Every time I hear the "which plane is better" discussion, I recall a Chuck Yeager story about a time he beat a younger pilot in a dogfight. The younger guy says "Yea, but you have the newer, better jet". So Chuck traded planes with him and still beat him.

I was an air traffic controller in the Navy and one of the best sights I ever got to see was during the Tiger Cruise on the USS Constellation. It was the last cruise of VF-2 Bounty Hunters flying the Tomcat. During the Tiger Cruise we had an Air Show out at sea and I got to see the F-14 do a super sonic flyby at 60 feet above the water. The most badass flyby I have ever seen. Watching the shockwaves hitting the water as the Tomcat blew past the ship was just AWESOME and something I will never forget!

Could've listened to them go on much longer. They covered so many details about the F14 that we don't know about its flight characteristics. Would've like to hear more on the F18 as well. These guys are seasoned pilots that know these planes like the back of their hands.

The Tomcat has 5 or 6 features that we all fans loved: 1) Variable geometry. 2) Those nice twin rudders, widely separated and inclined outwards. 3) Those air intakes, aggresively pointing forward and also with that beautiful negative inclination. 4) The black and white Jolly Roger of old VF-84 color scheme (yes, many of use discovered it in The Final Countdown). 5) Top Gun. 5) Robotech, with their Variable Fighters VF-1 Valkyrie so obviously inspired in the F14, even with the Jolly Roger. So in the end, there will be no other fighter with such a big fan population than the F14 for many decades to follow. It may fade somewhat when my generation fades away (I was born in 1978), but I think it will have to pass muuuch time for another one to come and reach thos level of fame

Scooter was my C.O. in VF-2. Great Skipper. Tragic loss for not only his family, but for the Navy too!

I notice the confidence in this gentleman’s speech, must have something to do with being catapulted from a carrier in an F14 and an F18. Love the channel, thank you for your service 🇺🇸

The Tomcat was the ultimate Bethpage, Long Island Beauty. In gloss gull gray over gloss white and in VF-84 or VF-111 livery, the F-14 may well be the finest looking military aircraft ever produced.

Trots was in my airwing (CVW-14) on the Connie 1985-1987. He was one of the few Hornet guys who were cool to F-14 guys, including RIOs. He most likely saved my life by taking a timely go around (he was dash 3) as our flight lead and we ended up sideways on the short (east/west) runway at Fallon due to an ABS failure and subsequent brake fire on the lead aircraft.

As a kid of the 80’s the F14 is so iconic. I think the F16 looks like a sports car while the F14 more of a muscle car … and the F18 is their child somewhere in between. It’s also amazing that the F14 is the first aircraft to use a microprocessor.

F-14D launching off the cats at twilight, then going ballistic into the night sky is one of the most beautiful sights ever.

Shame we never got to see the Super Tomcat 21 :(

The F-14A was late and way over budget waiting for the GE engine that was supposed to power the F-14. Out of desperation, it was decided to put the TF-30 engine from the F-111 into the "A" model. The TF 30, I think it was originally designed by Allison later taken over by Pratt &Whiney, needed to be modified for use in a "fighter" so they added an afterburner and a couple of additional compressors to the engine. When I got to VF124 in 1975, as one of the last non-fleet qualified F-14 instructors, the airplane started to have unexplained losses at sea. Because of where the airplanes crashed, they were unable to get to the airplanes to determine the cause of the losses. All the crews had reported was a flash of light followed by an explosion. As an aside I remember one of the RIO's at sea fell from about 20,000 feet without a proper chute opening, and he survived with minor injuries. One of the nuggets preparing for initial carrier quals was in the FCLP pattern at Miramar and an engine exploded on a go-around. Since they had access to the crash site they were able to determine the cause of the engine failure was a cracking compressor blade due to a stress fracture caused by a harmonic in one of the additional compressor sections. The fix was a spacer between the new compressor sections. We all wondered why this only happened in the F-14 and not the F-111. About 300 hours of fleet airtime later the same thing started to happen again. This time they got a crashed aircraft sooner and were able to determine that when they added the initial spacer they moved the harmonic to the other additional compressor section. The F-111s didn't have the problem until about 600 hours of airframe/engine time. It was determined that the harmonic was worse between 86-88% RPM. That was where the RPM's were in carrier landing practice and that flight regime was where a lot of Navy flight time occurred. The F-111's went on long missions practicing bombing missions and their engines were not in the 86-88% range during those missions but when they got about twice as much flight time on their aircraft, their engines had the same flaw.

