I love SMT 5, I got the same feeling in SMT 4. The feeling at the beginning when your weak and everything kills you and then by the end you’re out looking for the biggest baddest demons, like “Come get some”

Code Vein had one thing that Souls veterans hated - AI co-op that made the game so much more accessible rather than frustrating. I loved Code Vein for that.

Thank you soo much for defending SMTV!!!🙌🙌🙌 Your points are valid and true, i don't understand the hate for this great game! Its my most favorite SMT game and I'm near beating it. I want another sequel to this great game and i hope Atlus does it!!!👊👊👊

I don’t understand the hate for these games either. I’ve played almost all of them, and while they might not be my favorite in their respective series, I enjoyed them all. Especially Code Vein. I love pretty much everything FromSoft has ever made, especially the King’s Field series. I liked Code Vein precisely because it had a lot similar to what I like about the Souls games, but it also had its own distinct style and narrative. People are crazy man. All the haters missing out on all this good stuff

I agree with Grandia III. Still remember played it back in PS2 days, the graphic totally impressed me, and the gameplay + battle system totally addicted. So sad that it is criticised so much.

Tales of Legendia and Star Ocean 4 are not bad! I enjoyed them a lot.

Legendia is straight-up one of my favorite Tales games. The setting, the story, and the soundtrack are all fire, the gameplay is solid, and my only major criticism is the localization team cheaping out and not including voice acting for the last third of the game.

I LOVE star ocean 4. It's the first one i played and my favorite in the series (I haven't played 2 yet) I think its another one hated by switching up the combat a little cuz it plays differently than both 3 and 5. And by differently I mean much better

One game that I think doesn't deserve the hate is Tokyo Mirage Sessions. From what I know, though I don't know what people think of it these days, a lot of Shin Megami Tensei fans hated it because it looked like Persona. As a fan of both SMT and Persona, I couldn't care less if it looked more like either! I do sort of wish it was more like Fire Emblem, but either way, I love what we got. It is a little unfortunate that it doesn't have any variation of Press Turn or One More systems, but the Session system it does have is still very fun, and the flashiness very much fits with the Japanese idol motif.

