Came here to say just this. 👍

I suspect it was the other way around (ha! get it!), star charts are often printed E-W flipped so you _can_ hold them over your head to match the layout of the actual sky. The painters would have expected a "top down" plan (as you describe), since it's a building project.

@@1FatLittleMonkey Oh, that's what I thought the original comment was saying. It's customary for architectural plans to be top down so the contractors are used to flipping the plan when translating it upwards. But star maps are usually shown as you would see them looking up so you'd need to hold them above your head to translate it to the ceiling which the contractors weren't used to and therefore didn't do.

@@1FatLittleMonkey Fully agree. The painters were given a star map, but were expecting ceiling plans. I can't imagine how difficult it would have been to paint correctly from the map. You'd either be holding the plans over your head all day, or mentally flipping your layout constantly - which would get confusing very quickly.

@@MeToob Absolutely. the amount of additional work you'd need to do plus the physical strain on your neck.

They faithfully copied the original mistake, yes?

@@WyvernYT eh… for the most part. Supposedly the current ceiling is slightly less detailed. And their argument by then was “look… it’s abstract.”

​@@metropodwonder if they had a manual for all the excuse to make up 🤣

@@maruftim I mean, if you want to argue that the two attempts were separate artworks, doing it intentionally the second time, well, “it’s what everyone is used to, so why change it now.” Doing a bit of checking, they added at least one constellation in the 1944 version, Triangulum Minus. The original is still there, but the new ceiling was attached directly to it in the form of 4 foot by 8 foot panels made of concrete and… worryingly… asbestos. The latter being the reason they didn’t take them down when the MTA renovated the station in the late 1990s. Another note about the ceiling is that by the time the MTA (which, quick disclaimer, is the agency I work for, just for one of other sub agencies) took over the terminal building in 1983, the ceiling was almost black. You could barely see the constellations. They left a single patch in the north western corner to remind people of just how bad it was.

@@maruftim They're a railway company. Of course they have a manual for excuses.

Ok, but what about the important question? Did they put in Uranus?

@@MyRegardsToTheDodo Did they put *what* in Uranus?

Uaeeæaaeeerghhhh

MMMmmm-blagh

xnopyt

Answer in Progress trio is my favorite. Nevertheless, Tom ALWAYS gathers good guests

It has nothing to do with why I got ron-ned for 8k points while playing riichi mahjong, but thanks!

@@komiteunofficialaccount9224 I guess you're lucky it wasn't the dealer, otherwise it would've been 12k :)

@@darkshoxx happened more times than I wanted, unfortunately.

Yeah, like some book title: "Hermione Granger and The Whispering Gallery"

Spot on, once again.

Architect here: the plans would have been produced so that you look down at the plan. Because of that, the ceiling needs to be reflected, as if with a large mirror on the floor, and is called a Reflected Ceiling Plan. It works for what it is, but doesn't work if you hold the plan over your head.

@@ryanratcliff2726 Since the answer specified that the painters were looking down at the drawing, it sounds like they were aware of this, but whomever made the drawing wasn't. [If we had to play the blame game]

The problem with that idea, is that the stars aren't "painted" flat on the night sky, and so they would look completely different from the opposite angle. Many of the stars that we see as "constellations" aren't near each other at all.

@@Aoderic Yes, but instead of being just a representation of the night sky it's supposed to specifically be a celestial globe, which does represent outer space objects as painted points in a sphere with Earth concentric to it. Celestial globes and the similar armillary spheres have long been a symbol of Portuguese discoveries and the age of exploration as a whole, which is why they decided to represent the sky this way in the flag.

@evertonmatheus7084 I think you misunderstood my comment. But I don't disagree with you about armillary spheres and their importance and symbolism to the Portuguese and thus the Brazilians. It was the idea of "God's point of view" that does not line up with reality.

Same. I knew what the error was, and had an idea of how it got that way but didn't know it exactly.

Terminal station

A station is a structure where trains stop regularly. Terminal just means it's where a line ends, it doesn't make it stop being a station.

Well, that and now we can add the fact you can now make thru journeys via the station. The complex gained 8 new tracks on two new levels earlier this year when the Long Island Rail Road levels finally opened. It’s the one way fare from one station on one railroad to Grand Central, plus $8, gets you to any station on the other railroad.

@@metropod interesting point. Did they change the name to reflect the change?

@@HumancityJunction No because it was possible to make through journeys to other branches of Metro-North before. Although changing at 125th Street would take less time.

_Lining up_ doesn't necessarily mean _matching._ If they'd painted a view of the northern hemisphere, with Polaris closer to the northern end of the building, it would have "lined up" reasonably well with the Earth's axis. If they'd put Polaris on the eastern end of the building, no so much.

MMMmmm-blagh.

P.S. That whisper thing works in the Metropolitan Museum also, I believe it's in a move, or maybe How I met Your Mother, but it's an architectural feature happens in some buildings, yeah might be in the TV show it features an architect!! Sometimes this old Gen X brain still works

A plan is always a downward-looking view. That's what a plan is.

@@noneofyourbeeswax01 For the positioning of the walls, doors, etc. But the painting should be as viewed by the painter and passengers in the station.

@@10thdoctor15 I agree. What I'm saying is that any blueprint with that configuration is not technically a plan.

Strictly, Big Dipper is just a small asterism (collection of stars) inside Ursa Major.

Castor and Pollux are the two twin stars in the Gemini constellation.

@@lateralcast Thank you for answering. I went running with the window in the back of my head screaming, that Pollux was a son of Ares in mythology and Mars' moons are named after two of Ares' sons from mythology. But yes, thank you for correcting, the moons are of course Phobos (fear) and Deimos (panic). Very sweet of you to answer. It's beautiful having this podcast just spreading information.

Constellations aren't in the actual sky, they're just in the minds of people.

Not always - e.g. roof of a cave.

@@lateralcast True and tunnels for that matter, but those are holes contained in larger structures, not free-standing buildings.

It was referring to a conversation earlier in the podcast, and they were teasing the train guy.

Yes, but it was formulated by a British mind so it's a railway station. Same reason i call it "Madrid station" and not "estación de Madrid"

pedant!