How many thought immediately in their head: “Atheism”
@albinlindvall61653 жыл бұрын
111, my exact thought.
@giantotter3193 жыл бұрын
I thought paper money first tbh
@rexuchiha23103 жыл бұрын
I was thinking same because it's totally useless in conquest games.
@kevinfogle79293 жыл бұрын
I think we all did.....
@PeterWhittam3 жыл бұрын
Immediately 11
@iftachilfalach2843 жыл бұрын
Sotl : "the closest tech of being useless is.., atheism" God : is a win for me
@andoreh40213 жыл бұрын
Silk road IS actually useless on 1v1, tho...
@M0rdFustang3 жыл бұрын
@@andoreh4021 not if you trade with your enemy 😌
@Vordikk3 ай бұрын
@@M0rdFustang could've been useful if deleting units/buildings was not a thing.
@mehmetbahadryildirim32063 жыл бұрын
"hey guys, spirit of the law here" is a phrase that calms me down every single time i open a sotl video 11
@OmegaNovaB3 жыл бұрын
The second I understood the 11 at the end there, I 11’ed very hard
@pragadeeshwar9233 жыл бұрын
111¹1
@Just_a-guy3 жыл бұрын
I after all thia Timestill hear "spirit of la hire"
@unyosalvaje34933 жыл бұрын
@@OmegaNovaB can you tell me the truth in front of my eyes and reveal the meaning of eleven?
@OmegaNovaB3 жыл бұрын
@@unyosalvaje3493 the in game chat when u type 11 the game auto laughs
@Jackty893 жыл бұрын
+2 range on bombard cannon, think about it this way, you're not losing a castlle, the enemy is losing one
@hunterchapman93563 жыл бұрын
Ah I remember when I first started playing AoE2. I would give all my villagers breaks from working cause I felt bad for them
@dominikmagnus3 жыл бұрын
weird, I remember as a kid I would tend to overwork my villagers and plow through all exhaustible resources on the map before winning... same thing happened in warcraft 2, AoE and AoE2.
@hunterchapman93563 жыл бұрын
@@dominikmagnus that’s what I do now lol. They don’t work they don’t live basically
@3rdfriend3 жыл бұрын
I tried to get women work on the fields, bushes and sheep. while men needed to hunt, chop trees and dig for gold :D
@liamdell63193 жыл бұрын
@@3rdfriend Now we know that the only difference between Male and Female villagers is that the Males have slightly less frames in their attack animation, making them attack faster.
@volition1423 жыл бұрын
@@liamdell6319 their frame delay is lower meaning they attack first but at the same rate.
@RealFreshDuke3 жыл бұрын
TC extra range as a free civ bonus... Did you ever hear the tragedy of Teutons in Age of Kings? I thought not. It's not a story the DE players would tell you.
@SergioGarridoPaco3 жыл бұрын
Death star tc rush lmao double sw reference
@nlb1373 жыл бұрын
If it was a +2 castle +3 imp it wouldn't be a problem. You could probably make it 1/2/3 feudual/castle/imp and not be a problem, but castle would be safer.
@biofriik3 жыл бұрын
"They could actually... use that bonus to rush in the Dark Age?"
@gabrielblacklock39213 жыл бұрын
@@biofriik Is it possible to learn this build order?
@ignis4883 жыл бұрын
@@gabrielblacklock3921 not from a DE player
@hansoverhage3 жыл бұрын
Love how Huns have two "useless" Unique techs, still top tier.
@DefendTheCode3 жыл бұрын
Huns are fundamentally broken.
@thecspot13873 жыл бұрын
Instead of that garbage tech where you dont lose houses, you just dont need them lol
@acuarionohyogaable3 жыл бұрын
Tarkans created in stables are ready faster if you have a frank ally
@akshayherur696311 күн бұрын
True. Cav archers, Paladins, Trebs. Great civ bonus.
@T-West3 жыл бұрын
Atheism is useful, just not for all of us fellow math nerds who see the SotL videos. Cutting the cost of Spies in half means instead of checking the tooltip and dividing the cost by 200 to figure out how many Villagers your opponent has, you only need to divide by 100, which is a bit easier.
@jimtim11443 жыл бұрын
I see a man of culture as well. *tips fedora*
@ryanborn70263 жыл бұрын
And for certain monk-laden campaign runs ;)
@Janovich3 жыл бұрын
really? just divide by 100 first then by 2 lol lets say cost is 16200 gold. 16200/100 = 162 162/2 = 81 villagers
@Wyagra3 жыл бұрын
@@Janovich how the fek did you get 4! upvotes for such an redudant commentary
@dave-topic96092 жыл бұрын
@@Janovich hah, Nerd
@tirex36733 жыл бұрын
3:38 we had that as a free civ bonus for Teutons in AoK, turns out, making you town center outrange the enemies town center in dark age is a bad idea
@Tpoleful3 жыл бұрын
The unbeatable Teutonic douche. Thank god I didn't have access to multiplayer in those days.
@renzoraschioni38863 жыл бұрын
Someone should make a video that listes all differences between age of kings and now
@galliman1233 жыл бұрын
*flashback to bombard towers dealing melee damage*
@kevintrang30073 жыл бұрын
Camel ships.
@QWERTY-gp8fd3 жыл бұрын
@St. Haborym there is like only 3 ways to counter BT. Y u complaining
@leonciesla54563 жыл бұрын
Big brain arena play: Grab nomad and delete all your houses so you have a more open floorplan great for partying and hosting guests
@Thundermikeee3 жыл бұрын
hol'up: FOREST NOTHING .
@garretgang83493 жыл бұрын
@@Thundermikeee But you have to get to castle age first.
@Thundermikeee3 жыл бұрын
@@garretgang8349 well if you have anything on forest nothing its time to get to castle. and yeah huns are vastly superior when it comes to space management, im just trying here xD
@jeffsquires17173 жыл бұрын
lol the times i get that tech are usually on a black forest map that's bad or i got walled into a tight space and need land for farms/stables/etc. and it feels amazing deleting all your houses at once
@qwesx3 жыл бұрын
Big brain play: Build houses instead of walls, never run out of stone! Who cares if the enemy destroys them, just build like five layers.
