Poor guy had to play half his games on that green concrete in Soldier Field.

@@collinrust2641 Ouch. That too.

That's why I wanted Barry to be the one to break Paytons record. Detroit wasn't that much better.

And until Mike Ditka came along, the Bears' offensive line was okay, but nothing to write home about.

Barry Sanders went through it and was smart to retire young.

I would guess that maybe Barry Sanders 1991 season rates high?

Yes, the Bears have had their issues throughout the years. It's absolutely amazing.

The stretch from 68 to 75 was no QB picnic either.

Except for Sid Luckman, Jim McMahon (when he was healthy, which wasn't too often), and maybe Bill Wade in 1963, the Bears' quarterbacking history wasn't much of a picnic.

Oh, wow. Now that brings back some memories...the Vega!

My dad made the Vega and says the future was more like the Chevy citation!

That's classic!

Yeah I rememver that too lol

Yeah I remember that too

That's a great way of looking at it! Everything is relative.

Yes, before Steve Bartkowski there was some troubling QB situations for the Falcons. Then after him were troubling times again with David Archer, Turk Schoenert and Scott Campbell. I suppose I could go on and on, but you know the story far better than I. I'm with ya regarding your take on today's game and I certainly appreciate your comments - thanks!

I'm sure they felt even more brutal.

The field looked like a giant pool table

Candlestick Park’s Astroturf looked the worst.

The Astrodome always had the most raggedy-looking turf to me, at least until about the late '80s, and even then I'm sure it was not much better.

​@mxxjss what about Busch Stadium. Everybody hated playing there. In an 1979 Texas Monthly article, the Cowboys stated that the Astrodome and Busch Stadium were the worst surfaces they ever played on.

I watched that playoff game on tv and the only Bears score was towards the end of the game, so that Steve Schubert spike was bush league.

@@markgardner9460 I agree! You getting beat by 30 points,why spike the ball?

@tommy. Can't blame the Bears for their playoff loss going up against the so called "America's team" from back then, but give credit due for making the playoffs.

They almost drafted Montana in Round 3 in 1979, but Jim Finks changed his mind at the last second.

Billy Wade is not well known, but he wasn't bad. He led the league in passing attempts and completions and threw for over 3,000 yards in a 14 game season in 1962 ( John Unitas only had 2,967) and then led the Bears to the NFL title in 1963. His stats were not that far down in 1964, but the team had a losing record and in 1965, with Gayle Sayers now on the team, they gave the starting to Rudy Bukich which became Jack Concannon in 1968 and the start of the Bears run of Hall of Shame quarterbacks.

@@williamford9564 I was going to mention Bob Wade

@@williamford9564Rudy Bukich actually led the league in passing in 1965 and had one of the best years any Bears QB ever had (20 TD, 9 INT, QBR 93.7). Problem was, he was 35 years old and on the downside of his career, which only lasted 3 more seasons.

@@russellmurray3964 Bukich did play well. As you said he was older. He initially intended to retire after 1966 so the Bears traded for Concannon in early 1967 thinking he was a worthy successor. I think Bukich did agree to come back in 1967 as a backup and mentor.

Yeah, Phipps took to a more safer, short passing game (RB's Payton and Dave Williams) that year which aided in ball control. The leading WR only had 30 catches (Baschnagel) and their best deep threat, James Scott, only had 21 receptions.

@@markgardner9460 I recall some deep shots to Watts and Scott (thinking of the Rams game, for example).

Both of them were good deep threats. After 3 years with the Bears, Watts faded - perhaps it was injury-related. I'm not sure.

No se en what universe that would happen

@@kibitznec700 I mean, I saw the game so… 2 TDs lost - 1 called back and 1 dropped. The final was 27-17.

The Bears were hosed by the refs in that Oakland game - quick whistle

I imagine that it was when it was below freezing and the snow and sleet turned to ice-like playing conditions. That artificial turf was just nasty.

And don't forget those dugout trenches on both sidelines, which they never filled up until 1979.

I wonder how many players ended up there not by their own decision. It's surprising that they didn't get rid of them earlier.

Thank you very much! I grew up a Vikes fan, too, so I know how the Bears used to play 'em. They were always hard hitting games - Plank and Fencik as safeties were as tough as they came. The Vikes would block a punt, extra point or field goal and come away with a victory to win some of those games.

It's not a score you see very often, 28-3. Not very memorable. I don't recall seeing it any other times.

