Sword Fighters: Why Are There So Many Of Them? | Super Smash Bros. Ultimate

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Vars III

Vars III

2 жыл бұрын

For today's video I want to talk about the prevalence of swordfighters in Smash Ultimate: why they're so popular and what factors attribute to their success in the competitive scene.
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Пікірлер: 558
@MrMockRock
@MrMockRock 2 жыл бұрын
Appreciate the shout out! Just for the record though, we're cool, I've got no kind of claim on covering archetypes lol
@MarioTiani
@MarioTiani Жыл бұрын
Good...
@YOSSARIAN313
@YOSSARIAN313 2 жыл бұрын
With Big D beating riddles and going to grand finals at a major maybe you should do why no one plays ice climbers. They have the coolest comboes in the game but are brutally difficult to play optimally
@alexpotts6520
@alexpotts6520 2 жыл бұрын
You answered your own question there
@thikdikriky1559
@thikdikriky1559 2 жыл бұрын
Or I can just tell u why without this dude spoonfeeding it to you in a 15 minute video lol. They are just inconsistent asf, Nana is literally stupid sometimes, and in general it takes alot of work just to play a character that loses alot of relevant MUs and is no higher than mid tier. Plus having a historically bad stigma surrounding them doesn't help
@cjlite0210
@cjlite0210 2 жыл бұрын
Yeah, I usually end up abusing Side-B to get free strings, dragging my opponent to the ledge for a potentially easy kill
@Arc_TheAirPirate
@Arc_TheAirPirate 2 жыл бұрын
@@thikdikriky1559 Yeah but his videos are so much fun to listen to, I watch the ones I already know xD Dudes got a chill voice and is a great resource to share with friends that play a lot less than me :)
@thikdikriky1559
@thikdikriky1559 2 жыл бұрын
@@Arc_TheAirPirate he stretches out these 15 minute video when they could honestly be half the legnth. Bro sounds like a casual/outsider tbh. Content is mid asf 🥱
@sownajee5312
@sownajee5312 2 жыл бұрын
Because swords are cool
@Limit02
@Limit02 2 жыл бұрын
Based and true
@Instanence
@Instanence Жыл бұрын
you know what's not cool? Genishin Impact. Valorant. which is why this KZfaqr should shut down its (i won't identify them as human) channel and step outside. Just absolutely disgusting. if it wasn't for that these videos might be entertaining.
@elzar5987
@elzar5987 Жыл бұрын
Damn straight!
@briangruenewald7536
@briangruenewald7536 Жыл бұрын
100% agree!
@Aqua-rp1hd
@Aqua-rp1hd 11 ай бұрын
Absolutely not
@seanw3388
@seanw3388 2 жыл бұрын
They're consistent, because most of their attacks are safe and most swordies are relatively simple
@sirtoxic5147
@sirtoxic5147 2 жыл бұрын
NO. ANIME SWORDSMAN COOL.
@alanyang7801
@alanyang7801 2 жыл бұрын
So basically saying…they’re brainded 🙃
@hia5235
@hia5235 Жыл бұрын
I got tired of the game because there are too many sword users.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@hia5235 Most of them are RPG characters. Japan loves RPG characters.
@Oggre
@Oggre Жыл бұрын
@@hia5235 better have swordies than zoners imo
@novastardust1200
@novastardust1200 2 жыл бұрын
My one main complaint about "swordies" would be how many of them use actual swords. Id LOVE to see more variety with weapons like spears, axes, hammers, glaives. There are SO MANY options that are so underutilized. I feel this could especially help the FE rep issue a little. As much as I love FE, ill admit some rep variety would be SO MUCH better
@drumo2273
@drumo2273 2 жыл бұрын
How many characters can you think of that use different weapons though? This isn't a complaint btw, I 100% agree with you, but I'm kinda drawing a blank here lol. I know Kratos could use an axe if he was in, and... that's as far as I can recall.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 2 жыл бұрын
@@drumo2273 Byleth has multiple weapons is because in my opinion a spear and axe by it self would be boring🥱🥱🥱🥱🥱. They do work in Fire Emblem, but it doesn't work well in the context of Smash. Mk Leo has proven that Byleth is Hype.
@pendranomechannel6786
@pendranomechannel6786 Жыл бұрын
@@orangeslash1667 If they can make so many characters that just use a sword interesting, they could do the same for one that uses just a spear or axe.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@pendranomechannel6786 Nope, if Smash bros was a traditional fighting game, maybe a spear and Axe by it self could work????? However thats not the case.
@thanosisking7249
@thanosisking7249 Жыл бұрын
Why wouldn't a heavy hitting axe user work? I think it could be a really fun character, like a Gannon. Maybe a better recovery though lol
@lilbonsly
@lilbonsly 2 жыл бұрын
This is more of a breakdown of swordfighters instead of answering the question "Why are there so many of them?" The answer to THAT is that it's a go-to protagonist weapon and Smash primarily uses protagonists as the main crossover character
@mawillix2018
@mawillix2018 2 жыл бұрын
Good job!
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 2 жыл бұрын
@@mawillix2018 Japan loves RPG characters
@monchete9934
@monchete9934 Жыл бұрын
It's also a weapon that can be altered to suit almost every character archetype. Want a strong, sometimes burly fighter? Big sword. Want a graceful duelist that hits precise strikes rather than strong sweeps? Rapiers are your choice. Plus, JRPGs are filled with sword protagonists and this is a japanese game made for a mostly japanese audience in mind.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@monchete9934 Why else was Lucas put in Smash Bros when Mother 3 was never released outside of Japan?????? When Ridley was put into Smash bros, Japan called him Captain America, because only Americans wanted Ridley in smash. Japan does not care for Metroid.
@RaffoPhantom
@RaffoPhantom Жыл бұрын
Then Sakurai could have just chosen not to include that character but others who don't use a sword. Nobody held a gun to his head and said "ok, put in all the swordies". There are quite a few characters people want that don't use a sword and that could easily fit into smash. Geno, Crash, Spyro, Rayman, Bomberman, Shantae or even Skull Kid (leaving out all the troll picks like Shrek and Goku). Heck, I would have taken Doom Slayer/Master Chief over Sephiroth or Steve any day, even if they ended up being even more obnoxious to fight against.
@KAKATCam
@KAKATCam 2 жыл бұрын
Because I like JRPGs like Xenoblade and Dragon Quest. For me to main a character, I usually like to know their story and try and feel a sense of familiarity between games.
@davidhensey2000
@davidhensey2000 2 жыл бұрын
I’m more of the opposite, I’m usually interested in trying a new game after I main a character in smash. I plan on buying Xenoblade since I been playing with Aegis the last several months. Also interested in checking out fire emblem now. The only characters that don’t make me interested in trying out their game is fighting game characters since I’m already playing a fighting game, but if I did pick up Tekken, I’m rocking with Kazuya.
@juanmagalhaes2135
@juanmagalhaes2135 2 жыл бұрын
Sounds like a fellow Shulk main to me
@KAKATCam
@KAKATCam 2 жыл бұрын
@@juanmagalhaes2135 Nope, I am part of the sad Xenoblade 2 fans. I mean, I like both games equally, Shulk is just not my play style in Smash.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@KAKATCam Fun Fact: most of the the characters in Xenoblade 2 were designed by a Hentai artist😳😳😳😳😳😳.
@KAKATCam
@KAKATCam Жыл бұрын
@@orangeslash1667 Yes, that is common knowledge
@derpderp1562
@derpderp1562 2 жыл бұрын
I liked the thoughts on swordies having plenty of disjointed safe moves while still being nigh unreactable. I think a good point to bring up would be the lower amount of combo starters in comparison to brawler type characters to drive the difference home
@Arc_TheAirPirate
@Arc_TheAirPirate 2 жыл бұрын
But he said that though? :P
@Spyder-Marth
@Spyder-Marth 2 жыл бұрын
Good range, safe attacks, amazing kill power (or amazing damage building combos), cool combos in general, and they're all from game franchises that are either well known or so dang cool. Like Shulk is the lesser known but he's one of the coolest Swordfighters I've ever seen. Then there's Marth the OG FE character who's been in Smash for ages and while not as strong as some others, he's still mad popular. Fun fact: I originally became a swordie main because I used to be a fencer (a type of swordfighting martial art). First swordie I ever mained was Marth because I chose to free him early during World of Light. Then when I came across Corrin I picked him up as a main, too.
