location, best steering and channel frequencies for your home. That is something that 90% of consumers don't care to do, and will huff and puff about having to call their OEM for further assistance with. For a lot of non tech savvy users, they can install but not any further. Whether that be by lack of want or caring to. If you've made it this far I appreciate you reading my opinion on this, and again it is simply that. I wanted to put forward something i feel is oft overlooked, and to add to the conversation. Feel free to join in on constructive talks about this issue :]

I'm a cable guy.... ALWAYS buy your own.

The best $200 I've ever spent was buying my own Modem and Router. Haven't had to do a reset since.

I just moved and got back to GCI here in Alaska. Came from MTA where we got 40Mbit/s down on a good day, we averaged 20Mbit/s though. Now with GCI, we get a full 1000Mbit/s speed. It's amazing. Keep up the good work Linus. I love the content.

Renting has the advantage that the modem has a rolling warranty for the duration of your contract and the ISP will replace/update it when it fails, or if a non-patchable security vulnerability is discovered. Also because you are renting the hardware required to utilise a service, you can withhold payment for both if either the hardware or service fails and is not repaired within a billing cycle. This is why ISPs generally prioritise rental customers because of the potential loss of two revenue streams.

You guys are doing seriously venerable job and doing it very passionate. I wanna thank you all for making us conscious.

You should do a video on using a gateway/combo vs a separate modem and router. Personally I'm skeptical that there is a reason to spend more on getting dedicated devices vs a gateway if you aren't going to tinker and use those more advanced features, especially if, like me, you prefer having devices hardwired whenever possible.

Can you please create a video about setting custom fan curves? I am very confused about them, and am not sure what to set my fan curves on my PC to.

I worked a short time for Global Callcenter Solutions in the Comcast division. I was amazed by how many people had no idea you could buy your own router and save the 8$ a month. Most of them were incredibly happen to find out that buy their own is basically the same as using the rental. I actually used the very same device page from Xfinity in this video.

"ADSL is less common" - except in Australia of course. >< :)

I bought my cable modem. Of course, before you buy the modem, do your research and buy the modem they say is compatible with their service.

A note about DOCSIS 3.1: My ISP will not allow DOCSIS 3.0 modems on their 500Mbps or 1Gbps plans. This may not be the case with most ISPs, but it's something to check on when upgrading service. We were required to rent/purchase a DOCSIS 3.1 modem when we upgraded to 1Gbps.

Well We rent the modem from the ISP. It's pretty cheap (5€) and their routers happen to break once in a while. Basicly we would have to pay nearly 2 years to pay as much as for the regular modem. Allready broke once and it gets replaced directly without question.

Uhm.. I didn't know you can rent modems

*Just use ur Neighbor's Wifi*

I could hear the dial up sounds from Linus's head thinking up the segway.

Thanks so much for this info. I'm not a techie but so far I understand what you're saying!!

Question to the folks outside of Germany/Austria: Are AVM Fritzboxes a thing in your country? In our hemisphere they are pretty much standard when it comes to modems. Nearly every WiFi network in Germany is called FRITZ!Box XXXX. Even if you have never heard of AVM or Fritzbox, is there a "standard" modem type or brand present in your area like in our case?

even if you own it, you don't control the firmware.

here in the netherlands its not even common to get your own modem there are also like no modems you can buy in stores and isp do not give login information or anything

Very Informative. Thank You For Making This InfoVideo.

Now, it's just "included" in the monthly fee. No choice. Thanks Spectrum! I don't know better.

As a cable guy, I loved this video right up until the end when my company got throw under the bus... thanks! It's fine though, the things people hate about the company are above my pay grade and I CAN fix the stuff that's my responsibility. One thing to mention though the rental fees also include replacing defective units. If its slower than usual we swap it for a new one!

Here in Mexico, when you pay a plan, you don't have to rent the modem, you only pay for the service but when you cut the service plan the ISP's asks for their modem or box.

I love your segues into the ads

Pls...dont say that 40mbit are slow...i life in germany...

