I was in this exact boat. Saw the drama videos but never clicked!

SAME! Heard they were shit before, but didn't know exactly why. Hannah breaks it down in such a digestible way!

me neither!! i remember a few years back, a youtuber i love to watch said they were no longer supporting them so i was like “okay cool ill stay away” haha

Same! And I own a few Lime Crime products! I always wondered!

Same!! I remember years ago hearing about it and trying so hard to find more info about it but never could so I low key forgot about jt

Came here to say something similar, glad to see this point being made.

Thank you for this addition, super helpful and interesting to read!

this!!! lol as a lolita the images she used too made me slightly cringe😭😭

Yes yesss 👏 I really hope people know this

Maybe Doe was pulling from the novel Lolita?? Which is really gross too because it’s about a sexually exploited 13 year old

Reading this as I pack lunches for my husband and kid. 2004… what I would give for it to be Freshman year again 😓

I took psychic damage when she said that 😔

me too, i was born in 06 and it’s scary knowing how fast time goes

@@alexisemo6002 i was born in 1996 👀

Ahhh those good old days. Back when I wasn’t born yet. Best time of my life

Exactly. She literally said she did it bc she knew it was offensive and wanted to push the envelope. 🙄

Say it louder for the people in the back 👏🏻

From what I've read, Doe Deere herself is russian jewish (or at least claims to be). Which possibly makes the whole thing even worse

@@rotebohne8033 How the f--k is dressing up like Hilter mocking him? Like seriously, WTF is the point of this comment besides to justify trash ass behavior lol? Probably why you put this BS in someone else's comment vs. making your own because you knew you would get rightfully roasted for such a BS position lol.

She wanted attention. And she got it. Narssist are gonna Narssist. She will not stop. The best is we can all ignore her. Or pretend we have no idea who she is.

Meanwhile I had gardening gloves and plastic bags over my hands trying to remove a dead pigeon from my front yard 🙃 wtf is she on and low key where can I get some because I would also like to stop living in reality for a little bit

@@chelscara hmm. Behaving in ways one could believe of someone seen to be doing something hazardous for health, giving the impression they've done it countless times before. This humor gets positively dark so fast.

Can you proof this? Or should we just take your word for it?

@@miriamuSama yea its on her instagram

Exactly. "I don't want to offend any individual person, but I want to be offensive."

Its so pathetic honestly. I hate people who wanna walk through life being as offensive as possible but melt and cry when the offended people snap back. Cowardly and disgusting

What is “idc”??

@@mandypdx it means “i don’t care”

seriously, and she also even said "people really hated it in new york lolol"...yeah because there are a lot of jewish people in NYC and we don't appreciate your hate crime costume. so she knows it's rank and just didn't care

Yes, I remember this! And her response was something along the lines of “If it was sold at Urban Outfitter you wouldn’t be mad.”

Omg I remember this! I guess cancel culture is not so new then haha, because back in the day we had so many "exposure" posts in LJ too, and totally warranted. Didn't she send horrific emails too?

Omg, I remember this too! That's when I stopped checking Doe Deere's blog. I was just like...nope after that.

THIS! I remember this! Her attitude about this specific incident is why I stopped supporting her eBay shop! Like if you said anything to her she took it as a direct insult and would just block you, even if you were a customer.

She also sold crappy party sunglasses that were intended for children, like the standard ones you can buy in bulk usually come from the dollar store. She was passing them off as designer ones. I know she sold some as I saw it in her seller feedback on eBay and the buyers were NOT happy.

I hope she does it

Omg and Dolls Kill too!!

I SECOND THIS. The whole girl boss crap paired with her awful treatment of employees and then their steep decline in sales after dolls kill became popular

@@0ffline333 I used to live in La and all of my clothes are from there. The owner is sweet as pie so let’s not lol

@@pixiedust5239 i mean, she can still be sweet and shady 😅 there's been multiple scandals re: underpaying models and workers & racism but everytime they come up, they just turn off their ig comments until people forget

Very good point! Are you a Holocaust survivor?

People do realise but they just don't care. They know what they're doing and they're definitely not ignorant

Mocking nazis is a correct thing to do.

