Great video, AmorSciendi! But, when you were talking about how art doesn't "do" anything, I couldn't help but recall Brian Eno's recent explanation of art: Art is all the things we don't have to do. For example, we need to eat, but we don't need cuisine. We need to cover ourselves, but we don't need fashion. We need shelter, but we don't need architecture. Art is one of the most basic human traits, as we have been uselessly beautifying our surroundings since we lived in caves. We don't need music, but without it some of us wouldn't consider life worth living. So, maybe (just maybe) what art "does" is to make life worth living. That's a pretty important function. Oh, yeah, I'd just like to add: If Eno is correct about art, then it won't end until humans are extinct.

Thanks for this. I learned a lot, and there's so much to unpack it's hard to know where to start. It seems to me that the focus on Plato and Hegel leaves out half the story. We overlook the Aristotelean idea that an artist does not simply imitate nature, but creates something new--that is, the work of art itself. And Plato never seems to entertain the notion that art might exist in the realm of ideas as much as anything else does.

Thank you Amor Sciendi . . . . wow! what a fabulously clear 'gathering' of so many threads of discourse around what art is, what it does, where its been and what's here now. I read Danto's The End of Art and his What Art Is recently and was stimulated but also overwhelmed. Listening to this twice (and I will listen again) was like someone opening the door of a very stuffy room and letting a fresh spring breeze blow through. I cannot begin to express how grateful I am for the work of scholarship, compression, interlacing , capaciousness, pure scope, and brilliant communication that you've created here. You've been of true service to me (and I'm sure to many others). You are a brilliant teacher. I'll be one of your Patreon patrons as long as you're doing such powerful work.

Thank you, what a great, insightful presentation, a very rare find on this platform. A gem indeed!

Thank you for sharing your broad and rich understanding of art so clearly. I probably got more out of this video than the many years of art history classes through out my formal education.

wow ! I'm instantly a fan and will DEFINITELY be checking out all your other videos. Thanks SO much for showing us the direction YT should be taking with it's entire platform...deeper examinations and LESS knee-jerk reactions.

These ideas have been swirling around in my brain, thank you Amor Science for contextualizing it so beautifully.

Okay, mind sufficiently blown. A lot to take in, concisely and sincerely expressed, thank you.

"The only excuse for making a useless thing is that one admires it intensely. All art is quite useless.” OSCAR WILDE

Thank you so much for providing so much context and tying it all together, fantastic video!

In a nutshell: Danto argued that art has historically been defined by its ability to represent or embody certain aesthetic qualities, and it has gone through various stages and movements throughout history. However, with the advent of modern art and the rejection of traditional aesthetics, Danto claimed that art had reached a point where there were no longer any essential criteria or boundaries that could define what is or is not art.

Interesting video, but I find it sad that, as an artist who has lived and breathed art as a career and otherwise, that absolutely nothing I love about art is even remotely addressed in this video. I appreciate you sharing the views of these philosophers, and your explanations of their philosophy, but nothing could be more far removed from the thoughts and life of an actual artist. In my opinion at least. Someone who paints, someone who sketches, someone who sculpts with the aim to develop their skills, to create something beautiful and meaningful to them, to tell stories with their art and reach people with their chosen form of expression… the lens through which an actual artist views the meaning and purpose of art is removed from this discussion entirely.

this is a good- BUT THE EMOJI PAINTING BEHIND YOU I CANT

Wonderful, thoughtful, critical analysis. I really enjoyed! Thank you for posting! ❤

This video was so thought provoking and interesting, after watching I went immediately and joined your Patreon. Keep up the good work.

This was amazing. Great presentation ❤

Thank you for your work and for sharing your knowledge and thoughts with us.

Extraordinary. Made me think so differently about the idea of depiction as conviction, only to have the idea turned on its head. Compelling ideas here, and now I want to read more of Danto. Such resonant depth of research, related with precision and clarity. I look forward to all the podcasts. Exhilarating way to have one's ideas renewed.

I appreciate the amount of work that went into this video. Clearly a labor of love. It definitely taught me a few things and gave things to think about as I pursue my own vision of what art is.

