Regarding the rant on RHF shipping… thank you! It needed to be said in a big public forum. 😡 ❤

I have the Chris Bellman cut and the news of this coming out inspired me to dig it out and give it a listen at the weekend. I was blown away by the quality, relatively at least and for a seventies punk/new wave record. If you have the CB cut then, I agree with Mike, it's hard to justify buying the new one. So having said that I ordered one anyway :) What can I say, I'm an addict.

Tom Verlaine is NYC art rock personified. I've felt, for the last 30 years, he wanted a " transistor" radio" sound. I know what to expect when the needle hits the groove.

Got my Rhino Hi-Fi Series TELEVISION today. Sounds great with a nice ding on the upper right front cover. Unbelievable.

Mike, I was listening to this album in the background while I was watching this vid. The title track was playing when you starting talking about Rhino. At the climax of the song (about 8 minutes in) you dropped the F-bomb and went off about the shipping. It was perfectly timed! So epic! Great vid. Cheers.

Yeah I saw the other Mike's rant/lecture where he opined on how the artists "intended" this album to sound. I heard his arguments and I just don't agree. I'm actually glad that Kevin Gray was not familiar with this record prior to mastering. Without any bias or preconceived notion, Kevin was able to make this record sound as best as it could. Besides, its no big deal. People now have choices. If you want a great sounding copy, get this Rhino. If your ears is used to the shrill sound of the OG, then get that.

Mike…I agree with you 100%. And thank you for clarifying that the Belman is all analog. There have been reports floating around that it was from a digital file.

Mike, I missed your reviews. Thoroughly enjoyed this one !! Thank you

On this one I have to go with the “some people say” crowd. I do think it was intended to be shrill and grating. Impossible to ignore or relax. It’s cool that a different take exists but not everything is intended for audiophiles

The Hi Fi series are some of the best sounding records in my collection. I’ve been lucky to have minimal damage. They could really step it up with the mailers but that won’t stop me from purchasing them like some other people

My take on the Rhino HiFi is pretty much the same as yours. It’s the best sounding version w a slight high edge roll off more clarity and bass. But in no way does it change the feeling and electricity of this fantastic album. It improves it without making it something else. I lucked out with the mailing. In my video conversation w Rhino and KG, Patrick from Rhino says they are creating their own custom mailer. Hopefully sooner than later.

@TheInGroove I received this abroad in the "Vinyl Me Please" style mailer. Record was 100% flawless, no bumps. Maybe they've fixed it?

FWIW, I went ahead and ordered this one (and some others). They were shipped perfectly and not even a hint of a dent anywhere. The sound is revelatory.

I just got my Rhino HF KG cut ..... ABSOLUTELY glad I went thru the hoops to get it. Warner Canada packaging was excellent. I've had 2 other reissues that I sold a while ago .... the 2018 and the CB cut ..... This KG cut is definitely the MOST crankable version I've heard. I LOVE it. I'm DONE with this title. If you love this album, get it.

I recently bought J.J Cales Troubadour from The In Groove shipped to Switzerland. It took a while to get here but it was packed perfectly. Thank you for good packaging. ❤

I have the Bellman. It’s wonderful. I don’t need another copy. Thank you.

Also agree with you Mike on the way Rhino handles distribution of these HF series. This reminds me of Blue Note. Ordering from Blue Note's website directly is horrible. Orders are often delayed, like weeks or months. Horrible customer service. No phone, just email that are often not answered. The only difference between Blue Note and this Rhino High Fidelity is that I can order the blue note releases from other stores who handles retail sales so much better.

With the Marquee Moon annoucement months ago I played the CD. A couple of tracks in, I thought this sounds like cr*p & stopped, thinking it was a poor CD transfer, now I know it's the tape, question answered, thanks!

Bravo on the mailer issue comments, had the same issue with Van Morrison. That said, was able to get a replacement fairly quickly. We'll see how MM turns out, it is on its way...

Scored the WLP for a dollar at Goodwill in the early 00s thrift “gold rush”.

Hey Mike are you ever going to bring back live streams? I loved kicking back, hangin’ out and talkin’ records!

I was missing the Doobie Bros from my order and a "Heather" in customer service responded to my emails quickly and solved the problem post hatse. My replacement is on its way, as of today I have zero complaints with Rhino.

These should be available to all in stores, I don’t like ordering records and paying these high prices for mailing from these companies. US shipping for one album totals with tax included, $12.50. That $40 record is now $52 and change.

