Thank you! Glad you liked it :)

I hope the Republic of China(=taiwan) government will recapture the mainland china and unify it again. It is too bad that the territory of the liberal and powerful democratic government of the Republic of China is such a small island. If China were a democratic government, it would not have fought the United States like this now.

2:36 claiming that the communists worked with the KMT to fend off the Japanese invasion is rather bold. Looks more like the CPC did virtually nothing to fight the Japanese, while the KMT took the brunt of Japanese attacks. What the CPC did, was taking territory in the North in '45 after it was emptied by the Japanese after they had nearly crushed the KMT in the south the previous year. You think that counts as "cooperation"?

​@@katrinoy1 the population of china have a much stronger approval rating of their government than almost any country on earth. Simple reality is that there isnt such a thing as democracy under capitalism. Even if you have the ability to vote. Your interests are constantly being subverted by the influence of capital. Still a dictatorship. Just a class dictatorship

​@@katrinoy1 The Mainland _is_ democratic. It's the United States being the aggressor wtf.

I believe the event that stopped the Remnants of the Francoists Coup is called the Carnation Revolution right? Where the Military backed Carlos and prevented Spain from falling back to Francoist Dictatorship or worse, Civil War and finally succeeding their transition to a Democracy.

A slight difference being Lee Teng Hui, a Taiwan native, was appointed as sort of a compromise with the Taiwanese people, rather than a restoration of a monarch who happened to not be a tyrant. He was about the most nativist (as opposed to Mainland Chinese) KMT candidate ever. He would also win the first democratic election, partly because he was in the "middle". Also, the "old guard" in the KMT wasn't anti-democratic purely because they wanted to enforce some ideologies either. There was a strong divide and violent conflict between Taiwanese natives and Mainlanders who retreated from the mainland with the KMT. They being Chinese nationalists, wanted to remain "Chinese", and being a minority in Taiwan, they knew the natives would turn the state towards to one with an independent identity with democratization. Seeing Lee as too nativist, they splintered off and form their own parties. Which would split votes with the KMT, leading to DPP getting the presidency in 2000

If I recall, didn't Franco put in motion the idea of a constitutional monarchy upon his death? So he was succeeded by King Carlos I but Carlos was obligated to bring in a democratic government as part of his return to power?

@@cyqry A constitutional monarchy doesn't have to be Democratic. It just has to be bound by a constitution.

​@@jerm70Not to add that they were also scared of a republican "revolution" if some forms of democracy weren't introduced. Secret polls taken by Suarez's government at the time showed that after 40 years of right wing dictatorship, which toppled a democratic republic, republican sentiment was high and a majority

Wow, what amazingly kind words. Thank you so much. So glad you appreciate the democracy angle, and so glad to have you along!!

I hope the Republic of China(=taiwan) government will recapture the mainland china and unify it again. It is too bad that the territory of the liberal and powerful democratic government of the Republic of China is such a small island. If China were a democratic government, it would not have fought the United States like this now.

@@badofi liberal and neoliberal economics is what lead to the expansion of the middle class and growth of prosperity across the developed and developing world, and neoliberal politics is what prevents populists eroding our civil rights like in Poland and Hungary

​@@katrinoy1I think personally, taiwan can never recapturebthe mainland. But, we can always support this new thriving democracy. Dont lose hope because they cant recapture the mainland, understand how bad the PRC killed modern china and how taiwan reinvent itself into a thriving democracy.

liberal democracy is poison. just look at the riot in france, and the insurrection in US. when you tell the people they can believe in whatever they want, truth no longer matter, people don't care if Trump lose fair and sqaure, they will believe very emotionally and strongly believe that the election is stolen, you can't reason with that and all you are left with is chaos. the failure of liberal democracy to have the gut to face up that it is flawed and is danger will lead to it collapse. people who think CPC is doing a bad job in China really need to wake up. no country that is doing a "bad job" will see 100 of million of it citizen going overseas on vacation, and returning to the country at the end of their vacation. the west need to owe up to that fact that it ideolgical believes is not only wrong, it is dangerous. because this democracy narrative is undermining real good administration. which depend not on the number of votes, but the level of organisation. the failure to treat government as an administrative problem but to treat it as a political problem would lead to the regression of countries as politician blame each other than to organise around solving problems. if you want to protect "democracy" then you should start focusing on governance, not idealogy. idealogy cannot feed the people. what most people fail to realise is the reason CPC won the civil war on the mainland is simply because they could feed more people than KMT could, and why couldn't KMT? because the western government force KMT government to repay their WWII war debt, leading to hyperinflation, the salary given by KMT to it soldier can't even buy a loaf of bread, which is why over a million soldier deflected to CPC and CPC turn from being outnumbered 4 to 1 to overwhleming KMT 2 to 1. this is a very important lesson I hope you can all listen to, because it will have great impact on one country soon: Ukraine. DO NOT ALLOW YOUR WESTERN GOVERNMENT TO DRIVE UKRAINE TO BANKRUPTCY AFTER THE WAR. do not allow western government to repo Ukrainian asset after the war, because if you do that, the Ukrainian ppl will revolt like they did in China. don't fail and understand what really wins people over is their ability to survive... if your system end up becoming their doom, you force them to reject you. that's the hard truth. I pray for the Ukrainian people because I know, their greatest suffering won't end with the war, it going to get worst for them because of the economic structure of the west is exploitive... and that is so UNFAIR to them!

