The Dragon Lady Trope - Reclaiming Her Power

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2 жыл бұрын

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East Asian women onscreen have long been haunted by the figure of the Dragon Lady: a violent seductress who will do anything to achieve her goals. At the same time, the dragon lady is unapologetically driven, ultra-assertive, and has agency -- disproving the widespread assumption that Asian people must be “meek”.
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@thetake 2 жыл бұрын

@kittykittybangbang9367 2 жыл бұрын

Could you do a video about the dominatrix trope or how BDSM is portrayed in fiction/media

@saimaharaj109 2 жыл бұрын

Hi, I love what you guys are doing. Could you please do a video on this topic? Impregnation in horror movies, such as: Women getting impregnated by aliens. Women turning into bloated hives for alien reproduction. Women giving birth to a demonic child. Men getting impregnated by an otherworldly seductress. Misogynist, sexist, rape culture or just pushing a fear of aliens and demons? Is it possible to make a story arc where the woman that was impregnated, is recovering from this mental scarring?

@keziahmorris8079 2 жыл бұрын

Hey, can you do the mystery girl trope pls

@NoJusticeNoPeace 2 жыл бұрын

Raid is nothing but exploitative pay-to-win trash preying on people with addictive personalities. You shill for Raid, I unsub. Do better.

@HomerXXX 2 жыл бұрын

Great video like always ! But can you put the names of the movies your showcase scenes - in the video-disciptions! That would be great because I didnt know all the names of all the movies your show . That way I could watch them maybe be myself.

@RachelVaega 2 жыл бұрын

Mistress Ching from Pirates of the Caribbean is based on a real person; Ching Shih, one of the most successful and powerful pirates in history! Her story is actually amazing, I highly recommend looking into it! :)

@baxtersmom279 2 жыл бұрын

My favorite podcast, "The History Chicks", covered her in an episode.

@supr33 2 жыл бұрын

The Puppet History series on Watcher covered her story as well :)

@goddessnoir290 2 жыл бұрын

Thanks

@RachelVaega 2 жыл бұрын

@@supr33 I loved the Puppet History episode about her! To be fair though, I just love Puppet History in general haha

@missmeagan8117 2 жыл бұрын

Oral History podcast also covers her story!

@sindel545 2 жыл бұрын

Angry women in general are always seen as a negative stereotype which needs to change. For white women it's the 'femme fatal', for black women it's the 'sapphire', for asian women the 'dragon lady' and for latin women, the 'spicy latina'... Across years of film and TV, women have been steriotyped just for being angry or wanting revenge where male characters are seen as 'badass' and don't really have a stereotype for the same behavior. 🙄

@mpoemp4703 2 жыл бұрын

Thx for this

@egg_bun_ 2 жыл бұрын

This is the first time I've heard of a sapphire

@originalcosmicgirl 2 жыл бұрын

@@egg_bun_ It's a term not used as much today as it used to be. It's basically the "angry Black woman" stereotype. Sometimes, it has a bit of sexual exoticism and/or hypersexuality added to the mix.

@missmeagan8117 2 жыл бұрын

This!

@jordannewsom3606 2 жыл бұрын

Cry about it

@LeahWalentosky 2 жыл бұрын

I’m surprised Emperor Wu Zetian wasn’t mentioned. She ruled China just as ruthless as any male emperor and history disgraced her for it even accused her of witchcraft. She also did a lot for the common people, which is now being remembered. She also opened the Silk Road for trading. Her and the Dragon Lady have a lot in common. Humble origins with a pretty face. She was able to gain power through sex appeal. She also kept power through brutality. She made statues of herself, and was not written well by historians because she was a woman in power. She could be where the Dragon Lady stems from.

@LeahWalentosky 2 жыл бұрын

@@sheilawidjaja7331 in the film Empress Wu Tse-Tien a Chinese film from 1939 she is portrayed as using black magic to kill her daughter. She most likely did nether of those things.

@pillbugm8914 2 жыл бұрын

Recent shows in China have portrayed her differently without the whole witchcraft thing. She is still unfairly demonised however.

@LeahWalentosky 2 жыл бұрын

@@pillbugm8914 I’m a white American, and when had been fascinated with her story, do you know any such shows. I read about her in this book i had about powerful women when I was a child.

@Chris-rg6nm 2 жыл бұрын

This isn't a documentary on Chinese women

@LeahWalentosky 2 жыл бұрын

@@Chris-rg6nm how she has been viewed does hold a connection to the stereotype. Comes from a culture where submission was expected, used sex to gain power, ruthless in keeping power. These are traits of the dragon lady stereotype as well.

@PokhrajRoy. 2 жыл бұрын

“This country is the land of liberty for men of all nations…except the Chinese.” That line really cuts through.

@cbpd89 2 жыл бұрын

For being a national of immigrants, the USA is pretty bad at welcoming immigrants.

