Space Marine was my first boxed game, too. I remember little 11 year old me, wanting a game, teaching my mum the rules and she got a little too into it and and completely tabled me.

I loved old Epic. Unit cards. I had Squats. Land train, Cyclops, Overlord Airship, Goilliath cannons, so cool.

This is like listening to the history of my teenage years. Space Marine/Titan Legions was my #1 most favourite tt war game ever

You really hit the nail on the head, for me. I agree that this mythos or setting for war is best imagined as either small unit (skirmish) or large scale battles. I have played 40k and Horus Heresy for years, but the size battlefield does not reflect the impressions in my mind of such futuristic warfare. This is especially so with flyers at the 28mm level. And I love how the small infantry with small arm fire that cannot hurt a titan are seen in CONTEXT with larger things like titans. I am so happy about this game. Thank you for this video series.

Space Marine 2nd edition was so my jam, it's one of the few GW games that I miss playing from my youth

I remember going into this tiny game store in Caribou Maine and seeing Space Marine. I snagged a box, as did several other guys in the barracks. That started my path down the wargame road.

A beautiful walk down memory lane for us children of the 80s and anyone else curious about how we got to where we are today in terms of lore and games design. I haven't been this excited for a game for decades. Thanks Ash.

Adeptus Titanicus and Space Marine were about the best games GW ever did. We played the hell out of it when I was stationed in Japan. Small unit sizes allowed several of us to store armies on board ship. I am very cautiously optimistic about Legion Imperial. The price tag has got me very gun shy about it, though.

Epic has always been my first love in terms of GW games. Damn you Ash! Now you are tempting me to grab the new boxset.

This video is great, Ash!

Imagine how incredible the Orks would be, though! I'm still hopeful I'll get to paint modern mega gargants.

Yeah, I loved Space Marine, for a good year and a half from the end of 89-91 it was the main game I played with my brother and a couple of friends. I had a few bits of 40K with Rogue Trader at that time (heck, my first 40K Marine army was the Thousand Sons inspired by the picture of them on the side of the Space Marine box so they were red with the black M) but Space Marine was what we played, we had a 8x4ft board on a snooker table with roads and a cityscape painted with green and muddy fields and would set all the buildings on the cityscape and battle for hours with huge armies. Alas my brother fell out of love with GW and the hobby in general in 91, and a side effect of that is myself and the next group I was with going forward focused more on 40K, so by the time the last boxed set came out I no longer played, but I still have very fond memories of Space Marine and part of the reason I started AT when it came back, was Andy Hoare responding to a question on an early Warhammer TV stream about if they'd ever get to troops and him saying they'd like to down the line. I've been ever hopeful this was going to arrive at some point, and now its almost here and my eldest two sons are eager to give it a go after enjoying AT. So really looking forward to picking this game up.

My 1st box set was Space Marine '91. And the nostalgia bomb 💣 that went off in me when I saw those buildings, and remembered putting the plastic tops on the cardboard buildings! 😁

Well said. I’m old school too and while I never played 2nd Ed Epic I was fascinated by it and eventually played some Epic Armageddon. I have seen a lot of hate due to this being 30k or due to the infantry castings but in my mind they are fine and will serve the system well. I just hope 3D printing does not bury the system before it has even started as that will be a shame.

Can't remember the rules of the original Titanicus, nor the lore in the books, but I sure as shit remember my nine year old mind being blown away of the image of titans blowing each other away among the ruins of some city utterly devastated by war.

My buddy once said that "nostalgia is your inner child telling you he wants his stuff back". That applies here. I liked this look back at the game Ash, 👍

"Not for everybody... and that's OK" AMEN

I love that you're using the old intro for this TBT video - class meta joke! :D

Awesome video, love the new digs and a great walk down memory lane for those of us who began our miniature wargaming journey through epic. My first box set was 2nd ed Space Marines and I'm so jealous you have one copy sealed still. Love it. Keep up the great work and all the best with GMG.

There was so much content in those boxes. I had those first two starters and the booster box of space marines that gave you speeders and bikes. That was enough to play years of battles!