Sadly, some power players without military influences decided to weaponize "democracy" to take over the control. However due to the initial manipulation of "democracy: the game" at early stage which turned Taiwan into a democratic clown show today. It was "outsiders" vs " domestics", then it was "Chinese heritage vs Japanese overlord", then it is "anti-China" vs "pro-China".

Exactly

"by just being invited into parliament and confronted with every boring detail of politics" damn i feel that

Most of this is covered. Only the student protests was indirectly explained: middle class plus easily squashed resistance.

What you said is so true. Chiang's regime also face issue of legitimacy, their government was founded on democratic principles back on the mainland. While Chiang put the 1 million mainlanders into government and rule Taiwan by iron fist, Chiang Khai Shek always legitimise it by saying this is necessary until they "re-conquer mainland". By 70s 80s it is clear there won't be a return to Nanking, their autocracy by then is unpopular with Taiwanese and second generation mainlander, the rest is history.

Do you think the CCP also tried Lee Kuan-Yew's PAP Singapore model what is your opinion on their performance?

@@carlrodalegrado4104 CCP can't copy Lee Kuan-Yew's because Singapore is a tiny country.

@@nntflow7058 well at least they were inspired by it

@@carlrodalegrado4104 They do have some influence from Lee Kwan Yew.

Now KMT is in opposition while the PAP is still in power.

Your description reminds me a lot of the Spanish transition, and how both now King Emeritus Juan Carlos and Adolfo Suárez had to contend with the “old guard” and reactionary coup attempts, even with Franco buried and far along his decomposition process. Heck, the whole description of Taiwan’s transition reminds me of the Spanish one. For context, we the Portuguese are very interested in all of that, because we also got rid of a nearly 50-year-long dictatorship through an unusual process, a relatively bloodless military coup (there were civilian casualties, five people killed at the hands of cornered political policemen right in front of their HQ, which was under siege). Interestingly, General Spínola, the provisional leader designated - at gunpoint, but still, he effectively had a say in the matter - by the surrendering President of the Council (for all intents and purposes, the dictator), was an apparatchik (a very vocal one, having published a book advocating for federalization of the sprawling colonial empire just a month before, but absolutely a member of the defunct regime’s intelligentsia, having been the Governor of Portuguese Guinea until the preceding year). In our case, public pressure got the best of that provisional government (a military junta that had right below said leader a collection of factions, from the ranks of all the pro-democracy and communist captains that had just staged said coup), quickly forcing in a matter of days the immediate ceasefire in all colonial war fronts and a swift (nay, rushed) process of decolonization and repatriation. Interestingly, Marcello Caetano, said outgoing dictator, appeared mellower than Salazar, the deceased dictator who, much like Franco, ruled the country for the better part of their regime. His first few years were even called “Marcelist Spring”, but here, too, he had to contend with the “brigada do reumático” (lit. “rheumatoid brigade”, and I think you can guess why that nickname stuck), a group of high-ranking reactionary officials that blocked any attempts at further reform and would indeed prevent even floating the idea of a peaceful resolution to said colonial war. And, in fact, there were also still a few younger officials, who weren’t outright sacked after the coup, that could’ve and indeed tried to stage a counter-coup of their own. Fortunately, they didn’t have their way and here we are now.

Another thing worth noting is that Teng Hui was a deep Trojan Horse. My father knew him when they were both studying abroad at Cornell. Teng Hui was always pro-TI, even if he was smart enough to keep that discrete. My father HATED HIS GUTS when he found out Teng Hui had joined the KMT, thinking he was the worst sort of traitorous turncoat. But his attitude turned around 180 degrees after seeing what he had managed to do from the inside.