@morehero1 2 жыл бұрын

We're gonna build a new settlement. We'll have a happy new life, and we'll have equal rights for all. Except Blacks, Asians, Hispanics, Jews, gays, women, Muslims...Um ...everybody who's not a white man. And I mean "white" white, so no Italians, no Polish. Just people from Ireland, England, and Scotland. But from only certain parts of Scotland and Ireland. Just full blooded whites. No, y'know what? Not even whites. Nobody gets any rights. Ahhhh...America. What I thought when I heard this

@queentron17 2 жыл бұрын

@@morehero1 perfect response lol

@lindildeev5721 Жыл бұрын

Even worse is the fact that, when you think about it, "this country" has been the land of liberty for no one except white men.

@kiaraditmasa 8 ай бұрын

It has never been the land of liberty for Native and Americans so its a lie!

@seraqh 2 жыл бұрын

The fact that Lucy Liu makes up half of these clips just goes to show how few Asian American actresses are cast in prominent roles in Hollywood, but sure case Scarlett Johansson... 🙄

@working184 2 жыл бұрын

I agree with this but can we not put other women down to make a point?

@seraqh 2 жыл бұрын

@@working184 absolutely not, she took an opportunity from an Asian American actress, disregards the role she plays in upholding the white hierarchy in Hollywood and arguably did yellowface. Not a fan of her words and actions on this topic, in my opinion worthy of criticism

@bmwjourdandunngoddess6024 2 жыл бұрын

Scarlett Johnson pisses me off. Hate her. It’s sad that she’s Scarlet Witch. Scarlet is supposed to be a darkskin Romanian women too.

@bmwjourdandunngoddess6024 2 жыл бұрын

@@working184 Always saying “stop putting down other women” when it’s time to hold racist white women accountable . No we’ll gladly put them down. Cry.

@bmwjourdandunngoddess6024 2 жыл бұрын

@@seraqh Yes, STAND IN YOUR OPINION!

@chrissiek8706 2 жыл бұрын

Cristina Yang was one of my tv heroes in my teenage years: unapologetically badass surgeon, who knew what she wanted, knew her talents and strengths and did not let no man or woman to stand in her way. Overall awesome character.

@archer1949 2 жыл бұрын

Lucy Liu has done very well on first embracing and then subverting this image. She’s still playing the sexy badass where most actresses her age are being relegated to the mom or even Grandma.

@cqtaylor 2 жыл бұрын

As with Viola Davis, Lucy Liu should have been more well regarded in cinema if not for the rigidness of Hollywood casting.

@barbiquearea 2 жыл бұрын

I'm surprised Princess Azula from Avatar the Last Airbender wasn't mentioned or had a clip. She is without a doubt one of the most memorable dragon ladies to come out in recent decades. And she is an example of one who is not only power hungry, domineering and good at marital arts but can also literally breathe fire.

@chrystianaw8256 2 жыл бұрын

Azula is not a plot device though, she has a detailed back story compared to the traditional dragon lady trope.

@WaitingxInxSilence 2 жыл бұрын

Maybe because of her age? They talk a lot about sex as a weapon, which Azula doesn’t do, and including a minor from a kid’s show would be inappropriate.

@lordgeneralmilitantdeezy7550 2 жыл бұрын

@@WaitingxInxSilence I would point you to the oddly seductive way she talks to Zuko when sowing the seeds of paranoia in him as well as what Grey delisle said on a panel about what would happen if Zuko and Azula went on a journey together.

@noheterotho179 2 жыл бұрын

@@lordgeneralmilitantdeezy7550.. Oddly seductive? We might have watched different shows. I understand the use of seductive as a synonym for trickery but using the word seductive for a teenage girl is not the best choice.

@nullvoid6095 2 жыл бұрын

Don’t you diss on Azula’s character writing like that, bruh

@PokhrajRoy. 2 жыл бұрын

Lucy Liu is just Asian American Brilliance. I just wish we saw her in more movies.

@natashafigueroa9198 2 жыл бұрын

i really enjoyed her take on Watson in the US Sherlock show

@trinaq 2 жыл бұрын

@@natashafigueroa9198Seconded, she's a brilliant actress who is usually the highlight of everything she's in, along with Michelle Yeoh or Sandra Oh.

@PokhrajRoy. 2 жыл бұрын

@@natashafigueroa9198 Oh yes, she was brilliant!

@PokhrajRoy. 2 жыл бұрын

@@trinaq The Holy Trifecta of Asian American Brilliance .

@132karissanelson 2 жыл бұрын

In pirates of the Caribbean, Mistress Ching is based on Zheng Yi Sao, who did run a brothel and was terrifyingly brutal. I thought the movie portrayed her pretty well. But I can see how, without historical context, she could be seen as a dragon lady.

@kirag9509 2 жыл бұрын

But would anyone have known she was based on Zheng Yi Sao without the creators telling you she was based on Zheng Yi Sao? And do you think the actual Zheng Yi Sao would have allowed some rich white girl to control the pirate coalition? Zheng Yi Sao was so much so “that bitch” during her time that the British navy FEARED her. So to think she would cower from the British navy, let alone let some inexperienced white girl give her orders is fucking nonsense. Her whole character just reeked of token POC to help exoticize the pirates frackers

@VeeLondon1449 2 жыл бұрын

I’m just hope screenwriters create characters for Asian actors that have more range and deph.

