Thanks to Scopely for sponsoring this video - Download Star Trek Fleet Command on iOS & Android and battle in the Star Trek universe here: pixly.go2cloud.org/SH2rH
@HOLDENPOPE2 жыл бұрын
I love how the sponsor legitimately fits into the video
@robinthrush96722 жыл бұрын
Get a practice bat'leth from Purple Heart Armory to test please!
@joshuatempleton95562 жыл бұрын
show this to shad at your next game.
@bobcrutch89052 жыл бұрын
Hello Matt I hope you are well, happy Christmas to you and your family and all the best of luck for the channel in the new year...cheers now
@TheUncleRuckus2 жыл бұрын
Scopely sucks!
@Skallagrim2 жыл бұрын
Aw come on, I literally just recorded a video about the Bat'leth and am still editing... Nobody is going to believe that's a coincidence. xD
@JeffHays2 жыл бұрын
Does that count as being mooned?
@book31002 жыл бұрын
It'll be interesting nonetheless
@GallowglassAxe2 жыл бұрын
I would still watch yours too. There is an episode in Deep Space Nine where Lt. Dax makes a hologram Batleth and give very percise measurements. Unfortunately I don't know the episode off hand. Here it is. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/qsCJi9er2rrPpnk.html
@The_Jimplication2 жыл бұрын
To be fair you made a review years ago in the mohawk days of your channel of a different Klingon weapon , the Mek'leth , which was kind of like a kukri with a sharpend knuckle guard on it. It's been a long time since I watched it but I think you did shit on the bat'leth, but you kinda dug the Mek'leth.
@KickyFut2 жыл бұрын
So all the weapon people who were scoffing about the bat'leth a few years ago are now double backing on themselves?!🤔
@ECHenry2 жыл бұрын
We actually see a bat'leth variant in Worf's quarters with a significantly lengthened central grip. That might be onscreen evidence for a hypothetical longer "battlefield" version of the bat'leth.
@CD-ek3iq2 жыл бұрын
Gonna have to see a 3D version of it I think to be sure :)
@irregularassassin63802 жыл бұрын
Or a bat'leth tailored for fighting mounted opponents perhaps. It hasn't got any guard on the grip, which basically turns it into the haft of a polearm.
@thunder24342 жыл бұрын
"Battlefield Bat´leth", I like this name.
@williamgallagher49592 жыл бұрын
do you remember the episode number?
@nickm91022 жыл бұрын
@@williamgallagher4959 don't remember the number but you get a good look at Worf's quarters in the episode where perform the Right of Assention and Duras is killed. It is in season 3 I believe. On a slightly different topic in Way of the Warrior Dad has the Holosuite produce a Bat'leth if I recall correctly she gives length and weight.. Worf mentions it was a "warrior's configuration"
@Maverick8t882 жыл бұрын
Quite a bit is known about Klingon biology. The episode where Worf is paralyzed told us they have a lot of biological redundancy. Twice as many ribs and a fortified spinal cord for instance. So not only do they wear armor literally everywhere, their skeletal structure is almost a subcutaneous armor as well
@GuyNamedSean2 жыл бұрын
Taking that into account, it always seemed to me, and seemed that the show was trying to depict, that the bat'leth was intended as sort of an armed grappling weapon. Kind of like a poleax as mentioned in the video. You would use it to try to force the opponent off balance in melee and then use one of the two longer points to stab into the opponent's ribs.
@wirelessg182 жыл бұрын
Was that the episode when we found out that Klingons are evolved from basically humanoid scorpions?
@pwnmeisterage2 жыл бұрын
@@GuyNamedSean If you exclude ceremonial and traditional styles - stuff like competitive fencing and kendo - sword fights always include grappling. Sometimes a lot, sometimes only in decisive moves. Bulky heavy multi-pointed blades tend to make grapples more clumsy, risky, and difficult for both the wielder and the opponent.
@sadrak-px8wq2 жыл бұрын
@@wirelessg18 no, it's the episode where Worfs back is broken and he gets a newly cloned spine (s5 ep16 "Ethics")
@wirelessg182 жыл бұрын
@@sadrak-px8wq appreciate it
@markfergerson21452 жыл бұрын
Star Trek nerd here. In Next Generation and DS9 episodes we see Worf and other Klingons (and the occasional human) using the bat'leth as a draw/push cutter, chopper *and* stabber, plus hooking opponent's arms and legs. Binding with the curved front edge is extremely important. To my mind the typical bat'leth fight proceeds somewhat like a Sumo bout. There's an initial rush and clash often resulting in a bind, then some fencing roughly equivalent to grappling for a leverage advantage, then one combatant is taken off their feet. A typical finishing strike is a downward two-handed chop/stab taking advantage of the angle of the pointy ends; notice that the opposite end curves *away* from the user in that move, unlike what's seen in most fantasy weapons. As to the weapon's length, in lore it should be equal to your height when you take a knee (so that if one leg is disabled you can still fight effectively). I'm six feet tall so for me, *with my build*, that works out to almost exactly 4' 6" rather than he "official" five foot length so perhaps the average ancient Klingon was a bit taller than the average modern human or were longer in the torso. Finally, there are fan groups who practice bat'leth fighting developing various fight styles, and holding competitions at conventions, based on what's seen on screen. Pseudo-Historical Klingon Martial Arts, one might say. (A Klingon could probably pronounce PhKMA but I can't.)
@GothamClive2 жыл бұрын
The binding wouldn't actually work. It doesn't really work with swords either, outside of movies. However, the way it doesn't work makes it a better weapon. The bind always happens after somebody has blocked to give the fighters a chance to stare and growl at each other. If you look at the position the bat'leth usually has at the point of the bind, then you would see that in that situation the defender can easily attack the left or right of his opponent. A sword would give only one attack direction.
@Matt_Alaric2 жыл бұрын
"As to the weapon's length, in lore it should be equal to your height when you take a knee" Where is this stated in the lore?
@ronhan92 жыл бұрын
Also didnt Dax in DS9 specify exactly to the computer how she wanted hers in lenght and weight before she sparred with a klingon warrior she had known for many years in her former body
@markfergerson21452 жыл бұрын
@@ronhan9 I think you're right. My headcanon is that the bat'leths we see are mass produced standardized models stocked in all Klingon ships' armories and issued for their versions of away missions, and that each House may have its private versions (explaining the slight differences we see). Officers at or above Captain rank might be expected to carry their own custom models but your average warrior has to use the "one-size-fits-none" standard, but probably also trains with them.
@markfergerson21452 жыл бұрын
@@Matt_Alaric I've tried to post responses twice but they go away for some reason (either that or I can't see them for some reason). I saw it in a non-canon book but can't remember author or title. Do a search for "how long should a bat'leth be" or "sizing a bat'leth". There are fan sites giving the same advice but also not citing a source (dammit).
@kairyumina64072 жыл бұрын
Speaking on biology, you can also come down to things like metabolism and oxygen exchange. If another species tires faster, or slower, or has more explosive metabolism, that can also change how weapons are designed/ used.
@TheManOWrath2 жыл бұрын
No
@john-paulsilke8932 жыл бұрын
Gorillas share 96% of our DNA and almost all the same bones and even tendon and muscle connections. However in spite of all these similarities they are incapable of throwing overhand, hand lift around 25 times their body mass, vs a human who typically can’t lift twice their weight and have no endurance in comparison to a reasonably athletic human who can run for hours vs a few minutes for a gorilla.
@lowpull6222 жыл бұрын
Personally, I'd wouldn't be beamed with a Bat'Leth in a disruptor fight!😬
@lowpull6222 жыл бұрын
@@john-paulsilke893 Speak for your self!💪✌️
@Scuzzlebutt1422 жыл бұрын
One of the things we do know about klingon biology is lots of redundancy in organs, and they have a lattice work rib structure, meaning the heavy tines on the bat'leth make a degree of sense trying to punch through their ribs to get to their organs.
