I relate to this; when I took a figure drawing class I imitated the structure the teacher used for the collar bone and other shorthand on the figure, and when he came by and saw my work he said I was only seeing his structure and not using it correctly. It frustrated me back then because he only said this without telling me how to use his structure, landmarks and other shorthand to successfully depict the figure. If you’re gonna say I’m not using your structure correctly at least tell me how to map the features correctly

@@Artofcarissa It sucks, doesn't it? When someone who is supposed to TEACH us ends up just being dismissive without ever actually showing how to do it. Had one of these once; he failed almost the entire class, based on things he did NOT teach at all.

some people are incapable of this. it's great for business

I'm not sure if you're saying people have to learn to work like that, but if you are I'd have to disagree. It takes a very specific mindset to do that and while I believe that everyone is capable of drawing (and doing it well), I don't think everyone is capable of 'that' particular skill. It's almost like he has an eidetic memory, as it's just just from decades of practice. Kim Jung Gi has pretty much always been able to do that as long as he's been able to draw as I understand it?

RIP him for real😔😔

Now I wonder if artists could use AI as inspiration rather than abusing it 🤔

@@RosheenQuynh totally. As an artist, I see it as just a another tool, to be used for the creation of new and unique art ideas, but it doesn't replace artists.

@@zanleekain117 Yeah! AI shouldn't be used to replace jobs (and in my personal opinion, there are jobs that AI are not able to replace). Like, I'm a writer but I don't let ChatGPT do my job for me, I use it to help me. And it absolutely has so far! So I am ALL in support of using AI to help people. That's what it should do.

@@RosheenQuynh of artists were using AI the upheaval wouldn’t be so big. The problem is that people who aren’t artist are using it and calling themselves artists. That’s why the backlash. It’s people who can’t draw, use these apps to generate new images that are being made using already existing art. And you and me may scoff at it and say how trash it is. A lot of people starting accounts with AI generated images and getting 1000s of engagements and making a lot of money selling prints and other stuff.

@@sloppynyuszi 😬 Yikes

Wow, I feel exactly the same way!

Absolutely!

what

Totally agree with your third sentence! I improve the most when I hit a roadblock and have to learn my way through it.

Absolutely- its the muscle memory youve got recorded

what

Please do!

and similar to drawing, once you know some principles, it also helps you to learn how to listen to things you like and figure out what things they do you like

If you want to succeed as a modern band, music theory isn't just not helpful, it's actually harmful, because you're basically restricting yourself with the theory. For example no one in Nirvana or Slipknot learned music theory, and yet they blew up. However if you want to be a composer, or play in the orchestra music theory may be necessary I think kinda the same thing more or less goes with art. You don't necessary need theory in order to do appealing drawings or interesting concepts, and if you're just 100% about theory - you're basically do functions of a camera, which, let's be real, no one really is interested in

@@JeeJeen I wouldn't say that learning music theory is restrictive, because there's no celestial authority that forces you to follow the rules of music theory all the time. I think it's just beneficial to learn what others have found works, which is what music theory is, so you can use it when you desire to. But I'll admit I may be a bit biased being a more classical composer. And I don't think you need to learn music theory to be good a writing music, but you'll most likely know basic theory concepts (key signatures, time signatures, rhythm, chords) from learning how to play an instrument anyway.

@@BiggMilk i corroborate this with drawing too. learning more additional knowledge should only be a gain, not subtract anything - you can compare it to writing as well, like, learning more about words, syntax, grammar etc. doesn't stop you from doing the talking of in the way you are most of the wanting to be do

​@@JeeJeen I don't think you quite understand what music/art theory is and how artists use it. Art theory applies even to abstract art. It's literally just understanding how shapes, perspective, composition, colours, light and values work. When you understand these concepts well, you can use them however you want. If you're good at art without ever consciously learning theory, that's because you understand some of the theory intuitively, not because it somehow doesn't apply to your art. it's pretty cocky to assume you'd be able to intuitively apply theory that took centuries to develop though. Some of it, sure, and it may be enough to produce something good, but not all of it. Learning theory directly frees us from having to invent everything on our own before we can use it. And to quickly address your example of musicians who didn't "study theory", they absolutely did study some theory when they learned how to play their instruments. Chords are music theory. Scales are music theory. Tempo is music theory. They learned enough to make the music they wanted to make and that's fine. But it is absolutely false to assume learning more theory would somehow limit their creativity.