@RiceWarrior343 жыл бұрын
For the Mongols tech, I tend to use houses as early walls, but that makes them vulnerable to be taken down when things heat up in castle age and I need stronger walls. Nomads makes sure I don't need to rush to rebuild houses and get housed at a time when the pressure is on.
@youcanthandlethetruth54333 жыл бұрын
Wp
@sebastianrebazalarosa3634 Жыл бұрын
Big brain plays
@sirgodua3 жыл бұрын
My guess is that Atheism was included mostly for the last Attila campaign scenario where every enemy feels like Wonders are the way to go.
@jeffery_tang3 жыл бұрын
artillery is a must pick if you go for lots of bombard towers and bombard cannons, it's a staple in black forest
@gtheavyy85433 жыл бұрын
Black forest games are so different that they would need a balance sheet of their own. They favor booming, choke-point play and ranged units so much that I consider it equally different from arabia as some full water maps are. I guess not picking it in BF would be same as not picking Malay's Harbor tech in a water map. Then again, you can't argue that it's a tad bit expensive... 500G and 450S is definitely enough that you should think twice before investing
@OlafJorigson3 жыл бұрын
Well, as he mentioned, there are no "bad" techs since every one of them can be extremely useful depending on the situation. Paper Money can be a life saver in long games.
@mchad67793 жыл бұрын
I would still rather have siege engineers though. +1 range to everything, and more damage to buildings, qnd its cheaper. Not bad, but worse than the generic option
@rafsan15783 жыл бұрын
Not black forest, it works in every map.
@TheGloriousLobsterEmperor3 жыл бұрын
3:37 I'm sure you know this but in the base game it actually *was* a free civ bonus. Although it was +5 range and +2 attack, and it was so unbelievably broken that lobbies used to say "No Teutons" since deleting your TC and putting it sorta near your opponent's was the most effective way to end the early game.
@onikoneko3 жыл бұрын
Watching a lot of high-level games, I can see the value of Nomads. Getting housed in the middle of an opponent's big push into your base can be the difference between still managing to churn out enough cheap defense despite losing houses to push them out, and just dying because you can't even train anyone anymore. Not to mention, it lets you use houses as a viable cheap wall/wall reinforcement with no risk of getting housed during a big assault.
@Gammelmann3 жыл бұрын
Tarkans are underrated, and the Marauder tech as well IMO. Tarkans chew through buildings so fast compared to Knights, and they also compliment CA better than Knights, as they can tank much more arrow fire.
@suddenllybah3 жыл бұрын
I also feel like complaining about Stables Tarkans building slower is silly. It is a hell of a lot easier to spam stables than castles, due to costing only 175 wood and 50 seconds of build time
@davidvalderrey93853 жыл бұрын
I agree, perhaps you don't research It in every game, but a surprise raid with tarkans from a bunch of sneaky stables behind the enemy's base can do a lot of damage pretty fast
@Jacks_Suffocating_Nihilism3 жыл бұрын
They are like rams that can kill villagers and flee from military. Amazing unit.
@Endless-fire2 жыл бұрын
Think of them not as cavalry, but as siege.
@PriyabrataHalder3 жыл бұрын
I usually like huns as i hit castle age, research marauders, build 4 stables in this time, and go for a quick tarkan rush. they are so good at destroying buildings that i just focus on tcs to damage as much production as possible.
@noradrenalin80623 жыл бұрын
Haven't watched yet but if "Atheism" isn't number one I'll eat a treb.
@europeanpatriot80313 жыл бұрын
Just like in real life
@MrShadowThief3 жыл бұрын
It's useful in the campaigns.
@seizan883 жыл бұрын
Now I really want to see someone eat a treb.... and other bets maybe?
@M0rdFustang3 жыл бұрын
@@MrShadowThief I'm about to do the hun campaign now so I can use 😁
@212mochaman3 жыл бұрын
Atheism's pretty useful against goths if you're petrified of 3 hidden fwd barracks or anything like that
@MajorTomFisher3 жыл бұрын
Ironic how one of the few uses for the atheism tech is the pacifist speedruns that TWest does using lots of monks.
@martijn95683 жыл бұрын
And the last scenario of the Atilla the Hun campaign.
@kyallokytty3 жыл бұрын
@@martijn9568 thats the one mj tomfisher is refering to
@lorrdy76403 жыл бұрын
I searched for this comment! :D
@liamdell63193 жыл бұрын
@@kyallokytty It's also useful on non-pacifist playthroughs of that scenario.
@martijn95683 жыл бұрын
@@kyallokytty Except that doing pacifist runs isn't a requirement to get use out of the tech.
@santiagocorley32773 жыл бұрын
The lithuanians tech really saves me while being raided to death. I found it quite usefull, the extra range of the TC sometimes even means that two TCs will range the same units.
@unimportantcommenter43563 жыл бұрын
Its pretty common to push an attack in castle age, and even more common to have a mango vs TC situation, so I think this bonus is a blessing.
@daisychain51253 жыл бұрын
@@unimportantcommenter4356 The counter to a mangonel push is already a castle, and you need a castle to get the tech. That makes it a bit redundant. It's decent to prevent raids, but actually not that useful vs a mangonel push given the investment of building a castle in the first place (which is generally hard, a mangonel push comes in very early castle age if it's relevant). Guard Towers also do the job fine.
@MrAbgeBrandt3 жыл бұрын
You mean "will reach"? "to range" means something entirely different.
@daisychain51253 жыл бұрын
@@MrAbgeBrandt To range is used to mean to reach in AoE and in any videogame. Ranging an unit means being able to hit it.
@MrAbgeBrandt3 жыл бұрын
www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/range There's no mention of meaning the same as "reach". The usage of range for which sounds awfully stupid anyway. Same goes for other dictionaries, the link is just an example.
@shangri-la-la-la3 жыл бұрын
Honestly they could buff the Hun's Atheism by making it increase resistance to conversion on top of the wonder/relic victories and it would not brake the game given how rarely monks seems to be used in imperial age.
@MrAsaqe3 жыл бұрын
This makes their cav line utterly unstoppable, on top of the Tarkans casual ability to burn down monasteries and buildings
@shangri-la-la-la3 жыл бұрын
I rarely see more than like 3 or 4 monks being used. They are most commonly used in castle age to counteract a few knights and to get relics. This will not remove the unique tech from being generally a joke but it will be less of a joke while also fitting the name of the tech.