@@kneau Yes and no. “Mocking Nazis” is a nuanced thing. For example, Mel Brooks, a Jewish person, actively mocked Nazis and Hitler to take away their power in his work, but especially in “The Producers.” And it works somewhat well (he’s a controversial figure in the Jewish community). But so many people who mock Nazis and say they want to “punch Nazis” actively perpetuate antisemitic tropes and don’t say anything when Jewish people are attacked or targeted. Nazis are not the only group in history that were antisemitic and they certainly were not the last. Antisemitism is a 3000 year old form of hatred and it is a part of so much of our society. Just yesterday, a Texas synagogue was held hostage, and the FBI said that it had nothing to do with the Jewish community. It is incredibly ridiculous to say that a man holding a Jewish house of worship hostage didn’t have any ill will towards Jews. And I have seen very few people talk about that. So, if you want to actually help Jews, stop focusing on Nazis. Learn about antisemitism, learn that it exists on all sides of the political spectrum and exists in some form in every part of the world. Learn to call it out. Jews are only 2% of the US population and only 0.2% of the global population. And yet they are the target of 60% of religiously motivated hate crimes in the US. There’s a serious problem there.

It would be one thing if people dressed up on Halloween because it is literally one of the scariest things, as a scary costume. BUT none of the people who dress that way are doing it for that. They think of it as a joke or edgy costume and not as something negative or disgusting. Add in they frequently are shown to have bigoted attitudes to go with that choice in costume. So it isn't far off from why they chose to wear it. It's also not a good idea even on Halloween cause the question would become, are you a neo nazi who supports that stuff because they do still exist. It isn't all in the past.

Absolutely. And incredibly racist!

@@mek0626 why is it racist? I dont get it.

@@tedoymisojos how would it not be racist? i dont get it.

@@tedoymisojos go and look for the person called annie and their comment and its thread here in the comment section. they explain this beautifully

And the Oh No They Didn't gossip page. I was in some awesome LJ groups.

There were so many different communities on LJ. Plus everyone I knew had one. It was where everyone was before MySpace.

Oh man, I had an LJ and I wrote f/f fanfic. Lost the password years ago, but it bums me to think all my fanfic might be gone now 😢

@@wh0aheavy I checked mine a few years ago. (A friend and I were gossiping about highschool and we forgot someone's name, so I decided to read my LJ as a "primary source document." So much cringe)

Miss the livejournal communities tbh

That was a dagger *sobs in aging millennial*

I'm about to be 43 and I've never heard of it. I guess I'm too old for it lol

Live journal was my LIFE. I still use it to vent.

YESSS I loved LJ so much! I'm only 31 so it's crazy that people in their mid 20s have never heard of it

@@intothemystic5223 i'm 33 ;)

🎯

Was about to comment the same thing. I know that Kat Von D is no longer at KVD, but because they still use her initials I don't think I will ever want to buy their stuff again. But Lime Crime doesn't have that same baggage.

Yes that would be the "private labeled" issues that were mentioned

That was pretty common for eBay sellers to do back in the day. I sold Lolita style white ruffle socks with lace in adult sizes for $16.00 a pair that I bought much cheaper in bulk as part of my eBay business.

I was someone involved in this, and I caught it three months before I received any notice from Lime Crime about it. So if I didn't notice, I'd have gone THREE MONTHS with a compromised bank account.

@@trishanichole8440 Thank goodness you noticed! If you don't mind me asking, how much was stolen from your account?

@@meghannicole1474 I caught two $100 ish charges to EA Games pretty soon after it happened. I was one of the lucky people who got their money back without needing to pursue Limecrime about it. Luckily EA was easier to deal with directly and took care of it faster than my bank did lol

My info was stolen during this and thankfully I was able to settle it (after 3 months of back and forth with my bank). But I didn’t receive any money from LC 😭 Worst part was knowing that they were aware of the breach but decided not to alert anyone until it was getting posted everywhere

@@shea5581 That is terrifying! It sucks that you didn't receive any compensation for everything you had to go through.

Tumblr back in those days was so great lol.

I ironically was talking about LiveJournal yesterday with my boyfriend who is a big tech and computer geek. He had never heard of it and I was shocked! I had one like 2004-2006. I forgot my handle, email and password so I don't even know how to find it but I'd LOVE to go back and read my journal entries from that time in my life! I was going through so much! I was in my late teens or early 20's. Shit was so different back then!

@@hwoods-kg1jf hahaha omg I think if I found my Livejournal again I think I would die of embarrassment.

