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The Most Persistent Economic Fallacy of All Time!

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brittle13

brittle13

15 жыл бұрын

From a lecture given by Dr. Milton Friedman in Erie, Pennsylvania (1978).
This is essentially a restatement of the "parable of the broken window." This fallacy has been known since at least 1850 when French theorist Frédéric Bastiat published a pamphlet entitled, "That Which is Seen and That Which is Not Seen." You can read it here:
bastiat.org/en/...
It was popularized in 1946 by economist Henry Hazlitt in an important book called, "Economics in One Lesson." According to economist Walter Block, the book was instrumental in converting him from communism to capitalism. (Incidentally, Block's book "Defending the Undefendable" was instrumental in converting John Stossel to libertarianism.) It can be downloaded for free from the Foundation for Economic Education here:
www.fee.org/pdf...
Download "Defending the Undefendable" by Walter Block here:
mises.org/books...
John Stossel has a nice little video of this fallacy under the guise of so-called "green jobs." Watch it here:
• Video
Stossel also has a great article about this fallacy under yet another guise known as "Cash for Clunkers." Read it here:
www.realclearpo...
From The Boston Globe (1 Sep. 10):
"...the supply of used cars is artificially low, because your Uncle Sam decided last year to destroy hundreds of thousands of perfectly good automobiles as part of its hare-brained Car Allowance Rebate System - or, as most of us called it, Cash for Clunkers. That was the program under which the government paid consumers up to $4,500 when they traded in an old car and bought a new one with better gas mileage. The traded-in cars - which had to be in drivable condition to qualify for the rebate - were then demolished: Dealers were required to chemically wreck each car's engine, and send the car to be crushed or shredded.
Congress and the Obama administration trumpeted Cash for Clunkers as a triumph - the president pronounced it "successful beyond anybody's imagination.'' Which it was, if you define success as getting people to take "free'' money to make a purchase most of them are going to make anyway, while simultaneously wiping out productive assets that could provide value to many other consumers for years to come. By any rational standard, however, this program was sheer folly."
www.boston.com/...
Also, a report from Edmunds shows that it cost American taxpayers $24,000 to give away $4,500!
money.cnn.com/2...
From CNN Money / Fortune Magazine (17 Nov. 09):
"Cash for Clunkers. It was a well-intentioned plan that was supposed to increase consumer confidence, spur fuel efficiency, jump-start the auto industry, and help create American jobs.
Instead it disproportionately benefited foreign car companies, which create fewer North American jobs per auto dollar than the Detroit Three do. And sales came mostly from inventory, doing little to increase production and jobs.
What's more, by junking clunkers, the program removed many low-end vehicles from the used-car market, running up prices for the lower-income people who'd normally buy them. So we hurt the people most in need of help, while throwing taxpayer dollars down the drain. "
money.cnn.com/2...
The last paragraph above is the most important. A well-intentioned plan that hurt the very people it was intended to help? That's the only thing the government does consistently well! To find out one of the reasons why, watch this video:
• Voting Coalitions and ...
From WaPo (22 Feb. 10):
"A law hailed as the most sweeping piece of consumer legislation in decades has helped make it more difficult for millions of Americans to get credit, and made that credit more expensive."
mjperry.blogspo...
This video is an excerpt from Milton Friedman Speaks: Lecture 13, "Who Protects the Worker?"
www.freetochoos...

Пікірлер: 2 100
@evankant5965
@evankant5965 9 жыл бұрын
The exact same debate, the exact same arguments found in Bastiat's, "The Broken Window" written in the mid-19th century. It seems that Economic History is progressing in a very slow pace.
@kcor4
@kcor4 6 жыл бұрын
Or what was true a couple hundred years ago is still true today. Truth doesn't progress or regress; it merely is.
@m.browne2548
@m.browne2548 6 жыл бұрын
Agree with both of you but I also feel that these truths are still not being understood and still seem taboo at this time.
@youtubearchive3668
@youtubearchive3668 6 жыл бұрын
Oy vey dont ya know ve invented economics!
@szczesciejestkoloruczarneg749
@szczesciejestkoloruczarneg749 5 жыл бұрын
Economics is so hard to understand for so many. To me the hard thing to understand is why is it hard for so many? ://
@frankk1512
@frankk1512 4 жыл бұрын
no one is a destruction of capital for production of capital the other is movement.
@adulby
@adulby 13 жыл бұрын
"spending isnt good, producing is good" took a nice shot at Keynes right there. supply economics at its best.
@jackbrady9738
@jackbrady9738 2 жыл бұрын
spending produces produce tho
@Yurothehotot
@Yurothehotot Жыл бұрын
Supply has no value without demand.
@logmeindangit
@logmeindangit Жыл бұрын
@@jackbrady9738 spending does not produce. People produce, in order to exchange their labor for something else of value, something that someone else can provide better than they can. For example, let's say one guy knows how to make saws and nails, and another guy knows how to cut lumber. They each see value in the other person's labor, so will either barter to exchange goods and services, or will create a placeholder, money, to represent the value of those goods and services.. Money produces nothing, it just stands as a representation of value, but if confiscated from the person who earned it, as doesna thirf or a government imposing a tax, the confiscator, who has less respect for how that money was earned, because they did not earn it, they only took it from someone else. That taker will not be as careful in negotiating how it is spent. Too often, it is wasted on projects and people who do NOT produce an equivalent return of value for the money given them by the takers, the "thieves." When it is just two people agreeing to a transaction, exchanging their money for something else of value, like cut lumber, saws or nails, they are free to reach a decision, an agreement on what a fair trade would be. When government taxes people, taking money from earners, it did not earn it, it just took it. Since it did not earn it, the value of what effort it took to create that money is not nearly as well respected by government as the person who sacrificed their time and effort, and earned it. Government will often spend that confiscated money in ways that produces nothing but allegiance, as in a bribe. Also, welfare payments produce nothing for government when that money is "spent." The result, though, creates dependence by the welfare recipient, who didn't work for the money - they were given it because they were pitiful. And the pitiful will then come back to government to beg for more "free" (to them) money, and they will produce nothing in return except a dedicated vote for the government people giving them that confiscated, then redistributed money. But what did this do for the person from whom that money was taken? Nothing. In fact, it actually put that person farther behind, because the money they worked for, earned, was taken away from them, so has to be earned all over again. Taxation that does not benefit the taxed is enslavement, forced labor, the fruits of which are taken to become the oroperty of the thief, government. This is an example of how money does not always create production or products. Most of the time it does. The perversion arises when a third party, such as a robber or government, takes money from producers who have earned it, and gives it to people who have not. Certainly the robbers and government didn't earn it, and they produced nothing in exchange for the money they took. And the people receiving money from the thieves do not care where that money came from, ... but they should. They would, if they had honor.
@MicahErfan
@MicahErfan Жыл бұрын
what no understanding of aggregate demand does to a mf
@DerDammerung
@DerDammerung Жыл бұрын
​@@logmeindangit you explained that so well. Thank you.
