not really tho the k24 can handle up to 700 hp stock everything. and the ar tops at about 350 with stock internals.

@@minecrafterselite1 you obviously don't race in classes that require OEM parts and no aftermarket forced induction...

@@minecrafterselite1 You'll never have reliable 700hp on a K24 with all stock internals. Sure it can do it, but for how long? You shouldn't even try to get over 450. I prefer being safe and just getting new piston and rods

Wasn't the 2zz the answer for k24 or k20?

@@takumiinthe86 2ZZ is more like a B18 :)

It honestly really does. I've been super impressed with this motor.

For now all i know about turboing this engine is that unopened they can make at least 350whp and Papadakis has managed 800whp on a motor with modest upgrades. He made over 1000whp with one but that engine has a ton of custom parts in it.

Got my eye on the same project. These 2AR-FEs are in a bunch of sleepers and someone would make a killing if they figured out how to get it to the 250 sweet spot.

I've been racing mine at the 7200RPM redline, even with no additional changes it really changes the mood of the motor. I can't wait to make it sing at 8000 or even 9000RPM.

Kinda late but yeah I want my Camry to Make 250 at least I would be happy with that

@@juliobello4561 right now I got equal headers catback exhaust intake and I’m pushing 200 with a stock 178 along with tune maybe close dnough

@@treydavis3138 idk guys. I have the 2012 Scion xB only 158hp stock I'd be happy with 180hp

Nice, i'm happy to help. Also there should be more on this motor very soon.

Cool, good to know makes sense. Appreciate it!

Follow me on Insta @ Alex.tC2 Currently talking to companies to try and find one willing to make turbo headers, exhaust, and Intercooler piping for the 2AR. I’d be more than happy to stay in touch and let you know what I find out

can you have the 2ar and rear wheel drive? Im not quite familiar with it but curious

No factory bel housing or transmissions bolt up but with a adapter plate it is doable

Thank you, that's really a compliment :)

Balance shafts are more for idle NVH than high RPM. generally at higher RPM the frequencies get high enough that the mass of the engine and the rubber mounts absorb it all. Exactly how bad it is really depends on the motor. I want to quantify how bad the vibrations are so i can report back to everyone how much of a problem it really is. Particularly with the motor mounts i've designed for the MR2 Spyder. Plus the other reason is that the dealer that shipped me the crank shaft did not package it properly so the balance shaft gear was damaged.

There are more coming, i promise. The Pandemic has just slowed me down a bit. The 2AR is a great motor

Search PAPADAKIS RACING he has modified many 2AR-FE for his Drift Cars. He uses 2.7L 1AR-FE parts to up the 2AR's 2.5L to 2.7L. Papadakis Racing will offer complete built cylinder heads for 2AR-FE engines

Oh and I am intrigued as hell on the lash adjuster...

Yeah, that's about the only thing i can think of also but keep in mind this motor isn't turbo'd in any stock application. But based on those findings and the fact that the internals are fully forged and that the ECU has air to fuel ratios and timing appropriate for turbocharging beyond the stock power band in it i do suspect that toyota intended on people putting turbos on these anyways.

I thought the issue in the earlier motors was that feeding a log manifold from the end or middle resulted in different flow rates across the cylinders. Higher cylinder flow makes a lean condition as the AFM (or MAP) is measuring an upstream average. Center feed biases 2 &3 (MR2) and rear feed biases 1 (Caldina). Tuners were using cylinder trims to balance fueling back to an A/F target rather than using them to make the A/F different. We might be saying the same thing different ways because running a cylinder lean does make it hotter and more knock prone. The 2AR-FE inlet doesn't look much like a center fed log design to me.

@@stephenbello1081 we are saying the same thing mine is just more trivel. But the 2arfe is a side feeding log with an upward ram type..

Abdulla, That's interesting i had not seen anything about the 3UR matching the 2AR. It's entirely possible though and I'll have to look into this a bit. And yes, the power gains are mostly from the intake VVT-I, the exhaust VVT-I only helps the mid-range a little bit.

That's a weird question but an easy one to answer. It has one filter between the head cam carrier and the cam cap that feeds both camshafts.

Awesome, I'll be happy to help you out when you need parts and any questions need answered.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks what suspension system do you run on your spyder??