@Tpoleful3 жыл бұрын
I'd rather have some sort of buff for Tarkans as a second tech. Maybe a small attack bonus vs archers or a speed boost to make them as fast as light cav. Basically something that would specialize them to be picked over the knight line. Huns should still prefer Paladins in most situations though.
@shangri-la-la-la3 жыл бұрын
@@Tpoleful The Huns don't really need a buff. Hence making a basically worthless tech only useful in extremely rare situations.
@kampfer913 жыл бұрын
@@MrAsaqe Gotta stick to real life ya know ;)
@raulfernandez573 жыл бұрын
Heh, Paper Money sounds good on paper.
@eccentrichorse113 жыл бұрын
I think the nomads tech(the one that stops destroyed houses from decreasing the pop cap is handy just to clear up your base. You can basically delete all your houses to make room for other stuff, or to stop them from slowing down trade carts. Still not that amazing, but something to point out. Love your vids, cheers
@EcclesiastesLiker-py5ts3 жыл бұрын
Houses work well as an extra wall, to not have to use them is useful but to be able to build them then lose them to just doesn't do much. I would normally prefer to have houses to use as walls than not.
@CG-eh6oe3 жыл бұрын
Why would i ever want to delete my houses? They are free walls. Maybe usefull if you play forrest nothing or on some Black Forrest generations, but apart from that?
@ljss68053 жыл бұрын
@@CG-eh6oe Makes tons of sense in BF team games where they slow down trade and take up space you can use better for eco or even military. Also, the fact that you don't lose pop space when a house is lost doesn't mean you have to delete them if you're using them as walls.
@aguynamedsquid34743 жыл бұрын
As someone who's playing mongols almost exclusively atm, I grab Nomads when I have a decent number of forward houses or housewalls. It prevents me from getting housed as they go down and allows me to focus on making military for a counterattack, rather than having to get a vil to not only keep up the house production for a growing military but another to make up what I lost.
@HolyKhaaaaan3 жыл бұрын
That's more or less the reason I think nomads is a good technology. It's mostly to prevent getting housed from slowing down your production. It's not there to try and rescue and already lost game, but to preserve the resource of population so you don't lose.
@Tpoleful3 жыл бұрын
I still think it should also apply to Castles and Town centers. It would be a small improvement to the least useful unique tech. (I don't count Atheism as a useful tech)
@neildutoit51773 жыл бұрын
House wall in your opponent. If it fails, you loose nothing.
@zachariastsampasidis88803 жыл бұрын
@@Tpoleful Atheism is actually proportionally a lot more useful even in conquest. It's just the scenario that it's truly viable is exceedingly rare. Special exception to weird maps like wolf hill though arguably you use the gold to buy resources at the market and field more units with less villagers rather than just stockpile tons of gold
@Tpoleful3 жыл бұрын
@@zachariastsampasidis8880 Dude, the only time spies is viable is when you have a stubborn opponent who already lost but refusing to give up. If you can stockpile 10k gold in the heat of battle in any map, you probably should've won long ago. Lets not kid ourselves here. It's main use is in standard game mode which is not the default game mode as the og devs expected.
@DaCrump3 жыл бұрын
Paper Money has "a lot of value on paper" ha, I see what you did there. Take my like you magnificent bastard!
@MaxYoung-Maxinfet3 жыл бұрын
I feel like you could do a whole category for water techs since a lot of the time it is like having no tech in that age.
@tkzsfen3 жыл бұрын
In the Great Pantheon of Uselessness there is still nothing standing higher than the Incas team bonus. We will never know how many people have sighed after experiencing its "impact" on the game.
@rainbowevil3 жыл бұрын
For anyone wondering (like me) their team bonus is building farms 50% faster... 11
@daisychain51253 жыл бұрын
Actually a team bonus actively hurting me because I always forget about it and finish my first farms before Horse Collar completes. Usually you click Horse Collar then create the farms and they finish after the research. Because of stoopid bonus they finish before. So tilting.
@suddenllybah3 жыл бұрын
@@daisychain5125 oh yeah, throwing off by like 2-3 seconds is not great.
@daisychain51253 жыл бұрын
@@suddenllybah Yes, I think it costed me hundreds of wood in the midgame in several game. As any civ bonus it changes the build order, but this one feels so irrelevant I always forget about it. And I have to actively think "wait, let's spend 10 secs waiting before placing my farms" which really does not feel like a bonus.
@paulgoodman16203 жыл бұрын
Actually doing the math it comes to a bit more than 3 food of villager time saved for each farm you build. Not huge but not nothing over the course of a whole game where building 100+ farms is pretty reasonable, multiplied out over each player on the team.
@ibrahinalvarez54293 жыл бұрын
Huns. That's all
@AlphaRebel3 жыл бұрын
when the huns were released it wasnt uncommon to play standard victory and not conquest.
@icarian5533 жыл бұрын
I disagree with hill forts. It's very useful tech against raiding in general. Not just against mangonel/onager push. Town centers cover a larger area giving better protection for villagers and if enemy units are just trying to pass by, you can get even an extra shot or two against them. I see it also picked a lot in pro games.
@SIGNOR-G3 жыл бұрын
Yeah i think this tech is even better than tigui
@michaeltaylor86983 жыл бұрын
Uploaded 15 seconds ago. I'm guessing Cuman Mercenaries is going to be on the list. Edit: I was right. I hate the idea of techs that have a 1 time use.
@petersavonato49183 жыл бұрын
I'm afraid you'll hate the two new civs then...
@Sodacacik3 жыл бұрын
@@petersavonato4918 yeah looks lame
@Alias_Anybody3 жыл бұрын
Interestingly, in AoE3 high level players usually prefer shipments of military units/ressources RIGHT NOW over long time passive effects/upgrades because you may already be finished when those accumulate enough value.
@michaeltaylor86983 жыл бұрын
@@petersavonato4918 Oh I do. I'll give them a chance when they come out but I still don't like that out of so many possibilities for new civs they decided to go with Sicilians and Burgundians... And their bonuses seem more like Age 3 than Age 2 bonuses to me.