Well stated!

It still is. Ditka and McMahon were self promoters who came to Chicago to promote themselves.

​@@kendallevans4079So true

Ditka didn't do anything other than promote himself

@@kendallevans4079 Wrong. Before Ditka the Bears were an also-ran team. With minimal success at best. Mike turned that program around. Winning Coach of the year twice. He made them a powerhouse contender and a World Champion in 1985(one of the most dominant teams in history). As a player Ditka was a no-nonsense competitor. Nothing change when he was assistant under Coach Landry with the Cowboys. So I would hope as HC he would try to instill that kind of discipline to his players. And he did. The results speak for themselves.

Drafting McMahon and Dan Hampton helped immensely.

and Singletary

@@markgardner9460 Singletary was drafted in 2nd round in 1981. Amazing that 37 players were picked before him. He would start 9 games that year. Playing behind the one and only Alan Page(playing in his final season)

Thank you - I really appreciate that. Thanks for watching and commenting!

It always seemed that Tim Ryan and former-Bears wide receiver Johnny Morris were the commentators for Bears home games.

That's cool. One of my buddies had former Bengals linebacker Jim LeClair as a high school gym teacher. I see that Okoniewski played for the Cardinals for a couple of years after the Packers and that he was a second round draft pick. Thanks for watching and commenting!

In my freshman year at TSU, my PE teacher was former Steeler defensive end Ben McGee. He was a quiet guy, didn't really seem to like talking about football much.

To me, Vince Evans was similar in style to Bobby Douglass. Both of them were tough, great runners, and had BIG arms - they could really fire the ball. For value (rushing, receiving, blocking, leadership, and in a pinch quarterbacking/kicking/punting, if needed) I give the nod to Payton as the #1 RB of all-time

@@markgardner9460 agreed. Didn't Payton get a ring in '85...he would have been around 32?

Yes, 32. I just saw this: he lead the NFL in carries each year from '76 through '79. Talk about durable - then he played 8 more full seasons!

@@markgardner9460 Think about Payton getting tackled, he was amazing at avoiding hits, glancing off. I guess you could say he was an angry runner but he had/(depended on) an unbelievable straight arm and an innate ability to slither through stone wall hits. One of my favorite backs/players all time....shame he's not still with us. Thanks for your hard work and tolerating garrulous idiots like me.

I used to love watching him pop up super quickly when tackled. It was like he was on a trampoline. He weighed only 202 pounds, but he played like he was 250 pounds with no regard for his body. Thanks, Jammin'; it's easy to tolerate a super fan of this NFL era.

I agree with you - this group is worse than the early '70's group. Why they stuck with Avellini so long is amazing. He was only a 6th round draft pick, so it wasn't like they had invested a lot into him. Maybe it was Halas' tight-fistedness.

No the Rams had great teams. They made the playoffs almost every year.

bears? Jajajajajajajajajajaja

@@kibitznec700 Bears made the playoffs many times in the late 70's.

The difference between the two teams is that the Rams for most of the 1970's had a winning record whereas the Bears for that decade posted a good won loss only in 1977 and 1979.

Good point about Avellini not having anywhere near a fluid throwing motion, but it did look like he had a live arm.

Ive heard some stories as well as reading Jeff Pearlman's outstanding biography of Walter Payton, "Sweetness" about a decade ago that suggested that Avelinni wasnt the most popular, well-liked guy on the roster. He could come across as more then a little bit arrogant, diva-like and a prima donna when his stats and performances didnt back up his attitude. Phipps, IIRC, and a few other of Walter's teammates said in the book that the major problem with the mid-late 70's Chicago Bears was their ownership/FO's overall philosophy and committment to winning with bargain-basement, cheap players. They also had a future HOF GM in Jim Finks who was a great, saavy judge of talent but never felt that you had to have a great QB to win games, even in Minnesota, before Tarkenton was traded back to Vikings in 1972, Finks believed that a middling, mediocre QB in Gary Cuozzo was sufficient to win Super Bowls. Thankfully, Bud Grant was conscious and prescient enough to recognize this stupidity, but Finks' mindset on employing mediocre, lackluster QB's while stacking the rest of the team with Pro-Bowlers was how you won NFC Central division titles, or made the postseason. Finks refused to entertain a possible trade with SB-winning QB, 4-time Pro-Bowl Kenny Stabler with Oakland in 1979 preseason, saying "we're happy with who we have" and only begrudgingly considered the Raiders offer by trading a 3rd or 4th round pick. Many Bears scouts and players were certain that on Draft day 1979, they'd draft Joe Montana out of Notre Dame? We all know how that turned out. They were just as happy being a "bubble" playoff team going 10-6, 9-5, or 9-7, as much as going 7-9, 6-10, or 8-8.

