What changes (if any) do you hope are made to the Master Builder?

i think the main issue is that the only people getting paragons are those that are farming with the sole purpose of getting a paragon, and at that point they know exactly what paragon they want. this means that for casual players, theres no experimentation as paragons are essentially off limits in a normal game

So I actually had a chance to talk with the Lead Game Designer Rohan, and he mentioned to me and KhemoSwavey and DotTrev that they don't look at Engineer as a "Supportive" support tower, but rather a DPS tower. But definitely agree with the changes you suggest. I kind of wish Master Builder was built a little differently as well!

The paragon trap doesnt even need to touch bads. If it did traps just combine it with navarch who can take out bads and those are probably the only 2 towers you will ever need

The idea that you proposed with the paragon traps counting towards the next paragon's pops is amazing. Another idea would be to try to fight the notion that all paragons have to be super strong in popping bloons. Since it's a support tower, maybe remove a lot of the popping power it has and focus more on the support element. Kinda like an overclock that you can use only once per round (twice at d100) but stacks infinitely. Would be a breath of fresh air if every new paragon that came out wasn't a popping machine.

Feel like specifically for the boomer paragon,it should get an ability like perma charge,making it attack faster or make it so that the paragons can be maxed out with pops,since glaive lord regrow farming is the best way to get a high degree paragon

I really like the idea of letting the engineer paragon be able to get degrees for the next paragon since he is called the Master Builder

I think the paragon needs to reflect all 3 routes, still kinda mad about the engineer paragon, because now I’m worried about Druid paragon (favorite monkey is Druid, love avatar of wrath strategies)

Honestly I don’t mind the paragon power creep, but IMO the Engineer paragon was a huge letdown. It doesn’t feel like the paragon of a support tower in the slightest. It’s nice that it overclocks itself automatically, but couldn’t it do that for other towers in its range, since it doesn’t have global reach? What happened to the bloon trap? The cleansing foam? Also not really an issue but I also think it’s the least cool-looking paragon (say what you will about the Boomerang, but he’s got drip).

Honestly the idea of the "paragon trap" for the engineer paragon is really smart, buffing the paragons would be too op and this is just a fun way of doing it.

33.0 is coming with a new Paragon, Boss and further changes, however it is to keep your expectations on the neutral side as we don't know what else is coming with.

I dont play boss events anyways, paragons are something I get when I go for highest round records and so I still get hyped when new ones are announced cause theyre always fun to mess around with

I would really appreciate if one of the next few paragons were a much cheaper and weaker option instead of gradually getting more expensive/powerful. Add a 100-150k wizard paragon that’s good for the early tiers. I think this would really help with the power creep problem.

Dude... the editing put into this is amazing seriously impressive content

My idea for the builder would be to have each of the sentries do something different, where one would keep the sentry spawning (top), one would buff towers around it while placing foam (middle) and the last would be able to place multiple XL traps around itself (bottom). That way it keeps its cool sentry concept while also meshing them into the other paths

Really like your idea for the engi paragon trap. In a general sense, paragons should exemplify the best features of a tower without being obligated to incorporate the tier 5 ability. With the engi they put in pin and that was fun enough for me.

I hope NK takes their time with updating Master Builder and gives him what he needs to call himself a Paragon. I want my favourite tower to be done justice, and the glorified top path with little to no support he got last month was not enough.

I feel like paragons should be able to do extra damage to BADS for use in normal games, Also, I feel like we need more Bloons to pop in order to get higher degrees on paragons earlier so all paragons could be used for in boss events early on.

I saw this somewhere online where someone suggested the traps would make an explosion dealing massive damage (like the paragon sentries) after being filled

That master builder trap idea is GENIUS! I would love to see that

I kinda wished paragon could level up the same way heroes did.

Glue paragon and ice paragon should get paragon power from also how much bloons have been slowed. Since not all the paths do damage, this would be another great option, these would probably accumulate power together somehow until the combined max.

My idea for the overclock inclusion was that it has a ability that works like the techbot and allows you to max out (over loxk +ultraboost) the selected tower untill you change the thether to another tower.

I love your idea of the Master Builder trap getting sacrificed by other Paragons!

Imagine after all the towers get a paragon they add them in Battles 2 where they add a gamemode called "Boss rush" basically you either win by killing the boss early or killing your opponent while the gamemode is in Bananza too

I think it’s also important to mention Geraldo who was introduced in the middle of all of this with how ridiculously strong he is, making it easier to save for the stronger Paragons, as well as his Paragon Totems which is another way to get easy levels for Paragons. I suppose that’s just another element of the insane power creep in this game and will be addressed in the other video you mentioned.

