Jordan Peterson’s entire argument about makeup falls apart when someone just uses a different color than red/pink.

*talks about direct Peterson quote* Every Peterson fan: "stop misrepresenting him! Straw man!"

I suspect that any video that contains Peterson's name, and doesn't proclaim his greatness, will get more dislikes than likes when the JP zombie horde notices it.

cant believe he's actually questioning whether men and women can work together. he's nuts!

I suppose the natural conclusion of Peterson's logic is that men need to get out of the workplace if they can't control themselves. Come back when you can. Its simple.

Jordan Peterson is a hot mess.

Calling Jordan Peterson an intellectual is like calling a mustard stain art because it resembles Abe Lincoln.

I've worked with men and women at all kinds of workplaces. I've worked with women that wear makeup and those that don't (I don't wear makeup myself). I've worked at places where women dress up and wear heels and places where the standard dress code involved wearing jeans and t-shirts. When I worked at Game Stop, I was the only woman on staff. Everyone wore jeans and polios except me. I wanted to wear miniskirts and leggings (I was going through a phase at the time). Absolutely none of my coworkers hit on me and I actually got the most respect from customers at that workplace. I know, gamers respectful towards women?! Yes, they were. Grandparents with lists from their grandkids looking for Christmas presents? Not so much. In contrast, when I worked at Tractor Supply, I worked with a mix of men and women and we all wore jeans, t-shirts, and hooded sweatshirts to work. No heels, no makeup. To this day, that's the only place I've ever been sexually harassed by a coworker. As soon as I told my boss, the coworker was immediately reprimanded and he never shared a shift with me again (which did mean cutting his hours as well). He was also told that if the boss received one more complaint about him (no matter what kind of complaint it was), he would be fired. Don was one of the best managers I've ever worked for. I hope he's enjoying retirement and that they gave him a great pension (unlikely, but he totally deserves one). Oh and the place I had to deal with the most sexism from customers is probably an even split between Tractor Supply and Home Depot - and it was always elderly men (almost always white, but occasionally an older Latino man would... um, let's say come on strong). Ironically, the Bosnians (identified by their accents) were pretty damn respectful and polite. But hey, you know how those Muslims are. They were probably faking it, right? Yes, that last bit was sarcasm.

Being politically correct AKA being polite. I honestly don't know what ppl have against polite behavior and conversation. A little polite behavior gets you a long way in this world.

Regarding Jordan Peterson more generally, I've watched quite a few of his college lectures and find these fascinating. I only discovered his other pro-masculinity 'public persona' a little later and, to be honest, couldn't reconcile the two for a while. I still enjoy the psychology lectures but I'm a good deal less enamoured with his more sociological ideas and harping back to the Bible as the fount of all wisdom.

Speaking as a man, I presume most women wear make-up to work is because all the other women also wear make-up to work (i.e., they'd seem perverse if they didn't). I'm sure many woman would love to be able to turn up at work without make-up (if they're anything like men, who don't actually enjoy having to shave every day).

Have all the people coming here claiming men and women can't work together as some universal truth ever actually held a job that doesn't consist of putting french fries in boiling oil??

Hey kudos for having contrapoints in here! 👍🏽

Before women entered the workplace men would get distracted by women walking down the street, segregating them or telling women they can't wear makeup isn't going to solve core issue here which is *objectification*.

"What is he getting at." That is at the heart of Peterson's comments. He just makes these statements but never clarifies what point he is getting at. In this clip it seems like he might be indicating that women cannot work with men, or maybe that women should not dress a certain way. But I guarantee if you said that to him he would say you are misrepresenting me. Fine then what is your point?

Natalie is amazing and I miss Michael brooks so much ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️

I love how tense he is in this interview, his clenched teeth and his inner rage - all while talking in his lovely socks. Like a real manz.

High heels were first worn by men.

Jordan Peterson King of the Incels

finally...i was waiting on contrapoints to give her point of view on jordi

The desire to be attractive doesn't always have a sexual context. That was Jordan's simplistic mind going there.

2:57 Jordan Peterson: "Here's a rule, how about no makeup in the workplace" ; 3:32 Jordan Peterson: "Now I am not saying people shouldn't use sexual displays in the workplace. I am not saying that, but I am saying that is what they are doing."

This is what you get when someone who has enjoyed privilege up until now fails to keep up. He has fallen behind and blames everyone else.