I turned to dust when she said she didn’t know about live journal 💀💀💀

@@RosieGaga i literally aged 1000 years when i heard her @ 8:30

lmao literally me i cannot even get any of these brands in my country but sure tell me everything sis

literally same and I barely wear makeup😭

Me and my elf cosmetics relate lmaoo

Same here, I only wear lipstick and don't care for any other makeup but I love learning about brand history and makeup history in general.

You guys aren't missing much, only good thing I'd buy from LC is the lip products lol

same also people thinking it was only 10-15 years ago- that's not a very long time in the scheme of things or the lifetime of a business! I feel like telling everyone to get off my lawn

I'm a year younger than hannah and I feel the same way lol

@@helene8706 Haha, I had the same reaction... and I remember being a kid in the 90s feeling like the 70s and 80s were a million years ago. How the turn tables 🙃

Lol when people don't know early social media sites 😭 and they have to use current ones to describe them

@@jacjac_jac this all the time, so i remember how they feel lol

I remember this!!!

Yes!!!!!

Yesss

Lime crime would also use fake accounts to raise the bids on her clothes , back in her ebay daysb

I remember the temptalia shit thats how I found out about her beef with Shrinkle. Damn that it takes me back

You make perfect sense girlie 💖 also that is horribleeeeeeeeeeee

The saga continues...

Olovorgooo eso no lo sabía, bellisima devolvió el dinero?

OH!!! en fin de año fui a la tienda me queria comprar unas sombras pero no se me dio como mala espina y no compre nada. Como sabes que el componente esta vencido? viene de que en la paleta no en el empaque? para fijarme a la prox.

@@accordingtoisabel muy tarde, pero normalmente te das cuenta de que un producto está por expirarse o ya se expiró porque tiene un aroma fuerte, tiene una textura diferente (como cuando los labiales líquidos se vuelven pastosos con el tiempo) o el color cambia (una base que te queda más naranja que antes)

Same actually.

I still have hair dye of theirs from when I thought the owner wasn't involved anymore. It's a really crummy situation because their hair dye has treated my hair the best out of the ones I've tried so far. But I just cant support the company if this is okay behavior to them.

@@Sam_Lite did you watch the end of the video? Doe Deer is no longer involved in the company in any capacity so buying their products won't be supporting her behavior

@@Maggie-ot8vx I'm fixing a pipe burst in my house so I haven't finished the video but that's great news!! Cant wait to hear the rest.

@@Maggie-ot8vx true, but they handled her 'stepping down' but still being on the board so badly that I just don't really trust the brand even now

SAMMME! remember that dress/skirt that she altered with DUCT TAPE?!?! LOL

Yes it was chinchilla

This was my exact same experience as a 30 yr old lady hahah

Wait, is she involved? I’m not and have never bought anything but good to know

@@dreamof_me She's not. Near the end of the video it says she stepped out completely on lime crime and is no longer affiliated with it and won't receive any money from it.

@@dreamof_me she herself isnt involved anymore, personally however i found the way the company handled her first time "leaving" to be shady and gross, they knew people didnt support her so they worded things to mislead consumers into believing she no longer had involvement or financial gain (when she did) so even though she now actually has no involvement im still just not interested

People used to be free back then

What is your idea of free? This is incorrect. The internet is a newer invention and people’s understanding of the long-term consequences weren’t known. Saying people used to be free is a gross over-simplification of life.

Just a note, the model in the China Doll promo image is actually not Doe, it was one of the first times she used someone other than herself to promo her makeup. Can't remember the name of the model now, i think she might have been a blogger or something

I remember the video made by the customer of the dress with the taped hem, Doe even called her stupid or dumb after she reached out to her.

A KIMONO ISNT EVEN CHINESE! It’s Japanese!!! Why is nobody calling this out?!

@@kendall6049 You're totally right! That's what I was referring to when I was comparing it to "wearing a bunch of items from different cultures as if they're all the same", but I should have called it out explicitly.

I think she would still use “appropriation” and “stereotyping” referring to your hypothetical African culture pallet. Its valid to want the word “racism” to be used but I really don’t think it’s fair to imply her using the other words was her dampening the severity. I’m sure she would say it’s racist as well, but some words can be so similar in meaning people might think one word they’re using gets their point across.