From an aesthetic standpoint, I go for the F-14 every time. In the 70s, when my step-dad was in the navy, the tomcat was my poster plane. It was the reason I wanted to work on a carrier deck.

CDR Dale Snodgrass was my CO in VF-33 he brought a Tomcat back with a blown airbag from a 2 V 4 hop in Key West. As young PO3 I jokingly said "they must have been chasing you all over the sky" He smiled patted me on the should an said " Nobody Chases ME!" To this day I believe him. Good man Great leader. Me he rest in peace.

The funny thing about "analog vs. digital" is that the world's very first microprocessor's very first usage was to control the swing wings on the F-14. Only after that, was the 4004 microprocessor used for a calculator then a pinball game!

On Enterprise, the recoil from a loaded Tomcat shot could be felt down in the propulsion plants.

When experts in any field are having a technical discussion, it’s almost always interesting to listen. Not just any average joe, an expert. They have that bit of confidence and assertiveness you don’t find anywhere else.

Excellent info here. Love it! I was a Plane Captain in VFA-113. The first time I saw a Tomcat do a fast run, the flight deck was cleared( I just happened to walk out my berthing and onto the deck, I wasn't supposed to be there. Didn't know) when I saw this bird screaming straight down the port side. Broke the sound barrier right next to me! Holy f♡€《n s#|t! What a rush!

I watched the upgraded Hornet at an air show the other year and it was my stand out plane. The pilot pulled manoeuvres in that thing in such a small amount of airspace I was quiet amazed. There were eurofighters which ripped the sky apart and migs but that plane stood out for me.

FINNALY !! The definitive description, and last word on A Vs D and F-18. Thank you aviators, and good night nurse ! BTW 150kts, to 610, in 9.7 secs, = 46kts per second, for 10 seconds, 52 mph per second, and is ASTONISHING !!

Excellent conversation. Thanks for letting us eavesdrop.

As a kid, my favs were always the F-18, F-14, and the A-10. Had so many scale models of those and owned every toy I could find that represented them - GI Joe, Transformers. Never got into Robotech, but seemed interesting.

Aviation Maintenance 05-09. I was lucky enough to get to see Tomcats still flying right before they were removed from service as I entered my first command. One of my first memories of my arrival at Oceana as I made the left turn to head to the BEQ, I looked up and there were four of them flying pretty low, in formation. They were gone within a week or two. It was awesome. Ironically enough, I was arriving to maintain their replacements as aircrew obtained all their quals at the RAG. Brand new F/A-18E and F Supers. And now, those are set to be retired in two years.

what a great informative sharing, enjoyed this episode a lot, thanks guys!!!

Man I love this conversation! So much comprehensible information for a military aviation enthusiast like myself

Fascinating little gouge. Thanks Jello and Trots. I noticed the 82nd Airborne Division patch on the wall behind Trots head. That's where I served back in the day. Loved it! Perhaps I should mail you a 505th Parachute Infantry Regimental Crest patch?

Day and night qualified in an F-14D and F-18. Can not get better then this. Awesome sirs.

Thank you, gentlemen. Trots' concise summary of the jets and scenarios is one of the best I've heard.

Both guys lived during the Discovery Channel D model flyby. I was the tanker for the next event and saw it. Both recovered by the helo, a bit banged up but ok. Biscuit and Slim.

The full interview with Trots was a blast. I can't believe how much energy he has still, and what he must have been like as a young lieutenant - keep him away from the caffeine.

This guy was a CAG so, loads of respect! The "A" model had TF-30 PW (same as the F=111) and the "D" (the best of the breed) had General Electric F110s, a serious upgrade! I personally can testify about the reliability of the TF-30 as I was a (AFSC) 431 in the Air Force! In training I don't believe the 111s ever came back "Code1"! As an Air Force GUY, I still love the Aesthetic beauty of the Tom Cat! It "LOOKS" like it's hauling a$% just sitting on the ground!!!!!! I guess I'm just "old school" cause I would pick the Tom Cat over the F-18 every time!

Love this stuff! Keep them coming!

God the F-14 was my favorite when I was a kid. This guy is a legend to me. I got to watch the Grunman F-14 from Top Gun fly when I was a kid, at a Miramar airshow. But I was also a fan of the F-15, and we'd go to Edwards more often than we went to either Point Magu or any of the other California Naval bases. Got to sit in a YF-23, somewhere between 1989-1991. They were only allowing children up to the age of 11. The parents had to stand way back behind the lines lol. Part of the console was covered, as I recall. Back in those days they were allowed to break the sound barrier at an airshow. Flyby passes were well faster.

