How does B&M stand when compared to Intamin or Mack?

I think B&M is comfortable with their position in the industry, their coasters are super reliable and consistent crowd-pleasers, and they're making most of the biggest coasters around nowadays, refining their design with each new installation. When you look at how many coasters they add each year versus their competition, I think that speaks for itself

I think part of the issue is B&M can’t keep up with the rapid innovation of modern coasters. Manufacturers like Mack, Intamin and RMC are innovating very quickly and use new design styles that B&M aren’t really adapting to

Is it just me, or were a lot of their big innovations due to collaborations with John Wardley? If he's not askingg "Can we do this?" Perhaps B&M aren't thinking that way.

I don't really think it is B&M's fault to be honest with you but rather the parks fault. For example, Mako had a rattle in its first test run that was noticeable with the train shaking a little but it no longer has that rattle because the park went back to tighten everything. Also to much oil on the wheels can cause a rattle. I hear from workers of nemesis has a part on the chassis that Nemesis did not have to begin with. Also Nemesis has the same chassis from before the refurbishment happened. I will also say this about Mandril Mayhem, due to it being a wing, it will have a rattle either way until the parks maintenance crew is experienced with refurbishing it each season like Swarm's maintenance. Now about Iron Menace, that is a manufacture error of Clermont Steel Fabricators who has fabricated every single B&M ride and is also where the last section of track was put in. Also I still don't get the point of people arguing over new B&M's having rattles due to the fact of people just being picky and getting mad when they don't get what they are expecting. Last thing to mention yes, B&M does fall behind in innovation (At least from the early 2000's till now with Pipeline) but they do make up for it with there well trusted projects, and when they do innovate, they knock it out of the park like with Pipeline and learn from each project.

This so-called “rattle” for me is SO exaggerated. The only coaster I thought had a bit of a rattle was Iron Menace. That rattle you all talk about is there from day one and gets worse on pretty much every other manufacturer’s coasters. I rode Nemisis Reborn when this rattle was meant to be there and didn’t feel it at all. I did HEAR a rattle from the wheel covers but couldn’t understand why it was such a big topic of conversation. Even with a rattle, they’re still the smoothest and most reliable rides out there.

Has B&M done anything new recently? Pipeline, the world's first surf coaster, extremely smooth btw. And as far as your comments on B&M entering the family coaster biz, it's been documented that family coasters is somewhat the way of the future for many parks wanting to spend money on new attractions, for the purpose of capacity and something that visitors of all ages can enjoy.

Im glad its not just me that found that vibration on Mandril Mayhem! My guess at the time was they made the trains lighter so the launch could be less powerful and therefore cheaper, plus not being an intense coaster the trains didn't need to be as solid.

I heard the cost of steel is increasing rapidly. B&M may be cutting some for their tracks to meet the requested budgets of parks. Considering B&M is more expensive for coasters, this would help them make their rides cheaper.

Inferno is so underrated, it has this constant roughness feeling that tbh just adds to the intensity, it feels like the wheel bearings are running dry and I enjoy it, but not section of the layout sticks out as rougher than anywhere else so it let's you get your bearings (lol) and enjoy the rest of the ride. Theming and visuals aside, I find the ride experience of Inferno better than Reborn

It could be something with the sand filled track. On a hollow track any rattles from the train bogeys would be absorbed through the steel rails and into the void in the track. On a sand filled track, a rattle from the train bogeys has nowhere to go so you hear it as it is. Dont forget, sand filled tracks are a lot quieter as well so any potential sounds are not drowned out by the roar. Another possibility is that things need adjusting. I imagine the train bogeys will have some adjustment in them to compensate for wear and fine tuning.

I believeB&M are comfortable in the position. They are in their products are reliable and are not that hard to maintain hence why their are B&Ms from decades ago still operating plus their like Apple but in the coaster form they don’t do what others do they stick to what they know will work everytime and when they do add a new design to their pro folio it’s sure to be a crowd pleaser that’s what makes b&m a reputable and trust worthy brand for coasters they aren’t quick to follow trends and often set their own plus they revamp existing ride models to modern standards for example they brung back the 2nd gen standup which was pretty cool and that’s what makes them who they are they are what I means if ain’t broke don’t fix

Some of their legendary coasters show their age, indeed. Silver Star (2002) in Europapark, Germany is getting rougher lately. Still a great ride but noticable shuffles and bumps which weren't there ~10 years ago. I hope they find their industry-leading smoothness again. But it's not just B&M. Mack also has rattle issues with its newer rides (Voltron especially) while Vekoma, of all the companies, recently built their smoothest ride ever (FLY in Phantasialand).

At the end of the day, whenever a park has coasters that are closed, the B&M or Ms are always open. The quality and reliability of their coasters speak for themselves.

