This, I 100% agree with you

I wanted to side with the witness

@@Sultaanash Ooooo, you're so cool and edgy! I bet you're so cool that no one understands you. I bet no one can appreciate how smart and cool you are.

​@@jopabr24either you're trolling or this is the biggest cope I've seen today

@@jopabr24 I appreciate it, I'm genuinely happy that someone else was able to understand someone like me that they made a whole video game antagonist that shares the personality. Im not saying they know me personally. But the fact that this means I am not alone in the way I am? Yes. Very happy indeed. The Witness is very human.

That is why when he is finished he is just a normal (big) body

Why it sounds so desperate in exiscion. It’s lost everything now and has everything it’s wronged over the years coming for it. It’s the “impossible, we, we are in control” as if battles itself unable to understand how we beat it. Then in exiscion it’s just constantly insulting us as we’re ripping it apart from its own mind.

I thought that was us severing it's connection to the Traveler

@@phaseflowers it severed itself. We were about to kill it during final so instead it severs itself to try escape and I doing so it frees the traveler

yall the witness is a “they” 😭😭

Noooo don't say it like that ewww (very cool design though)

This comment is so interesting because a very similar analogy is made by Caital in Overthrow. She talks about beasts of Torobotl that relied on a mutual relationship. And then your analogy makes the relationship between the Guardian and The Witness parasitic. Which is fitting because The Witness is a parasite to the Traveler. 🤔

It was rooted into the traveler

Like a massive rotting weed

egregore moment

there’s a big connection to darkness and mycelium/fungus in this game. apparent by egregore, and the roots that all the darkness enemies explode into upon death.

I was getting plant vibes too. It does look like tree roots. Not to mention the egregore and the weird weeds that the ghosts scan during that little public event in the pale heart. Maybe it's because the precursors were given so much by the traveler that they ended up with plant-like qualities upon forming into the witness. Since the traveler gives life to nature and all that

However the Gravemind specifically is a singular pre-existing intelligence that subsumes the others unlike The Witness

@@ShadowEclipse777there are *supposedly* hints that the witness had one leading mind, the individual who caused all of its species to converge into one

​@@ACR_Legends his name was Trump 😂

@@TheK1ngBNazty”Ah, Guardians, we will have the greatest final shape of all, it will be great. Greatest final shape you’ve ever seen.”

Difference is that the Gravemind was born from a god like being that eventually turned into a Hive Mind. It’s the equivalent to the Gardener of Winnower becoming the Witness

I had to hop in the raid to see what you were talking about and you're completely right--there's roots in Substratum that reach up into the next rocky layer of the Monolith. I also noticed that the roots seem to be on specifically one half of the Monolith which I think is some sort of clue but I haven't pieced it together yet.

To be fair, he did just cut off most of his body

I finally made my way all the way up there and was surprised to find out that the smoke disintegrates you instantly with a unique debuff

It's true actually the entire raid is inside the Witness's Body

@@ahmedimranimran5100it’s not, byf was wrong when he said that and half the community latched onto it

@@ChardogNation really?? So where is it even located

@@ahmedimranimran5100 literally just the monolith / tree of silver wings with the witness coiled around up until final encounter . We know it’s not the witnesses body because it was there during the campaign and as shown in the video can see he’s separate from it

@@ChardogNationAfter the campaign the Witness grows big and roots itself inside the monolith, likely to speed up the process of the Final Shape. So it isn’t necessarily the monolith, but it is PART of the monolith.

Even if they are chanting the dread language (Dreadic), I doubt those are meant to be decipherable at all. Pretty sure it’s just a case of “hey it sounds cool, let’s use it” instead of it having some hidden meaning. Plus, Byf isn’t focusing on Dreadic for now, since he’s not really a linguist, so he’s leaving that up to other members in the communit.

@@twelved4983 Yeah, ur right, Byf is focused on other things. I just get really excited when I hear the dread language! Bungie says it's decipherable, but we still don't have any clues, so you could say I commented this cuz I'm flying blind, here. 😅

@@ianshaw3189 yeah, we ain’t really gonna get anywhere until we’ve got our Rosetta Stone for Dreadic. I mean, for the Fallen language, I believe it was the Truth rocket’s lore tab that provided some insight into it, unless the lore tab in D2 is different than in D1. But we need something like that for Dreadic

The pyramid language 'Sinchurus' is the witness' voice line in the final shape's 10th campaign cutscene.

@@ianshaw3189 Someone made a video about at and the person who got people working on the Fallen language - Sarsion is taking a look into it as well.

Do you still love him even though he's a worm?

I LOVE your profile picture, Jade was my favorite

considering the disciples, dread, and nezarec himself were all being’s formerly different species and then corrupted by the witness/darkness, i believe the roots spawned from them are the release of that amass of energy that “dreadified” them, it could also be the darkness releasing from them combining with the light similar to the way the echoes are formed

I think these roots are the byproduct when light and dark merge, like when we killed nez and rhulk we did it with „light“

It was slightly based on neurons in the brain how they look with all the connections. It looks like a bush without the rest of the brain.

