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Hey nintendo Did not do that, Nintendo was never liked that before 😡

@@Megamus643AlphaofLife lmao

@@Megamus643AlphaofLife Do your research.

@@Megamus643AlphaofLifeone time nintendo tried to sue the company that made game genie devices. Because they claimed it altered copyrighted code, but in order to mess with the game you had to buy it first so they lost. To add salt to the injury sega licensed game genie devices that were made for the sega consoles while they still made for nintendo. I don't know why people like to lick a company's boot and act like they never do anything wrong, sometimes we see comments that say "this would never happen with iwata👌😞" but they have done questionable stuff since forever just like any other big corp in the world

@@Megamus643AlphaofLife It's practically confirmed that they did; watch this: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/sLhhqKioz96bhn0.html

Ironic

The issue here is that the rights of the code was disputed and murky this han nothing to do with what you are mentioning

@@simnm8057 exactly, most fans actually have a good reason to pirate the older games, they're not available. Nintendo just wanted to increase profits

@@TheNameIsSR thats not what im referring about what im talking about is that the the owner to the rights to the code was disputed and to nintendo they had the right to use the code for donkey kong2 from the original donkey kong

"You were the chosen one! It was said you’d destroy the plagiarists, not join them!"

Ironic because Nintendo's music is IN THIS VIDEO. Did he get sued?

There are certain rules that Nintendo lay out and if you follow them, Nintendo won't go after you for that video. It's a common rule that Japanese companies have, which is "if you use our content, you must provide your own commentary, or creativity in it." In other words, you cannot just upload a soundtrack onto KZfaq and call it a day. Additionally you cannot just paste in Nintendo music and put an artwork over it either, whether official or fanart. Additionally according to one of the most biggest websites that host Nintendo fangames, only 15% of them get taken down by Nintendo themselves. Main reasoning being "it's too close to a game Nintendo already made." This also started the trend of "if Nintendo takes it down, they're making that game officially."

eugene

@@rayplaysgamesrpg7233 Is that why Nintendo seems to be fine with remixes of their soundtracks?

@@magic2546 Mostly.

Damn i don't know if i should feel sorry for nintendo or not

@@randoburr5201 you really shouldn't feel bad for them they can't even buy better hardware for the switch with their multimillion money

@@LegitproArts Nintendo won't shake their outdated philosophy of using garbage hardware for their game systems. They have more money than God, they can afford to use much better hardware what will make their systems look and feel strong and powerful.

@@marccaselle8108 I mean it sold 100m units and counting

@@IAm-zo1bo children

It was not that hard to read the data from the chips (and yes, they had devices to read that data, it was much simpler than today….and they don’t need the internet for such things). Also the offer was plain text, so you don’t even needed any programming experience.

@@MabuseXX Yeah, but how were people supposed to do that in an arcade without getting caught?

@@MabuseXX "it wad much simpler than today" I highly doubt that. Today i can just download a rom and a hex editor and voila. If not, there are specific tools for that today that you can get by the click of a button.