@ModernKnight2 жыл бұрын
It was great to see you apply historical analysis and thought processes to a fictional weapon. Hmm, now I'm wondering if I can source one to try from horseback.
@eldrenofthemist24922 жыл бұрын
Can you Test it while Wearing armor. Both on Horse back and on foot. You could also test it's Usefulness against Both Shields and armor. Lastly. Is it more Effective in Tight spaces Like in a Castle, ship or Battle line formation. or Is it better when you have more space like open field. Would it be more like a sword like a every day self defense weapon. or more for duals, Arenas, tournaments or other such event based battles. Edit: Also the Bat'Leth Maybe use-able while fighting in or under water. It maybe good as an amphibious assault weapon. Which would be nice to test as well.
@aaronpulley75282 жыл бұрын
Batleth on horseback video. 🤣 Yes please! Did the Klingons use them while mounted on targs?
@Riceball012 жыл бұрын
Matt, you really need to look into whether or not anybody makes synthetic practice bat'leths so that you can take it to your class and see how well they actually work. Then you should have Tod make a proper one from steel and sharpened and see how well it cuts.
@starchitin2 жыл бұрын
I'd love to see vids of this
@robinthrush96722 жыл бұрын
Purple Heart Armory has one.
@LarryGarfieldCrell2 жыл бұрын
Oh god, a Todd-made bat'leth for weird historical^W sci-fi weapons would be *amazing*. I'd love to see that collaboration.
@Tarnfalk2 жыл бұрын
I’m also super curious how it’d do against earth swords.
@BigHenFor2 жыл бұрын
@@Tarnfalk One-handed or Two-handed? I wonder if someone one day will mod the game "Hellish Quart" with a Klingon using a Bat'leth? That would be fun to watch.
@miketheskepticalone62852 жыл бұрын
I hadn't considered the length difference inherent between a naval infantry weapon, intended for combat in close confines, and a infantryman's weapon intended for the open field. This would make Worf's personal weapon a sailor's cutlass version of the bat'leth ... and suddenly the triple-grip makes sense. It needs to be able to absorb the attack of the heavier landsman's weapon, and it needs to be lighter, without sacrificing strength. It's not only shorter, handier in close confines, it's also structuraly lighter, with narrower ribs and grip-points ... so it gets more ribs, and a somewhat skeletonised appearance in comparison to, say, the Sword of Kah'less. Damn ... Dan Curry was The Man! I think the main stumbling block is how it's always referred to as the "Klingon Battle Sword", based on it's unitary construction and full-length cutting edge ... Really, it combines the features and function of a defensive short polearm, one designed to break armour, and a battle-AXE, designed to maximize the destructive power of a single massive strike. All in a package designed for (relatively) easy carrying. That it can still be gripped and manipulated from any point in its frame, due to the handgrip being a separate structure behind the cutting edge, also makes switching between defensive and offensive action surprisingly swift, especially given the mass of the thing.
@PJDAltamirus04252 жыл бұрын
Why would it get to be light as a ship, something you can mount or a wall and grab instead of having to lugg around and also when wrapping into rooms is a thing? Tons of cutlasses Matt showed in several video are about the same weight as long saber or heavier and made sturdier.
@hazzardalsohazzard26242 жыл бұрын
@@PJDAltamirus0425 Heavy weapons can be harder to use for extended periods, which could matter a lot. Italian Cavalry in the 19th century did training with a lighter sword than their fighting sword, because they had entire days of training and didn't want fencing practice to be too tiring.
@MrTrilbe2 жыл бұрын
I mostly find it odd that people do refer to it as the "Klingon Battle Sword" when they have a seperate battle sword design the Mek'leth kzfaq.info/get/bejne/fpaUf7ilsrzNhX0.html
@miketheskepticalone62852 жыл бұрын
Mostly, @@PJDAltamirus0425 , at least in my mind, because it carried through pre-space travel into actual shipboard carry and use, and the Klingon's slightly odd fetish for light, agile corvettes instead of heavier cruisers. Also, it was obviously a weapon they were not willing to abandon, so modifications were made to keep it at least somewhat practical for regular carry. No one, no matter how obsessive, will be entirely happy about carrying the equivalent of a bearded war axe AND spiked shield as personal sidearms, so ... stripping some mass, shortening it to make it both a bit handier and lighter for daily carry, and reinforcing the structure so it can still carry the brunt of action just make sense. Also, cutlasses were very much "daily use" sidearms, and expected to do a lot of heavy work lighter infantry and cavalry sabers would not be subjected to, and being too LIGHT for a task isn't one of the bat'leth's faults.
@jonathanwessner34562 жыл бұрын
@@PJDAltamirus0425 Advanced materials technology. Lighter, more durable, and harder materials are possible in the Trek age. Ergo, a weapon with the lightness of aluminum, strength of heavy steel, and edge retention of high carbon steel would be a good thing. Add in that their world (I believe) has higher gravity, a lighter weapon would be faster in their hands
@ericmitchell9852 жыл бұрын
Have to say, I've never seen the comparison to a two-handed dueling shield, but, now that you pointed it out, I can't unsee it.
@Brentisimo2 жыл бұрын
I never considered this weapon in the context of close quarters armored combat. Once you mentioned armored combat, I could suddenly see its practical usage.
@disappointedoptimist2552 жыл бұрын
Yeah it'd be a better grappling implement than even a poleaxe with the curves and projections
@doppelhelixes2 жыл бұрын
i use a bat'leth in a VRchat game where you can draw your own weapon and armor. A lot of people wonder how i could beat them, i just block their weapon with the bat'leth while stabing them between their armor in the same move
@chrisball37782 жыл бұрын
Not watched it in decades, but from what I remember from TNG, the Bat'Leth was originally mostly a cultural artefact for Worf, which he embraced and tried to learn because he was an orphan brought up by humans who wanted to reconnect with his Klingon heritage. He used it to reenact historical and mythological Klingon battles and duels on the Enterprise holodeck. Originally it didn't really matter if it was a practical weapon- it was a symbol of his identity that mattered to Worf's character. But the fandom decided it was really cool so the writers created loads of extra lore for it and increasingly incorporated it into battle scenes. Which is basically just being a good writer who responds to audience feedback.
@Helbore2 жыл бұрын
Yep, the first time we see one, Worf uses it in combat against Duras, who is wielding a pretty traditional-looking sword. Which brings up an important aspect of consideration for the bat'leth as a weapon - its not only used against other bat'leths. It needs to be considered assuming that some Klingons will counter it with different weapons.
@andrewsuryali85402 жыл бұрын
I've played with a Bat'leth before, and it's actually pretty easy to thrust with BECAUSE the outward blades are curved. When you try to thrust one-handed with it, your natural grip will have to be slightly angled, which results in the curved edge of the outward blade actually pointing straight forward.
@thomasdiamond94582 жыл бұрын
Anyone trained in rifle and bayonet can see this could be used with effect, left parry,right parry, lunge,butt stroke,the cross check and slash. I would have no problem using in close contact.
@michaelhorning60142 жыл бұрын
I remember when I first saw the battleth I thought, "Looks cool, not practical." Then when they showed Worf using it, it was clear some actual thought went into it.
@spacecadet352 жыл бұрын
I use a bat'leth occassional in LARP and in sparring. I am not usually allowed to use it very often because it is too easy to beat my opponents and is considered unfair and unsporting.
@Skyfire_The_Goth2 жыл бұрын
@@spacecadet35 It's oh so much easier to try to limit what others can do than it is to improve themselves. I think, instead of, basically handicapping you, they should work to get better, maybe even learn to use one themselves and become overall better LARPers.
@juliahenriques2102 жыл бұрын
@@spacecadet35 Interesting. How do you deal with side blows to the blade messing the edge alignment and with the reduced leverage in a bind? In my limited experience I've found hooking, long range, and quick leveraging far superior to binds and hands-apart stances. That said, I can see how people would want to restrict it the same way they usually restrict spears and greatswords. If you're not larping in armour, things can go south pretty fast.
