SideWinder Force Feedback Pro

SideWinder Force Feedback Pro - 26 Years Later

Рет қаралды 277,507

Күн бұрын

Revisiting the 1997 Microsoft SideWinder Force Feedback Pro joystick for PC! This started off as simple FFB stick nostalgia, showing off a few Windows 95 games, annnd ended up going down rabbit holes on gameport adapters, DirectX, patent trolls, and the quiet demise/resurrection of force feedback flight sticks.
● LGR links:
/ lazygamereviews
/ lazygamereviews
/ lazygamereviews
● Links to related videos and projects:
What's Inside the SideWinder FFB Pro Joystick
• What's Inside the Micr...
What Happened to Force Feedback Flight Sticks
• What happened to Force...
‪@RedKiteRender‬ where the above footage originally came from:
/ @redkiterender
Necroware Gameport to USB Adapter
github.com/necroware/gameport...
FFB-Vert
www.iowajohnsons.com/FFBVert/F...
VP Force Rhino FFB
forum.dcs.world/topic/246873-...
00:00 Introduction to SideWinder FFB
03:05 Unboxing a 1999 SideWinder FFB Pro
05:51 Different than rumble/haptics
08:42 Installation and setup process
10:06 Control Panel forces testing
14:16 Urban Assault
17:50 Combat Flight Simulator
20:55 MechWarrior 3
23:42 Star Wars Episode 1 Racer
26:49 Game port to USB adapters, Force Feedback 2
28:41 Why aren't force feedback joysticks made anymore?
31:01 The legacy of force feedback sticks, conclusions
#LGR #retro #computer #flight #simulator

Пікірлер: 1 600

@LGR Жыл бұрын

And yes, you can cover up the hand sensor to let the stick move freely around on its own at full force! Here's a demonstration of that with Episode 1 Racer on the FFB2 that just arrived: twitter.com/lazygamereviews/status/1682444490009726984

@bshoke Жыл бұрын

microsoft included an adapter on the precision pro for USB I don't know if they had it with the force feedback versions

@LGR Жыл бұрын

Unfortunately, that particular adapter is _only_ designed for the non-FFB sticks like the Precision Pro. Hence the need for custom microcontroller projects today :)

@bshoke Жыл бұрын

@@LGR that is a bit of a bummer one of these days I’m going to get my FFB version going because I had always wanted FFB but when they were current but costs kept it out of reach I got the non FFB version and it was a great stick well into my university years.

@dercncplaner Жыл бұрын

we need a modern one today

@PeTTs0n88 Жыл бұрын

@@LGR Oooh please post a little update if you ever manage to get your hands on a USB adapter for this thing, that'd be really awesome! (Like the USB4VC project you covered on Blerbs - I'm really glad you did because that's such a freaking amazing thing to have and I'm glad I got one!)

@Renzsu Жыл бұрын

Microsoft really owes us a reissue or new version of this joystick. What are they doing releasing such a kick-ass flightsim and NOT have a stick like this on the market!

@DeinonychusCowboy Жыл бұрын

What are they doing? Making more weird mice designs no one likes, looks like. 😅

@arnox4554 Жыл бұрын

"What are they doing" That's a question you could ask Microsoft about a LOT of their damn products these days. Microsoft quality has gone to shit now, ever since the release of Windows 10.

@DJKr15py Жыл бұрын

@@arnox4554*Windows 8. Windows 10 while still flawed is markedly better than 8.

@todesziege Жыл бұрын

Microsoft have been treating PC gaming as the red headed stepchild ever since the XBox came along.

@CTyler84 Жыл бұрын

It boggles the mind. The new Flightsim release downright emptied all the stores of all flightsticks! And pushed the prices up for all that was left, like that warthog stick. You'd think that was the ideal time to produce and release their own superior ForceFeedback stick and dominate the market... but I guess not. What a massive missed opportunity. Maybe they learned something for Microsoft Flight Simulator 2024, but I'm not optimistic.

@TufteMotorsport Жыл бұрын

Clint is just like a vendor at late 90s mall. He doesn't force a sale on you, he is just enjoying himself talking about all the products and making good vibes so you may enjoy the product too. I have subbed to LGR 6 years now, and man.. the vibe is still real!

@Toonrick12 6 ай бұрын

Considering he has done a full on cosplay as a CompUSA employee for Halloween once, he really does fit the vibe.

@deuswulf6193 Жыл бұрын

Kind of crazy how we have moved backwards in terms of peripheral features like this. I have a Novint Falcon laying around somewhere, a shame that never ended up going anywhere. Feeling the gravity of objects in HL2 was amazing.

@greggv8 Жыл бұрын

IMHO the NES gamepad was the first giant leap backward in game controls. When I first saw one in a store circa 1985 I was thinking "Where's the joystick? How am I supposed to play games with *that*?" I figured that little, hard edged rectangle would be the worst, most uncomfortable thing to use, and when I first got hands on one, I was right. Did Nintendo ever have anyone with, y'know, *hands*, test that gamepad?