Lee was just an opportunist with few weaknesses. funny how his liberalizing image in public abided with his wife always walking behind him in public instead of holding hands together. what an figure of old Chinese tradition if you ask me

true@@IsaacKuo

true@@eatdawontonsoup

I feel this is what China could of been if the KMT continued running the mainland. But I feel Taiwan needs to become independent though

@@thomasbarca9297 well 蔣經國 is definitely different from his father’s generation (warlords who believes in violence and totality) and has true experiences from somewhere none China. He might not make the same answer to the question of how to modernize China but this doesn’t guarantee his answer would be a democratic or liberal one. Then again, this relative sophisticated and “softness” might even bring his doom easier were KMT maintained control of China.

@@thomasbarca9297 and yeah that’s where one realizes the story of KMT or the story of modern China really means very little for Taiwanese people. We just want to be left alone and live with dignity.

@@thomasbarca9297 unlikely. the kmt on the mainland were hugely corrupt to the point that the US more or less lost faith and did little to stop the communist. China would have become something similar to the korean and vietnam war if kmt remained, only ten times more devastating due to the size of the country.

​​@@diegobrianlin5597lee Tung Hui, or Iwasato masao, identifies more as a Japanese 😂😂😂 guy was a total clown and a Japanese right-wing shill

Yes will billions from USA- everything is possible :D

South Korea's reform is mostly influenced by USA. You see it in the kind of government they follow along with the American influenced cuisines and sports popular in South Korea now.

Surely you mean in 1884?

@@henrikagestedt7835 lmao fuck. yes. thank you

These aren't the only mistakes you make in the video.

KMT took charge in 1945 at the end of WWII, not 1949

and Singapore

Are you denying the narrative of democracy=rich, dictatorship=poverty?

Taiwan and South Korea have an eerily similar modern history. Both were Japanese colonies that were then ran by military dictators. Both democratized peacefully and today are liberal democracies whom have had women presidents.

​@@KenGold666Singapore is the exact opposite of a democracy

​@@luiscarlospallaresascanio2374Russia is more rich than north Korea. You could say Russia is a dictatorship.. but idk dictatorship to me is places like Israel and north Korea

It was DPP's Chen who really forced KMT to cooperate the change of the outdated KMT-RoC constitution with amendments to update according to present reality. It was almost a change of the country's name to Republic of Taiwan but the US refused to accept the change.

To be fair to CCK, he did allow the establishment of the DPP, although at that time other parties were still forbidden by "law". So there are indications, that he was for democratization. But yeah, the title of "Father of Taiwan's Democracy" goes clearly to LTH!

you mean cucks that sold out taiwan to amerimutts, you realize the country is now a silon state? it relies almost entirely on tsmc and select few industries, and the united states is also backstabing taiwan by siphoning workers from taiwan to develop their own intel and amd chips so they wouldn't need tsmc anymore.

not to mention amerimutts don't recognize that the south china sea belongs to the republic of china and taiwan. and wants to give it to the Philippines going back on their word, zero reason to work with the amerimutt golems.

Lee finished what Chiang Ching-kuo started. The '80s were where the opposition parties caught attention by fighting in the legislator, which was still full of KMT officials who couldn't be removed because they represented provinces on the mainland that the gov't was pretending to still rule. The fights seemed silly at the time, but they were representative of the struggle against the single-party system. Even having opposition parties was a new thing then. Pres. Lee pushed for presidential elections and later for the disbanding of the redundant provincial government.

SYS was founded by the Soviets. SYS did come to Taiwan before. He came to gain support from Taiwanese and Japanese for his revolution. That's before he finally switched to the Soviet side in 1920s. BTW. Dr. SYS treated Taiwan/Formosa as a foreign country before he died. He even mentioned about supporting Taiwan independence in 1924 after he teamed up with the Soviets.

@@bctvanw SYS was educated in America. He wanted to bring Western Ideas to China but he also wanted to bring out more social reform. I would not call him really leftist. I personally think he just wanted what was best for China.

@@WoAiTuMadre2698 Sun yat-sen's ideas were also somewhat more idiosyncratic than I think this implies. For instance, a lot of his conceptions of freedom/democracy were "freedom for the nation," not necessarily "freedom for the individual." Arguably the two ideological tenant that survived past Sun's lifetime in the KMT's ideology was the political tutelage and land reform, lol.

@@icouldntthinkofaname379 I mean like I said SYS wanted what was best for the nation. His ideas were nationalistic for China. Even than what he did propose would grant the Chinese people more freedoms since it did provide limitations to government power.

He was pretty much the same as Ho Chi Minh. A Left Nationalist who turned to Socialism as a way to get USSR support in opposing Imperialism & Colonialism.