​@@giraffe1219 I really urge you to reconsider your outlook on this topic. Appropriation and stereotyping are often used to refer to actions that do not rise to the level of racism. For example, western people wear “kimonos” all the time and many white-owned businesses sell them. Those are all instances of appropriation, but don’t generally rise to the severity of racism. If someone were to say “Asians are good at math”, that would be stereotyping, but it seems severe to call that person a racist. Appropriation and stereotyping are not necessarily actively harmful to a community. If a white person wants to wear a Chinese traditional dress to their prom (an instance of appropriation), it may rub me the wrong way, but ultimately it’s not perpetuating any ideas that are actively harmful to me as a person. Using a “Chinadoll” concept perpetuates the idea that Asian women are exotic dolls to be played with. It dehumanizes them. Asian women are literally dying, being pushed into a subway train, followed home from an Uber. Also, Hannah has used the term "racist" before in other videos to refer to other actions. Part of the job of being a commentary channel and trying to hold people accountable for their actions is paying attention to these kinds of things and using the right terminology.

@@pastichio_ this was a great explanation!

Totally agree. I think it's strange that the beauty community gets so outraged by the actions of beauty brand owners, but no one seems to really care about these other brand owners, many of whom are not saints I'm sure

@@a.beaverhausen1140 Speak for yourself on that, most of the people I know, and myself who boycott fashion and make up brands for these types of scandals also boycott brands like Goya, Nestle, and Kellog's for their scandals. We might hear less about them because the media doesn't focus on it, and they don't promote it to their customers, but when we know, we put in the effort to do better. I use buycott to help with boycotting food companies.

@@vannareyne6336 I will also say it’s much EASIER to boycott makeup vs food brands. Too Faced does something fucked up, it’s easy to just not buy from them. There’s lots of makeup out there and none of its a need. It’s much harder to boycott food brands like Nestle, because they own so many different brands. And food is a need, and sometimes I can’t afford to buy the expensive fair trade items. It does suck, because I still feel strongly about not giving money to evil corporations, but it’s so extremely difficult when it comes to food.

@@EmilyWhite2013z I agree it is harder with some things, especially since the owners own sooo many brands it makes it even harder to buy alternatives. I am a big believer that if you can do better, you should do better. But that comes from recognizing that not everyone is in that position for a variety of reasons. You’re doing your best and that is enough :)

@@vannareyne6336 you absolutely can’t boycott everything that’s evil, though. That was kinda my point. I’m not trying to argue that it’s actually ~totally fine~ to buy from these brands with horrific owners, but 100% you will be actively buying something from someone who’s horrifically racist or an abuser or who is stealing water from impoverished countries or funding war or something unspeakably evil. You can *try* to stay on the ball, but you cannot know all of it because these people are very capable of covering things up. The beauty community often gets berated for being awful, but it’s actually extremely typical of all businesses and all products, the dirty laundry is just slightly more out in the open than in 99% of other industries.

I had no idea it was carried at the Bay! Woa!!

And they are still carried at urban outfitters but that was said in the video I believe

They also sell them at winners lol

I didn't even know it was sold there, I thought they were a Hot Topic brand this whole time, ngl. I'm glad they're slowly phasing them out.

i love sugar pill for stage makeup bc the shadows are so pigmented , the owner is a sweetheart too

I still love sugarpill, they still keep it lowkey and drama free with beautiful formulas

Yeah except Amy has been seen hanging out with Jeffree Star so…

I love their makeup!! The formulas are really nice and I like being able to support an Asian-owned business

I bought from the recently and I have been for a while. They still make very nice makeup. I didn't try the small cat palettes or the pill shaped palettes, but the singles are still damn pigmented and give you a lot of product. Also the liquid lipsticks and lipglosses are super nice, I adore all the glittery shades, they are not as drying as many other brands. The only thing which may annoy some is the scent and taste of the lipsticks, which is like... orange creamsicle? I actually adore it, but some said it makes them gag XD

This was a big takeaway for me! I'm so glad I didn't have disposable income before I knew about these scandals and things because I really would've loved some Lime Crime or JSC lipsticks!

Why did lilac lipstick have such a grip on us back in the day? 🤡

Scandals*

Does not remotely surprise me.

@@miascott8945 I don’t know how much of her comments and interactions from 2003-2005 are still available on Livejournal, but those receipts of her being cruel to her teenage fans and unhappy customers would be so entertaining to read now.