@@MabuseXX ​ @Richter WLK is correct. There weren't commercial devices for accessing arcade hardware (if there were, Nintendo probably wouldn't have needed to outsource conversion kits in the first place) and for anyone who follow hardware hacking, it often requires fabrication of equipment, a lot of fine soldering skills and tracing of circuits to find the desired ones. For something like this to happen, someone would need to essentially cannibalize one of these arcade cabinet's roms, possibly the board too, and create a from scratch interface board that could be connected to a PC (which at the time would likely have been a mess of wires to a PCI card, PCI-e in the grand scheme of things is relatively new in computers, and such a USB device isn't likely either at the time, so oldschool pci or perhaps serial?) An example of this is Wii U NAND dumping. To even get the data from the NAND chip, you had to rig up something like this. gbatemp.net/attachments/tsop-wired-jpg.77841/ and make that interface with a PC through another board. Further, if they just 'had devices' like that, then Nintendo wouldn't have had to pay a third party to decompile and reverse engineer the code for Donkey Kong Jr, They would have used their new, in house programmers. Also if you're just going by the video here, we don't actually know it was in plain-text, and it probably still wasn't at the time. The video is of course going to show it in plain text. Wouldn't help viewers if he just pasted say... 43 6F 6E 67 72 61 74 75 6C 61 74 69 6F 6E 20 21 69 66 20 79 6F 75 20 61 6E 61 6C 79 7A 65 20 64 69 66 66 69 63 75 6C 74 20 74 68 69 73 20 70 72 6F 67 72 61 6D 2C 0A 77 65 20 77 6F 75 6C 64 20 74 65 61 63 68 20 79 6F 75 2E 20 2A 2A 2A 2A 2A 54 65 6C 2E 20 54 6F 6B 79 6F 2D 4A 61 70 61 6E 20 30 34 34 28 32 34 34 29 32 31 35 31 20 45 78 74 65 6E 74 69 6F 6E 20 33 30 34 20 73 79 73 74 65 6D 20 64 65 73 69 67 6E 20 69 6B 65 67 61 6D 69 20 63 6F 2E 20 6C 69 6D 2E Edit: I also forgot to mention having or writing dumping/interpreter software from scratch, or how how easily pirate cabinets could be made if it were 'much easier' at the time. All you would need is to buy one of these devices, plug in a single rom, and get a silicon fabricator to mass produce the hardware, then flash the dumped rom to it.

So pirates and hackers would get job offers back then ?

Actually .. 9 years before King Kong was made. There was an ape abducted a woman and carries to to a top of a tall tree. But the planes... All Universal there

That part isn't that bad dude chill

That's not why Universal lost. Through investigation it was found that Universal didn't actually own the rights to King Kong as they claimed they did.

@@okamijubei What about the orignal 1930';s one

@@80s_Gamr It gets better. Years before their Donkey Kong lawsuit, Universal themselves were sued over their version of King Kong. In that lawsuit, Universal's lawyers successfully argued that they didn't break copyright law because King Kong had already entered the public domain.

I have a Tetris machine. According to the internet japan has a lot of Tetris machines but as far as I'm aware America only has the one. being that Tetris plus is one of my favorite games i really need to get Tetris plus 2 running in an emulator. Sad that game never got ported to console.

@@bland9876 I've played on a tetris machine before In America, in Las Vegas at the pinball hall of fame there's a tetris arcade machine

@@jeremiahbennett3004 you mis understanding when I said America just has the one I mean like Japan has Tetris plus, Tetris by Sega, etc where as we just got the one by tegen. Not that there was literally 1 Tetris machine in the US lol. Edit: Yes there is those funny version of Tetris with like huge joysticks or whatever but I'm just thinking of back in the 80s/90s

@@bland9876 ah ok, the wording was just weird

Me you and 217 other people had Donkey Kong arcade cabinets ?!?🤷🏻‍♀️I don't think so !? But my dad had one in the basement and we left the coin for open and clicked the trigger to add credits ! We also had an old Pepsi machine and a Galaga or Galaxy blaster flying shooter game that was also awesome but I wanted TMNT arcade cabinet back then not Donkey Kong or whatever we had.

Probably, but just if they use their ips since inspired nintendo games have definitively existed without they suing. If they copy the code that is trouble.

I guess they're just hypocritical as hell.

At the time of the incident, computer program coding wasn't recognized as copyrightable material. In 1983 when laws were created to recognize program coding as copyrightable, it had a double-edge sword effect on Nintendo. It was used against them, so on the flip side, they took it upon themselves to use it against others whenever they can to the fullest. In a way, the law was good and bad. Good as in protecting creator's rights. Bad as in a company like Nintendo finding a way to "abuse" the law to attack anyone even though it is within their rights.

I mean it was about 40 years ago, that's a completely different group of people who ran Nintendo back then.

@@EarthboundX Yeah that's what I figured not too long after posting this comment. It's still sad to see that this is how they are now when they used to be somewhat like the people who make fan games.

@@jenniferhamels1176 Honestly doesn't explain much. Someone could still tell that it was copied, so lawsuits would definitely be filed, so Nintendo is still a bit hypocritical. If that IS true though, then it makes the whole situation even more hypocritical of Nintendo to just take down fan games.