This is great, thank you for this invaluable lesson.

There is something fantastically freeing but equally terrifying about the claim that art does not have boundaries anymore. Thank you for this fascinating video on the intersection between art, history and philosophy!

This was really interesting and offered insights I hadn’t considered before. Thank you!

Great ! Thank you for your time and explanation.

fantastic! concise and incisive without feeling like a mere synopsis. I had been thinking in terms of every medium reaching a point where it is incapable of creating anything genuinely new (baring an unforeseen technological advancement in tools/raw materials) at which point it resorts to quotation and pluralism. This video is forcing me to reevaluate. Thanks.

Wonderful video. I've always thought about how art movements have defineable time periods, but with the introduction of the internet, vasts amount of art movement microcosms are constantly being born, and constantly dying. The art world has become so volatile and so complex now that it's within everyone's hands.

So many thought provoking points in this video. Thank you for sharing!!

This is just brilliant!

I haven't heard of 'retinal art' before, but it perfectly encapsulates what I like about art (and recontextualises my undying love for art nouveau). I appreciate the philosophy input, but I'll stick to my pretty paintings, sculptures and furniture ;) Thank you so much for this video, even if the conclusions I reach are so different from yours

Thought provoking ideas about art which I will have see again and again. One of the ideas that came to my mind is that lots of contemporary art I see to comes with, or requires a commentary by the artist or or an art critic, to explain to the viewer what the resulting painting or sculpture is about or means. There is a part of me that is feels, or believes, or questions that if an art work needs an explanation to understand, or comprehend, or appreciate it, then the artistic endeavor is more of a ‘trick” or hoax. Now I will begin to question that idea or criticism. Thank you.

Thank you for your summary. I have just read this book. Now everything is on place.

Another great video, really interesting to see how things have moved on since I studied Art History back in the late 80's

Thanks for this really good reflection.

Really high quality survey and analysis of the issue and relevant theory

Definitely thought-provoking. Thanks, and Happy Trails

You have tied together so many of the dangling loose treads of knowledge learned over my life. This video now ranks as a one of the Top Five in my list of MUST SEE on KZfaq. Thank you for being such an effective teacher!

So glad I found this!

Excellent Video, thanks so much for uploading!

thank toy for the interesting video. in some point i had to slow it down so i can keep up with all the ideas...

Really great video, you were able to explain complex philosophical position's in a lucid and concise way that made it accessable to a broad audience. Well done.

Really good video that covers so many things like art, philosophy, association with time (context), emotion, technical change (camera) and so forth. This video in a short period, rationally covers so many ideas rather well.

excellent. thank you for thr review and the logic of Danto

Clear, educational and delightful!

I really enjoyed this video. Thanks!

so much knowledge in a single video i love itttt

Great video. I am an artist, I am not dead. Have you read the book, Art and Physics: Parallel Visions in Space, Time and Light by Leonard Shlain? It is about how artist see it first then science follows, ie. first Giotto then Galileo. Its a great read about the parallel developments of Art and Physics. Thank You!

many thanks/ glad to have found this talk

Excellent! So much to ruminate on here…

Wow! that was great! Thank you for one of the best lectures I´ve listened to in quite a while. I learned from it. Thank you.

Great talk… made me Think - and I love that. Now I need to explore ✌🏼

Well done, Amor. Instant subscriber.

Thank you for this vidéo ! It is liberating . I am not crazy to enjoy both ancient art and modern art in very different ways 😊

A rhyme of mine. Time defines the rhyme From the macabre to the sublime Time, an infinite line Through verse, defined.