@MrWolfSnack Жыл бұрын

@@greggv8 The big problem I have with the original NES controller is that the ends are tiny hard sharp points, and its so small that it hurts to hold it. What's funny is that knockoff companies that make the plug and play Nintendo ripoff junk, they add a joystick to the controller themselves, lol

@adsilcott Жыл бұрын

I agree. A few years back I decided to buy a HOTAS and I was sad to find that they don't really do force feedback anymore. I bought a nice one but always felt like something was missing, and it made me wish I had kept my sidewinder...

@deuswulf6193 Жыл бұрын

@@greggv8 In their defense, they were building off their hand held "Game & Watch" products. You can see the familiarity in Japan's version of the NES (Fanicom). I could be wrong, but the first time we saw the D pad used by nintendo was with the 1982 Donkey Kong handheld. They were probably inspired by earlier designs seen with some of the handheld pac-man toys that came out around 1981. A joystick with a handheld probably wouldn't have worked very well. To their credit an arcade like joystick was released at some point, but it was more of an optional accessory.

@jubuttib Жыл бұрын

@@greggv8 I still maintain that for a lot of things a D-pad is superior to either analog or digital sticks, be their full size, arcade size or thumbsize. But the one on the NES was hard on your thumbs, certainly. I still remember the calluses I got from them. I actually had (and still do) the NES Advantage stick, but I still felt like many games were better to play using a D-pad.

@AstraLee-Investigator_Sapling- Жыл бұрын

I have a precision pro sidewinder that I still use for basically every joystick game. It’s just really nicely made and works in everything. If you open up a sidewinder, the bottom plate has the names and signatures of all the people at MS who worked on the project molded into the plastic.

@1ochotnik Жыл бұрын

same. Precision Pro is quite robust

@flightsimdeskuk Жыл бұрын

I have 3 of them. Just to have spares!

@malcontender6319 Жыл бұрын

Back when Microsoft wasn't entirely evil and took pride in their products.

@cameroncovington5705 11 ай бұрын

Same here, and I love mine. I'll have to open it up and look I never knew that.

@TechRyze 11 ай бұрын

@@malcontender6319 MS was WAY more evil in the 90s. Great joystick, though.

@RJmakes69 Жыл бұрын

No matter what’s going on, you always gotta make time for LGR.

@MicheleBohmke Жыл бұрын

I had one of those back in the day and played a lot of descent 1 and 2 with it.

@musicaldude9429 Жыл бұрын

true, i might be late for work but, come on boss , its LGR ,get over it

@SlurpTheFoxHole Жыл бұрын

Always.

@TheRealNerdTyler Жыл бұрын

Every time

@thrasher3222 Жыл бұрын

Never miss it!

@urabraskthedeplorable725 Жыл бұрын

Urban Assault was one of the first "real" games I ever played as a kid. Seeing it run again more than 20 years later is a trip.

@underhandedrichard2896 Жыл бұрын

that was always a great game to throw down on. Especially on IGZ

@mattcaldwell4727 Жыл бұрын

I loved that game, played it, modded it, made my own scenarios, etc. The community recoded the entire thing from scratch, its free and called OpenUA (UA:Source) that plays perfectly on modern OS/hardware. It is only one of two or three games I ever had with force feedback compatibility which might be part of why I played it so much.

@stevethepocket Жыл бұрын

My dad used to work for a military contractor that made, among other things, flight simulators for the US Air Force. And his team was involved in programming the force feedback on the throttles and yokes to be accurate enough to train pilots for the real thing. Wild to think that he probably helped lay the groundwork for stuff like this.

@cultureshock5000 Жыл бұрын

microsoft flight sim x?

@stevethepocket Жыл бұрын

@@cultureshock5000 No, like, actual physical flight simulator pods. The kind that completely enclose you in a replica cockpit with real working gauges and stuff.

@T0asty- Жыл бұрын

That's pretty awesome.

@casedistorted Жыл бұрын

sucks someone patented this sh and now we don't get force feedback in any modern flight sticks.

@Jorendo Жыл бұрын

@@casedistorted Got a source for that? Can't find that anywhere, what I do see is that the market is just to small to have it as a viable thing in Joysticks. It would increase the price of the joysticks as is and it is already hard to market them to the crowd other then the die hard flightsim fans.

@R2debo_ Жыл бұрын

Force feedback in one of the most valuable features of a helicopter flight stick. I own 2 sidewinders, one modified and one not. The ability to feel and witness progressive trim, instantaneous trim, feel the vibrations of a stalling warbird, feel the resistance of a sticks elevator movements after taking off due to the wind hitting the ailerons is just amazing. Feeling the flight stick shake when you fire the machine guns in a Fokker DR.1 is really cool too. Force feedback that is in my opinion as valuable as head tracking and I will never understand why it's not a more common feature. It makes modern jets feel boring in comparison cause of their fly by wire design. There's not much purpose for it in modern jets except for maybe a stick shaker or vibration when shooting guns. After looking at the inside of the microsoft force feedback 2, it really shouldn't be as expensive of a feature as some believe it would be. Just a few reliable small motors and a few gears is enough to do the job.

@georgetazberik6834 Жыл бұрын

"I will never understand why it's not a more common feature." Patent trolls.

@magfal Жыл бұрын

@@georgetazberik6834almost always the correct answer to that question

@turbomanmechachrist Жыл бұрын

@@georgetazberik6834 It's more about being directed at a very niche market.