@tyrant-den884 2 жыл бұрын

Hollywood: "Or, we give you more Akwafina?"

@zitronentee 2 жыл бұрын

@@tyrant-den884 The Farewell really hit me on many levels

@enbeast8350 2 жыл бұрын

We can just hire more Asian screenwriters, actors, POC in Hollywood in general, but noooo, that's too simple of an idea. Hollywood would never go for it

@trinaq 2 жыл бұрын

Please cover the "English Rose", the stereotype of a classic, beautiful English lady, who conforms to traditional feminine stereotypes. Evie from "The Mummy" could be an example.

@yeebler 2 жыл бұрын

There's nothing wrong with being those things.

@vysharra 2 жыл бұрын

@@yeebler they represent the privilege of being “appropriately” femme while also being wealthy/educated in a way only the upper class can be. Misogyny poisons everything about being a woman/femininity, including when they let “the right ones” exist in men’s spaces (but only so long as they behave, like Evie who suffers from the judgement of the men around her in Act 1 because she refuses to sit down and be quiet like a good aristocratic lady)

@giulianoaaronfrancoynsfran4858 2 жыл бұрын

@@vysharra i think i sort off agree with what you said, its not bad being traditionally femenine but they just paint it as a wealthy beutifull white woman, i do not think they should stop making femenine characthers but that they should stop making them all the same

@runningfromabear8354 2 жыл бұрын

@@yeebler There's plenty wrong with it. Coming from the England, I was put in a restrictive box of who I could and couldn't be. Only upper-middle and upper class England exists as per American's. It made living in the US a fucking nightmare and I was happy to get the fuck out and go home.

@inescastellano7960 2 жыл бұрын

I’d love this!!

@MnMsandOreos 2 жыл бұрын

Lucy Liu’s character in Why Women Kill is an excellent example of a deconstruction of the trope. Spoilers! At first she seems to be a complete dragon lady: she’s ruthless, money hungry, and seems to have seduced her husband for social standing. You also assume that she is going to be a ruthless murderer, based on the title and framing of the show. But when she finds out her husband is dying from AIDs, even though she knows he never loved her romantically (since he was gay), she realized they truly did love each other in a beautiful friendship way and helps him die on his own terms, even though it’s exceptionally hard for her. Her heart was never truly cold, she could pause her ruthlessness for sympathy, and she was not a cold hard killer

@Chris-rg6nm 2 жыл бұрын

Why don't people understand that tropes are just boilerplate characters? Writers learn the tropes to have a starting point for their characters and every character can't get a full rounded story line so they seem shallow on the outside.

@beverlyledbetter4906 2 жыл бұрын

Ziyi Zhang: another knockout, as is Ji Hyun Jun, Lucy Liu, Min Ah Shin...oh I can name so many!

@sheilawidjaja7331 2 жыл бұрын

For me, the question that I always ask is: why can't we just have well-written characters?

@normbreakingclown676 2 жыл бұрын

While i like these discussions it,s always the trope was usually they one dimensional that was based of sexist tropes how ever if you give these tropes more dept it,s no longer sexist They are not wrong but yeah.....

@tonyyounge9433 2 жыл бұрын

Racism or "social politics" or both

@sydposting 2 жыл бұрын

Xu Xialing in Shang Chi was originally supposed to have a Cool Asian Girl Hair Highlight, but her actress (Zhang Meng’er) personally nixed it, which I adore. She chose not to perpetuate that overdone trope and it made her character that much stronger.

@arielgonzalez9993 2 жыл бұрын

She still was meh for the reminder of the movie in favor of the marvel formula

@Mndz113 2 жыл бұрын

Christina Yang is trope breaking, in my humble opinion, because she is ambitious and sexual in spite of Asian stereotypes (not that she does so in spite of her ethnicity) she is ambitious and ruthless and sexual. Her mother isn’t a “tiger mom” but an interior decorator who just wants a daughter more like herself. It’s not said enough how ground breaking she a character and Sandra Oh herself as her actor are against these stereotypes. Thank you for coming to my Ted talk, I’ll come off my soap box. Loved this and all your videos!

@fiestadancers 2 жыл бұрын

Christina Yang was so compelling in Grey’s Anatomy. When I think of that show, I think of her performance during the hospital shooting and her ptsd after the plane crash. Wow, those performances are so memorable.

@Mndz113 2 жыл бұрын

@@fiestadancers even her more nuanced scenes. Where she emotes without words the conflicts within, her last season and the struggles in her friendship with Meredith and the realization of her dreams in Switzerland. Ugh. Iconic.

@fiestadancers 2 жыл бұрын

@@Mndz113 you’re right. Those are the scenes that built up her character. Without them, I would have been less impacted by the intense scenes. And there were many quiet moments that were effecting as well. Sandra Oh breathed fire into that role.