I’m so glad I listened to this throughout. I found myself strongly disputing where I thought this was going initially, but it’s marvellously tied up at the end . Thank you. I absolutely agree that the schism comes from the chemical plate process, and the birth of photography. Hockney was done some invaluable exploration in this field I think. So I found myself grasping for a quote from Nietzsche at the start, which admittedly may not be as purposeful as I first thought, but I still think it demonstrates in some regard the self actualisation that art has undergone - “Had we not approved of the arts and invented this type of cult of the untrue. The insight into general truth and mendacity that is not given to us by science. The insight into delusion and error as a condition of cognitive and sensate existence, it would be utterly unbearable. Honesty would lead to nausea and suicide. But now our honesty has a counter force that helps us avoid such consequences. Art has the goodwill to appearance, as an aesthetic phenomenon its existence is still bearable to us. And art furnishes us with the eye and hand, and above all, the good conscience to be able to make such a phenomenon of ourselves “

WONDERFUL TITLE / PREMISE. I'LL WATCH THIS ASAP. I've never seen this channel before‼️ Liked and Subscribed 🙋🏼‍♀️❤️🙋🏼‍♀️💜🙋🏼‍♀️❤️🙋🏼‍♀️

thought provoking video Thank you.

Art is the ACT of creation in which you enjoy the creation thereof in the present moment. What becomes of the work afterwards is immaterial.

Great video great explanations!

Lovely stuff. Cheers.

I paint, and acquired a degree from an art school thirty years ago. Though I do, in fact, read and enjoy philosophy, it has nothing directly to do with my painting, and the remark that conceptual art "looks like philosophy" made me smile. This touches upon a central criticism of the contemporary "art world", that it's easy to mimic process or content by being inscrutable. Of note here, the word "like", which can be a synonym for "pretension". Secondly, though Picasso couldn't stop Franco, nor did anyone else, so why pick on art? Thirdly, I've always wondered why painters have to justify their work, while poets and musical composers are not only allowed to engage in, but are even celebrated for their capacity to obtain lyrical sophistication. When I was in school, the word "beauty" was banned, and the worst pejorative imaginable was "decorative", which of course rendered painting, per se, somewhat difficult. I eventually overcame my naïveté by realising that everything in this world is a business, and the "conceptual" was the ideal golden vessel for reification, richly rewarding. What exactly is Jeff Koon's talent, what his contribution to human society?

Very enlightening, thanks

Thank you very much for this outstanding lecture

Excellent synthesis and presentation, trying to be as fair as the format allows to both philosophy & art, very informative and refreshing, much appreciated kind Sir.

Nice work. ❤

thanks, this video really with my presentation in philosophy!

Extremely clearly explained.

Beautiful way of speaking, thanks.

good video ... educational ... the fact that we have both artists as well as philosophers (and politicians etc) trying to 'make an impact' on other people's lives is a good thing no matter what ... but when one group tries to *totally* discredit another group, then we certainly have serious problems there that particular group(s) better deal with ASAP before it's too late, or disasters could (and have) happen(ed) as history is the best witness to that ...

Excellent summary and analysis. The fact that you closed with a viewpoint is also appreciated. Posters don't always do that. So thanks. That said, a few questions: 1. You say philosophers "relegated" art to expression and emotion. Is emotion also a form of truth inquiry? Can truth only be found or discovered by the application of reason, not intuition? Can something "feel true", and be true, even if one cannot explain it logically? To further this, can a full grasp of a given truth be reached with reason only, absent a feeling of that truth? 2. Art had no reason or utility. This is the narrative philosophers tried to dump art into, unsuccessfully you argue, by stating that it was impotent. But before we get to your conclusion, which argues, correctly one could say, that philosophers failed in this nefarious attempt. Does emotion have a role in the utility or use of an idea or happening or person even? What moves a person to act? Is it not feeling? Reason can and perhaps should provide the structure within which an action is taken, a movement made. But is it not feeling that provides the fuel for that action? Are they not like dance partners, switching leads depending on the time and place of the dance, but dancing most cohesively and beautifully when they are joint/move as one? 3. Perceptual equivalence: how do we know what something really is, is it by its closest or most accurate physical depiction whether in repose or movement? Or is it by searching for a glimpse into its inherent or intrinsic qualities or values? Its nature? The Portrait of Dorian Gray by Oscar Wilde, for example, examines this. What was the most accurate depiction of Dorian Gray, according to that tale. In other words, does art posses in addition to its "mimetic properties" as you put it, revelatory potential? 4. Pluralism. If this is where art, or at least the progression of Western art (paintings and sculpting mostly, as you point out, but perhaps even other forms of art like music and literature, as I think you imply), is this not to suggest that in the overarching debate about where Western art is progressing toward, Friedrich Nietzsche has won over Friedrich Hegel? For rather than Hegel's historical dialogues between different ages & cultures, where Western art appears to have ended at is Nietzsche's Perspectivism. The view that there is no one direction in art seems to draw from Nietzsche's there is no absolute view of truth, all viewing is attached to some perspective. So did he seed contemporary art? Once again, this is an excellent summary and analysis. Thanks for making and sharing it. I have subscribed.