@sluxi Жыл бұрын

@@georgetazberik6834 Except it isn't really that. LGR did a good job explaining that all the sticks that were made years ago licensed those patents and the FFB wheels currently on the market also license Immersion patents. The patents also get fewer and fewer as time goes by and they expire. More of a lack of a viable market. (and the last attempts like the G940 were apparently quite flawed)

@soundscape3065 Жыл бұрын

As someone who does car sim stuff (simracing, trucking, etc), I find it a bit mind blowing how ffb is a pretty niche thing for flight simmers when it's pretty much a solved thing for driving games.

@shoopusdawhoopus Жыл бұрын

This thing made Battlezone 2 come alive for me as a kid. Using the throttle as an actual throttle for vehicles was the most immersive thing i may have ever done, only surpassed by VR's honeymoon period.

@user2C47 Жыл бұрын

@@wza223-fo3mc Looks like it's already run out in the few hours since you posted.

@celebratelife865 Жыл бұрын

I just wanted to say that you have always done a really great job at writing the script for your content. It comes across as very linear, engaging, and leaves me wanting more. Keep up the great work. 🎉

@LGR Жыл бұрын

Thank you!

@Play-On7 Жыл бұрын

1997 feels like such a magical year.

@todesziege Жыл бұрын

Truly the golden age of PC gaming.

@BurtSampson Жыл бұрын

nothing special. might have been the first year i smoked weed. that or 96. if that's the case, i guess it's kind of special then

@canaconn2388 Жыл бұрын

@@BurtSampson you probably missed out while you were high.

@jackieAZ 11 ай бұрын

In terms of gaming it really was Quake 2, goldeneye 64, castlevania SotN, fallout, postal, star fox 64, carmageddon, mortal Kombat 4, doom 64, Turok Dino hunter, tomb raider 2, yoshi story

@zodwraith5745 11 ай бұрын

If I had to pin down one year it's probably 1997 where it became "cool" to own a PC and prices were rapidly dropping where you were 2k minimum to get into a PC just the year before and it was around or under 1k by the end of 97. PC gaming started being taken seriously by developers and we saw a massive influx of cutting edge games in that era.

@Wulfex Жыл бұрын

There's an optical sensor on the front that detects if you're holding the joystick that kicks the force feedback on and off. You can hold your finger over it and it'll kick without you holding it.

@DarthVader-mx9rm Жыл бұрын

yep my FFB 2 stick has one as well though i had to clean it as it was keeping the stick stuck on

@NotFerrari Жыл бұрын

probably a security feature, which is awesome, considering the strength of FFB 😅

@CarletonTorpin Жыл бұрын

That feature was always my favorite. It felt like a magical, living thing whenever i got close enough to it.

@MosoKaiser Жыл бұрын

@@NotFerrariThe sensor's main purpose is most likely just to prevent unnecessary wear on the FFB motors, as some people no doubt would have kept the stick hooked up for extended periods of time, and without such sensor mechanism the motors would have been running the entire time it's plugged in.

@straightpipediesel Жыл бұрын

@@MosoKaiser Actually it was because the force feedback is based on closed-loop control to make the feeling more accurate. The tuning of the control loops had to account for the damping effect of the user's hand gripping the stick. Without this added damping, they would oscillate. You can see this if you block the sensor with tape and giving the stick a light nudge with your finger, it will chatter and visibly shake.

@mybike1100 Жыл бұрын

I remember getting one of these for Christmas as a kid and it absolutely blowing my mind when I started up MechWarrior 3 with this joystick. Feeling every step, weapon fire and damage taken made me feel like a real mech pilot.

@messagedeleted1922 Жыл бұрын

Yes these things were excellent with the mechwarrior series.

@fonesrphunny7242 Жыл бұрын

Did anyone actually get good with using any joystick in a Mechwarrior game? No matter how much I played MW3 or 4, I found accurate aiming while moving nearly impossible.

@mybike1100 Жыл бұрын

@fonesrphunny7242 I beat mw3 and pirate's moon on medium mode a couple times with the joystick. I never got into mw4 too much. I got really good at torso twisting and using the view hat to aim accurately.

@d.r.1402 Жыл бұрын

@@fonesrphunny7242 I did, but online games, you were at a disadvantage.

@headcrab4090 Жыл бұрын

@@d.r.1402 Same thing with Combat Flight Simulator.

@AdavenXT Жыл бұрын

I only had a Precision Pro, not a force feedback model. It was still a great stick, but eventually wore out since it didn't have the optical internals the Force Feedback had. One day, I took it apart to see if I could fix its centering issue. I couldn't, but I was pleasantly surprised to see the signatures of the dev team on the inside in raised plastic. I thought it was really neat that they had taken the time and effort to include that in the mold knowing few people would ever see it.

@bubu5908 7 ай бұрын

The Precision Pro doesn't have potentiometers, but an optical sensor. I have multiple units, and they still work like on day one.

@mikieswart 2 ай бұрын

“opts over pots” as me grandaddy used to say

@thetaleteller4692 Жыл бұрын

I have fond memory of my Sidewinder playing countless hours of Wing Commander. Being able to twist the stick for role maneuvers was just great.