@LarryGarfieldCrell2 жыл бұрын
The biggest change I might make is dulling the central edge in front of the hands. If you're fighting another bat'leth user, odds are that area is going to smack into the enemy blade a lot. Given the design, it's really hard to not hit edge on edge, and edge on edge is likely to damage that portion quickly. Also, it's the least likely area to actually cut with. You have to get past the big vertical line of defense (the other guy's bat'leth), then strike in, then slide sideways. That's really hard. Most of the killing will happen with the pointy bits. So the central area should basically be a giant ricasso. Keep it tough and blunt to reduce damage and use that for defense, then swing the sharp and pointy bits around over/under the enemy's weapon out of a bind to stab him. And for that, the blades curving in as they do works better, as you will mostly be striking with a swing, not a linear stab. So basically, it's an anti-armor *stabbing* weapon (those look like pretty robust points), with an absolutely massive ricasso to protect your hands. You basically block with the ricasso and repost in a swing in a single move. Though I totally agree that a single-hole grip would be better, especially if doing larger swings. I do have some concerns about it being forward heavy, but that can probably be addressed mainly by how you hold it and swing it. If you hold it diagonally, close to you, it's probably not a big deal. And if you are mostly swinging in an arc, then that forward weight helps give it more penetrative power. Now please do the Mek'leth! :-)
@markfergerson21452 жыл бұрын
On the other hand you have the entire forward curve to bind with.
@chemistrykrang80652 жыл бұрын
Re the Mek'leth - actually looks quite practical. It's pretty much a kukri or small forward-curved falchion with a knuckle bow, right? Not half as daft as it first appears.
@spacecadet352 жыл бұрын
From a lot of experience, the first thing to do is "fatten" the grips so that they are more comfortable when striking. The way they are usually made, with leather wrapped around steel, makes it very hard to get your body weight behind a strike.
@arnaudgerard19712 жыл бұрын
Have you seen the fight between Qui Gon and Maul? Yes, Maul stabs him with the blade, yet before that, he knocks him with the handle. If that handle had been sharpened, Qui Gon not only would have been startled, but pretty heavily wounded already at the chin. Yes, it's probably not easy to get passed the opponents Bat'Leth, or whatever other weapon he might use, but at the moment you would do it, you might slice his throat already. Maybe, if the material really isn't that great in retaining sharpness (I'd say, it would be a Klingon material ;) nevertheless: I would still go sharpened edge every day of the week.
@ufc9902 жыл бұрын
Riposte not repost
@stephanwatson79022 жыл бұрын
16:46 I actually like where the points are, imagine swinging it with one hand. Much like the Falx sword, that would allow you to stab off of a swing; which makes for a very powerful penetrative attack
@robertcopp24112 жыл бұрын
For fighting in confined spaces (hallways, spaceships, indoors) I think a bat'leth with multiple grip points, striking points and hand protection would be super useful. the striking points being ahead of the grip would also make generating heavy strikes without tons of room for wind ups or maneuvering a lot easier.
@JamesCalbraith2 жыл бұрын
Love the idea that what we see in ST are basically Klingon cutlasses, because the action happens on ships.
@jts1702a2 жыл бұрын
They have limited size (for a two-handed weapon), are relatively flat, so can be stowed away in tight compartments in armories. Sounds like a ship weapon, alright!
@DrTssha2 жыл бұрын
And in situations where a Bat'leth is too big or bulky, there's a dagger close at hand to allow stabbing at extremely close quarters.
@Doc-Holliday18512 жыл бұрын
The original batleth is a lot better than the new redesigned ones.
@scholagladiatoria2 жыл бұрын
I agree
@axelhopfinger5332 жыл бұрын
Everything original Star Trek is better than any of the new stuff. Because everything past Voyager was made by imbeciles.
@Vivi23722 жыл бұрын
@@axelhopfinger533 The same people who made Voyager made Enterprise bud. And if this were over 20 years ago people would be saying the same thing about DS9 and Voyager. And if it were over 30 years ago they'd be saying it about TNG.
@axelhopfinger5332 жыл бұрын
@@Vivi2372 Ah sorry, completely forgot Enterprise. Yeah that was quite a decent Star Trek show too, would have deserved more seasons tbh. But i'm generally so repulsed by abominable Shitscovery and the JJ Abrams movies that i consider Star Trek defunct, desecrated and quite frankly dead since then. I mean, the Oville is better Star Trek than anything officially produced under the IP.
@Axterix132 жыл бұрын
@@marcogenovesi8570 I think you mean after the time war non-sense, for Enterprise, as the time war crap is all there at the start of series. And that's also when you get most of the sort of forced human vs Vulcan issues. The series gets much better once they begin building toward the founding of the Federation. But then, that's the norm for all but ToS... it takes them about two seasons to find their footing. That said, the opening theme song drags Enterprise down across all four seasons.
@martonmakhult34162 жыл бұрын
It is basicly a huge two handed can opener. So yeah, the armored combat weapon concept does make sense actually.
@PeoplecallmeLucifer2 жыл бұрын
11:30 well the theory is that the in universe reason for the design is twofold. 1 Klingons Don't use shields because they find it dishonorable and bat'leth was suposed to offer some defensive capabilites. and the second was to temper the Klingon natural battle frenzy becasue it required a lot of practice to use effficiently and there is also a history it started as some kind of a farming tool (which I cna see since it always kidna reminded me to antlers (and antlers were some of the earliest human tool matherial) )
@Psiberzerker2 жыл бұрын
For Improving the design, I would also add side scales. Those grips are basically leather wrapped sheet metal. For human hands, I would round that out with wood, bone, or whatever, for a more secure, and comfortable grip. (In addition to what Matt said, straight side spikes, and more grip options in general.)
@swagromancer2 жыл бұрын
For a human user, that would be quite sensible. For Klingons, however, that would likely be considered a cultural affront. They are no strangers to ergonomics, as their disruptors and other types of meelee weapons show, but the bat'leth is sort of a ritualistic weapon heavily tied to Klingon mythology. A lot of Klingon rituals require the endurance of pain and discomfort, so I guess that's why the bat'leth never got updated in the way other weapons have.
@littlekong76852 жыл бұрын
I read a few great internet treatises on the Bat'Leth. One thing that strikes me as interesting, is the lore behind its invention. An unskilled warrior poet/bard created the weapon under the nose of a powerful and brutal overlord. He took passionate youths, farmers, craftsmen, and trained them as a small guerrilla army to battle the much larger, more professional oppressors armies. The culture had swords, flails, spears, (We see some "historical" weapons through the show), but these were used without shields (as shields were considered cowardly, and when they were used, were discarded immediately when battle began so as to effect more power in their strikes). And "professional warriors" would rely on excessive rage to carry them through enemies with sheer brutality and force. So, by designing a slower, more defensive weapon, one that can catch powerful two handed blows and redirect them, while still allowing a reverse counter strike, would be valuable. The amateurs were forced to learn control, to redirect the much more ferocious warriors strikes and use that power against them as they over-committed and opened themselves to the back end of the weapon which could thrust upwards into ribs/arm pits. The weapon also allowed them to work as units on the battlefield, as unlike a flail or a massive two handed sword, you could stay close and attack the same opponent together, where the oppressors armies would be a mob of individual warriors attacking without finesse or defence with the biggest weapon at hand. The Bat'Leth is basically a shield, axe, and sword all rolled into one unit, a unit strong enough to absorb blows, fast enough to counter-strike, but powerful enough to crack armour and tough Klingon hides. This is why the creator taught joy, not rage like the oppressor had. Taught them to slow and to think in battle, to work in formation, to use terrain and to learn from other battles through song, and to share tactics, not hold them as family secrets. He tempered them in a way they would accept and so won out against a much larger (less organized) force that used brutality and numbers above all else to win. He out thought his opponents, out finessed them, and outlasted them until their own rage made them vulnerable and weak.