@michaeltaylor86983 жыл бұрын
@@Alias_Anybody Because Age 3 plays much faster than 2. If games in Age 3 were 45 minutes or more on average people would take permanent cards over 1 time use cards. I only play Age 3 with friends where we have a 30 minute treaty. None of us bother with the one time unit cards as a result
@Thescott163 жыл бұрын
My Hun opponent: Me, and my Aztec battle-Monks: _Checkmate, Atheist._
@The_Room_2_Doggys_Revenge3 жыл бұрын
I just realize the Italians are the discount civ, all their civ bonuses and silk road are discounts
@joshuagabrielcatindig76073 жыл бұрын
Merchant of Venice, everyone. Oh wait, it's supposed to be Venezia. Don't want no angry skater ice boi coming after me, lol.
@leonardorivelorivelo92533 жыл бұрын
@@joshuagabrielcatindig7607 Was that a Jojo reference?
@joshuagabrielcatindig76073 жыл бұрын
@@leonardorivelorivelo9253 I suppose, along with a Fire Emblem one.
@BJ-vl2vz3 жыл бұрын
I think the fan favourite Yeomen was also on Spirit's hit-list due to its insane cost in castle age
@ryanborn70263 жыл бұрын
I was surprised he didn't have it too
@shangri-la-la-la3 жыл бұрын
The cost is high but it does provide something actually useful so not actually bad per say.
@AgeofNoob3 жыл бұрын
Ah, yes. Atheism. You never get tired of making it on bad lists, do you? 11
@thekingofspoons10273 жыл бұрын
if strategy games have taught us anything, it's to always go for the easiest target
@kampfer913 жыл бұрын
Well Hun is pretty strong and broken , so may be that tech balanced them out so no one have to spend extra resources to research it .
@AgeofNoob3 жыл бұрын
@@kampfer91 Huns are fine the way they are tbh, I don't think they need a change :)
@LumosX3 жыл бұрын
based thread
@M0rdFustang3 жыл бұрын
@@streetspete 😂
@Adam-fs4sx3 жыл бұрын
I'd bet Berserkergang and Thalassocracy are two of the three not included. Berserkergang costs a lot to just improve regeneration of one type of unit, most of which will either survive or die in a fight regardless of the extra 0.33 HP/sec bonus. Thalassocracy is arguably even worse: if your docks are within range of enemy ships in castle age, it's probably because you've lost the water fight already, and new arrow-tickle harbours aren't going to make a difference.
@jimtim11443 жыл бұрын
The hp regen is not good but it aint bad either. Tbh is hard to rate its value due to it maybe saving countless units or maybe it not saving many. Still if I was going to spam them I would pick it up. Honestly the berbers version may be for more units but the effect is so much worse might aswell save the cost and time and just make one monk. As for the harbor tech it has its uses it aint for water supremacy but you can trick ships to fight under them giving you the advantage but I think the tech is more used as a cheaper casual defense than tower spamming a shoreline for protecting fishing ships and trade cogs. Yeah not the most useful and it probs deserved to be on this list but it has its moments.
@acentialpapd94183 жыл бұрын
Bro apparently you never used thalassocracy aggressively. Imagine having a wood cost resilient tower. In maps such as islands it fucking rocks.
@NotThatGuyJD3 жыл бұрын
Thalassocracy is super useful in maps where water isn't that "wide". It can also be used offensively, forcing a couple harbours up just before/during a big engagement helps quite a bit also makes you less likely to be completely removed from water as your harbours are much harder to take out.
@HermesGO33 жыл бұрын
Whaaaat ? Hill fort is the BEST tech in the game. I can't count the number of mango rushs I countered with it. Those hoang tears were delicious.
@daisychain51253 жыл бұрын
You can make a castle during a mangonel rush? The whole point is it's supposed to hit you before you collected stone. Otherwise the best way to counter it is to delete farms and put a castle near the TC, no matter the civ.
@HermesGO33 жыл бұрын
@@daisychain5125 When my gameplan is to boom with lithuanians I just go heavy on stone late feudal age so I can get a castle up fast if needed (with some market abuse when they're rly fast). If they change their plan it's not lost and I go 4 Tc boom and then castle when pressure arrives. With my castle and Hill fort + bodkin they just can't do anything to my eco (especially if they go archers). I out boom them, get army, trade with theirs, they don't have eco to reproduce, I do, dead.
@daisychain51253 жыл бұрын
@@HermesGO3 In theory, that only works if the opponent poorly scouts and poorly executes his own build order (so what I'm saying is that it works if you're better, so you could win with another strat). You'll always be later to a FC if you go on stone and/or have less military so you should be vulnerable to an early pressure if he executes properly. As every all-in strat, if he's late to it he'll fall behind but it's like people doing a scoutrush at minute 15 or a drush when the opponent is already fully walled and feudal: that's just them misexecuting. If you sit back in base mining stone you'll have 3-4 villagers having no purpose besides collecting stone for a theoretical attack so you should have less of other ressources and be later to castle age/be overwhelmed in feudal. Investing into stone in a fast castle is generally only good if your castle gets you value for sure to compensate for the villagers mining, so generally a castle drop (which is super cheesy above low elo) or a super strong unique unit in early castle age (Burmese and Spanish). And then again, any civ can counter a Hoang rush by just putting a castle or having guard towers by the time mangonels start eating TC, the tech does not make the difference here. If Hoang wins games when everyone knows what he'll do it's because his build order and market abuse is absolutely top-tier so he starts mangonel-pushing you around minute 16 before you can have enough stone for a castle. And as I said, Castles or Guard Towers are probably good enough. I think it's easier to defend a Hoang rush as Spanish, Teutons or especially Koreans than as Lithuanians with that tech.
@daisychain51253 жыл бұрын
To elaborate: Spanish has faster builders, tend to go on stone and still get value from it and Conqs are probably the best units in early castle age vs mangonels/monks/knights (and probably overall). Teutons can garrison more, their knights resist conversion and have extra armor to dive in and kill the mangonels/monks and their farms are cheaper to relocate if you lose the front of your TC. Koreans have faster mining of stone and free guard towers to obliterate mangonels. All of those are passive bonuses and more useful than Hill Forts to defend against Hoang pushes. So if you say that's the main use of the tech and it's outclassed by passive bonuses that have plenty of other uses I find it really underwhelming.