Hey! You taught at Ross school! Fascinating video, gave me a lot of pause. Thank you.

Solid analysis, congrats

You never hear about “the end of sports” or the “the end of business”, or the “end of audio-visual storytelling”….just art.

you are just brilliant! thank you, fantastic

Really useful thanks, I wonder how known Luhmann's Art as a Social System is in Art Theory

I totally agree with the.complete 25:20 absence of value atributed to technique and meaning and mystery which are the true components or lasting art

The book to check out is Elie Faure's History of Art

Nice video on describing Danto's book and influence. The narrator here reflects greatly on Danto's book, especially within the philosophical viewpoints. I enjoy reading Arthur C Danto's After the End of Art, if only that I need to open to a random page every few days, and read his excellent art and related philosophy vernacular. I keep a glossy soft cover copy with me at all times, in my business valise, that a lady friend gave me some years ago. She had many handwritten footnotes on the pages. Also as a somewhat accomplished artist in the technical field of scientific and astronomy art, which my works have been published by NASA many times, I can't help but to think of a phrase I saw some years ago in the local newspapers during a big art event here in Portland Oregon. Art is not a product, it's a process. I find many people discussing it as only in the post process, as only a product, to either sell or critique. I see very few artists or commenters here, that are perhaps not artists, as to why they may only speak of art as if only a completed project, but very few mention the process of producing art.

Just an outstanding video that earned you at least one Patreon sponsor, eager to check out your other videos. Sounds like Danto had an experience with the Brillo boxes like the one I had in Marfa Texas many years ago. Donald Judd has a bunch of stuff down there, and I don't know about now, but at that time there was a community of Minimalist and Post-Minimalist, whatever the difference is, artists exhibiting all over this little town, true believers far from New York and dreams of winning the big prize. I was confronted with art that was so close to nothing, but that also did have some sort of visual appeal, not just conceptual...haven't stopped thinking about it since. It's a wonderful thing when art actually startles your eyes open. I do wonder from your description what Danto thought Warhol had added, why he didn't think art stopped with Duchamp. Maybe because it wasn't Duchamp who startled him that day.

Loved it. Subscribed. Not sure agree with Danto, but I do agree to the extent of your final comments: pluralist, stimulating and provoking thought - yes; but having ended in philosophy... apples and oranges (says metaphysicist) Even had a bit of a problem understanding how he gets to that conclusion, the Hegel-Warhol thingy.. I'm afraid seems a bit contrived (to me), but actually loved the rest of his argument - and yours! Thanks for that. Cheers.

I've been to many art museums, and every other. I don't always read the stories behind the images, because stories are mostly fictional. I enjoy looking at art, but like you explain it is just images that people created many years ago. I don't really care about the stories. It is sad that the people were not as famous then. I'm an artist also, but I don't place a high value on anything that I create. What I think means nothing to the world. My art work doesn't mean anything. This is why my thoughts on art doesn't matter. I create it, because I enjoy it. I don't create it to change the world, or share the end of times. People always have a story to tell. Probably they will have stories to tell about a chewing gum wrapper they find in the near future. The tales they tell for entertainment these days is something else. Not everything have meaning.

Thank you for this, this is art ❤

Good stuff thank you!

Great video!

This video and your channel are amazing subscribed Any thoughts on Hegel’s view of art particularly the idea of the zeitgeist or spirit of the times seems similar to Danto

As a contemporary artist myself this video very concisely the argument I have against most “retinal art” in how it is a product and not an artwork

I was surprised the end of art was not attributed to Duchamp in full by purposely cutting out the heart of traditional visual aesthetics, an enduring checkmate.