@richlee37772 жыл бұрын
Love it! Even if there are "superior" alternatives, sometimes a weapon with strong traditions behind it will be more popular. Klingon cultures values tradition strongly, and this story would elevate the Bat'Leth higher than it's practical purpose might indicate.
@littlekong76852 жыл бұрын
@@richlee3777 I think when you look at it as a purposefully challenging weapon to wield (thus increasing the honour of the few who wield it masterfully, as only the calm and thoughtful can master it), and a weapon built for a purpose long since abandoned, it changes the context and reveals a new purpose born from the tradition.
@arnaudgerard19712 жыл бұрын
Now that's a nice poem song they will sing about you in Sto'Vo'Kor. (Even if it's true or not :)
@Valandar22 жыл бұрын
The Bat'leth is like a Klingon - it's scary, and dangerous, but not as dangerous as a lot of people claim.
@alexanerose48202 жыл бұрын
Unless humans have evolved tough skin , better reflexes, or regenration then that thing is gonna chop you like pork if it lands wether you're a typical Red Shirt or captian of teh whole ship which in summary emans still prettty freakin' dangerous It's only a question of delivery and opportunity as with many weapons
@Valandar22 жыл бұрын
@@alexanerose4820 Not saying it's a USELESS weapon. I'm saying it's not as dangerous as many real world weapons, which would become only more dangerous in the hands of someone with the power and endurance of a Klingon. But too many fans have it in their heads that a Bat'leth is an unstoppable weapon that will overcome anything.
@cdavidrollins88682 жыл бұрын
Great video! Good analysis. In the various series they make a point of the "overdesign" of Klingon physiology, specifically things like 23 ribs, an eight chambered heart, and multiple internal organs. The bony protuberances on their forwards are shown to extend down their backs and other parts of their bodies are shown to have some level of perhaps vestigial internal armoring. The episode in which Worf devolved into some form of ancient Klingon showed him with a full exoskeleton. So in this sense the comments about the bat'eth being designed for armor making even more sense. The Klingon is always armored. I think this is why other Klingon weapons like the d'k tahg and kut'luch are so vicious looking is because you have to do really terrible damage to hope to kill a Klingon.
@Peter_Wendt2 жыл бұрын
Scholagladatoria makes much more sense in the original Klingon.
@swagromancer2 жыл бұрын
Which would be {yanwI' DuSaQ}, for anyone interested in a translation.
@sarahscott53052 жыл бұрын
I'd love to see you take look at the Mek'leth, I've loved it since I first saw it in DS9 ☺️ I'd still love to have a Bat'leth though, even if a 5 foot blade would be as big as me x
@andymac48832 жыл бұрын
Very glad to see you bringing up Dan Curry; I remember reading about his intentions and methodology in coming up with the Bat'leth and creating an exotic but practical weapon, and I always wondered about that whenever I saw people criticising the weapon.
@kitsunekierein72532 жыл бұрын
Another interesting observation is that the three handles can actually change the physics of cuts made with them. For example, gripping on the same handle will give you reach and spin physics with very wide chapping movements. Transition to grip the outside handle in one hand and the middle handle in the other, and suddenly you can multiply the force of chops by pulling one handle and pushing the other. This also allows you to change the position of the weapon in a fundamentally different way when compared to the first. And by gripping the outside handle, you suddenly have stupid exact control over the weapon, are poised to receive heavy blows, parry and attack in ways not possible in the above two positions. This grants the weapon a certain amount of unpredictability in that the weilder need only change grip to fundamentally alter their fighting style mid fight similar to half swording as you pointed out. I'm not a martial artist, but I do have a certain level of skill in both stick fighting and the bastard sword without any formal training. I'm more of a martial enthusiast/hobbyist. If you are a martial artist, feel free to kindly correct me where it is appropriate! Keep it up man!
@PJDAltamirus04252 жыл бұрын
.....Yeah, but you accomplish the same thing quicker with one long hand hold along being to do pool cueing.
@kitsunekierein72532 жыл бұрын
@@PJDAltamirus0425 I hadn't thought about that... This is why y'all are the experts! 😂
@PJDAltamirus04252 жыл бұрын
@@kitsunekierein7253 I'm not an expert.. I've just toyed around with allot of weapons... Matt is the expert.
@arnaudgerard19712 жыл бұрын
Although I wonder, if you do one long instead of 3 segments, you don't have the blade connections in the middle. Then you basically have one large ring -> ellipse. I of course don't know what that means for balance, or maybe vibrations in the blade or the handle, whether that would make it more practical for the user or not. And of course I don't know anything about Klingon material(s), whether they are prone to vibrations etc. or not.
@laurenceperkins74682 жыл бұрын
@@arnaudgerard1971 If you were designing one for real use, the three grip design could be made of thinner/lighter material to reduce the overall weight of the weapon without sacrificing rigidity. The tradeoff for that is more limited grip options. But if your fighting style would be making use of those three positions anyway it might be a worthwhile tradeoff.
@damientonkin2 жыл бұрын
As someone who's trained (not extensively) in Okinawan staff technique I've generally thought of the bat'leth in those terms. It's clearly not a sword but as a short range polearm it makes a certain amount of sense. I have a replica of Worfs mek'leth in my collection which I need to make a sparing version of at some point. I think Michael Dorn has much larger hands than I do.
@paavohirn37282 жыл бұрын
If anyone could make highly educated points about the possible contexts of the Bat'leth it would be you, Matt 🤯 Thanks again for the entertaining and informative take on a subject i didn't expect to look into. Oh, also the blade design makes sense considering advanced (i presume) Klingon metallurgy.
@jamesonbetts18322 жыл бұрын
I always thought that the weapon actually seemed most similar to various types of bulls or deer that fought to show dominance rather than specifically to kill. In my eyes I feel like Klingons had an analog to this and took inspiration as an icon of strength.
@adambielen89962 жыл бұрын
Thats actually an interesting thought. It even matches up with out they are shown being used against each other, locking horns if you will.
@carloshenriquezimmer75432 жыл бұрын
And if you think about it, beying a mithologcal/ceremonial weapon design, an animal inpiration makes a lot of sense. Also, Klingon Houses very ofthen fight against each other, for dominance rather than elimination, so the analogy is very appropriate.
@mahrcheen2 жыл бұрын
That makes sense
@karlsmith25702 жыл бұрын
I'd seen a number of those other weapons specialists who you've mentioned, and I actually have to agree with you on the fact that they didn't dive deeply enough into the the design elements of which the Bat'Leth was based on I personally appreciate that you dove deeper into these design elements of what the Bat'Leth was based upon
@john-paulsilke8932 жыл бұрын
Very much like martial arts. They are typically very good against a similar skill set but quite vulnerable against different martial arts depending on their foundations. (Boxing vs wrestling for example, or Karate against Jujitsu).
@karlsmith25702 жыл бұрын
@@john-paulsilke893 or even Kung Fu vs. Muay Tai
@mikepette44222 жыл бұрын
glad he did this I always thought some of the people were criticising the weapon a little too much.
@karlsmith25702 жыл бұрын
@@mikepette4422 yeah, for real
@cptblood19812 жыл бұрын
I read something many years ago by a HEMA enthusiast who said that, even for humans on earth, it was a fine weapon, his biggest criticism was that it was impractical in THE WAY IT WAS USED in star trek. He described a much different way of using it involving short thrusts and hooking type maneuvers. He described it as a much more defensive style than you see on screen with it being used as a shield more. It was really fascinating and, to my untrained mind, seemed to make a lot of sense.
@spacecadet352 жыл бұрын
From experience with the weapon, the standard guard I use, I call the "Wall block" Basically you hide behind the bat'leth. When the attack, you deflect with the wall and hit them with the tail end. Then ten quick, full power, attacks in three seconds usually finishes the engagement.
@joshuahadams2 жыл бұрын
I’d wanna almost box with it. Keep it close, block and parry with the centre and jab and hook with the ends, maybe think of it like an overgrown trench knife.