@HermesGO33 жыл бұрын
@@daisychain5125 As I said I go on stone late feudal, meaning when I'm almost ready to go up, I pool villagers from food, which I won't need immediatly or from wood if I have too much. So I don't damage my castle time as much as you say. I talked about hoang rush but I pulled off this against really any matchup if my map allows it and most of the time I decide to go for it if my scout rush did ok damage (usually does, power of the 18 pop BO). A castle drop dosen't stop a mango push, it just redirects it somwhere else most of the time. Seen Hoang do it plenty of times, seen my opponent try it sometimes. Building your castle in front of your TC is often a nighmare cause the enemy mango does reckt your villagers. Even if you get it up, it costs a lot of idle time and often a lot dead villagers. Once again, hill forts allow you ti build your castle anywhere else it's safe and usefull and then just push back mangos with your TC. There are of course ways to counter this strat but it worked pretty well when I was playing at 1200elo and I can still pull it out from time to time at 1400+ now. I also saw some pros try it (mostly Viper) and they did ok. It's a valid strat, quite unique to this civ, and very funny when the opponent can't do anything to your eco and you get to build a big army to erase his (reminds me of old days low elo games).
@hyperN13372 жыл бұрын
Personally I'd slot Greek Fire for the Byzantines somewhere on the list as well. The cost feels a bit steep for +1 range to what is basically a melee boat, is a UT for just one unit, and requires you to be in a situation where you are both making a lot of fire ships for a long period of time instead of galleons, and demands it being a water map with boat play to begin with.
@soko-ban3 жыл бұрын
9:08 my guesses are Mahouts, Andean Sling and, if you're familiar with the accuracy issue, probably either Greek Fire or Shatagni, otherwise maybe Royal Heirs
@FortuneTellher3 жыл бұрын
those are actually all really great examples of underpowered techs. I was thinking Warwulf myself.
@soko-ban3 жыл бұрын
@@FortuneTellher I'm not sure about low to mid level play, but being able to reliably win Treb wars is no joke, so I wouldn't say the tech is bad or underpowered, just that Britons don't really need it to be great
@erensozen7912 жыл бұрын
@@FortuneTellher warwolf is one of the best techs in the game no kidding
@liamdell63193 жыл бұрын
Marauders is actually really good for Battle Royal mode since you don't need to try and capture a castle, just capture a stable.
@Calebgoblin3 жыл бұрын
Since Spirit basically rearranges my whole brain with every video, I didn't even try to make my own guess
@shigerufan13 жыл бұрын
The Mongol tech works for when you like to build your houses on choke points.
@morgs51183 жыл бұрын
Or house wall but by that time stone walls are more viable
@zayedulalam4603 жыл бұрын
"Civilizations with poor unique techs don't need them to be improved." *shows hun and vietnamese gameplay*
@Alche_mist3 жыл бұрын
Huns and Slavs (although Druzhina can be very powerful) are the poster children of not needing the unique tech AND having a niche unique unit while still being very powerful. The same can be said about the Byzantines (Guess Greek Fire is one of the three non-mentioned techs), although the general wisdom puts them below the Slavs and Huns.
@zachariastsampasidis88803 жыл бұрын
@@Alche_mist Slavs have very powerful around options with the sole exception of archery which is fine. A great team bonus, a great eco bonus, a full cavalry and siege techtree (mostly, yes paladin and bbc is missing but they are mitigated considerably) and probably one of the best civs to go siege onager in 1v1 due to the discount. The problem with orthodoxy is that monks have inherently low hp; if it was buffed to also increase monk hp a bit more and perhaps a small price reduction it would be a serious contender Hillforts also allows for amazing harass and trolling even at a high level, and Greek fire is also decent to great to any map that includes water
@IschmarVI3 жыл бұрын
Imo the biggest problem with Nomads is that it has a respectable research time which more or less prevents you from researching it reactively. If it had like 10 seconds research time or something, it would definitely have its moments when say, a horde of hungry rams starts battering down your houses. But the way it is now, once the tech is through there are no houses left anyways ...
@alexanderkorsunsky27923 жыл бұрын
Stuff I never researched because I felt there were more pressing matters, but never thought about why. I think he hits the nail on the head.
@lolwalullalullol9123 жыл бұрын
Unpopular opinion: Shatagni is really crappy. Increasing range of hand cannons is almost useless. Its inaccuracy increases over distance. No use increasing its range.
@ashenronin74103 жыл бұрын
Besides, hand cannons are nearly useless
@duongnhdn Жыл бұрын
@@ashenronin7410 Really? I always think they are the best solution for Goths flood.
@ashenronin7410 Жыл бұрын
@@duongnhdn oh yes i think they are good too. But you need to mass a ton for them to be so good, i believe. Very expensive yet very fragile. I prefer to counter with stronger champions
@josephbrandenburg4373 Жыл бұрын
@@ashenronin7410 i think HC's got a round of buffs around the time of Dawn of the Dukes
@Avinash_Lincoln3 жыл бұрын
A civ can be strong in many ways Indians: the only sin we commited was being strong on team games and you guys just nerfed us to ground😭😭😭. Edit: wow thanks for the likes guys, Also This is what I commented originally " Second then, I bet Aethism is here". Good luck people.
@europeanpatriot80313 жыл бұрын
Just like in real life
@Avinash_Lincoln3 жыл бұрын
@@europeanpatriot8031 what do you mean brother?
@nostalgicdouchebag19123 жыл бұрын
@@Avinash_Lincoln y'know the with the British conquest and all... AOE2 is historically accurate once again lmao with nerfing Indians till they became the worst 1v1 Arabia civ.
@kartiksaraf46763 жыл бұрын
@@nostalgicdouchebag1912 AOE2 period is uptill 1500-1600 at most. British conquest was in ~1700-1800
@nostalgicdouchebag19123 жыл бұрын
@@kartiksaraf4676 I don't think you get the joke my friend
@ninnoofthelastunicorn26933 жыл бұрын
Man, I wish we had one of you for every game out there. Relaxed, math based, with a injection of humor videos. I'd love to see how you'd approach a game like Total Warhammer
@Limrasson3 жыл бұрын
Actually I think the range upgrades are all very good, since they extend the coverage of the defensive building. So potentially you need less towers/castles to control an area or with the TC, you can have more buildings/farms protected by it.