@Sickmmaner
@Sickmmaner 2 жыл бұрын
Simple. Swords have lots of range, so they are safe to attack with if spaced well. They can beat out attacks from boxers, and can easily deflect projectiles sent out from zoners. Most swordies are also really FAST for some reason as well, so they can overwhelm most other characters and juggle them with ease. Seriously, why are basically all of the sword characters in this game so fast? It almost seems like a design flaw, given that most games trade off speed for more range. It seems that they have average speed and power and above average range, so why wouldn't you pick one up if you want to win?
@Spyder-Marth
@Spyder-Marth 2 жыл бұрын
Facts. Out of my three mains (Corrin, Marth, and Zelda), Marth has the most speed and is my go-to against projectile-heavy spammers and campy players in general. I love how he can go full aggro or slow down the pace of a game when he wants to because of his dumb range with his tilts lol.
@dantefiore8442
@dantefiore8442 2 жыл бұрын
@@Spyder-Marth WHy not Lucina then? She's Marth but without worrying about neve landing tipper
@oliviahughes3158
@oliviahughes3158 2 жыл бұрын
Eh, the speed isn't necessarily a gamebreaker. Reminder that Roy, albeit a top 5 character NOW, was consistently a low-tiered character in all of his other iterations.
@Blue24675
@Blue24675 2 жыл бұрын
@@oliviahughes3158 well he was a low tier because he just straight up didn’t work in the previous games
@Quackra
@Quackra 2 жыл бұрын
​@@Blue24675 In Melee, he didn't work because bad programming on his moves and bad frame data. In Sm4sh, if you consider not being good not working, then you would be right. Giving him better frame data and movement fixed him in Ultimate.
@PyraXadon
@PyraXadon 2 жыл бұрын
As someone who's almost exclusively been playing sword characters in Smash, it's been a very uh...interesting experience. It's too a point that my mind is wired into fighting with disjointed hitboxes, and anything closer to the body feels somehow 'unsafe' to me. Going from Pit in Brawl to Corrin in Smash4 to finally the Aegis Sisters has been just nothing but disjointed boxes. With Roy and Byleth in between during my time in Ultimate. This is partly in due to the fact that I actually really like all of these characters/their series, but it's also because it's really hard to go back when you've gotten so used to how Pyra/Mythra's hitboxes and just how much pressure you can dole out with just a few sword swipes.
@TheInquisitor26
@TheInquisitor26 2 жыл бұрын
I have to admit, I’ve gone from rushdown to sword archetype over the course of my playing Ultimate. Never thought I would change my character type but everything you said about sword characters is true
@alexc2265
@alexc2265 Жыл бұрын
I was originally a Fox main, but they changed him too much in Brawl, so I’ve been a swordfighter since
@stormRed
@stormRed 2 жыл бұрын
Historically, hitting with long thing better than not hitting with long thing
@piey4803
@piey4803 2 жыл бұрын
I love corrin cuz she has a wet hard long thing
@angeldude101
@angeldude101 2 жыл бұрын
And then people found a way to simulate hitting with _really_ long thing without needing to actually make or hold long thing.
@juba1479
@juba1479 2 жыл бұрын
Most of the the series the swordies come from are RPGs, they are usually the main character, in RPGs the main character always wields swords. Its that simple.
@angeldude101
@angeldude101 2 жыл бұрын
Pretty much. I only know of 1 RPG that I've played where the protagonist's default weapon isn't a sword or vaguely-sword-shaped-object. That character used dual chakrams. (Smash really should have more dual wielding characters.)
@juba1479
@juba1479 Жыл бұрын
@@angeldude101 Is it Threads of Fate on PS1?
@angeldude101
@angeldude101 Жыл бұрын
@@juba1479 Actually I was referring to the small indie title called CrossCode.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@angeldude101 Smash doesn't allow indie characters.
@angeldude101
@angeldude101 Жыл бұрын
​@@orangeslash1667 As full fighters, yes. As Mii Fighters? They're fair game! Regardless, that character was a dream pic that I knew would never get in since barely anyone knows the game they're from. And besides, my favourite character from another franchise that is already in Smash also happens to use dual chakrams as well, though being the tritagonist, it wasn't much of a surprise getting the deuteragonist(s) from the same game instead.
@kevingriffith6011
@kevingriffith6011 Жыл бұрын
Ultimately I think part of the problem people have with sword character saturation is more superficial... To give an example: Mario characters have the highest population density in Smash (with 10 characters), but these characters are *wildly different* in visual design (Stand Mario up next to Bowser, Peach, Wario, Bowser Jr, Pirahna Plant... they are all immediately distinct from one another even to a complete outsider). Fire Emblem characters are, by and large, "Reasonably proportioned anime protagonist who wields a sword" and the fact that fire emblem brings 8 of them (the second most represented game series in smash) can make it feel like the game is oversaturated with them... and this isn't even considering how many other games in smash are bringing the same visual archetype. Honestly I don't think there's a good solution here either. Fantasy RPG protagonists almost universally use swords, and game series in Smash are pretty much always represented by their protagonists... so more swords. It wouldn't do to remove characters that appeared in previous versions of Smash either, since the tagline was "everyone is here" so ultimately we got the best solution... just let the complainers complain online, game is still fun and having an oversaturated niche is only disappointing when you add another one on in a reveal trailer.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
Anime RPG's are hard sometimes to sell well in America.
@kevingriffith6011
@kevingriffith6011 Жыл бұрын
@@orangeslash1667 While I see where you're coming from, I don't know about that. I can't speak for sales but some of the most celebrated RPGs are anime as all hell. (Persona and Final Fantasy come to mind) Being an anime character isn't really a factor in success in the west like it used to be.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@kevingriffith6011 The problem with Fire Emblem is that because Final Fantasy and Dragon Quest didn't sell well on the NES in America, Nintendo didn't have the courage to localize them. When Fire Emblem was localized they still didn't sell well until Awakening. Awakening was actually going to be the last Fire emblem game because sales were so bad. Xenoblade suffers a similar problem. It was originally going to a Japanese only game because Nintendo didn't have any faith that it would sell well in the West. Finally there's Dragon Quest the original JRPG. With the exception of Dragon Quest 8, DQ never sells well in the West until maybe recently???????
@Buglin_Burger7878
@Buglin_Burger7878 Жыл бұрын
A lot of it is Fire Emblem, a game with a weapon triangle, two if you count fist, bow, and magic. Mounted units including horse riders with axes and spears. Dragon riders with axes or bows. ...yet every single one in Smash has a sword. Fire Emblem translates almost nothing to Smash. Before I knew about FE but played other strategy games I was convinced that because of how FE was represented in Smash it was the worst strategy game in the world. After seeing it... it has the worst representation of almost anything out there. It is made even worse by the fact Incineroar's Counter is now more FE accurate then Marth's.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@Buglin_Burger7878 The reason why Byleth has three weapons at once is because while a spear and an axe is important in an RPG. In the context of a plaformer Fighting game it's not enough for a moveset. Fire Emblem characters in Smash are the masters of spacing, which can be strategic in the Context of Smash bros. Mkleo playing Byleth has proven that you can't be reckless playing Byleth otherwise you may not win. Caption Falcon and Fox prove that not every character has to be a one to one translation of their games like Hero, Sephiroth, and the Belmonts.
@duwanglover3424
@duwanglover3424 2 жыл бұрын
On the topic of blind spot hit boxes, that’s why Roy (outside of his damage) is so strong. While every other sword fighter priorities keeping you at a set distance away from you, Roy wants to be as close as possible and has his sweet spots almost in his chest.
@painuchiha2694
@painuchiha2694 2 жыл бұрын
Can we all agree link’s nair is still a sword somehow lol
@kingmeprime
@kingmeprime 2 жыл бұрын
With your content style, looking at how the introduction of a character entirely changed a meta (while also talking about before and after) may be a small gold mine. Sans comes to mind firstly. All of the dlc characters have a potential spot. Although you run the risk of talking about things that veterans already know. Breaking down WHY dlc is so disruptive as well as the evolution of how they're used (or not) is a neat idea I would love to see you do. I love the methodical but practical approach you bring to the table. Keep it up !
@venexo1434
@venexo1434 2 жыл бұрын
Can you elaborate on Dlc being disruptive. I generally see them as a good thing to fresh things up.