@polymatt Жыл бұрын

This video makes me so happy. I actually had one back in the day and remember playing MechWarrior - it was absolutely unreal. One of those moments when you felt that this was truly a leap in technology. Awesome video!

@LGR Жыл бұрын

Thanks Matt, glad you enjoyed! MechWarrior with this is truly game-changing

@elliott959 Жыл бұрын

I still love my USB sidewinder precision 2 (no force feedback) for older games (x-wing, mechwarrior, etc). It's new enough to work with a modern OS, and old enough to work with most games without any drivers or software or anything super weird.

@wicky615 Жыл бұрын

Urban assault is such an underrated hidden gem of a game

@DeetexSeraphine Жыл бұрын

Niche community with an OpenSource package, still kicking around

@javkiller Жыл бұрын

It was a very unique post apocalypse scenario. Almost felt a little bit like Mospeada by way of an RTS.

@fridaycaliforniaa236 Жыл бұрын

I like it even more than Incoming, even if Incoming had better visuals 🥰

@thetombuck 11 ай бұрын

Such a brilliant game. I always loved the detail in the world building. Only draws backs are the crappy ending and the bs cheating ai common to many RTS of the time

@DeetexSeraphine 11 ай бұрын

@thetombuck common misconception: the AI did not actually cheat. Unlike the player it only ever has one pool of energy, can not teleport, and is as much beholden to Line of Sight / Fog of War as thr player is.

@Jezee213 Жыл бұрын

Still holds up 26 years later, love this stick!

@malcontender6319 Жыл бұрын

This is *the* joystick. First 50 kill round in an F-18 Hornet in BF2 on Kubra dam. It was transcendent. Not to mention the mechwarrior games, because it was king there too.

@messagedeleted1922 Жыл бұрын

Yes I remember feeling rather meh about mechwarrior 2 until I played it with the joystick.

@Stephen-OldBadGamer Жыл бұрын

God dammit. It was you!!! I just upgraded to a GeForce 3 and was "trying" to go ham in an LAV. Dam you.

@whosle Жыл бұрын

Torso twist

@ChucksSEADnDEAD 10 ай бұрын

Thanks for the reminder that I need to get back to BF2hub lol

@lurchilurch5507 Жыл бұрын

I had the second version with the USB plug, which was also a bit more stylish IMO. Pretty epic piece of hardware, I found it recently and it still works!

@MrAusshir Жыл бұрын

This video was a lot more detailed than I expected. Props for going into all the simulator community stuff at the end of the video!

@Damien_N Жыл бұрын

This is the biggest channel I’ve ever seen talk about Urban Assault. That was easily one of my favourite games as a kid. Very ambitious, and something I’d love to see done again.

@ozzyp97 Жыл бұрын

About 8 years back I found a perfectly nice FFB2 for 15€ in a local game store of all places. It's been an excellent and reliable stick ever since, and playing older games with proper support is just awesome. Certainly one of the best things to ever bear a Microsoft badge.

@CakePrincessCelestia Жыл бұрын

I'm using one for over 20 years and I fly a lot. That thing is probably the most reliable and rugged thing I will ever have bought in my entire life.

@gruzzob Жыл бұрын

I found mine in a thrift shop about 15 years back for 20 bucks with no power cable (luckily it takes a standard figure 8 plug), thought it was bad for a while until I discovered the hand sensor on the stick xD.

@T3hBeowulf Жыл бұрын

Oh my goodness, this! 😁 @LGR, this is still, hands down, my favorite control device of all time. When I was a kid, this was featured in Popular Science Magazine and I read the article to my Mom with giddy excitement. It wasn't available at the time and I had no idea if I'd ever get to experience it, especially because of the cost. To my delightful surprise, my parents bought one for me for Christmas and it was every bit as awesome in person as I'd imagined from reading the article. Point of note: The "first" version had a fan in that spot that ramped up after some time. The motors in the first version were so strong that in a perfect storm of effect transitions, could cause wrist strain / injury. The second revision is what you have where the motor size was scaled down, negating the need for a fan. My joystick is of the "first version" variety and yes, when it bucks, you feel the slam forcefully in your wrist, arm and shoulder. But, I still love it to this day. Thank you for featuring this!

@Finnisher_DAD Жыл бұрын

Oh okay that explains it then, I had the version with the fan too and yeah I kept the feedback strength quite low!

@nathankelley9760 Жыл бұрын

You definitely earned your paycheck with this project! 😂 I’m 10 years older, an IT Director and Technology Teacher at a private school. 80’s and 90’s were a great time to grow up and I enjoy your videos! I have a vintage collection and share it with the kids at school.

@darksideofpixels955 Жыл бұрын

oooh what memories you brought back! I remember when my dad took that joystick and started playing "Combat Flight Simulator". I was by his side as he played the game and I remember the first time I tried to use it. I was shocked and amused by the force feedback, really intense and immersive. You really made me smile like a kid. Thanks for this great video!

@MrRikrdorm Жыл бұрын

I remember having the SideWinder Force Feedback wheel and playing tons of Midtown Madness 2 and Monster Truck Madness. That thing blew my 9 year old mind when the wheel felt like the one in my parents car.