Haven't 'hated' any of these games but my thoughts on them would be: -Chrono Cross: haven't played so no comment there -Ar Tonelico Quoga: haven't finished (or played in years) but didn't like that much due to the combat not feeling that fluid (especially in comparison to Tales which it tried to copy to a degree) and one big change with combat I didn't like was how the Revatail was locked to 1 song based off what appearance she had If I'm remembering right). Didn't get far enough to get a good handle on if the story was good or not though...may give it a second shot eventually when I don't have anything in the works and want to go back to the backlog. -Chaos Wars: haven't played so no comment there -Grandia 3: played but never beat...got sidetracked with other games. Actually kinda liked it (hell my bro hated the intro song so I always had it playing just to annoy him when he was in the room lol). Like Quoga it's another game I gotta go back to one of these days...on top of picking up Grandia 1 and 2 (probably will get the collection on Switch). Biggest issue i probably had was at the time i just liked action arpgs far more than turn based so I didn't feel like sticking with it (especially since i kept going back to replay Tales games back when i got Grandia 3 lol). -Star Ocean 4: Got close to end game but never got around to beating it due to other games (probably another NG+ run of a Tales game lol) and my bro mainly playing the Xbox360 i got it on. Liked the combat, story was okish i guess (worse than the first 3 though...seems like a trend that i hope SO 6 ends...reminder there's a stream for said game tomorrow btw that will hopefully have a release date), would say the biggest turnoff was the character models looking too dollish (seems to be an issue with all 3D SO games as even SO6 feels like that). Will probably beat it in the next few months though as I decided to go back and beat all SO games before SO6 comes out (never actually did it though I've had all games for years...always had another game come out that took my attention away for months and when i came back forgot where I was and had to restart and the cycle repeated again and again lol), beat SO 1 and 2 and about 3/5ths of the way through 3 (according to the walkthrough...using one mainly for private actions tbh as many of them are easily missable) and that'll take me maybe another 2 weeks at most to beat it (if I play at the pace I usually play games which is about 3 to 6 hours once every 2 to 4 days). -Tales of Legendia: liked it a lot but would place it at around middle of the pack of the series. Until Ludger and Alphen though Senel was my favorite MC as far as combat goes. Will say the last act/character chapters could've been integrated into the story better via sidequests and they should've went a bit of a different route with the final act/boss as it just felt tacked on...or they should've ended at the end of Act 2 (even if it meant no playable Shirly). Would say it also had one of the stronger stories in the serires (well for acts 1 and 2, not so much for 3). -Valkyria Revolution: another game I liked a lot though i will say combat could've been tweaked a bit more to make the action feel a bit more interesting (rather than tap X once they should've went with a musou/P5 Strikers style of combat for melee imo...in fact from what i remember hearing the game originally had combat more like that with light/heavy attacks and combo enders but fan feedback pushed the devs to change it to this), also as far as combat goes i feel like gun gameplay could've been expanded on a lot more by increasing the amount of ammo you got about a hundredfold (with how many enemies you take on that much ammo would not be excessive). As for Ragnite/spells those skills were all ok but I will say they should've added more interactions between spells (for example when using burning field if you use a tornado spell after it will cause enemies to re-ignite and prolong the burning field's time ont he field). Story wise it's tied with 4 for best in the Valkyria series with one key aspect being better than the main series: the entire squad (not just a 3 to 5 members) played some role in the story/had their say (likely due to a smaller cast of characters). Will say one thing I'd hope they changed (along with all the combat stuff above) is giving the game an actual world map and treating it like a classic rpg with multiple towns and all rather than go mission based if they ever make a sequel. The one aspect I did not like though was how grindy the weapon based upgrading system was...you needed far more ragnite than you should have to max it out. -SMT5: haven't played so no real comment...never got into the SMT series mainly due to how dungeon exploration worked (at least in older games where it's in first person/dungeon crawler/Class of Heroes style). May eventually pick this one up but lack of character driven story in a turn based game (don't outright hate TB but unless there's a good, long story said games don't hold too much draw for me...Trails is my second favorite series but that's mainly due to the story, characters, and lore not the combat...granted has the best TB system I've played imo). -Code Vein: another case of a game I got to around 4/5ths of the way through before other games/life took me away...it was on track of being my GotY for 2019 though so my opinion on the game is positive...also my favorite Souls like due to having a character driven story rather than the Souls typical item description/random npc dialogue driven story. -Tales of Symphonia Dawn of a New World: won't say I hate it but was very disappointed with the game given Symphonia's my favorite game in the series due to having easily the best story/world building/writing and this one having maybe middle/slightly below the middle of the pack quality in comparison. The main cast also being heavily nerfed in combat with set gear and not even half of the 1st game's artes didn't help and throw in the monster allies felt mostly needless imo as you couldn't really play as them and it feels like they made the OG cast weaker to encourage going for monsters as Monsters could actually be stronger than the main cast if you evolved the right ones into the right evolutions (Sword Dancer was BS OP). The world map being taken out for point and click was also a turnoff tbh and the art style while not bad feels like it could've been far better if they went more Vesperia's lightly colored Cel shading than Abyss's more muted color scheme tbh. And yes Emil and Marta bring it down a tiny bit for being too annoying at times. Finally...i feel like they could've expanded a whole lot more at the end with the story and had a more interesting last boss if the last boss we did get wasn't able to stop what he was attempting to halt (I'm being vague to avoid spoilers as even now a decade later people will still complain if they haven't played the game lol)...will also say personally I'd have made the OG cast npcs and add 2 more completely new characters as the final 2 members of the party rather than treat them as they did. Combat wise it was solid though as far as the general feel of playing the characters go with how responsive the inputs were, how many more artes we got over Symphonia, and how the skill system worked (more or less like Vesperia's minus being attached to weapons if I'm remembering right...got them from leveling up or something). Side quests were hit or miss though and like Arise felt more like most were hunt/fetch quests and nothing deeper. Now as for my personal pick of a game not on this list that gets more hate than it deserves: Akiba's Beat. Pretty much hated for the same reason as Valkyria Revolution: combat was drastically changed from the strip combat system to a Tales like combat system and the game was hated for it though it was marketed as it's own thing...hell people claim it's a part of the Trip series but I don't think it actually was meant to be at all and someone in marketing or someone that covered the game fucked up and tied the two together by saying it was a spin off at one point and the company decided to go with it for whatever reason. Combat wise it's great and the closest any company has ever gotten to a Tales game's classic style of combat so far with the only real weak points being you can only cancel attacks/spell animation by swapping characters and for whatever reason you couldn't jump over enemies heads with a normal jump (you'd hit an invisible wall for some reason), granted you could go over if you're using a skill though (which is why no letting you jump over was especially weird). Attack wise i will say some animations are quite a bit slower than most Tales animation though (especially for the MC in comparison to the other characters) so i can see why someone may say that it could feel slow/clunky. My favorite character to play as though was definitely Reiji though (spear guy that fights a lot in the air like a dragoon) granted he's one of the last characters you get so it takes a while to get him. Will say the dungeon design could've been a bit better/more varies (granted at least hey add puzzles unlike other series like Tales or FF which has mostly decided to go full on hallways) and while there was some side content to do (arena, bonding events, the usual fetch/hunt quests) the game could've added a bit more things to do besides that. The equipment system was interesting with the cards that gave additional effects like HP/SP regen or elemental attack boost/resistance and led to a collect them all moment. Story was also solid with some themes that could mess with your head, even if told completely via Visual Novel/Tales skit style portraits and all characters were great imo.