Right...and the other cool things happening with DK like a movie and theme park section aren't happening...

@@rohanrodrigues7115 there's a DK movie? We haven't even gotten the Mario one yet

@@zacziggarot there's a third sonic movie and a knuckles show on its way before we got the sequel 🙃

@@rohanrodrigues7115 the DK section is coming 2024

@@rohanrodrigues7115 are you sure that there's a 3rd sonic movie? Jim Carrey has said that Sonic 2 would be his last movie and he was retiring.

You can play it on switch

It was on N64 too in DK64.

@my Thomas Channel isn't that the NES version and not the arcade one

@@FilmBucket It's that arcade one but Nintendo did modify the code their own way so it doesn't involve Ikegami Tsushinki anymore.

@@VOAN how do you know

They are still around but they want nothing to do with gaming, not because of Nintendo but because they want their coding skill to be use in real world situation. The Donkey Kong situation was different cause videogame was still a new thing back then. Nowadays there's no point in them coding for gaming cause every gaming company already had their own coders.

Yes

They absolutely don't eat supports today. Getting into the medical device industry in the 80s almost assuredly means all those guys are millionaires today.

Copy dat, what what why?

Like what EA did to SEGA?

copycat 🐱

haha that song is the best thing ever

That spoiled the video 😭😭😭

Spoilers bruh

Why are y'all looking at the comments while looking at the video? Do you not expect people to say something about the video???

@@wisemeowster on mobile it shows a preview of a comment it just so happens this specific comment that it previews

@@wisemeowster when you watch a video on mobile, it shows comments directly below the video. It sometimes doesn't even show pinned comments, so I just saw this comment

or their music lmfao

@@MrChainChomp Right? LMAO

Why do you say lmao in all caps

@@VeryTastySoup87 To emphasize the LMAO

R4 for life

Thomas Game Docs is always at least 30% right!

Yea ppl just don't get it. If they all were an ip holder, or if someone was trying to replicate the same KZfaq persona,they'd be the first to be trying to sue

if i had a franchise that people loved so much they made their own whole entire fangames of it i wouldbe honored

@@paws9248 Yeah that's the case of the Sonic team, Nintendo was light on their IP back then lending it to PHILIPS in their CDi project, we all know how those games turned out. Probably out of trauma LOL

The thing is, if it is a non-profit project, there shouldn't be any kind of issues since the Fair Use Law (FUL) protects people from creating projects associated with an IP as long as you aren't profiting from that, in fact, going against the FUL is a crime in itself, a crime that Nintendo has been doing quite a lot of times and people are still defending a criminal.

@@jironamos7650 The problem is that fair use laws do have certain limitations, and one of those limitations is the form in which fair use is being implemented in. If someone draws a protected IP character from a video game, for example, and doesn't profit from the drawing, that is considered fair use, but if someone takes a protected IP video game and then makes a fan game version of it, because the original IP was being held for a video game and the new work is also a video game, that can be considered a violation of fair use because it's the same media as the original IP. This is to protect the original IP holder from potential confusion over legitimacy, consumers MAY mistakenly believe that the fan game is an official licensed game made by the IP holder, which MAY be harmful to the IP holder's reputation or cause damages to the value of the IP in general. Whether you agree with their decisions or not, that's the reason why Nintendo is able to take down any fangame they want to, regardless of whether it's for-profit or not.

They've literally never sued anyone for making a fan game. I get being mad at them for issuing takedowns but don't make stuff up just to get your point across.

@@NightFlyStudio It’s something Nintendo haters love to do. Just blindly overexaggerate the narrative to make the situation even worse than it actually is.

@@NightFlyStudio that's bull, you can't even DRAW a picture of Mario without getting the Nintendo regime down your back

@@FallingStar1080 What YOU’RE saying is bull.

They stole the code, the game is Shigeru's.

well, based on the state of the switch online emulators... they should had outsource it...

Arent most if not all arcade boards custom to some degree? I was first introduced to emulators in 1996. Emulation of a game from 1981 in the 90s, 2000s, 2010s, present day does not seem like something that would be difficult to get right, especially on hardware released in the last 20 years.