@Danioton
@Danioton 4 жыл бұрын
Friedman is asserting Say's Law - Growth in the standard of living is due to increases in the ability to produce goods and services that other people are willing to pay for and is not due to consumption itself. Say's Law is often misstated as demand creates its own supply. Anyone can easily look up one of the many English translations of Say's book and find the relevant chapter to read for yourself. Demands are unlimited and spending does not itself create value. To spend one has to produce something of value wanted by someone else willing to exchange their production with you (something facilitated by current/money).
@krishnanunnimadathil8142
@krishnanunnimadathil8142 Жыл бұрын
You mean “supply creates its own demand”, as Say would have put it?
@user-bp2io3bi5l
@user-bp2io3bi5l 3 ай бұрын
so if no body wanted some thing then why would anybody supply it
@durwinpocha2488
@durwinpocha2488 2 жыл бұрын
"You tend to think, that you're spending someone else's money and you are in a way. But he's spending yours....." Milton Friedman.
@christopheradderley6902
@christopheradderley6902 9 жыл бұрын
Milton specifically refers to being employed in "productive or creative activity". People who allocate money (administrators of large Government programmes) are not by their very nature employed in creative or productive activity. Then you move on to the second debate about market resource allocation vs Government resource allocation and Hayek explained this issue better than many. How can any one person or organisation possess that kind of knowledge and act upon the information either accurately or at the correct time?
@cm770011
@cm770011 7 жыл бұрын
Christopher Adderley and the finance industry only allocates money therefore making private equity overall a wasteful enterprise for our elites to be pursuing with such dogma
@christopheradderley6902
@christopheradderley6902 7 жыл бұрын
Looking at society as a whole; misallocation of capital resources is arguably hugely wasteful. Either in a public or private capacity. Private equity is arguably less wasteful than pulling choices out of a hat and going for it.
@solank7620
@solank7620 6 жыл бұрын
Matt Good lord you have it backwards. Private equity does amazing good. Investors do more good than anybody. They take on great risk, and find the best talent with the best ideas. It is very, very, VERY fucking difficult to do this. Especially since you are competing with other intelligent, talented investors. Without investors, there is no Ford. No Apple. No Google. Facebook never becomes anything. And the list is endless. Investors create industries. These people deserve tons of credit. They increase liquidity in the market. They reduce bid:ask spreads. And by competing with other investors, they bid up the price that entrepreneurs can get for their companies, and increase the salaries employees can demand. Investors are some of the people you should be most thankful to in all of society.
@solank7620
@solank7620 5 жыл бұрын
Cerebral Cinephile There is no guarantee whatsoever that increasing corporate taxes will increase tax revenue. Most likely it would reduce them. Ireland reduced corporate taxes, their revenues went up and the EU bitched about it. You have it absolutely backwards on food stamps and such. I saw Tucker Carlson claim food stamps were a subsidy. This is total bullshit, and a misunderstanding of basic economic mechanics. Food stamps change the opportunity costs of unemployment. They are a penalty. Not some subsidy. Imagine if a state had a basic income of $20,000. Do you want employers would be able to decrease wages? Of course not. They’d have to raise wages because employees wouldn’t be as desperate for jobs.
@prabhakaranjeyamohan4579
@prabhakaranjeyamohan4579 3 жыл бұрын
@@solank7620 Investors invest in companies that makes them money, either that's good or bad to the society is later to be known. Of course they invest in company which might benefit the society but can also may invest in company which would degrade the society like say pharmaceutical companies which sell crappy medicines costing healthcare and our health, lobbying government to promote their products which might be unethical. Just saying goverment or private, good people making good decisions make the society good. And it is a good thing that in a democratic society , people have control over choosing a government which will do better in allocating resources.
@gibaudrac1
@gibaudrac1 10 жыл бұрын
This guy blows my mind.
@cerebrobeso9660
@cerebrobeso9660 5 жыл бұрын
I didn't know Friedman was the Incredible Hulk.
@gambu4810
@gambu4810 4 жыл бұрын
What do you mean about this?
@cerebrobeso9660
@cerebrobeso9660 4 жыл бұрын
@@gambu4810 the color seems green
@ericjeon4901
@ericjeon4901 7 жыл бұрын
his argument is very persuasive as it focuses on the value of freedom for citizens
@franticamber
@franticamber 14 жыл бұрын
No one---and I mean NO ONE---articulates the principles of free market economics better than Dr. Milton Friedman. I MISS HIM!!!
@sandal_thong8631
@sandal_thong8631 Жыл бұрын
I have several economics books by John Kenneth Galbraith, which I think are excellent.
@berictzepeshku3424
@berictzepeshku3424 12 жыл бұрын
as a simple example - deciding to become an artist or a professional athlete is practically economic suicide in a country like the US in which the safety net is so threadbare. yet millions of people choose to go into these professions all the time knowing full well that the probability of doing that for a living full time is very low. they do it because they enjoy doing the work
@Renato4004
@Renato4004 6 жыл бұрын
He actually makes a case for direct democracy and small communities goods and serivces. Something that occurrs in Switzerland. The people from that community have the right to vote where to spend the money and how, they would first arrange meetings as it is done in several places, something like the common expenses and then decide the outcome of their spending. Switzerland wouldn't be switzerland only because of their free market, their direct democracy and their direct decision of the laws and public spending is key.
@zubstep
@zubstep 6 жыл бұрын
To add to your point, the concept described by Friedman here is subsidiarity. You can have subsidiarity without direct democracy, but it seems much more likely to be in practice with direct democracy than without it.
@BygoneT
@BygoneT 4 жыл бұрын
Yeah but direct democracy is a suicidal enterprise if people don't care about politics and factual data. People also tend to get greedy about having more "Freedoms". I don't think it would work in large scale and especially in Murica.
@sungod9797
@sungod9797 3 жыл бұрын
Direct democracy leads to mob rule.
@GhostSamaritan
@GhostSamaritan 2 жыл бұрын
@@sungod9797 How? If anything, representative democracy leads to a mob rule. A bottom-up approach to direct democracy would be superior (i.e. a city has more influence over itself than the state, a state has more influence over itself than the nation, etc.)
@burhanjohncena
@burhanjohncena 9 жыл бұрын
The government should not involve itself with economic activity too much, but at least, the government should provide mechanisms to reduce pollution emissions and provide policing and defense.
@JordanSumberg
@JordanSumberg 6 жыл бұрын
You are the most reasonable person in all of politics and modern discourse.
@selfishcapitalist3523
@selfishcapitalist3523 4 жыл бұрын
Yes
@Lexrezende
@Lexrezende 3 жыл бұрын
Economy should try to become a science again and stop being an ideology, a religion. Economy should substitute homo economicus for homo sapiens and become a serious area, not the hilarious and pathetic bullshit it became.