Don't wear makeup and heels, and you're "unprofessional." Do wear makeup and heels, and you're "asking for it." Nothing we do is ever right.

has anyone read bill c-16 (i think its called) that made peterson famous? it's very innocuous. i have no idea how he arrived at the conclusion that it was the compelled speech legislation he said it was. i suspect he was being intellectually dishonest in the way he represented it. i can't really see how anyone could interpret it how he did. then again i'm not a lawyer so... but go read it, it's very short. it's just a tiny amendment that adds trans people to a pre-existing list of groups it's possible to commit hatecrime against. doesn't even mention pronouns as far as i remember.

that everything they are saying tracks and makes total sense but the video has almost just as many dislikes as likes kinda proves the point about peterson fans exactly.

😔❤️ Michael brooks. One of the rare folks that makes me LAUGH OUT LOUD….and STILL. thank you for everything. 🙏❤️❤️❤️😃 (when he said boom after Peterson mentioned lipstick. For whatever reason, it’s SO F-ING FUNNY from MB) RIP JE T’AIME (LOL😃 everyone else laughed too 💪😆 nice)

"Do you have to have sex with everything that attracts you, Mr. Peterson?"

When the topic of make up came into their discussion and Jordan tried to say that make up should be banned in the workplace, it would have been perfect if the Vice reporter had brought up the fact that Peterson was wearing make up at that very moment!!! Perhaps Jordan was wearing rouge in order to get his ass slammed in by that Asian reporter!!!

Prepare for a endless barrage of comments from Peterson cultists whining how you're supposedly taking him out of context.

I'd love to hear someone ask Jordan Peterson if straight men should be removed from the workplace for ever getting a haircut, shaving or wearing any form-fitting clothes because that all is very likely to attract gay men to them.

Personally, I can't take anyone who still thinks Jung is a thing seriously.

Glad to see the petersonians are apply their upright postures by mass-disliking this video. Or perhaps they're just keyboard-mashing, those poor things... you see, it's quite hard to type with prosthetic lobster pincers.

The only conclusion I could make out of that is that Jorden has a heel kink

Holy shit, i just noticed the like dislike ratio and there being more dislikes than likes. Whats bizarre is that this was one of the most deep and profound breakdowns that i had seen about peterson at the time. This conversation was also where i first discovered contrapoints. The fact that a detailed and honest discussion about the implications of jordan petersons comments and his effect on his audience as a sort of father figure with sage-like wisdom in a time of deep confusion for many young people in a sort of oligarchic, technology infused global society could get such disapproval is an obvious indication that people do not want to engage in criticism of their idol, and that this largely emotional response that cuts to the core of many peoples beings is itself ironically having a chilling effect on the same free speech peterson claims to hold so dear. Before this conversation i was still grappling in myself why this guy had such a following and why it seemed so difficult to criticize the overwhelming message behind all the truisms he speaks, nonetheless i never liked the guy a whole lot because you can kind of unconsciously understand that there is something controversial, something constipated about what he is saying despite his popularity with young people.

I have been hearing lot of these stuff for some time now and I agree with all your criticism but one thing I almost never hear is that what Peterson is saying is offensive and deeply degrading to men. Not in a PC sense. If you accept everything you say is true what is the conclusion that we can draw from that about men? Men are people who have no control over our sexual impulses, we are basically unevolved barbarian waiting to attack anything that fancies our sexual desire. Yes make up, lipstick and high heels are sexual cues like million other things that all kind of people do everyday both men and women. They do it to get attention from people who they find attractive. How do you know if you are that guy? Just talk to them, if you are great, if not leave them the fuck alone. It's not rocket science it's the the basic concept of consent, we do it everyday in all aspects of life, you see a great advertisement for a Ferrari that doesn't mean Ferrari is inviting you to rob it's showrooms or factories. People like Peterson who despite his apparent "intellect" is apparently unable to distinguish between social interactions between decent normal human beings and criminal behaviour. Can you imagine how deeply misogynistic and chauvinistic you have to be to not understand simple rules of human social interaction.

I love Natalie. You should have her on more often!❤️

Tbh, his lectures on psychology are pretty decent... not great, but above average. But on almost any other topic, he's just an ignorant pseudo intellectual who's plainly desperate not to lose any of his followers.

It’s so simple: control yourself! No matter what, just control yourself at work. Be an adult. Don’t want to hear about “women make it difficult by wearing lipstick”, just control yourself! Women probably go through similar feelings anyway because the things men wear at work tend to be (in my experience) the things that women like. But that doesn’t matter at all. It’s not a man/woman thing. It doesn’t have to be perfectly equal. What matters is that men/women can turn up to work nearly naked or in a full leather catsuit and whip - whatever floats the other employee’s boat; it’s on the other employee to control themselves! Professional behaviour is written into the contract like professional dress is.

Excellent conversation between these two. Really insightful.

I love how angry he is throughout this all too closely situated interview.

I looove you Natalie!!!❤️🌷💋✨

Lol, years ago I worked in a hotel where make up was mandatory.