MAME is open source and has been around since 1997 but I agree the NES version is fairly close to the arcade version and a mite easier to get going in whatever system you're porting it to.

Rare actually ported DK arcade to DK64. This is how Nintendo got around the legal issues with Ikagami. They did a great job too considering they didn't use any source code!

To be fair, they didn't plan on backstabbing Sony until someone reread the contract and realized Sony was going to backstab them.

@@foxymetroid way I heard it, any CD software sold on that platform, all the profits would go to Sony. Which was a sh!t deal in Nintendo’s eyes. I’m glossing over a lot, but when they killed it with the NES, they acted like a tyrant over the industry. A lot of developers got fed up & moved over to Sega(Genesis/Megadrive). Much as I like Nintendo, they have these antiquated business practices that to this day, baffle & infuriate me. Probably not alone in this.

Yamauchi was like lot of business people at the time. Cutthroat and sneaky. If you think Yamauchi was bad, Jack Tramiel was worse.

@@genericsavings Ive heard the same. Nintendo was fairly ruthless in the late 80's and 90's when it came to development. But funny thing is Sega went and did the same shit when THEY got big and devs started getting that same frustration over Sega (hence why EA has all those Yellow tabs on their Genesis games and there was a bit lawsuit over that). Nintendo, Sega, Sony, Microsoft, Activision, Atari, EA, Apple, John Deere.. ect.. Doesnt matter who they are. Power corrupts and when all of them got a big head, they all tightened their grip wanting more control and money. Seems inevitable for anyone really.

Yes, which is why it felt so similar. Mario is Popeye, DK is Bruno, and Pauline was Olive Oil.

I watched this video when it first came out 2 months ago but didn’t see your comment at the time. I’m seeing it now and am honestly amazed at the comment. I had no idea this was the initial idea!

ive heard

thank so much!!!

@@ThomasGameDocs Anytime man

@@ThomasGameDocs this story is fake because Nintendo never steals

@@dr.eggman8378 Mario 2 isn't a mario game

@@justarandomhandlewithnomeaning I never said anything about Mario 2 being a real game plus the game is real so I don’t know what your talking about

But didn’t Nintendo create the idea of donkey Kong first.

Well of course the lawsuit is over the code. Nintendo owned everything BUT the code.

@@gamercentral2417 stated in the video by the end.

And I think that next month, I might as well support SEGA, by buying the MP3 Soundtrack for Shadow the Hedgehog on Amazon, because that's what I have a shopping account for to make it count. THIS IS WHO I AM!

So they tried to get revenge on Nintendo for stealing their code by stealing Miyamoto's IDEA? Fuck, that's petty. And giving it to a big competitor of Nintendo, even… God damn. Sounds like Ikegami isn't the classiest of acts, either.

@@CarbonRollerCaco Nah. Nintendo is trash. They inspire hate in their partners. They MADE sony wreck them with PSX lol.

@@armyofninjas9055 Sounds like you just jealous of a successful company. Yes Sony wreck them with the PSX but Sony got their ass whoop by Nintendo with the Wii and the Wii isn't even a powerful machine. Nintendo whoop them so hard they left Japan for good.

@@VOAN Remote controller

@@VOAN How dense can you be to white knight nintendo and talk about "muh nintendo successes" when the convo is about how scummy they are.

Nintendo: Do what I say, not what I do. Always remember that.

I love their games, but Nintendo's always been dirty AF. But at least they do seem to let their creative teams actually be creative. Unlike a lot of other game companies that pretty much tell their developers how to design their games to meet objectives laid out in a board room.

Most companies are hypocrites though. Its usually just the degree that differs. But for sure Nintendo is a massive hypocrite when it comes to their attitudes towards "stealing"

hipocracy

​@@VOANbruh that's just having a mom

Probably waay more money in medical than in gaming machines at that time (probably even still so now)

​@@lyianx *This is off-topic, but your profile picture I kinda recognize. Isn't his name Bill or something?*

Probably. I'm sure it still involved a very large sum of money exchanging hands tho

Thats quite possible.. which.. to me.. seems stupid.. They already paid for that work... when they did the initial contract. IMO the ruling was just a sign of court not really knowing how to deal with computer code legally at that time. Today, for one, contracts would be far more clear and two, im fairly sure the written code would (in almost all cases) would be owned by the ones who paid to have it written, not the ones who wrote it. But that goes by to 1 (where it would be stated who before work began).