@kingmeprime
@kingmeprime 2 жыл бұрын
Being disruptive does not mean a new character is inherently bad. Others wouldn't agree with me but.. In this context I mean specifically how adding new fighters changes the way a game works. How players think of the game, of their characters, and of their playstyle. One old example is how villager was top tier in sm4sh. Then dlc was added and it just so happened that these new characters had answers to villager. Making them less powerful and subsequently changing the meta. This happens in ultimate as well, but not every addition is ground breaking. To finish, I'm aware that creating a new fighter gives said character an edge. Nobody has fought against them before. Think of how long Mario has been exactly the same. Compared to how Min Min feels. Some of the change they bring is this newness. I appreciate what that brings ! But perception is not the same as results and breaking that down is something I would like to watch
@eriklopez2645
@eriklopez2645 2 жыл бұрын
pretty new to smash scene, and idk anything, but i think its cuz you can swing your sword around with minimal risk. you can approach without actually approaching.
@Sickmmaner
@Sickmmaner 2 жыл бұрын
Pretty much.
@collective2007
@collective2007 2 жыл бұрын
Kinda why min min is so annoying, she has the range of a projectile character, but with no projectiles
@JacobPDeIiNoNi
@JacobPDeIiNoNi 2 жыл бұрын
To be fair, most characters who “actually approach” also have minimal risk. Most of the time any rushdown character hits your shield you need to read what they do after in order to punish, which is exactly the same as punishing sword moves on shield. They just have little risk in terms of good frame data instead of good range. Of course it’s easier for them to trade, but also easier for them to avoid those attacks because of better speed. So all in all it’s not like rushdown characters approaching is risky, if it was they would be a bad rushdown character. Being close to their opponent is to their advantage.
@painuchiha2694
@painuchiha2694 2 жыл бұрын
Sephiroth has to be the most popular character in the game lol I see him all the time…even in my deepest nightmares 😰
@themidnightotaku22
@themidnightotaku22 2 жыл бұрын
Sephiroth & Meta Knight are my favorite “swordies” with Corrin being a close second. I’m still wondering if people like to main Sephiroth nowadays or not.
@kingmeprime
@kingmeprime 2 жыл бұрын
I don't enjoy Seph these days because of how straight the hit boxes are. Plus I always feel like I'm spamming the same 2 moves over and over. He's fun to mess with and elegant to do right ! Just not in my hands.
@foks0054
@foks0054 2 жыл бұрын
I don’t consider seph or meta knight swordies
@themidnightotaku22
@themidnightotaku22 2 жыл бұрын
...fair enough@@foks0054
@SamuelJohnsonYT
@SamuelJohnsonYT 2 жыл бұрын
I'm a Sephiroth Main he's so much fun to use
@themidnightotaku22
@themidnightotaku22 2 жыл бұрын
Ok that’s 2/3 dislikes, wish I knew how to do polls on here...
@danielometch.3780
@danielometch.3780 2 жыл бұрын
I have been watching your videos and enjoy them so much! So calming and relaxing. I just wish you could show what songs you use in your videos. They are so good and fit so well.
@FireflyMykah
@FireflyMykah 2 жыл бұрын
Great video! I was expecting you to go more into the character pick philosophy on why the characters are in this game based on the title but it was a good video regardless. Some thoughts I have on the prevalence of sword fighters design wise is that I think Sword characters are just better for a cartoon fighting game. guns are the most popular weapon in video games, then swords or staffs, but guns are harder to implement compared to other weapons. That’s one of the reasons Snake has so many explosives compared to his weapons arsenal in his origin game. A lot of iconic game characters use swords in general due to swords being more tied to fantasy along with magic, but most mid range weapons resemble a sword in one fashion or another (e.g. staffs, daggers). You can kind of see the three most popular forms of combat in the miis: guns, swords, and melee. One could argue it’s missing a mage mii or magic user, but a lot of the time magic is used to enhance a character’s movelist in all sorts of games with one of the three still being the base.
@JonnyJayKhan
@JonnyJayKhan 2 жыл бұрын
As someone who isn't that great at Smash it's easy to space someone out with sword moves and it's easy to hit Corrin or Cloud combos (most of which just need tilts and falling aerials) but it's way harder to hit Brawler combos which are way more intricate and usually require grabs and more difficult aerials. The only thing which is just as easy is playing a zoner but then everyone hates you
@SonicTheCutehog
@SonicTheCutehog 2 жыл бұрын
Maybe because swords are the most common weapon type in video games?
@gamexpert1990
@gamexpert1990 2 жыл бұрын
11:23 Ironically, despite being generally considered the weakest in the class otherwise, this is almost a non-weakness for Mii Swordfighter. Several of his moves, including aerials, do at least cover a portion of his body's hurtbox. :-)
@victorpena8356
@victorpena8356 2 жыл бұрын
Thats a great strength, too bad the biggest weakness of Mii Swordfighter for which many people do not choose him is: Being a mii.
@pendranomechannel6786
@pendranomechannel6786 Жыл бұрын
In future smash games it would a real shot in the arm to diversify the character archetypes. The cast is dominated by too many similarly themed characters, even if they do play differently. I’d like to see something like a mech pilot, a pole arm user, a mad scientist, a clown, a genie, a wrestler, something with multiple limbs, anything but another fuzzy animal or anime swordsman. Hopefully diverse themes would mean more diverse gameplay as well.
@forhisneutralspecialhewiel2295
@forhisneutralspecialhewiel2295 Жыл бұрын
We already have a mech pilot in the form of Bowser Jr. We already have a wrestler in the form of Incineroar. The question is: how many actually recognizable videogame characters with the traits you mentioned are out there? Like, you can have Eggman for mad scientist and Machamp for multiple limbs, but for a clown? A genie? Maybe Shantae could work, but she's actually a half-genie, so IDK.
@pendranomechannel6786
@pendranomechannel6786 Жыл бұрын
I should have been more specific about what I meant. I sort of agree with Incineroar as a wrestler but Bowser Jr is a total copout as far as a real mech pilot type character. When I say mech pilot I mean one where the mech is an actual mechanic of the character’s gameplay. I envision a character that can fight in the mech, but can also hop out and fight on foot with a whole different fighting style, like 2 characters in 1. So technically you’re right but functionally Jr is just another character because he can’t be played outside the mech except for like one move. I can think of at least one good example for every archetype I listed, some more recognizable than others. IMO though, I think variety and fun are more important than recognizability. I mean how many great but lesser known video game characters have been introduced to new audiences in a crossover game? How many people do you think knew who Ice Climbers or Mr. Game & Watch were outside of Smash. I’d argue that smash makes characters recognizable.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@pendranomechannel6786 Diversifying everyone is pretty hard to due without breaking the balance of Smash. While random characters like R.O.B, Ice Climbers, and Plant are nice. There was a ton of hype when characters like Kazyua, Sephiroth, Steve, Joker, Snake, King K Rool, Banjo and Kazooie got in Smash.
@booogagaming5223
@booogagaming5223 2 жыл бұрын
There are "so" many sword fighters because swords are the most common weapon. End of discussion. Swords are generally the middlegrounds of all weapons, they are long quick, defensive, everything you ever asked for. Name any character who uses weapons, and chances are, they use a sword somewhere in their game. Honestly, what other weapon do you all want people to use? An axe fighter? How is that going to be different that a sword, it's basically gonna be Ike with a tipper. I mean guns are a thing, and guess what, it's the other main group of fighters in smash bros. Just like the mii's, there are 3 classes of weapon types, with practically no exceptions. One semi unique weapon is a hammer, and even at that, ice climbers hammer functions like a sword, just with a hammer hitbox. Honestly, I wish Sakurai made more unique weapons so sword haters would finally be like "oooh so epic, a weapon that functions EXACTLY like a sword except looks differently" and stop crying.
@yoso378
@yoso378 2 жыл бұрын
Swords were pretty much the "main character weapon" until like... the mid/late 2000s and a lot of older franchises (like the ones smash pulls from) keep that tradition even in their more recent releases.
@angeldude101
@angeldude101 2 жыл бұрын
And even in sci-fi when guns pretty much obsolete swords, what do writers do? Make _laser swords!_ (Which is exactly what Shulk and Mythra's swords are. Pyra's technically isn't a laser, it's really just a sword-shaped flamethrower.)