The engineer does have the trap path, but it’s in the form of pin

6:24 here i think uou made a good point, the trap would fill up and slowly empty itself when it is full, without despawning. This could help make the trap act like a sentry like its a tower in itself, that contributes to the next paragon degree.

Very interesting topic. I believe that there is room for Ninja Kiwi to partly solve the difference in utility between some paragons through monkey knowledge. After all, there are still some unspent points every max level player has. Maybe some knowledge points could decrease the gap between the usefulness of the Boomerang paragon and the Dart Paragon, such as allowing the price of tier 5s to factor into the degree, so that Boomer isn’t stuck at degree 1 without a huge cost sink. As for power creep, I expect the Ace Paragon to push this even further given how costly and huge its tier 5s are. I think what we really need are more bosses that actually require the strengths of the other paragons. Bloonarius is the only boss that needs high pierce, and for the APM, it usually suffices; there's no need for Glaive Dominus at tier 3. The other 2 bosses, Lych and Vortex, are nothing but damage sponges asking for high single target DPS. We need more reasons for the strengths of niche paragons to matter and be useful. Vortex is the closest thing we have to that because it requires long range, but that has a problem too since it has a larger AOE than most paragons, forcing you to just use the global range attacks exclusively. It's going to be a big task to get everything just right.

I think the Master builder’s plain DPS should be slightly nerfed if it gets traps, but my idea for a trap would be a powerful trap that could eat a lot of ZOMGs, and have an ability to make a new ultra-powered trap that can eat a BAD, but it fills up right after. Also for the Overclock aspect, I think it should have a passive ability of buffing the effectiveness of the Overclock/Ultraboost

I love the Paragon Totem trap idea! Maybe they could be more effective than totems since you’d probably be getting them rather late.

I love your idea about the trap acting as sacrifice for other paragons. If I had my way I’d do these things: -Make Navarch ability cooldown much much longer at lower levels and decrease as you level up -Make each dollar generated worth 1 pop instead of 4 for levelling -Make master builder have a radius where it ultraboosts other towers each round -Give the laser sentry a lock option -Add a visible indicator to the MB overclocking himself so you can see what level he is -Add your paragon power XXXL trap idea -If it’s precedent that paragon abilities can affect BADs, then glaive dominus should knock BADs back slightly with moab press. -APM is fun, don’t touch him, except fix the instant lvl 30 bug

I think the paragon degree convertion trap is a great idea, but it would absalutly be overpowered because it would buff all the paragons by giving them higher degree, this buffs all paragon by the same amout so although this dose solve the trapless problem it dosen't solve the meda problem so I think the trap should give more degree the lower the original degree is, this way of it's used on a dart paragon that was orignally going to be degree 30 it would only boost it to 35 but a boomer paragon that was originally going to be 0 would become 20 and a boat paragon that was orignally going to be 50 would only be buffed to 51, and maybe make it so that when you use this ability you can also choose from a smal discount on the paragon and refound a small amout of money, or it can also give the paragon a small permenemt buff, the refound would not be added as power but because this way it would be getting a lower original degree which means the trap's degree power buff is stronger, if the player choose the discount then this could encorage new player to get use to getting low degree paragon before round 100 and this could prepare them for bosses because bosses are extremely diffrent compared normal bloons and some new player would just not play them because they think it's too hard, if the player choose the smal buff then this could encorage the more """EXTREME PRO GAMING""" player to make new meda stratagies to optimize degree farming with this, but this system is absalutly over powered if the paragons are as powerful as they are now so NK need to nerf the hell out of all the paragons I think this way the paragon system would be way more complicated to use effectively but if optimized paragons are will just as powerful as they are now, I think this could combat the current meta and encourage the player to invent and optimize new strategies by creating a learning curve on the paragon system this would make the new paragon system heavily based around the master builder giving buffs to other paragons but hey that's why it's a support tower

This man makes such amazing videos. The fact that he makes his videos only as long as necessary makes me respect him so much and the way he isn't afraid to make videos less than 8 mins is amazing.

Amazing work to the editor of this video

The Master does incorporate the bottom path with it’s pin Main attack. It’s not the big trap that everyone was hoping for, but still bottom path nonetheless

I would love to see an XXXXL trap that could swallow one BAD per trap, having that much power would be chaotic Balance?! WHAT'S THAT?!!

Making 100 degree paragons acquirable normally, with my personal suggestion being let paragons buy tiers once they're placed, would already go a long way to making them much more worthwhile in normal singleplayer

might be a weird comment but going back and seeing your older videos, and being able to basically see a before and after of you with a beard, you grew an incredibly good beard, you really pull it off man.