Thank you for providing awesome information. So Jim Finks was to blame - I was unaware of his philosophy in that regard. Regarding Halas (the team) being satisfied with middling win/loss records, it reminds me of Connie Mack's similar philosophy of fielding those sorts of teams because it will keep the fans interested and coming to the games, but you don't have to pay the players high salaries because it isn't substantiated based upon not going to the playoffs. Thank you for watching and commenting - much appreciated!

Despite being a quarterback in his playing days, Finks really had a blind spot when it came to the quarterback position. He traded a first round pick for Mike Phipps who had maybe a good nine game stretch in his entire Bear career @@davidroberts7282

It's amazing that Walter could stay so healthy, given the number of carries and the fact that everybody in the stadium knew that he was going to get the ball.

@@markgardner9460Payton once remarked that one thing he really appreciated about Jim McMahon was that when Ditka and Ed Hughes would call Walter's number for a run up the middle against a stacked d-line on 3rd and 8, McMahon would audible out of it and get the easy short pass for a first down, saving Payton a bit of futile wear and tear running a play destined for failure. And he admired McMahon having the moxie to hold his own afterward with Ditka on the sidelines when Jimmy Mac was getting his butt chewed out for changing the play.

He wasn't used to running out of bounds, right?

Looking at this video compared to the one I made for the Bears QB's from '70-'74, I think that this bunch from '75-'79 was worse. What do you think?

I don't know the stats perfectly but this group could rank as the worst group of five years in history which would be a great video itselff ranking worst QB's on a team in a five year or decade period.@@markgardner9460

That's a great idea - thanks!!! I've already got something in mind.

He was the Bears back-up Punter and Kicker too!

You're welcome - thanks for watching and commenting!

Having a play run wide while in the shadow of your own end zone isn't the best play to call, but yeah, definitely rare.

Aw man and at 9:20 Payton runs down an interception return after 55 yards, that was great!

YES! I love that play - he was a total gamer.

By future teammate Tommy Hart

That's right! Good call.

Right on - thanks, Donald.

I watched that '76 Bears/Raiders game on tv back then - great game

Thank you - great to hear from you again!

I couldn't hold off any longer. Which batch of QB's was worse, from the 1st video or 2nd?

@@markgardner9460 The second. The fact that they stuck with Avellini ( a 6th round draft pick, not like he was drafted as an “elite” quarterback) that long is appalling. 69 interceptions! And can you believe they traded a FIRST ROUND draft pick for Phipps who was a 5 year bust in Cleveland!!

In 7 years with the Browns, he threw for exactly 7,700 yards and 40 td's with 81 int's. What the heck did the Bears think they were getting anyway? He couldn't even beat out 13th round draft pick Brian Sipe for the starting job in Cleveland.

Yes, I noticed that he had a pretty strong arm, as a few of these passes were thrown right on a line - not rainbow passes.

Thank you!!

I didn't care for his celebration in the outfield end zone at Metropolitan Stadium in Bloomington, MN.

@@markgardner9460 me neither

It's a party on a Friday night!!!

Avellini was bad. Huff was worse

Somehow the Bucs thought highly enough of him to start him in '77.

Huff looked like he could play,but not so much..

Who hit Phillps at 20:15 it made me wince!

I'm guessing that Luckman is before almost all viewers of this channel time. I'd love to see video of his passing! It's quite rare, I'm sure. Thank you for watching and commenting.

Willie McClendon was their 3rd round pick - oops! Could have had Joe, but then again, a lot of other teams missed on him, too.

Turk Schonert in the '80 9th round was the highest QB selected after Vince Evans in the 6th round of the '77 draft. They stockpiled defensive picks, predominately.

@@markgardner9460 It paid off in the long run but they took a long time to get there.

It's amazing. You'd think that they'd find a diamond in the rough by now, so I think that it has to be attributed to team philosopy in combination with coaching. I mean, what else? 80+ years now.

@markgardner9460 the bears have always had the reputation for being cheap.

That's another great point.