@jackbrady9738
@jackbrady9738 2 жыл бұрын
government should: 1. long long term medical research (that free market wouldnt do cuz too risky) 2. defence 3. justice
@pioneertech-w5o
@pioneertech-w5o 12 жыл бұрын
one of Keynes's biggest ideas was that government pay off debt during times of prosperity. Unfortunately, the most fundamental oversight that Keynes had was that the nature of government is not to shrink itself, but to grow itself. A government that has access to the ability to create money will never shrink, nor will it never permanently reduce its debt, regardless of the relative prosperity of the economy
@SilvanoJulio
@SilvanoJulio 4 жыл бұрын
This is awsome. I was libertarian during my entire life, in a instinctively way, and I didn't know it. I didn't know this way of thinking existed and It had strong fundations. I am very impresed. I always was the special guy who was born very poor but I always thought as a rich man, even when I was a kid. I didn't like my neiborhood, the way poor people acted, their habits, I wanted to be different. For the past 16 years and currently, here in Argentina, a socialist goverment created millons of poor people that depend on the govemernt help to live. Then they use poor pleople for the reelection, and so on. Now, I am very very well economically thanks to my own effort and I have to pay too much taxes to affort the rest of the poor people that is not able to produce any goods or service. All those theories are present here in Argentina
@shybandit521
@shybandit521 3 жыл бұрын
Most people are instinctively libertarian. Most have to be trained either through education (communist teachers) or through daily life giving you a mindset (I'm poor so I'll always be poor) to become anything else. It's human nature to buy and sell, people always want to sacrifice as little as possible to get something, and gain as much as possible from a sacrifice, and it always hurts on an instinctual level when what you gain from a sacrifice is taken away. For example, no matter how necessary a good road may be to get your bakery more business, it feels like you baked the bread for nothing when you lost a significant portion of your profits on that sale to a government who you barely feel the effects of.
@gabbar51ngh
@gabbar51ngh 3 жыл бұрын
Almost everyone is an individualist when they realise Their Freedom is violated. You can find homosexual socialists suddenly talking like Libertarians when it comes to government banning homosexuality. Individualism Trumps collectivist ideology.
@berictzepeshku3424
@berictzepeshku3424 12 жыл бұрын
selfishness is not something you can define however it pleases you - it is a word with a precise meaning. selfishness is the disregard for others in the pursuit of personal goals. selfishness (pursuing your interest even when it harms others) can be compared/contrasted with 3 other concepts: altruism (harming oneself to help others), spite (harming oneself in order to harm others), cooperation (helping yourself and others at the same time)
@jamesedmonds5693
@jamesedmonds5693 11 жыл бұрын
My Boss who installs carpet has been charging the same price for 20 years. His only pay increases comes from accepting more work. We were talking to a guy once who owned some rentals who said he just paid some mexicans to install carpet for him and their prices couldnt be beat, then Lonnie told him what he charged per square yard and the owner said he them twice as much. Then lonnie told him about the guarentees he offers, which the mexicans didnt.
@DCLNick
@DCLNick 13 жыл бұрын
@diurdi I agree with the theory but I'd like to see everyone pursue their goals on an even playing field. I'm not sure it always works that way in practice. I include profit because it tends to accumulate the resource of money towards those that are in the position to profit i.e. existing higher socio-economic groups, and those with money have easier access to resources to pursue their goals. I don't believe the most wealthy are always the most worthy, work the hardest or are the most creative.
@felixchanthapanya2912
@felixchanthapanya2912 7 жыл бұрын
The EU makes me really sad.
@truckerfromreno
@truckerfromreno 11 жыл бұрын
I'm so happy we have reached agreement. Much love x
@df4250
@df4250 6 жыл бұрын
Hhhmmm, "Spending's not good, What's good is producing." Sounds to me like a pretty flawed argument since what's the point of producing if there's no spending? Also, heaps of emphasis on "productivity" - the production of a product at ever increasing efficiency and profitability (very often- bugger the efficiency, just increase the efficiency of the profitability at whatever cost). Any consideration to what the offsets are to this notion of ever increasing productivity?
@soostdijk
@soostdijk 4 жыл бұрын
DF a produced good, like a bottle of milk is still good if there is no money, but if there is money, but no milk you are screwed
@df4250
@df4250 4 жыл бұрын
@@soostdijk Production of a bottle of milk might be ok for a while, until it goes off eventually. If there is no money, no one can buy the milk. Continued production of milk that ends up going off is sheer waste that achieves nothing. On another tack, continued production of items that are profitable but in some way harmful, is not good because the overarching drive for profitability at all costs will eventually be self defeating in that it can destroy the goose that laid the golden egg. The problem I have with Milton's teachings is that he totally lacks any planning or consideration of the consequences of the single minded "efficient" drive for profit, irrespective of the social or environmental consequences. By "efficient" I mean a process whereby the maximisation of profit is pursued without due consideration to damaging consequences, which, if they were taken into account, would adversely affect the maximisation of profit.
@Kevin-rs6cr
@Kevin-rs6cr 7 жыл бұрын
The principal fallacy is supply-side economics. Giving the super-rich giant tax taxes cuts does not lead to greater investment by the rich it leads to greater savings. One must understand the very important difference between investment in economic terms and investment in financial terms or savings. When one buys a share of stock in a company, or any other existing capital asset, that is not investment in economic terms, that is savings. Supply only increases when new capital is created not when the ownership of existing capital transfers from one person to another. There is already a significant tax advantage to economic investment. When a company takes its profits and reinvests them by hiring people or purchasing capital equipment in order to expand production those expenses are 100% tax-deductible over time. When top marginal personal and corporate income, capital gains, and dividend tax rates are lowered the cost of recognizing profits and using those profits to purchase existing capital becomes more favorable relative to making new investments. It should be clear that this policy is a rent-seeking policy on the part of the super-rich and does nothing to expand the economy. Furthermore the idea that tax revenues are simply frittered away is nonsense. The government makes important investments in education, infrastructure, and basic R&D which would simply not occur if left completely to the private sector. Taxing wealth which is being hoarded by the super-rich and directing it towards necessary public investment can reasonably expected to be an expansionary policy.
@ModernGameArmy
@ModernGameArmy 7 жыл бұрын
Kevin Neeland supply side economics is not a thing. In no economic text book will you find such a phrase
@Kevin-rs6cr
@Kevin-rs6cr 7 жыл бұрын
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Supply-side_economics
@ModernGameArmy
@ModernGameArmy 7 жыл бұрын
"In no economic text book" Of course there is a page on Wikipedia
@Kevin-rs6cr
@Kevin-rs6cr 7 жыл бұрын
I am not sure what your point is. It is covered in the following textbook: www.amazon.com/Principles-Economics-7th-Mankiws/dp/128516587X/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&qid=1502594262&sr=8-2&keywords=economics+textbook It literally took me 2 minutes to find an economics textbook which discusses supply-side economics.