@@rav3r0c I'm using Apexi coilovers and whiteline sway bars. The big improvements came from some custom bracing on the front end, the crossmember that has the steering box and front lower control arm attachment points is really really floppy. i braced it to the main rails under the body and also braced it diagonally to the main rails in the engine bay. This dramatically changed the handling on the car. The other big thing wasn't chassis at all but i switched to a custom wilwood brake setup and made a vacuum regulator circuit to get much more consistent brake booster assist. That improved driver confidence going deep into a corner and made the car much faster as a result.

Honestly, these engines are dirt cheap because Toyota made so many of them. Unless you're going to be building it up for performance i'd suggest just getting another used one and tossing it in as-is.

Hey man, appreciate your response. Do you know any good used engine dealers? I searched a few and they're pricey, like $1800. Thanks again.

@@66designs37 The best thing to do is to go to a local pick-n-pull and pull one yourself. They generally run $250-300 that way.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks That's more like it, I'll call around on Monday, wondering if I can find one with low enough milage and hopefully regular oil changes, that I don't get one that consumes oil. Maybe less than 120,000? I just ordered a dial bore gauge for a couple hundred, was gonna start tear down right now. Was kinda looking forward to building it if the block was ok. But realistically I get what you're saying. I dunno, I can always hold on to the gauge. I'm a car classic restorer and have built older engines and will be building performance motors here and there in the future. Tolerances weren't as critical and our machinist in school was really good. Took engine building in ROP, but yeah that was 20 years ago. Hope that makes sense. You're awesome.

It'll be a bit, I'm waiting on the machine shop right now but i promise there will be another update as soon as i can. I do have reground cams, 280 degrees and 10.9mm lift. The injectors will be 545cc denso long reach high atomization units. they are identical in size to the stock units so the fuel rail will remain stock. It should be more than enough fuel but if for some reason it isn't I'll just bump the fuel pressure from 3 bar to 4 bar to get them up to 630cc. The throttle body and the whole intake is a bit more fuzzy right now. I want to try the stock intake to see how far that gets me but i expect that it will be a restriction. After that I'll make something custom and I'll either use the larger tundra throttle body or the BMW S65 individual throttle bodies. They are almost a perfect match for this motor with a simple adapter plate.

Frankenstein Motorworks I like the keep it basic and then notch it up on the easy parts later. I’m sure you’ll hit the power target with adjustments. Cheers

@@damianmitchell7911 Yeah, especially when you consider the amount of work it is to make a custom intake and how easy it is to fit it in the vehicle after the fact. In the MR2 the intake is super easy to swap out. I do think there's probably a bit of power also locked up in the exhaust but the exhaust i have on there is pretty close to the most that can fit in there already so hopefully it isn't too much of an issue. I'm sure I'll hit the 250whp target, honestly that one is not too hard. the 300whp target will be a bit trickier but it's still in the 125hp/L neighbourhood which is somewhat in the expected region if i bring the engine's peak power in the 8000rpm area.

Frankenstein Motorworks I’ll keep following very cool project cheers

@@FrankensteinMotorworks on the topic of ITBs for an ar series motor, wouldn't the diameter of the throttles become a restriction at higher RPM power levels? The ITBs on the S65 only have to handle 500cc each, where as on a 1ar spinning to a similar redline as the S65 of around 8500 rpm, each throttle would have to handle 675ccs. That's a really big jump in displacement for each throttle to handle.

Not yet, this is still very much on my to-do list but covid kinda threw a wrench in those plans.

Marco, I've actually already got the cams in my hands. I probably should have shown them in the video. Stock had the same cam profile on the intake and exhaust and i'm keeping that going. The duration is going from 244 degrees to 280 degrees and increasing lift at the valve from 9.7mm to 10.9mm. My goal is to bring the peak power up from 6100RPM to 7800RPM or so. If i can maintain that 190lb*ft. of torque i was getting before but at 7800rpm I'll be at 280whp, if the increased displacement helps bring the torque up I might even hit the 300whp stretch goal. But those numbers are ambitious. If i manage 250whp I'll be quite happy. As for keeping the stock bottom end, i think the trickiest part may be the cast pistons at a higher RPM. the stock 98mm stroke is rather long for 8000RPM. but i bet the stock rods would probably be just fine. I do know that some of what i'm doing is overkill but my goal up front is more to worry about making the power than to worry about the exact budget. I would like to experiment at a later date to bring the cost down.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks Cool! Does RPM usually kill cast pistons? I thought it was usually high pressures, temperature, too much timing, etc? In any case, for stock bottom ends it might be worth limiting the redline. Considering the dual VVTI, maybe the cams you spec'd would still be ok for something like a 7400 redline?

