Daniel Wolpert: The real reason for brains

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Daniel Wolpert: The real reason for brains

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Күн бұрын

www.ted.com Neuroscientist Daniel Wolpert starts from a surprising premise: the brain evolved, not to think or feel, but to control movement. In this entertaining, data-rich talk he gives us a glimpse into how the brain creates the grace and agility of human motion.
TEDTalks is a daily video podcast of the best talks and performances from the TED Conference, where the world's leading thinkers and doers give the talk of their lives in 18 minutes. Featured speakers have included Al Gore on climate change, Philippe Starck on design, Jill Bolte Taylor on observing her own stroke, Nicholas Negroponte on One Laptop per Child, Jane Goodall on chimpanzees, Bill Gates on malaria and mosquitoes, Pattie Maes on the "Sixth Sense" wearable tech, and "Lost" producer JJ Abrams on the allure of mystery. TED stands for Technology, Entertainment, Design, and TEDTalks cover these topics as well as science, business, development and the arts. Closed captions and translated subtitles in a variety of languages are now available on TED.com, at www.ted.com/tra....

Пікірлер: 350

@MrCattlehunter 12 жыл бұрын

Ironic that brains exist to facilitate the movements of the body, while more than one philosopher have dreamed of the possibility of existing as a brain independent of the body...

@kettlebellmusclegain 9 жыл бұрын

Without seeing the studies, I have felt this way for years and have attempted to tell my community and audience of it. I'm happy to be able to share this now with them. Beautiful talk Daniel !!!

@emiki6 3 жыл бұрын

If you reply I will tell you a more profound model.

@StarKillerSith1 Жыл бұрын

@@emiki6 Tell me

@emiki6 Жыл бұрын

@@StarKillerSith1 I'm not sure what I wanted to write back then, but rewatching the video I think it's the following: Generally movement is too fast, to receive and process sensory input, so you just don't use it in moves you already know. Sensory input is mostly used in retrospect. You want to move in a particular way, the CNS predicts what it needs to tell the body to replicate what you want, then the body moves and you observe the result. If the result is deviated from your will, then the sensory stuff is taken into consideration and the CNS finetunes the commands to match what you want better. If you practice a movement a lot of time, you get proficient in it and can execute it increasingly fast, accurate and precise. The CNS commands work this way: The goal isn't to flex the muscle, but to move the joints and that is translated to how much each muscle have to flex and when. The distance of the muscles to the CNS is different, thus the time for the signals to get there is different. The CNS have to be aware of the delay and send the signals sooner to the muscles further and later for the muscles nearer, to produce synchronous movement. Punches are a good example. A perfect punch is executed, when every muscle flexes at the right time and there is a quasi-solid structure assembled for a moment exactly when the punch lands. If that is fulfilled the the puncher will hit like a truck. It's more technique than force, because it relies on supporting the punch, not throwing it. The person told me this refers to it as "seismic punch", because when he hits the sandbag this way, there's can be heard a specific bang sound. There is nowhere for the force to "leak" because of the perfect support and it all goes into the bag from the floor. If the punch lacks synchronicity, the force will leak and the puncher need much more brute strength to achieve the same result in punching force. Also if the spine, shoulders etc aren't held in a particular way, then the structure isn't supported by the solid bone structure, but the flexible tendons and muscles to keep the integrity, thus force will leak. All the bones and joints needs to be aligned to an arch, that connects the opponent to the floor through a punch, thus the performer will "hit the opponent with the floor". For this, the CNS needs to send the right kind of impulses, to the right muscles, at the right time. To do this, there is a movement program that the CNS developed before by practice and now, just executes it. There are movement programs for everything. There are fundamental programs that control singular joints, the next layer is bi-jount movements and so on. If your fundamental programs are screwed, you are at a disadvantage, you will be weaker, less flexible and prone to injury. The more a kid moves the more chance there is to develop good programs. Also, programs are somewhat inherited genetically and you also mimics your parents, so if they move well or badly, you will copy it. Talent is a big factor, some can learn movements and develop good programs fast, other struggle and have to consciously counter their lack of talent, while never reaching the level of the talented one.