Thanks Ash, good times in the old days of Goblin Green, it is worth noting the fantastic community behind this game that has kept a fan base alive for this scale since 2nd edition. Fans of each of the edition have worked hard introducing dw lists and cleaner rules to keep the pulse of the game going

One of the first minis I bought in a lot when I got back into the hobby was an old adeptus titanicus titans. God I wished I’d known what I was holding before I got rid of it 😢 love of all the things they started back the flight of the Eisenstein is still such a important part of 40k history Great video as always ash

Thank you for a nice video. I think the weird thing about the different editions of Epic is how remarkably different they are. Typically, games seem to develop with one or two larger changes, and then coming editions tend to clean up unnecessary clutter in the games. However, with Epic, every edition throws out the kitchen sink and brings a new one in. That seems to suggest some larger issue that's never been solved in the system, most likely that issue being the issue of time/smoothness in game play versus the fun of complexity/granularity in a system with loads of tiny models. There's some things I like in every edition of the game. Space Marine has granularity, specifically for Titans. Epic 40 000 has one of the most evocative force organization charts, where every part of your larger force is a Warhammer 40 000 army and where combats between these "represents turns 4-6 in a game of Warhammer 40 000" which is just lovely. It also adds the blast markers, which is also one of these ways to both add and change things on the battlefield as the fighting progresses and which leaves a mark on it, and as you mention with destroying buildings, that's one of those things that are just cool and awesome. It also adds the mechanic of having weaker units bogging down the enemy by taking pot shots and adding blast markers, a mechanic that really shines in Epic: Armageddon. It looks like Legiones is bringing together a lot of these things and that's great. I wish we'd see blast markers and more granularity in Titans, but oh well.

Great video. Adeptus Titanicus was the very first Games Workshop wargame that I played when I was a kid. From then on I was hooked. You're so lucky to still have a copy of A.T.

After Space Crusade, Titan Legions was the first GW game I bought for Christmas for my son. I remember the the Imperator and Orc MegaGargant being cardboard cutouts. I bought the epic 40K box and LOTS of metal miniatures. I bought the Eldar. I bought the Tyranids. What a great supplement and army. That unique army build, inspired! I bought most of the Chaos armies. I missed out on the Tau by which time I had really stopped playing it. And then they spoiled it by bringing out Epic Armageddon. What I did though, was buy some of the old unit cards which seemed a better way of building armies. Now, all sold.

Titan Legions was my second boxed game after Man O War. I remember swapping a Super NES game (I think!) for a load of epic minis as well. Loved my (probably totally illegal) Whitescars + Imperator Titan army.

Nicely done fella. Very pleased this game is back. Many thanks for your content to support this release 👍

I still remember my box back in 1991 , 3 factions .. sad that didnt caught on xD

Epic 40k always had a special pleace in my heart, with this game my decades spanning crippling addiction to everything Warhammer started. But also I always loved the scale, there is something in me that loves really small scale things, Micro Machines over Matchbox, Mircomaster Transformers over regular Transformers.

2nd Ed. Epic was the first Tabletop Wargame I got into. I've played every Edition of Epic and of course got the new box as well. I'm somewhat disappointed they went with a new version of the SM/TL rules for LI, because E:A is such a brilliant system. I keep getting hung up on the notion that E40k was streamlined - it abstracted shooting, but then you had fate cards, complex damage tables for each individual war engine, terrain rules to a sometimes absurd degree (if your Warlord Titan steps within 10cm of a farm on an agri-world, there's a 0.08% chance it will be shot by an angry farmer for trespassing. And of course army building got extremely granular as well. E:A to me is not really a mix of SM/TL and E40k, while it has some E40k DNA (use of Blast Markers, Assaults as a combination of close combat and firefights), and just maybe a hint of SM/TL (army composition), it has some unique features - alternate activations with the option to retain ini and the AP/AT system that make it extremely distinct from all the other Epics and arguably better. AP/AT means that it is the only game that can truly differentiate between infantry units - in both SM/TL and E40k the difference between a stand of Terminators and a stand of basic guard grunts in't that big, because the system can't make them as different as the background would suggest and still leave room for Titans. In E:A there is a big difference and it still has room at the top for a Titan to be a Titan. And of course alternating activations means you constantly think about how your opponent could respond to what you want to do. "OK, that formationis out of position and I could engage it. If I don't do it now, they could move that other formation over and I'd have to deal with intermingled formations. But If I engage now, there is that formation over there, that hasn't activated so far and they could really do some damage to my unit, especially after engaging. Is it worth taking that risk? If they intermingle, I could maybe march that formation ito firefight range and then retain to engage, so I think I might wait it out by moving that formation on the other flank, where there's little action at the moment and let them worry about what happens here."