"Inevitable Rebrand" 😂

And i wish other youtubers were as smooth at promos as you 😂

Here in the Netherlands it is common practice amongst virtually all provider to supply the modem at no additional cost. Even when you cancel your contract you get to keep it.

The cables going to my house only support 40Mb/s 😢

3:27 that's why many modems have MAC Clone ;)

Long stupid story. My ISP (AT&T) made us buy the modem when we got aDSL several years ago. No non-AT&T modems were allowed. A couple of years ago we had connectivity issues - which historically have always been due to the line outside the house being broken or interfered with - and the tech they sent over replaced our paid for modem with a new one to "fix" the problem, which then was a $7 a month rental. The problem persisted. Eventually after an actual repair (which once again was dealt with outside the house) I plugged our old modem back in and it worked fine. I called AT&T and told them I didn't want to use the rented one, I wanted to go back to the old one. The customer "service" person said sorry, when the old modem got taken away we can't track it down to bring back. I told them, it wasn't taken away and I'm actually using it RIGHT NOW. I was told to bring the new one to the local UPS store where it will be sent back in bulk (they also sent a postage paid label to put on,which UPS didn't want). Yet for MONTHS we were continueally charged the rental fee. I FINALLY got a customer service tech who knew what to do, and we even got credited back for the months of rental fees for the product we weren't using and didn't have, which actually covered our monthly bill for like 2 1/2 months. When we tried to upgrade our speed we were told we'd need a new modem, so we declined. We have relatively slow speed but it works fine for us. Wish it was cheaper though.

I would love a video about how can you play game that are still downloading on some plataforms like origin. Love your vids!

Oh how I long for the day that my rental fee was “only” $8.00.

Most isps in the uk give you the modem for free not as rent

As a Spectrum technician, there are a couple or few things I will mention. In the Kentucky area, we use a few manufacturers. Ubee, Motorola, Technicolor, and Hitron. For Wifi, it's Sagemcom. DOCSIS 3.0 modems are used for all speeds type up to 400M. However, the way our service is built, if you want 1Gig, the only modems that are approved to work are our own DOCSIS 3.1 modems. Some of our modems do have 32 channels or 24 channels. However, they do not support up to a Gig. Why? No idea. Could be something to do with the way everything works. Spectrum provides the cable modem for free (yes, it vastly differs from one provider to the next) and the only thing that costs extra is the router. I highly do not recommend renting your own modem for a number of reasons. 1. We run trouble calls for modems that are approved, constantly. This is namely due to the customer setting everything up themselves and us only making sure the speeds work. But down the line, these modems can easily cause time out errors and sync errors. When a service provider provides a piece of equipment for free, it's for a good reason. 2. If your technician arrives and wants to install a modem and router combo, just ask for a separate solution. 3. Do not complain about your speeds if you bought your own equipment. We can guarantee our wired speeds. NEVER WiFi because every single house is different in the devices, wall material and size of the house.

With many isp in Australia a modem is included with your internet plan, or for an extra fee if you pay month to month. With my isp, for a cable connection they provide a modem and you can *only* use that modem so you can't upgrade even if you want to

Should buy it ...nuff said.

Spread this to those who don't knoe that you can buy one.

(IT admin guy here) When i talk to people about THIS particular topic i will ALWAYS recommend that they buy a modem that follows compatability recomendations and demonstrations here, but only dose the modem part of the network traffic and no switching or wifi services. Then get teh wifi switch that they want and has the features they want. This allows for better network control and security as your moden is not holding any control over your wiifi network and most "nice" wifi switches and setup a passthrough VPN ip. I didn't even have to setup my modem i just hooked it up to my coax for Comcast and they remotly set it up for me in 5 min, this is usefully and also scary because it mean your cable company can make any changes on your modem at any time and make it unavailable to you reguardless of if your renting it or not. I use Wifi in my house for between device communications not just internet so comcast doing updates on my device without informing me (which they will do updates and restart/temp disable your modem WITHOUT notice) could interupt in house device communications, especially as the internet of things trend gains momentum and infrastructure.