@ModernGameArmy
@ModernGameArmy 7 жыл бұрын
I can't find anywhere on that page where it mentions anything about supply side economics.
@soumyabhattacharjee6442
@soumyabhattacharjee6442 5 жыл бұрын
I like his propensity to look at logical extremes (though I don't agree with a lot of his ideas). I tend to look at logical extremes as well, it's an immediate way of judging a logic. My friends hate it when I do that. They confuse it with a straw man 😑
@adamhammond9985
@adamhammond9985 5 жыл бұрын
Same thing happens to me. It's a formal argument known as reductio ad absurdum. People think it's appealing to extremes but it is not. www.logicallyfallacious.com/tools/lp/Bo/LogicalFallacies/30/Appeal-to-Extremes
@tiendoan1333
@tiendoan1333 3 жыл бұрын
@@adamhammond9985 You can commit a fallacy but still have a correct conclusion
@gabbar51ngh
@gabbar51ngh 3 жыл бұрын
@@tiendoan1333 he didn't commit a fallacy. When your inherent statement or argument itself is flawed from the very beginning then it's good way to show how ineffective it is by expanding it to show it's not producing any results.
@RedPillGrimReaper
@RedPillGrimReaper 3 жыл бұрын
True. What you’re talking about is reductio ad absurdum, and the reason people think it’s a logical fallacy is because people have use logical fallacies to make it work most of the time. But if you’re using it while maintaining the framework of the argument, it does not necessarily have to be a strawman
@dovahkiin516
@dovahkiin516 12 жыл бұрын
@PeaceRequiresAnarchy The last thing I want to reply to is that the paper said aggression is not justified. Which is interesting because both papers point out that you still need a form of justice when people steal, murder, etc. The difference is that in Chaos Theory he writes that if someone hunts you down it is not against your will if you sign a contract. But you have to sit back and think in both societies you are experiencing aggression from the state, and in anarchy you are experiencing
@generatordoc
@generatordoc 12 жыл бұрын
Water cooperatives existed for years in incorporated communities wherein a community board provided oversight for a modest stipend, and all construction was bonded and contracted by the coop. There were full time employees that performed the labor functions at the utility for wages. Utility bills were calculated to provide maintenance and cover payroll expenses. Police, fire, and public maintenance were departments of local governments. It is in the interest of all involved to contribute.
@Griesmer
@Griesmer 6 жыл бұрын
"Feds" "loose" $9 Trillion, Do"D" "loose" $2.3 Trillion on just one occasion
@cm770011
@cm770011 7 жыл бұрын
2:15 yep
@thatsthewayitgoes9
@thatsthewayitgoes9 19 күн бұрын
This segment by audience member and Milton Friedman is, in my opinion, brilliant & true and should be taught in every grade & High School & college
@Satarack
@Satarack 12 жыл бұрын
@halloranedward Google UNICOR, also known as the Federal Prison Industries. They don't produce goods for the common market, but they do produce goods for the government. Any purchase by a federal agency of more than $2,500 is required by the mandatory source clause to purchase from UNICOR if UNICOR offers those goods (The US Defense department has an exemption from this). If the agency wants to purchase from the free market they need to receive UNICOR's permission to do so.
@elsiegel84
@elsiegel84 7 жыл бұрын
The fundamental fallacy here is that the government taxes to spend, whereas the opposite is true. The government must spend dollars into existence before they can ever be taxed, and before they can ever be exchanged for bonds. Any notion to the contrary defies logic.
@hermitoldguy6312
@hermitoldguy6312 3 жыл бұрын
Govt could levy taxes in wheat, rather than dollars.
@elsiegel84
@elsiegel84 3 жыл бұрын
@@hermitoldguy6312 Of course they could and often did under feudalism. Under capitalism only money counts.
@sandal_thong8631
@sandal_thong8631 Жыл бұрын
Nonsense.
@Mandibil
@Mandibil 4 жыл бұрын
Government spending is always the broken window. Friedman apparnetly coludnt let that one go
@LucisFerre1
@LucisFerre1 12 жыл бұрын
[[read what adam smith said about large corporations and monopolies and his quote about "the invisible hand" (it's only one passage and it is fundamentally opposed to friedman). ]] That passage about the invisible hand is in a chapter about free (international) trade. Both Smith and Friedman were pro-free trade & anti-protectionism, anti-tariffs. Indeed, Smith's Wealth of Nations had an enormous influence on the demise of Mercantilism, which is steeped in the protectionist rhetoric.
@dovahkiin516
@dovahkiin516 12 жыл бұрын
(continued), thus since the government contracts out all it's work to private companies it does use the market force to get a cheaper better road. So, as you can see private companies compete for the gov contracts for road building. This results in the creative methods for efficiency/safety/lower cost, private roads thus have little advantage since the government already uses market powers.
@WJack97224
@WJack97224 5 жыл бұрын
Exactly. This fella admitted taxes are theft, which is sin, and so he is attempting to justify sin. Pure lunacy. Thank you Milton for setting this fella straight. Thanks for posting this video. Good on ya mate.
@khurmiful
@khurmiful 6 жыл бұрын
The guy makes a lot of sense, most of the times
@brekinla
@brekinla 3 жыл бұрын
I have yet to hear the exception, could you enlighten us?
@gabbar51ngh
@gabbar51ngh 3 жыл бұрын
@@brekinla well he wanted fed to let money printer go brr to avoid great depression. Milton's a monetarist. Look up Hayek's views on Milton.
@PeaceRequiresAnarchy
@PeaceRequiresAnarchy 12 жыл бұрын
@TimeWarp66 In the blog post I link to a few resources on this subject you may find helpful. The first of the two essays that make up economist Robert Murphy's "Chaos Theory" (linked to in the post) deals with private law, while the second essay deals with private defense. I assure you that government's are not necessary for these things to be provided in a society. Please take the time to read those two essays in Murphy's "Chaos Theory." They will change your views that you stated above.
@branhoff
@branhoff 12 жыл бұрын
Honestly there should be no Corporate tax period. Milton Friedman discusses this point. The problem with corporate taxes is that corporations don't pay taxes. People pay taxes. Corporations simply push their tax burden onto their workers in the form of less jobs or lower wages/benefits or onto consumers in the form of higher prices. When they can no longer do that viably they simply pick up and move. I will reply to this message to extend a few more points. Please be sure to read it :)
@Lexrezende
@Lexrezende 3 жыл бұрын
I love how people that create the most fallacious theory in history still have the poker face to tell other people they are using fallacies lol
@luvbotany
@luvbotany 10 жыл бұрын
Its hard to imagine local governments or private biz developing the Interstate system, the internet, NASA, CDC, EPA, SEC, Military, the Fed,.... while the government isnt good at everything, in many things the government does makes life for the vast majority of the people of the USA better. Thus the argument that stealing money for taxes is bad doesnt hold water. The big topic of the day is healthcare but if you look around the world, big government healthcare is by far better for the people, empirically far better result. Additionally who pays 40%? certainly not the rich... only us working smucks pay that which is a whole nuther problem. And additionally additionally, that whole 'if 40 then why not 98%' doesnt work because what about 0% huh? Milty is the master of 'winning' an argument with the absurd notion but not offering real truth. Certainly there is a balance. Funny how when you travel the world, the countries with the highest taxation has the highest standard of living and the highest satisfaction ratings. That cant be a coincidence...