@skallywalla502 2 жыл бұрын

YES! I don't know how many years it's been, but I knew she was the strongest actress on that show when she sat in a conference room after the plane crash with bridal magazines open in front of her and said in this dazed voice "I'd like to talk about the flowers I'm thinking of." So subtle and unbelievably powerful. 🙌🏻🙌🏻🙌🏻

@Leiliel1 2 жыл бұрын

Really, the Dragon Lady is a lot easier to reclaim and make healthier than the Lotus Blossom, I think. Because, by definition, the Dragon Lady plays on fears of a woman having agency and power over her own sexuality. If this is treated as more aspirational and sympathetic, well, you've done a lot to de-other the character. And at least the DL...does things, by definition.

@Spicie95 2 жыл бұрын

I'll admit I haven't watched those Charlie's Angels movies in over a decade and I am not Asian, but I would think Lucy Liu has an point with her statement. Alex Monday wasn't supposed to represent every Asian person in the world, but she was an Asian woman in two major (female lead) Hollywood movies, which is still representation - even if the movies aren't exactly masterpieces.

@eduardaperes4630 2 жыл бұрын

I'm so glad Melinda May is mentioned, she's a great example of deconstructing this trope. btw agents of shield is full of well written and developed female characters.

@natalidadpared2591 2 жыл бұрын

I couldn't agree more 🙌

@nehcooahnait7827 2 жыл бұрын

I highly disagree with the second part of your comment. I really dislike the Jiaying character and the way they wrote stories around her.

@fortune_roses 2 жыл бұрын

Exactly. Personified as either a *flower or a sword* ... nothing in-between (like an actual human being who is "well-rounded")

@jessicavictoriacarrillo7254 2 жыл бұрын

Justice for the First Mrs. Mark Darcy. I loved Lucy Liu in "Set It Up" and "Why Women Kill"

@trinaq 2 жыл бұрын

Likewise, Lucy Liu is such an underrated actress, and she's usually always the highlight of any project she's apart of! 💜

@ephilx 2 жыл бұрын

This speaks as why part of the hate towards The Last Jedi's Rose Tico probably came from her not fitting into any of these two stereotypical extremes general audiences (and whiny star wars fans) are comfortable with.

@lee210294 2 жыл бұрын

Star Wars being the absolute worse? Color me shocked.

@sophiatalksmusic3588 2 жыл бұрын

Honestly, I didn't get the hate. I thought she was... fine? Like, she wasn't a fantastic character, but she wasn't awful, either. She was just sort of okay. I felt sorry for the actress though; she didn't deserve any of the hate.

@Chris-rg6nm 2 жыл бұрын

Wait no it doesn't. Plus she is Vietnamese not Chinese you racist.

@ephilx 2 жыл бұрын

@@Chris-rg6nm ok

@blondetiger3940 2 жыл бұрын

@@Chris-rg6nm So Vietnamese aren't asian now?

@jadziawynter9241 2 жыл бұрын

Can you guys go into detail about the Jezebel trope for black women? It's wide spread in hip hop Or about Voodoo/Hoodoo they're different but are thought to be the same and are always demonized and misunderstood

@Oberky 2 жыл бұрын

I didn't even know Hoodoo was a thing, but after googling it because of your comment, it seems like Hoodoo often gets portrayed as Voodoo in hollywood movies? Because it's often just about an individual that offers their powers and knowledge? Am I correct in that observation or am I still misinterpreting it? You really blew my mind there, thanks for giving me an opportunity to learn something new!

@goddessnoir290 2 жыл бұрын

I like this suggestion

@Vivalarosa45 2 жыл бұрын

"If my dad wont let me into his empire I'm going to build my own." Words to live by.

@kira411 2 жыл бұрын

I hope that someday I'll see a video on the topic of xenophobia towards Russians/Eastern Europeans in Hollywood. Anti-Slavic sentiment's almost always overlooked, although it has a history as long as racism

@mewesquirrel6720 2 жыл бұрын

@nehcooahnait7827 2 жыл бұрын

I have been binge watching Friends recently. In one episode an ethnic Russian character was very angry towards Joey, saying that he finds some American movies disrespectful to his people cuz Russians are always portrayed to be terrorists and villains. Here I am also watching Hawkeye… bad guys are Russian crime syndicates in sports suits

@bmwjourdandunngoddess6024 2 жыл бұрын

@@nehcooahnait7827 Now that you’re saying something, I’m noticing this too.

@hoangquanle3310 Жыл бұрын

OMG I cannot count how many American films I've watched where Eastern Europeans, Russians in particular but sometimes Serbs or Albanians, are villains.

@phodosanatka 2 жыл бұрын

Can you make a video on representation of Russians in Hollywood? I think there’s a lot to say. From using Russians as go to villains, to not casting Russian speaking actors, resulting in some awful Russian accents that even Russian speakers don’t understand…

@BloodOfMadara 2 жыл бұрын

😂I’m not even of Russian descent and I full heartedly agree! The accents are painful, and I mean painful to listen to. I do not understand why they’d rather cast an American actress from the south such as Jennifer Lawrence than a Russian speaking actress for red sparrow that’s one of the more recent examples, there’s plenty more. Also, there seems to be a disconnect in the understanding of their cultural and behavioral norms because they are apparently stiff people who don’t smile because there’s a Russian proverb that translates, roughly, to “laughing for no reason is a sign of stupidity.” I do not think they are cold people, but upfront and honest. It is in their actions, they will not put on fake, plastic smiles. They can speak like a punch to the mouth in terms of being direct, but they are a sincere people from what I’ve noticed.