Exactly lol same I was around back then and think mine is still online 😂

😂🙋‍♀️ i know, i gawked when she said "i dont know what livejournal is". heeeeelp

I'm 29 and grew up using LJ if that makes you feel better lol. Best experience in fandom to this day tbh.

Yeah and the term 'China doll' is another term for the 'Lotus Blossom' or 'Geisha' stereotype that Asian women are submissive and delicate and sexy, a stereotype used to fetishize Asian women in the worst way.

I’d maybe argue that it’s both? Like it’s fetishising a ridiculous stereotype of a homogenous ~Asian woman~ concept which is just so many layers of dehumanising and racist, with some misogyny thrown in as the icing on the shitty cake

Right? Christine is the last person who deserves such treatment. Her reviews could never be described as snarky or rude in any way.

Lol shes bad but i actually dont think shes reached his level

@@meuliaisacoolgirl I definitely don't think she's as bad as Jeffree, but the fact that anybody's even in the same ballpark surprised me

Did you watch until the end of the video? The owner is no longer associated with the brand, so that shouldn't stop you from using their products if that's what's holding you back.

I'm really surprised his grandmother, who literally fought the Nazis, didn't come down harder on him.

It definitely seems to have been a "thing" then and I don't get it. There was even a movie that came out around that time called Neo Ned where Gabrielle Union played a woman who thought she was the reincarnation of Hitler and befriends a neo Nazi (played by Jeremy Renner) who then falls in love with her. Absolutely bizarre.

@@Neverendingstory78 As a Jewish woman, I don't think any invisible repercussions are enough.

I think it was part of the counter culture movement of the 2000s. It’s so fascinated bc you see trends, a lot of this stuff happens in the emo punk scenes and niche stuff like that. Goth metal heads etc all those subcultures because that’s where Jeffree Star started out, and then Dahvie Vanity was part of that crowd or scene or whatever, and even the more pop/gay side like Perez Hilton’s and such like all online culture from the 2000s was absolutely the Wild West and it’s seems the most polarizing people were the ones who did all this messed up stuff and ended up becoming the most popular for some reason. It’s weird how this happened again recently with Ayesha Erotica who got doxxed or something and was also super racist ugh I mean even one of the drag queens who won drag race Sharon needles who was totally like part of this scene apparently she also has a racist last like it’s crazy how all of this stuff happened in these communities, and ur sucks cuz there r obviously good people in these communities but the they get a bad rap cuz of a couple of bad apples. ugh

Like how older millennials feel when gen-Z kids haven't heard of LiveJournal? 😆

Lol I'm a millennial but only got into beauty content during the pandemic pretty much, so I haven't been aware of anything going on cuz it's simply not been on my radar 😄 Didn't even know what indie makeup meant until I found these channels.

When Hanna said she never heard if Live Journal 😭

When she said she didn't know what LJ was, I was like, ahhh she's actually a baby, lol.

@@TheAdrift or Xanga?!

I remember buying one of their lipsticks in late 2015/early 2016 and I really hated it. I still don’t know to this day if I got a dud or if it just didn’t work for me. I remember it being dryer than Kylie’s lipsticks

Thanks for the translation but I still have no idea how to pronounce that 😂

@@mek0626 you could simplify it to KSE-nya VOR-uh-tuh-vuh

i remember hearing about this on tumblr! she had glitters that she sold and it came out she was lying about the source of the glitter (pretty sure they were drop ship glitters) and not entirely eyesafe. i wish i still had the lime crime's crimes masterpost saved.

@@tinyowlbear they were craft glitter lol

@@cassafrassbloodshred9551 yes thank you! i thought i remembered right but the optimist in my brain was like "there is no way she did that" lol

Wow, that nuts! Then again I can’t be surprising considering it was Doe Deer who did it. I’m glad I’m not the only one who remembered that she lied about using unsafe ingredients in the products.

I think some of the pigments in the lipsticks were also in hair dye,which is a big no no and they lied about it to the fda and changed them on their website

We knew as early as 2003-2004.

Neopets! I spent so many hours on there back in the day

I use to vlog on there memories

@@thrifty.jeanne I was obsessed! I remember painting one of my Jub Jubs with a cloud paintbrush and was certain that I had MADE IT. Fame and fortune here I come.

Yesss!!!!

Who?

YESSS