I think awful paper is so much more detrimental than decent student paints. Most of the time you can get very similar results with cotman as long as you aren't using trash papers. There is of course a difference between student grade paints between brands though. Some brands (especially with cakes) are just awful. I've used cotman tubes and tbh there's not much difference between those and the professional tubes. The pans always looked too chalky to me in nearly any brand though if it's extruded. I make my own paints right now but I used WN professional and cotman for years.

I'm currently agonising over this and your comment has really helped me. I'd rather learn experientially why the Professional is better than the Cotman. So thank you.

@@joblowers211202 I'm so happy you found it helpful 😀

Me too! This is an old video now, but I still use my big studio set quite a lot. I love the Mauve :)

Glad to hear you echo my thoughts! I do love my Cotman set, but if I continue to paint semi-regularly I feel I might do the same as you and swap them out as I go.

The Colour Cave studio of m m here on KZfaq recently put together a custom watercolour palette & was using a mixture of cotman & a few other professional paints, they said that there are some colours in the cotman range that have high enough lightfast ratings that she would be happy to use them in a piece to sell. I think from the W&N pro range, you’d enjoy the olive green - it is much more earthy than say the sap green but it’s still bright and vibrant too.

@@colleenbeers8572 Olive Green! Oh don't tease me! 😂

The Colour Cave I’ll tag you on Instagram to show you!

Glad it was helpful!

This is so helpful! Thank you!

@@imrobie5758 You're very welcome. I'm glad to hear you found it helpful. 😊

Thank you Laura! 😊

@@TheColourCave You're welcome.

Hi Jacky, thank you so much for your comment - it's always lovely to hear that people are returning to art. I personally prefer pan paints, but your mention of tubes vs. pans might make for a good video! Hmmm! Thanks for dropping in to comment :)

You're welcome!

I’d love to hear your recommendations on student-grade paints for beginners, my experience being limited as it is. I enjoy my Cotman paints but I do prefer more delicate, desaturated colours so that’s probably why I like them so much.

@@TheColourCave I have Van Gogh tubes and I really like them, not done too much testing with the pan set I got but the tubes are cheap as chips. I have all three Jane Davenport palettes, the third one Glitz Sea has too many greens for me lol. However the brights have enough colours to get someone started and the Neutrals adds a second primary set. Apparently Prima and Jane Davenport are the same as the Mungyo and made by the same company. I snagged the 36 set of Mijello Mission Gold Professional paints that come with a palette for around £40-45. Most colours are super highly pigmented though there are a couple that aren't and a couple of fugitive colours. I also want to try Shinhan which are cheaper but don't come with a palette. It's also hard to work out which of their lines are which lol. Mission Gold also sells a pure pigment set that sounds interesting though I think it's heavy on either blues or reds. I have those flip out palettes that were everywhere a little while ago. They have no lightfastness ratings or colour names. They would be good for someone who likes a lot of control as I feel you really need to move most of them around yourself. Most are non granulating too but again highly pigmented. 42 colours for around £10 now I think plus the smaller cocktail (more pastel) colours. I'm trying out Daiso watercolours next weekend but for around £1.50 for 12 tubes how good can they be lol. I have some Royal and Langnickel I think they are and they are pretty awful, dry chalky and if you put them in a palette they flake out really badly lol. I think they were my first tubes and they are worse than Cotman! I will double check in the morning to make sure that was the brand. Sorry for the soliloquy, I love playing with watercolours and talking about them lol. I just don't get the chance that often! Oh and there are many paints I want to try! Being in AUS I have to be careful though. I bought one tube of Maimeri Blu and it slid all around my palette because it's made with honey 😥 Makes me scared to try other honey based tubes!

@@artycraftyalchemy appreciate the comment - thanks for all the info :)

One tube at a time is a good way to go 😁 That way you don't need to buy a whole new palette all at once.

Most Welcome!

I completely agree with you, especially on the layering. I would LOVE to try the Schmincke paints- definitely on my to-do list 😊

First off, ten Cave Points to you for having an excellent screen name. I’m still very much exploring different brands, but I’m enjoying the process... maybe one day I’ll have a varied palette too!

The Colour Cave Thank you, it originated with a joke about my mom’s old job and my tendency to be weirdly strong. But as for the palette, I found that using my cotman set helped me figure out which colors I like best. I gave it to my friend who liked cotman paints when I moved on to professional grade paints. As for trying paints, dot charts are the way to go, Daniel smith has them, and I think Schminke does too. It’d really let you get a feel for what colors you like, and I think the dots have enough paint to do at least a small piece of artwork.

Very welcome! 😊

Such a kind comment, thank you! I still use my Cotmans all the time, and I still enjoy them as a medium. I’m gradually replacing them with the professional set. It would be well worth saving for a smaller set of the professional colours (after all, you can mix what you like!) if performance is a big deal to you. It’s easy to get a hold of a large, empty palette and just add a half pan or two every now and then, starting with the colours you use most.

@@TheColourCave I spend way too long online last night checking out some options.. I found an amazing deal on the Talens Van Gogh 24 set for $36 which gets much better reviews than the Cotman (I do also have a small Cotman set already), but I also found out I can order the blank Van Gogh palettes on Amazon . I'm in the US and it's harder to get your hands on the European brands.. there is a bit at one store and a bit at another, so I had like twenty windows open at the same time lol. I can't settle on which palette I want because none of them have all the colors I'm looking for, the smaller sets could be combined but tend to have a lot of duplicates, and for some reason there is a HUGE price jump in their large sets which is typically the opposite of other brands where the price per pan drops, perhaps because they switch to metal palettes at that level? I've already discovered I like to have a lot of convenience colors so I think Van Gogh might be as close as I can get to large number count and affordable price, I just can't bring myself to pay the high end brand prices for paint some of them are just insane. Van Gogh has a 48 pan but it's about $120, the 45 pan (actually only 40 colors as that is all they make the rest are duplicated) Cotman is around $60, the largest WN professional I can find is 24 and it's $110. At the same time I'm debating whether pans are even the best idea for me vs. buying some tubes for a larger well palette but I hate having to mix everything that goes on paper and while tubes are more cost effective they have a much higher initial price point. I've got some thinking to do.

I agree, and actually have an extra one, but for some reason it’s interfering with my camera and creating lines across all of my videos. Weirdly, everything is in the same configuration as the old cave where it wasn’t a problem - still trying to figure it out!

@@TheColourCave I hope you don't need an electrician as well as your carpenter 😅

Haha I’ve already got one of those too, but that’s a whole other story! 🙈

Most welcome, I hope you found it helpful. I think the phthalo is a green shade.

@@TheColourCave thank you so much! and yesss, i found it very helpful! especially the side by side swatches :D

I bought it sealed directly from W & N, so yes. Even if it was a ‘dodgy’ set, the paint colour names would have matched those of the Cotman set. Winsor & Newton are a U.K. based company, so it may just be a case of price/import costs for the professional paints. I have seen the same casings with Cotmans in them too.

@@TheColourCave Thanks for replying :) It's cool that you can choose in the UK which grade comes in the travel set!

@@aartadventure Jackson's have the pro set on the Aus site, but it is vomit-inducingly expensive - I could buy the 24-pan set here in the UK for the same money 🤯 Here's the link if you'd like to check it out all the same... www.jacksonsart.com/en-au/winsor-newton-professional-watercolour-field-box-set-of-12-half-pans

Yes! 😁

@@TheColourCave don't you mean 'eye'