@Hennu_TRM3 жыл бұрын
I think greek fire is pretty underwhelming. It doesn't feel like the fire ships perform that much better. Also if you're in a water fight it's usually better to put your res into ships than to build a castle.
@francescosantelli18883 жыл бұрын
Portuguese Carrack: don't see how can be better in castle age to add extra armor to ships instead of having 3-4 more ships (very situational in my opinion) Shatagni (indians) and greek fire (byz): more range but less accuracy...too expensive for what you get, rarely worthy the investment Ethiopians royal heirs: already created pretty fast, not a great added value Berbers maghrabi camels: just personal experience, I don't see a great advantage in battle, I think they should slightly increase the regeneration rate to make it worthy
@starcraft2own3 жыл бұрын
Some of these i don't agree on at all. Extra armor on water fights can be a huge advantage. It's the same concept as why you pick up armor for knights instead of just making more knights. If your ships take 12 shots to take down while the enemy only needs 10 shots, (Portugese has 10% extra ship hp too) then it can snowball incredibly fast and you can win even against someone with more ships. And fireship range makes them viable even in late castle age up to imperial, i agree you might not want fireships but that extra range makes them go from situational to fairly strong. It also allows you to win fire vs fire super easy. It's not a tech to underestimate if you use it right. The berber tech is not a battle tech, just like how unupgraded bezerks aren't meant to regen in battle either. You will get your advantage the second battle, the third battle and so on. I think the tech is a must have if you go camel units for sure, i always get it.
@deedarfan85593 жыл бұрын
Carrack +1 armor greatly decrease enemy fire ship damage, easy to understand.
@alexanderren1097 Жыл бұрын
Mongol's Nomad tech is useful for making a smaller and more efficient base. You build a bunch of houses, then self destruct them, rebuild in the same place self destruct again, and repeat until you max out you population limit and then destroy them again and build something else there like military buildings. This way you can build either an overall smaller base so you don't need to build as big of a wall around it or you can build the same size base as you normally would just with more room for additional military buildings instead of having houses taking up the space
@davidnoahperkins3 жыл бұрын
I haven’t played AoE in years but I saw your “New Farming Meta” video come across my feed some months ago and I can’t stop watching your videos
@helaba29573 жыл бұрын
Mathematically speaking, Atheism is the best tech, since it saves you 15,000 gold!
@joaquincarrascosa913 жыл бұрын
I think artillery is a good tech in post-imperial, it´s expensive but allows you to outrange other cannons and siege onagers, it can pay for itself.
@jimtim11443 жыл бұрын
Also it gives bombards more time to shoot things making them get off more shots. Which is helpful due to them being slow shooters. Still wish they did melle dmg instead so they could one shot rams which I think they should.
@ad3z103 жыл бұрын
In high level games, sure, but in 800-1200 games like he's rating most people aren't going to properly micromanage their BBC in Post Imp to make use of it.
@darkdill3 жыл бұрын
Ways to change the various bad UT's. - Paper Money: Change it to provide a permanent trickle of gold instead of a big gold packet. - Cuman Mercenaries: Change it to provide you and your allies with a free Elite Kipchak every X seconds. - Madrasah: Remove, add it to the Saracens as a baseline civ bonus, replace with something new.
@thomasfplm3 жыл бұрын
Cumman mercenaries: allies can create Kipchaks with the same techs as yours (paying their normal costs).
@zachariastsampasidis88803 жыл бұрын
@@thomasfplm This sounds broken. Many civs have limited archery and cavalry options or very suboptimal for reasons. Granted they would still lack bracer and stuff but giving siege onager civs kipchaks sounds broken. In fact any civ that doesnt have a good cav archer benefits a lot potentially, while alsobeing unplayable for 1v1. I guess the cuman player still gets 10 free kipchaks instantly when the tech finishes or something
@thomasfplm3 жыл бұрын
@@zachariastsampasidis8880, what if the other players Kipchaks were unupgraded and got no upgrades, and/or were more expensive?
@zachariastsampasidis88803 жыл бұрын
@@thomasfplm I think cuman mercenaries is fine. No need to reinvent the wheel or make everything a simple stat increase
@d3athblad33 жыл бұрын
Marauder shouldn't be a candidate here. As a Huns player, you'll anyways build a lot of stables, at least 8-10 in Imp. With this tech, you can suddenly create a ton of siege-cavs that will clean up opponents' bases!
@europeanpatriot80313 жыл бұрын
Spirit of the LockPickingLawyer
@PablitoAndCo3 жыл бұрын
Before watching: Silk road is going to be pretty high up on the list. 7:35 : There it is, I knew it would appear.
@josephcote86343 жыл бұрын
Nomad allows you to delete your houses after you reach your limit to have more space for econ and military buildings. This could work in an arena game where your opponent has boomed into the rest of the map.
@bruderpastaklo43143 жыл бұрын
and then there is me ....a person that usually researchs all techs available because it triggers me to see unresearched techs in my buildings
@no1ofconsequence9363 жыл бұрын
In games against the AI, when I was rushed or otherwise took a beating, I would sometimes end up moving my base around so that they couldn't defeat me. That Mongol tech sounds like it'd be rather useful towards that end, but then again, I've become a better player since then, in no small part to this channel, and rarely am I in that situation. Still something to keep in mind, I suppose.
@semi59o3 жыл бұрын
I don’t think u understand how to use “the Great Wall” and “nomad” well. The Great Wall is more for tower/bombard tower rush. It’s especially useful in team games for the Chinese to spawn bombard towers in the field fight. Nomad is not saving the houses from being destroyed by enemies, a little redundancy can do that, as most enemies don’t have interest in ur houses. It’s a tech that u are able to delete ur houses on ur own to save spaces for farms and production buildings. For example, in arena, ur base can be full of houses and u r being pressured. Researching nomad can give u precious space to farm and mass ur hussars.
@Hamanuna3 жыл бұрын
Thanks to the last update, The Artillery tech is really worth it, so which tech would fill their spot?