I think my favorite idea for the trap I've seen is being able to set it to eat all of a single type of bloon other than bads. Like, you set it at the end of the track and choose ddts, and it just never fills up, but only eats ddts.

Something you mentioned briefly - it's so hard to balance things that are so far in lategame because if you are farming optimally, you can spend the money for APM, you might as well just get an Ascended Shadow instead. Minor damage increases don't really shake out and even with the fraction of towers as paragons that exist now some are totally useless.

amazing content keep up the good work

I would say that a trap ability for the engi paragon could be there. Like you click it, a massive trap covering the screen is lowered from ropes that eats up everything non bad. Then it is stored somewhere on the map( you cannot place towers over it or it will break, releasing all bloons held).

Really cool solution with the sacraficial trap.

if a bloon trap was implemented for the engine pagaron maybe give it a lot more bloon capacity such as doubled the amount of RBE from big trap. or be able to place 2 or 3 big traps. it would then be even more of a support tower because late rounds you are getting a lot more BAD's so then you may want to engie towards the back to clean up. or another idea. if you have certain paragons on the field maybe they debuff or even disable other paragons. say you have APE on field. you would not be able to get a ninja paragon down or the ninja would have less damage. now from a coders perspective this would be something that would be a PAIN to add and maintain.

If Paragons were only a side act in every patch, like new skins, they would be great. but they add 0 replayability to the game and therefore not much new content. They really butchered the game when stopping to add new towers and deciding to nerf every tower to the ground. Chimps is so boring when all u can do on harder maps are perma spike strats

That bloon trap idea is genius!

I have a SUPER EASY fix for this whole problem: Instead of round 120, make the boss go to round 200 on elite. Honestly it solves all problems. Now we have the dart paragon early, then ppl can chose between glave or engi which can overclock paragons (instead of BAD trap) or even sun god and then a 1 million pricetag Ninja or Navar for late. Honestly it is the obvious route to take.

i wish the vtsg was a paragon and that u can get the lotn and anti to make freeplay even easier

i mean, for what it's worth, the dreadbloon is supposed to have immunities to certain classes of towers, which will hopefully add paragon variety. outside of that, more gamemodes where paragons are available and have different necessities/strategies that could maybe help

the idea of support paragon helping level other paragons is BIG BRAIN keep up the great work

I have a pretty fun idea for the paragon trap. Since the bloon chipper is confirmed to not be coming to bloons, they can add a big bloon chipper as a trap, it would also be a cool easter egg if the bloon chipper on scrapyard would get sacrificed into the paragon (just an animation ofc, wont buff the paragon). Basically, it does big damage to all bloons and tosses them back, but it has durability with bads and will explode after sucking in a couple bads (maybe increasing with degree?!?!) after it explodes you need to use an ability to bring it back. this way it is the only way to stall bads while not being too op with the ability to insta kill them

I would love if by beating the first game of each difficulty you unlock extra challenges. I previously had the idea of support only and camo regrow pain, you know stuff like that. But I would also love a mode where rounds rank up super fast and you get double the money, always degree 100 paragons and cheaper too.

you have edited the subtitles, this is fantastic!

I would keep the engi the exact same as it is, however its ability is the trap that can take in a BAD but has a very very long cooldown. It also has cleansing foam , but it can remove fortification from bfbs moabs.

My first thought was that it could give a buff like the Elite Sniper, but maybe increasing the attack speed the further the balloons get down the track

I would say the trap could eat BADs but can only be placed once every 2-5 rounds also a BAD would extend the wait time to five rounds no matter what while filling up the trap

I will say, ever since the boat paragon was introduced. I haven't used him for boss events after I saw him solo Bloonarius Elite tier 5. A good boss event would have players go back to the old strats for Elite bosses. Meaning Elite specific restrictions, Mad and temple with damage amplifiers for tier 3, Vtsg for tier 4, etc. Another good way to balance the boat paragon problem is to make every 100$ count as 1 pop. There is no fixing the Apex unless the MK point is removed or changed sadly. Paragon levels could also maybe count Abilities as more level food for higher degrees to balance out things

Master builder does in a way have a bit of the bottom path, tier 3 to be exact, since he uses more than one gun :)

make the engi paragon spawn a bloonchipper, nerf damage of the sentries a small amount, nerf damage of the guns as well, and have a 10% attack speed buff to all towers on screen, piece of cake. the bloonchipper "trap" sucks in 50 moab-class bloons, except bads. it's an ability that has a crazy long 2 minute cooldown, and while the ability isn't active, the engi paragon just spawns regular xxxl traps.

