The only reason I am considering a mac is for battery life. Cannot wait for windows on arm

I have a Microsoft Dev Kit 2023 which has the Snapdragon 8cx Gen 3 processor, 32 GB RAM and 512 GB NVMe PCIe Gen 4 SSD. Performance is great when running native ARM Windows applications such as the Office 365, Edge and Visual Studio 2022. Even emulators such as Dolphin which have a Windows ARM version run exceptionally well. WSL2 and Windows Subsystem for Android also work well, but there are some caveats which I will come on to. It performs better than my Intel 8th Gen Core i7 NUC with Intel Iris Plus Graphics which it replaces and is silent as I have never heard the fan come on, where as my Intel NUC gets extremely noisy when stressed. I also don't experience any Janky mouse behaviour when the ARM PC is under load unlike the Intel NUC. The Windows ARM is great apart from couple of significant issues. 1) Poor graphics driver support ... current Microsoft / Qualcomm graphics drivers only support Direct X. No native OpenGL / CL and Vulkan driver support. OpenGL / CL support is available via a software compatibility layer downloaded via the Microsoft Store, but this doesn't work very well or support the latest version of Open GL. There is also no WSL2 hardware graphics acceleration support, even though the graphics driver supports WDDM 3.0. I find this frustrating, because if Qualcomm can produce graphic drivers with this all this support for Chrome OS including hardware acceleration for its Linux container and Android, why not Windows ARM? It will put off many smaller developers from porting their programs and games to Windows ARM. 2) Development - I was expecting the Microsoft Dev Kit 2023 to be a standalone development PC where I could build any Windows ARM binaries without needing a x86 PC. Unfortunately, that's not always the case due to some current workflow gaps in Visual Studio 2022 for ARM, and Qualcomm's own Windows ARM NPU SDK not including a full set of tools needed to get NPU programming up and running on an ARM PC. The complete suite of tools is included in a Linux SDK compatible which is compatible with Ubuntu 18.04 LTS. OK, you can install this under WSL2 on the ARM PC, but some of those Linux tools only run on an x86 PC and try and install TensorFlow via an ARM version of Python! I manged to get it working using micro-condo, but it failed because some of the python tools and scripts that used Tensorflow to build the model were x86 binaries and x86 emulation does not appear to work in WSL2 as it runs ARM versions of Linux! Consequently, I am just using my Dev Kit as my daily driver PC and no longer for development. Microsoft and Qualcomm need to up their game if they want all developers to take Windows ARM seriously, which is a pity, because it could be great if giving the right support.

Hoping Windows on ARM does take off to promote competition and also give us more options. Enjoying MacOS on M1 and wondering how different M1/M2 and QualComm SoC peformances are with their respective OS (or has it been mainly an OS optimization matter).

Microsoft needs their own Rosetta 2

I have held off purchasing a new Windows laptop 💻 since 2020 after I seeing what Apple Silicon was able to do and the creation of Nuvia to design a Windows based RISC processor. Performance on a Windows machine is what I'm after and adding fans, liquid cooled processors and 700 watt power supplies says that x86 based platforms are at the limit of portability, performance and efficiency compared to RISC. It's time to shift.

What I find more promising is that Qualcoms exclusivity deal with Microsoft might end soon, finally allowing other brands to compete with and hopefuly beat the maker of this video.

i love the blooper line " its not even surprising anymore " and i would love to see some sort of real world test when you can get your hands on one of these fancy devices, stating the battery is "decent" without your normal stats doesnt instill alot of confidence

As a windows user and an ARM-based mac user, i'm really glad to see more options on ARM-Based windows laptop, also more support for the ARM Architecture.

Thank you for actually talking about software compatibility issues along with challenges of this architecture transition. KZfaq seems to be full of clickbait videos with people making weird faces on thumbnails. So this is a breath of fresh air.

They need to get rid of the qualcom exclusivity deal and create a better translation layer similar to rosetta 2.

Fantastic video. I've used Windows on ARM for two years and its worked very well for my use case, which is frequent travel and MS 365. Love ❤️ the battery life and always on connection with my cellular provider. No hot spotting my phone or using public wi-fi.