@mikeblain9973
@mikeblain9973 10 жыл бұрын
Friedman was not really arguing for a particular tax rate. He was only refuting the questioner's point that the gov employees buy stuff which benefits the rest of us. Friedman was just saying everybody would be better of by maximizing productive jobs, and minimizing gov jobs. He was not saying gov is unnecessary.
@luvbotany
@luvbotany 10 жыл бұрын
Mike Blain Everyone is only better off by maximizing productive jobs and minimizing gov jobs if society is actually better off, let me explain. Privatizing the prison system has been a disaster. Incompetence in the public sector is no justification for privatization because maybe the job is just too big and hard for private monies, like NASA and FEMA. Mistakes happens but gov learns from its mistakes much better than private companies as they are held morally as well as fiscally responsible whereas private companies can come and go without any consequences with people holding big bags of money, in privatizing profits and socializing losses. Freedom industries in WV polluting a river is a typical example that is repeated daily. Just the fact that people agree that gov play a role in many aspects of life tells me that its not about gov/no gov but about where to draw the lines. If your rich vs poor can dramatically change where you think that line ought to be drawn. This also tells me that profits ought to be taxed much heavier until such a time whereas privatizing profits and socializing losses is not the norm but the exception to pay for the inevitable...
@mikeblain9973
@mikeblain9973 10 жыл бұрын
luvbotany I think most people agree that socializing losses is a bad idea, and Friedman would have definitely have agreed. Yes, the prison system should be handled by gov. But those things have nothing to do with Friedman's point in this video. So how fiscally responsible are the SEC? When they make mistakes (like Madoff) it does not cost them anything. How is anyone morally responsible for invading a country under false pretense? They only have to bluff their way through to the end of their elected term, and no consequences.
@mikebetts2046
@mikebetts2046 10 жыл бұрын
Hey luvbotany, I think you are dead wrong about "working smucks" paying 40%. I know of nobody making less than around 200k + that pays the 40% marginal rate. I just crossed the 100k line and the rich still pay a higher rate than I do (at least the working rich; doctors, lawyers, company execs, etc). Too many people live under the delusion that the poor and middle class carry the heaviest tax burden. I for one call BS on that.
@mikebetts2046
@mikebetts2046 10 жыл бұрын
Furthermore, your comment about higher taxes and standard of living is not as logical as you think. I could just as easily state that the higher standard of living allows higher taxes while you seem to think the higher taxes caused the higher standard of living. If you are correct then why not crank everyones tax rate up to around 75% then? Just think of how great it would be then?
@PeaceRequiresAnarchy
@PeaceRequiresAnarchy 12 жыл бұрын
@Phalanx3800 The US Post Office only has a coercive monopoly on first class mail. Companies like UPS manage to compete in a sense because of the similarities of third class mail and first class mail services, but competition in the specific services of first class mail are still violently outlawed by the state.
@sandal_thong8631
@sandal_thong8631 Жыл бұрын
Nonsense. In the past city folk could send some documents by bike courier instead of the post office. They weren't "violently outlawed."
@corybarnes2341
@corybarnes2341 3 ай бұрын
We've been following Frideman's model for a very long time. We reduced taxes massively. Wealth inequality increased. Productivity didn't. Now we have situations where people working full time cannot afford to house and feed themselves. It has destroyed our society and paved the way for the Chinese, who don't have any interest in his philosophies, to become the most powerful country on the planet.
@Enedrapvp
@Enedrapvp 10 жыл бұрын
Name one starving person in a capitalist system. I can name millions in socialist and communist systems. Your beliefs are fallacy.
@haydenf4562
@haydenf4562 3 жыл бұрын
Look up gadaffi Libya and South Yemen. They thrive until the cia overthrows them
@Lexrezende
@Lexrezende 3 жыл бұрын
Socialism and capitalism are both shit. We souldn't have to choose between one of them (and we don't). Only stupid people believe that we have to choose one or the other. Both are idiotic, unsustainable and self destructive faiths based on fallacies. Capitalism deny the role of collective, the collective needs of humans, mainly the need of stability and security. Socialism denies the individual needs. Both confuse infinite raise in wealth and comfort with life quality enhancement. Both produce more pollution than the planet is capable of processing. Both extract more resources than the planet is able to replenish. Both have a blind faith in exponentially technological development without considering its risks and the impossibility of taking countermeasures when things change so rapidly that we can't understand and predict problems. Both are materialistic and destroys transcendental values that are important to people and their mental health. It's unbelievable that people are still trying to force XIX century dogmas in the XXI century world.
@88CrazyLegs88
@88CrazyLegs88 10 жыл бұрын
The original argument wasn't all that logical, but Milton's rebuttal is equally fallacious. He ASSUMES that the government worker is not, or can not, in fact create anything for the economy. But the opposite is true. Look at Boeing. A corporation that has produced, essentially, modern flight. Pay homage to the Wright brothers all you like, it was Boeing who produced what we see today and in the last century of modern air travel. And this just scratches the surface. We could go into the theory that advanced flight has ushered in an era of relative peace compared to what might have come about. Or any of the other corporations who benefited from the government either directly or indirectly and revolutionized the world. Like Microsoft, for example bringing the modern home computer. The list is substantial.
@mikeblain9973
@mikeblain9973 10 жыл бұрын
So you are saying commercial enterprises are productive. Yes, and Friedman was saying government is not productive. It sounds like you are making the same case as him, except for your first sentence. Do you want to clarify?
@88CrazyLegs88
@88CrazyLegs88 10 жыл бұрын
Who do you think subsidized Boeing? The government. The Pentagon funding tons of research into what is our now modern day technological civilization. MIT was at the heart of it. Milton is just flat wrong. The only argument he could make is that the free market MIGHT have done the same thing but cheaper. But, I doubt he would tread that far.
@mikeblain9973
@mikeblain9973 10 жыл бұрын
88CrazyLegs88 Gov involvement generally stifles innovation. Surely you are not saying we would not have had those innovations without gov?
@88CrazyLegs88
@88CrazyLegs88 10 жыл бұрын
Mike Blain What you're saying here is fairly common among Libertarians and of course Neocons, but it's just untrue. Gov stifles innovation CAN be true, and it can surely be false. Look at Nuclear power plants for instance. Without the Manhattan Project there never would be this alternative energy. But, the government DID stifle progress on specific types of nuclear power that uses Thorium instead of Uranium. Thorium cannot be weaponized, so no funding. That was bad, in my opinion. So, it can be, just like many things in the world, good or bad.
