What's a new bending ability you think they should add?? ~ Tim

Her 230 year lifespan is/was definitely just a continuity error, but I fully support them doubling down on it and saying no y'know what, yeah, she's literally immortal cuz she's just THAT badass.

I like the idea that Kyoshi at 230 decides she wanted to change. She willed herself to flow onwards from her stagnation. But in doing so, those 230 years of life caught up with her and she died just as she decided to truly live.

I like to think that Kioshi not just *die*, but she made a whole big sacred ceremony while her body disintegrated in ashes through Kioshi's Island because she is a badass

I remember doing calculations based on what we see of past Avatars in the Air Bender temple, and taking the ten thousand years of the Harmonic Convergence cycle as literal, to show that the average lifespan of an Avatar was under 50 years - suggesting they usually die violent deaths.

I believe the improv rule of "yes, and" applies to retconning as well. The creators could have said "no, Kyoshi was not born that long ago, ignore that line". But they instead said "yes, and this is what it means for the worldbuilding".

"Avatar Kyoshi refused to die, both because she was too good for death, and because she decided not to, but in the end death only found her because she went knocking at his door." was exactly where I thought this would end up, but it was still very satisfying to see it happen.

11:44 the fact that Sozin and Roku share a birthday and the second Kyoshi book sets up the fire Nation uniting under the shadow of Kyoshi keeping them in line makes me think that Sozin being born when she died might not have been an accident and might’ve been an attempt at getting a fire lord avatar

I can see Toph learning the immortality secret.

I like this because it comes with consequences, its not just a miraculous solution. And it also continues something mentioned in the show: that Kiyoshi's sense of justice did not match the opinion of the people. Her heroic act was judged negatively by the citizens. A conquerer that upsets the status-quo is to her, the representation of the old, stagnant, a bad thing. for the people it might be positive, the possibility for change. This being-out-of-touch or having a biased point of view fits very nicely with someone who has stagnated herself, who the world has outgrown. The island she created herself is a representation of how she encased herself in a bubble.

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I like to think Earthbenders can sustain themselves physically since they are so connected to the physical. Whereas, Airbenders may keep their spirit in a body at a near death state.

Lao ge is my top pick for a villain in a future Avatar project. I'd die to see the story of Kyoshi's death.

This really fits how Earth Kingdom peoples general cultural perceptions have them have less benders and their stubbornness is tied to their bending styles. It actually fits a ton of how they use earth bending but just extended out to the physical body.

I like your idea for her death, I can see her realising that the world is changing around her and yet she has not. With that realization she accepted deaths embrace and allowed the next avatar to be born

i always assumed everyone lived over 100 years in avatar because Zuko expected Aang to be an old man who trained for 100 years. Also, the old guy that killed Katara's mom has an even older mom. Also King Boomy is basically what Aang would have been in that scenario. A super old but powerful master. I assumed everyone was like that

It also makes sense that, since other benders have thematic abilities related to their element, earth benders might be able to tap into immortality easier. Earth, or stone, is typically rigid and immutable. Focusing on treating their body much like a mountain, they could theoretically train to resist outside influence to their physical form the same way they resist being crushed by boulders.

Going by the logic of "crystalizeing themselves", Anng was, at one point before the show started, immortal. Also, as a Zelda fan, you can see this exact logic of having an unbreakable and unchanging will come up ALWAYS with characters who live for longer than they should.

your theory of kiyoshi choosing to die is very interesting and possible. A suspicion ive had for a long time is that something really emotionally upsetting happened to kiyoshi and unbalancing her and stopping herself from being able to keep herself stagnant. The immortality technique requires allot of emotional control, serenity and self asuredness. So i think if you managed to make someone using it really conflicted and emotionally upset that might end them.

The fact that Kioshi is the only Avatar that achieved this is important in itself, as it could have been her communing with previous Avatars that led her to make the decision to "move on".

The way you wove this dark immortality narrative made me think of terrariums - beautiful to watch, but if you open the lid, the smell of rot comes out pretty quickly. Gotta say, wasn't expecting the plot twist here to be "the creators made a mistake" 😂 good stuff! Characters who choose to die are a really powerful archetype - hope that we get to see Avatar Kyoshi's spiritual let go one day. Great video, Tim!