@RaffoPhantom
@RaffoPhantom Жыл бұрын
Actually, it is not the end of discussion. Sakurai could have chosen to not put those characters in. There were plenty of characters that are just as popular if not more that do not weild any kind of weapon whatsoever. Geno (technically he does use an arm canon, sure, but it's part of his body so I don't count it as a weapon.And the argument is about sword fighters here), Crash, Spyro, Rayman, Bomberman, Shantae or even Skull Kid. None of those use a sword and were highly popular characters. Also I think the biggest issue people have with swordies started with the inclusion of so many Fire Emblem characters with swords specifically. Fire Emblem in particular has a vast amount of weapons to choose from. Even if they played practically the same I am positive the reception, albeit still negative, wouldn't be as strong as it is now if they took from that huge pool of weapons. Give Ike an axe, Roy a lance, have Corrin use more dragon transformation stuff and you got a lot more differentiating factors for them. Not nearly as much people complained about Robin, did they? It doesn't matter if those weapons are canon or not, Sakurai is not shy of giving characters moves that are not canon (neither Ness nor Lucas learn PK Fire, Thunder, Freeze, Magnet or Starstorm in the Mother games. So basically the only special that is canon to either of those characters is PK Flash for Ness) so why are weapons a different story?
@booogagaming5223
@booogagaming5223 Жыл бұрын
@@RaffoPhantom Yeah, valid points, but the biggest issue is probably licensing, Nintendo probably spent a fortune getting Sora into smash because it has 3 dots in the shape of Mickey Mouse. I believe the reason we get so many Fire Emblem characters is because Nintendo already has rights to it, and there's a looooot of games in the Fire Emblem series to choose from. Also, did you just nerd emoji me at the beginning? "Well actually 🤓" Lmao
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@RaffoPhantom The problem with Corrin is that, if he turned into a full dragon, he would be Broken. RPG characters are a big deal in Japan.
@TheFlashyLucario
@TheFlashyLucario 2 жыл бұрын
I’m a Aegis/Cloud main (with pocket Palutena). I actually recently fully committed to maining Aegis instead of having her as a pocket (I’ve been playing her since her release). The thing I like about swordies is that they have good range with decent frame data. They are relatively easy to play, but still in depth. I especially love Aegis for being 2 swordies, one being rushdown and the other being basically a much better Ganondorf with unreasonable hitboxes that should not exist lmao. Their flexibility makes them so much fun. This game also favors swordies a lot, that probably plays a huge part why many people main them
@CodeNameMoniker
@CodeNameMoniker 2 жыл бұрын
My favourite swordfighter is Roy. No, not the Fire Emblem swordie - the Bowser Jr. skin. People gloss over this character, but almost every hitbox he has is disjointed. Jr. can slow the game down if needed by throwing out hitboxes (cannon and mechakoopa) while adding to the pressure with short hop fairs, or speed it up on a dime by chasing the opponent all across the stage like a rushdown with kart. He's fast, heavy, has lingering aerials, and incredible recovery. Of course, the better your opponent, the less likely you are to successfully trap them (almost everything jr. does can be shielded or jumped over) but when you bait out an option from your opponent with a cannonball, rush in to fair/bair them, then fastfall onto a mechakoopa and throw it off stage for the kill, there's no greater feeling of satisfaction in this game.
@Blyeth-go4wr
@Blyeth-go4wr 9 ай бұрын
Koopa Roy is not a swordie…
@MarioSMG64
@MarioSMG64 2 жыл бұрын
This video is very refreshing. I remember being downvoted a bunch on Reddit for claiming that Marth/Lucina don’t play at all similarly to Chrom/Roy. Much of the community is still of the irritating mindset that “sword/fire emblem bad” and I hope it will diminish over time, but that feels unlikely. Edit: the replies to this comment prove most of the Smash community has no idea what they're talking about
@kingmeprime
@kingmeprime 2 жыл бұрын
I doubt it but I hope so. Those two types are entirely different
@LC-wv7tz
@LC-wv7tz 2 жыл бұрын
They do play extremely similarly, though. A ton of their moves are the same, just with tweaked frame data and sweet spots. Marth and Roy are FAR more similar to one another than Fox and Wolf, for example. They did more to make them different in Ultimate compared to previous games, but they are still far more similar to one another than pretty much any two characters chosen from any other archetype. Marth and Roy are vastly more similar to each other than Mario is to Pikachu or Samus is Duck Hunt. Sword users are vastly over represented. Especially considering how similar they all play to one another compared to other archetypes. There are twice as many as their needs to be. You could literally halve the number of them and still have plenty to choose from (and then they would feel more unique as a result as there would be more variation between the ones left over). But the characters are super easy to learn and play, so they are popular and people need the fan service.
@123christianac
@123christianac 2 жыл бұрын
@@LC-wv7tz "considering how similar they all play to one another" ...except they don't play similarly at all. Despite Lucina being a clone of Marth, early Smash Ultimate tiers had Marth an entire tier away from Lucina. Why? Having a tipper or not changed how they played. It is the same for Chrom and Roy. This argument only works for Marth and Roy... to which Roy is a semi-clone of Marth. None of the other sword fighters play similarly and counting clones in this is disingenuous.
@LC-wv7tz
@LC-wv7tz 2 жыл бұрын
@@123christianac Wrong. They play extremely similarly.
@123christianac
@123christianac 2 жыл бұрын
@@LC-wv7tz And no. Tell me. How does Marth and Shulk play? Robin and Byleth? Aegis and Corrin? Ike and Cloud? None of these characters don't play alike. Also, aren't you being hypocritical be being ok with Fox and Wolf and not the sword fighters?
@danytalksmusic
@danytalksmusic 2 жыл бұрын
brilliant insight on why Leo uses Byleth!
@Saltyoven
@Saltyoven 2 жыл бұрын
Let's answer that with 2 questions. Why did Sakurai decide to divide the Miis into Brawler, Swordfighter, and Gunner and how many characters don't fall into any of those 3 categories?
@bravo_vevo
@bravo_vevo 2 жыл бұрын
While I do not mind the amount of swordies in smash. I do have to disagree about the lack of body hitboxes being a sort of weakness. They are designed to act as a walling tool, and if people get up close the swordies are usually designed to have a get-off me tool. Cloud having Climmhazard alongside other swordies liking to up b oos. this exclude the swordies with fast frame data like chroy and aegis cause they can use the rest of their frame data in hand with said tool. Smash is moving more to an oos meta/advantage state heavy meta so it’s perfect to play characters that minimize the risks like swordies, that’s how it feels like why they’re so popular, same with zoners.
@mozmatt4716
@mozmatt4716 2 жыл бұрын
Probably cause sword attacks have long range and have a wide arc so they are easy to hit generally.
@Dra9ondemon
@Dra9ondemon Жыл бұрын
Eyyy, SAO footage used! I still feel bad for that Pugilists girl.
@darkraven5626
@darkraven5626 2 жыл бұрын
Falcon does have a chiseled chest, the body feature that can make even the male cast of all species blush right before that Falcon Punch connects with them.
@leifster7762
@leifster7762 2 жыл бұрын
I love Swordies. I think their safer and Stray attacks are right for me. Absolutely my favorite smash archetype(Btw I also love Fire Emblem and Final Fantasy as well as Xenoblade). I get if people say characters like Aegis are overturned,but I love them to point I don’t care that much tbh lol
@PrinceSamurai45
@PrinceSamurai45 Жыл бұрын
I used to play Brawl as Ike and loved him for all the reasons you laid out. Plus I LOVED his counter. Kept people at range and almost all his attacks felt like they started killing at under 100%. Their only real weakness was aerial combat and really powerful zoners. Diddy Kong, Game &Watch, and Snake were the only truly hard matchups. Well and another good Ike player.
@BaselardFE
@BaselardFE 2 жыл бұрын
A lot of characters that I like just ended up being swordies. Ike, Corrin, Shulk, Byleth, Pyra Mythra lmao
@willycheez7218
@willycheez7218 2 жыл бұрын
You do not like those characters
@Yoshixandir
@Yoshixandir 2 жыл бұрын
Lol that’s perfectly fine. They are pretty fun to use. Not to mention all those sword fighters play differently
@dantelawrence4676
@dantelawrence4676 2 жыл бұрын
@@willycheez7218 Why would they not like those characters if they literally said that they do in their comment?