@mikeblain9973
@mikeblain9973 10 жыл бұрын
88CrazyLegs88 Government is not a source of funds, they can only channel taxpayer funds. They might postpone taxpayers having to pay, by borrowing then taxing later. Maybe thorium will prove viable, maybe not. Government cannot make it viable if it isn't.
@redunzl5
@redunzl5 11 жыл бұрын
Investment bank securitizers were more willing to securitize risky loans because they generally retained minimal risk. Whereas the GSE's guaranteed the performance of their MBS's, private securitizers generally did not, and might only retain a thin slice of risk.[34] Often, banks would offload this risk to insurance companies or other counterparties through credit default swaps, making their actual risk exposures extremely difficult for investors and creditors to discern.[35]
@Gabriel21733
@Gabriel21733 12 жыл бұрын
@TheRosa63 : as I was saying, it you got all you needed for free you and you learned a trade, you would produce what you loved, and what was not necessary you would not produce. Food, shelter and care or healthcare would be provided by your inner circle and vice versa. People Irving in communes do not need money. And when you needed something you did not have you traded. We need to simplify matters.
@Audiofalcon7
@Audiofalcon7 12 жыл бұрын
2) Businesses need accessibility to get people around. Whether it's efficient parking lots of easy to travel roads - accessibility is another major factor that businesses, real estate companies, and more, would invest in. Competition in road production and infrastructure will also allow for creative methods to be built that increases efficiency, safety, as well as lower the cost significantly. Roads *need* the creativity of architects and citizens to help create better travel; it needs a market.
@LaureanoLuna
@LaureanoLuna 12 жыл бұрын
The man mentions the 'marginal propensity to consume' too. It could be that private people would not spend all that money but save a part of it whereas the government would spend it all, so circumventing the 'exit' that savings represent. The difference between government's and people's marginal propensity to spend is a well-known issue, which is relevant in some contexts.
@branhoff
@branhoff 12 жыл бұрын
I'm ok with making some cuts to Defense. I try emphasize that, however, defense spending has remained constant for the last years while entitlement programs cost more than the previous fiscal every year (plus taking up 2/3 of the budget as it is). If we don't get entitlements back to a reasonable level it will consume us eventually. Defense spending could stand to be reduced as well though.
@FletchforFreedom
@FletchforFreedom 12 жыл бұрын
@cosmopolite66 Sorry for the confusion. I am not using an "ad populum" fallacy. Had I suggested that everybody believes my point that would be the case, be referencing the conclusion of those actively engaged in the research (historians) is not a fallacy at all. And I didn't even make that point as an argument, per se, but as a response to the claim that I was ignorant on the American Revolution when I am, in fact, well versed in the research and the take of historians.
@dovahkiin516
@dovahkiin516 12 жыл бұрын
@PeaceRequiresAnarchy Another interesting problem that would most likely would arise in a anarchy state wherein you have private firms competing, is that you might see price fixing. Also, another interesting question that pops into my mind is how would any one firm be able to have authority over you when you are speeding? Also, who would pay for the highways between cities that falls into no man's land? Would their be no speed limit in society, or just the highways?
@gavihuts
@gavihuts 11 жыл бұрын
Part One. Just because individiduals aren't spending their money immediately doesn't mean they are misers who hurt the economy. I read in a book from 2001 that the average worker uses about $150,000 worth of tools. You can't procure that money out of nowhere, an individual or company must save money to create that business, and when taxes are increased you are inhibiting the creation of those industrialized jobs.
@dovahkiin516
@dovahkiin516 12 жыл бұрын
Electrical distribution is a private company, but is a monopoly because of government. You don't see three or four power lines going to your house because power companies have a monopoly. As for water utilities most are gov. A empirical study done in a water privatized country showed that water concessions have the hardest time making a return profit. With 7 out of the 10 concessions had negative return rates with one more going out of business. I don't really see that as a "works best"
@LaureanoLuna
@LaureanoLuna 12 жыл бұрын
I don't think the video deals with exactly the broken window fallacy. The argument proposed to Friedman is simply that the marginal propensity to consume of government is higher than that of the average taxpayer, hence the multiplier of government revenue is higher than that of taxpayer income. So increasing taxes may be good when the marginal propensity to save is too high, resulting in more savings than investements and the consequent deflationary gap. Am I wrong?
@LeviDanielBarnes
@LeviDanielBarnes 11 жыл бұрын
Thanks for being so patient with me. At tax rates of 100% you'd get much less production because workers' efforts are not reflected in their paychecks. How widely can we apply this principle? Can I conclude that any time 100% is a bad idea, then 40% is also bad? Is zero percent always the answer in such situations? Why not? Can you see how the questioner's (insincere) contention that 40% taxation is good does not imply that 100% is even better? Doesn't that invalidate Heir Friedman's response?
@FletchforFreedom
@FletchforFreedom 12 жыл бұрын
@niclasjt Those were just some examples. The average "poor" household in the US has more than one color TV, cable, a VCR and DVD, cell phones, a microwave, ceiling fans, etc. The median "poor" family with children also has a computer, a video game system and three color TVs. The average house owned by the "poor" has three bedrooms, one-and-a-half baths, a garage, and a porch or patio. Clearly, the concept of poverty has RADICALLY changed.
@sandeepr2087
@sandeepr2087 27 күн бұрын
Great man and a great teacher ability to conceptualise complex subject in simple words.
@redunzl5
@redunzl5 11 жыл бұрын
As mortgage originators began to distribute more and more of their loans through private label MBS's, GSE's lost the ability to monitor and control mortgage originators. Competition between the GSEs and private securitizers for loans further undermined GSEs power and strengthened mortgage originators. This contributed to a decline in underwriting standards and was a major cause of the financial crisis.[34]
@jannmutube
@jannmutube 11 жыл бұрын
My perspective is that deregulation started a process of stealing from Individual Retirement Accounts. It started with the technology bubble. The explanation for the market fall was that companies were being put on the NY Stock Exchange that were really name only and there was nothing behind them. They took money in and cashed out. They could do it because the conservative "free market" proponents repealed the Glass Stegall Act which would have prevented over capitalization of stock.
@MillionthUsername
@MillionthUsername 11 жыл бұрын
The premise in the question is that taking 40% doesn't harm production because that taken money then gets spent. The fallacy is supposing this spending has the same effect as the spending that the producers would have done. But this is false because the producers would spend more on production while the takers spend it more on consumption. This holds true at any level because it's the nature of the act itself. Production is the engine of prosperity, not consumption.