@spacecadet352 жыл бұрын
@@joshuahadams - Your idea sounds good to me. There is more than one right way to use a weapon.
@TorianTammas2 жыл бұрын
@@spacecadet35This sounds like a sure way to die against a combination of spear and shield.
@spacecadet352 жыл бұрын
@@TorianTammas - You modify your technique against different weapons. I fight differently against a polearm or spear than I do against a sword
@inregionecaecorum2 жыл бұрын
Every time there is a knife amnesty there is the obligatory picture of a Bat'leth on display as one of the terrifying weapons that have been handed in.
@S.A.M.S.20172 жыл бұрын
I always thought that the Bat’leth was under-rated having also studied Chinese and Okinawan martial arts in addition to American military swordsmanship. I don’t own any fantasy weapons but if I were to choose one to own and train with, the Bat’leth would be my choice. I have seen a trend among in the Star Wars fans of training the lightsaber as a martial art. I would venture to say that if a group of dedicated Star Trek fans started a group that is dedicated to training the Bat’leth, we may learn that its potential as a martial art is greater than most people give it credit for.
@jamielondon64362 жыл бұрын
Those groups exist. :-)
@S.A.M.S.20172 жыл бұрын
@@jamielondon6436 Well there we go. I would be interested to see what techniques they come up with.
@jamielondon64362 жыл бұрын
@@S.A.M.S.2017 I'd be surprised if none of them were on KZfaq …
@longrider422 жыл бұрын
As others, including yourself have said. The Bat'Leth was used on board star ships, and in tight quarters, so you would not want a long weapon. I think even a longer sword would be impractical. I've always envisioned using one in a style of the short staff or Bo Staff, as some one else pointed out. The Bat'Leth is both weapon and shield, just like a staff. Keep up the good work.
@Kamdrimar2 жыл бұрын
Melee weapons on space ships make a lot of sense when you think of a species having space travel before they have the ability to prevent ranged weapons from punching holes in the ship.
@Torquenation2 жыл бұрын
I like the way that you bring the totality of the question into consideration. A very good approach to understanding all types of situations. Fun too.
@ducatobeing2 жыл бұрын
I felt that you gave a very fair and well conceived analysis of the Bat'leth. As a life log Trek fan and history geek I really enjoyed your video. You didn't poke fun and your comments were constructive. Thank you, Very entertaining!
@M4TCH3SM4L0N32 жыл бұрын
I think that if you straighten out the outer blades you would actually make it more dangerous for thrusting. As it is, although you can't run someone all the way through with the Bat'leth, you can fully extend the weapon in front of your body without much fear of the opposite blade hooking on your person. I think that is especially true in light of your point about fighting in corridors, because you have the benefits of a longer reach but without increasing the space the weapon occupies.
@spacecadet352 жыл бұрын
From experience with the weapon, sweeping attacks are its strength. It is very rare that you would try to stab with it. While you can stab with it, it is more like staff than a sword. But I would make the curve a bit shallower to keep the center of gravity closer to the hand grips.
@changingyoutubeusernameisn73022 жыл бұрын
I'm put in mind of some of the axe-pick hybrids that were used in primarily [i]unarmored[/i] warfare in the Phillipines and Indonesia, which nonetheless focused on concentrating force into a point at the top of the blade. This also let them hook and easily reach over shields. If you consider the Klingon rubber forehead thing to be a more developed sagittal crest, it would make them far less vulnerable to blunt force to the head and further emphasize skull/rib puncturing ability and decapitation.
@sadrak-px8wq2 жыл бұрын
I'm so happy that my two favourite (and most trusted) HEMA experts give the Bat'leth serious credibility. Thanks, Matt!
@ThomasRonnberg2 жыл бұрын
Brilliant work Matt. This is excellent. Especially for acknowledging the designers' history and combining it with the massive and excellent array of pictures and explanations
@Lakikano2 жыл бұрын
Glad to see this! As a martial artist and trekkie myself I always thought the bat’leth was a good design. Picking one up and playing around with it I found that it seems to work well with Okinawan bo technique.
@longrider422 жыл бұрын
Because like a staff, you can use it to both attack and defend. So a Staff style of fighting makes sense.
@chemistrykrang80652 жыл бұрын
Okinawan Bo is a very versatile set of styles, and many of the techniques work well with sticks of different lengths too.
@annelively69322 жыл бұрын
but that technique sucks
@Lakikano2 жыл бұрын
@@annelively6932 lol, okay. Compared to what exactly? And why?
@annelively69322 жыл бұрын
@@Lakikano all other techniques. from all evidence. i mean who the fuck right? jeez
@michaelbates48342 жыл бұрын
Some very interesting considerations that you've brought up. As only a casual Star Trek enjoyer, my curiosity was drawn by some of the unusual and exotic weapons in the illustrations that you showed. Maybe the content of a future video? As far as the Bat'leth goes, I think another element of the design is its role (as I understand it) in ritualized combat. I would think that might cause the design to become more static, despite more practical considerations. I would like to hear more about how you think it would best be used (though that has probably been done to death by other content creators). Would it be most effective as a chopping weapon? What about thrusting or draw/push cuts? Not being a martial arts practitioner, it seems to me that the concave blade might be useful for binding other weapons and then performing push or draw cuts.
@markfergerson21452 жыл бұрын
Matt has done videos on (I think) all of the "unusual and exotic weapons" he showed. I'm kind of surprised he didn't use as an example the Central American macahuitl too.
@terrybullspellr83192 жыл бұрын
This is probably the most thoughtful bat'leth video i have seen.
@JosephKerr272 жыл бұрын
You mention good improvements. I definitely think unobstructed hand movement is key, but eliminating all the segments decreases structural integrity. Compromise with two big grip-holes separated by a middle strut. Plus, this weapon seems to want to turn in the hands, so the grip needs to be well-shaped and enough mass needs to be kept in the handle to offset that tendency. Totally agree on the points needed for thrusting, but I think that can be achieved by adding spikes without altering the weapon's continuous curve. Making me smile as always, Matt! :)
@anthonywestbrook21552 жыл бұрын
So I think it makes sense to conclude that Klingon hands were unarmored, and that targeting the hands was important enough to prioritize hand protection.
@spacecadet352 жыл бұрын
From a lot of sparring with Bat'leths, yes, the hands are a vulnerable point and most experienced swordsmen will target them eventually. But that is easier said than done because there is steel between the hands and the opponent. But is probably the single most effect tactic against the Bat'leth. So when using a Bat'leth, you should be aware of this.
@henrymach2 жыл бұрын
The real irony here is that the Bat' Leth is a very good defensive weapon
@titanscerw2 жыл бұрын
Not quiet oxymoron as shield for example is yet another type of defensive weapon
@rab7034 Жыл бұрын
I have NEVER heard a more concise, in- depth, discussion and, indeed a better explanation of the weapons design and potential history, in such a paleontological point of view by a martial arstist/practitioner/instructor and an expert on historical weapons design! Thank you Matt. By the way, Skal' tends to agree with you, if you were not aware.
@nicklarocco41782 жыл бұрын
As far as the Bat'leth's intended use, I think there's an episode of DS9 where Worf gives some history on the weapon. He says, and I'm paraphrasing, that old klingon weapons were far too agressive, and favored nothing but attack. This lead to wars where too many klingons died, because they were not focused on survival at all. So Kahless the Unforgettable designed a blade with defense in mind. The forward facing crescent was designed to catch incoming blades, parry, and counterattack much more effectively than previous klingon weapons. In addition Kahless created a new martial art to accompany the bat'leth that focused on defense, waiting for opportunities, counterattacks, and overall patience. It's also important Bat'leth translates to "sword of honor." It's seen in Klingon culture as being the most honorable weapon to use. Other weapons, like disruptors, and the mek'leth (kind of like a knife or short sword maybe) are looked down upon as being more weapons of desperation, or by cowards.