I got a surface pro X G1.. it still works fine. It works just fine and got better with W11.. it's not the wold fastes machine, but it's not slow..

But Snapdragon 8cx Gen 3 is only half of the performance of apple processors. I hope that will be a better performance on Qualcomm Oryon... because if not, there is no competition. I changed all my computers to M1; the only issues are the retro compatibility and the low quantity of software optimized for ARM processors. The electricity bill was reduced a lot.

Thanks for the video today David! Learning bout new stuff again, so cool that they can put that super small piece of technology inside of a slim surface pro.

ARM is just more elegant solution. And probably the future of the industry.

So can I use a external gpu for good gaming performance?

I wonder if someone will make desktop motherboard with soldered Qualcomm CPU when they can compete with arm and Intel. Might be interesting in 5 years.

I think the thing holding back Windows on ARM from becoming mainstream is the majority of consumers (that are looking for a PC) will buy whatever is cheapest, and don’t really care about specs At least this is how it is where i live I think the only reason apple is successful in transitioning the Mac to ARM is they control BOTH the hardware AND the OS Unless Microsoft is willing to fund the production of REALLY low end ARM devices to compete with the x86 devices that perform best when left in S mode, then i don’t think Windows on ARM will ever become mainstream (By really low end, I’m referring to devices priced up to approx £250) Third party manufacturers cannot be relied upon by themselves to flood the market with such devices, as they will be too cautious The only alternative is for Microsoft to stop trying to compete with Chromebook’s, and flood the market with what i consider “middle ground” devices, price range of approx £300 to £600

Impressive advantages! Altough I doubt if average computer user heard of this arch.

Can Windows 11 ARM running inside a virtual machine on a MacBook still emulate x86 software? Because that might be considered 'emulation within emulation' which Mac wouldn't allow.

Can it do video editing in 4k

Why there is no HDCP wireless display driver for my Surface Pro X?

Whats about Windows CE?? Windows CE was first to use ARM ???

I love it ! I have a windows dual boot on my phone, and even running on an 855+ windows arm is still pretty impressive

Song and artist @ 2:23?

This sounds great but does this mean I can play Moh Allied Assault on an arm device like my phone?

On that ThinkPad, take a look in the BIOS. They have added support for dual booting Linux. I have a ThinkPad X13s and it kind of just showed up a few months ago.

Like your breakdown of ARM. I recently flew to Toronto from Australia and my flights were 25 hours in total so 12 isn’t much laddie

I Feel Bad For Intel, AMD And Snapdragon Everyone In The Market Started To Build Their Own Chip...

45wa is like 12500 mah ish isnt it? Most laptops run at 3.7v?

I actually really liked windows RT. If you only needed the office apps, which is all I need for my business laptop, it was perfect.

I'm looking at getting the pro x sq1 or pro 7. This video definitely threw me off, cause now I'm leaning towards the arm.

windows 10 supported only x86 32 bit apps but only windows 11 and later windows 10 insider builds support x86-64 64 bit apps

i want 100% arm support. drivers. apps. everything. i been waiting for this before you kids new arm was coming to desktop. gimme. I've waited long enough.

I've been waiting for Microsoft to dropo x86 antique instruction set for modern ARM.

I would buy an ARM-based Lenovo and slap Debian on it.

Now that Oryon is revealed here in Oct 2023, I'm happy to see they delivered (believing the benchmarks)! Can't wait to upgrade to a Windows ARM laptop next year... Until then gonna daily drive my 2018 HP Pavilion :)

Need the SQ3 in a Surface Go-sized form factor. There are no good ultra-portable devices on the market anymore outside of Chinese manufacturers like OneNetbook and GPD.

So app compatibility is not really a problem anymore

Is it possible that with the new ARM ai your out-takes will get a whole new look (non-sound) 😉

Hey how do you uninstall/remove ARM?

Imagine it combined with foldable screen so we can use phone tablet laptop in 1 devices

I'd love to try a Windows arm device. But I'm afraid that if it doesn't get adopted it'll end up like Windows RT.