@TheArklyte3 жыл бұрын
Cuman Mercenaries can be useful if you find 3 other psychos to play full 4Cuman team with you;)
@integralinsanity16413 жыл бұрын
Big brain
@potatoesstarch23763 жыл бұрын
I would argue that silk roads is the best tech for 1v1 trading as you will be losing many trade carts.
@fgfgfgfgt3 жыл бұрын
Yes when u use trade carts like siege ram
@pinyi25823 жыл бұрын
Shatagni/Royal Heirs/Mahouts/Eupseong/Greek Fire. they should be on the list
@saulzebovitz78993 жыл бұрын
Agreed... I play Ethiopians all the time. Royal heirs would be a lot better and I'd get it more, if shotels weren't already so fast to be created.
@clefspeareiii17103 жыл бұрын
“Greek Fire” - What, you mean you don’t like out-ranging enemy fire ships for a whole half a second, and also having just as long to avoid dying to demo ships??? Yeah... it’s really only good for raiding those buildings placed *slightly* out of reach for normal fire ships (Also the 3x/9x/256x tech mods make it **really** derpy XD)
@Spiz1033 жыл бұрын
I've had fun with Mongols using Nomads on Forest Nothing. If you rush a Castle up it really makes it easier to get up a huge villager count quickly.
@maxmustsleep3 жыл бұрын
i sometimes use mognol's nomad to save space in team games since they do take up an area that could be used for faming. it also helps with better pathfinding for trade carts
@gustavosanches34543 жыл бұрын
I havent played AOE2 since I was a kid... why do I keep watching his videos?
@calebcouch25973 жыл бұрын
Hop back on the train brother, the game is more popular than ever, and you could basically run it on a toaster
@Trasseurxd3 жыл бұрын
The mistake isnt watching the videos my lost son. The mistake is abandoning the grounds of age of emprires for such a long time. You are always welcome to come back and settle down again. You are always welcome in the family.
@jimtim11443 жыл бұрын
Gustavo my honorable grandson. You must once again play this great game! The game has so much to offer and has hundreds of hours of campaign!
@fruitenantcolonel92073 жыл бұрын
I think Microsoft is trying to tell is something by making atheism the most useless tech. What's up with that bill?
@filosofodosgames85503 жыл бұрын
if Atilla was alive today, Bill would be a major target for plundering!!!
@doctordarkness1003 жыл бұрын
Bill has become one with the machine. He is god now. The faithless ones shall perish
@ljss68053 жыл бұрын
I agree on most, but Mongols' NOMADS is an awesome tech. I disagree with the analysis of that paying for itself only when you're already losing the game. Houses take up tons of space that you can spend on military or eco buildings and that can make your trade more effective. Nomad is a great tech.
@Gannon21453 жыл бұрын
I haven't played this game in like 15+ years but I can't stop watching these
@rytsty43023 жыл бұрын
7:23 that was a good one
@captainkirk2653 жыл бұрын
Imagine playing a standard game mode 8 player free for all on where everyone's playing as Huns and everyone researches atheism. You've built a wonder. You will win in 2 weeks. Me: Luckily for me, I have no life.
@febrip.a11193 жыл бұрын
Lol
@kaihus3 жыл бұрын
Nomads tech can also be very useful on very tight and clumped up maps like nomad or soccotra, if you need more space for farms and buildings. You can just delete all your houses afterwards
@mythology24673 жыл бұрын
Nomads is great when you're pressed for space, you can use your whole arena base for farms and useful buildings. I think the other techs were shatagni because HC naturally suck, chratras since b. Eles have so much hp already, Greek fire since you're not exactly heavy micro fire ships.
@gmwdim3 жыл бұрын
Boiling oil for the Persians used to be pretty bad, until DE changed it.
@BryanLikesCandy3 жыл бұрын
What was that one again? I'm old and my brain can't keep up sometimes!
@gmwdim3 жыл бұрын
It made castles do more damage to rams. However the extra damage wasn’t enough to stop rams from destroying castles. Especially since you would need murder holes as well to make it even remotely useful, which is a further resource investment for pretty minimal benefit.
@kyallokytty3 жыл бұрын
How did DE change it?
@BryanLikesCandy3 жыл бұрын
@@kyallokytty replaced it with Kamandaran.
@kevintrang30073 жыл бұрын
@@BryanLikesCandy That explains why I've never heard of trash archers before
@avideogamemaster3 жыл бұрын
The Korean tech that increases the speed of the turtle ships. Not only water maps are rare, turtle ships are fairly expensive and slow. Having to pay more for just 15% more speed is a bit much. I'm glad they replaced the tech in the newest patch.
@faultier32153 жыл бұрын
Silk Road is such an extremely usefull tech! just remember to research it when you start building markets in the corner and it will save you 2000 wood and 1000 gold for 40 trade carts! Also, at this point of a game you are often low on gold, so you will be able to afford more trade cards faster, meaning your trade profit will be much bigger at an earlier point in the game
@EdwardNavu3 жыл бұрын
I got an eToro ad in between the topic of Saracen Madrasah (Monk hedge) and Burgundian civ bonus (Knight hedge). Interesting.
@pieterpretorius97433 жыл бұрын
One-time techs are the dumbest ones imo. It just doesn't feel like a technology.
@najarvis3 жыл бұрын
I would disagree with the comment on Paper Money that "if you don't use it right away it is wasted." It is still a net 500 gold increase that you didn't have to collect, regardless if you spend it now or in 2 hours that's still 500 gold you wouldn't have had otherwise (7:29).
@codyirwin55083 жыл бұрын
Remember 500 gold in early castle is alot different than 500 gold mid imperial.
@najarvis3 жыл бұрын
@@codyirwin5508 True, but again it is still an extra 500 gold you didn't have otherwise. That's enough for almost 7 knights. SOTL has shown that even a few extra numbers can have huge effects.
@Nonex443 жыл бұрын
Can you do best and worst team bonuses if you haven't already? Great stuff by the way!
@ALFversusDONGATO3 жыл бұрын
Zealotry for Saracens has a very interesting effect (+30 HP for Camels), but it's too expensive to use at 750F 700G. In most cases, you're better off just creating 12 Camel Riders or 9 Mamelukes for that cost
@ShadowOfCicero3 жыл бұрын
You know what Nomads would be useful for: Forest Nothing.