@The_Mad_King2 жыл бұрын
I am glad you make me think about different sides of “weapons ideas” I usually think the made up crap from sci-fi shows are useless nerd ideas and have no call to be in the conversation but you sir have always given me such great points of view here I am ... and agreed as usual... I love this show man. I want to buy you an ale some day
@arnaudgerard19712 жыл бұрын
Blood Wine or Romulan Ale?
@dezmod16442 жыл бұрын
@@arnaudgerard1971 prune juice?
@Ezyasnos2 жыл бұрын
The problem I have with a Bat'Leth is edge alignment (or well, more like point algnment). The leverage of the blade in front of the hand makes it rather unwieldy I think.
@chimaera44612 жыл бұрын
That's what I thought too. Maybe Klingons have particularly strong wrists.
@spacecadet352 жыл бұрын
Yeah, but you get used to that pretty quickly.
@Amaritudine2 жыл бұрын
@@chimaera4461In the fiction, an average Klingon is about twice as strong as an average human. They also have extra muscles and bones in their arms compared to us, so strong wrists are quite likely.
@bartweijs2 жыл бұрын
I had a customer once ask for a bath'leth. I explained him that I don't have access to baakonite composite (which is the special metal used in them). Nevertheless, I cut one out of 3mm steel and found it to be very very unwieldy. Then I cut one out of aluminium to mimic the props used on the set, and lo and behold, it's actually not a bad weapon. It's meant for a mobile person in active combat, it's not a static-swinging weapon. but you essentially have a shield in front of you; with spikes on either end to jab with. It struggles with spears; but it excells als closer range, and it allows you to close in much quicker then you expect. It would be better being straighter (2 horizontal spikes and 2 vertical spikes) and longer, but this would look less fancy ;-)
@laurenceperkins74682 жыл бұрын
Steel blades, aluminum body maybe? Get the weight down to where someone can handle it without having to do years of strength training.
@fabiangabriel79012 жыл бұрын
Dear Matt. I've been waiting for YEARS for you to make this movie. Thank you! Merry christmas, and a happy new year, from a big great klingon-nerd!
@patrickstewart34462 жыл бұрын
From what I’ve seen of it’s use, the Bat’leth was designed to overcome a foe armed with a… bat’leth. 😁
@TrekCannon2 жыл бұрын
Finally, someone who sees the value in the BAT'LETH
@KTo2882 жыл бұрын
many years ago at a convention I watched attendees cosplaying the Duras sisters do a short kata with the Bat'leth before their main skit. As I remember it they used a lot of very close circular movements around and across the body. To me they most reminded me of the kind of cuts one would make to dissuade someone trying to get into grappling range and wrestling you. So next up for completeness we need an episode on the Vulcan Lirpa, which has me thinking, especially the Amok Time version, of a very much shortened Monk's spade.
@McClane4Ever.2 жыл бұрын
In the context of a boarding weapon, it makes a lot of sense. Thanks for the fantastic video!
@Turkoktonos12 жыл бұрын
Hello Matt, would be interesting, if you could make a video about how to use the Bat'Leth. Defensive seems to be very easy with it, but how to attack seems to be quite difficult.
@TrueFork2 жыл бұрын
I remember 20+ years ago someone made a book on bat'leth technique but paramount sued them before I could buy a copy
@jritchey2672 жыл бұрын
Good points all around. Personally, I've always loved the Bat'leth in principle, but had issues with it's execution. Most of the issues I see are the same ones I have with film/video game design in general and just took as artifacts of the exaggeration and haste inherent in that context. Weapons in media are almost always grossly out of proportion and crudely executed so they "read" better on screen and can be easily fabricated en masse, ergonomics be damned (there are exceptions). However, with some thought and nuance applied to the principle in profile, cross section, and balance, it would be glorious to wield. Probably a minor nightmare to produce, but that's an entirely different matter. Always wanted a nice pattern-welded one...
@Wirrn2 жыл бұрын
Haven't had a chance to watch it yet but as much as I spent years saying the Bat'leth sucks, it is actually viable in the right hands (and not used anything like the way we see in the show). Give it to someone who's really good at *tai chi*, and ask them to use it - it suddenly works quite well(though it could do with being a little less spikey) - you hold it in close and use it defensively in lots of circular motions as you get right up in there in grappling range, with the option for a couple of longer strikes if needed. It's basically one of those high end exotic martial arts weapons, like a two handed version of sun and moon / deer antler knives / whatever you call them. The sort of thing that IF you're really good martial arts already you can switch over to and do really well with (but a poor battlefield weapon and terrible for giving newbies)
@TroyPacelli2 жыл бұрын
I am so appreciative of this video. I am a big Klingon enthusiast, and I got beat up in the comments section of Shadiversity's video about the batleH making many of the same arguments. I'm actually surprised that I haven't heard anyone comment on how the demonstrated usage on the show depicts it being used in a similar fashion as a shield, implying even more versatility. Shad even did a video about shields being used offensively. IDK. Just ... this is refreshing. Also, of all videos I've seen on KZfaq about the batleH, this one consistently demonstrated the best pronunciation of the word; better than the actors on the show, IMO. I have studied the language, attended the annual qep'a' (large meeting of the Klingon Language Institute) when it was held in the Chicgoland area, and appreciate this con-lang.
@chadfalardeau53962 жыл бұрын
If you watch TNG you can clearly see it requires specific training to be proficient with it.
@Quincy_Morris2 жыл бұрын
Yeah I really liked the design because it certainly looks alien, not like anything on earth (at least not the usual ones) but still looks like a reasonable weapon when you see how it’s used.
@dexterbelmain5892 жыл бұрын
Q'plah!
@RobinRobertsesq2 жыл бұрын
In E.E. "Doc" Smith's space opera series "Lensmen" he wrote of a space marine role that was armed to fight boarding actions in space that included in their arms a boarding axe resembling a short halberd or bec de corbin.
@stevethepirate28752 жыл бұрын
From the look of it in use, I kind of see it being similar to a short, bladed, quarterstaff.
@BananaMana692 жыл бұрын
You just got a pretty solid reply from Shad on this. Cant wait for the reply!
@SethKotta2 жыл бұрын
I'm convinced the bat'leth evolved from a farming tool, and that the concave blade would have made it better suited for harvesting their version of wheat or whatever.
@lobstermacsansbro4772 жыл бұрын
I'm they pretty much outright say it in the episode where they hunt for the Sword of Kahless. They mention he used the blade reap the field and to carve tools. Also Kahless was notably of common blood so the idea that the bat'leth originated as some sort of farming tool makes more sense.
@batou19762 жыл бұрын
Never really heard Matt talk about Star Trek before, and yet… I’ve always known he was a Trekkie. 😏
@bkane5732 жыл бұрын
*cough* trekker
@arnaudgerard19712 жыл бұрын
@@bkane573 Well, I think you should wear your dishonor with pride. :)
@chriswilliams19442 жыл бұрын
What an excellent, erudite video! No idea how this ended up on my recommended list, but very glad it did. You've won another subscriber with it. :)
@Poohze012 жыл бұрын
A couple of points - First up it's always seemed to me that the Bat'Leth is optimized for defense. The hand are very well protected as you mention, and the weapon is held in front of the body, with projections on each side that can easily defend attacks coming from either direction. Not that easy to get through. It's offensive possibilities seem more limited to me, although I might change my mind on that if I ever get to handle one. Second point, it's certainly not a side-arm! You couldn't really wear one while fighting with a spear or fire-arm as your main weapon, and there's no easy way to sheath a Bat'Leth. So I think of it as a specialized dueling weapon, meant for settling affairs of honor rather than being used on the battlefield or carried for self defense.
@stalkingtiger7772 жыл бұрын
Since it's mostly shown in dueling and the fact that Klingons love to get close enough to bite your face off, I think it's not impractical. Question: Pugil sticks are very similar in handling (length/offending ends) to a Bat'leth. I wonder if you're able to get anyone in your school who has knowledge sparring with Pugil Sticks to try and spar with practice Bat'leths? I would be interested in seeing if the skills carry over.