If I remember right I read somewhere that the F-110’s were burning through the lining for the AB which then burned through the flight controls. The fix was the liner had to be replaced every so often. Both great aircraft but I wonder how much better the Tomcat could have been if it had the dedicated funding like the Eagle had/has

Just saw this in my feed. This is a question I always wondered from two of my favourite aircraft. I'm subbed now. Keep the content coming.

Was a LSO in CAG 2 when he was the CO of VFA-151. Great guy.

Great podcast with outstanding insights on the F-14 and F-18. Wonder how many other squadron commanders had the same requirement for 'auto throttles?'

What a conversation. I’d love to have a ride in one of these amazing machines.

My dad worked for an old company named Singer-Link. He helped build flight stimulators for the F-14. Went all over helping set them up from an electrical standpoint. I remember getting Jolly Rodger stickers as a gift when he returned home one time. I wish he was still alive to see his work mattered and the next generation of fighters and advanced simulators of today.

Fascinating. I could listen to them talk about this all day

I believe Scooter was flying a missile profile for the radars. He was with VF-2 just before. Hell of a guy.

The Discovery show he referred to was Carrier: Fortress at Sea and both crew bailed out and survived during that incident thankfully.

Terrific interview ! Trots is a great guest.

This is such a great conversation!

I even remember watching that Discovery channel show. @ 6:50 I was in the army because my vision wasn't good enough to fly, but I always wished I could. Ya'll lived the dream. Thanks for keep the seas safe and the skies clear.

I went to engineering school with a person who went to Top Gun in F-18s. He said (in reference to mixing it up in the telephone booth, or close in) that if you didn’t splash a F-14 within a minute, they would tell you to go home. He was always good for a great story but not a BSer. His callsign was “Fangs”. Had the top flight and academic record in the history of the Naval flight school. Entered flight school with an engineering degree and a private aerobatic license. During college he would party with the real "Pappy" Boyington, so of course he had go into the Marines which he said would get the Navy flight school students mad when he out scored them. His father flew P-51s and in later years flew crop dusters. As he grew up, he and his dad built high performance model planes so from a very young age he was all over everything to do about flying. After the Marines he flew F-16s.

I am so glad that I stumbled across this video. Thoroughly enjoyable.

Hey Razgriz, I was an OS (radarman) on the USS Fox CG 33 being air picket for the Ranger task group on our tiger cruise after WESTPAC 82. We got the same air show. Super sonic low level passes. Live ord drops from A6s...man, almost made that 7months worth it 😊

The more I learn about the Tomcat, the more I understand why it was retired early and why the F-15, F-16, and F-18 are still flying a half century later. It was an awesome plane. Yet it was unreliable and dangerous. Everything from it's control system to its avionics to it's radar was not only antiquated but didn't age with any grace at all. He put it best when he said, analog vs digital. The other platforms were amenable to digital upgrades as to where the Tomcat was made in such a way it simply wasn't possible. And the older it got the more exponentially expensive it became to keep it flying.

Trots cracks me up, he talk and acts exactly like i would expect a veteran fighter pilot to be. the guy is an archetype 🤣🤣🤣

Good interviewer. Leads the conversation without constantly stepping on the other man.

Thank You for your Service,Sir.

From the maintenance side I was at VF213 in the mid eighties and VFA-105 at Cecil in the nineties. The only reason we didn’t fly all twelve hornets everyday was the ship couldn’t find a spot on the roof for all of them. We were lucky during a Westpac if we started the day with two or three F14s. With the lot 13 hornets there was few if any missed sorties ever!

It warms my heart hearing about GE powered vipers routinely chasing down hornets when they try to run.

Subscribed & liked. You guys are amazing

I’ve never flown any aircraft. Im always in awe at air shows when fighters are flying, the sound of the air “ripping” apart is awesome! f-14 or f-18. Both are beautiful but I couldn’t tell you which is better !

Hell of a conversation!

I believe it was "Nasty" Manazir who jumped out of his Tomcat after a "zero airspeed" maneuver, got him into a flat spin. Great short discussion gents! BZ "Jello" and "Trots"!

It’s funny he mentioned “The Final Countdown”! I literally just watched that two nights ago!!! Such a great TOMCAT movie too!

Incredibly interesting, thanks for this.

The Tomcat has range, endurance, maneuverability at high altitude, powerful radar and the Pheonix. It is expensive, hard to maintain, 60s concept, and can't carry all the weapons. The Hornet can dogfight, can carry all the weapons in the navy arsenal, is modernized and reliable. However it is sluggish and slow, it can't CAP. Both planes compliment eachother really well

Loaded all variants of the F-14 while serving in VF-102 and VF-101. It was a maintenance nightmare. I remember Mr. Aiello while serving in VFA-94 from 03-07. Hobo 403 if I recall. SHWFOTS!