@clefspeareiii17103 жыл бұрын
I mean, assuming you start in post-castle/ imperial age in your Forrest Nothing games...
@ljss68053 жыл бұрын
And BF in post imp; makes for better trade and more aggressive military and eco buildings.
@lucaa.64063 жыл бұрын
Artillery is a very good tech in close maps.
@uzairahmed48323 жыл бұрын
"... You know which one I mean" I was hoping that he'll diss on the saracens again
@rasmustagu3 жыл бұрын
"Hey guys, Spirit of The Law here" I hear as I binge the 23rd video in a row.. today.
@Digibullet323 жыл бұрын
3:20 .... alll i wante din this video was 1 of those catapults to die to those arrows... :( never saw it :(
@Just_a-guy3 жыл бұрын
10 trade cart and silk road pay for itself. That can u lost in one raid. especially when u lost gold income and have to replace. And it is team game so being slow isnt that big of a deal. I consider it very good and relatively cheap for imp
@fkk10023 жыл бұрын
Yeah, it's a sick bonus in team games. Silk Road should not have been mentioned in the video.
@Hawklaxx3 жыл бұрын
The problem is that it is entirely useless in 1v1. Tbf I do agree that it is actually a pretty strong tech for team games but I’d say for over half the games played it is useless.
@Just_a-guy3 жыл бұрын
@@Hawklaxx all water bonus are usless on lots of map :/ But i wont say that Carrack is bad. And most shocking thing about it is the fact that SoTL said lately that teamgames often ends when trade is destroyed. So cheap tech that helps rebuild it should be one of the best :D
@Hawklaxx3 жыл бұрын
@@Just_a-guy that is a good point, see I don’t really disagree tbh. Just trynna explain what I think spirits thought process is.
@luisdizon24863 жыл бұрын
The one time one of my Hun teammates used Atheism was also the one time the opponents actually went for a wonder victory. They still won though.
@digppa253 жыл бұрын
Ok mostly agree, except for artillery. Artillery gets bbt to 13 range which matches the range of bbc with siege engineers, so basically you can micro them and never get your towers taken down by bbc. It also gets your bbc to 14 range which means you can stay closer to your line when taking down trebs. Its a must have for for any team game where i have turks, and any 1v1 turk mirror. More situational when you are turks 1v1, but very few 1v1 games get to the imperial unique tech anyway.
@Bannanafighter3 жыл бұрын
artillery guy here! request it to be taken off the list!!
@harishsundar34093 жыл бұрын
Turks don't have siege engineers, so it is basically just a +1 to bombard cannons and it is at the cost of a castle to produce janissaries out of
@rovsea-37613 жыл бұрын
Concur, I'd argue that for turks +2 range on bombard cannons is often worth the cost of a castle, especially in a team game.
@zachariastsampasidis88803 жыл бұрын
@@harishsundar3409 Yeah it feels retarded to have turks missing siege engineers. Trebs have insane range, Tatars have hill bonus and they still got a +2 range while also having siege engineers. I get that bombards produce faster and instantly from Turks (chemistry free) and even have higher hp but they are THE designated gunpowder civ and they have gutted skirms pikes and mango lines
@Sodacacik3 жыл бұрын
Just make it possible to trade between two of your own markets. EASY MODE
@louiskeen91643 жыл бұрын
BRINNNGG BAAAACKKK THE INTROOOOOOOOOOOO
@OriginalMasterChafa3 жыл бұрын
I immediately thought of Greek Fire from the Byzantines, which gives fire ships +1 range. It is not bad IF the map has a substantial amount of water AND the enemy makes ships...
@caglaralaca3 жыл бұрын
Actually you are right.. Because... Greek Fire increases Fire ship range by +1 but at the same time it reduces Fire Ship's %100 acc to 80 (iirc) It should be fixed asap.
@OriginalMasterChafa3 жыл бұрын
@@caglaralaca omg that sucks
@CG-eh6oe3 жыл бұрын
@@caglaralaca Actually, fires have a 0% accuracy. They miss every shot. But their dispersion is pretty low, so they hit anyway as ships are rather big - they just hit another pixxel, but who cares. But if you increase the range, the dispersion increases as well, making it possible to miss for real.
@oyuyuy3 жыл бұрын
I must say that I disagree with the balancing aspect. In my opinion, everything should be at least situational, otherwise there's no point of having it in the game. I don't mind if once strategy is favored 80-20 over another, but if it's 99-1 it's kind of silly I think.
@Septimus_ii3 жыл бұрын
Yeah, I would prefer that every civ had a good balance of civ bonuses, unique units and unique teches
@jimtim11443 жыл бұрын
Well I would tend to agree but simply stating this is the easy part. What would be the change you would have? How much would this new tech cost? What value does this proposed new tech bring? That is more to the point than just saying that the tech itself needs to change. What is your proposed change? I personally think they should just have Atheism as is so keep the cheaper spies/treason but they should get rid of the whole wonder thing and replace it with all units resist conversion. Kinda like the Teutonic team bonus.
@Alche_mist3 жыл бұрын
But everything IS at least situational. But some things (like the Hun unique techs or some of the Monastery techs such as the Herbal Medicine) are useful in other game modes than the Multiplayer Conquest. Which is completely fine.
@MushroomCloudGaming3 жыл бұрын
I honestly don't think any tech should cost stone, especially Turk Artillery.
@jimtim11443 жыл бұрын
Yeah stone cost is rough BUT If you are doing the tech you are probably collecting more stone than the average player. So you probs can afford it. And it makes tower pushing god tier as turks so I would say its worth it. I would say its worth the one castle you lost for it.
@MushroomCloudGaming3 жыл бұрын
@@jimtim1144 Yes absolutely. I love the turks and I love their overpowered bombard tower :)
@01ehlert3 жыл бұрын
Andean sling (no minimum range on skirms and slings), bearded axe (+1 throwing axemen range) (when do you see axes not as a meme), Timurid seige craft (flaming camels and +2 on trenbs) and maybe iron clad (+melee on seige).
@sethp62103 жыл бұрын
I like to use Nomads to be able to delete all the houses in my base to have more room for farms and military production, still not super useful but definitely makes more sense when you use it like that