@@lyianx Not really. Consider, you are a hospital in need of software tailored to your needs for managing your stock. You commission someone to write something that suits your needs, and you pay for it. Then it seems more hospitals could use that same solution, so the person who wrote it sells it to more hospitals. That is perfectly within their right. You only paid for the final product, and they _sold_ it to you. Even though it was originally tailored to your needs, this does not give you any rights to their code.

yeah, because it'd be dumb to own it, if you didn't make the script.

LOL. Hollywood does that shit ALL the time! Scripts and ideas are CONSTANTLY stolen. Its very common for studios to hear ideas pitched at them, they reject them, then make their own script from that idea so they dont have to buy the one pitched to them.

the PC compatible proved the legality of "clean room" reverse engineering in the USA. Code itself was already copyrighted in the USA, but it's functionality is not. so you have one team disassemble the code, and write a description of what the code does that contains no code. the description is sent to another team, which, having never seen the copyrighted code, writes their own code to do the same thing. even if it happens to be identical, because they never saw the original, it's not a copy.

yeah it's pretty odd. i guess when people see copyright as justified, they also consider unauthorized copying "stealing", even if there isn't a law.

For stuff like this i appreciate when people make a distinction between illegal and unlawful

Kind of like it wasn't a crime when you did it, but it is now.

​@@johnmoser3594 I guess but if there were copyright laws that existed then Nintendo probably would have specified to the contracted company about the rights. You can pay another company to make something for you and you can own that.

this is most likely why there are such harsh laws in japan about reverse engineering code now. to try and prevent incidents like this.

what?

@@sofia.eris.bauhaus making fan games based on established ip's. The stupidest thing to do, especially for nintendo games

@@rohanrodrigues7115 i'm pretty sure your avatar is technically a copyright violation 😏. and yes, i do think people _should_ be able to create derivative works, all creativity involves using previously existing concepts. like Mario being originally being a legally-distinct Popeye clone before becoming more of it's own thing. i guess i can't advise people to make illegal artworks because i don't want to get them in trouble. but i also don't advise people to ever pay for access to copyrighted works. i've been avoiding to do that for about 15 years, and i'm not missing much.

@@sofia.eris.bauhaus my avatar is "technically" not a copyright violation 😉. As for your second para, yes, people can do that obviously, look at undertale. And judging from the third para, you don't pay for official works?

@@rohanrodrigues7115 i am very much for supporting artists, but outside of the copyright system. commissions, crowdfunding, and just donations are all ways of financing that don't rely on artificial monopolies and restricting access. i have a little playlist called "against monopoly" that gets go through various aspects, of you're interested. most artists don't get much or anything out of copyright. so i'd hope we can make this a win-win arrangement. to be fair, i'm pretty short on money these days, so i'm not doing many donations. but i realize supporting artists in in my long-term interests, so i'll do it more if i can.

Well, without knowing what the contract stated, both statements are assumptions. We do not know if the original contract stated that the code became the property of Nintendo (I assume it didn't, or Ikegami woul dhave had no argument at all). I also very much doubt the contract stated "you may not put your name inside the code".

Hypocritical Nintendo I hope Nintendo loses rights to original design of DK, Jump man and Lady

RARE did an excellent job porting the arcade DK to DK64. And without any source code too.

Sad thing is that this is accurate

name a company of that size that isn't scummy. unfortunately, this is a completely normal state of affairs in the corporate world.

@@romulus_ Keep drinking that kool-aid. Perhaps Nintendo might love you back one day.

​@@Phreno_Xeno so quick to try to diss me that you didn't realize i'm saying they're all the same. pathetic.

@@Phreno_Xeno Either you're way too fast at reading, or the education system has failed you.

The shit with Nintendo OST video’s getting taken might actually have not even been done by Nintendo, there is proof that they might have been taken down by an impostor POSING as Nintendo.