Not the only time that a philosophy creates a very extremely specific version of bending. Zahir being able to fly freely using air bending is an air-bending specific version of this. I forget if combustion bending had something like that or was experiments or whatever.

“In the time before the Avatar, we bent not the elements but the energy within ourselves.”

The way you described immortality in the Avatar universe gave me some serious “stagnation caused by the rejunivating waters” vibes from Sekiro.

1) We don’t know how long Yangchen lived. 2) It’s pronounced Lao Guh. 3) love your videos

This made me think about Marceline in adventure time, and how scary it would be to be immortal and stuck in the mental patterns you had when you became immortal

I really like this idea ... the stronger resolve you have, your body decays slower, If you are truly stagnant of mind, truly unwaivering resolve, stubborn, you stop ageing completely and become immortal.... and so comes the disadvantage to immortality ...

I like this theory. It, again, give the contrast between how earthbender and airbender's ideology about the cycle of life and death. While earthbender's ideology immortalised themselves by stagnated their body and mind, the airbender's ideology immortalised themselves by giving up the body and set free their soul to live at spirit realm, like what iroh did.

I always thought Kyoshi's and Bumi's long life had to do with bonebending. Since our bones are made of calcium, I always figured that self bonebending could be an Earth style. I feel like we can see it used when Bumi first introduced. He all hunched over, and then his his posture changes extremely while his bone make cracking sounds when he goes to fight aang. I have also imagined that a form of musculoskeletal, or arthritic, pain relief could be achieved this way.

I’ve been loving the novels specifically for their world building and how they’ve expanded the lore. These books are so packed with references to the most random and specific things from the shows and comics, and the stories that take place are all compelling and interesting. If you haven’t read them and you’re an Avatar fan, do yourself a favor and check them out.

I respect the hell out of anyone who makes a timeline error in production and goes "screw it, shes immortal now"

I definitely subscribe to the idea of the avatar recognizing, even if they stagnated, that they could not/should not break the cycle of the avatar and willingly surrendering instead of pursuing immortality. Especially if Kyoshi began to see that her stagnant ways were not leading to a better world. Stagnant or not you can still recognize patterns and even if you can't change your ways your perception of those ways can change, especially if you commune with the prior avatars for some feedback.

I can sort of see Earthbending providing some kind of internal enhancement, related to how Waterbenders can heal. It would also fit the endurance of the combat-oriented Earthbenders we see. Not just toon physics, but their bodies are just tougher? And yeah, Kyoshi deciding to meet death on her terms is cool, and fitting as the Avatar.

I really like the idea of this being earthbending-specific. The bender becomes like a mountain or another large piece of rock, immovable and eternal, at least compared to human scales. And it would be an example of a very spiritual earthbending technique, which shows that airbending and waterbending aren't the only bending styles with spiritual techniques. Yes, historically airbending has been "the spiritual one" and waterbending has healing (as a relatively common skill, too), but earthbending having a spiritual technique shows that even the elements with historically less spiritual practice have techniques the bender can learn through spiritual practice. Which makes me want to explore the possibilities for spiritual practice in all bending styles, but especially earth and fire since those are the less explored ones.

That’s interesting. “Immortality” is a HUGE thing in Daoism! The Chinese have been studying herbology, physical exercise (from martial arts to more subtle exercises like chi kung), nutrition and acupunture for thousands of years now :)

Immortality and stagnation kinda fit as the dark side of the immovable and stalwart earth benders

So I always did agree with the idea that Kyoshi chose to die, but because of this video I actually have a different theory: You talk about how this is likely related to Guru Pathik's way of life. Well Aang is never able to fully unlock his chakras because he is too connected to the world and the people in it. As much as I love Rangi, I wonder if perhaps she died around the time Kyoshi is middle aged and because of this Kyoshi, much like Zaheer in 'Enter the Void', lost the last thing tethering her to the world and preventing her from clearing that final chakra. She goes on to live however many years, but then perhaps down the line, she falls in love again; she becomes connected to the world again; she no longer stagnates. I feel there's something very poetic about being imortal, until such time that you're able to feel love and feel human.