@willycheez7218
@willycheez7218 2 жыл бұрын
@@dantelawrence4676 Because you can't just like that many soulless characters
@Jonathankiller100
@Jonathankiller100 2 жыл бұрын
@@willycheez7218 Bro you ain’t played Radiant Dawn or Path of Radiance if you calling Ike soulless. You definitely right on Byleth though, easily one of the worst characters to exist in video games lmao
@davidbarnett2597
@davidbarnett2597 2 жыл бұрын
There are so many of they because they are so easy to pump out
@Aa-dc2xu
@Aa-dc2xu Жыл бұрын
I feel like the title of this video is misleading. This video didn't really answer why there are so many sword characters, instead, it answered why sword characters are so popular to use. The reason there are so many sword characters is simply because a lot video game characters tend to use swords, especially JRPG characters. And it only makes sense to add JRPG characters to this game since they're either very iconic (like Cloud or Sora) or Nintendo wants to promote some new JRPG through Smash (Corrin or Byleth).
@Buglin_Burger7878
@Buglin_Burger7878 Жыл бұрын
Except they could've went and had the 3 Houses representatives as one, like Pokemon trainer or even add the big bad of a series. They have options, even Chrom can use a Bow.
@Aa-dc2xu
@Aa-dc2xu Жыл бұрын
@@Buglin_Burger7878 They could, but Sakurai prefers to use the main character of a series when he adds their game into smash. Unless their main character is already an assist trophy like with what happened with Aegis and Min Min.
@vjoe5389
@vjoe5389 Жыл бұрын
Even tho I main Mewtwo and secondary Joker, I admit that most of my best characters that aren't my main/secondary happen to be swordfighters. Roy, Chrom, Hero, Lucina, Pyra/Mythra, Cloud, Byleth, and Ike are just to name a few. Most of these characters are easy to learn, easy to use, they are really good against cheesy characters, great range, and most are decently fast. As much as I love Smash Ultimate, I feel like you can't really get better at the game without having a swordfighter in your arsenal of mains/secondaries. Even tho I personally don't have a problem with it since I like most of the swordies, I do feel like it's very unfortunate to those who don't like them. While it's not impossible to succeed in Ultimate never using a swordfighter, it is pretty difficult.
@MrWwechampion333
@MrWwechampion333 2 жыл бұрын
i play roy and the reason i use swordies is bc i just love swords in general
@karanveersehra6336
@karanveersehra6336 2 жыл бұрын
Yea
@NightRaven5568
@NightRaven5568 2 жыл бұрын
My problem with swordies isn’t stuff like Ike or byleth they are balanced It’s the insane speed that rivals or even beats rush down characters that I have a problem with so mythra, lucaina, Roy, chrom.
@Konda_X
@Konda_X 2 жыл бұрын
Nice favorite game series, my favorite game series is Fire Emblem too but also Pokémon
@VenomPichu
@VenomPichu 2 жыл бұрын
I never knew sword fighters were popular. Usually I hear people complain about them for there being “too many” sword users. There’s about 19 of them. Which is a pretty good amount, but I hate how people would get angry and act as if 80% of the roster uses swords. FYI, I personally don’t view characters such as Pit and Dark Pit as sword fighters. They battle with bows that turn into small blades for self defense. The same can be said for Joker. He fights with a knife, which doesn’t even count. But besides that, this was a good video. I like using sword fighters. Hell, one of my mains is the Mii Sword Fighter. They’re a good character to play as. And mixing up their costume makes it even more fun.
@Buglin_Burger7878
@Buglin_Burger7878 Жыл бұрын
A lot of it is due to how poorly Fire Emblem is represented, for a strategy game with a weapon triangle (technically at least 2), mounted units ranging from horse and spear to dragon with bow. People who literally turn into dragons. Now look at how all of them reps rely on Swords. Every time you saw the name Fire Emblem it means Sword. That broke people quickly because it was predictable. Odd hair color with sword.
@VenomPichu
@VenomPichu Жыл бұрын
@@Buglin_Burger7878 So, Fire Emblem has characters to which have different weapons. I think I may know why they chose characters with swords. It’s because they’re the main characters of their respectful games. Robin even though has a sword, feels more like a mage in my opinion. And Byleth is like a hybrid of many different weapons in one. Not just wielding a sword. It’s not fair how characters who _aren’t_ from Fire Emblem got backlash just for holding a sword. If many Smash fans hated sword fighters all their lives…why did they want Sora? After all, he uses a sword too, and he wrapped up Ultimate’s support. But I usually stay away from them. It’s not worth arguing and fighting about fictional characters. It’s a waste of time. Even after a year of Ultimate’s completion, people are _still_ complaining about characters like their a disgrace to the series. Either play the game or stop playing it.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@Buglin_Burger7878 Not everything can transfer well in smash, and Fire Emblem is one example. Corrin is based on the manaketes, however Corrin is not accurate. That's because if Corrin was accurate, he would be broken. As for Byleth, I don't think a character who just wield a spear is enough for a Smash move set. Sometimes sacrifices most be made for the sake of balance.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@VenomPichu Because Sora comes from an action RPG, which is easy to understand. Fire Emblem come from a strategy RPG's strategy series, a genre that almost never sells well in the West.
@davidhensey2000
@davidhensey2000 2 жыл бұрын
The character I learned how to play with was Lucina so it was just easier and more natural switching to other sword characters such as Roy and Aegis. The only non sword character I have played with so far is Pauletina, but plan using Min Min and Kazuya next.
@jesusFMA
@jesusFMA 2 жыл бұрын
I used Marth first, and still do from time to time. He’s fun. Like you, I also moved to Palutena, again, simple and fun. I see that you are going the degenerate path with those other pics hahaha. Have fun!
@davidhensey2000
@davidhensey2000 2 жыл бұрын
@@jesusFMA After discovering riddles and watching him play, I don’t think their is a character in the game who’s knockouts look more satisfying than Kazuya. For the next smash tournament that happens in Las Vegas, I would love to enter and confidently be able to play with Kazuya and Min Min as I am with Aegis.
@jesusFMA
@jesusFMA 2 жыл бұрын
@@davidhensey2000 True!! Riddles’ Kazuya is crazy. Go get them 02Death’s :)
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@davidhensey2000 Be warned Kazuya has a big learning curve.
@Za_Phantom
@Za_Phantom 2 жыл бұрын
love these characters
@Antonio-is2cn
@Antonio-is2cn Жыл бұрын
Because sword fighters are fun to play! (I main the Fire Emblem characters!)
@Kilo6Charlie
@Kilo6Charlie 2 жыл бұрын
I am SUPER not a competitive Smash player. But I consider myself pretty good and certainly the best that I know personally (in no small part to knowing very few people who actually enjoy Smash) and I love Swordfighters. Granted I am also a massive Fire Emblem fan having played every game in the series except two (Thracia 776 and Genealogy of the Holy War if we count the remakes as the same as the originals. Which I do) My mains are Ike, Lucina, Wolf, and Lucario. I'd love to see a good teardown of each of them, what makes them good, bad, etc. I have no idea how prevalently played each one is in the roster or where they even rank. I just enjoy them and are quite good with them. One thing I am surprised hasn't been mentioned is the move Counter though. Shared by a TON of FE characters (most honestly) and the likes of Lucario. It's frankly one of my favourite Specials and pulling it off feels FANTASTIC, but clips that get shown almost never utilize it. I can't help but wonder why. Is it just really hard to pull off and I'm apparently really good at it? (Something I have heard actually) or is it not worth doing? I know it has a pretty punishable end lag if you miss time it
@gameboyn64
@gameboyn64 Жыл бұрын
The problem with counter is that it relies on your opponent to cooperate with you. A lot of times your opponent will just screw up and you get punished for it. Another issue is that a lot of players with throw out moves that do not intend to threaten the space you currently occupie but where they think you will move to. The final issue is that if you use it a lot, it gets predictable. Better players tend to know what options their opponents have available to them and make reads accordingly. I'm an intermediate player and I've hard read counters plenty of times. That's why the most common (and unintended) use of counter is edge guarding where your opponent is forced to throw out a hitbox in a predictable location.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@gameboyn64 Or moves like Charaziard's Side B.