You need a DOSCIS 3.1 modem for 1000 Mbit/s. It may have a theoretical limit of 10 Gbit/s but still is needed for 1 Gbit/s. So if you are thinking about purchasing your own modem for 1 Gbit/s make sure you purchase a modem fast enough for your carrier since each carrier handles the channels differently

My ISP actually let me buy a modem from them and they set it up for me, it was at a fair price, and it has paid for itself already.

My ISP rented me a Fritz!Box. Not gonna pay those 200€ upfront

could you make a video explaining what to look/know about buying routers/modems

In Switzerland, they usually give you for free use (it is still their property), and usually after two years, you do not even have to give them back if you change provider. But, it is true that usually, what they give you is not the top product. But it is plug'n'play. And it does its job (4 LAN ports, WifI ac standard, covers 100m2 appartement/house easily. It is part of their marketing costs. If they want to retain a customer, they need to offer good service and good device. I am paying 29SFr/month for a 100Mb connection. The Swiss franc is about the same as the US dollar.

I spent around $9 to buy my modem and I have a consistent 100mbps with reasonably good range, I don't see any benefit in renting a modem

In the Netherlands you just get it for free.. xD And a pretty good one with wifi AC build in lol.

I work for an ISP and we charge $3/m for standard and $5/m for wireless. We use docsis 3.1 and offer Gbps using OFDM. Soon to be 10Gb in a few months.

FTTP here and use a 64bit atom box running Sophos UTM9 as a router to our network supplied NTD. Works MUCH MUCH better and more stable than any ISP supplied underpowered rubbish box. Have only ever once rented a modem and regretted, never again. I now supply all my own gear though we've LONG outlived an AIO crapball (freebsd router, cisco poe 24p switch, QNAP etc etc etc all in the rack in the corner.

Isps rent modems because they have a monopoly. The ones they give you are weak old and expensive

That is why I got a nice used Motorola stand alone (modem only) one for my network for $20 over a year ago, and it still works great. Yes I checked to see if it would work first. I have a nice Asus router for my wifi, and a nice Netgear switch for LAN. You have to get the ID number of the modem before they will turn on the internet.

Quite American/Canadian look. For finland, ADSL is still quite common, as all houses are not hooked to a fiber optic based cable. For those, usually housing complex has a central hub that is wired by normal LAN cable to each apartment, and all you need is a router that hooks to LAN slot, in layman's terms. ISP's are also very unresteictive and older hardware gives lower speeds, but 100/50 is most common thing to see and very old stuff can provide that over a LAN connection. ADSL is still in old places 20/2 max, and common limit of all DSL is the nowadays meager 2mbit upload, but some providers use latest DSL technologies to deliver even 100/2 mbit over (A)DSL which is very good for copper and phone line based tech. Cable had a brief life and ended, but was a thing for some time. I seen a lot of cable modems thrown away, and likely bad options, price or other things kept most consumers off of it. Third, VERY common thing sold especially to people with lack of options in ADSL hooked apartment is 4G Modems, that provide really fast and depending on area and amount of use, speedy connections with ease of simcard and only your home's LAN and wif needing setup. Common is that usually anything you have, should work. ISP's also rarely rent, and rather sell you a router or modem of kind you need, in monthly bill that is usually combined to your internet bill, but once paid up, you're paid up, and a common router or modem can be given to someone else to use, if you find yourself moving away or changing the internet type you use. ADSL at least, is not dead in world scale, but it has more or disappeared from the states and Canada, for sure.

Bruh you lots isps are weird in comparison to EU and the UK

I literally never heard of rental Modems

Im am 100x more grateful that ur finally making videos for us poor and not as tech savvy!!! I finally feel like im learning something not just wishing i knew what u were saying!

for Spectrum (Charter) in the U.S. they don't support customer owned modems and give you one of theirs. but they say they don't charge for the modem, although it's probably just included in the internet pricing. worked for them years back when they stopped supporting customer modems and they at least told customers they would offer one for free to those who needed it.

Based on the number of months I’m on leave, I decide whether it is worth to buy a new modem or just rent it. I carry my last apartments modem with me in the new apartment so I really don’t have to worry about buying or renting a new one.