I actually picked up Valkyria Chronicles Revolution on xbox and been meaning to give it a shot. I didnt know code vein was hated. It was dope

Y’all are weird for hating Lymle that’s all I can say. As a jrpg lover I’m not sure why people dislike her I thought she was precious.

I loved so much SMT V, it was my favorite game from last year and I will always defend it. Code Vein was an amazing game too and I enjoyed it so much.

In my opinion Legendia hatred mostly comes from the fact that it was released after Symphony, so people probably expected 3d battle system but they got 2d instead, there also was Rebirth game before Legendia but it was released only in Japan. My hatred comes from the trope "Your Princess in another castle" and whole existence of Shirley, she didn't grow on me throughout the game and I think I dropped after as I love to call it Act 1 of the game after she did something really stupid in my opinion and I never returned to the game only because of her existence

I love SMTV it's a good rpg

Suikoden 4 falls on this category for me, I love it and never understood why people hate it so much, and well also Drakengard 2 (idk if it would be included as an JRPG but for me it has enough role-playing features it should)

People are too grumpy. Hating is a strong emotion, but it comes out of people's mouths easily for silly reasons. Claiming that certain games suck because of some bad points and ignoring the good points of games. The internet is too polarized. To this day people seem to hate that game from The Caligula Effect, because it looks too much like Persona, and in some ways it is far superior to Persona itself when it comes to developing the psyche of the characters, but no one seemed to care about that at the time, everyone just jumps into the carousel of hate: If he looks like Persona, let's hate him.

Emil and marta are among my favorite tales cast, I remember getting goose bumps during emil's/ratatosk scenes.

I'll proudly hate on Chrono Cross. Not only did it get rid of the happy ending of Trigger, but had gameplay issues of 1) limiting leveling, 2) too many characters, 3) what limited unique abilities the characters has you were limited to how often you could use it, and 4) several guide-dang-it moments (especially when you could steal items on certain bosses).

Good list. I had such a fun time playing Chaos Wars for a game night. Legendia is so good, especially if you play past the first ending. Chrono Cross and SMT5 are two of my all time favorites. Dawn of the New World does get too much hate and I like it a lot, I'll say though that it isn't the Symphonia comparisons that hurt it for me, it was that the Judith air combat in Vesperia was so good and so fun that when Dawn of the New World came out and I could never get a great feel for air combat (which plays such a huge part of that combat); the comparison hurt it for me.

The gameplay loop, music and atmosphere of SMT V are amazing. I do agree with the criticism of the games story though, it was quite forgettable overall.

My pick for this question is always Star Ocean 5, I enjoyed it! Context is always important, there weren’t many jrpgs at all at that point in the generation.

I'll say this. I absolutely love Code Vein when I played it. It's actually the first souls like game I beaten. Great story and characters and combat mechanics. My only issue with it is sometimes lvl design can get in the way of combat. Sometimes a big ass enemy dashes to you when you're walking on a small path and you are expected to dodge it's attacks with little room. That gets annoying.

Finally someone who defends SMTV! Now if only someone would defend Tokyo Mirage Sessions. It got way too much hate just for some censorship

I would say Disgaea 3, but locking the postgame behind dlc was wrong. Tales of Symphonia 2 on ps3 is a masterpiece to me.

I think Cold Steel gets some undeserved hate too. Some things I'll agree, like the harem thing that felt shoehorned in and sometimes Rean can get a bit too wishy-washy, but several things about its hate that annoy me is because it's "too anime." HELLO! Trails in the Sky was very anime too, and that wasn't hated. Characters were too tropey, Vita/Misty said it best. Cliches are cliches for a reason, and of course, the whole power of friendship thing! That's in EVERY SINGLE JRPG OUT THERE! Honestly, I think the hate Cold Steel gets is from Trails in the Sky elitists.