@ZacharyDietze
@ZacharyDietze Жыл бұрын
I think the main reason is that they are the "easiest" to program for. Nobody up at Nintendo wants to program more unique and complex characters like Conker, Rayman, Geno, Bomberman, etc. when they can just use a standard human figure swinging a sword around, and it’s not like they care anyways since they know they’ll get money off of them regardless. Just ask anyone working on characters for Project M EX Remix and most of them would probably say the same exact thing. It’s a lazy but unfortunately very effective marketing tactic to say there is more with less effort. It’s kinda the same reason why the vast majority of echo fighters have little to nothing changed about them for their movesets, they’re just glorified skins, although with those in particular it’s way more noticeable. Really the only DLC "swordfighter" (If you can even call him that) who’s unique is Steve, but even Sakurai jokingly admitted that he didn’t even want him in game, and I’m guessing they only gave in because they were forced to put him by Microsoft after Banjo to get their own end of the deal. Roughly 70% of all the Fighters Pass DLC characters alone used a sword or dagger as a primary weapon in some way. The facts are impossible to ignore, and it’s not even up for debate: Nintendo just doesn’t care and they have no reason to.
@skylandersfan6954
@skylandersfan6954 Жыл бұрын
How much work goes into a character is the same regardless of their weapon type, its not a lazy decision. Crash just spins and kicks but that doesn't change the fact those animations would take time to make regardless of how simple they are in concept
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@skylandersfan6954 It's more like Sakurai wants to keep the fighters simple. Steve is the exception to the rule, he said that he was the single hardest character to design for Smash.
@kaito2220
@kaito2220 2 жыл бұрын
DDD has a disjoint like a swordie but nonexistent frame data to use it effectively...guess what I'm saying is do an episode on the King!
@LC-wv7tz
@LC-wv7tz 2 жыл бұрын
Similarly, Meta Knight has a weapon, but it has less range than many brawlers and he has no kill power to speak of.
@kaito2220
@kaito2220 2 жыл бұрын
@@LC-wv7tzYeah and Sepheroth is allowed to have a sword that's longer and stronger than ddd's hammer and has one wing cause why tf not, steve kinda has similar disjoints to meta knight but he can touch you once and you're at 70%, if not killed by a diamond b-air Dlc lowkey soured ultimate imo XD
@LC-wv7tz
@LC-wv7tz 2 жыл бұрын
@@kaito2220 Yeah. Not a fan of the DLC at all. I never bought any of it. Been playing Smash since 1998, and the DLC packs are the first time I didn't get new Smash stuff when it came out.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@LC-wv7tz Not even Banjo???
@Taktaagic
@Taktaagic 2 жыл бұрын
Seeing you think that swordies aren’t just clones with no soul is honestly releaving. It’s dumb that some folks think that swordies are a waste
@royemmer3703
@royemmer3703 2 жыл бұрын
But they are💀
@kingmeprime
@kingmeprime 2 жыл бұрын
People just get frustrated; and rightfully so. Being walled out is frustrating. For me personally I prefer a fast paced back-and-forth game. That is what smash is to me. Zoners and some swordies can get in the way of that. Although where I understand the depth that goes behind it, a lot of people don't care. They're mad and they want change. The roster we have now does feel mildly excessive but I'm grateful for what sword characters bring to the game. They should get more praise !
@SSM24_
@SSM24_ 2 жыл бұрын
I do honestly think _four_ direct Marth clones/semi-clones is a bit much even if they do play differently, but other than that I absolutely agree, there's a ton of variety in how each swordfighter actually plays (though they could also stand to have fewer down-B counters tbh).
@LC-wv7tz
@LC-wv7tz 2 жыл бұрын
Sword users are a fine archetype, but there is far too many of them. You could literally cut the number of them in half and the game would still be fine and they do play extremely similarly. There are minute differences between Marth/Lucina and Roy/Chrom. To say nothing of the fact that Marth and Roy are *already* almost the same character with the same moves, just with tweaked frame data and sweet spots. They did more to make them different in this game than ever before, but comparing them to, for example, the spacies they are still way more similar to one another than Fox is to Falco or Wolf. Characters like Byleth and Sephiroth are at least pretty unique, but most swordies play the same and have the same gameplan. They are easy to play and hard to punish and there are twice as many of them as there needs to be. Spam out giant unpunishable intangible hitboxes and randomly clip the opponent a few times. Then spam your broken giant hit box intangible kill move with as frames almost as good as brawlers. It gets so boring fighting these same characters over and over again.
@Yoshixandir
@Yoshixandir 2 жыл бұрын
Most of the sword fighter despite being similar they all play differently. That’s why they are fun to use. My favorite sword fighter is shulk, Ike, Lucina and byleth and they all have to be played differently
@derptron9862
@derptron9862 Жыл бұрын
What’s the clip at 4:27 from?
@EmoryIllustrated
@EmoryIllustrated 2 жыл бұрын
Roy, a character who's sweetspots exist close to his body, and thus has easier combos, is a deadly combination of a brawler and swordie. Roy isn't broken because he has great kill power, but because he has easy kill setups. His sweetspots are super lineate, which in combination with their higher hitstun makes them incredibly useful. All you need to win as Roy is to be in your opponents face, and you're guaranteed success. Compare this to Marth. His tippers are significantly stronger than Roy's sweetspots, yet his is considered a much worse character... Why is that? Because, he is the opposite of Roy is every respect. His sweetspots are further from is body, which means it is significantly more difficult to capitalize on the greater hit-stun it has. Tipper hit-boxes are much smaller too, which means you rarely get to take advantage of tipper hitstun. Hitting a sour spot with Marth is also significantly more dangerous than Roy hitting a sour spot. Marth will always be close to the opponent when a sour spot lands, which almost always guarantees a punish from the opponent. Meanwhile, Roy can land a sourspot, and still easily escape unscathed. What you have is this: Marth is a character requiring precision, with few combos and kill confirms, who is easily punished for sloppy play. Roy is a character that you play aggressively, with hard to mess-up combos and several kill confirms, who is easily punished only when the player doesn't know what they're doing.
@Spyder-Marth
@Spyder-Marth 2 жыл бұрын
I see where you're coming from but I have to disagree with the Marth sour thing. The only sour that's really punishable is the up smash and foward smash at low percent. Anything else is very safe because it either starts a *true* combo (that could lead into a tipper, even), or is still strong enough to knock someone away far enough to give you time to recover. Marth's sour aerials and sour tilts (besides F-tilt) starts a true combo or kill confirm that's mad safe. It's only not safe if you don't properly perform a follow-up attack or dodge a baited move. Speaking of which, Marth's so good with follow-ups that he's such a good baiting character. The amount of fake follow-ups I can pull to land a well-spaced tipper is insane. Not to mention a lot of his aerials are safe on shield, especially Nair and Uair. If I'm being honest, Marth may actually get more reward from his sours but of course it takes more precision. Even if you combo into another sour, you're usually in a safe position. Just like Roy, you're only getting punished if you don't know what you're doing.
@jasomega2446
@jasomega2446 2 жыл бұрын
Sword fighters Are Amazing Play styles!
@OverZeelous
@OverZeelous 2 жыл бұрын
Disjoints. Roll credits.
@uhhGalaxii
@uhhGalaxii 2 жыл бұрын
Seeing a Guilty Gear clip in here was sick as hell. love that game
@Popsvoice
@Popsvoice 2 жыл бұрын
“Mythra, the best combo swordie…” Just wanted to point out that the best combos with a sword belong to Sora. She’s the better swordie but not for comboing. Sora has combos even at 100+.
@free3793
@free3793 2 жыл бұрын
I mean I dont play the game but it’s technically a key right and not a sword
@espurrseyes42
@espurrseyes42 2 жыл бұрын
@@free3793 A KeyBLADE. A sword-key hybrid.
@ivrydice0954
@ivrydice0954 Жыл бұрын
Mythra has combos at 100% too lmao. While also not being slow as a senior. After all part of having a good combo game is comboing into another combo or advantage.
@Popsvoice
@Popsvoice Жыл бұрын
@@ivrydice0954 for sure Mythra is better. Sora just has combos that work at any percent, and only depend on the Sora player messing up; no DI or SDI helps. That’s the only point I was making.
@ivrydice0954
@ivrydice0954 Жыл бұрын
@@Popsvoice So Sora having combos at any percent makes him the best combo swordie?