@@marcopalmeri8492 The issue is just the acceleration on the piston trying to rip the piston apart. With a 98mm stroke that piston is really flying at higher RPM. Wikipedia talks a little about it but there's a bunch of other info out there en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mean_piston_speed This motor is already at 23.5m/s at 7200RPM. Generally a stroke that long would be in a diesel engine with a 5000RPM redline. How Toyota is safely making it to 7200RPM is beyond me. Would it be ok to 7400RPM? maybe, i haven't been able to try it because the stock valvetrain isn't super happy up there. The good news is the motors are pretty cheap, you can get them all day long for about $300 and sometimes even cheaper. This would probably be worth experimenting. take a stock motor and replace the valve springs and just see how high it can go before the next point of failure presents itself.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks you mention ARP head studs. Do you know the part number for those? I will be pulling my head off shortly. Thanks

@@89gts I don't have the fit tested yet.

Theres actually one frs with 2az turbo swap

It's a great motor for the MKI. I did one way back in 2009 and had a blast until i replaced it with an MKIII chassis: FrankensteinMotorworks.com/2AREB61MKI/IMG_0559.jpg

Frankenstein Motorworks I was reading a your forum posts on MR2OC.Im sure if KZfaq was popular back then as it is now you’d have a lot more MKI willing to see your progress/documentation via video. It’s a shame MKI are a small demographic at this point. I’ll have to do some more research into the possibility of a plug n play option for that left axles where you made the custom spindle

I considered it but if you look at Papadakis' teardown for his 1000whp 2ar-fe that runs anti-lag he isn't running anything other than the stock plastic spacer in the gap: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/bbaGlpqhsOCqZmg.html So given that, i will be skipping on the reinforcements at least until i see issues with the current setup. I will likely also bump up to 1/2" studs before any cylinder support.

I'm not sure which part you're asking about but while I'm generally happy to share information I hesitate on stuff like this until I've actually tested it so i know it's actually fit for purpose. I've just had too many issues of getting accused for recommending bad parts when it wasn't a recommendation at all.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks My appologies. The parts were camshafts, valvetrain , piston bore and stokes, journals and bearings. Also I was wondering a good bore and stroke for turbo appliance within the specs. I know its a lot but I am doing my research first. So any recomendation or info it will be greatly appreciated. Afterall you are the only person giving it a shot, so thats great. Keep it up bud.

@@rdsjankee Sure, those are all things I feel pretty confident on, the valvetrain stuff is the stuff i’m not really wanting to share right now until i test it. The camshafts are custom regrinds with 280 degree duration and 10.9mm lift. The block has been rebored but just to get a new finish and get rid of .01mm of bore ovaling from wear, it was bored over by less than 0.1mm. The stroke is 105mm, it’s a stock 1ar-fe crankshaft with the balance shaft gear removed from it (to reduce windage and drag). All the bearings & piston rings in this motor are OEM units, they’ve put up with immense abuse so far so i am keeping them. I’d like to find a different thrust bearing if i could but i might just need to service that one a bit more often. It could actually be serviced with the engine in the car so it isn’t the end of the world and it’ll still do multiple years of racing between needing service. As for a recommendation for doing a turbo build, it all depends on your power target. 350whp does not even require opening up the motor.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks Wao thats sound great without replacing any parts except the crankshaft. Cus i was gonna start by filling up the block an do forged internals. Cus I am aspiring to a do 420hp at least so I am starting with buying the other motor first so I can start buying anything I might need

THATS WHAT IM SAYIN

James, I agree with this. This project is one that got dramatically derailed because of COVID. But with that said, about 4 days ago i picked up a stock 2.7L version of this motor and i will be tossing it in my white racecar so i can get it on the dyno to see what the power gains are and get this project back on track.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks glad to hear things are coming together looking forward to seeing how much we can get out of these I may have to get a spyder if things go well!

Sorry, I’ve way too many things on my plate. I really want to get this done ASAP also but i’m only one man with far from unlimited budgets :( Right now I’m waiting on custom pistons before i can proceed. I have the head stuff here already but i can’t do anything with that until i final test the piston fitment. I promise it’s still a high priority item

Frankenstein Motorworks no worries, just want to make sure you are alive. The 2arfe AC should be the highest priority... lol.