I love how nuanced this is.

It's really interesting revisiting this interview now that Peterson has gone fully mask-off about his anti-trans bigotry.

Prepare for the trolls.

8:15 ”it’s a brilliant move” it isn’t a move, it is him saying what he believes.

ContraPoints is one of my favourite KZfaqrs at the moment; it's always nice to see her on other channels. Jordan Peterson is highly overrated as a public intellectual. I don't say this because I disagree with him, I say it because some of the things he says are flat out dumb. What he _is_ good at is certain rhetorical tricks that can catch people off guard. Michael criticised that Vice reporter for not catching that trick right away, but I suspect most others wouldn't catch it either unless they knew to expect it.

You should really have him on the show, I think it would be educational for everyone :D

Maybe he's covering for the fact that HE CAN'T GET ALONG WITH WOMEN IN THE WORKPLACE.

To say makeup or heels is unprofessional is like saying wearing clothes that are stylish or colorful is unprofessional. By that logic anything other than a gray uniform jumpsuit is unprofessional.

Men should wear codpieces in the workplace.

Contra Points?!? Oh shiiiiiit my favorite anime crossover

Omg, I didn't realize that trying to cover up my under-eye circles so I don't look tired, wore bronzer because I'm pale and when I don't people ask if I'm feeling sick, and some lip gloss that help with that pale/sick thing and chapped lips I was supposedly trying to simulate the look of a woman in heat and practically begging to be sexually harassed in the workplace.

My girl Contra back in the house!

I found Contra's channel just a few weeks ago and I was so happy to see Michael in one of her videos and now this. It's good to see good leftist communist maoists working together.

Not a lot of smart discussion in this comment section.

Natalie is awesome!

I take several issues with a lot of what's said here, but in the name of brevity I'll just hit this one: Contrapoints states the effectiveness of labeling a person's behavior "bigoted" instead of attaching the label to the behavior's actor. I would like know how an action can be truthfully attributed as bigoted without incorporating the actor's motivations, or at least their supposed motives.

Always thought the makeup thing was a strange comment from him. Makeup is one of those things that we've been doing for so long that it doesn't require a need to increase sexual attraction for it to be done. It's more a tradition than anything else these days.

waiting for the nerds to find this

In my understanding, the makeup question was only raised because he wants to point out that the sexism debate not necessary had to stop at a certain point. Rules that are currently created to prevent sexism in offices could - as a consequence - also include dress-code and makeup. So it is not about makeup. Makeup is only an example. It is about the fear, that things that are currently not on debate could be the target of people who develop anti-sexism policies. And at the end everyone looses.

This comments section needs to brace for impact from the "intellectuals"

I know what i wear in the workplace: FUCKING SHOES!

Women don't wear make up to work in order to look "attractive" to men. Women wear make up to work because it is expected and in some cases required in order to look "professional". Looking professional in accordance with dominant social norms is the primary impetus behind women wearing make up in the workplace; secondary reasons do include the general social pressure on women to look more "youthful" than their years, to look more "well-rested" than most women generally are, and lastly, yes, the more women conform to the standards of appearance that are imposed on us the more easily we can progress through many work environments. None of these reasons for wearing make up in the workplace reflect women's individual wish to look more attractive to men but rather are a reasoned response to the societal pressures that are paced disproportionately on women in order to progress in the workplace. Shows like this should really consider speaking to women about their experiences and how differently women are often treated for non-conformity to appearance standards before offering up agreement with the supposed "truism" that women only wear make up out of a personal desire to perform a sexual display.

"If you are a parent and comb the hair of your pre school kid then you want your kid to have sex". Jordan Peterson irrefutable logic, the only thing more idiotic than this are whatever Jordan Peterson's fanboys might say about that.

"How about no makeup in the work place?" How about shoes during an interview? SMFH.

Why is her last name “Parrott” I can’t even find anything about her going by that.

Jordan Peterson shouldn't knock it , he could benefit greatly from a little makeup . Ugh !

The Peterson cult strikes again. No matter how many times I re-watch this Peterson's clip, I cannot shake the similarities of him and my ultra traditional, misogynist grandpa's rhetoric about those wimminzz working.

We hate having to make ourselves up and wear shoes that hurt. All of it is a pain, and a waste of our time.

I only recently realized that ContraPoints was Nykytyne2, whom i've known from like ten years ago.

I am a solid left winger and I like the fact that JP is calling out the “personal is political” ideology that has replaced left wing politics. Unless people can take responsibility for their own lives, they can’t make a contribution to any kind of collective well being. There is a kind of dissonance when it comes to sexuality. I see people defending rampant sexualisation as empowerment, while complaining about the objectification of women and it feeding rape culture. The scramble for inclusivity has dismantled the actual left wing platform which was the most inclusive platform ever. People have become obsessed about things that divide us, where the job of the left should be to concentrate on the common challenges that unite us. In the UK and AUS, same sex marriage was enacted by conservative governments. Because it is not really a political issue.