Yeah, not to mention that it was unclear whether the eyes go above the line or halfway through the lines cause artists use that circle with the cross on it in different ways

@@Artofcarissa gosh yeah. I personally place the eyes below the line and then draw a second line below that to keep my eye sizes consistent. But I never would have learned that trying to mimic other artists

Super fascinating stuff! Especially how babies learn to sign. I do not have a degree in linguistics. But I have spent a few weekends satisfying an intense curiosity lol. Out of curiosity, if we were to look at developing artistic ability as a form of communication in a similar way to language acquisition (not saying it's 1:1 but if we were to approach it as if it were) and watching videos like Brooke's, taking a course, or studying an art book would be considered "studying" or learning about art, what do you think would contribute directly to acquisition? My limited "research" primarily consists of Krashen talks and skimming through books and papers, and so I wonder what the equivalent of comprehensible input would be for learning art. I assume it would have a lot to do with observation as that is the "listening" of the medium as Brooke's brought out.

Thank you for putting it into expert's words!

Oh man thanks so much for the support Ethan!!

@@CharacterDesignForge thank you for your videos they provide great information, well entertaining, and I'm looking forward to Stormfellers.

Really appreciate that! I offer critiques through Patreon and my website for that exact purpose- it's the best way for me to get eyes on your work and offer some help.

Exactly- when those manga artists largely DO understand those principles and stylize from there!

Since you brought up how important the fundamentals are, I want to jump in and say I think this is major problem, not just with art AI, but AI in general. It appears to cut out the "heavy lifting"-the basics that it takes years and years to master. Whether its the structure of anatomy, or the structure of a cohesive sentence. But what is that doing to us mentally if we do not have to stretch and build those skills?

Thanks so much!

Much appreciated!

Glad you liked it!

Which part at the end is confusing?

Absolutely- fundamentals and realism are completely different! One is a final look/approach/rendering style, the other is the tools any artist needs

also, this video really made me contemplate if I should keep referencing my friend's art instead of *actual* things, I just suck at knowing where to look

Hmm, I’m not Brookes but I’ve done creature design and I’d probably start with a habitat and research adaptations used to survive in said habitat, then pick and choose some (ie, if I was going for desert, big feet, big ears, + thick eyelashes for something cute, but thick hide, large sails, and extra eyelids + ridges for something scary)

Patience :) Every artist that made those did this

I appreciate that!

@@CharacterDesignForge :)

Thanks man!

@@CharacterDesignForge I definitely want to go to lightbox this year as well! Hope to see you there :P

Yes, Im doing the best I can to balance everything as well as production on the Stormfellers pilot- but April was really crazy for me personally as well! Please dont take a one month gap as a sign I’ve quit- quite the opposite 😅

Here’s a hint: studying only one franchise means studying only work that has been stylized. The video’s advice will still be helpful for you. 😉

As I mentioned in another comment, copying as a means to study is something I advocate for/ I even talked about doing master studies. this video is about learning and studying, so as to understand a subject matter, not a mandate to constantly draw with some kind of realism.

@@CharacterDesignForge Ah!

Yeah definitely have advocated for the benefit of copying as a learning exercise- and not at all saying you cant have multiple kinds of cats! this is moreso the unavoidable need for artists to have fundamentals- not just imitating

@@CharacterDesignForge Yeah, I see.

Have you ever tried taking a human anatomy course. Draw from real life, I learned to draw the body from studying from real bones of people, human cadavers in lab, learning the actual functions of each muscle in relation to their origin and insertions, nerves and connective tissue modalities. How each joint functions in relation to what movements the human body can do. Eventually I started to visualize the human body in my head, I can draw anyone’s bones like taking an x ray of someone with my eyes and draw the muscles on top and draw them in any perspective because of experience. You need to break each section of the body and focus on one thing until you can draw it from front, back, side, top view. Like draw the humerus from every angle then attach it to the scapula and draw the scapula and then the clavicle attaches to the acromion lateral and to the sternum medially, then draw the vertebrae, 7 cervical, 12 thoracic, 5 lumbar, sacrum, coccyx. Then draw the ribs that are 12 ribs within the thoracic cage from T1- T12 vertebrae attach them to the sternum, then add the iliac hip joint to the sacrum to complete the hip and you’ll have the torso complete. Then add muscles on top by looking at individual muscles focusing on superficial muscles deep muscles won’t help you much only know their functions of what they do extension of the arm flexion of the shoulder. You get the gist of how complicated it can be but the human body is like a Lego each piece from appendicular skeleton attaches to the axial, if you can draw one piece just keep adding another. Easier said than done but it can be done because I’ve done and I was older than you as well in my thirties. Become better at observing everything in the world, perspective see the lines of buildings find the eye level of a building in relation to you point of view of from an object rotate the space and imagine it from the floor or Birds Eye view. Be creative in how you learn don’t be discouraged, you have to believe in yourself if you draw everyday 1 thing with purpose you will improve. It becomes fun when you can draw anything and your not hindered by your own skill just by your imagination but it takes time and experience and observing the real thing. You can only learn so much from a book or video, in the end you have to find a way to apply that knowledge. Don’t just copy others, take a picture of yourself and draw yourself look at your body and how it moves, draw yourself naked get comfortable with it. Learn the fundamentals on sketching give simple shapes form.