@istvanheimer1845 4 ай бұрын

@@emiki6 great, thanx! I was wondering: what about music? I mean how do we learn to appreciate Mozart or Beethoven? Raeding or the nature is easier, isn't it?

@emiki6 4 ай бұрын

@@istvanheimer1845 írhatom magyarul amit gondolok? :D

@TinkerTailor. 10 жыл бұрын

Jellyfish actually use on of the most efficient means of traveling known in the animal kingdom. They create vortexes between contraction and expulsion, when the vortex is filled they are pushed forward. A completely deliberate and controlled method of traveling. One of the most efficient means of traveling in the animal kingdom.

@ShawnRavenfire 11 жыл бұрын

I suspect a lot of the difficulty in teaching robots to move in a humanlike manner is that humans base our decisions on probability, and are constantly reevaluating, whereas machines think in terms of absolute certainty, which is a concept which doesn't apply to the real world. Ironic, then, that humans have such a tendency to seek out certainty, and in doing so, become more robot-like.

@jerryknewtwd9751 4 жыл бұрын

Shawn Ravenfire your statement is highly profound and important in the development of machine learning.

@CreepyMemes 10 ай бұрын

10 years later and Ai is based on probability

@KayAteChef 11 жыл бұрын

I didn't struggle to understand him. His speech is pretty clear.

@itsamadman 10 жыл бұрын

The first thing that came to mind when I saw this was Ido Portal lol.

@BedVerhoef 8 жыл бұрын

found this because of ido! an incredible human!

@MIKO00 12 жыл бұрын

I find his assertions VERY intriguing, but he hasn't completely sold me on the idea that the brain exists ONLY to control movement. Certainly this might be true in lower life forms. Aso one could argue that absolutely anything that is perceived as changing is movement. Typing and writing and talking all involve movement but their GOAL is to express thought.

@lilyzhong7458 4 жыл бұрын

I learned so much from this Ted Talk. Thank you very much the creators that made this happen!

@Forkroute 12 жыл бұрын

wow...one of the best TED I have watched

@fossilman2 12 жыл бұрын

As a young man, Richard Feynman would pace when trying to solve a radio repair puzzle. Albert Einstein is reported to have said he did his thinking while in motion.

@selfelements8037 7 жыл бұрын

9:24 This is the magic of sports where for the most part things happen so quickly that decision-making has to be made almost unconsciously, meaning it's mainly an intuitive process rather than a conscious one. And as neuroscience already suggests, the unconscious portion of the mind is orders of magnitude faster and more capable than the conscious mind which theoretically equates no more than a 56kbps dial-up modem.

@sparkloweb 12 жыл бұрын

2:18 Guy in 2nd row, blue shirt, is a tenured professor.

@metalitia4 3 жыл бұрын

no, he is definitely pre-tenure (no gray hair) and reassessing his life choices . Guy in black in front of him is tenured and obvs feels called out

@fonzdaii 12 жыл бұрын

simply genius. Great experimental design, and incredible ability to see the big picture...people always forget to bring it down to the basics! Movement!

@McNoat 6 жыл бұрын

I've attended a talk of him a couple of days ago and he is still using the first couple of slides that he used in this video from over 6 years ago ^.^

@eyelid222 5 жыл бұрын

what about message? Message also the same?

@muhammadarafat6630 5 жыл бұрын

This video had actually been uploaded seven years before you wrote this comment, so....

@ethanallenhawley1052 11 ай бұрын

I'm so glad KZfaq put a banner under this video to provide additional context on Climate change for why we have brains. Clearly, it's not to correct wrong-think by applying banners to the bottom of KZfaq videos.

@GluttonForSex 12 жыл бұрын

This actually makes a lot of sense.