Always buy if your tech savvy, but if you suck just lease it lol

DOCSIS will always be limited by the number of 6 MHz channels available on the wire. Upstream is 0-50 MHz and downstream is 50-1000 MHz. That means maximum 8 upstream channels, so it's impossible for upstream to ever be higher than about 460 Mbps in the future. On the downstream side there are more channels, but those have to be shared with television. One 6 Mhz channel can carry one analog SD channel, about 6 digital SD channels, or 2 digital HD channels (or 3 for craptastic providers like Comcast who overcompress the video). Bottom line, don't expect DOCSIS to get much faster than it already is now. The technology is just about hitting the maximum speeds attainable by its underlying transport, similar to the way modems maxed out at 56 Kbps. Buy the DOCSIS 3.0 modem and use it until the inevitable switch to fiber.

The other thing to note about buying a modem is that some ISPs often don't troubleshoot network issues. This was more common 10 years ago, but if the internet went down and you're not renting their modem, the ISP often replied "It's probably the modem that you have on your network that isn't ours."

u ddnt take ur shirt off... :,v

_I simply rent the modem because the ones I’ve bought never really work even if they are compatible. Then, simply use it as a modem and use my own router._

In the UK the main Cable operator provides a modem/router as part of your package (If you end your contract, they will ask that you return all network equipment or they may charge you). It is actually in their terms and conditions that you are NOT allowed to plug in your own device into the cable socket. I say Modem/Router because the user does have the option to either use it as a Wireless router, or turn it into Modem only mode and then they can plug in their own Router connecting it to the "Modem". A side not in relation to this video, this provider is currently upgrading his network to 3.1 with an aim to upgrade 15 million premises from 3.0 to 3.1 by 2021 (even though they top offering will only be 1000Mbps). The reason for the upgrade is that though the theoretical speed of 3.01 is 1000 apparently the current 500+ package is already starting to the strain Docsis 3.0... Also 3.1 doesn't support 10Gbps up and down as Linus says, the upload is between 1 and 2 Gbps, you would need to be looking at full duplex 3.1 also known as dosciss 4.0 Currently this provider uses an HFC (Hybrid Fibre Coax) connection but they are upgrading slowly to as true FTTP There are now more company provided cable this can range from FTTH/FTTP or FTTC each will have their own rules on what you can connect. Generally though you wont "lease" the network equipment it would just form part of your original agreement.

Our modem rental was $20 a month. It also failed about once a month and had to drive 15 miles to the nearest xfinity store to get another one. I went out and bought a $200 one and has been running for 4 years now. Saving money not only on the monthly bill but in the gas I would use getting a new stupid box every month.

*WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOF*

LOL acting like 40 megabits per second is slow, my house literally gets .5 megabits download and upload speed

american ISPs really go in raw on their customers. here in UK you can get 80mbps down 20mbps up for £25 a month. about £19 is line rental which goes to bt for "maintaining and upgrading" fiber/copper network and £6 is for 80/20 internet. also you get a free modem and router (or a combo), free weekend and evening calls, and line installation is free.

In my area, the isp changed the multiplexing technology used multiple times in the last years, rendering a bought modem useless. I get the modem/router combo free from the isp, which uses gfast and g.dmt with vdsl2 at time moment. It also would not be easy to find a modem supporting these technologies on the free market (feel free to proof me wrong).

Rent is the worst thing you can possibly do in anything. In the long run you will always spend a lot a lot a lot more money than you would've spend upfront. Yes, yes, yes not everyone can afford it upfront. And in you're really in such a case that you really can't do anything about that and you have to rent, then yes, rent. Otherwise never ever rent anything.

Only running a 2 Mbps connection here, Crying everyday :(

I always rented them in case there was issues, I could get them switched out for newer versions. However my latest modem from Comcast only has 2 Ethernet outputs, so I'll likely be buying from now on.

Is not as easy as just buying the highest channel count modem.. There are other things to consider.. If you buy something not supported you may end up with only 1 or 2 channels working.. While the rest is unable to allocate the right frequency.. Modulation is something that ISP check on the recommended modems before they put it on their list. Most common supported brands are Arris and Sagemcom..

Did not know you could rent