@mewesquirrel6720 2 жыл бұрын

You're EVIL

@user-vm6lx5yx1k 2 жыл бұрын

You Squirrel is evil and behave yourself as some loser school boy who have no other option to up yours self-respect then to humiliate others. You are racist.

@aurea. 2 жыл бұрын

Yes!

@mewesquirrel6720 2 жыл бұрын

@@user-vm6lx5yx1k Russians are white people 🙂 Don't make us come into your country

@VidWatcher01 2 жыл бұрын

"Why do Chinese girls taste different from other girls?" Me:🤦🏾‍♀️😖

@alorapendrak9752 2 жыл бұрын

and this mr bond is why your female bed partners usually want to kill you.

@22rajiboo 2 жыл бұрын

Same. I visibly cringed, i couldn't believe.

@aurea. 2 жыл бұрын

I was taken aback by that line 💀

@katherineheasley6196 2 жыл бұрын

Michelle Yeoh was the best Bond girl ever. Yeah, I said it.

@jeanette8606 2 жыл бұрын

She's Malaysian and had studied ballet before featuring in Hong Kong films in mid 1980s, she has also worked with the best Hong Kong martial arts choreographers she also has proved she can do more than just action roles as well and is a versatile actress.

@starrsmith3810 2 жыл бұрын

I’m noticing a thing where people who put the Dragon Lady label on Asian characters that they make it out to be a BAD thing that they wear their cultures clothing

@clairekim2525 2 жыл бұрын

Yeah whether or not it’s a stereotype really depends on whether the media frames the clothing as “exotic” or just as an authentic part of their character

@edi9892 2 жыл бұрын

My favourite role of Lucy Lu was that of Watson in Elementary. That was a complex and yet believable character. In Kill Bill, she had a decent role, but not too remarkable. She didn't stand out neither positively nor negatively. My favourite aspect of it was how her tragic backstory connected to that little girl whose mom was an Assassin and died fighting the protagonist.

@kotalashe4628 2 жыл бұрын

I love these sm! You guys should do the "Indian Princess" trope! 💖

@gatorcroc7212 2 жыл бұрын

Uh for anyone who has an ounce of historical knowledge, the "Misstress Qing" character is based off of a real pirate warlord who was a Chinese Woman. And a complete badass.

@Amy_the_Lizard 2 жыл бұрын

Yeah, I was a little taken aback by her inclusion. I mean, I get that she fit the trope, but she was an actual person who was known for being an extremely successful pirate, allegedly dyed flags red with the blood of sailors who broke her code of conduct, and opened a brothel/casino after retiring. Honestly, I was kinda pleased they didn't hypersexualize her since she was originally a prostitute before becoming a pirate...

@kirag9509 2 жыл бұрын

Well if you had an ounce of historical knowledge, you would know that Zheng Yi Sao was very much “that bitch” during her life time, She was so powerful that the British navy, arguably the most powerful naval force of the time period, FEARED her. So to see her character reduced to some random pirate leader taking orders from some young, inexperienced, rich white girl is laughable. So yeah the creators “say” she was based on Zheng Yi Sao but her character portrayal was such a far cry from the actual Zheng Yi Sao that I would say that it’s not actually Zheng Yi Sao but just a lazy exotic POC insert to an already very white franchise

@silveryfeather208 2 жыл бұрын

@@kirag9509 Even though I hate pirates, I think the British Empire was worse, so I don't really feel bad that the British feared her.

@bnadira212 2 жыл бұрын

Lucy Lui is so pretty and such a well rounded actress 😍

@yolandacarroll558 2 жыл бұрын

Simply not writing her as a one dimensional character fixes so much of this trope. It's sad that when an Asian woman has power, ambition and owns her sexuality she has to be a villain. 😞

@jordannewsom3606 2 жыл бұрын

Well murdering 1000s of people is villainous lol. Common sense

@darlenegoodwin 2 жыл бұрын

There's no excuse for the massacre in Atlanta early this year. Because not all Asian women are what Hollywood still sees them.

@andilin5i69 2 жыл бұрын

As a asian male,I would love to see the evolution of asian males in Hollywood.

@user-bu9cy5if4d 2 жыл бұрын

So, now you could cover the "brutal tough Russian lady" trope, often east-european women are represented as well as relentless and heartless. Having seen this take, it seems similar, but different. Thanks for your work anyway!

@sophiatalksmusic3588 2 жыл бұрын

Paused this video to read the wikipedia page for Anna May Wong, and wow, she got snubbed a lot. There were multiple times where she was declined Chinese roles in favour of white actresses, at one point because she was said to be "too Chinese to play a Chinese [character]." At least she got some progressive roles during her career, and when she did, it's almost sad how happy she was to receive them, because she didn't get them a lot. On her role in the film "Daughter of Shanghai," where she played a sympathetic role- "I like my part in this picture better than any I've had before ... because this picture gives Chinese a break-we have sympathetic parts for a change! To me, that means a great deal." Edit: A commemorative coin with a picture of Anna May Wong is being released this year in a collection of coins featuring American women involved in arts, activism, and sciences.