OMG! More of this please just awesome 😎

Very interesting conversation! Would love to hear more.

Some comments from other pilots Israel Baharav (12 kills): `When we evaluated the F-14, the US Navy pilots at NAS Miramar told us that the Tomcat could perform equally as well in a dogfight with an A-4. This did not prove to be the case, however, for when I flew the TA-4 against the F-14, the end result of the engagement was embarrassment for the Tomcat. Not only could the TA-4 out-turn the F-14, but during the turn itself, the Tomcat’s energy state dropped so low that I was able to fly the TA-4 in the vertical as though the Skyhawk was the superior fighter and the F-14 the inferior!’ Assaf Ben-Nun (5 kills): ‘The F-14 lacked thrust, was complex and not user-friendly and was not aerodynamically clean - indeed, the jet shuddered every time I pulled high-G or high angle-of-attack. During my sortie, I flew DACT against Amnon Arad in a Skyhawk, and although we finished with honours even at the end of the session, I found it hard to believe that the F-14 had no edge whatsoever over the A-4 in WVR air combat.’ Francesco "Paco" Chierici (F-14 pilot) "Though the Tomcat was technically a fighter plane, it wasn’t really designed for the visual BFM arena. It had a number of elements working against it when it came to dogfighting. First was its size, it was fondly referred to as the ‘Big Fighter,’ and it was huge. One of the basic tenants of aerial combat is, ‘lose sight, lose the fight.’ Against a Tomcat that was almost impossible. The A-model was also underpowered for maneuvering fights with an approximately 0.67:1 thrust to weight ratio. Furthermore, we had a 6.5 G limit, though there was no black box that would tell on you, so we often went well beyond 7 G. While it had massive elevators that would develop an incredible instantaneous pitch rate, the lack of ailerons and the sheer width of the plane made the roll rate sluggish. Finally, the ergonomics of the cockpit were designed in the late ‘60s. There was no HOTAS (Hands On Throttles and Stick). The BVR intercept was run by the RIO in the back manipulating the radar and working with the pilot. Once the merge was imminent, inside 10 nautical miles, the pilot took over. But he would still have to call for the RIO to engage the dogfight mode of the radar. In a two-circle fight, where degrees of turn per second are a premium, the Tomcat was quite adept. But if you got the A-model slow, into the ‘black hole’ around 250 knots, you were stuck in a region the plane did not excel in. The TF-30 engines just didn’t have enough grunt to allow the plane to fly extremely slowly, nor to power back up to proper maneuvering speed. The GE engines, on the other hand, enabled a skilled pilot to work the slow speed environment successfully. A very good pilot could even pirouette the plane using the GE engines by bringing one out of afterburner. The Tomcat would swap ends gracefully and reverse course instantly. The auto function of the wing sweep could work against a pilot in the BFM arena as well. The angle of the sweep was a function of a variety of factors, including speed, angle of attack, and altitude. F-15s liked to drag the Tomcat high and use their superior thrust to gain an advantage. An off-the-books tactic we used to counter this was to manually extend the wings to the fullest, then incrementally lower the flaps beyond the normal maneuver setting. It was hugely successful, but the danger was that the flap torque tubes were not designed for this and could become stuck." Scott R Wilson (USAF) "Way back in the mid-80s I asked one of our F-4E pilots at Ramstein about the media hype versus reality of ACM with other airplanes. He told me the F-14 was actually rather easy to beat. He said one of the keys to dogfighting was being able to judge your opponent's energy state and adjust your tactics accordingly. With most other fighters it's fairly difficult to do, but when the Tomcat's wings started swinging out, you knew he was low on energy and was therefore more predictable and easier to kill." Mike Glenn (Hughes maintenance supervisor) “By the last F-111B built, Grumman and GD had worked out the bugs. I will tell you that [prototype] number 7 could fly circles around our early F-14s-longer, faster, and very maintenance-friendly compared to earlier F-111Bs and F-14s.”

The Tomcat was like a big 1960 supercharge muscle car. It was heavy, somewhat primitive and not easy to handle but boy did it have power. The Superhornet is like a modern crossover SUV. It could carry plenty and it had a ton of high tech options but it will never be as fast and sexy as that old sportcar. The carriers lost something with the retirement of the Tomcat that they have never gotten back. The Tomcat was able to intercept threat faster and farther away from the carrier than any of the newer birds. Plus, it had an absolutely mammoth radar.