It seems a part of said stagnation to become inmortal is staying away from other people. Meeting others it what makes humans want to learn to change and grow, so the easier way to keep that focus on keeping everything together in your body and mind is isolating themselves so no new thoughts or ideas taints them. Therefore another bad side effect of searching inmortality in the Avatar world is loneliness.

I'm really glad the Kyoshi novels are finally getting some attention. They're so great.

This channel has long been one of my favorites on KZfaq. I used to have strong preferences when I was reading but I couldn’t articulate why one novel or short story was so much more engaging for me than another. I used to write extensively in my teens but it tapered off when I wasn’t replicating the depth and complexity of what I read from other people. Watching your videos has expanded my enjoyment of the stories I consume. And your voice is steady and soothing, which makes it great to have on in the background while I do chores or if I’m in bed for the night trying to fall asleep. Would LOVE if you did a series on video game stories, which are a more interactive medium than books and movies and TV. I think it would be fascinating to explore what has worked really well, what bombed and why, and it could be an opportunity to raise support for writers in the industry.

I love that this skill is so uniquely related to earth-bending. Being calm and steadfast, mastering neural jing, waiting, listening, excerting total control over one's mind and body; all of these things sound like they'd be the PERFECT ingredients for immortality. And they also happen to be core values of, and skills needed for, earth-bending. I just love how they managed to give us such a satisfying explanation for a mistake. A happy little accident if ever I saw one :)

Thank you Tim! I connected about two thirds of the points you made in this video (the oldest characters in the show all being earth benders, Kyoshi's age, her choosing to die after realising it was sort of a curse) But you just connected everything that little bit more that made it all fit together so much neater, massive props. The only real difference is I suspect Guru Patik IS Loa Gee, and that eventually, if Aang hadn't chosen Katara, he would've taught him the technique just like he did Kyoshi. Though I think Aang would've objected again on similar grounds

Oh man I remember I first started watching you right when you were phasing out "Nightfurries" :D your books are cool. Can't wait for the Netflix series regardless of quality, but we all hope it's good. Kioshi being born 400 years before the series is one of the coolest oversights and lore quandary :D

I actually see this as highly related to Blood Bending. It's the Earth people's interpretation and lens through which they express their will over the human body. The philosophies of the Water tribes around change and adaptation translate to literally manipulating another person's will and changing how they move. For Earthbenders, the same principle applies but with their own philosophies of stubborn rigidity and resilience against change, so when the notion of "bending the body" is approached, it produces something more like immortality than puppeteering. I think it makes sense that regardless of how you're doing it, attempting to bend the human body comes with dire spiritual consequences that thematically echo the likes of Fullmetal Alchemist and the Philosopher's Stone. Balanced, in a word.

I feel each one of the bending disciplines can learn the ability to live long in different ways by mastering the “elements” of their elements. Earth benders through keeping their body orderly and stable. Water benders by allowing each of the cells in their body to change, but heal. Air benders by preventing the stress of the mortal world to weigh on their bodies. And even fire benders by maintaining the energy within their bodies keeping them lively. In all, every bender has the ability to live forever but the techniques are specific to the style.

I always views the prolonged life as a secondary ability of Earth Benders. It’s something that all Earth Benders can have, and maybe do have. That they can draw power, strength snd longevity from the Earth itself, slowing their aging, and promoting their life. Kyoshi and Bumi were both unimaginably powerful Earth Benders, alongside Toph, all three of which are, if not long lived, are extremely spry in their old age. Bumi and Toph being the direct examples.

I really like the idea that it's not bending but a whole new magic system based on the idea of mental focus and self-perspective, which anybody (theoretically) could achieve. Opens up a lot of possibilities for the future. Another ability in this new magic system could be Laghimas flight.

