Yeah but how far can you go when goldberg runs through everyone

totally agree! people were hot for that angle too because they made bam bam look like a really credible threat coming in.

@@chrisortiz8072 The key is they could've delayed the actual match for two months or so. Yes Goldberg runs through everyone, but they could've kept teasing the match like the way they did with sting and hogan for almost an entire year.

Ikr

Bigelow's best days were behind him at that point

It was Hogan's idea, but he made Nash take the fall for it.

@@wolf7el356 That's such an easy out. It's like some people really believe Hogan's a super villain or something lol Was he an A-hole? Sure...but most of the top guys in wcw were out for themselves as well. Nash also has a habit of twisting facts around, to suit his narrative.

Nash, Hall, Hogan, Page, Flair, Sting etc... They didn't get into their position without being selfish. No rich person in power gets that way being nice. Still, no matter what anyone says, it made for a great time in wrestling, where lots of other stars were made off the back of the Monday night wars. It happened in WWF at the time, it happens in AEW right now. (Omega The Bucks) they wouldn't be anything but mid carders at best if they weren't in charge. Even Cody was a mid carder in WWE

​@@RicGagger How selfish are the Elite being though? It doesn't seem like they're being overtly as selfish as the nWo ever were. They have programs going that indicate they're being set to put over other guys and aren't hogging the airtime like the nWo ever did, they aren't bringing in guys just to bury them, the first year of programming they didn't even get anywhere near their own titles even though they book the shows, it's just evident that a portion of the audience came to see them because of their own initial talents, Omega is a world renowned wrestler thanks in part to his time in NJPW, how would it look to now have have him win on the show sometimes?? Also WWE lost their minds, so what kind of validity and credibility does your statement do for you when mentioning them in the same breath as The Elite?? WWE buried world class talent because the ceo can't be bothered to update his world views on how the industry has changed (and this isn't even bothering to bring in SJW nonsense into the equation), Ricochet was jobbed out to shitty football player after he was booked to lose against Lesnar, that's the ceo's fault not Ricochet and then the CEO drinks his own kool-aid and believes that a talent like Ricochet is an undercard act, so it's absurd to mention them here because they have a proven track record of fucking great talent ever since WCW and ECW lost the wrestling war from the 90s... The Elite aren't perfect BUT they're not a senile jackass like Vince McMahon is either. Also, if your comeback to this statement is to mention the pocketbook of the WWE, then don't bother, selling off half of the roster just to make yourself look proifitbale to investors is of course a smart business move but scummy as hell when you're the fan which you and I simply are... I mean yeah there is admiration to watching the lizard cut his tail off just to survive but also gross to see

@@mageside I think they're being very selfish. Considering the program isn't gaining any new fans. Just the same 750k-1million that always tune in. The nwo, the horsemen... That was entertaining no matter what you say. Millions tuned into to see them. Vince has definitely lost all touch with reality, but who said anything about WWE? (Other than you, an obvious aew STANBoy) I stated facts. The Elite are midcarders without them booking themselves to be main attractions.

Ultra instinct kevin nash

SegaSaturnSNK I smoke dope

Why is this blurred

Fuckit Im on One I quit

I have to take credit for that, because i was the one that showed conrad how to write that code into his videos. I didn't even ask for a cent either, because I'm a decent guy............ unlike Hogan hahahahahahahahahaha

Kevin Newsom I agree 100% with you. This was actually the last WCW pay-per-view that I ever ordered. I loved Starcade 1998 and like every other WCW fan in the world at this time back then I did not give two fucking shits about Bill fucking Goldberg. I ordered that damn paper view to watch Kevin Nash take the title from him and just like all the people that saw the match live everyone in my living room jumped up screaming with joy that Kevin Nash beat Bill Goldberg. This idea that Bill was the hardest thing in the company going into Starrcade 1998 is bullshit. And yeah it did suck a week after this when they did the finger poke of doom. I was happy as hell with stockade 199 and yeah it did suck a week after this when they did the finger poke of doom. I was happy as hell with Starrcadebut when Nashly down for Hogan in the rain even people that were halfway paying attention to the dirt sheets knew what had just happened. Hulk Hogan could not stand to not be the champion for one second longer so hogan decided to just put the belt back on him and put the NWO back together, thus killing off the companies hottest baby face and hottest baby face faction in the Wolfpac. It really felt like WCW had no ideas left and they were just going to go back with the original NWO idea. Honestly looking back the best thing for Hogan, for WCW, for the wrestling business as a whole, would probably have been if Hogan would’ve just went home in 1999 sat out for a year and then went back to the WWF. You can’t have the same baby face is in same heels on top in the same territory for five or six years. It doesn’t work, it gets stale. It’s why Hulkamania started to get stale in 91-92, It’s why even a great booker like Dusty Rhodes runs out of things to do with the same group of guys after four or five years. Hogan had already done everything there was for him to do and WCW at that point. I also think in the year 2000 would’ve been a good time for Hol Hogan had already done everything there was for him to do and WCW at that point. I also think in the year 2000 would’ve been a good time for Hall and Nash to go back to WWF. In a perfect world of course it would’ve been cool if WCW could’ve gotten some fresh talent back from WWF because that’s always what had happened between WCW and WWF for the last 20 years. Guys would have a good run in one company for about half a decade and then they would go to the other company. Problem was that this time after the finger poke of doom WCW never really got better. There were some good matches that happened along the way but they were good matches in the middle of terrible shows.