@dickdastardly4801 Жыл бұрын

I used the USB version with Crimson Skies and Comanche 4. Good times😁

@5dstrix Жыл бұрын

Your parents must have had a really tiny car. Did they use a gokart?

@Clos93 Жыл бұрын

@@5dstrixhe meant the feeling when turning it. Most cheap wheels at the time were literally just a analog stick shaped like a racing wheel.

@BoloH. Жыл бұрын

Oh yes, got one as a birthday present, Monster Truck Madness was awesome. Still have the wheel!

@MrRikrdorm Жыл бұрын

@5dstrix before the Sidewinder I had a cheap wheel that moved the car like crazy just by touching it. But the sidewinder made it feel like I was moving the wheel of a real car (or at least me as a kid thought so)

@retropuffer2986 Жыл бұрын

Loved those joysticks back in the day for the various Star Wars flight sims. Being able to use those little buttons on top on the stick for your ships other functions was awesome.

@edwinedgerly2438 11 ай бұрын

I love this joystick! My favorite fact is that if you pop the housing open, the bottom plate has the signatures of the entire design team. I always figured they knew anyone cracking open the hardware would have a greater appreciation of the design team that made it.

@simonrockstream Жыл бұрын

thank you for making such super chill and good vibe videos, thank you. you make incredible stuff, you're insanely smart and knowledgeable AND you're super funny! Keep being you, you're worth a lot

@LGR Жыл бұрын

That’s very kind, thank you!

@ClassicGameSessions Жыл бұрын

This was the boss joystick at the time. Awesome! 🕹

@CakePrincessCelestia Жыл бұрын

The successor still is... ^^

@Wulfex Жыл бұрын

My childhood! And it comes with one of my favorite games, Urban Assault! There's an open-source rebuild of the game that allows you to run it on modern hardware, if anyone is interested.

@J.Rambo1022 Жыл бұрын

Where is it? Urban assault is awesome.

@fridaycaliforniaa236 Жыл бұрын

@@J.Rambo1022 Same, I need it

@furrymessiah Жыл бұрын

I can't help but think you and I crossed paths in our youth, Clint. I spent many an afternoon at that same Comp USA store, and at the Software Etc (and the Babbages next door) at Hanes Mall. And when the Best Buy opened, that place was like paradise to my young insatiable gamer gremlin self. Heck, I even used to frequent the video game booths they had at the old Cooks Flea Market.

@thrasher3222 Жыл бұрын

Greetings. I had both the Sidewinder and FF2 back in the day and wore them both out! Great sticks and I loved the force feedback. The new PS5 controllers implement force feedback in the triggers, which is cool, but nothing really does it quite as well as the OG Microsoft joysticks. I bet if they brought them back for XBox & PC they'd sell a lot more XBoxes and a ton of Joysticks!! Great video, thanks Clint!!

@Redhotsmasher Жыл бұрын

I'm still wondering why they chose to implement force feedback in the triggers instead of the sticks, would've made much more sense IMO.

@xpd13 Жыл бұрын

I am so glad you covered this. I used to have this stick and adored it. It still is the golden standard to me after all these years

@RippPryde Жыл бұрын

Always happy to see any Mechwarrior game in a video!

@Dragomir90 Жыл бұрын

Seeing urban assault so many years later is like an explosion of nostalgia. I remember feeling when a new vehicle is unlocked, and you quickly running to test it out :) Fantastic game, and so pity that no more games like it not released :(

@NikkiNicoleXD Жыл бұрын

This is so cool! Thanks for sharing this. I've always heard about the SideWinders, but never seen them in motion.

@mirage809 Жыл бұрын

Holy. The force feedback on that thing is something special. You basically need to bolt it to the table with how much of a kick it can give. The way the force feedback works is very clever and very similar to how the haptic feedback works in modern controllers. The PlayStation 5 controller in particular shows the haptic motors as a sound device to your computer. Games can control the motors by sending sound through them. (And yes, with a little tweaking you can use them as a sound device and feel the music.) Very similar to how this SideWinder controller uses MIDI to control the motors. These force feedback devices don't translate to video well. You really need to try one yourself to really experience what these things are like. Find a local arcade that still has some 90s Sega racing games for the best experience. They went mad with the force feedback on those.

@takkyu82 Жыл бұрын

I had the Digital Sound System 80, they were amazing speakers. Then Klipsch made the ProMedia 2.1 set, and I never looked for anything else. Sometimes miss those old MS DSS 80 speakers though.

@dagglock7615 Жыл бұрын

I just bought one of these and I'm glad that you had a video on it. Just downloaded the CD. Great Video!!!

@psycomatrix Жыл бұрын

I had both the model 1 and 2. Both wore out and, as you said, became kind of obsolete since times went ahead without support for the niche of FF. Was one of the best experiences I ever had. I too remember the in-store show case and the, more or less the same, test provided in the sidewinder software. Brought me back to the good old time this video did. Thx Clint! Excellent as always!

@PieceOfPieSoftware Жыл бұрын

I remember my fascination with Force Feedback when the family first got some kind of driving wheel back in the day. Playing it with Need For Speed: Hot Pursuit (I think), where it would rumble when you drove over a wooden bridge, was the coolest thing ever. Always nice seeing this nostalgic stuff, especially running on hardware of the time.