Kyoshi: Death can have me When it earns me.

dude iwas here since u were a kid and i was one too love seeing ur chanel grow

Banana _and_ onion juice! Onions are key! Seriously: Neal Stephenson explores this theme with a “Thousander” character named Fraa Jad in his novel _Anathem_ . If you haven’t read it, I bet you would enjoy it.

i LOVED this video!! thank you!!

Kyoshi is the definition of the perfect avatar. 👌🏽

Great vid, always nice to see new avatar content!

Always love your content! Excited whenever I get the ding!

Thanks for pointing out the beautiful esoteric knowledge in these powerful shows...

A Kyoshi show would be everything. I love her big messy boots. She feels regal and sharp; extremely calculated. In a different universe, a big ol' Slytherin💚; no doubt.

honestly i’d always assumed that Kyoshi passed away at the time of her choosing. i don’t see it making sense any other way

When I read the kyoshi novels and the line about bending the tiny elements in the tiny parts of your degrading body i immediately thought of Tim and how he must be maulding about it

Perhaps you could use this technique as a sort of emergency resort in a life-or-death situation. When you think about it, what distinguishes a living organism from a dead one is the internal order. A bullet to the head, an impaled stomach, a frozen heart, a body overrun by a viral or bacterial infection, or one riddled by parasitic worms, these are all cases of how that internal order can be disrupted or destroyed. But what if you could freeze or crystalize your body right as something was about to happen? Say you crystalized your brain and skull for a split-second before the bullet hit? Or your stomach before the spear penetrated your gut? Would that allow you to survive otherwise fatal happenings?

Love the idea there is a more spiritual and less direct side to each type of bending, earth benders live longer like water benders heal or air benders do that spirit projection stuff Idk what the fire bender version of this is tho

Great video! That is quite an interesting idea!

Great video as always!

Yay these are some of my favourite books I’m so happy there is a video on this.

You mentioned stagnation and I'm surprised you didn't pivot into the implications of the avatar cycle stagnating as well. Either eay, great video!

Hey Hello Future Me! Lore question for you. How did the air Nomad build/carve there temples on mountains tops and on the side of cliffs(western temple)? My theory is they may have used some advanced type of sound bending or airbending to levitate and carve the stones into the positions and shapes they desired. What are your thoughts?

Yay!!! Will be back to comment but got so excited when you posted!!

I think part of the earth bender thing comes back to what toph says when she talks about needing to be stubborn and to face it head on and I also think that bumi didnt follow that cuz he grew old and did die

The attribution of Stanation seems a little strange when applied to Guru Pathik, but I suppose if you can stall something you can also slow it to a crawl and that would seem to fit his rather relaxed approach to life.

I definitely perceive this ability as earthbending-related. I see it as the counterpart to flight or astral projection for airbenders - a high-level ability accessible at the purest spiritual form of your element. The freedom and worldly detachment of air, and the worldliness and unmovable mindset of earth.

I always thought her 200+ year life span was coz the writers dropped a random number (400) before the present day, then realised "shit, we want her directly before Roku"

I would love if you did a video on Yangchen and the confirmed "forbidden technique" in her first book. And the origins of combustion bending and chi blocking we get in her books too

It seems like earthbenders have a strong tendency for this longevity too. When you look at the list of people who lived way too long, up at the top you got this immortal dude, you got Kyoshi, Guru Patik, King Bumi, and Toph. Lots of old people living happy lives in the earth kingdom too. Quite a large kingdom it is, in fact. Not like these people are making earthquakes in the bedroom more often than everyone else, so longevity likely plays a role in their population.

Loved this video!!

I think she did use this stagnation technique for a few decades in order to bring balance to the world and only when she was satisfied with how the world was, she allowed her own flow to start again. Going by what we know Roku's life, it was mostly Sozin that caused issues and who posed the biggest threat to the balance of the world and even he only became a real problem near the end of Roku's life. So Roku likely inherited a very peaceful world from Kyoshi and this is due to her living 200+ years working on this peace and likely gave up her immortality at a point that she felt: the world will be fine for a few decades, so I can let go. So maybe, at the age of 200 or so, she allowed her body to pick up where it left off, stopping to keep her "inventory" (which likely also took its energy) lived for a few more decades, before going out peaceful so the Avatar cycle could continue. As another important part of the Balance in the world, the Avatar has to be reincarnated every few decades in a different nation for the peace to hold. But I also think, she didn't die before "taking care" of her old mentor, it is unnatural for people to live that long and this might as well disrupt the balance of the world.