@lordmew5
@lordmew5 2 жыл бұрын
I think there are 2 things you failed to bring up in the current strength of sword fighters. First and most important being the severe lack of movement abilities. This makes it very hard for players to even get in on sword fighters you dont retain momentum when you jump, its hard to get off platforms and most importantly intial dashes are really bad in this game and have you unable to do anything really meaningful out of it or during it. This leads to a lot of characters having some kind of combos starter that isn't reliable against a player spamming aerials that have almost no lag. The second is that you cant run through opponents anymore. So in smash ultimate you mostly only need to control the space in front not so much a circle around yourself because the opponent reliable go behind you without you see it like with a double jumpwhich you can see. These two things combined means the most optimal way to play is by controlling the space in front of you and spamming aerials because there is no reliable way to get in on a spamming a opinion and even if you can get in with a dash you can't use your combo starter attack reliably. The exception to this are precisely the characters you described characters whose combo starter were dash attacks or rising aerials out of a dash examples sheik rising fair, wolf dash attack and nair, greninja dash attack. I don't think sword characters are overpowered i just think the design of the game vey heavily encourages their style.
@jared5387
@jared5387 2 жыл бұрын
another character that is rarely seen would be pit/dark pit since there are very few players who use them
@Antonio-is2cn
@Antonio-is2cn 2 жыл бұрын
Link/Toon Link/Young Link Meta Knight Pit Dark Pit Marth Roy Ike Lucina Robin Corrin Chrom Byleth Shulk Pyra/Mythra Cloud Sephiroth Hero Mii Swordfighter Sora? (That's clearly a key not a sword) 22 Sword fighters in Smash (Ganondorf is not included here because he's a physical fighter)
@SonicTheCutehog
@SonicTheCutehog Жыл бұрын
Pit and Dark Pit are arguably also since they use their bow split into two halves to attack, not a sword.
@leoerus
@leoerus 2 жыл бұрын
What is the song used at the end?
@aahanrashid
@aahanrashid Жыл бұрын
Which anime is the clip at 4:26 from?
@alexc2265
@alexc2265 Жыл бұрын
1:48 Oh geez, is that a Dr Fate spamming in Injustice?
@Laaki27
@Laaki27 2 жыл бұрын
What’s the anime at 4:26?
@samuelkennedy2840
@samuelkennedy2840 2 жыл бұрын
13:20 Then there's my friend who says that "all fe characters are the same" including Byleth and Robin in that claim
@dantelawrence4676
@dantelawrence4676 2 жыл бұрын
They probably never played as any of the FE characters then. Robin, Corrin, Byleth and even Ike are very different from each other and the other FE characters.
@crazypomp927
@crazypomp927 2 жыл бұрын
Roy is broken AF!!! I mained Lucina in the early Smash Ultimate meta back when everyone thought she was the best character in the game, but I was already telling people that she wasn't even the best swordie because Roy is broken AF. Roy side B kills earlier than Cloud limit Crosslash. Broken AF.
@chesscakee
@chesscakee 2 жыл бұрын
Can you do a why everyone ____ video on Steve? I hear you mention him and I want to know where he fits in the Meta of Smash.
@davidnelson43
@davidnelson43 2 жыл бұрын
what is the anime where the guy got cut my the sword
@gameboyn64
@gameboyn64 Жыл бұрын
The thing i hate the most about playing as a swordy is that it clanks all the time with body hitboxes. I've clanked cloud f smash with cpt falcon f tilt that was attacking the wrong way because of his butt hitbox
@jonathanlgill
@jonathanlgill 2 жыл бұрын
I love the swordfighter archetype. I will say I think the two DLC packs went a bit too far in how many were included. I like how Hero and Byleth play, but then the DLC second pack had the majority of its characters wield swords (if you include Steve). I think that felt a bit too disjoint heavy. But I also think a major reason the archtype is popular right now is that the two best players in the world only play swordfighters; and each of them can play multiple characters within that archetype.
@jesusmejia3417
@jesusmejia3417 2 жыл бұрын
I mean, I don't know if there are many swordies or not but man Sephiroth is so cool he NEEDS to be in Smash.
@jonathanlgill
@jonathanlgill 2 жыл бұрын
@@jesusmejia3417 I feel like a second Final Fantasy character should have been from one of the FF games that actually debuted on a Nintendo platform. Instead we got a second character from a single game, VII, and a character whose been pretty overexposed with his inclusion in Kingdom Hearts and various FF spinoffs. He's animated very nicely, though. And his katana slicing is distinct from any other character we have.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 2 жыл бұрын
@@jesusmejia3417 Thats because he represents Dissidia, without. He wouldn't be anywhere near Smash.
@elizabethstauffer8573
@elizabethstauffer8573 2 жыл бұрын
I wish they would have committed to Ganon having a sword and making him the first heavy swordy
@DLCguy
@DLCguy 2 жыл бұрын
Ike?
@elizabethstauffer8573
@elizabethstauffer8573 2 жыл бұрын
@@DLCguy oh I straight up forgot he exists
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 2 жыл бұрын
@@elizabethstauffer8573 Thats because Path of Radiance didn't sell well. Ike is more beloved in Smash and Fire Emblem Heros than the game he came from.
@Ai-jr4ou
@Ai-jr4ou 2 жыл бұрын
I think sword fighters extend only to swords and other relatively large objects (Dedede hammer, Palu Staff and Shield). Palu because she makes big wings or beams of light and then Bair and Dash attack are invincible so you can't challenge them, things like Dedede are self-explanatory big non-sword object without a hurtbox. Like Mewtwo if we cut the tail hurtbox. But things like the Pits and to a lesser extent Game & Watch should be outed from that listing. In all fairness looking at Pit's moves he should be a sword fighter but his hitboxes are just not on the furthest parts of the blade so you get a good midrange move at best. The only real exception is his F-tilt which is missing a little off the top, but is still big otherwise. In gameplay though it is an awful move due to a verity of the moves numbers. And I am not sure how core the point about swordfighters moves just killing is to your statements but only Bair does that for Pit which is not too big of a hitbox and only starts doing that job of being a raw kill option at 130+ with everything else being either a smash attack read (every character has) or a aerial offstage where the blastzone is super close.
@SN-gv9zw
@SN-gv9zw 2 жыл бұрын
you should probably link mockrock’s channel in the description
@someguynamedtom9873
@someguynamedtom9873 2 жыл бұрын
I have mythra as a pocket character because she’s good, easy and safe Probably the same with other swordies their range makes them safer and less comital
@famillesabot5719
@famillesabot5719 2 жыл бұрын
I found someone who don't $hit on Mythra as a Smash character. I can die in peace.
@NightRaven5568
@NightRaven5568 2 жыл бұрын
@@famillesabot5719 well he said easy so if you consider calling a character easy to be shit on then he did
@smiile6226
@smiile6226 2 жыл бұрын
I would love a Video About Zero Suit Samus and why there are only few succeding with her and why some say shes top 10 and other say Low hightier
@actuallynotsteve
@actuallynotsteve Жыл бұрын
She's extremely tough to use effectively because she requires very precise inputs and is super light/punishable if you mess up
@TricksterLawlet
@TricksterLawlet 2 жыл бұрын
I wonder if the Links will be considered one
@wellberightback4861
@wellberightback4861 2 жыл бұрын
God knows how broken sephiroth would have been if he swung his sword instead of doing thrusts...
@zombie-bv9pr
@zombie-bv9pr 2 жыл бұрын
yea imagine if he had both an aerial and a smash attack where he swings and covers about half the stage...
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@zombie-bv9pr Fire Emblem truly represents the realistic way of using a sword. Sephiroth, Pyra and Mythra are just flashy powerful characters that so happens to have a sword.
@NodokenStar-k917
@NodokenStar-k917 2 жыл бұрын
Roy is ma main, ma boi, but most importantly… He’s my swordsman.
@hecatia666
@hecatia666 2 жыл бұрын
I'm very aware about Lucina being better than Marth. I've been told this many times but I'm a stubborn woman and I'll keep playing my boy because he feels rewarding to play.
@sakutaro3musik486
@sakutaro3musik486 2 жыл бұрын
byleth is my main and I love his gameplay, swordies play really different, the reason marth and lucina have the same moveset is because they are echo fighters, same goes for Roy and Chrom, but other then that all play different and out of all echo fighters those even play the most different, is there even a difference when it comes to other echo fighters?
@anothenblue2630
@anothenblue2630 2 жыл бұрын
Ken and Ryu are essentially their own thing, the former being called an echo is weird. Daisy, Dark Samus and Richter are glorified alt costumes, Dark Pit is a literal color swap.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@anothenblue2630 Dark Pit's Side B is different from Pit and Dark Pit's arrow deals more damage than Pit's.