I think the old man (Halas) was partially to blame, for stubbornly refusing to change eith the times as the years went on. His ideas of offense was considered archaic even for the '70s.

I think the only team that had it worse at QB was the Bucs their first few years.

Remember when Joe Charboneau rookie cards were hot in '81? Dealers were selling lots of 100 of his for $100+

I think that the success was primarily due to Walter Payton's 1,852 rushing yards in 1977 which was #1 in the NFL, his 1,610 rushing yards in 1979 which was #2, and the Bears playing in an extremely weak NFC Central Division.

No it was because of Walter Payton both times

Hi Ross! I was thinking to myself, if I got a Bears jersey of an offensive player and it couldn't be Sayers or Payton, who would it be? Well, I'm not sure that I've come to a conclusion yet. You know me, I've got to keep it prior to '81.

That would be reasonable but I would choose Piccolo or Douglas

I'd probably go with Ditka's #89, then how 'bout Bobby Joe Green's #88 for kicks 'n giggles?

@@markgardner9460 oh nice option , of course you have Dick Butkus as I seen you wear it.

I could opt for Doug Atkins or Bill George or #77 Red Grange

I didn't even know that Halas' number was 7. I learn something new everyday from viewers like yourself - thanks!

@@markgardner9460 no problem. I bleed blue and orange.

My grandfather's favorite running back was Bronko Nagurski. Gotta love that last name - it's a lot like Butkus, Csonka, Ditka and Nitschke....hard-sounding vowels.

@@markgardner9460 it's easy to see why, didn't he come back 6 years after he retired cause they lost all the FBS to the war draft? There's so many great players over the years and a lot get forgotten. Bill George, Doug Atkins, Wally Chambers, The whole 63 team l,Buffone. Galimore. It's the mythology of the Bears that keeps me around.

That's right - he threw a touchdown on three completions and then his career was finished.

Yep - Grim started with the Vikes, then played with the G-Men, Da Bears, then back to the Vikes for '76 and '77

Didn't know he went back to Vikings good stuff I love learning

At Fran Tarkenton's insistence is how Grim came back to play for the Vikes and that's how Bob Tucker (another Giants receiver) came to play with the Vikes for the last 4 years of his career. What Fran wanted, Fran got.

I know Bob Tucker was te on Giants really good too bad it went bad in NY for Fran

Exactly how bad it got will be addressed in my next video - super excited about it.

That he was! One fearless runner for sure.

Yes!!!

Yes they really do need to bring them back.

Yes, sometimes it's tough to cram in everything into these videos, but thanks for pointing that out.

@@markgardner9460 It was sarcasm. I am just amazed how NFL teams could not draft back then

Yeah, they didn't have the scouting combine, but then again the 1974 1st round was held on January 29th. Now it's held three months later, so teams had far less time to perform their due diligence.

@@newtheisThe Bears couldn't draft worth beans until Jim Finks showed up in 1974. And Lionel Antoine was one of their better picks, that's how lousy the other ones were.

I'm glad that you liked it!

Very underrated. Played with the Bears after the Niners.

That's about 75 years ago - they should have had at least one or two since then!

The team has a better tradition of running backs and defensive players.

I scratch my head too, thinking about how many QB's they've went through and are still looking to land a perennial Pro Bowl QB.

@@markgardner9460 yep

They traded QB Orton and a few high draft picks for Jay Cutler who was a Pro Bowler in 2008. How did he do? 8 years and no Pro Bowls.

Walter was a one man gang. I'm amazed that he was able to produce such huge numbers year after year because he wasn't that big of a guy.

Maybe The Pack of those days were like the Chicago Cubs - the lovable losers - where it was much to be a fan of perpetual losers.

Jay Cutler was OK. In '95, Erik Kramer had 29 td's, 10 int's and 3,838 yards, but he didn't make the Pro Bowl and that was his only standout year with the Bears.

You bring up a good point. The Bears offensive line was geared towards the run, so they drafted accordingly. Logically, the pass blocking would suffer. It's the exact opposite problem that Dan Marino experienced in Miami where they were a passing team, so they drafted offensive linemen primarily for their pass-protecting skills. Therefore, Miami's rushing attack suffered.

Evans was the most gifted athlete. Had high hopes for him just didn’t work out. That blame falls on the organization not the offensive line. Bears invested 4 first round picks in the offensive line between 76-83 never had a good offensive coordinator

I think his inaccuracy was the biggest factor. He had a cannon for an arm, but he couldn't control it - much like Bobby Douglass.