My Cars came damaged as well. I never received a return email. Last week, I purchased Herbie Hancock, Coltrane, and Television. Thankfully, they put all 3 in a functional mailer with the edges that protrude out beyond where the records are stored. Not as good as The In Groove's shipping by any means but, luckily, all three of my new ones arrived damage-free. I live in Prescott, AZ so maybe they're starting to use decent mailers in the US now?

just ordered mine! i missed out on the cars, deffo don’t wanna drop the ball on television. let’s hope mine isn’t damaged too bad 🙃 if they can get the mailers figured out, rhino might have the best all-around audiophile series on the market

Dude, you described exactly how I listened to Marquee Moon! 8 track!

🤣ROFL What an advertising catch phrase, "Rhino High Fidelity - It Won't Make Your Fillings Hurt!" 🤣 I definitely agree, this series has been a real winner (so far). Plus, it's great not to see the same old reissues. Great to see them picking great, rarely reissued (of good quality) records. Can't wait to get a copy of " Candy-O".

I must have a HOT STAMPER of the original as my US 1st press is amazing and has none of the issue mentioned. Every OG sounds a little different depending of how early it was stamped etc. now I have only heard 6 or 7 OGs in my lifetime so I am sure there are better and some worse but I guess I like that shrill sound. Lol on another note, bravo to Mike for his superb packaging, grading and quality! I am a regular for a reason.

Nice response to the other Michael's review.

Yeah Mike, there is a big interdepartmentalt disconnect at Rhino. Patrick at Rhino said they are frustrated that the work they put in is getting damaged by the poor shipping. Ive not purchased many other Rhino lps through Rhino nor have I ever heard and read about on the forums this issue of poor packaging or lack of customer service. It seems almost exlusive for this series that these issues are occuring. My The Cars S/T was dinged also. I would purchase another if they would repress that title. Which is another dumb thing imo, if any title of this series should be in print with this fantastic mastering, it should be The Cars.

Bought the Cars and Coltrane through the Warner Canadian website after the Cars sold out in the US. Pleased when I got perfect undamaged records in a sturdy mailer. Was holding out on the follow-up releases until I heard more about the "new and improved" US mailer. Looks I'll be paying an extra record's worth for international shipping if I want any shot of undamaged records.

My copy of cars arrived perfect. No damage

I have an original US copy and an original UK copy. The UK copy is more muted sounding which would normally be a downside but in this case I prefer it because it cuts down on that shrillness you’re talking about. I used to have a Rhino copy and it sounded good sonically, but it had too much groove distortion for my taste (could be my system or maybe I got a bad copy)

Great review; structure, content, views - enjoyed this a lot.

Rhino and ERC sharpie shootout coming soon!

Purchased the recent Devo release it was double album problem was it was side 1-2 on both records the corners was bent and I shipped it back on my dime later to be reimbursed to their credit. All that and to add to it I preordered, Went to my local record store bought the colored vinyl same price and felt better about it.

The first run of Rhino/Bellman Marquee's were pressed at RTI. Has the silver round RTI sticker on the outer poly bag. Big improvement over the originals which at one time I owned 3 because I found them cheap used(those were the days). Yes it's in your face:) The LP seems to have stayed in print near the end of the vinyl era of the late 80's as I've seen copies with the 80's Elektra label. Had a early 90's German copy that was better than the US copies sonically and much better press quality. Look forward to hearing the KG cut. I haven't had as many big issues with Optimal pressings as others seem to have.

I'm so, so glad I haven't had the need or want to get the Rhino Fidelity reissues. Case in point, I bought the Grateful Dead Fox Theatre 12/10/71 box, and ALL FOUR sides of the box were dented from the inside. When I contacted Rhino, I asked for JUST the box. They sent me another copy, full and sealed and the same thing happened. I now have two copies that are kinda not perfect. So I had to settle and say, okay, I've learned my lesson! I completely agree with Mike @15:40 at in this video. Absolutely ridiculous.

I agree with your thoughts on the first press sound. The most notorious example is probably Raw Power. Did Iggy want it to sound like that? No, so he had another go and that's worse! I'd like to see Peter Jackson's "de-mix" tech applied to it.