@Star-Rose99 2 жыл бұрын

Do you think you could do the wallflower/shrinking violet trope.

@trinaq 2 жыл бұрын

Yes, please, it's one of my favourite tropes, probably because I used to embody it in my younger years.

@kittykittybangbang9367 2 жыл бұрын

It's the shrinking violet trope where a girl is really nice, kind, and shy?

@jessicavictoriacarrillo7254 2 жыл бұрын

And why we should all take a petal out of her book and let her bloom in her own space

@PokhrajRoy. 2 жыл бұрын

Anna May Wong was a brilliant performer but robbed of good opportunities. A tragedy indeed.

@Windona 2 жыл бұрын

Honestly Lucy Liu in any role would be top tier excellent. I do like the point Liu made about some characters being seen as a dragon lady solely because of her ethnicity- it sometimes feels like the pursuit of good rep can lead to people making overly narrow definitions of what good rep is.

@grapeshot 2 жыл бұрын

I suppose this stereotype can go hand-in-hand with the Asian tiger mom. I grew up around a number of Asians and trust me the whole tiger mom thing is a stereotype.

@lee210294 2 жыл бұрын

What's the Tiger Mom stereotype?

@helfulvids 2 жыл бұрын

@@lee210294 look up the book BATTLE HYMM OF THE TIGER MOTHER

@ninarances9074 Жыл бұрын

@@lee210294 It's a stereotype where Asian moms push their kids to exceed better in academics, jobs, and even hobbies. Even though it's a stereotype, it's still sorta true in real life. Tiger moms, like the Dragon Lady, are very strict and ruthless. And because of the pressure they put on their kids, it could lead to kids having mental health problems because of too much pressure and expectations put onto them. I don't have parents like that, but I'm sure many Asians do. Some are probably ok with their parents doing 'tiger parenting' because they grew to understand that their parents are just worried about their future and don't want them to fail and only want what's best for them. But there are probably some kids out there whose tiger parents' parenting skills pushed them too hard and affected them negatively. For the latter, there was this case of a person who killed her tiger parents because of their way of parenting (for the record, I do not know too much about the case, I only brought it up because of this topic).

@lee210294 Жыл бұрын

@@ninarances9074 Oh I see, kinda like the mom from that Disney movie Turning Red. And I hadn't heard of that case, but it sounds horrific 💀 Thanks for explaining!

@ninarances9074 Жыл бұрын

@@lee210294 Yeah Ming is a good example of a tiger mom. Right now, another character that reminds me of a tiger mom is Nicole from "Gumball". But I don't think she is that strict when it comes to her kids' studies and exceeding expectations. Yeah she gets mad when they get into trouble, but I don't think she pushes her kids to excell in school????? I don't remember any episode where she does that. But I guess her backstory kinda shows she was raised by tiger parents? And yeah, the case seems pretty horrific when I read a bit about it. You're welcome!

@tramainens 2 жыл бұрын

Like other comments have mentioned, I am genuinely surprised that Azula (The Last Airbender), Mother (Memoirs of a Geisha), and Empress Wu Zetian (Empress Wu) were not mentioned. I also feel like the dragon lady trope manifests in many K-dramas through a matriarch, single mother, stepmother, or mother-in-law. I wish the Take could do a series where they unpack all the racial tropes for each race in one vide: one video for Black American tropes (mammy, jezebel, and sapphire) and one video for East Asian tropes (dragon lady, lotus blossom, and tiger mother). It could be interesting to see how all three/four interact together on-screen and throughout history.

@Bloodark124 2 жыл бұрын

Thank you for calling it all out. Keep this up and dismantle all these harmful shit in the media.

@pendragon2012 2 жыл бұрын

Agent Melinda May is amazing! Also of note is Daisy Johnson, a half-Chinese character played by half-Chinese actress Chloe Bennett, in that show who is very kick ass but also the very definition of a hero.

@natalidadpared2591 2 жыл бұрын

OMG, you did include the only one Melinda May! A truly underrated Marvel character and a gem who should be appreciated more ✨🌈

@MrMikkyn 2 жыл бұрын

The sexy spicy submissive demure dichotomy happens in to every race in America. Black Maid vs Sassy Queen Latina Maid vs Spicy Latina Lotus Flower Girl vs Dragon Lady Mysterious Hijabi vs Spicy Arabian Woman

@CrickeyMushu 2 жыл бұрын

YES. I've been waiting for this one. Please do one on the lotus flower/china doll trope!!

@gangurogeisha 2 жыл бұрын

I’m sure you’ve found this out by now, but they already have a video on the topic.

@LikeTheProphet 2 жыл бұрын

Mistress Ching was based on Zheng Yi Sao, who became SO POWERFUL and led such an unspeakably enormous naval force, that the emperor at the time literally paid her to retire. She then opened a fancy brothel and lived the rest of her days in quiet managerial luxury. Tbh, I don’t see that as “dragon lady stereotype” so much as “Tuesday,” if you’re as badass as she was.