Totally agree dude

@Ryan Sondalle nash was extremely popular it made sense

I would've rather seen ddp pull a upset on Goldberg a little earlier...

Agree, WCW was still red hot even after Goldberg lost. It wasn't until the fallout of the FPoD and continuous bad booking that WCW started their slide in '99.

It was 2 late then

I wanted DDP's title run as a face. wasn't interested in seeing him as a heel.

Had it set up beautifully too. Everybody bought the Diamond Cutter reversal out of the Jackhammer at Halloween Havoc(those that could see it anyway) as the finish. And the crowd would have fucking gone apeshit if he won it there. And that was Page's time.

sanddune That 1999 January episode drew a 5.0 rating and the next episode the week after it drew another 5.0. If anything TFPOD boosted the ratings. What killed it was Hogan and Goldberg being injured in the span of 2-4 weeks of it being done.

Hey Sanddune next time you go off what seems to be what people assume do some research. Tonshaad facts backing on that one

Or I can be aware that a nosedive has nothing to do with an immediate rating the very next week. I also realize that when analyzing the demise of the company that it isn't black and white and there was a lot of moving parts. So your buddy's simpleton take of pointing out the following week's ratings does not exactly speak of a trend. So next time instead of telling me what to do, grow a brain. Learn what words like 'trends' and 'analytics' mean before causing a giant IQ dump in a thread.

On the contrary, ratings for January 1999 were among their highest and were continue to be very good until April, May when Flair wanted to be a bad guy, and Hulk wanted to be a good guy. This is how successful the finger point of doom is that almost 20 years later, it is among the most talked about things/events in wrestling history which makes it a success.

Correct, that night was great the next nitro was such a kick in the balls

Goldberg's pay-per-view history in his first WCW World Heavyweight Championship run: BATB: Goldberg beats Curt Hennig, semi-main event, in under four minutes. Road Wild: Goldberg wins a battle royal, semi-main event. I don't even think the title was on the line. Fall Brawl: Goldberg didn't wrestle. HH: Goldberg beats Page, main event, his first pay-per-view main event since becoming champion three and a half months earlier. WW3: Goldberg didn't wrestle. Starrcade: Goldberg dropped the title to Nash, main event. The next time Eric Bischoff or Tony Schiavone tries to tell you that the "marks in the internet" couldn't have done a better job, don't believe it, because _anybody_ could've seen what was wrong with how Goldberg was booked.

Something about that taser man, that was to big of a burial piece man, left a bad taste in my mouth for sure

But at that time, who on the roster WASNT in the NWO lol.

@@matthewbaker8635 ddp

Sting even goldberg was a great choice for the undertaker and all it seems picked lesnar instead.

Sting wasn’t tan enough.

DDP should have ended the streak

Nash to break streak goldberg ego politique

@@truthteller3732 its an eric bischoff reference. Hogan buried Sting at Starrcade 97 after building the match for a year and a half, and eric justifies it by saying sting showed up to the show without a tan. Its idiotic because sting was playing a loner gothic character

No. Shouldve been disco inferno

Sting wasnt even there after Havoc

I figured DDP was ready, and the two could've had a rematch at Starrcade and maybe made it into a saga of good matches.

Nah it should have been Page

Russo bro

Great point. I think Nash was a great pick to beat Goldberg. Part of me wonders how things would have played out had we not lived in a world with "creative control clauses."

I have Starrcade recorded on VHS. The videos you see on KZfaq have fake crowd noise in favor of Goldberg. The crowd was in Nash's corner. I think Nash should've beat Goldberg without interference.

Are all the brainlets saying this out of their minds? “Ruin” Nash? Nash was never anything at all! He’s just tall! He could never, EVER work. What killed WCW was dummies like Hogan and Nash

@@countof3everybodyOD he was a much better worker and promo than Goldberg. Goldberg was just big.