The clips you played were intellectual exercises which have little bearing on reality. They are mental exercises in the way that intuition pumps are, as DC Dennett puts it. You using them as ad hoc arguments pitted against real life situations, creates a lot of errors because you presume the world of these arguments parallels our natural world. And it doesn't. Presenting his arguments in such a way, is to make a strawman out of Peterson's arguments. It's grossly inaccurate to do so. As time progresses we develop new tooling for which to critically analyze issues of our past. Rehashing old "truisms" give us a better understanding of those issues and could very well change our perception of them. What you hold to be true now does not mean it will be true in the future. You guys also seem to shift the context or specifically the justification for both JBP and your own arguments too much. It's kind of disconcerting because it makes your line of reasoning hard to follow logically. For example, Peterson was basing the justification of makeup on the base drive for sexual procreation. That does not mean there can not be higher order motivations for wearing makeup. @9:28 Sam conflates the context of JBPs base justification for makeup for that of the specific example of using attractiveness for workplace politics. @10:10 Natalie then reframes the argument essentially saying that there is no logical bridge for using a specific example from a broad policy. This is true and means that Sam's conflation of the justification is incorrect. However they both take it as collaborating statements instead of contradictory. That often the case when you have 2 agreeable people conversing and it's bias confirmation. The arguments or what's said no longer matter but we need to agree or be united against a cause. In this case, against whatever JBP says.

...this is nothing but...the degradation..[eyes well up]..of the individual!! [Shatters into tears]

If you twist someone's words around long enough to declare their actions are biggoted do you win a toaster or something?

Peterson couldn't even acknowledge that men and women can share the same work environment. This guy is a creep. That's all he is.

The 21st century L.Ron Hubbard. "A society in which women are taught anything but the management of a family, the care of men, and the creation of the future generation is a society which is on its way out." LRH

You guys should have him on and have a conversation.

Should play Cathy Newman clip.

Yeah, obviously men aren't expected to act like mature adults around women with makeup. Clearly, women are asking for sexual harrassment when they wear lipstick or high heels, and men shouldn't be blamed for that. We should take women's personal freedom and liberty away by forcing them to not wear makeup of any kind while at work. They all must dress like nuns.

Women have been very active in the workplace since start of WWII - so over 75 years.

"I'm just asking questions!" = JAQing off

What if she’s wearing purple or brown lipstick good doctor?

4:25 men and women working together got fixed in the 60' and 70's or there is a rape/assault/misogyny problem in the workplace... pick one. To the people complaining about Peterson followers commenting, this channel is more than happy to ride the wave and gain views from his name, it's common sense to expect people that agree with him to be here, and they probably won't like the rather childish descriptions of his opinions here. why not critique him with thought out points rather than "he hates women working" "he does lectures on the nazis therefore nazi" "everyone that follows him is a troll in a cult" etc etc. You can't solve problems in life by just turning the guy asking the difficult questions cartoon baddie.

Natalie's last video was absolutely brilliant - very personal and educational.... As a "white" cis hetero male who wants to understand every aspect of my fellow human beings I really value videos like hers!

I can't be the only one who heard the fart at 12:05?

Damn, Natalie is awesome!

That Vice interview was originally 2 hours long. I hope they release the whole thing, because what we got was a cherry-picked mess.

Is Jordan Peterson not wearing makeup for the interview??? looks like it

Jordan Peterson resurrects the old playground argument that, "boys can't hit girls" and calls it philosophy.

"So is wearing a tie", in response to make-up or rogue being sexually provocative pls elaborate

Jordan Peterson is a person who I agree with on some things and disagree with on others.

What if someone said, “ I reserve the right to use the n-word and not be disqualified, or in any way punished for doing so! “ We could make the leap to calling that person a bigot. I know that I would.

Contrapoint my love! On my favorite news show?! THIS IS MY SHIT

Why does Jordan Peterson where hair gel?

I thought this was simple. He's asking questions to point out how complicated and nuance women to men interactions are. I guess this wasn't common sense that I thought it was

I dont get it, ppl talk shit bout Peterson but dont debate him. Im really looking forward for a good debate, best thing we have is Peterson and Cathy? That was a joke ... Unless You have additional footage, i dont see how you get to "The conclusion of like sexual abuse by men of power, the lesson is that girls should work anymore." from that vice video.

It's wise to not dismiss Jordan's points as CRAZY, and debate them soberly...

Miss you Michael x