Yeah, CBGB (where Television was virtually the house band -- they even built the stage!) wasn't exactly a "hi-fi" venue. I remember thinking "Marquee Moon" was tinny-sounding when it came out, but (to a lesser extent) so was "Talking Heads '77," from the same scene. I have to admit I thought it was funny they were giving this record a "Rhino High Fidelity" treatment. The producer, Andy Johns, is probably best known for "Exile on Main Street," a famously crude and murky-sounding record that outraged a lot of people in 1972 (but we love that grungy sound now). Like you, I've listened mostly to the 2012 Rhino pressing (and various CD versions) this century, so I'm curious about how the new Rhino Hi-Fi compares. I've also seen people complaining that it's too "pretty." And Television was not pretty -- as you can see from that punkish, 3rd generation xerox-looking cover. I'm curious: How do other noisy 1977 records like "Never Mind the Bullocks" or "Blank Generation" sound on your system? P.S. Can you imagine a manufacturer of any other product on the market who doesn't care if their merchandise is visibly (and audibly) damaged by the time it reaches retailers? The manufacturing standards at most US record factories are bad enough. We really don't need sub-par LPs that are ALSO damaged in shipping. Pretty soon everybody will just have to buy from Amazon just so they can return defective and damaged merchandise with no questions asked.

I just returned a heavily warped album at my local record store and since they did not have any in stock, asked them to order me another copy, he answered no problem, but warned me that it would most likely also be warped, he then showed me how the gatefold was made and how it puts pressure on the record. When I asked why would they do that if it causes lots of returns, he answered, 'they dont care'. I had doubts about that, but after listening to your rant, maybe he's right and they just don't care.

The In Groove has the best record shippers out there.

Ive ordered from each release of this series. Ive loved them. Also I’ve been lucky with mine being delivered to Australia. Other than taking weeks to arrive. Mine have all arrived perfect with no damage. I think internationally they use a different shipping company - this latest one is coming to me thru DHL. From what i understand in USA they’ve used UPS? And the damage I’ve seen to some of the boxes looks to be more of delivery company issue than Rhino. The boxes I’ve got my previous Rhino’s aren’t to much different to VMP and Mofi that I’ve received.

Its a nightmare if you receive a damaged copy. I completely agree. I hope I’m not going off topic here but could a local craftsperson repair the damage?

Interesting that rhino chooses an album that was lacking sonically right down to the master tape. Unlike chad who picks albums to reissue that are recorded right originally. Thanks for the review.

My UK first press (with quotation marks) sounds fantastic. Waiting for the new Rhino now 👍🏻

I live in Canada and bought the cars album from the US before i learned that it was sold In Canada. It arrived with smash corners. I then order from warner canada , which was cheaper than the US copy. It did come with a different mailer but still had a smashed corner. At least , i can eventually sell the cheaper copy for a higher price.

Release on SACD

My Rhino copy arrived today with a dinged corner, in the crappy mailer you describe. I almost look at the ding as a relief considering the condition so many records arrive here in. But it's still frustrating.

The original sounds great

I have ordered Marquee Moon and Coltrane through Warner Canada. Let's see if they arrive "un-dinged". Previously, I got Cars through the States and one corner was slightly dinged.

Thanks for the review. The new one is brighter, livelier and hits harder than my original. The original is darker and sounds more ominous in it's presentation and after listening to it I'm more out of breath and feel like I've heard something special even though I've played the thing 100 times. The new one on the other hand seems to demand being played louder. Not sure it's going to hold up as well in the long run - only time will tell. Great product and a worthwhile addition to my record collection.

Part of the reason the original pressing doesn’t sound very good is that vinyl quality was already crap by the early/ mid ‘70s. I know ‘cause I was there! I bought MM in late 1978. Record companies found ways to make vinyl thinner and thinner while continuing to rob the consumer blind. Nothing’s changed: now they keep re-releasing albums and charging insane prices that promise ‘audiophile pressings’.

Lmao 😅. You always make me laugh 😆. Thx for the review and info, I went to order that Rhino remastered Television on Rhino’s site but stopped after the total $$$ was due. $85 Cdn is a huge poke and a bit more than I’m willing to pay. I found a copy of the 2012 Rhino u showed and it’s being held for me. So after this I think the older redux is gonna be good enough. Oh yes I’ve listened to it for years on cd 💿 so I do have a copy.

Amen! Thank you for always using sturdy shippers!

I don't see sour grapes here; I see a guy with a legitimate concern. As you said, Mike, this is a beautiful record, why damage it because Rhino refuses to package it right for shipping. Anyway, hope you get this all resolved. As for myself, I may be missing out on the great sound of a 2024 re-master, but I'm happy with the copy I got in 1977.