Thanks for info. I was wondering where gov-in-exile took money for compensations.

At least the original owners were Taiwanese who had been there for hundreds of years before the arrival of the KMT. With the KMT land reform, the lands were forcibly taken from the local population and given out to KMT invaders and collaborators, who previously had no legitimate claim whatsoever.

That's how land reform *should* work. FWIW, similar things happened in Korea and Japan. Land reform was absolutely crucial to reforming the peasantry for eventual rapid industrialization. A handful of selfish Taiwanese picked the wrong side, and are still butthurt about it. If you don't like it, you can always go to Yasukuni Shrine and cry all you want.

@@michaelyuan3382cool story bro, unfortunately international law and history, including peace treaties that ended WW2 and created the UN says they have every right to claim taiwan.

It also helped that the KMT took much of the national reserves when they evacuated the mainland.

"I am moved to see a foreign KZfaqr record the history of the development of Taiwan's democratization." When I came to Taiwan in 1994, Lee Deng-hui was the President of the R.O.C. (on Taiwan). I do recall that vote-buying was still prevalent, and the majority of the media was still state controlled. This did not disappear during the rule of the Minjindang's (DPP) Chen-Shui-bian (who would later be charged and jailed for corruption). The next president, Ma Ying-jiu was formerly a Guomindang (KMT) Minister of Justice, who had been removed from his position because he was attempting to prosecute high-level Guomindang (KMT) members for corruption - the so-called 'ill-gotten assets.' He was also the mayor of Taipei, which is seen as a crucial step to becoming president. I will not discuss the current president, since it goes beyond the range of this video. But, hey, what do I know? I still recall the time I was told by a Taiwanese woman that I could not understand politics of the R.O.C. "because I was a foreigner."

That would be because, it’s government. Not a country

@@bruhtnt4258 what exactly is a country then? Is it not an area ruled by its own sovereign government?

@@asdawasda It's whatever the CCP wants when they stamp their feet and get mad that people call Taiwan a country.

​@@bruhtnt4258found the chinese

@@asdawasdacall it a place.

Though I mostly agree with you, there could be some genuinity from Mr. Chiang as he publicly declare that descendants of Chiang will never become presidents again.

Thanks Johnny!!

As a party KMT has never initiated the change. They opposed change but was forced to do it with the pressure from the DPP. KMT's best stand is to maintain the status quo interpreted as 'no change until unification in undetermined future'. CCP-China is using KMT's stand to unify now or threat of invasion.

The U.S. had no qualms about supporting anti-communist dictatorships. To a well informed person, it would be a black mark on their reputation, but most people wouldn’t care

It's honestly amazing, and a political avenue I (as a Communist, who most people think are all USSR/China/DPRK fans, which I clearly am not) would encourage in all nations.

People won't try to cut off your head if you make them think the power you wield was given to you by them in the first place.

The book which served as the bulk of our research (linked in pinned comment if interested) discusses that as well. The authors have an interesting point which is that a big determining factor in the direction of a ruling party or autocrat is the signals it receives. There are two main varieties of signals - negative ones (which suggest the status quo is in trouble) and reassuring ones (which suggest reform would actually be productive). One very important type of signal is elections. They allow a ruling party, even if they are tightly regulated etc., to see how they're doing, how the people feel, how they'd fare post-transition. China lacks these. It's one reason Singapore, despite having a more competent ruling party and structure than China, is more likely to democratize successfully, sooner than China. Lots to think about! Hope you enjoyed, and give the book a look!

I hope the Republic of China(=taiwan) government will recapture the mainland china and unify it again. It is too bad that the territory of the liberal and powerful democratic government of the Republic of China is such a small island. If China were a democratic government, it would not have fought the United States like this now.

@@katrinoy1 I think PRChina will transition to Democracy when GDP per capita reaches parity with the West. If China per capita GDP reach parity with Taiwan at 35k. Half that of USA per capita GDP at 70k. Chinese total GDP economy would 2x size that of the USA.

Hey, so glad you're interested in learning more! We've got a book linked in the pinned comment that we recommend. Most of the video's research is drawn from it, but it also discusses Japan and South Korea extensively!

@@spectacles-dm Thank youu!!

I hope the Republic of China(=taiwan) government will recapture the mainland china and unify it again. It is too bad that the territory of the liberal and powerful democratic government of the Republic of China is such a small island. If China were a democratic government, it would not have fought the United States like this now.

If you are interested in the early years of the ROC after WWII, I recommend "Accidental State" by Hsiao-Ting Ling.