@fozzy20 Жыл бұрын

Ah man, i had one of these back in the day. Playing Eurofighter 2000. What a game and what a joystick. I forgot that existed

@therexbellator 11 ай бұрын

Thank you Clint for covering this peripheral. You brought back a lot of good memories from this era. This joystick was phenomenal and I had as much fun with its force feedback features as you did in the video (I loved messing around with that control panel). I still can't wrap my head around how some parts of the gaming hardware industry have regressed in the last 20 years. The late 90s/early 00s were a fruitful time of awesome peripherals and devices (You should do the Microsoft Strategic Commander controller next). Even audio peripherals came in all shapes and sizes and we had THX quality quadraphonic sound with games that supported them, nowadays everything's compressed to stereo or some simulated 7.1 audio that adds a lot of fuzzy reverb. It stinks! Hoping someday these patent trolls eff off so that the industry can fill that niche again.

@fen4554 Жыл бұрын

Always wanted to see this thing in action, thanks.

@richardgmale2913 Жыл бұрын

I loved using force feedback with Viper Racing - it was the best way of working out when you would spin out of control.

@stenic2 Жыл бұрын

Viper racing was very cool

@ChrisLincoln Жыл бұрын

I had Urban Assault as a kid! I really loved that short burst of FPS/RTS hybrid games we got, like Battlezone and Uprising.

@Carboxylated 11 ай бұрын

i had so much fun watching the pod racing sequence, full TILT! I remember my babysitter's dad having this in his study with MechWarrior 3 and I remember it being very realistic as a wee lad. Epic video! One of my favorites from you.

@NooNaN926 Жыл бұрын

Big time memory unlocked with those Microsoft speakers. I had that set. It was great from memory. I've reacquired a ton of my old gear but never would have remembered those without seeing that ad. Great video as always!

@Serpream Жыл бұрын

I got the Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 still in the attic in original box (very good condition). I still hold hope everyday that someone will make a driver for GoG games that supported feedback.

@D.J._S Жыл бұрын

Windows 10/11 has a driver for it built in. It just plugs in, and works. At worse you might have to go into Devices and Printers, and detect it then configure it. You can even find the original software online, and it works.

@Serpream Жыл бұрын

@@D.J._S hmm been trying on and off with no luck. Will try again next time in attic.

@LGR Жыл бұрын

Indeed, it works with modern Windows with no additional drivers or software needed. Tested with Episode 1 Racer GOG version with great results! twitter.com/lazygamereviews/status/1682444490009726984

@samijoukainen8289 Жыл бұрын

I have tested this with USB adapter that didn't work on win10.

@Zierlerpin Жыл бұрын

I still use (and currently have set up on my desk) my Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 (green light/grey trigger variant). It's great for space games, and the force feedback still works with War Thunder - great for sensing the torque on old biplanes!

@inceptional 2 ай бұрын

It's utterly bonkers that we're decades later and I don't think there's a modern console controller out there with as satisfying force feedback as this. :-o

@alkestos 11 ай бұрын

I love me some before sleep, relaxing and chill LGR experience. Thank you for all of these.

@stevendykes1006 Жыл бұрын

I had this exact joystick growing up, came with the i76 and mdk bundle. Good times. I think my dad still has it in storage.

@aintnomeaning Жыл бұрын

Dude I remember on the rare times I got to go to Greensboro from Kernersville as a kid I always begged to go to that compUSA. Stuff like this joystick were way out of my budget 😭

@justandardprocedure Жыл бұрын

Cool to see another local

@psbelljr 11 ай бұрын

Thanks for the trip down memory lane. CompUSA in Greensboro, Combat Flight Simulator, MechWarrior3... I love it!

@LGR 11 ай бұрын

You bet!

@fixitman2174 Жыл бұрын

I still have one of these that I bought brand-new back in the 90's. I wore out most of the buttons, rebuilt it, and put it away. Thanks for bringing back some fond memories. Also- thanks for the closeup of the power brick. I forgot which of the dozens I have went with it.

@flowperformance3223 Жыл бұрын

I had the non-force feedback version. It was fantastic. Spent many hours enjoying X-Wing vs. Tie Fighter using this

@Norweeg Жыл бұрын

I owned the Logitech Wingman Force. It was a behemoth but it was also very well made and was a blast for games.

@heliflyer7 Жыл бұрын

Thanks for the shout out on: "What's Inside the SideWinder FFB Pro Joystick"! @Adequate Creative gave me the heads up.

@LGR Жыл бұрын

Certainly, thanks for posting it!

@nickf3242 Жыл бұрын

My favorite of the in-store demo was the helicopter starting. I can still feel the phantom swirling motion. Thanks for bringing back that memory. I always loved fore-feedback. I always thought that it was the future way before all this VR/AR.

@lschmitt Жыл бұрын

I used to dream about it back in the day, to fly with FS98 and FS2000 "as real as it gets". But back then, it was kind impossible to find one where I live, and if I could find one, I'm sure I couldn't afford to have one.

@martinbcooper Жыл бұрын

I saved my pocket money forever and bought one of these badboys back in 97 when I was 14. IT WAS AMAZING! MS Flight Sim and Interstate 76 were about the only games I had that worked, but they rocked.