I recently picked up a 2e 40k starter, to celebrate the 30th anniversary of the best 40k being released. And now this, and this time I am in the position to pull the trigger on release day. Shaping up to be a pretty exciting christmas.

Epic Armageddon is (still) the best wargame ever for me. (despite some minor niggling flaws which are forgiven under a blanket of nostalgic love)

Throwback intro music? nice!

Hey the old intro ! Love it to be back

Your journey and love for 'Epic' scale right from 88/89 through to today Ash mirrors mine. Completely relate. As to "the circle being closed and the game returning to cherished roots", a lovely way to frame it. I can't deny the inner-childhood in me was already re-kindled when Adeptus Titanicus made its comeback five years ago, Legions is the culmination of that same long wait. So pumped to get back into it once again. Looking forward to your future content.

That Jim Burn's cover did it for me! Loved the miniatures, the formation cards which made it so quick to arrange a game, and miniatures like Capital Imperialis (I do hope they bring that back!) As Regimental HQ...awesome!. Most of mine were ultras so when I pick up the new boxset it's gonna be Battle of Calth.

I'm still looking forward to epic Eldar and Ork re-makes.

Interesting video - the original games came out around the time I was entering my 30 year wargame hibernation so I missed pretty much all of this. I do remember my friend bringing over some teeny space marine units and rhinos but we never actually played with them as we were still into Rogue Trader back then. I do like the idea of it though - big stompy mechs smashing stuff and stomping on things is always going to be cool!

Great content. I really hope this scale settles in for the long term, this time. I love it.

Fantastic video. Love hearing about your history with games.

i love vids into the history of such franchises - it make things so much clearer. and yes - not every game gw makes needs to be a huge one like wh40k. sometimes with a smaller audience and smaller scope you can still create a wonderful product that gunning for the big 'success' would not have made possible.

16:35 - I think you forgot about Aeronautica. Yes, it's not quite Epic, but it was pretty clear when that was released that was the direction they were heading, basically creating a heap of air support units that could be used in Legions.

I only started in at 2nd edition but I share your passion

Armageddon is my favorite epic game. Parts of Imperialis feel like they have taken the space marine rules added a bunch of special rules just to do what Armageddon did with it's ap and at values. But still will be fun, and honestly games look so much better than huge 40k/30k games.

That was very informative and now I feel like I have a better appreciation of the game, it boosts my enthusiasm

Oh the halcyon days we love 👍Our group collected all the Epic scale stuff from the start as well - and luckily still retain the majority of it. Great vid.. cheers - Time to go digging 😃

Thank you! Really loved this video. Got to say I'm really excited for this. It's been my dream.for heresy.

At this point I need to just hand ash my wallet and let him buy me things I didn’t know I needed. Great content sir!

Man, that's awesome. Epic 40k was my first GW purchase with my first paycheck from my first part time job in '98.

Hey Ash, I didn't realize that you had played that much Epic Armageddon. Did you participate in the game's development on the old Specialist Games forums, and if so, what was your forum handle? And I 100% agree about the great way that the EA rulebook was laid out - it was like a specification document with section and sub-section numbers. It made it very easy to find specific rules. The only thing that would have made it better would have been a two-sided cardboard sheet with a quick-start guide, like came with 40k 3rd edition.

This was a great walk back down memory lane😄 I got into epic with Space Marine 2nd ed. and Titan Legions (my god there was indeed so much card on the table!😂) but -as you mentioned- the rules changes in Epic 40k were a bit too much for me. I never tried Epic Armageddon which is a shame on reflection. The new version does look good, but I agree it needs the cards and buildings in the box. And lastly: no Pacino marine on the cover of Legions Imperialis?☹️

I have been waiting for this for years! Great video!

The thing about the lack of xenos races is that those are things that can always be added later. I’m fairly sure GW have stated that they have no intention of adding them, but fairly sure they said the same thing about Epic when AT18 was released. It’s probably better to start with things limited to the Heresy and allowing the system to get up and running quicker and add other things in later, than it is to try and cram everything in at launch. The only reason tOW is going to have as many factions as it will is probably because they have so many pre-existing molds in storage that they can dust off and so many people already have extensive collections they can use at launch, whereas for the most part they’re starting from scratch for LI and the old Epic molds are useless due to the scale change and the old minis being wildly inconsistent in size.