I like many of the things you say. Painting sculpture music and more can be art. Even a sound or the uncarved block of wood. Just because I can not see 'it' as art does not make it so. Thankfully! I have gone back years later to find amazing surprises. Feels like a connection too... Everything for just a moment... Sometimes. Amazing!!!

Great work.

Well put.

Great talk/setting out of issues. Is the end of art the realisation .. I and a separate Uni-verse .. is an illusion? One .. all that is was and will be and no-thing. The end of art, the end of the centre, the end of boundary. Infinite.

One issue I had during the majority of the opening was your varying use of the word 'art' to mean either visual art or art as a general concept. For example, Plato may have opined that 'art' is a reflection of a reflection, as you put it... but he also thought (like Confucius) that music shaped the fabric of society and he had all kinds of opinions about the exact musical rules that should be followed to promote certain emotions and values in the minds of the general population. When you bring poetry and jazz into the mix and re-emphasise how certain philosophers had no time for 'art', I legitimately do not know whether you are referring to visual art (sculpting, painting) or everything. Apart from that, I very much enjoyed this. Thanks very much.

Thank you!!!

Great vid my dude. I'd love to see a video where you expand on the thoughts you close with and investigate where the holes in the approach is. As an artist I'm deeply concerned with all of this!

Interesting play on words. The end of art. To what ends will it go? No end is final. Art marches on, signifying whatever the artist and audiences want to signify. We make it all up.

you are right: contemporary art is blatantly about philosophical issues and often is straining for self-importance. Your explanation has softened my attitude, or sometimes cynical predisposition, to seeing what a museum considers important "art". Much contemporary art is not really about a "retinal" vision at all- like Duchamp proclaimed to abjure. Nor is the art presented even visionary... sometimes nothing more than hyperbolizing current ideologies in our faces-- but then perhaps that what it always was, as you pointed out? ! Having revealed that bias of mine, I realize that I also am bored with mimetic art, and despite my likes or dislikes, am more often captivated by the effrontery of both the museum and the "artist" or social commentator-cum-"artist". thank you for this broad sweep of an evolution of art. Truly. thank you.

We need to define how the word “art” is being used here and with Danto. (The End of the) the philosophical discourse of art, the academic linear development of art as a discipline, the conventional critic and market based hierarchy of art, and so on. Medium is literally what it says. It’s in between being and experience. Thought/concept is still a medium. So, yes, it’s problematic lol. And this is a youtube comment, so I’ll get to the punch. Art as a cultural, social, economic entity is pretty impotent at the moment. BUT, as an endeavor for an individual it is as rich as ever. I started oil painting this past winter at the age of 45. It has improved my life and my relationship with the world that I see. Just as playing and recording music made all of music, including birdsong and water and wind, all the more beautiful. I got all tangled up with post modernism and critical theory decades ago and it led nowhere. Life and time is too precious to get lost in a maze of rhetoric and negation. There is no conclusion. There is no absolute good or bad. Seek and find and push your own boundaries.

Gosh, thank you! I would love to find some discussion of other art histories beyond Western and European. Huge topics, l realize. But Hockney has presented some discussion of the way Eastern scroll paintings work to, in the end, influence Cubism. And Picasso and African masks…but there must be more.

Very interesting indeed. I am an artist as well. It is giving me things to think about and new reasons create.

That was incredible

Excellent video.

After watching this very well done video and chewing on the content for while.... philosophy is like dating someone long distance online and playing head games for your whole life and sitting in shadows trying to understand shadows. Art feels like love, joy, peace, sunshine, a happy marriage, children playing, loving pets, a garden in the backyard, birds singing, and sparkles on crystal clear water. I don't think they mix well without it being a mental tail chase of depression and anxiety and mania that I just can't waste time on or I'll create nothing for no one and end up in a hospital hahahaha. Thanks for the video! I learned a lot as I overthought my overthinking that was overthinking what I overthought... until I couldn't think anymore and just decided to love