Having worked on both as an "I" level aviation electronics technician, and being on the last west coast cruise for the F-14 I was so glad to see them go away. They were a maintenance nightmare.

Awesome video Jell-O, really digging the video setup!

Oh man hes done it!!!

Wow! Never would have guessed that type of acceleration in a jet!!

Even back in the 80's as a kid the F/A 18 was my favourite fighter jet. My favourite is the F-35 now,but i still love the F/A 18.

Cool as hell. I just finished my cplse and am working on my CFI. I want to try this at some point.

Those ferry tanks cost approx. $50,000 each in mid 90's dollars. as per the Hultgreen loss report. They seriously affected aero. The Phoenix launch rails were heavy as well. They were retained for bombing as well.

I can’t help but think of what the Tomcat 21 might have been .

I'm just glad I have seen F-14 Tomcat at Cecil Field airshow in 1987. It was loud and proud! There was an F-15 Eagle as this airshow that during its demonstration clearly outclimbed the F-14 Tomcat going straight up. The Legacy F-18 Hornets looks super maneuverable in their demonstrations but simply didnt have the raw power of the other 2 jets.

I think I've heard every tomcat story so far...and i never get bored of hearing them again 😁

US Navy pilots are the best in the world. I could listen to this guy talk all day. His knowledge, clarity, confidence, and command of language is just something else.

10:10 you had me at F-14.

Great interview bud. It is Marlar or Bunky from our NROTC days.

You could see Jello loves the Hornet's high alpha maneuvres in air show setting. ❤🇫🇮

Tomcat was a beautiful aircraft!

Chasing clouds has to be the coolest expression I've heard in a while.

i see this vid more than once !! and its always a pleasure to see aa AC fighter pilot for both the Hornet and the Tomcat !!

It's always fun to discuss the differences but the planes are supposed to complement each other not compete with each other. A better comparison is the F14 vs the super hornet. The F14 having speed, endurance, radar and longer range weapons and arguable better looks is a beast. But I will always favor reliability. Better to have 6 planes in the air when you really need it than 2.

The F14 needed an E variant like that of the F15. High payload, multi mission strike capable platform to stay relevant

I was in the Navy during the transition, and I worked on equipment from both aircraft as an AT. I distinctly remember the F-14 pilot patch that said, "Anytime baby", and the F/A-18 pilot patch that said, "Now, baby".

Hi! Any chance of seeing a higher resolution version of the image of the planes in the thumbnail? Excelent video btw! Thanks!

The crazy part is the F16 and F18 were the only 2 fighter jets that could do loops on the Dallas Cowboy Stadium. No they never went down in the Stadium. It was measured how big the inside of the stadium was and how sharp the F16 and F18 could cut. The F16 could turn a bit tighter than the F18 but they could both do it. The F14 needed the whole parking lot. So in a dog fight. I’d hate to be in a Tomcat.

what a guy...

Hi Jell-O, I've watched watched many of your videos and have recently subscribed. I know that you don't have 1 Hornet that you fly all the time, but whatever plan is ready to go. How similar are different aircraft ? Do they have their little differences in handling or maybe different quirk? You have great content. Thank you for your service to this great nation. And as Pail would say, Fly Navy and cheers.

Once we did the motive flow line mods it was an animal

Tomcat looks better, and that's what matters most. Who cares what you can do, if you don't look cool doing it?

I gotta wonder. Given the superior slow speed performance of the hornet, and the fact most jets could run you down if you tried to disengage, do you think hornet pilots are trained to be naturally more aggressive?

I always enjoy conversations like this. I was in the US Navy for 8 years, 3 of those years I worked on the flight deck as a grape. I always enjoy seeing the F14 launch. Nothing but raw power. It just came to mind.....why doesn't the F14 or F18 have their own APU? Helicopters do.

Watched 2 F14’s on the Stennis go in the drink. One off the cat went vertical with no control. The other on landing when the tail hook broke. Tail hook incident was the craziest thing ever. After ejection a/c recovered and flew by itself for a few seconds. VF-211 if I remember right it was triple sticks. Somewhere around 2002 in the Indian Ocean.

In terms of overall operational performance, especially in the phone booth, the edge goes to the F/A-18. But for aesthetics and just "cool" factor, the Tomcat is still ahead.

Tomcat is beautiful and special, love it. Used to hate the look of F18 but all because of Top Gun Maverick now the F18s have grown on me and redeemed themselves

GOODNESS!!!! Stories! Very entertaining.

I remember that footage from Discovery when I was a kid!

Growling Sidewinder uploaded today a video about that 💀