@@michaelscholten9753 On yeah, 100% still alive. I’m working hard on editing the 2gr-fe wiring instructions video for the SW20 right now. It’s 18 hours of video and I’m doing my best to make it short and concise without missing details. I’m also *WAY* happier with the editing than previous videos but that isn’t what’s taking extra time. I’m just getting better at it as i do more of it. As for the A/C on the 2AR-FE. that’s a solid point, i need to do that one also. I’m going to release a new axle carrier bracket for the 2GR in a few weeks so the A/C should be the next part i work on after that one. I’ve been slacking on it because it’s an expensive R&D effort. I’m very likely going to have to make a custom A/C compressor body to fit that nissan pump to make everything affordable for production while fitting the chassis without trimming anything. I’m also considering potentially doing a reverse mount setup with the stock 1zz A/C pump and driving it from the same pulley as the water pump since the rotation is correct. I just need to spend time on it, there’s many workable solutions it just needs to be cost optimized while producing a quality part.

The 2GR-FE's crankshaft is completely different than the 2AR-FE's crankshaft. But if you want the 86mm stroke you can probably use the 8AR-FE's crankshaft in the 2AR. this brings the motor down to 2L

Oh really 🤔 im mainly trying to find a crankshaft that can withstand so much force and friction, maybe im mixing the 2gr crankshaft with the 1AR. I know theres one out there that popadakis uses. Your vidoes are amazing for the 2AR, not many know about this motors capabilites.

@@keitht8595 Papadakis used a stock 1ar-fe crankshaft in his motor until he went beyond 850whp. beyond that point he went for a fully billet crankshaft on his 1000whp build.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks thank you for that info, much appreciated. I have a decedent kit with a water to air intercooler so i know once the boost goes up im going to have to do something serious with the drive train. Your wisdom and videos do wonders my friend thanks again

I do have a set of custom ground cams here for that engine.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks did you do it yourself? i heard brian cower grinds cams for the 2arfe a while back, but didnt know if that was true. these cars are impossible to find stuff for

@@goybi7356 No, i hired it out. custom grinds are really not much more expensive than off the shelf grinds. I won't give out my numbers until i've tested it though. It's not that i want to keep it a secret it's just i don't want to send people in the wrong direction until it is tested.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks i understand. keep up the good work man. built NA 2AR's are uncommon and i'm interested in going that route just to see what its about. so far ive found ferrea valvetrain parts and the JE 11:1 pistons, molnar rods, etc. not sure if id wanna bore the block tho

The only stock transmission that will bole up to the 2AR that can handle the power is the wide case E series transmission. You'll see a lot of advice saying to use the MR2 transmission but don't do that. they are rare and super expensive. The Camry transmission will have the shift location in a position much more appropriate for a FWD car and as long as you get it from a 90's V6 Camry you will get the wide case E series. Feel free to contact me for images and a better description of the difference between a wide case and a narrow case e series. Note that the wide case e series comes with a 30lb weight penalty and the extra internal friction and rotating mass also comes with a horsepower penalty. It also comes with a shift quality and synchro lifespan penalty. To the point where i've actually made parts to use the narrow E series transmission in the MR2 because on builds that have under 400whp it is a much better choice of transmission. The first generation tC comes with this transmission and i would strongly urge you to use that transmission until you are 100% sure that you will be exceeding it's capabilities. Conveniently the wide and narrow trans use the same clutch, same shifting mechanism, the same front and the same left mounting brackets so switching in the future only requires the rear motor mount to change. You'll also need different axles but when you cross that barrier you'll also need to go to custom built axles anyways so that isn't an additional expense you'd avoid by going to the wide one right off the bat.

I haven't played with the A25A-FKS engine yet so i can't really speak for it. I do expect that the new dynamic force engines are probably pretty awesome though.

The advantage with the 2GR in the MKII is there's a mount that exists currently. the costs with the 2AR-FE should be a fair bit cheaper because the engine is super cheap and available. If this build ends up making decent power i will make a 2ar-fe mount for the MKII also. It's going to be a good place to start especially for those looking to turbo. 2.7L is a heck of a lot of displacement for as small as this is.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks I'm already curious about how much lighter a 2AR is than a 2GR, and if it would be counterproductive to try fitting that block to a 3S-GTE head.