Windows ARM just needs a good x86 and x64 compatibility.

Will it run games?

It’d be interesting to see what happens when newer snapdragons get paired with discrete GPUs, talk about an unstoppable workhorse

I do not understand why companies like AMD and Intel do not try to get ARM processors in Laptops. So much faster cause of the efficiency with that limited cooling.

Actually, Windows has been compiled for other architectures since before windows 95 in house at microsoft and is probably still tested and compiled for other CPU's other than Intel. If you think Windows on anything other than x86 is a new thing for Microsoft you're sadly mistaken; they've been doing this since pretty much day one. As far as I know, they've got working copies of Windows for a bunch of RISC based CPU's such as ARM, PPC, etc. and have had them for a VERY long time.

What about gaming on windows

Arm its based in old Risc Machines

Love the bloopers 😅

Apart from the hardware, how's the state of Windows being closer to become just another flavor of Linux? This will also play a major role in the hardware compatibility.

This is like the 4th time MS has refloated ARM. Dumped. Refloated. Dumped. Refloated. In every case, the zealots point at their battery - Its still on after 20 hrs - as their party piece. In a windows world, paying for the arm battery life is a trade off with driver, system, performance, compat, the list is long - problems. I've watched multiple MS leadership talk up ARM to then do the silent toilet flush. I'd be a whole lot less vented spleen on this if MS had not been bad actors in this play. The end user got dumped repeatedly. An example is if you bought the RT kit, having decided to dump you and your kit, they declined to open up the bootloader so as to possibly allow the kit to be repurposed. No. They made a choice to create landfill. Each time, dumped. Apple - who create their own kind of hell, at least went arm and have not entirely screwed the pooch multiple times. Anyone going M1/M2 - while suffering the Apple garden issues, will at least not be going through the dumpster MS style.

What about Steam, can it run games perfectly?

Does Windows on ARM still have the Windows 95-era legacy interfaces buried inside, like the old control panel, or are all the interfaces new and shiny?

can someone please give me a nice windows on ARM device which is a tablet🥺 i really want it. for coding on the go

Meanwhile Arm Suing Qualcomm..

How the heck windows is faster on m1

Full Windows on a phone? Android had better look out. Please make a video on this possibility.

if they do this right, I might leave apple... might

Sorry man. But you do sound too positive ($$$) about Qualcomm chip's performance, without any type of transparent test it looks a lot like wishefull thinking

Did anyone see a mr mobile logo early on

Windows on arm with qualcomm oryon processor come in 2023

I like x86 more. It’s open source. Arm is closed. It’s more finicky installing a new OS onto an arm device than a x86 PC. Rom images are way too hard to find in my opinion. Like mobile roms. Can you give me the Rom image for the Sony Mylo? The Nokia n900? Can you run this on a different device? No. The driver compatibility issues are another problem. We should have a universal CPU that can run all architectures. Although it’s very far-fetched and probably will never exist. Not to mention you can’t upgrade the RAM of your ARM phone because the RAM is in the CPU, and most of all the components are in the CPU, as well as the rom, meaning you can’t upgrade anything in the phone

Windows on arm great

Hmmm. Some of this information about running all x86 apps through emulation seems to conflict with what I've been seeing from other reviews, where they point out that some programs either end up crashing after running in emulation after a while or not running at all....

windows on arm with Qualcomm Oryon cpu 2023

what they need to do is basically what Apple did, instead of playing with emulation, they should be creating a translation layer, something that basically read the x64 bit code, and converts it to arm binary, so that you actually gain much more performance than say an attempt to emulate. Emulation is very task heavy on the system hence why apps appear sluggish. But you have microsoft cutting employees

I never watched this but it was in my history mmmm

Windows on ARM pretty much a native Microsoft 365 device - it works very well with M365 end point. Nothing else

ARM is incompatible with gaming..

ORYON CRYON? ORYON ONYON? 🤣

You know you can just say ARM. You don't need to keep saying "ARM architecture". We know it's an ISA lmfao.

First

Windows on ARM is not Windows. It runs almost nothing. In fact, it's deceptive marketing.

Windows Is Dead.