@SlapstickGenius23 2 жыл бұрын

Finally, the classic old dragon lady villainess trope has become a shadow of its recent descendant, the contemporary badass dragon lady heroine.

@courtneytovar1880 2 жыл бұрын

Amazing video, as always.

@Aaarandom 2 жыл бұрын

One of my favorite channels 💗

@RenaG 2 жыл бұрын

Video starts at 3:50

@sirensblood4177 2 жыл бұрын

Thank you for mentioning Shohreh Aghdashloo. She's not nearly mentioned or appreciated enough as she should be

@user-lo6lj8fc8e 2 жыл бұрын

I think it would be interesting to watch about Russian women on screen

@user-vm6lx5yx1k 2 жыл бұрын

Agreed

@genvalencia1740 2 жыл бұрын

Yas! More POC content please and thank you. :)

@MrMikkyn 2 жыл бұрын

I love Dragon Lady, and I love Lucy Liu and I love her in Quentin Tarentino's Kill Bill. I had no female asian role models growing up. But powerful asian women in Hollywood has always been able to provide me with them. Especially with Wachowski films.

@nitzangly13 2 жыл бұрын

Ohh the amount of work lucy liu had done is amazing! She's awesome!!!

@christopherbrunson1232 2 жыл бұрын

I love this channel

@sculptureofsound2 2 жыл бұрын

I agree with everything but O-Ren from Kill Bill did have a back story

@chanmarr8118 2 жыл бұрын

12:35 They mentioned she has a back story so a character was something more.

@jessmith7324 2 жыл бұрын

Mistress Chang of Pirates was based on a real life person. Other facts not withstanding.

@esunadeluna 2 жыл бұрын

Is it stupid of me that I never thought of the dragon lady as Asian? I always thought if she had the typical traits, she would be a dragon lady, never thought if that ethnicity..😓

@jasminw6462 2 жыл бұрын

Never been this early!!✌🏼

@romewilliams3526 2 жыл бұрын

Ikr

@PyanY 2 жыл бұрын

Could've mention xiao long nu ( little dragon maiden), the total opposite of the dragon lady troupe

@Byrnzi360 2 жыл бұрын

Lucy Liu is a great adaptation of the character John Watson.

@ernestfox4880 2 жыл бұрын

Why not reference "Memoirs of a Geisha"? An American produced film and Gong Li was EVERYTHING! Wait...can't be a "Dragon Lady" depicting East Asian women in their own culture. Or is it because, westerns we're not involved...WAIT...The Hot Springs scene...🤔

@kirag9509 2 жыл бұрын

I mean……they never said that Hatsumomo WASNT a dragon lady so I don’t understand this argument? And your statement, “depicting East Asian women in their their own culture,” perpetuates the Asian monolith stereotype. Almost all the female actresses in the Memoirs of a Geisha were played by Chinese actresses. So to say that Chinese women playing Japanese characters = them playing “their own culture” is super weird because they are not “in their own culture”

@passiveagressive4983 2 жыл бұрын

Lucy Liu is an icon❤️

@SlayerNinaFriki 2 жыл бұрын

I don't know if you have done this before, but what about sexual abuse/rape as a backstory trope?

@zenmaster24 2 жыл бұрын

the character in lovecraft country is not a dragon lady - she is a Kumiho

@anneschaeffer7977 2 жыл бұрын

I love how half these characters are Lucy Liu

@brandihyman1984 2 жыл бұрын

People have called me dragon lady I had no idea where it stems from thx ❤

@fweeeeeeeep 2 жыл бұрын

Would love to see you talking more about indigenous / native american/global south indigenous representation !! Especially women. Ignored and still stereotyped more than any other group imo.

@silveryfeather208 2 жыл бұрын

The worse trope I hate is anything that has to do with women 'using' their sexuality as a weapon. It's so gross and reinforces the incel mindset that 'wome are controlling' or something.

@valeriecee54 2 жыл бұрын

So far, Raya and Namaari are the best forms of dragon lady representation in the media.

@genevieveowusu885 2 жыл бұрын

How so?

@rroketa 2 жыл бұрын

id be interested in seeing a vid on the cool, 'swag' asian trope

@ECPlex 2 жыл бұрын

one of the most famous pirates was a lady like the one in "Pirates of the Caribbean" Zheng Yi Sao

@jeanette8606 2 жыл бұрын

If you want to see real Chinese actresses watch Hong Kong films. Hollywood will always stereotype ethnicities. Maggie Cheung Man Yuk is one of Hong Kong's most well known and versatile actresses I'd put here up but then again I am biased towards classic Hong Kong films.

@tintedcherry 2 жыл бұрын

THIS! I love watching wong kar wai’s and hou hsiao hsien’s films bc everything was very artistically captured

@jeanette8606 2 жыл бұрын

@@tintedcherry yeah Wong Kar Wai’s best films are the Cantonese versions of As Tears Go By (1988) and The Days of being Wild (1990) both with Maggie Cheung 👍🏻 I haven’t seen any of Hou Hsiao Hsien’s films only Raise The Red Lantern (1991) which he produced.