I just finished grandia 3 on my backlog and I can see why people would dislike the story. The story starts off really promising with Yuki's adventure to be an aspiring pilot while upholding the Grandia theme of being an adventure. It ends up falling flat after the 2nd disc putting aside/minimizing the adventuring pilot theme and replacing it with a generic JRPG plotline. Still a great game with the battle system which I definitely enjoyed.

Just arrived and haven't seen a thing but I hope FF XIII is here. I loved that game, soundtrack, world and characters. :)

its funny how the biggest critics and loudest voices usually barely played the games enough to understand them and its usually easy to tell.

Code Vein is awesome and I'm still hoping for some kind of story conclusion to it, and the rest of the God Eater franchise as it is all connected. On an individual game basis though, I still want to know what happened to all the characters after the games wrap up.

From what I heard their was a lot of developement problems at Atlus on SMTV that the story was rewritten multiple times and even the Head writer quit or something. You can really tell their was some cut corners in the game

I really really tried to like Chrono Cross but when I finished it, I was relieved it was over. I think the glut of characters and lack of development for so many of them was the main factor. Also I didn't love the battle system, some interesting stuff but overall the elemental system made me feel like I had less choice in my party lineup than I would like. Honestly I think that particular game is a bit over loved/rated.

Smt 5 is one of my favorite turn based rpgs of all time. Battle mechanics and visuals were amazing.

I agree with you on Cross (I haven't played most of the others). I think if the game was called Dimension Cross, it would've been better received. If anything, I think the connections to Trigger actually drag down the story because it feels like it was stuck in just to make it a sequel. As for SMT5, I don't hate it. It's a solid 7 in my book. I just think it's a big step back from 4/Apocalypse. It honestly feels more like Nocturne and if it was SMT4, I'd say it made some improvements (like how the supporting cast actually got more development than in Nocturne. Odd how your friends never want to stick around you in the apocalypse with all the demons around. Surely you'd want to band together, strength in numbers, you know?). The problem with 5 is that everything was just done better in 4. The settings had far more life to it (I get it, barren wasteland apocalypse but even Nocturne had more life in it than this did). The characters were more fleshed out and I actually cared about them and understood why they eventually sided at the end. Honestly, 5 feels like it went through development trouble. Considering it was announced along with the Switch and it took years before we saw another trailer, it makes me wonder if they had a basic idea of a follow up to Nocturne but not the characters or plot.

If you stuff yourself with something eventually you burf it up. That's what happened with SMT V. People went mental doing everything, anything as fast as possible and in the end didn't enjoy it.

I was thinking of the last game on the list just before it was said. It's my number one guilty pleasure and I really liked the observation on the main character with the reason why his divisive personality works for the plot. I actually like the monster party members, particularly raising, training, and evolving them in multiple paths. Felt to me like Pokemon if they used actual monsters instead of magic animals.

Where can I buy that Edelgard t-shirt?

Ar Tonelico Qoga, Code Vein and Tales of Symphonia: Dawn of a New World are all great! But so is Time and Eternity (which also gets a lot of undeserved hatred), it was so funny, I kept laughing while playing through it. :D

What happens to Tales of Symphonia Dawn of the New World is the same thing that happens in, for example, Okamiden or Deus Ex Invisible War. They're not bad games, but when you're a sequel of a masterpiece the people expects a lot about you

Didn’t know Norma garnered so much hate in the Tales community but I’m glad Erick ended up not minding her after playing her character quest

Tales of Legendia is one of my favorite in the series, few games have made me laugh as hard as this one and I'll always remember it with love.

I totally agree with you this time, people hate games whitout playing it first

Thanks Erick! I bought Chaos Wars like 4 years ago because it's an RPG. Haven't played it but read the reviews about the Dub, honestly had no idea it had a sub option. This gives me hope to play it :D.

Dude, I wasn't aware of the hate of Code Vein. I love it. Plus, it has the best character creator of any game.