Rhino has always been a label to look for to find great releases, especially their compilation records. I haven't noticed any problems with damaged covers on records at record stores in Northern California. Maybe they receive a lot of records in more sturdy big boxes because they order in much larger quantities. I know that doesn't help you, Mike, since you probably don't need hundreds of records of a particular title. Either way, I share your frustration on how records are often shipped very poorly, and how it results in damage. 😲

I'm in the UK and I thought I'd take a punt on this. I'm expecting it to sound good, from all the reviews, but have to say I'm somewhat worried about what condition it will turn up in!

through the entire rant (which is awesome btw) I was thinking - my Cars came fine?? - then you said it and I remembered - I got a Canada shipment! Man, I have been staring at Crossings and Jaco - and considering this Television - but now I def. wont get three at a time from them - and I might just order from Canada again!

I think you do Optimal a disservice, at least based on my own experience? That plant presses almost perfect records and has greatly improved in the last two and a half years. Prior to that, occasional spots of 'non fill', off centre spindle holes and very short, straight line scratches on opening tracks were problematic, but replacements albums were and are always perfect. Optimal pressed the vinyl for the Chris Bellman mastered 'Marquee Moon' in Europe while RTI pressed the U.S. edition. My sample is perfect! I agree with you on Pallas however. The current plant is a far cry from the plant that turned out the wonderful Speakers Corner records in the 1990s and beyond. Too many defects on Pallas vinyl nowadays. I have no modern era Sony Japan pressings, but have lots of CBS/Sony Japan vinyl from the 70s and 80s and it's fine, as you would expect from a Japanese plant. I don't like run of the mill QRP pressings though, usually defective, in my hands anyway. QRP seems to reserve its best work for the Analogue Productions' premium line of releases. I agree that RTI has greatly improved and hope that the pressing quality that seems routine on the Tone Poet line is the standard that we can expect in the future for all of its vinyl pressings.

This album was also reissued in 2018 as part of the Rhino Rocktober series on double blue vinyl cut by Ian Sefchick at Capitol Mastering and pressed by Record Industry. I really wonder how this would compare against the original and the other two Rhino reissues. Has anyone heard it and can comment on its sound quality compared to anything?

I live in NJ - and every Rhino High Fidelity LP I purchased (everyone except Herbie Hancock - since I have another great copy) and regardless of most people's shipping issues, mine arrive pristine. Not sure why, but they do. And my copies have to come from California to NJ and it takes over a week. Maybe the post office where I live handles things better?

Are Kevin Gray's ears not so sharp? Every mastering engineer has a sound. Original tape being played through modern kit. Everything Changes as Take That sang.

You make a compelling point. I just wish I could order the Television LP here in the UK. There is a Warner site called "Dig" but it doesn't have this album in its shop yet!!! I got the Cars LP from that, but there is no sign at all of Television. What is that about?

Mike....regarding damaged records, like most of us music lovers, i absolutely HATE recieving damaged records through UPS, USPS, Fed Ex, etc. Bashed in corners, creases, seam splits and so on....just sucks to no end. I have also noticed though that sometimes records are damaged in the warehouses by idiots who don't give a shit how they handle them. So these are damaged even before they are stuffed into the mailers. As customers we pay handsome prices for vinyl. Wouldn't it be nice if we could receive them in perfect or next to perfect condition?

Yes! Plus they charge a ton for shipping! WTF?

Great video

Agreed on putting all the care in the world into mastering and pressing as well as packaging just to have it c*cked up in the mailing. RHINO: hire a logistics person to sort this out - not complicated!

Funny that: I just gave up on Rhino who twice tried to ship me the Coltrane from the series. Both times they shipped it untracked. Neither ever arrived. Oh - and they want you to wait two months for the parcel to arrive before they can take any action. Fuck Rhino.

I received their Herbie Hancock 'Crossings' album, and it arrived in perfect condition to San Francisco. But yeah, that really sucks about their customer service; any company selling products to the public should have a decent customer service department if they get contacted by customers - if they're not, that's bad business practice, but I guess if you want what they have, you have to put up with it.

Hi mike i feel your pain i ordered the cars and it was dinged on one corner did contact customer service no response. Im awaiting the television with fingers crossed but from your experience im not going to be happy its such a shame a great product like this is so badly treated like this. Hope they sort it as great series. Cheers joe

The Package to Switzerland was perfect!