@tintedcherry 2 жыл бұрын

@@jeanette8606 you should try millennium mambo, the soundtracks are top tier and it has the best opening, ever known to man kind in cinematography of all time. I rewatched it just to see shu qi narrates her life as Vicky in the zhongshan land bridge in a slow motion. I haven’t been checking out a lot of wkw’s films so I’d definitely try to catch up on it

@bloodmongerzero4431 Жыл бұрын

Basically dragon lady is an asian femme fatale

@NidoWeena 2 жыл бұрын

There is a reason Fry from Futurama falls in love with a Lucy Lui clone - she's fkn awesome.

@Mila-OPetr 2 жыл бұрын

I don't know, when I was a kid, it felt empowering to see acknowledgement that women can be strong, powerful, strong leaders. I knew that power how you use this power depends on you. But the recognition that a woman can have that power was amazing and inspiring. Also, perhaps I don't understand it fully, since I am not Asian. By the way, I don't think I personally being a child ever linked evil qualities to Asian people because of this trope, possibly since they were often opposed by positive Asian characters (like the ones played by Jackie Chan)

@clairekim2525 2 жыл бұрын

The issue is not those traits themselves, but the fact that there are soooo many “dragon lady” type characters that specifically treat East Asian women characters as non-human in a sense, and that show their (sometimes positive) traits of seductiveness, cunning, and power to be explicitly **racialized** instead of just being part of their character, and framed as “exotic,” “foreign,” and “threatening” which creates that mental link between race and villainy in real life too. If you’re interested, there’s the related, more general idea of Yellow Peril, which the Dragon Lady trope can be traced back too.

@moustik31 2 жыл бұрын

I didnt realise, there were so many BIPOC actors and actresses in Black & White movies. This is something, I'd love to study more.

@PokhrajRoy. 2 жыл бұрын

Btw I love the MERCH!

@screllin 2 жыл бұрын

The thing is I've never thought of any of these characters as dragon ladies, so maybe that's on the person watching and how they interpret what they are watching.

@Jimholy 2 жыл бұрын

Love Christjen Avaserala

@derred723 2 жыл бұрын

1:00 What the hell was that? She jump near her? Was that supposed to be a kick? lol.

@mafiagirl.elizzq Жыл бұрын

I just want peace between the east and the west as a mixed girl

@favouriteghost 2 жыл бұрын

At 11:00 the quote "And did it break his heart?" and Lucy Liu's response "I do that sort of thing" - what is that from??

@tabathastaples7884 3 ай бұрын

Shepherd's Chapel Network !!!!!!! Do you have the Gift / Spiritual Discernment ???????

@BlackReshiram 2 жыл бұрын

NOOOOO THE TAKE. DONT FALL FOR THE DARK SIDE. DONT LET RAID: SHADOW LEGENDS TAKE YOU

@giannix1395 2 жыл бұрын

This is kinda similar to the spicy Latina trope

@doorhinge2039 Жыл бұрын

0:03 I'm a drunk dude watching this lol

@mankytoes 2 жыл бұрын

"Asian women are super submissive"- tell me you don't know any Asian women without actually telling me (usually confusing "quiet" with "submissive").

@crystalcastillo7575 2 жыл бұрын

These tropes always go from one extreme to another. It's sad that women can never just Be, we always have to have some type of cliche attached to us AND I'm OVER IT!!!

@user-pm9pw6cj4c 2 жыл бұрын

Please make a video on how South Asians often get excluded when describing "Asians" in general

@ashleightompkins3200 2 жыл бұрын

I'd love to see a video on tiger mom's and education mama's.

@singingacapellasongsmusicc3205 2 жыл бұрын

I like that many actors & actresses want to give their characters more depth or not make tropes , less ethnic.

@davidhoj 2 жыл бұрын

the ole yellow fever

@Elfos64 2 жыл бұрын

I thought dragon lady just meant non-combative yet commandingly tough as nails, not sexual dominant nor necessarily Asian. One of my co-workers (who was a white accountant) at my old job was dubbed the dragon lady because she was tough on uncooperative customers when it came time for them to pay the bills.

@kirag9509 2 жыл бұрын

The term “dragon lady” definitely derives from (East) Asian stereotypes. Similar to how the term “tiger mom” also derived from (East) Asian stereotypes. But unlike to term “tiger mom,” the term “dragon lady” has lived in the American cultural lexicon for so long that people forget it originated from (East) Asian stereotypes. In fact, the first mention of “Dragon Lady” was arguably in “Terry and the Pirates” and it specially referred to a Chinese woman. And combined with the Yellow Peril (also going on at the same time) the term “dragon lady” caught on and was almost exclusively used to refer to East (and sometimes South East) Asians. But I agree with you that I have never really thought of dragons ladies as sexually dominant or sexual in general. But then again, because Hollywood often portrays Asians as inherently sexual, I can see why the sexual part is also inherently attached to the term “dragon lady”