@CPLains 12 жыл бұрын

good talk. interestingly, the start uses the exact same argument, almost in the same way, that Rodolfo Llinas made in "I of the Vortex" (2002) if anyone is curious about more sources

@facundolucasch3393 Жыл бұрын

Este video cambió para siempre la relación que tengo con el movimiento y también con mi profesión como kinesiólogo 🙏🏽

@nicolasmrn 3 жыл бұрын

He also have a very sharp sense of humor.

@F_L_U_X 12 жыл бұрын

Nerdgasm at 2:16 lol I love these TED talks ^_^ ^ unrelated comments

@TobyEllisSongwriter 12 жыл бұрын

interesting, I'm trying to think about how to minimise noise in my movements when playing guitar/piano/drums now.

@takaditakadang 11 жыл бұрын

He sounds like Stewie

@nicolasmrn 3 жыл бұрын

haha true

@SIMKINETICS 12 жыл бұрын

One implication here is that we know nothing with certainty; knowledge is based on practical probability.

@Bmants 12 жыл бұрын

@IIiTzVicII : Amazing that so many of us see the world through our television, and not much beyond that.

@Snagabott 12 жыл бұрын

Listening to him made my throat weary.

@MIKO00 12 жыл бұрын

Certainly animals evolved a nervous system INITIALLY to guide movement. A good example is in the evolution of bilateral symmetry and then the positioning of optical sensory apparatus at one end. This is observable in this basic, fundamental form in planaria. Planaria are super simple animals what cannot really "see" much but can sense light and dark and movement. The positioning of the sensory apparati at one side only allows a creature to have a sense of direction, and move TOWARD or AWAY.

@SuperToughnut 12 жыл бұрын

I generally make 1.5 movements a day. I definitely do these movements to avoid the negative noisy consequences that come about if I hold it in.

@DonQuixotedeKaw 12 жыл бұрын

The cup girl was very impressive, but that feat was from trained muscle memory, far more than from conscious thought. It took disciplined cognition to create the pattern, yes, but it was trial&error through repetition, with on-site storage, that allowed that intense speed. To transfer this to robotics, the motion sensors must have their own abilities for learned pattern recall. The brain at that point commands "perform series X" and the body does it. Unless, like he said, there is added input.

@tdreamgmail 12 жыл бұрын

@ThElitE LOL at the guy on the left, stony faced, unreserved agreement :D

@roidroid 12 жыл бұрын

Weird, I was just thinking and writing about this a few days ago, wondering if good robotic movement systems were already using the method (i mean it just seems so obvious): To use a constantly running internal simulation to control the speed of movements, based on how accurately your internal simulation seems to be predicting the real-world movement results (ie: giving robots a self-limiting sense of "confidence"). I'm glad to see it's already got a name: "Bayesian Inference". Yay learning!

@Hajjat 12 жыл бұрын

LMAAO at the Professor's tenure analogy, hilarious :D

@theonlyartist1992 12 жыл бұрын

got to be one of the most interesting talks in a while.... that and the Norden Bombsight

@SuperToughnut 12 жыл бұрын

We think with our minds; we move with our brains. You are not a gray slug wrapped in a wonderful hasmat suit. You are a mind that is connected to a brain that is connect to a body.

@FosbackFilms 12 жыл бұрын

@amjams I don't think he was suggesting that the brain was only useful for movement. Just that movement was its primary purpose.

@FishLovesGaming 12 жыл бұрын

Fantastic talk, thanks!

@conillusionist 12 жыл бұрын

wow, this video really showed me a new perspective. thanks TED! :D

@ScottFerguson7 12 жыл бұрын

@syntheticsteve I agree with your statement that the human form is a machine. I disagree with the premise that a human being is his or her form. Consciousness is first cause as Planck and so many other scientists have stated. "I regard consciousness as fundamental. I regard matter as derivative from consciousness. We cannot get behind consciousness. Everything that we talk about, everything that we regard as existing, postulates consciousness." - Max Planck

@Spacecoke 12 жыл бұрын

@iDokoV most people can tickle themselves, but as he said in thsi vid "not as good as someone else" he never said nobody can tickle themselves, he was very clear.