@markfergerson21452 жыл бұрын
AIUI the pugil stick was invented to simulate a rifle/bayonet combo, so anyone practiced with a polearm that has pointy bits at both ends should be pretty good with a bat'leth.
@rngwrldngnr2 жыл бұрын
16:00 regarding the restricted grip. I have often seen in other engineering contexts that devices will be designed in such a way that it becomes harder to use it badly (or moreover hard to make certain rookie mistakes, or very serious mistakes) even if that also cuts down on the flexibility of the device, particularly for experts who would be unlikely to make those mistakes. I'm curious if there's any history of militaries making that kind of design compromise to have weapons that can be more easily trained on and trusted to less experienced soldiers to basically allow them to equip more soldiers with it. Hard to say if that feels in character for the Klingons or not, but just a thought.
@Belphegorite2 жыл бұрын
You were probably thinking of melee weapons, but that is why automatic weapons went from fully automatic to selective fire. Inexperienced shooters waste ammo and can cause collateral damage as their shots go off target with full auto. A three round burst was a compromise between getting multiple shots at the target and firing effectively.
@greyvr43362 жыл бұрын
Yes. After the Indian Mutiny, the British designed several inferior weapons for 'native troops.' There are bolt action 'muskets' with unrifled bores and no magazine on the Enfield bolt action design. Also the US Army has a history of trying to make it harder to empty your magazine. The trapdoor Springfield single shot was used when lever actions were options. The Krag was slower to load than the Mauser. The Springfield 1903 had a magazine cutoff, the Garand took 8rd enbloc clips instead of a 20 round mag, (which was considered.) and the M16 was revised to 3rd burst for a time.
@laurenceperkins74682 жыл бұрын
There's also the simple structural consideration that that long grip will need to be made of thicker material than three short ones would. Potentially the three-grip version could have a substantial weight reduction for the low, low price of not being able to hold it in positions you probably weren't using anyway.
@greyvr43362 жыл бұрын
@@laurenceperkins7468 I think you're falling victim to the very common problem where one thinks an item isn't as strong as it really is. Many things are stronger then we think they are. Additionally, since Bat'leths are magic space metal, we should most likely add strength to the estimation.
@greyvr43362 жыл бұрын
OH! Another example of militaries making compromises is the use of steel sword scabbards. Awful things, they blunt the edge of the sword as you move around. It's much better to use a wood scabbard, but wood scabbards break, so logistics departments pushed metal scabbards. Result was blunt swords in combat. If swords had remained important, I imagine we might have seen serious pushback eventually, but this was quite late in the sword's life as a weapon.
@franksmedley86192 жыл бұрын
Hello there. I don't often comment on these kind of videos, even though I was an Enlisted Weapons Instructor in the USMC back in 1978 through 1980. I almost started typing frantically early on in the video, but by the end you had addressed my incipient comments topic. That the four foot version of the weapon is probably an 'indoors' and 'confined battlefield' type weapon. I also agree with the idea of straightening out the outer blades for better thrusting use. In addition, I agree that if one were to use this in an open battlefield, that one would do far better with a weapon of at least 5 feet, and probably more... like 6+ feet (I could easily see a strong Warrior wielding a 7 food Bat'Leth on foot and overpowering his foes with the mass of his weapon and utilizing it's better 'reach' to his opponent. Straightening the outer points would also turn this into a pretty good shortish pole arm for thrusting purposes. Even though the resulting weapon would be larger and heavier, it would do better damage to an armored opponent, in the hands of a trained Warrior. I still feel though, that Klingons would have had more 'normal' swords... probably something like an over sized Broadsword as a secondary weapon in case their Bat'Leth was somehow removed from their grasp. Having to fall back to just a knife seems a bit 'silly' to me culturally, even though the Klingons use such knives as an 'honor' weapon... probably to finish off a wounded foe... thus granting them a Warrior's Death and passage to the Warriors Paradise.
@stevenscott21362 жыл бұрын
I'm in the "specialized dueling weapon" camp. The name actually MEANS "honor sword", and you can see that while Worf has an elaborate flowy martial-art for it, other Klingons simply swing it like an axe and block like it's a hockey stick. This suggests that most don't bother to learn the old dueling/exercise style Worf picked up (Worf seems like basically the Matt Easton of Klingons, anyway), but simply keep it around out of tradition. If it was a practical weapon anymore, I'd expect to see more skillful use -- some of the comments here suggest what that use would look like. So it probably HAD a use (important enough to be tied to the great hero Kahless, anyway), but was soon replaced with other weapons, and spent centuries being a sport/performance, with the techniques slowly turning into the over-stylized kata that Worf likes, while actual skill in combat basically vanished as warriors spent their time with crossbows, firearms, disruptors, etc. The shape would have changed to suit the duelists and performers -- think of the old-style rifles used by military drill teams, because they happen to handle better in the fancy performances than the issued fighting rifles.
@hellfish23092 жыл бұрын
The irony being that Worf eventually prefers the mek’leth
@dlatrexswords2 жыл бұрын
Great points all around Matt! Loved you showcasing all of the Chinese weapons which it parallels. While it looks like Dan Curry probably did use the Deer horn knives ( 鹿角刀; Lùjiǎodāo) as the primary inspiration, I'd also mention that there is a Wushu weapon which is probably the closest real-world analog in the Cicada Wing dao (蝉翅刀/Chanchidao) kzfaq.info/get/bejne/sLtjgdaUtrOYoHU.html History is often even more wild than fiction!
@v_fencer2 жыл бұрын
Thanks for mentioning this. Many people somehow take it the reverse way.
@JZBai2 жыл бұрын
To add some even more (really obscure) Chinese weapons the Bat'leth may have taken inspiration from, there is the "Longtou ZhaDao/Dragon Head Guillotine Knife/龙头铡刀" or "Da Pi Suo/Big Split Lock/大劈锁": kzfaq.info/get/bejne/l5ikncSY1bnHgKc.html kzfaq.info/get/bejne/i9xjoLmUrJyaqHk.html
@Muazen2 жыл бұрын
I remember they said in TNG that Klingons have multiple redundant organs, would their weapons need to do wider damage to the body as for example piercing their heart might not immediately kill them? Also, if you think the sword has potential, how about the choreography they used in the shows?
@KorGarrot2 жыл бұрын
I think they also have a complex ribcage structure, meaning it would likely take much more force to break through compared to a humans (or need more pointy bits to stab between the complex ribs. As far as the way that Worf uses it, his style reminds me a lot of Wu Shu. Lots of smooth and flowing moves that are almost as much style as they are combative.
@shinjofox2 жыл бұрын
On Deep Space 9. Jadzia Dax gives us measurements for a Batleth in "warriors configuration" Kor's words. It is as follows "A "warrior's configuration" for a bat'leth was "tip to tip 116 centimeters, weight five point three kilos with an exterior handgripping diameter of five centimeters "
@shinjofox2 жыл бұрын
Will we be looking at the Mek'leth next time they sponsor a video? Or perhaps the Lurpa.
@stav13692 жыл бұрын
Awsome vid Mat. You sold me. I thought it was a little ridiculous but I am not to arrogant to admit I did not properly consider all the points you put forward.
@trr940012 жыл бұрын
I’ve always thought of it more as an axe you could parry with.
@Elidrys2 жыл бұрын
Too many people tear down this weapon, good to see it done more justice. Its actually a good weapon, quite interesting too.
@thomashounsome77372 жыл бұрын
I agree with pretty much everything you said here. The evolution of any given weapons that has so many things involved, local resources, what you're fighting against, and of course the biology of the Klingon species itself amongst others. As a bit of a Star Trek buff I do know they have a lot of backup biological systems and they are very Hardy in general so a puncturing, crushing weapon makes a fair bit of sense.
@mr313372 жыл бұрын
Get Tod to make some and do some bat'leth sparring! With the old school Star Trek fight music playing!