@@WolfofESit’s likely just the dread affect. Anything we see that’s been made dread does it. Likely due to the power they were granted is being released on death. Tho not truly dead. We’ve got a lore tab saying rhulks remains were alive and tried to corrupt a guardians transporting them. The roots for atleast disciples I hope means rebirth. Slowly over time they will heal and recover to be reborn. We still own part of rhulks and all of nezarecs and caluses I believe in the tower, if any of them were to wake up in the tower. That would he raid worthy

@@WolfofES From my understanding we weakened and killed Nezerac with light and dark. Since he failed to combine them into prismatic he got weakened by overloading with both instead of stronger. However Rhulk got weakened and killed by his own darkness power and his superweapon the Upended. The Upended as far as I understand it is the obelisk thing in the middle of his pyramid and it has the ability of absorbing energy and using it to destroy things made of similar energy. Rhulk was trapped in his pyramid by Savathun and the loaded charge of the upended was sabotaged. Rhulk invited us in and wanted us to use our light in the pyramid so he could charge the upended with light to destroy the throneworld. However in the final fight we feed Rhulks own darkness power back into the upended damaging him, his armor and forcefield to weaken him so he could be killed. TLDR: We kill Nezerac with light and dark but Rhulk only with his own darkness.

I accidentally deleted a comment debate I had with someone who said something similar to this. I'm not sure I agree with this take but still you're making good observations and valid points.

Exactly what I thought. It’s clearly separate from the Witness’ body given we follow it up to and stand atop it when we face off against the Witness at the top of its Monolith. The fact that it also shows up during Excision despite the fact that the Witness separated itself from the Monolith and also started to grow flowers of Light in Excision? Verity is implied to be the heart of the Traveler as well, given its place in the opening cinematic when the Traveler is pushing back against the Witness and its Final Shape, along with the aesthetic itself, and then tied in with what people have pointed out that the four “zones” players are randomly assigned to (three “inside” and one “outside”) resemble the four chambers of a heart… Needless to say that the roots are still the corrupted “guts” of the Traveler, and it’s no less disturbing when you look at the illusion of Verity’s true appearance as the Witness shows it to us before we clear the encounter, and when we die during the encounter, and see the truth of what the Witness has done to it. The blood of the Traveler (the Light) still courses through it, but the tissues are infected beyond recognition.

That's a really good question and I'm still trying to figure it out. You're right, The Witness didn't look like this until the end of Iconoclasm. But how tf did it move back to the Monolith? How did it transform? And how is it possible for The Witness to transform at the ritual site while also being a major piece of the Monolith's structure?

@@zohzowI get the strong feeling that the “mini-witness” we see in the pale heart is just a projection or an aberration, sorta like how oryx did with his echoes. We never did actually shoot him in iconoclasm. Now I do feel like the “mini-witness” form is what it genuinely did look like outside the traveler. It still ain’t clear but maybe (considering the fact that we haven’t seen any genuine giant pyramid ships in tfs) that he might’ve just crammed the pyramid tech right into his own body when he came thru the portal and thanks to the properties of the pale heart, was able to make the monolith.

@@Eptzol Those are really good points but here's the thing... In the post-Iconoclasm cutscene it appears to me that The Witness physically teleports to our fireteam (whenever it grabs the H.E.L.M. to prevent our escape). And it appears to me that in that moment is when The Witness becomes snake. A small detail that supports that interpretation is the fact that The Witness as seen in Zenith has a scratch on it's temple from our battle in Iconoclasm--which leads me to think that they are the same bodies.

@@zohzow Also good points, maybe it did indeed build the monolith from the get-go but didn’t fully insert itself into it until after the iconoclasm cutscene (meaning that all the pyramid stuff we see in the monolith was already fully built to begin with but the roots have been just inserted by the witness) but that also wouldn’t make much sense due to its body seeming to be attached to some pyramid tech aswell, who knows honestly.

I think after the cutscene where the witness transforms it ends up going back to the monolith and merging itself with it during the 3 days between then and the raid. I think the monolith itself is made up of all the pyramid ships it brought with it. With how chaotic and thrown together the architecture of the raid is I think the witness literally pulled appart it's ships and threw them back together to form its monolith.

I was thinking about that area as well and I think that might be the area where the witness started merging itself with the monolith. It grew up so high it came out the top of the building. Some of its hands seem to have been discarded there for whatever reason. Maybe it has something to do with the area and maybe the herald of finality had a role to play.

@@danielleighton4161 Omg that's such a good idea. Suddenly The Herald of Finality is looking reeeeaaally interesting

That's my interpretation, yes. But there are valid points to be made that suggest the roots are a gutted tree of silver wings.

DONT

Oh nah 😭

Go to bed, you're grounded.

I think it's safe to say that The Witness is completely dead. I think we may receive more lore on it's nature but The Witness will most likely never influence the narrative again.

@@zohzowyeah but we have to be worried about a certain antagonist that being the winnower I mean the witness called itself as the first knife so meaning the winnower might be the next big bad for destiny

That information comes from a clip that I made. Here's what was said: "This thing that we're going up right now is it The Witness?" - Streamer "it isn't- [the raid] is the spire, the thing you see on the skyboxes throughout the pale heart" - Former Bungie dev CatamyKX She was talking about the Monolith which is not what this video is about.

It seems to basically be an excuse to make him really fucking big in as lazy of a way as possible but also being "lore accurate" cuz he basically transformed his pyramid ships into the obelisk and a extension of himself. I really liked the raid and a lot of the design, but it definitely isn't exactly what I wanted.

I like it. It shows how ir connected to the traveler. It’s weaker the further down it goes. The fact the monolith isn’t a building it’s alive because it’s the witness. We are actively hurting it every step we take forward. Each encounter. Till we see it face to face. It also makes sense how the traveler is able to break free for a short time during damage to give us the surging light buff. The roots at the core are weak and easily broken