@gladsheep 12 жыл бұрын

Good martial arts/self-defense lesson: 17:06-18:20

@xapemanx 12 жыл бұрын

17:07 you laugh you lose

@shiftyjake 12 жыл бұрын

@amjams I think you might have missed the point of the talk. He's basically asking "Why don't plants have brains?" and answering, "Because they don't move." If an individual member of some random species loses a limb and somehow manages to kill and eat more critters in its lifetime than most other individuals, that has no bearing on what the limb's original evolutionary purpose was or the value of that purpose to all the species who have limbs.

@jonstfrancis 7 жыл бұрын

The fact that the brain is situated at the front of the animal and near sensory organs associated with feeding is telling really. For that reason alone it could be argued that brains pertain to finding food by sense and locomotion. Locomotion more importantly as sensing food would be torture if you couldn't move to reach it.

@Lundix 12 жыл бұрын

@gaiagale He does focus pretty exclusively on the movement bit, I agree. And I too believe that the human brain has evolved beyond the point where every function can neatly be related to movement. Perhaps we can draw two main lessons from this though: A: The brain survives and is indeed favoured in evolution, primarily because it allows complex movement. B: Keeping [A] in mind is probably smart when studying/contemplating anything related to "brained" animals, humans included.

@roidroid 12 жыл бұрын

@funincluded oh, you're right! That's a form of communication that requires no muscles to either send nor receive. And supposedly trees do communicate to eachother via smells, ie: Signalling distress. When one tree is under attack from insects, other trees nearby will change their sap chemistry to be less palatable to the insects.

@SuperFinGuy 12 жыл бұрын

Yup movement is ontological primary, physics shows it. All objects are primary made from motion. Reproduction is not an end though, it is a means of survival. The end is survival.

@BigMTBrain 12 жыл бұрын

@gaiagale - Perhaps I interpreted your question wrong. I see now that you were simply implicating D.W.'s concept as not including two potent aspects of brain functioning: thinking and feeling. "beings" vs "doings": In fact, even at apparent rest, the subconscious is constantly panning and "doing" things to keep us alive: breathing, blood circulation, food digestion, etc., etc., etc. "protect them first": Emotions help us evaluate past actions and assess priorities for future actions.

@jasondads9509 3 жыл бұрын

This is great the green and red combine nicely to give yellow

@theoriginalanomaly 12 жыл бұрын

@theoriginalanomaly The point is... it isn't some simple algorithm that will take computers to the next level. It would be incredibly complex and brilliant code written to evaluate positions with complex strategical evaluations. This mixed with the brute force method. But just think how complicated it would be to create a strategical evaluation that can compare with piece evaluation and still be able to break strategical rules if/when the position requires it.

@congoose100 11 жыл бұрын

The predictive element of the movement process lends credence to the notion of ‘visualizing’ a movement for success. See the free throw going in before shooting the ball…

@Lundix 12 жыл бұрын

@gaiagale Ah, I might've rushed that one a bit. These comments don't allow much elaboration. What I meant is that when one tries to achieve some higher understanding of the behavior of any animal with a brain, [A] may be one of the premises one should remember. I was primarily thinking of epistemology and psychology when I wrote my reply (I'm studying philosophy of science these days), but I think it may well apply in any area concerning the behavior of beings who have a brain to speak of.

@DigitizedSelf 12 жыл бұрын

Nice talk - at times a bit simplistic in it's approach but I'm sure that's necessary to make it understandable for a wider audience. Truth be told the Bayesian statistics part didn't surprise me the least, but it's nice to have the suspicion confirmed.

@MIKO00 12 жыл бұрын

Indeed one might argue that the placement of the concentration of sensory apparatuses is even more significant than the brain itself.

@sinprelic 12 жыл бұрын

@gaiagale what does a child have to do? absorb social rules to abide by them in the future.. eat.. learn how to respond.. learn the constancies of the physical world, and in turn that it can act on it.. it learns properties of materials and the properties of the self.. it's all movement-based. really. it makes beautiful sense.