But he did manage to have a long career. Helped get the Raiders into the playoffs in 1993.

I think that's a credit to his demonstrated ability to always be ready for action in the event of an injury and also in keeping in great shape at an advanced football age. He also must have had the respect of his teammates or else Al Davis would not have kept him on the team for so long.

Douglass was incredibly agile - AND a bruising runner, too, when the situation called for it. In these QB's defense, they didn't have any big name receivers to which to throw, but then it becomes a case of "which cames first: the chicken or the egg?" Were the QB's bad because the receivers were bad or the other way around?

@@markgardner9460 "Agreed"!!

It's posting

Yeah, no kidding!

Evans was a lot like an earlier Bears QB - Bobby Douglass - in that they had tremendous arms, but didn't have the necessary touch and accuracy to take their games to the next level. Both were great running QB's, too.

Same thing with Gary Cuozzo when he was with the Vikes!

I'll go with the '92 CB's

Every once in awhile Walter would throw on an option play, but other than that...

Jimmy Mac said that, eh? He was one tough dude.

Or maybe more like "Get him outta there!!!"

I went to a bunch of games at Soldier Field back then, and I can guarantee you absolutely no one I ever ran into was saying anything remotely like that. It was more like, "THAT (expletive) AVELLINI IS OUR (expletive) QB (expletive, expletive)".

@@russellmurray3964 yet today they scream for our modern day Bob avellini

With only a few exceptions, NFL teams in this era were predominately running teams. The QB's coming out of college were almost all QB's who rarely threw the ball. So, the modern passing game was in it's infancy in that regard (The AFL is an entirely different story). I like that you mentioned the offensive line because they were drafted primarily based upon their run blocking effectiveness. Coaches, too, were inexperienced in passing strategies. Viewers of today's product are spoiled because they mainly view QB's who are first rate passers who had years of passing experience through high school and college. By the time that they arrive at the pro level, a lot of them are game ready.

They look crisp 'n clean. I like 'em too!

I, personally never cared for the navy blue pants.

@@robertmasina7388 The Bears introduced the navy blue pants in 1984 to connect with the 1940 championship team that also wore navy blue pants (the Bears hadn't worn them since 1940. On an interesting side note, they did wear orange pants in 1948-49 and in preseason games of 1950 and 1952). I don't remember exactly why, but I'm guessing it was in tribute to founder/owner/coach George Halas, who had passed away the previous season on 10/31/83.

Isn't that amazing? Hard to believe that they can't get it right.

Yes, he had a very long career. Even though he didn't start that many games, he did play professionally for 17 years, so that is amazing. He was even out of the NFL for the '88 season, but came back to play another 7 years.

What were you watching!? Evans was TERRIBLE!

If he was so terrible, how did he play 17 years in the NFL?

@@markgardner9460 part time backup the whole 17 yrs.

@@debbiehenson1096 Why are You Hating?

Yeah, he played in '84 for Da Bears.

I'll have to take another look see.

Considering it was Villapiano, and especially the team he played for, I would not be surprised.

That's right - hold out and request a trade if they did.

....and those guys were doing that at a 2 to 1 clip. Just awful.

I think the Cards lost their first 8 games

Had Bidwell spent some money and let Don Coryell do his job unabated- the Cardinals would’ve remained competitive. Instead- Bidwell was cheap- Coryell leaves and goes to San Diego, Cards bring in Wilkinson and that was the end for the Cardiac Cardinals.

@@roxiebeagle Bidwell left a lot to be desired...

Now that I think about it- the Don Coryell St. Louis years are usually forgotten because of his career with the Chargers. The Cardinals from 73-78 would be a great story: building the foundation for greatness but never finishing and then watching it crumble.

That's a good idea - thank you!

Bring 'em back!!

@@markgardner9460 number 10 on NFL worst cursed teams

Well, they played in an extremely weak NFC Central Division, so that helped.

No importa igual NO BUSINESS IN 77 AND 79.

Bo Jackson? Dan Rather?

Dan

Let's just say that he wasn't that good, but then again, he was the first string QB. So if he was bad as the first string QB, how bad were the second and third stringers?

I missed the stats about avellini at the end omg.

Way back in the 1940's - Sid Luckman. Hall of Famer, but not really a household name to today's NFL fans, perhaps.