@anothenblue2630
@anothenblue2630 Жыл бұрын
@@orangeslash1667 big whoop, still a glorified alt costume that's a literal Pit recolor. Hell, Dark Samus has more differences than him just by virtue of having different animations.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@anothenblue2630 The propose of Echos is that you can stock the two characters in the same slot on the character select screen. Most characters can only have 8 alts and 3 taunts, so now you can double that. For example Dark Samus's pink alt is a reference to Gandrayda from Prime 3, while normal Samus's pink alt is a reference to her Varia Suit from the NES Metroid. Sakurai really loves references🤓.
@anothenblue2630
@anothenblue2630 Жыл бұрын
@@orangeslash1667 the problem is that half of them are wasted like this and will nver escape clone hell, not to mention who's an echo and who isn't is very arbitrary.
@captainamedeus7047
@captainamedeus7047 2 жыл бұрын
I’m still surprised that Ganondorf doesn’t have more sword attacks. Then again, he was always a Captain Falcon copycat
@Triforce9426
@Triforce9426 2 жыл бұрын
Meta Knight over her with his butter knife of a sword that barely has hitboxes that match it's length.
@levert2457
@levert2457 2 жыл бұрын
I'm not a professional or anything when it comes to this but can we call certain sword fighters to have balance weapons club fighters because I like to think Twilight princess link from brawl was our first club swordsman then Lucina and Chrome.
@rhoem1353
@rhoem1353 Жыл бұрын
Sword main love them so much
@BlankPapers
@BlankPapers Жыл бұрын
Swords are just a common trait among characters and especially main characters. Variety would be nice, but sometimes, getting those popular picks…and fire emblem characters, into the roster requires you to submit to the sword gods. As for the actual discussion, swords are reliable, but they’re also a double edged sword, pun intended. It’s the same way why rangers can get owned by swordies, as swordies can be owned by fighters. They don’t necessarily have bad frame data, but they’re slow enough to be exploitable, and faster characters can see that, punish, and defeat. Admittively, auto piloting is easy as a swordie, but sometimes, that can be to your detriment when your stray hits become exploitable habits, and sometimes, your stray hits, even infrequent, is the thing they’re waiting for to end a stock. Consider that in a game of chicken, when you’re landing a final blow, a stray hit can be easy to hit, it can also be slow enough or be just the wrong amount of space, for your opponent to up smash you with their much faster move, or back or forward air you the same way.
@damir_van_kalaz
@damir_van_kalaz Жыл бұрын
I'm sick of seeing this topic come up already when it's so obvious why. First, let's understand what we're dealing with: Smash's roster consists entirely of already established characters from other IPs. Furthermore, the numerous more obscure characters throughout gaming history are always ignored unless it's a character from a forgotten game of Nintendo's that they want to remind people about the existence of. In addition, when a new video game series is selected to be represented in Smash, the main character of that series or game is always the first pick. Now ask yourself, how many popular, well-known main characters are there in gaming that use axes, spears, hammers, daggers, or some other variety of melee weapon that is NOT a sword? Best examples that come to mind for me would be Gordon Freeman who uses a crowbar, Ezio who uses a wrist blade, and if we really want to count him, there's Kratos, who more recently has begun using an axe more often than the pair of swords he used to wield. Now, how many of these characters are there that use bows, guns, magic, or any other form of ranged weaponry that is also NOT a sword? For the record, we're not counting the MCs of any of the Call of Duty or Battlefield games because none of those characters are iconic enough to be represented as a fighter in Smash. Your best hope would be characters like Doomslayer, Master Chief, Dante, Lara Croft, or Marcus Fenix, and even out of those five, three of them also use swords in addition to their firearms. Now, how many of these characters are there that primarily use a sword? Just off the top of my head, there's 2B (Nier: Automata), Lloyd (Tales of Symphonia), Yuri (Tales of Vesperia), Raiden (Metal Gear), Yu Narukami (Persona 4), Adol (Ys), and Zack (Final Fantasy 7). And I bet whoever is reading this also had a lot more examples come to mind with that last question than the previous two. The only other thing more common than seeing a popular video game character with a sword is seeing one that uses their fists, and what do you know? The fist-fighters in Smash outnumber the swordfighters. Imagine that one. Mystery solved. You can all stop whining about characters wielding swords now. Though, realistically, you'll still keep whining because your character from some obscure indie game uses a melee weapon that isn't a sword and clearly they have something better than a snowball's chance in hell of being included in the popularity contest that is the Smash roster. I get it. I'd love to see Lea from Crosscode, or Hat Kid from A Hat in Time, or Robin from Iconoclasts, or the knight from Hollow Knight (although he is also a sword wielder), but when even an indie character as obnoxiously popular as Sans gets the mii fighter treatment, the odds aren't exactly looking too good, now are they?
@spicymeatballs2thespicening
@spicymeatballs2thespicening Жыл бұрын
Min min isn't the main character of arms, but anyway 90% of the examples you gave in the second part are rpg characters, of course there are a thousand of those with swords. The characters from other genres that you mentioned wouldn't fit the swordfighter archetype at all if their kits represented them well, even the ones with swords, for example doomslayer would probably be a zoner/brawler hybrid, and raiden a rushdown with a lot of multihits. Obviously there are millions of characters with sword like weapons, but there's an over-representation of fire emblem esque characters who just have one sword and slash you with it once for 90% of their moves.
@nathanlevesque7812
@nathanlevesque7812 2 жыл бұрын
They are overly simple, but I guess basic people needs characters too.
@lordtt3984
@lordtt3984 2 жыл бұрын
Because they're awesome tf? Why would I play as a toy robot when I can be the final boss of FF7 instead?
@breezeless_7665
@breezeless_7665 Жыл бұрын
Zoners not being as much picked as swordies just shows how much range and speed matters. Look at melee, Samus has both projectiles to control neutral and kill opponents but still lasers are considered better due to its speed
@davidquintanilla9330
@davidquintanilla9330 2 жыл бұрын
All beginners hate the feeling of their aerials always losing to enemy aerials.
@absenteechild8542
@absenteechild8542 Жыл бұрын
I think the issue most people have with swordies is how similar most of them are. I wish they would’ve given us a Lance or Axe fire emblem rep somewhere along the line just to mix things up.
@prouttourp4522
@prouttourp4522 2 жыл бұрын
Anyone got the name of the music playing?
@rotomRASENGAN
@rotomRASENGAN 2 жыл бұрын
I think it’s from Fire Emblem Fates. The music throughout the majority of the video.
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@rotomRASENGAN Fates had a very difficult Development.
@trongtran8951
@trongtran8951 2 жыл бұрын
When will you make why no play Meta Knight? Like there are some notable wins from MK players vs pro players like Bonk vs Wadi, Jay vs Maister, Abandgo vs Shuton. Despite he has decent kill attack and decent MU chart even against FP2, he is still being underwhelming.
@TJF588
@TJF588 Жыл бұрын
That rundown of series with swordfighter representatives. Like, yes, yes, they're from RPGs, and RPGs are contractually obligated the have sword-wielding leads. Which is the sorry state of things. Buck the trend, devs! Establish axes, or polearms! You can do it, I'm sure it's not _that_ much of a risk among your target audiences.
@michelemichienzi934
@michelemichienzi934 2 жыл бұрын
People joke about "Super Fire Emblem Bros.", I would honestly love that game
@theoctohat2005
@theoctohat2005 Жыл бұрын
BIG SWORD=BIG COOL
@eyyy2271
@eyyy2271 2 жыл бұрын
Yo Vars, will you do a video on Corrin at some point? 👌
@Tee_Wilson
@Tee_Wilson 2 жыл бұрын
Yes pls!
@orangeslash1667
@orangeslash1667 Жыл бұрын
@@Tee_Wilson the Reason for fate's sloppy story, is because the writers where trying to achieve too much with not enough time. Intelligents Systems had an idea for Fate to have three stories to appeal to everyone, but they realized that they didn't have enough writers. So they hired an outside writer, Shin Kibayashi was that writer. Intelligent Systems wanted Shin to write the outline for each pathway, what happened instead is that Shin wrote 500 pages for each pathway. Nintendo knew this was too long so they cut the story into pieces without the writers permission and the fact the Nintendo demanded Fates come on the Fire Emblem Anniversary only made things worse. Which resulted in this hilariously mess of a story. The good news this that there is a manga based on Fates that is a little better. Its called Fire Emblem If: the Crown of Niberlung.
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