@@katrinoy1 In what ways does the People's Republic of China fight the US that you think wouldn't happen if they were a democracy?

Thank you for watching and sharing your thoughts! Agreed!!

Thanks for watching and we appreciate the thoughtful comment! We wouldn't characterize ourselves as pro-KMT in any way, not least because, as you note, we mention that they were not ideologically disposed towards democracy until at least the 1990s. To say the least, we *are* ideological democrats, and we would be as opposed as anyone in the pan-Green camp to their actions in the 20th century or their pro-PRC turn in the 21st. There are certainly aspects of the story that we weren't able to hit for the sake of time but are nonetheless important-perhaps we'll revisit them in a future video.

@@spectacles-dm I think you should have at least mention the Kaohsiung Incident, also how Lee Teng-hui supported the taiwanization movement and he was later expelled from the KMT.

It's quite misleading to call benshengren as "natives" that title should only be reserved for the aborigines

@@revolusirevolusi-jw7tn If you lived on Taiwan for centuries, you are pretty much native. Maybe not aboriginal but that is different.

@@Tamamo-no-Bae that's not how it works. There's a reason why white Americans aren't called native Americans even though they have been in America longer than the han Chinese benshenren have been in Taiwan

Thank you!

That's right yeah.

Sun Yatsen was supporting facism at his old age before his death. Chiang Kai Shek basically continuing Sun Yatsen's ideology.

as a citizen of nanking (former ROC capital no less) i see remnants of kmt everywhere. saddened we couldn’t keep what Sun laid out for us. now it’s a home i could never go back to

@@bocchium our beautiful homeland has been looted and ransacked by the communist bandits.

@@bocchium chinese dissident?

yeah, people forget the communists were once part of the kuomintang, both parties have, and continue to worship sun yat sen, sun already had socialist alignments, and planned to implement land reforms and social welfare, i cant help but feel that this video is somewhat biased against the kmt im probably biased as well, my grandfather was a soldier in the National Revolutionary Army (military branch of the kmt, effectively the chinese army) during the 2nd sino-japanese war, Republic of China Army during and after the civil war, and eventually became a kmt member

@@justit1074 my grandfather was in the ROC Navy and fought during the Civil War. He was also somehow involved in the Korean War, although it is not clear to what extent. He eventually started a family in Taiwan.

Thanks!

Thank you so much!! Means a lot!

Thanks for your feedback! We thought that a little humor can help break up a video like this and make it easier to watch, but I think a few of them didn't land as well as we'd hoped. I still hope you enjoyed the video, and thanks for watching!

@@JohnSmith-mc2zz That’s Woody Harrelson in the movie _Zombieland_ 😉

I hope the Republic of China(=taiwan) government will recapture the mainland china and unify it again. It is too bad that the territory of the liberal and powerful democratic government of the Republic of China is such a small island. If China were a democratic government, it would not have fought the United States like this now.

Step 3: Neo-liberalism and McCarthy-ism

Hey I recognize you i like your content :)

🤞🤞🤞🤞

Unlikely. Chinese people are too weak to fight the CCP.

They wont

since Taiwan is still the ROC, do you think if the PRC falls the Taipei Gouvernment will return to the mainland?

@@typiclyjohny5114 no I don’t think so at least not immediately afterwards since the political atmosphere would be so different from Taiwans and political parties will spring up all over the country but I really hope that a new government/party would form that redeclares the country as the ROC and adopts a modified version of the ROC constitution until the country is fully stable and until the established Taiwanese parties make a return to the mainland to assist with democratization and reunification. One case scenario that I personally wish never happens is if the only the KMT returns to mainland and the current ruling party the DPP declares Taiwanese independence.

@@typiclyjohny5114 At this point the ideological differences are too large for Taiwanese and Chinese to reintegrate with each other. Even their language changed somewhat. They are gonna end up like US and UK.

Thanks for the feedback! Several others have said the same, and this is helpful for us :)

Taiwan is only recognized by 10+ countries in the world…. Taiwan would be very happy to be recognized by 1/4 of countries!

yeah true, i just looked it up years ago and saw a list that was probably from 1980-90 where a lot more countrys still recognized taiwan so i had that number vaguely in my long-term memory thanks for correcting me ^^. and honestly that just proves/reinforces the point i was trying to make ^^ @@gratain

@@funfungerman8401 Instead of recognizing Taiwan, they recognize the Republic of China, ROC, another China.

Honestly Taiwan is basically it’s own country, and I pretty much see it that way. They literally have their own currency, government, elections, banks, military, airports, and passport.

I can't see that happening in china .