@chaos_omega2 жыл бұрын
I think Da'mon Stith would agree, I believe he's made some synthetics ones and played around with them (Purpleheart Armory has some too, I think?)
@ananonymousnerd.21792 жыл бұрын
Two things regarding bat'leths (their design in-universe and Klingon biology): If I recall the lore correctly, the first bat'leth, the Sword of Kahless, was created and wielded by Kahless the Unforgettable (who would have guessed with a name like that?) when he dipped a lock of his own hair into an active volcano and later cooled the lock in a lake to form the shape of the blade. This is the widely accepted explanation, though it might just be Klingon folklore. An alternate telling of the tale, though it isn't official canon, the videogame Star Trek Online posits that the first bat'leth was instead constructed out of the carapace of a species known as the Hur'q (think of the "bugs" in Starship Troopers, but with wings, devastating sonic screams, a massive warfleet, and suffering from a crippling Ketracel-White withdrawal). This is quite badass, since the Hur'q destroyed everything they ran into (in STO, they nearly curb-stomped the Dominion at least twice) until they reached Qo'noS, where they were counter-curb-stomped by the Klingons (who were still waving swords and distinctly lacked any significant firearms around the time). The Hur'q are stated to be the threat that came closest to driving the Klingon people extinct, so when a legendary warrior decides to turn the bodies of your worst historical enemy into a kickass sword to (presumably) slay said enemies with, one does not simply object. However, the folktale of Kahless making the sword from a lock of hair in an active volcano stands as fairly well established lore (in beta canon novels and videogame canon, at least; I don't own a streaming service so I can't actually watch my favorite sci-fi and therefore lack fundamental knowledge on the current state of Star Trek "canon"). Klingon biology is also more robust than human biology. I seem to recall from reading the wiki (recall that I can't actually watch the episodes to confirm), in one episode of TNG, Worf suffers extreme injuries and eventual organ failure, being completely beyond Doctor Crusher's abilities to save, only for a set of redundant organs to kick into action immediately and render him perfectly healthy and instantly fit for duty. So while they might not be at Mass Effect Krogan-levels of redundancy, I'd say that Klingons on average can survive much worse injuries than humans. Who would have guessed, from a species that quite literally KILLED ITS OWN GODS before they could figure out how to build a bicycle? Also, you were spot-on about the East Asian influence on the bat'leth, but in more ways than you think. Worf's fighting style actually draws heavily from several martial arts, including (I may be recalling wrong) taekwondo, which is primarily a Korean martial art (some historians would place its origins in China, but it undoubtedly matured, became popularized, and took modern form in Korea).
@varkesh4562 жыл бұрын
I loved to see the switch worf went with as time went on and he began to favout the mek'leth over the bat'leth for it's greater control indicating in a ds9 episode that although the bat'leth has superior range most get overconfiedent with it. Supporting exactly what you have stated that the bat'leth is indeed a ranged pole arm (ish) style weapon and the point that size and shape varies is a great parell with the saber. The final point i enjoyed was the fact that klingons are almost always heavily armoured and would add that for a heavily based fight culture having a main weapon that can be used quite easily in non death causing ways (injury still likely) as long as you dont stab with the pointy parts fully was a great option. I think it is the probally one of the most successful pop culture alien weapons to survive in peoples minds and i love how so many other cultures still have nothing like this in star trek...prehaps because most of them do not focus on armour (as you stated in your video) due to the ranged alternatives...even the later introduced jem'hadar also a very martial race also wore armour and also had a simular concept in terms of a bladed weapon.
@joshridinger34072 жыл бұрын
according to that episode where dax goes on a suicide mission with the kang, kor, and koloth, a 116cm bat'leth is '5.3 kilos'. i chalk this up to the writers judging weapon weights by the dimensions of overbuilt stage props (similar to the way people used to believe medieval "broadswords" were 10-20 pounds)
@XainEisenhart2 жыл бұрын
Regarding the three holes instead of the one, could it be like short hilted swords where its meant to promote/force "proper grip"?
@The1stImmortal2 жыл бұрын
The naval sabre/cutlass analogy works well... a lot of Klingon melee combat is likely to be in ship-to-ship boarding actions - narrow corridors and live equipment all around.
@kevingubernatis33242 жыл бұрын
I literally agree with everything that you've said in this video. I've been trying to sing the praises of the bat'leth, or "Sword of Honor" for many years now, and it's been an uphill battle. Not only, as you say, are people making harsh judgments about some seriously unknown variables, but it's also an ALIEN weapon, that was designed literally to confound the humans that looked at it. I agree completely that having the blade set forward, which offers a lot of hand protection, is a distinct advantage, and I also agree that having one large hand hole, as with the Sword of Kahless, is a lot more maneuverable, and useful than the standard design, and have said so many times. I've always wanted to see a well choreographed fight scene with one opponent, likely a Klingon, using a bat'leth, while the other, likely a human, uses a typical (or perhaps even esoteric, earth weapon. Great video!
@DVankeuren2 жыл бұрын
No, it was not literally designed to confound humans. It was a very ancient weapon designed long before Klingons met humans.
@kevingubernatis33242 жыл бұрын
@@DVankeurenyou misunderstand my friend. I don't mean in the Canon lore of star trek, I mean when it was developed as a prop by the guy mentioned in the video. He was asked to create a weapon that was from an alien culture, so of course he made something that looked alien to him, and would look alien to most other people.
@matthewvelo2 жыл бұрын
A double-ended Falx perhaps? Were the Klingons Dacian? Great video Matt, possibly one of the longest Star Trek related videos I've ever sat through with any real interest. BTW, agree with the hand-hold comments, that's the first thing I thought of once seeing the weapon.
@TimmyB18672 жыл бұрын
Full agreement on pretty well everything that wasn't a paid sponsor. As I studied Okinawan kobudo I've come to love the Bat'leth as I understand better how to use something like it. You're right about the hand holds, and I would if I were into speculative fiction, would be inclined to suggest that the three hole design came in as a more 'modern' invention as Klingon combat became more formalized as firearms or the Klingon equivalent replaced the close combat weapons. Considering the Klingons culture, they could have even made a choice to make it more difficult.
@logruszed2 жыл бұрын
Furthermore, on the subject of weight, we'd need to at least allow for exotic space metals in the construction. Certainly with one of the primary methods of use is to use the blade to absorb impacts. I'd think you would really need to have some new metal for this.
@Jabberforce2 жыл бұрын
I expect a HEMA video soon of you bat'lething vs different swords
@Kris-ym2zr2 жыл бұрын
This is a great and interesting video. I like hearing you breakdown fantasy/sci-fi weapons.
@peepshow0902 жыл бұрын
Don't forget that the batleth is used in combination with a disruptor
@Peter_Wendt2 жыл бұрын
More to the point, it is used in combination with a mighty Klingon warrior!
@slicerneons33002 жыл бұрын
Qapla' Folks! I find that Humans trying to demonstrate the effectiveness of a Bat'leth whether for or against, is going to inevitably not be as accurate to the weapons potenrial. It is a Klingon Weapon Built for Klingons made for Klingons to weild. Us puny human d'blok just don't get it. Basically I agree.
@Peter_Wendt2 жыл бұрын
This Matt Easton human has the heart of a Klingon! It would be an honour to face him on the field of battle.
@gregcampwriter2 жыл бұрын
Worf hands Data a bat'leth. "Hey, Commander, some things in here don't react well to bat'leth strokes."
@MrValour2 жыл бұрын
Great video and all i ever wanted to hear about the bat'leth! I always thought it was a weapon well suited for a klingon warrior. It is essentially a sharp and pointy barrier between you and your opponent which is great in close combat. That, along with its heaviness and "clumsiness" fits the klingon fighting style i imagine perfectly. It is also very intuitive to use and has multiple ways to be used which might be good when a klingon is too angry for precise fencing. I actually thought about straightening the points as well but then you would have to rotate the weapon so much it would lose much of its defensive potential at that moment. The other point could also be used against the wearer.