@@ucallthatatweet The 2AR-FE is 30lbs lighter than the 2GR-FE according to Toyota, there’s also 5-10lbs saved in the exhaust from a V configuration to an Inline configuration. Fully trimmed the engine and EB62 trans as it was ready to drop into the MR2 Spyder it weighed 410lbs acording to my scale. As for fitting the 3s-gte head on the 2ar-fe block, I suspect the bore spacing on the 2AR is bigger than the 3s-gte which would make the task go from ridiculously difficult and expensive to impossible. But in the end, the 2AR has bigger valves, bigger ports and more valve lift than the 3s-gte. The 2AR-FE makes the same power as the 3s-gte even before you put a turbo on the 2AR. I just don’t see what the benefit of it would be, the 2AR really is quite advanced.

I reached out to JE and asked about the valve clearance and they stated that their pistons would not work with the extra valve lift I'm using. Somehow i missed that CP made pistons for this engine. Honestly the valve lift i'm using is not a heck of a lot more than factory so I'm really surprised that they said that but that more or less forced my hand for custom pistons.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks Here's info on the CP pistons. Might have reach out to them for the actual specs, just know they made 2 compressions and 2 sizes. www.dezod.com/collections/dezod-motorsports-engine-build-parts

The hybrid ECUs do quite a bit to blend the power with the electric motors. I'm sure someone out there is smart enough to program these but that person is not me.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks yes but will it fit the transmission and also what if I used ECU of the swap engine?

@@MoNa-ce5mb the hybrid transmission is just two electric motors and a planetary gearset. without the hybrid ECU to control it there will not be any power sent to the ground.

Wow that's 👍

To make it carb legal you have to do a few things, first is run the stock catalytic converter and second you have to run the Scion tC evaporative emissions module and you also need to run the stock tune with the stock airbox. The good news is I can disable the immobilizer on an ECU and leave the stock tune on there. These things will cost you a bit of horsepower but still give you significantly more than the stock Spyder gave you. I would expect 185-190whp or so with all that stuff instead of the 205rwhp that I get with the configuration I've designed.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks Thanks for the reply. I will most likely start to purchase parts for this swap soon. My MRS is a daily driver and I think this would be a good swap over the 2zz.

Yes, I helped him put the 2AR-FXE based build in his Spyder.

The 2AR is about 1.5-2" taller than the 2AZ and uses a very similar engine to trans bolt pattern so the only thing needed to mount it will be a right side engine mount and then you'll need to sort the electronics to control it. Since i assume you're doing this to go for big power there's really no point in trying to make it run off the stock ECU, just go straight to a Haltech.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks I figured as much. I sorted out the electrical harness. I'm going to contact you at your website to continue this conversation.

correct, 2011+ Scion tC

Frankenstein Motorworks do you guys have any parts for the tC???

It depends on how much power level at what RPM and what kind of fuel you're looking to run. It'll handle a fair bit of boost on stock internals.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks For Street race and normal drive type fuel Super Premium 95. What your suggestion?

@@assdaasddfg5173 for a car that will remain on the street and since all the factory applications for this motor are front wheel drive i would suggest you leave the motor stock inside because it'll hold enough boost as-is, more than the front tires can handle anyways. Just add boost

Thanks for the quick reply

They are in the same family, they share the same block, head, valvetrain and timing cover but the fxe normally has intake only vvt-i and has a higher 12.5:1 compression ratio. It's designed to be a hybrid motor. I was able to use the 2AR-FXE motor with minor modifications and no custom parts and make 260hp. With that info i'm currently in process of figuring out how to make even more naturally aspirated horsepower.

no, the 2GR-FE is a V6 configuration and the 2AR-FE is an I4 configuration. They are VERY similar architectures on both motors but very few if any parts actually interchange. Even the valves are different lengths between the motors despite the geometry being almost identical.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks thanks fir the information

Yes, i even already sell a mount to make it bolt right in.

Yes, the stock block is perfectly capable of way more than this power level.

@@FrankensteinMotorworks Awesome good to know ! I have a 2016 Camry that I’m modifying it’s the 2ar fe engine so the 4 cylinder one I’m trying to make it to the ultimate sleeper and I plan on adding boost eventually

There are many similarities to the 2AZ, this is essentially the next generation of that motor.

Yeah. Find a v6 RAV from 2012 and you can walk a lot more cars than you believe.