I loved SM1. Had to be dragged kicking and screaming to SM2.

Nice! The Blood Angels look so cute! I saw titanicus and space marine but it was space hulk that grabbed me. Great stuff Ash thanks

This captured my own feelings too - its such a buzz seeing how this game is so reflective of SM1.

The old music is back! YAAAAYYY!!!

Great vid ash, can't wait for all your content on this. I can't tell you how excited I am to play this game- as a youngun I was lucky enough to get a copy of BFG from my local store back in the early 2000s which built a love of specialist games for me, but I never got the chance to experience epic armageddon other than tangentially through white dwarf. Being able to get on at the start with LI feels very cathartic. Totally agree with your comments about the scale you want to experience these universes in.

Awesome! Eight years old? Man in ‘88 I graduated HS and went into the Army. At Fort Dix we loved this game! Any clue when Battlefleet Gothic is coming out?

Great video, Ash! I also like the relaxed vibe of the video and the warmth of the new office "set".

Great stuff. Loved the old games.

I prefer the larger minis from Imperialis because of the details, and they're easier to mod and paint details on.

Space Marine and Titan Legions were my jam as well. They were such good systems and incredibly underrated imo. You could do a throwback thursday of some old Epic games. Maybe a nostaligc Imperial v Orcs game with Megagargants and Imperator titans? Ir even Net Epic...

Love this! Great video.

AMAZING VIDEO Ash! Really nice Epic system overview! I love the format of the video!

Great Video

What a great video! Love the new style and some amazing history here. I can wait to see your battle reports that will happen as soon as you have some opponents.

Having played a huge amount of 2nd edition space marine in my youth, just got into Legions Imperialis. Somewhat against my better judgement, as i was very concerned about it being properly supported going forwards, but my son wanted it. We played a demo in our local GW store which was great and we've now played our first game at home. It is much better at passing the immersion test than most other GW games with much less cause to dive into the rulebook, and is nice and quick to play. As you say, really just an extension of the original game. Big downside is you cannot plug and play out of the boxset as it has no terrain. And the other annoyance is delivering rules for new units through campaign books. I thought we were done with that nonsense GW! Great overview!

Thanks for a very interesting overview. Epic 40k was such an under-rated rules set, the streamlining that (in my view) didn't work in 40k 3rd edition was perfect for Epic, to this day I think it's a gold standard of an elegant set of rules. A shame it didn't stick.

Great video, Ash. My recollection is that Battlefleet Gothic lifted its core mechanics from Epic 40K, not the other way around. I also agree with you about the best scales to engage the 30K/40K universe - A. 6/8mm to capture the grandness of battle, and B. 28/32mm for skirmish battles of 6-15 models. What GW has turned standard 40K into is just not an enjoyable examination of a battle.

The Adeptus Titanicus cover of #108 was my first White Dwarf aged 13. Adeptus Titanicus was my first GW game, which I finally got in-hand on the day that I (weirdly enough...) kissed the Blatney Stone. I won best army at the first (and only IIRC) Epic 40,000 tournament on the day that Pricess Diana died. Like you Ash, the various versions of Epic signpost eras of the first twenty years of my gaming life. I resisted Adeptus Titanicus 2018, but resisting Legions Imperialis is trickier. You are not helping 😉

I'm excited because I always wanted to play Epic when I was a kid but never had the money to but it and 40K. I've got my preorder in and i can't wait! I'm also excited to see what the community does to make it more 40K. P.S. Loving the Halifax representation in the background :)

Was really excited for a new epic 40k. I never got into 40k proper but bought WFB as a kid as thats what my mates played, even though I wanted to get Space Marine. However the lack of alien races (which I'm into as opposed to Space Marines) has made me lukewarm on Imperialis. Though this weekend I've the house to myself and I'm going to binge on all your Imperialis content then and see if my apathy towards the game is unwarranted. The gameplay is always the critical thing for me.

Thanks grand dad for telling us a story. There should be some fire in the background. That would fit Grandpa Canada's style. 😁👍

Epic scale is the best scale

Great video

The fact rhat the community kept Epic Armageddon going for that gap of time where GW abandoned it really speak volumes about the love that game had. I agree with you that the new LI box set isn't what it could be. The lack of buildings, or legally playable armies, makes it feel like a step sideways instead of a step forward. I think they should have taken a similar approach to Battletech: include the core rules and then a lore primer to get people started rather than a honking hardcover book that jacks up the price. Then you can include more models, getting both forces up to at least 1k points or more and possibly even lowering the cost of the box altogether.