@Vnam72
@Vnam72 12 жыл бұрын
GDP = Consumption (C) + Investment (I) + Government spending (G) + Net exports (NX). If the Government takes 40% of the 'productive' income and spends it all then G goes up and C possibly goes up too, depending on the multiplier effect. Can someone explain to me how this doesn't create growth, at least in the short term, i.e. the kind you would want during a depression? Thanks
@ManiTati
@ManiTati 12 жыл бұрын
Btw, what "loss of intellectual property"? Which country was losing what intellectual property? I didn't know that, can you elaborate?
@dovahkiin516
@dovahkiin516 12 жыл бұрын
@PeaceRequiresAnarchy The anarchy that I described came from the textbook political ideologies by Andrew Heywood. It was a class I took from college. And it holds a better view of Anarchy than Chaos Theory.
@silentmajor
@silentmajor 11 жыл бұрын
Are there anymore Milton Friedman's around? :(
@GenghisVern
@GenghisVern Жыл бұрын
The fallacy is that federal government needs to tax dollars in order to spend, when that's not the case at all. The USG cannot "go broke" in US dollars; it's impossible. Alan Greenspan tried to explain this to Paul Ryan about 10 years ago when they tried to privatize SSA.
@dovahkiin516
@dovahkiin516 12 жыл бұрын
For one, road safety (excluding highways) is really not an issue. Privatized roads have tolls, and they often exclude people from using it. Having increased cost to travel will cause people to have decrease travel resulting in less tourism. Interstate trade will have an increasing cost structure. Also, just because businesses need roads does not mean anything. Do you expect that the burden of cost to fall mainly on businesses?
@TheRosa63
@TheRosa63 12 жыл бұрын
I think I might know, when there are producers there are workers who make it, who get paid who spend their money, then someone else does the same thing, and they use their money to buy stuff, it snowballs, the more money people earn the more stuff they can buy, but if all you do is take from the producers and give to someone not producing a good or service we want and need and not having anything to sell making money to pay wages which are spent on more stuff which are spent on making more
@FletchforFreedom
@FletchforFreedom 12 жыл бұрын
@Porkusido As both of the premises on which your thesis is based (economic success of Scandinavia; quality of the services provided by the state) do not bear scrutiny, the conclusion cannot hold.
@jwidja
@jwidja 11 жыл бұрын
There's this guy called Stefan Molyneux, he's what's considered an anarcho-capitalist, similar to Adam Kokesh. He's a philosopher moreso than Friedman who is an economist, but he has some amazing economic presentations. I personally prefer the philosophy he teaches, but I love economics and he has some of the most comprehensibly and clear presentations on both subjects I have ever come across. Recommend him greatly
@VassiliZaitsev12
@VassiliZaitsev12 12 жыл бұрын
@FletchforFreedom Well, according to The Nielsen Company, they produced a report for advertising companies and found that the % of american's that own TV's is at 96.7%. So, we really aren't talking a great difference here. Published 2011. Not to mention the Swedish report was from 06, which most likely has increased since then. So, what's the difference? Not that big of a deal maybe 1-3% at most
@PFB1994
@PFB1994 11 жыл бұрын
I am not missing anything. The question is whether it is better to regulate and not allow free toxic waste pollution in the first place or allow the toxic waste to be dumped and try to settle it in court procedures on what the damage was to the injured parties(provided the injured parties have access to similar quality of lawyers that the corporation doing the polluting has). But either way you are going to have the government involved.
@LucisFerre1
@LucisFerre1 12 жыл бұрын
The Veterans Hospitals are using volunteer services from very well paid doctors on loan from other hospitals. Their training took years and LOTS of money...and they make enough money to draw them to that demanding career that consumes much of their lives to qualify for. If you have a government monopoly on medical treatment, then hospitals will be run like the DMV and the quality of doctors will be like something you get in the Philippines.
@dovahkiin516
@dovahkiin516 12 жыл бұрын
(continued) Also, how is a single road connecting point A to point B with the only access not consider a monopoly? Last I checked that was consider a monopoly. What do you not understand about that statement? Monopolies? How do you not follow the logic? Also, I was not referring to the US about the free market and roads. I was referring to the fact that free market dealing with roads does exist (around the world) and that it was not solved any problems.
@LucisFerre1
@LucisFerre1 12 жыл бұрын
Adam Smith's single comment about the invisible hand (Wealth of Nations, book 4, chapter 2) is not opposed to anything Prof Friedman has said. What Smith said was, (paraphrasing) businessmen pursuing their own interests, (profit) inadvertently do good for society without that being their main intent. Because they profit by finding out what people desire & need and offering it to them. Competition (i.e. self improvement) consists of offering higher quality, lower prices &/or greater convenience.
@VassiliZaitsev12
@VassiliZaitsev12 12 жыл бұрын
@FletchforFreedom According to "trading economics" website, a study done showed that in 2006 it was reported that 94% of all Swedes have color TV, however, the number of TV's in Sweden might be higher including non-color TV. So, saying only half of all Swedes do is a strange thing to say, or I should say an erroneous statement.
@gobbly1337
@gobbly1337 11 жыл бұрын
Perhaps I misspoke, I used the word increase when I meant the term 'increase efficiency', or 'effectively increase'. I'm not sure what you mean by individual wealth, to me that is like saying the rich are getting richer, regardless of the rest of the population which figures into averages. But perhaps it is time to agree to disagree :)
@Audiofalcon7
@Audiofalcon7 12 жыл бұрын
You are essentially stating that there is a market where one does not exist. Creative methods are not allowed as freely as you make it out to be: If creative, entrepreneurial methods would exist, then toll roads would *not* be the only idea to spawn. The monopolization exists *through* the use of government contracting, because only one institution is allowed to handle the contracts, which creates a type of oligarchy ab initio. Mandates and other costs makes it *very* hard for entrepreneurship.
@habadashery2009
@habadashery2009 12 жыл бұрын
@june372 how do you think the value of money is determined? it is determined by the amount of debt it produces.
@maximemeis111
@maximemeis111 12 жыл бұрын
Actually the "or" part means that it can be defined as either or. Anyway "responsible for this child' fits perfectly with "duty to deal with something". But you might still ask yourself: do you have a right to your own life? And do other people have a right on your life? The question of government taking care of healthcare (if you choose to be consistent with your answer) will depend on the answer you give.
@shepd3
@shepd3 11 жыл бұрын
Assuming a free society, flame throwers and missile launchers hurt nobody (well, assuming they are not fired at someone else's property). You may dump toxic waste on your property as you wish, so long as you damage nobody else's. You may hunt bald eagles as long as they land on your property unclaimed. You may burn tires on your private property so long as the toxic fumes are contained to your property. What you are missing is that burning tires and toxic waste often damage other's property.
@lavabeard5939
@lavabeard5939 11 жыл бұрын
Yes. You are right. But that is NOT how government spending can be applied effectively. Like Friedman said, there are some things that the government does better than the public. Defense, for example is one everyone agrees on. There is also Keynesianism which is effective if used correctly. For example, during a recession the government can fund infrastructure or scientific projects or participate in a war if that is the unfortunate case. After the economy recovers, spending can be reigned in.