Another idea for the over clock is that the ability boost every tower in a zone and paragon too but slight 10% or 20% speed or range Idk. For the trap the paragon idea is super cool, I can totaly imagine having all paragon to a decent degree in only one game with this. But it could also be something like it eat an infinite amount of bloons, and get only filled up by moab or higher. Now the thing that would make it not the ultimate cleaner would be to make it only make money and paragon power by eating moabs or higher, so it's would be a choice to make. Sad part is once you are done building paragons it become brain dead again but it's at least limited by the tower range.

wait that trap funtion you said is kind of insane thats so smart

This man is a genius. I like how your mind works Hbomb and I like your videos too

I would let the master builder to apply a random tower an overclock buff, with a chance of having an ultra boost charge every couple of seconds, in terms of the bottom path, i think it should have like a bloon chipper effect for bads, were it tries to suck them up, deals damage, then the bad escapes the trap. (It's also kind of a stun)

Master Builder trap Throws the trap into a MOAB, ZOMG, BAD, or Boss and causes balloons that would normally pass through the large balloon to be absorbed into it for X amount of time. Upon expiration, deal damage equal to RBE absorbed by the trap. X is dependent on Paragon level with diminishing returns. Would make for an interesting ability, gotta time it, and has the double effect of allowing your damage towers to focus the boss while also turning enemies into damage... for a time.

I feel like for the navarch, the farm meta part could be changed by halving the amount of $ -> pops to only 2 pops

I’ve learnt that you can use the tier 5 middle path from the heli that you can pick up a sentry from the paragon

Actually making a trap ability that is similar to his 0-0-5 but instead of giving out money it buffs other towers depending on how full it is and when it explodes it can be like a super buff (idk it just has to be flashy), might be nice

" locked with a crazy long cooldown " navarch of the seas cooldown: literally a few of the fastest abilities to regen and can still instakill bads

do you think making all heroes excluding (adora,ben,geraldo)have some sort of mechanic that helps with paragons when they hit level 20 a good idea?

Ultraboost aura was my idea of what it would do pre release. Would be perfect for engi

One thing that might be a bit broken but risky for the engie is if he gets an ability where he puts down a trap that insta kills everything other than bosses, BUT, it can only pop 1 balloon. So you either get a BAD or you get a red balloon and poof, it's gone

the master builder trap helpng build other paragons would be amazing! Thats a fantastic idea

The way I would change the engineer paragon is I would leave the tower itself the same (albeit without the self ultraboosting) and change its ability instead. Where the first time you use it, it spawns the red turret, the second time you use it, it spawns some kind of 'radio beacon' that grants an overclock buff to nearby towers, and the third time you use it, it spawns a trap that can eat a RBE slightly higher than 1 BADs worth (The idea being you need to use the ability 3 times each time you want a trap, so its not as reliable as navarch's ability, nor can it kill a fortified BAD). That being said however, I do like the idea of the trap being a sacrifice for the next paragon you get instead.

welp dreadbloon came out and i think the immunity could be fun to play with to force certain paragons, like onstead of limiting to one cat cant deal damage, there could be that only one category can eal damage

I think this should be for the Master Builder • Overclock should be an AOE Burst That Overclocks other towers around it from time to time, Kinda like 0-4-0 Super Monkey Ability l • The Trap would be able to suck up MOAB's for a certain time so that it constantly collects RBE rather than sit there being a Liability • Add one more Turret that is a Monkey Farmer that Collects Banana's and add 20% of that Revenue per Banana Collected and added more Radius • Or that Turet can Collect Banana's from Farms and Shoot out peeled banana's on the ground that stuns a bloon or blow back a baloon Tell me if it's too much or remove one or two of them then it's enough

For master builder "Black Hole Trap" could fit 10x the XXXL trap does and hold 1 Bad then it sells automatically

Which hero to buy first? Or should I invest in knowlage points at the beginning?

6:21 i think it's possible, but it would be balanced like: he will be able to eat a bad for every 50 degrees

For the master builder I think a trap that can hold 2 FZOMGs or any equivalent would be good. It doesn’t have to insta kill BADs but it should be an upgrade.

Great vid, but yeah the main issue as I see is that for casual players a new game mode where you have to beat r120 would be necessary to make paragons realistic... (ik that the elite boss ends on 120, but that's not really for casual players;))

The master Builder doesn't need to kill bads but it definatly should be able to OC other paragons. + the trap in some way.