Thank's Ash, I'm digging the deep dive into the history and lore. I personally find the Horus Heresy the more interesting and evocative part of the 30K/40K universe. Looking forward to 8mm army mans go boom.

I had Blood bowl 2nd edition, dark future, and Space marine as a kid. I wanted Space Hulk but I only got these for christmas so never quite got it. I was drawn to space marine since I could use the buildings in battletech also.

I'm excited to see small scale stuff getting some current main stream releases. That said I'm not a huge HH fan so LI will be a pass for me. Seeing all those old Epic sets was worth the watch tho since I was wee little during their hayday.

I never got into old epic, i always wanted, but as a youngster I just didn't have the cash. So I stuck to 40k and BFG, but I remember looking at the tiny stud in the online stores, before they vanished from GW's & FW's inventory. When Titanicus was released I jumped in, hoping for return of Epic. (and I hope for the return of BFG as well) What I think GW needs to do now, is include xenos in the Heresy universe, at al the different scales. (subjectively eldar or orks just need rules)

Great video, mirrors my own experience and expectations. I started way back then too, the only version I didn’t play was e40k and I have to agree that while I love SM2, EA is my go to and the best set of rules. I’ve made my peace with the scale change and the lack of xenos (for now maybe?) and am just going to take my time and enjoy it (I’ve had the boxed set for 2 days now and I haven’t had the time to open it as I don’t want to rush that experience, I’m going to wait until I have an hour or two to really get into it)

Since Warhammer The Old World is coming out next year, I would love to see Ash play different iterations of Warhammer FaBa. Also didn't know that Epic scale games had so long history.

😎👍

Thanks again as always for your views Ash !

I also had those boxes

Great video, I also love the Epic system and will be getting the starter set once it comes back into stock lol. I started with Dirtside 2 before finding out about Epic in the late 90's. been in love with both systems since. I was wondering though do you think they will continue the line with another edition of Space marine with the Eldar? And do you think they will skip over Titan legion remake?

I just started the video, but now I have to wonder... there's a Boy Scout miniature wargame? I never got to wargame in the Boy Scouts.

Just to keep reporting on the audio issues, every time you went into the "Look at this box set contents" view, the audio went to the left ear again. Everything with you in the shot was fine. Watching on desktop, Firefox, surround sound headset. Hope you get it figured out without too much trouble, audio issues are always weird.

How can we have Throw Back Thursday on....Wednesday?? Cats and dogs living together! Mass hysteria!

Epic 40,000 pre-dates Battle Fleet Gothic by 2 years. I remember quite clearly because Epic came out about the time that I started collecting and I was very much an embedded store regular by the time Battle Fleet Gothic came out. So it's likely that Battle Fleet Gothic borrowed from Epic. Unless perhaps, Andy Chambers was working on both at the same time and came up with the mechanic for a pre-release BFG and decided it was a good fit for Epic. But either way Epic would have been the first released with the Mechanic.

So do we get a play through of original space marine.

The scale suits 40K vehicles and long range guns way better. It is cool with fliers, tanks, Titans... On a normal table they are like taking your car 100-200 meters down the road.

EA was always my favourite game. Looking at the rules for the new version, I'm not sure if it is as good as EA. But I will give it a go.

This scale is not for me. Thank you for the trip down memory lane. I remember a lot of this stuff advertised in White Dwarf. I remember seeing Epic 40K being played in my FLGS. The art from Space Marine was used for one of my first 40K boxes the Space Marine Strikeforce.

You know what, Ash? You've turned me. I was against this on the basis of it being 30k, probably because of the seeming over focus on all things space marine over the last 10 years... but it does actually make sense for this specific product to be 30k. Maybe I'll give this a chance... Thanks =)

You should keep an eye on Epic Warpath by Mantic. Kickstarter in the new year, from the small amount of info it's set to be just like Epic Space Marine with an actually decent mantic ruleset made by Alessio Cavatore

Is 8mm the Primaris of 6mm?

Nice history lesson and editorial, Ash... but you're getting away from your core channel- you need more book reading in your next one.

Epic 40k predates Battlefleet Gothic by 2 years. Battlefleet took it's rule system from Epic, not vice versa.