Weekends are always a little better when a new Hello Future Me video comes out.

I was about to write a comment about how the passage from the book sounded similar to Daoist 'internal alchemy' (tai chi, qigong, neidan), but you did it for me :)

A video about Avatar? On the _Hello Future Me_ channel? Who would have guessed?!

Your conclusion is amazing 😂👏 this is such a great answer for the pickle the creators out themselves in

Excellent video! I think I see an alternative to your reading on the statement, here. 6:44 I see what you are saying, but it doesn't seem like the only possible interpretation. I think that he could be warning her against exactly that stagnation, and at the same time opening up the path to shape shifting. I.e. "You are correct, stagnation is a terrible fate that one can easily slide into. _Those who live_ are a clear flowing river, dying an uncountable number of deaths. If you want to live, you must allow for change and for parts of you to die." (But not necessarily the whole. You could change, yet continue to be you, and in rejuvenation change things a little, shifting your form over time and changing your experiences along with them.) "But, I try to teach you of the mind. Here, too, lurks that danger - however, the fields of the mind are vaster by far than those of the body, and as you continue to experience, you can continue to grow in mind as you do with your body, more even. For while the body naturally decays, the pure spirit only follows this decline. If you have the time, and stay vigilant against stagnation, you may surpass many would-be explorers." In this interpretation, I think Kyoshi would have understood it the way you portrayed in the video, at least at first. I could imagine her later realizing this, and then choosing to stop, seeing that she wasn't able to regain what she had unknowingly lost. I'd be curious to hear your take on this, I'm way less versed in the lore than you ^^

What an interesting question for Kyoshi to ask. It's such a change based question that comes out a seeming concern out of always staying the same which seems off base for Earthbenders who are stereotypically resistant to change. I wonder if that's the influence of the other Avatars

I would really like to see crystalbending as a new earth bending subset. Yes earth benders can move crystals we've seen this in the series. But I don't think we've heard of earth benders crystallizing anything themselves (someone please correct me if I'm wrong!). It would be neat if it was a technique developed with the help of water benders since water benders can easily create ice which is just a lattice structure of water. I don't think it gets too scientific. Plus I love when we can loop back to Iroh's speech about how learning about other benders techniques can improve your own bending.

Toph also being the last living member of Team Avatar also reinforces this idea that particular powerful (and stubborn) Earthbenders can access this technique. It doesn’t have to be bending per se, the way that Waterbending can move chi in the body to heal but you’re not… using Water to stitch wounds per se. There’s precedent for bending to extend past its element in allegorical was.

A project I’m working on has a similar immortality! So cool that they came up with a similar idea.

Your content is awesome man 😊😊😊😊❤❤❤

Love the Avatar chronicles content. Would you be interested in making a review with your general thoughts on these 4 books?

Involving the real world... in theory, bending could be utilizing solids, liquids, gasses, and plasma. Earth, Water, Air, and Fire respectively. If that is the case, then it could be that anyone could bend any actual element but the element would have to be in the form they can manipulate. So an Earth bender could extend their life by manipulting their solid bits while a water bender would need to melt first. Problem being: - Lavabending is an earthbending technique - icebending is a waterbending technique - metal bending requires impurities in the metal, so it cant be any solid. Ultimately, the spiritual nature of bending rules out over any other explanation, in Avatar, but I think each respective style bending matter based on its phase could be a neat idea in its own IP.

I have a theory that Earth bending Immortality (and some other advanced techniques) is a form of Energy Bending because it doesn't really involve any direct manipulation of Earth but it is tied to the spiritual principals of Earth bending. I think the same is true of techniques like Zaheer's levitation, Jinora's astral projection, the Bhanti tribe's 'soul reading' and perhaps even waterbending healing to an extent. These are techniques that go beyond manipulating an element and focus instead on mastery of the spiritual aspects of each element. Zaheer's Levitation depends on total peace of mind, Immortality requires that trademark Earth bending force of will and water bending healing is all about redirecting energy and renewal.