The copyright law was indeed vague back then. But Nintendo was most likely aware of their first crime though. You can't just "secretly" produce another 80,000 arcade machines. That was in fact part of the contract, so it was illegal. As for the recent OST stuff, yes, I do realise it's within Nintendo's right to delete soundtrack uploads and such. It's their right, and it's legal. But it certainly isn't morally right. Also as long as people like GiIvaSunner aren't monetising their videos, Nintendo isn't losing any money, since they're not providing the albums themselves. Nintendo can do what they want, but not in anyway do I sympathise with these kind of decisions they make.

@@Rediscool9 That's been proven false. KZfaq themselves came forward and confirmed it really was from Nintendo.

@@TheGamersState Can you give me a link?

Japanese with there copyright issue 😆 Well at least Western way better thanks to quake we never having half life and many other future FPS.

Ya really

It’s stupid

I dont agree that it WAS ikegami's code. Hell, NOBODY knew who's code it was until a law was made up DURING THE LAWSUIT and then it was decided. Thats pretty slimy if the courts if you ask me.

that's not how the law works

@@polocatfan what do you mean that’s not how it works. Laws change as times change. Laws are developed over time. And when a law against a specific act doesn’t yet account for something or doesn’t exist yet. acts that would violate it, don’t. And no, you can’t just say “now we can persecute them again since the law changed” because that’s double jeopardy and yes, is illegal. For a very extreme example, in the 1700’s, slavery in US was legal. Now it is obviously illegal. Law’s change because of loopholes and missing parts, when this case happened, Japanese Copyright law wasn’t developed, and therefore copyright as a concept wasn’t really enforced. You probably just said that comment thinking I didn’t know anything, and that a simple comment would make me say “oh no I’m so incorrect.” Laws exist to protect the freedoms of others… at least in some places. They also prevent wrongs from being committed on others. So what part did I actually get wrong. You want to refute a point, bring evidence to back up your claim. Edit: was fixing a typo

@@thelostician not saying your wrong but this is japan where talking about not the US. I’m not sure if double jeopardy is a thing in Japan also…

@@nocwilson0578 don’t worry I checked before I wrote that, Double Jeopardy does actually exist in Japan. It’s in article 39 of the constitution of Japan 1947. It’s cool, I understand that line of concern. :) Edit: sorry I meant it’s illegal to commit double jeopardy.

Fanmades cannot be illegal unless you are contractually making money of them, which that NEVER happens.

I think Croc is similar. Was supposed to be a Yoshi centric game but Ninty stole aspects of it to become SM64.

That's just the title, they stole parts of the coding, game design and characters were theirs. They should have just hired them for the sequel and paid for the coding.

Nice

the best timeline

And Pokemon would be alongside Kirby

Nah Probably Link from Zelda

except i literally don't care that a multimillion company lost money because they did sometimes wrong. they deserve that

@@amadeotheben me either lol - i just think the presentation in the video is shoddy and pointlessly opaque. i already said in my post that nintendo could be crooks. idk who you're even replying to lol

Good comment

They jailed a guy for 10 YEARS (or around that) for some stupid thing

@@platinumdiamond1445 no they didnt that never happened

@@platinumdiamond1445 oh wait youre talking about the dude that made a switch malware and sold it as a hacking device yeah that due bricked peoples consoles

I'm surprised Nintendo didn't sue Gary Bowser over his last name.

@@johntracy72 they would've tried if they didn't hire one already.

If every case were that simple, everyone, including you, would be behind bars. Everyone has stolen something. And nothing is ever black and white.

Thinking is hard ehh

@@FallingStar1080 sorry 😇.

​@@Nighttale233 well, maybe this helps you make an informed estimate: i think copyright is harmful, and Nintendo does big contributions to that harm. their persecution of rom sites and derivative works, their pushing of DRM and other "copy protection" garbage is making the world worse. it's an assault on free communication and free competition. other game companies do similar shit of course, and some are definitely worse. but that is not an excuse for shitty behavior. they should be criticized, and i don't plan to buy anything from them. but i won't condemn them for being the victim of copyright, especially not retroactive copyright enforcement. copyright is a minefield as it is, retroactive copyright is absolutely terrifying for any creative person.