I went to a Nitro back in late 98 or early 99 in Des Moines Iowa. When Goldberg came out there were a ton of boo’s I mean a ton. Hall and Nash got huge pops along with DDP. Funny thing is when we got home and watched the recording of it on vhs. They had piped in Goldberg chants that weren’t there.

Dusty Rhodes is laughing at this comment in the afterlife.

Duck lips?

I'm not sure what made you believe this. But, you are incorrect, I'm afraid. Kevin Trash was on the booking committee and he was technically the head booker for all of this. He likes to use the Fingerpoke of Doom to fool everyone into believing he didn't beat Greenberg for selfish ego, and to hurt Bill. He likes to act like "What did that do for me? I gave the belt to Hogan right away". Everybody seems to conveniently forget thar Hogan had creative control in his contract, to where he could even PUT HIMSELF IN MATCHES. Hogan could basically do anything he wanted. So, I guarantee that Trash had nothing to do with booking Hogan to fingerpoke him right afterward. I guarantee that Hogan pull a classic Cunt Hogan move, in lying to everyone about his intentions up until that Nitro. See, Hogan couldn't actually have his full contractual powers until the calendar flipped over to 1999 because he only had a certain amount of shots per year in his contract, and he had used them all up by Halloween Havoc in 1998 (Warrior vs Hogan 2, which was one of the worst matches ever). When Hogan completed all of his shots, his contract operated completely differently, if he were to do extra shots. So, I'm sure Trash was feeling great about himself, planning totally different shit (that would all centre around him being "cool" and such a "bad ass" who nobody ever gets the better of). But then, Cunt Hogan showed up to Nitro and suddenly says "You and I should swerve the audience in the Main Event. We've been feuding for a while now and people really buy it. So, they'll never see this coming. We'll act like it's going to be a major war. Then, I'll fingerpoke you. You take a back bump. And I'll get the 3 on you. Then, the NWO will be all back together and Bill can chase me with the belt all year, going through the whole NWO all the way til the Starrcade main event."

The problem with that way of thinking is that it assumes that Nash wasn't the idea guy for his own storylines. It also neglects the fact that Nash was on the booking committee well before any of this. He just didn't become HEAD of the committee til weeks into 99. So, it's just Nash never accepting that he's not as smart as he wants to claim he is. He says things like "expecially", consistently, then claims to have a high IQ. Nash's go-to move when he can't defend, or cope with his terrible ideas is to be exasperated and joke and/or insult, then hit you with a "what if..?", to deflect all responsibility

So you were born in 83?

It was stupid, because they turned around and put the belt back on Hogan a week later with their "inside jokey" Fingerpoke of Doom finish. If Nash had kept the belt for a while and feuded with Goldberg for a few months? I think everyone would have been and still be fine with it.

not good at math huh?

DISTRESS He was born in 1981

That is what Nash like's to say but that injury happened a year later so that plan not happening was not because of injury.

I mean, anyone who watched thinks he did lol.

Absolutely

@Douglas Taggart Agree with everything you said except for the Diamond Cutter being hotter than the Stunner at that point. Stunner was rising in 97 not 98. By 98 Ausitn had just started his peak in terms of how over he was and in Oct 98 Austin was the undisputed hottest wrestler in the business. Rock got red hot around this time as well so the People's Elbow was extremely over. By Halloween Havoc I'd say the hottest finishes in wrestling were 1. Stunner 2. Spear/Jack Hammer 3. People's Elbow 4. Diamond Cutter 5. Mr Socko I give People's Elbow the edge because Rock was more over than DDP at this point.

@Zee Dee That argument could be made in 97 but not by 98. Austin was the hottest thing in the business by far in the fall of 98. The only 2 coming close were Goldberg and Rock. DDP was hot but not like he was in 97. I know this because I've recently re-watched everything on the network. The Stunner in 98 trumped the Diamond Cutter. This was Austin's stunner still red hot in the beginning of 99: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/iNCZd9Nz1qq8oqs.html You won't find any Diamond Cutter getting those kind of pops in 98

Yeah but I also hated the finish overkill. If nash beat him clean or least with minor interference not fking pretending to tase him badly etc etc

Yeah but there's a difference between getting good heat and trolling to the point that you turn off your fan base.

By 99 anyway

The NWO should of stayed with 3 or 4 guys.. When they started to add uncool people who didn't fit I lost interest.. It took the cool factor away.. I want Heel Stables to be Strong but I don't want them to be invincible.. The NWO became too strong that no one and even other groups couldn't beat them..

The NWO wolfpac was over af still tho. This brought crazy heat to Nash and Hogan (the finger poke). It was great booking. The issue here is WCW was overpaying for everything, not making enough and had network executives attempting to book the show at this point. Nothing could have saved it.