Yes, I concur with you on Rhino's shipping problem. For what they charge for shipping, they could complete the package with a good mailer. Why skimp at the finish line? This brings up a continuously frustrating problem of records by mail - if it's advertised as mint and it arrives to the buyer damaged due to a crappy mailer, then it's not mint any more, right?. I mean, come on - at least make the effort to finish the job right.

Mike, how does the 2 LP disc elektra version compare with new Rhino reissue overall? Rhino is good about shipping box sets but with single disc orders, I've had damaged ones come through. Thanks.

Order from Warner Canada, problem solved. They use proper mailers 👍🏼

Mike vs. Michael - continues....

I bought The Stooges Fun House box and 5 of the sleeves had seam splits. Rhino did not print extra sleeves. My options were $100 credit or return the box. How do you not print extra sleeves for something so expensive?

1000% on the Rhino packaging. And yep, zero response from customer service. They can’t be unaware, of this. Why. It just buy the same packaging that Acoustic Sounds uses, or clone it at least

great information. thank you. now I am extremely unsure of which pressing to get.

Same experience with Rhino. Sad, so much put into the product and then shipping destroys them. I feel Mike's anger. I sent an email when I got the Cars. No response to date.

It’s hilarious to hear how the “audiophiles” react to this kind of recording. Never have I ever had the urge to turn down the volume on the original US pressing. Maybe this kind of recording is not for you.

i'll stick with my near mint promo copy of marquee moon.

Mike or someone else , I know that Marquee Moon is sold out at Rhino . But does anyone think that it'll eventually be repressed again , maybe in a different color ? I'm kicking myself for not getting it . Thanks !!!

Amazon improved their vinyl shipping. A lot. My Rhino hifi Cars album came okay. I'm sorry you got a bumped copy.

Jimmy Page is right even when he's wrong 😂✌🏻 I laughted at your comment Mike. Am joking you are provbably right ! But the others are unavailable. Perhaps Analogue Productions could look into this

Excellent!

It’s utterly incomprehensible that Rhino is simply incapable of mandating their fulfillment center use Whiplash mailers or something similar. Un-fawk-in real.

If you think ordering in the US was difficult, try being in the UK. It was impossible and quite frankly has put me off buying Rhino again. What a mess.

So many people with the corner, alot seem like yours ( and my Cars ) left bottom corner. I am wondering if the damage is in the pre-packing stage or conveyer travel . My corner ding, the mailer, though shabby by comparison to yours or Chad's was not damaged. Only when I opened it, did I discover the corner ding. I can say my Television arrived undamaged and the mailer, though still not high quality, it is somewhat better.

You are not from the 80's. That has a an iconic sound for those of us that were there back then.

Great to hear your comment on the original - totally agree - it's quite unlistenable. Michael Fremer seems to believe this is what Tom Verlaine intended.

The original sounds great to begin with, this is not an audiophile record.

I didn't bother with Herbie Hancock "Crossings" or Doobie Brother's "Captain and Me" as the Speaker's Corner got better reviews across the board.... got everthing else (in the UK). I had one slight corner ding on one record, it didn't bother me that much! lol Perhaps international mailer are better? You've increased my anxiety though.... will my copy of Television turn up ok??????!!!! ahhhhhhhh!

I tend to agree to you. Better having a record that you enjoy listening to it rather an OG that sounds bad

Thanks Mike, I ordered it. I hate, at least on my system, hard sounding LP's to listen to. Marquee Moon is a very questionable recording.

Me too, I always never liked the recording! Everyone keeps saying it’s well recorded….it isn’t!

I agree with your view that artists do not always get the sound of an album right. For one thing, I have to imagine these guys have hearing damage from years of loud shows. I think those remasters do sound perfect to Jimmy Page at this stage in life. However, they are perhaps not the right sound for the average fan whose ears have not taken the same beating (a beaten taking making brilliant music, of course). And I apply this to myself. I love the sound of the Marquee Moon album and the original Sterling cut. But I don't think I have the same ear for higher frequencies, thus I tend to like "brighter" pressings (although I do not like digitally sourced records at all). But to someone with ears that have better "frequency response," that Sterling Marquee Moon might have that "icepick in the ear" effect, haha.

Have you heard the original 12inch 45rpm released in 🇬🇧 UK?

16:00 - 18:00 has been my experience as well, especially with Blue Note! You would think in 2024 these companies would have figured this out?! I find myself going to any place other than the producers site to order LP’s… 🤕

I've ordered it. Hope it is not damaged if it arrived Germany