Doctor diabolical’s cliffhanger also had a rattle

I have a feeling the reason why the new installation of B&M coasters are rough is that steel is getting more expensive, making it much harder to get better quality steel.

I think the coaster industry is gonna do a big 180 in the next decade. B&M will shift their focus to family and flat rides, while other companies like Zamperla and Vekoma will start making large innovative rides. Could be wrong tho

B&M perfected the Giga, it wasn’t a new design, but a new level for an existing one and as stated in my other comment: the surf coaster is amazing!

I rode Emperor like a week after it opened and on the wing side of the dive coaster, it bumped through the entire layout, both sides

B&M has not gotten any rougher. The issue is glass smooth and computerized feeling coasters like new Vekomas and Rmc Ibox Coasters have made me people weaker.

I never found Black Mamba in Phantasialand to be that extraordinarily smooth...

If it ain’t broke - don’t fix it. That’s why they haven’t invested in new models. Cedar Fair - their largest customer, just merged with Six Flags to create the largest chain of parks in the US. Them alone can keep B&M in business ordering 2-3 new coasters a year.

I really hope that Kings Dominion's new wing coaster doesn't have this problem.

In my opinion, Intamin and Mack are going to be the future rollercoaster dominators and then follows B&M / RMC and Vekoma

Nemesis is an inverted coaster, the other ones you mentioned are not.... Meaning I think B and M should think about resigning their inverted trains

I rode Mandrill Mayhem last year in an inner seat and didn't notice a rattle. I rode the swarm at the start of the month and my first ride was front inner and it was just as smooth as when it first opened. I got a second ride on an outer seat and it was bouncy

I heard someone point out that the roughness could be due to the new trains not using welds and using bolts instead it could be a problem with that or with the sand filled track and that why new B&M’s have a rattle while the old ones don’t? Or it could be that track manufacturing has been worse causing more imperfections and maybe the wheel chassis aren’t as tight as needed

The smoother B&M's seem to be the ones that arent too compact, like Nemesis is - they tend not to make such tight layouts anymore, prefering to make use of the open space and use larger elements, and I wonder if this could be why?

Iron menace has an insane rattle everywhere. Even the 0g moments like the 0g roll have a rattle. It makes it arguably the worst ride in the park. I had a bad headache getting off it and it’s by far the worst B&M I’ve rode. The only redeeming quality is the drop. It’s absolutely unacceptable to have a BRAND NEW coaster be rougher than the 100 year old coaster next door.

You’ve got to remember that the nemesis trains aren’t new, it’s only some of the track, so that may be what’s causing some of it

I rode nemesis reborn a couple weeks ago, I did notice it was a bit rough as I experienced a bit of head banging especially through the zero-g roll which flung my head into the left side of the shoulder restraint! Although when I rode it back in late April a couple of times it was smooth and I had no issues and felt great to ride.

On one hand, i think you are... overreacting a bit on the quality thing. I think that enthusiasts are ridiculous , in general with this rattle thing which is usually just the noise made from the upstop wheels or the wheel bougies being slightly adjusted too far in/out. B&M has quality written all over it- still! The only evidence you need is to look at how when they install an attraction, there is almost zero down time vs top thrill 2 or a ride such as Voltron. B&M is like the Apple of the amusement park world where they don't introduce "new" technology until it's well established and at a 98% reliability rate That said, what i think they need to do is adopt a more aggressive track layout philosophy. Intamin, and RMC are by far the best at this in that they not only pace elements at twice the tempo of B&M but they also carefully design the elements to have a calculated effect on your body, not just a force. For instance, the Mosasaurus roll on Velocicoaster, is not just a heartline spin, it's timed and paced rhymthically to make you feel like you're being tossed/hurled not just inverted. The 2nd inversion on Steel Vengeance, that comes before your body can quite get it's bearings from the sideways small pop of air that inverts you while falling and whips you straight at the bottom of the element, feeling like 2.5 or 3 elements in one. B&M is also only "boring" to enthusiasts. My coworkers think that every ride they make is awesome and honestly, they are the ones buying park tickets but every one that has ridden Vengeance or Velocicoaster speaks to how, in the words of my friends kids " how otherworldly different" that ride is. I mean, if you've ridden the outward banked airtime hill on Orion- it reminds me of when my white coworker tried to duplicate my collard greens she tried and loved and nobody in her house would eat them. They were bitter, flavorless and undercooked! that attempt at wave turn-ish element was poorly executed. B&M are MASTERFUL engineers and would, like intamin benefit from bringing in fresh new talent to create like Intamin does. Intamin, has refined it's reliability issues mostly, but have allowed fresh new engineers to come in and create a dossier of elements that they send to parks ( there is a youtube interview with Sascha Czibulka you should read) when they discuss rides like Konda that shows how forward thinking they are. The biggest issue B&M has is that without innovation and with other companies catching up to them in quality, parks are seeking that next attraction elsewhere. Just my thoughts

Dorney is my home park and I personally think that talon is smoother than the brand new iron menace.