Look what WWE did that same night. Mankind beat The Rock to win the title. WCW definitely got the short end of the stick that night.

Shit yeah that would have been awesome. Nash was mega over.

Just with How Over Nash was and how sick everyone was of Hogan and Goldberg it would have been a great story

Jericho especially so......

That would've been crazy, neither of them were anywhere near Goldbergs level, especially Jericho in 98, he was a popular joke character at that point

What? Wrestling isn’t that complicated. The uniform Scott Hall had were those worn by Goldberg’s security team. I don’t think there had to be a link between Bigelow interfering and Hall disguising himself as a security personnel.

"Fans often times in our great sport" he said something like that all the time

@@jakelang806 It's cause he's not yelling "IT'S STINGGGGGGGGG!" now lol.

*He can't wrestle.* *& he still thinks wrestling is real.*

@@JA-ev7om he's openly admitted wrestling is staged. U have no clue what you are talking about.

@@Jameswilliams-ty4cf *r/woosh*

@@Jameswilliams-ty4cf *Let me rephrase.* *He still thinks he's "Da Man!"* *R.i.p Bobby Heenan*

Yeah he is definitely past his prime. No doubt. But look at the ratings when he shows up. Supply and demand.

Goldberg didnt make those tats popular.. he got it because it was popular lol

Tribal tats were out way before he got it. It actually originated from Samoa. Learn something before celebrating your ignorance fool.

watch?v=gTDjV5WVCwY?t=88 That's Goldberg pinning Hogan for the title. Watch and listen to that crowd. He was over as hell and it was one of the greatest moments in WCW's history.

They chanted "Goldberg sucks" in that match vs Nash in 1998. Goldberg wasn't that over at that time. It was time to make him lose that belt.

Look at the link I shared. Also, Kevin Nash was the WORST DRAWING WORLD CHAMPION OF ALL-TIME in the WWF. Don't try to give me any bullshit about Goldberg not being over when they had him lose to a guy who was a proven failure. That did NOTHING for anyone. NOTHING.

Actually Shawn Michaels is the lowest drawing PPV champion of all time. Suck that in WWE machine.

Nope, Nash had the worst average house show attendance of all during his 358 days on top.

Hmmm and was it on purpose because it's odd he went back to wwe and everything was all good

Hogan ruined WCW not Nash.

Eric Bischoff who ruined WCW

"needed to be done" WHY? Goldberg was STILL drawing huge numbers. When fans talk that's all it is. But when someone with as much experience as bobby Heenan, I take as gospel because he worked in every territory, he had 30+ years in the business. When BOBBY says "the biggest mistake that company made was ending the streak" so I believe bobby.

@@michaelmclaren1333 I'm not convinced man, that place went nuts when nash won, but what should have happened was a rematch where nash turns heel and keeps the belt, to give Goldberg people to run through again, but I think they obviously handled it wrong, and it exposed Goldberg and made the nwo look like shit, I just think everything that happened after the loss was garbage in a different universe it was done the right way

@@foxholiday4308 as ANY place would. The place went nuts for the same reason that saying the name of the city there in does

@@michaelmclaren1333 Maybe you're right, but it seems to me that the crowds had been chanting Goldberg sucks for months, and Halloween havoc people were on their feet when the diamond cutter landed, when they thought page was going over. Now nash was most certainly a dick back stage and probably left them no choice but to end the streak, but they did everything they could to protect bill, I think if there actions were different after that night you and i would be having a different conversation. I feel like it had to end, how do you book a guy who is undefeated, for years to come? Especially a guy who was too green to go 30 minutes every night, and not make your other top guys look weak

@@foxholiday4308 if you watch bash at the beach 96 the people pop like crazy when Hogan came out. If it's good writing the fans will pop even for someone that had been booed previously. If you watch Hogan pauses and looks around before dropping the leg on mach. Then the ring gets filled up with cups and garbage because the fans feel like they had been screwed. It was genius to have the outsiders never mentioned Hogans name even when they were quoting the billionaire Ted skits. EDIT: and Nash, when he ended Goldberg streak was a part of the WHITE hot wolfpack angle. Only a few weeks later Nash abolishes the wolfpack. So those fans that were cheering Nash to end Goldberg streak were silent when Nash handed the title back to Hogan. And those fans that they lose don't come back.

i totally agree. raven never had the same heat after that.

Pissed me off they only gave Raven one damn day with the US belt!

Raven vs. Goldberg was actually a better match than what Goldberg had been doing.

okay then he didn't need to be the guy to end the streak or win the title and could've afforded a loss thank you for proving my point.

Anyone know why There is a big blurred blob on screen

He was supposed to be the heel, not the babyface. Dumbass

He got booed the next day on nitro, so “over” he was lmao