@ThanosSofroniou 11 жыл бұрын

Absolutely agree, robots are programmed before hand what to do whereas humans make predictions based on past experiences and probability as you mentioned. There's an interesting video on Ted from Jeff Hawkins

@mamidia1 12 жыл бұрын

Great video.

@WhichDoctor1 12 жыл бұрын

@gaiagale "The real reason for brains" is more than just "control movement" I would suggest you think a little about how much movement is involved in everything we do. Even the highest reaches of spiritual or philosophical thought, if it influences the way we respond to the world in any manner, involves modifying our movements. I really cant think of any use of the brain that wouldn't alter our movement to some, although maybe small, degree.

@reasonformirrors 12 жыл бұрын

This guy is really nice. He could tell me I have cancer and I'd be like, "thanks!"

@theoriginalanomaly 12 жыл бұрын

@Llewellyn124 I know what you mean. But I also know that it isn't that simple either. Most games or positions can only be won with 1 set series of moves. For example sacrifice of the queen may be the start of a series of 12 moves. And only 1 variation of the 12 moves would win... whereas the other 12^30 moves would lead most likely lead to high percentage of losses. Therefore a program to follow the highest percentage of win would avoid winning.

@srgwarcock 12 жыл бұрын

4:50 the robots are probably thinking "GO TO THE RECYCLE BIN YOU FLESH BORN SHOW OFF!"

@ashhazz01 12 жыл бұрын

Best channel ever

@M.Minderbinder 12 жыл бұрын

I'm addicted to Ted

@chessdude67 12 жыл бұрын

Excellent! Enjoyed it very much.

@jadacook55 11 жыл бұрын

I love these ted talks.

@Truthiness231 12 жыл бұрын

Fantastic talk, can't wait to see where this all leads ^.^

@AlphaDeutsch 12 жыл бұрын

9:49 guy on the right= me in class :p

@XavierMacX 12 жыл бұрын

@2bsirius Because the amount of permutations per move for Chess is far less than Go. Most computers, such as Deep Blue, will compute many moves in advance or to the end of the game to determine the 'best' move. There are too many possibilities for in each move in Go to do this.

@Dhragonfly 12 жыл бұрын

in response to his last point about vision, how then would he explain bats? they lack vision though are very capable-in fact extremely precise-of movement.

@shiftyjake 12 жыл бұрын

@amjams To each his own. I think even Wolpert would agree that once the simplest brains developed for movement, evolutionary pressures favored other features as well, like abstract thought in humans. It's just all built on a common foundation.

@paularizer 7 жыл бұрын

This was interesting for the first 5 minutes

@Luciall15 4 жыл бұрын

go to the last 5!

@momentary_ 12 жыл бұрын

@2bsirius Chess is a simpler game to predict than GO!. There are, at most, 100 or so possible moves in chess at any one time. Very large numbers of those moves can be ignored because of immediate consequence, so most of the time, chess is reduced to a few dozen moves or less per turn. GO! on the other hand doesn't lend itself to such easy determination. It has as many moves, but none are easily ignored. The consequences of moves aren't as clear cut as in chess.

@spartan117ak 12 жыл бұрын

See, Ted talks are still awesome.

@warlord1981nl 12 жыл бұрын

Man, I was going the zombie snacks option... Boy, was I wrong!

@hilariofreire 12 жыл бұрын

I wonder what he thinks about parkour and free running

@ItalyPaola 11 жыл бұрын

After the dots at minute 16:26 I really want to dance :D

@muhammadarafat6630 5 жыл бұрын

I don't think that it's only his accent. I mean, imagine yourself trying to give a talk with such complexity in less than 20 minutes (which seems like the amount of time they have given him), you would surely hurry speaking. But Idk, it seems like some people who are familiar with his accent haven't found difficulty understanding him, so...