I was thinking like you say, if it has instant bad killer with very long cool down or limited amounts like only 1 trap, or make it so you can hook like 20 Zong’s and suck up 20 zomgs in the trap 2

I think making engineer have a trap ability, which could eat one bad, or equivalent RBE, with a massive cooldown.

The master builder incorporates more paths from the dartling gunner than the engineer.

Engineer Paragon Rework -Replace laser beam sentry for a sentry that deploys XXXL traps and automatically picks them up (lasts 60 secs and have 75 secs cooldown for the sake of balance) -Replace rocket sentry for a sentry that apply an ultraboost every 5 secs to a random tower in its range (lasts 60 secs also 75 secs cooldown) -Buff the damage of the plasma sentry

i think glaive dominus could have a spot to shine once we get a boss that splits into multiple parts or something, so hitting multiple of them is gonna be good, but at the same time APM should have a slight nerf for bouncy balls, like -1 max bounce, or turn some of the damage into utility, making all nearby non-energy projectiles empowered with plasma, giving +1 damage, but decrease the damage of the paragon itself (x5x dart thingy) at least glaive dominus can attack through the vortex shield, maybe ascended shadow should also be useful for maps with awkward placements and heck, maybe paragons could have their own boss utilities, in this case slowing down the boss by 10-20% based on the degree

Since ace paragon is next I believe it will be under utilitesed because it will probably be too expensive and hard to level up it will definitely be worrying for future paragons

I'm really just waiting for the farm paragon. That will change everything

I kinda think the vengeful sun god tower is technically a super monkey paragon because it needs darkness champion and anti-bloon out of range for it to work

I feel like Paragons are great for BTD6 Veterans to challenge themself with Freeplay. Having them at all is still nice, although the balance of Price and Damage is something that will need some reworking but when we get more Paragons we should be able to see some synergies and hopefully stuff like a Glue paragon for mostly support with some damage or an Ice Paragon that takes a well rounded tower and turns it into a crazy Synergetic Hybrid that can stun while also being a damage machine. Some people make jokes about stuff like the Monkey Village or Banana farm getting a Paragon but I wouldnt mind that either, a Monkey Village Paragon would be nice, maybe being able to buff other Paragons while Having a more powerful Ballista attack (not nearly as much as other Paragons but there nonetheless), Letting towers effect BADS with effects or slows as long as beforehand it could have effected a ZOMG, Then giving every Tower within the radius a small damage and attack speed buff, and having a even more powerful buff ability that lasts multiple rounds, For the bottom path being included it could probably have something like a map-wide auto-pickup for any form of money generation, Sniper Drops, Heli Drops, stuff like that. Idk either way Im hyped for whatever is next

Let the master builder paragon have a trap that CAN eat a bad but only if it hasn't eaten ANYTHING else and it can be manually sold but goes on a cooldown thus meaning you have to choose between having the trap up for support on other moabs or sell it to specifically handle the bad

Can the pop count that the traps produce get converted to paragon power instead? I think it would be the most interesting way to lean into him supporting other paragons. I think a nice way to balance it would be to make it a perma trap with a pop limit and when that's reached the trap would go offline for a certain amount of time, rounds or both And the amount of paragon power generated would scale with the level of the master builder

Speaking of problems with _things_ in Bloons, you should definitely do a video about the problems with bosses. They definitely have a lot of problems, such as their extremely repetitive nature, as well as the fact that a boss always feels the same, no matter what map or, even restrictions.

I have an idea: what if Engie Paragon had an active ability that could increase a paragon's _degree_ temporarily? That combined with the paragon totem trap could balance the playing field among the other paragons who don't have a good way to up their degree. That personally seems like the biggest issue in paragon balancing. Also, NK could go for a meta where getting lower degree paragons is better for support while higher degree paragons do the damage. That would let stuff like Glue Paragon or Sniper Paragon work with nonparagon damage dealers, or maybe even 4th degree tower spam strats.

Idea for the trap: Eats BFB and below or ZOMGs that are down to 1/4 of their health, the trap doesn't despawn or get filled up however gives a 1.1x bonus for all money generated via balloons going into the trap, so one red balloon on round one would give 1.1 dollar,

Notice how this only came out because the engineer paragon didn't have a trap at release.

Good idea. Also let us lock the purple sentry. I avoid using Master Builder because I hate that the laser follows me around when I'm collecting money and placing monkeys and I can't lock it in place.

Master buidler trap concept: bloons in trap are cnverted to energy for paragon totems(liek geraldo's) which cdan be place whenever an abiltity is active that activates when tehre's enough bloons trapped to create a totem

congrats! now we have a paragon limit and i cannot have fun in freeplay