At the moment parks are installing a lot of family coasters. So I'd argue that they are priming themselves to meet that demand. One manufacturer that you don't mention in the video that is killing it right now is Vekoma. Their smoothness and innovation right now is incredible and they really deserve more investment. I would love to see a UK park invest in a big Vekoma coaster. Roll on Universal entering the UK market, it might push Merlin to push B&M to come up with some newer exciting concepts, given their long standing relationship.

B&M did have a wing coaster with a launch before mandril back in 2015

The surf coaster is the second most fun coaster I’ve ever ridden only behind ride to happiness.

Pipeline is awesome, glass-smooth and pretty innovative. But, I think that may be not enought to keep up the company.

I was doing work experience at the park this week, and the rides are not as reliable as they seem. While working on Oblivion, it went down many times for problems which many other rides did not face. However, they are all good rides though.

Could be that they aren't filling the tracks with sand. You can see this when comparing Kumba to the rest of the Busch Gardens B&M's

I think the parks are using wheels that are harder and last linger may be ?

Wait what was that tv show in the beginning?

Only companies that really seem like they can be ahead of them is Mack and Intamin. Vekoma isn’t there yet, RMC has slowed down, and Zamperla is not ready for the big time from what I see.

And the floorless coaster

B&M isn’t going anywhere. It might not be the number 1 manufacturer but it’s staying

I think intamin will make more Hypers and launch coasters and Vekoma will make lopping coasters and launch coasters

I rode Valravn in the back and that thing is just straight up rough

tbh I think a lot of new coasters of all manufactures ar abit rough maybe cos of lighter trains

Nemesis Reborn, Mandrill Mayhem, Maximus - Der Flug des Wächters and Iron Menace are all new B&M's and all have something wrong with them... they have changed something in there design I reckon. Let's see how Penguin Trek and Phoenix Rising are and maybe even the new Kings Dominion wing coaster just to see if they have a rattle or jolt or something else wrong with them first.

You mean to tell me B&M should be worried about Zamperla?😂

Ive ridden 2 of the newest B&Ms in Pipeline and Iron Menace and while Pipeline has a bit of a shimmy, its not bad at all.... Iron Menace however, is bad. Cedar Fair should be pissed with how Iron Menace turned out cuz its not even that one moment on IM, its the whole ride....unless youre in the middle seat. Its fine in the middle bit incredibly shaky the further out you sit...which is crazy cuz even the 20 year old dives like Sheikra or Griffon dont have this shakiness on the far edges....and those are 10 across. Hell, I think Kumba are Busch Gardens runs better than its rebuilt sibling The Hulk. B&Ms have always had a slight rattle but theyve taken the B&M rattle and made it their entire personality.

Clermont Steel Fabricators in Batavia, Ohio makes all of the steel track for BM roller coasters.

I heard that when Alton did the Nemesis walk through night, an engineer was asked about the rattle. Said it had something to do with the sand filled track, and the forces aren't being absorbed as they did and are feeding back into the train.

B&M wasnt the innovator of the boxtrack, it was Giovanola which who worked with Intamin on Shockwave at Drayton Manor and later on they worked with B&M.

bruh nemesis is so smooth I sat on the 2nd to back row and there was a slight vibration u literally could not even notice it.

The b and m rattle is confusing and concerning. My other concern for the past DECADE to 12 years is how boring their rides have become. I love how intense batman and hulk are, but their wing coasters and other later models are so boring. Tatsu is a super intense flier, while the superman clones are boring. Idk. The gp wants more intensity and b and m are offering less intensity. And then when there is intensity, the trains rattle for some reason. The hypers are going nowhere but im thinking they should start to mix the twister layouts of the family coasters with the hyper model. Their rides are just so formulaic now. But i love their tighter transitions, faster paced installs, and lately they just draw everything out making them forceless.

Saw you riding hyperia today

Rattle, rattle, rattle. Fury 325 and Diamondback, my fav giga & hyper but they rattle. B&M are people movers, my home park of Carowinds has so many B&Ms, no Intamin (just the small drop tower), and one new Mack.

They need to go back to making inverted coasters instead of all these wing ones 😂 Or at least make some with rotating seats like X2.

I rode the new b&m dive at Six Flags Fiesta Texas and was shocked by how BADLY it shuffles. And it's practically brand new.

Valravyn is Very smooooth..

My hometown theme park is seaworld orlando

Personally, when i rode mandrill mayhem I found it smooth as butter

I have heard people say so much good things about the surfcoaster but i really didn't find it good. Ice breaker was way better for me

There is no rattle

B&M is turning into Boeing

B&M's coasters are becoming unreliable and rough, while they are still less forceful than coasters from other manufacturers and more expensive - there's no point to getting a B&M now.