@dovahkiin516
@dovahkiin516 12 жыл бұрын
(continued1) Also, how is a single road connecting point A to point B with the only access not consider a monopoly? Last I checked that was consider a monopoly. What do you not understand about that statement? Monopolies? How do you not follow the logic? Also, I was not referring to the US about the free market and roads. I was referring to the fact that free market dealing with roads does exist (around the world) and that it was not solved any problems.
@redunzl5
@redunzl5 11 жыл бұрын
I'm familiar with it. It affords loan opportunities to previously marginalized populations via relaxed lending criteria and regulations. Nowhere in the act does it force lenders to make bad loans. You should read it.
@LeviDanielBarnes
@LeviDanielBarnes 11 жыл бұрын
Why must the dependency be linear? Whatever you think of Dr. Friedman's conclusion, his response here is the very definition of a slippery slope fallacy. Milton Friedman is brilliant. This just wasn't his strongest moment. It makes me glad there are no cameras recording all the dumb things I do and say daily.
@patheally
@patheally 12 жыл бұрын
My general thinking on the subject is: many areas that promote a strong nation may have to be propped up no matter how much money they lose. And I'm not talking about health care either. (health care threatens to bankrupt our country, hence needs the efficiency of the insurance company's to manage it). But more like science, the arts, the military, and infrastructure perhaps to cite a few.
@FletchforFreedom
@FletchforFreedom 12 жыл бұрын
@indoctus41 In fact, Prebisch's trade interventionism and isolationist recommendations failed spectacularly and Ricardo (and Adam Smith) were completely vindicated.
@FletchforFreedom
@FletchforFreedom 12 жыл бұрын
@cosmopolite66 Had you a clue, you would realize that, in fact, unions CAN and DO overprice labor in the short term resulting in reduced hiring and greater shifts to automation to reduce costs which, again, ultimately reduces employment. On top of which the percentage of capital allocated to labor has remained essentially unchanged for decades meaning that gains in one area must be offset somewhere else.
@gobbly1337
@gobbly1337 11 жыл бұрын
And 35 years later we have more goods and services than we know what to do with, and our economy sucks.
@Nukepositive
@Nukepositive 11 жыл бұрын
I'm not sure I heard this right. What I got from Friedman was that: taxes are justified because we actually receive goods and services in return. If we didn't receive goods and services (but in most cases we do), then taxes would be unjustified. Just making sure I got that right.
@Gabriel21733
@Gabriel21733 12 жыл бұрын
I do not understand the premise that "producing is what matters" . in general terms yes, but if there is no demand or sufficient demand for the produced goods, then it is an exercise in futility.
@ChuckSFP
@ChuckSFP 12 жыл бұрын
Yes but if you're subsidizing spending through government, you're effectively lowering the spending power because not only are you removing spending power from individuals, you're taxing the public employees, lowering their spending power anyway. He's talking about government spending, not the spending of the populace at large. He didn't necessarily deny that public employee's work and spend money, but he denied the Keynesian idea that the government can grow GDP simply by spending.
@FletchforFreedom
@FletchforFreedom 12 жыл бұрын
@byroniczero There is no contyradiction and no restriction to "material" production. Since it is highly debatable that there are any goods that cannot be accounted for in conventional market terms and most of what the governmnet does can EASILY be provided by the private sector, your definition does not hold. Economically, everything produced by the (grossly inefficient) governmnet can only come into existence by taking resources from the private sector - resulting in a net productive LOSS.
@Treblaine
@Treblaine 12 жыл бұрын
They are in competition, even if not in conflict. Navy has significant air-strike capability, so does Air Force (Army+marines to lesser extent). Army + Marines boast similar ground operations capability. Delta force (army) and Navy SEALs compete for honour in special operations. They compete for Commander in Chief's favours for different operations competing to who is best for almost identical functions. They DO cooperate, but they seek to do better than the other to justify their existence.
@FletchforFreedom
@FletchforFreedom 12 жыл бұрын
@dorianleakey By all means, let me know what I've provided that is "biased" or "extreme". I haven't at any time in this exchange said anything that is not generally accepted. That there is a HUGE positiove correlation between the adoption of free markets and prosperity and that the average "poor" in the US has more living space, cars, TVs and disposable income than the middle class of Europe are not controversial; they are simple fact (Census Bureau and OECD data) cont
@Treblaine
@Treblaine 12 жыл бұрын
You are right that Military healthcare is not of same quality as private. That is GOOD. You want people to go for private healthcare if they can afford it. Public healthcare is not about the Hotel treatment, it is about the "not-dying" treatment. If you got cancer and for any reason you can't afford private, they would do a reasonable job of getting that tumour... but it's going to be the most cost effective treatment, not the very most expensive treatment.
@worldssmallestfan
@worldssmallestfan 12 жыл бұрын
Is Friedman's answer more related to crowding out, a Keynesian multiplier, or explaining why a government should exist?
@chica476
@chica476 11 жыл бұрын
Curious why you have a Video disreputing Friedman while having Adam Smith as your Avatar?
@PeaceRequiresAnarchy
@PeaceRequiresAnarchy 12 жыл бұрын
@dovahkiin516 The food equivalent of this monopoly would be for one organization, say Walmart, to forcibly take your money from you regardless of whether you wanted their products or wanted them for their price. Further, Walmart would violently prevent any other grocery stores (food providers, like law providers), from selling food.
@Treblaine
@Treblaine 12 жыл бұрын
What difference does it make other than an "Argument from Authority" fallacy?
@TheBrutalDeluxe
@TheBrutalDeluxe 12 жыл бұрын
1. Public monopolies differ from monopolies as we were discussing them. In the UK there are half a dozen energy companies and 2 cable/satellite companies plus Freeview/.Freesat. 2. Will do but I doubt it will disprove the point I was making re stable markets. 3. If everyone was watching NFL rather than college/HS football then people were only watching 1 thing. Without NFL football there was 2 things to watch. High school or college football. 2>1. QED.
@redunzl5
@redunzl5 11 жыл бұрын
SEC. 801. This title may be cited as the "Community Reinvestment Act of 1977". [Codified to 12 U.S.C. 2901 note] SEC. 802. CONGRESSIONAL AND STATEMENT OF PURPOSE. (a) The Congress finds that-- (1) regulated financial institutions are required by law to demonstrate that their deposit facilities serve the convenience and needs of the communities in which they are chartered to do business;
@skibumwilly1895
@skibumwilly1895 11 жыл бұрын
In “Inheriting an Abundant Earth” a simple rule tweak on inheritance ends up changing the direction and purpose of modern human life! Here’s a fair way to transition forward! It's something specific we can demand. If this isn’t the best answer, at least we’re thinking about what might be. Are we really just this close to having it work right? Oh yeah, it's a Ski movie! Watch “Inheriting an Abundant Earth” on KZfaq, then sign the petition, and share it everywhere!!
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