Nicely done of them. :)

thanks for the upload, my man

While I agree with you on being mostly against the idea of body-bending, this immortality/neutral jing/molecular crystallization is now the another bodily bending. First was water: blood bending. Then, we have fire spiritual-healing and the common water bodily-healing. Then, we have the air bending special technique of astral projection of the spirt. To me, it seems like we're being built up to body-bending being the ultimate Avatar exclusive technique requiring complete mastery and control over: the physical body (earth), the life-force or energy of life (fire), the freedom of the spirit (air), and the ability to consistently flow your energy from mental to physical and back (water). Fire is described as life to Anng and Zuko after they are judged by the dragons, air nomads have been connected to mastery of the spirit, and water has been a connection to the rest throughout the franchise - being our introduction to bodily healing, providing life in the physical world, and taming spirits via bending or spirit-world relations (the rains that will heal Heibai's (spelling?) forest, the spirit oasis not only holding the physical bodies of the moon and ocean spirits, but also its ability to heal near death injuries, and how Korra learns to start taming/calming spirits). It being a special bending requiring intense mastery and some type of dire need to perform, to the point where Kioshi is the only avatar to have even come close and even then not have succeeded, would make it balanced. These specialized bending techniques could all be pieces able to imitate the full process, but not actually do the real thing, just like how Amon gave the appearance of energy bending via chi blocking with blood bending.

This reminds me very much of the Bene Gesserit who learn to control the molecular structure of their bodies using training and a healthy addiction to spice.

To go meta, I've heard of this concept before, well more like a study that says our own cells "forgetting" what they are as aging progresses. Theory is making them "remember" again would on mitigate or even stall aging

I kind of like the idea that earthbenders have a semi spiritual connection to the 3arth that at the most extreme end allows the most powerful and determined individuals to live forever

I like to think it’s because of their connection with nature. You see the vine benders in Kora and thof’s (idk how to spell her name) ability to see through the vines.

If you want a book series on immortality in a fantasy world i would suggest the autorian archives. It goes pretty deep midway through the first arc and all the way into i think the third. Although be warned it's a spin off novel of a trilogy and they sort of skim over thoes events when they get to them.

The best thing about writing on the fly ideas can make or break stories

10:25 I always thought the mistake was made when Koh the Face Stealer talked about when he battled Avatar Kuruk (that's when I noticed Kioshi apparently lived for over 200 years), but indeed the Kioshi Island episode was before it, so I guess you're right.

Just a remark about the iron in blood: That wouldn't work because there's just not enough of it in the human body. It would follow the same principle as platinum or whatever those mechs were made of in LoK. There's simply not enough mineral-saturation to pull it off. =/ A good example is from Fullmetal Alchemist. The only reason why Ed was able to craft a blade in Gluttony's stomach was due to the sheer volume of blood to draw from, on top of any other minerals Gluttony had eaten that was mixed in.

There's a character in the Mahabharata named Bishma that is granted the boon of immortality. He only dies when he chooses to. It was a cool concept and it's cool to see it possibly applying to Kiyoshi

I like the idea that there are different tiers of bending. Regular "push a rock" to metal bending to inner body bending. Like water has liquid water to healing to spirit bending. While fueling the fan interpretations of what would bend a certain thing, it does provide depth to the system. As another example, in the Codex Alera series by Jim Butcher, there's both external fury crafting of the 6 elements (earth, air, fire, water, metal, & wood) and an internal part - fire crafters can stoke fear, water crafters can be empathic and heal, wood crafters are stealthy in wooded shadows and good archers, earth crafters can heighten strength and animal instincts (for lack of a better G term for the effect), air crafters can speed up mentally and physically, and metal crafters can nullify pain and hone their (metal) weapons to an exceedingly fine edge. The main character is creative enough to find other uses for various crafting forms.