@frizfryy Жыл бұрын

My brother got that speaker setup as a gift and it was actually quite potent it sounded really good had punchy bass. Sadly after quite a few years of service it just stopped working correctly and he threw it out I wish he would have saved it. I have this exact joystick in my collection and I was really happy to see a video made on it thank you Clint.

@nevadahamaker7149 Жыл бұрын

I have a Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 joystick and I recently pulled it out to try with Flight Simulator 2020. Although FS2020 doesn't have a built-in profile for it, and it doesn't support force feedback effects, once you configure the inputs the Sidewinder works quite well as a general purpose joystick. I love the even resistance that it provides which is unmatched by any spring-based joystick.

@CakePrincessCelestia Жыл бұрын

MSFS need FFB support so badly... ever other important sim still supports it today.

@seattime4075 Жыл бұрын

Third party software is available for this. I have a FF stick from VPForce.

@GeekSHO Жыл бұрын

I picked one up in high school while I worked at a CompUSA. My heart aches thinking of the same question, "why are they gone?!" It brings an incredible level of immersion. My favorites were Mechwarrior 4 Mercs and Descent Freespace. It would be incredible for something modern like Elite Dangerous, Star Citizen, or even No Mans Sky.

@DoctorNemmo Жыл бұрын

Mouse gaming took its place.

@SnakebitSTI 11 ай бұрын

@@DoctorNemmoExpensive flight sticks for flight sims never went away. And force feedback is significant for simulating flying.

@javkiller Жыл бұрын

Man the absolute joy upon using this. I was HUGE into Urban Assault back then I would've loved to play it with this thing!

@GameplayandTalk Жыл бұрын

It's really cool to see this in action! Years back a co-worker gave me two of these--the one that you are using here with Gameport, and the follow-up USB version (Force Feedback 2). I still have them but have yet to bother getting them set up. Been on a retro PC kick recently so I may just have to finally try them out!

@wettuga2762 Жыл бұрын

I have the Sidewinder Force Feedback Wheel USB and it's a force to be reckoned with! I never had the Force Feedback Joystick but it's never too late to try out a piece of history, I'll keep an eye on local online markets for the USB version 🙂

@SF2K01 Жыл бұрын

I had this one and remember the feeling while using it was unbelievable. It replaced a very basic joystick we had before and honestly no other joystick was as much of a pleasure to use, especially for various flight sims. Definitely used this with max settings for the resistance often and when I'd crash the grip would forcibly go back and forth. Don't recall it breaking so much as not being compatible with the newer machines I replaced my older computer with.

@Malthus Жыл бұрын

Yeah I think I just put mine on the street at some point because software was no longer being written for it to work with any later games/Operating systems...still have found memories playing F22-raptor with it(without FFB mind you).

@Malthus Жыл бұрын

Funny that Mr LGR was having compatibility issues with the software because I remember after getting the darn thing to work: "Well I'm never doing this again" 😆 Great joystick but terrible software support as windows 95-98 were plagued with addressing issues...plug and play back then wasn't quite "plug and play". 😆

@volvo09 Жыл бұрын

Seems like force feedback would be a requirement for a good flight sim experience. Just like a driving game without force feedback, it just doesn't feel right.

@SF2K01 Жыл бұрын

@@volvo09 There's definitely something significant lost when I play more modern flight games like Chorus with just a mouse. Playing Wing Commander or Tie-Fighter with a flight stick just feels more real.

@kirbyclements 11 ай бұрын

love your channel! Thank you!

@BigHilm Жыл бұрын

Always wanted one of these back in the day! Now I have 2! 😊

@DarthVader-mx9rm Жыл бұрын

I managed to find a Sidewinder Force Feedback 2 at a thriftstore recently. Not in the box but the stick was in great shape. Plugged it in and despite its age it works great with windows 11. Think its going to be a nice stick for ace combat

@-Bill. Жыл бұрын

It's got great motion too, you can rotate the stick too, about 10 degrees each way - it allows for spinning - that's a neat trick 😅

@StonerDodongo Жыл бұрын

do an aileron roll!

@btizef2008 Жыл бұрын

Wow. Middle wallop caught me off guard there! I used to live that way as a kid as my dad was in the army there. Nice video, I had one of the later usb Microsoft models and loved it!

@zentran2690 Жыл бұрын

Partially because of you I went and purchased 4 sidwinder force feedbacks two pros and two FFB 2's. I had been thinking about them for awhile but this really sold me.

@dstrbd223 11 ай бұрын

I miss the CompUSA in Greensboro, over by Four Seasons mall. I’m from Asheboro originally.

@Idelacio Жыл бұрын

Still got mine (Sidewinder 2 specifically), those motors are insane! Real workout to using one of these. :D My main issue is that the stick itself is, eh, tacky plastic. Still, one of the best feedback sticks of all time for it's power alone. Playing IL2 was a heck of a lot easier when you can 'feel' the plan starting to stall or get a bit rough in flight for whatever reason.

@SnaxOnSnaxOnSnaxOnSnaxOnSnax Жыл бұрын

Thanks for never ending content. Your channel will always scratch my itch for old school tech, also saving me hundred is not thousands on not buying all pre 90's tech I come across, i just come and search and usually find what fills the void.