@ScottFerguson7 12 жыл бұрын

@Waranoa Note that Mr. Wolpert does not mention consciousness except in passing and that he is a materialist. Science has killed materialism. “all matter exists only by virtue of a force which brings the particles of an atom to vibration which holds the atom together. We must assume behind this force is the existence of a conscious and intelligent mind. This mind is the matrix of all matter.“ Planck "We know truth, not only by reason, but also by the heart."-Blaise Pascal (1723-1662)

@Lundix 12 жыл бұрын

@gaiagale I hadn't heard of it before, but I just finished watching it. Thanks a lot for the heads up, it was very enjoyable, in much the same way as I enjoyed 'Waking Life'. At this point my thoughts are too chaotic and disorganized for me to partake in any serious discussion of it. I'll watch it again in a couple of weeks, and then I might have some thoughts for you.

@GodsGreenPlanet 7 жыл бұрын

Not just movement... It's the universal consciousness that governs our universe

@comdrive3865 Жыл бұрын

uhhh

@rickyc874 5 жыл бұрын

The dancing dots were listening to bobby shmurda

@mattmoore111 12 жыл бұрын

If that speaker was in the movie Avatar, what charachter would he have been.

@BigMTBrain 12 жыл бұрын

@3:00 - Regarding the dexterity of optimizing robotic movement, things are much more advanced than depicted at this point in Wolpert's talk. Please see the following video to learn more: /watch?v=ag-txw4KUgo

@gulllars 12 жыл бұрын

@hilariofreire roughly the same classical musicians would think about deathmetal, acid trance or dubstep? Loads of noise, but once you understand the patterns and purpose of the noise it can become beautiful.

@somon90 10 жыл бұрын

They do have a nervous system though, such movement wouldn't really work without some inter-connectivity, It might work using other means of synchronization, but as said, jellyfish do have a nervous system, they are actually quite aware of their sorroundings with some species going as far as having having rudimentary eyes

@LeonidasGGG 12 жыл бұрын

Our brain are always "on the go" mode... cool.

@Cyllid 12 жыл бұрын

@lightandbeautiful Wow, you're insane. I thought you were from this post, but going to your channel confirmed it.

@fonzdaii 12 жыл бұрын

@ennot you got it all wrong, the thing about movement is that it demands PREDICTION / ANALYTICAL skills, which certainly Bill Gates and other thinkers have plenty of.

@mattmoore111 12 жыл бұрын

So how does that explain physical self sacrifice for non relatives?

@doug24444 12 жыл бұрын

This is profoundly interesting psychologically and suggests that below the subconscious there is a need go move, the body's basic intelligence? The appeal of sports at all levels, perhaps.

@signifyingsomething 12 жыл бұрын

10:49 Combined together into one (tomato?) sauce

@etvaeril9020 4 жыл бұрын

SignifyingSomething lolol

@bejoy0007 8 жыл бұрын

excellent ! Staring brick by brick vertically upwards from visual thinking to meta cognition of abstract conceptual thinking. I would wait to hear from you when you reach that level using your scientific methodology.

@akosdemeter1943 6 жыл бұрын

This.

@hotcatmax123 12 жыл бұрын

that cat is so smart hehe

@haoyuzhang38 3 жыл бұрын

so cute and learned a lot

@toothasaur 12 жыл бұрын

what a smart dude.

@RestInPieces777 12 жыл бұрын

In retrospect, it's not surprising at all that the brain exists mostly to control movement.

@GMLSX 12 жыл бұрын

I don't get the Problem with robot movement. I mean: What's up with inverse kinematic CGI Animators use? That's usually very fast.

@callum1131 11 жыл бұрын

trust America to make cup stacking an actual sport

@CognosSquare 12 жыл бұрын

I CAN BRAIN TOO. I BRAIN ALL SORTS OF THINGS.

@mattmoore111 12 жыл бұрын

Hes even standing in front of a bit of the set from Avatar....

@AshwinEAcharya 12 жыл бұрын

A TED speech a day makes Ashwin a Bright Boy :).

@elu5ive 12 жыл бұрын

@2bsirius the previous dude is right. but computers still could outpay even the best players if they had enough computing power which would be about (power of a modern multi-tower server)^6