@standardnerd9840 Жыл бұрын

I had a set of DSS-80's and only got rid of them a few years back. GREAT speakers! The subwoofer made a great foot warmer. We also had the Game Voice and this joystick. My brother-in-law is STILL using the DSS-80s and still has his game voice and joystick in working order. The AWE64 was a royal PITA sound card!

@GreyWolfLeaderTW Жыл бұрын

You gotta love how fast the entire gaming industry adopted haptic force feedback as soon as people saw how simple it is and yet how immersive it made Star Fox 64.

@blanchfor Жыл бұрын

1997 was 26 years ago??? God I feel old, I miss the 90s, best decade of 20th century and better than anything the 21st century has offered so far

@hotwheels9754 Жыл бұрын

I’m 26 Help me xD

@theblackwidower 11 ай бұрын

The 90s didn't have Half-Life 2 or advanced AIDS treatments that meant the illness wasn't a death sentence, or total access to the collective knowledge of all humanity in my pocket. So how is the 90s better? "Nostalgia is heroin for old people." - Dara O Briain

@funghazi 11 ай бұрын

@@theblackwidowerYes, but the 90s had Wing Commander games, checkmate.

@theblackwidower 11 ай бұрын

@@funghazi The 2010s had Elite Dangerous. UNO!

@isodoublet 7 ай бұрын

@@theblackwidower Yeah but on the other hand it was actually possible for young people to afford homes, people weren't all at each other's throats, and there weren't a handful of corporations in complete control of all discourse in the name of maximally packing advertisements into everyone's brains. Technologically we improved, but socially we regressed and by a lot. It's not a hard point to grasp, so stop playing dumb.

@markmuir7338 Жыл бұрын

You've revitalize my interest in making a custom flight stick for realistic flight controls for MS FlightSim / X-plane. I love the way the Sidewinder Pro can change the center position - essential for flight!

@DJAtomic5 Жыл бұрын

Watching you load up Microsoft Combat flight sim with the sidewinder gave me a sense of nostalgia because I remember growing up playing that game all the time and how much I miss those times!

@nartkoc Жыл бұрын

hi.. your videos are therapy for me.. thank you so much..

@scottcol23 Жыл бұрын

Now you need to do the FFB-2 USB! Keep up the great work Clint.

@Fazeshyft 10 ай бұрын

YES! I'm thrilled that you've finally given these gems a look. The joystick was always a treat, and Urban Assault is a forgotten gem from my formative years when this exact package was an unexpected Christmas gift. Is there any possibility you'd review Urban Assault more in depth for a future video? If so, there's an open source port of it for modern systems.

@TheMadAfrican1 Жыл бұрын

I remember seeing Clint find this on Thrifts! Great to see him checking it out at last.

@jamesotty484 Жыл бұрын

I've got a sidewinder 2 and it is great used to be into flight simulator and things but recently haven't had any real reason to pull out the stick. But from this video you gave me some ideas!

@FirebirdDude 10 ай бұрын

Thanks for doing a video on the Rolls-Royce of joysticks! I picked up one at a flea market but never got it to work. A normal Sidewinder was always my go to stick. Gotta love Microsoft!!

@Filipcreate Жыл бұрын

Clint, I love your videos. They are so nostalgic and comfy ❤ Damn, I remember all those SideWinder ads in the trial versions of different Microsoft Games. Those were the golden times for accessories like this. Nowadays people just use mouse and keyboard or gamepads.

@rubyvolt Жыл бұрын

the blinking cursor on the black transition page....love it.

@TB-9K Жыл бұрын

Great vid! Well done! Please dona review on all the other popular (and perhaps not so popular) gameport-joysticks in the future. I'd live to see them lined up and compared. The Thrustmaster range alone was interesting back in the day with its FCS, WCS and RCS devices. I have heard that the Sidewinder FFB2 is a sought-after device for helo pilots in the DCS community, as it allows proper trimming of the helicopter.

@DaBoaringDragon Жыл бұрын

Oh man, this takes me back. I remember seeing this and similar joysticks in my local Electronics Boutique. Always wanted one, even though I didn’t play any games compatible with them. They were just big and they looked cool lol. Thanks for the nostalgic whiplash!

@zt7119 Жыл бұрын

Hey, I’m a latecomer and I love your videos, and I appreciate the fact that you don’t f(screw) around with your jokes while keeping it (relatively) classy.

@davecSFD Жыл бұрын

I still have mine. Played DOOM, Jane's ATF (Advanced Tactical Fighters), and Mechwarrior 2 and 3 with it. I still remember the calibration you had to do when starting DOOM every time. I got it at CompUSA in White Plains, NY. The hours my father spent on tech support for Jetfighter 3 trying to get the Sound Blaster card to work with the game. God bless his soul. He never got it working so he got me Jane's ATF instead. Ended up being a really good decision. I learned so much about flying and military aerospace from that (very realistic for it's time) game. Back in the day a sound card (no on-board sound existed) could fail to function correctly with your software and actually cause it to crash. So even if you didn't want sound you still couldn't play the game. I remember my dad trying every combo of DMA and IRQ thinkable. And he was a Information Systems Director at a fortune 500 company.