Tales of Legendia had a good lengthly Post Game that doesn't even felt it was just a topping but more like an extension for loose ends and I loved its soundtrack and the victory banters

As for Code Vein, it is a fine game but the fact my character had the personality of a wooden board to the point he felt like a background character than a main protag bugged me. Some games pull it off better like Persona 5 but I imagine that is because we didn't have to spend time designing him like in Code Vein. It works for souls games since there isn't as much of a story as there is lore to piece a story together

For me it's Xenoblade 2, a lot of people like myself absolutly LOVE IT and some hate it. I'll always love the World, the music, the story, the combat, and the very well writen characters. This is a true masterpiece for me. And when you add Torna, it becomes one of the best JRPGs of all time imo

There are very few characters in jrpgs that I hate but when I do hate them that feeling doesn't really change the more I play the game

Ff13 trilogy don’t deserve the mainstream hate they define the 7th generation jrpg

Great video! It is very clear how much you just enjoy jrpgs dude. I would say that reasons that many people were disappointed with Star Oxean 4 and Grandia 3 us that they were competent games but so much more unoriginal than their predecessors in their respective series. They are well done but rather bland, overly clichéd, and they both did not live up to the good ideas in their own stories, especially Stat Ocean 4.

I'll be honest here, I actually liked Code Vein. But there was 1 massive issue I had with it. On the PC Game Pass version for whatever reason the mouse cursor was always dead center, even if I were playing with a controller. If I could figure out a way to get rid of that, I'd actually want to do a full playthrough of it. Until they figure that out though, its a pass.

Qoga was my first and only ar tonelico game I played, and at the time I generally preferred real time combat. I hate qoga's combat though. You spend 5 minutes smacking the enemy with your drill for like 100-500 damage, do an ultimate for 10-20k damage. . The baddie is still at 90% health, then you reach song level 3 or whatever, play a rhythm game, and them omgwtfbbq nuke the baddie for 900,000,000 damage. It feels like evwry battle is you wasting time pretending to fight as you just wait for the iwin button to turn up.

I will stand by Code Vein as a really competent and really good Souls-like with a lot of heart. It was a really good experience overall, and the difficulty was really well-done.

Thank you for the Langrisser recommendation, it's an amazing game. Keep making these epic videos that highlight forgotten or overlooked jrpgs.

Erick: Hey guys, whats up?! Also Erick: I dont read comments.

I Love Tales Of Legendia it was classic to me story, characters & gameplay everything was on point!

Star Ocean I got stuck really early on. I have no idea what I missed. I felt like I went to every corner 5 x over and I couldn't find how to progress.

The story of Chrono Cross made me play Chrono Trigger. Both games have great stories and lore.

My problem with Qoga isn't the different combat system (though some ingenuity would be nice) but the incessant fanservice. It isn't as bad as Hyperdimension Neptunia or Super Robot Wars Taisen (this is the game's name, right?) but it kinda hurts the game IMHO. As for Legendia, I almost always end it after finishing the main quest. Having the character quests tucked in the end, with no new dungeons and no voice acting, ruins them for me.

I feel like I'm in the minority of souls dorks who actually really enjoyed code vein. It definitely felt more like god eater 3 than any fromsoft game but the combat reminded me a fair bit of bloodborne.

I know this is off topic but I would like to hear your opinion of Yakuza 7. I don't know if you started it yet but it is a JRPG & it's wild. Would be great to hear what you think about it.

The points of hatred against star ocean 4 and grandia 3 I completely disagree with. The opening isn’t bad in grandia 3 and Lymle ended up being one of my more liked characters by the end of SO4.

Congrats. Now Digimon Survive joined the list.

I really have to go back and finish Code Vein and Valkyria Revolution, I haven’t played either in over a year but luckily I never went past the intro stage so I shouldn’t have much of an issue picking up where I left off. Edit; Oh and SMT5 but I only recently bought it, I didn’t know it got hate but then again, I didn’t hear praise either.

I'm honestly freaking shocked that any fans didn't love SMT V. That game is an absolute blast. It's truly a beautiful Switch game and the actual gameplay is the best in the entire series, spinoffs included.

I just thought Valkyria Revolutions gameplay lacked the strategy. I don't hate action gameplay but that enemy AI made it hard to enjoy

Star Ocean: The Last Hope was what saved me from dissappointment of FFXIII during PS3 era. A great game!

I loved Dawn of the new world such a huge improvement of the original Symphonia. And how can anybody hate Jonny Young Bosch’s performance. I was also unaware of the hate for Code Vein it used one mechanic from the souls games big deal it has much more in common with the God Eater series as far as gameplay and pacing are concerned and I also love souls games. As for Chrono Cross it’s totally connected to Trigger. The director at the time made that statement to save face with western fans. The og cast was there and you see the consequences of their actions for messing around with time as well as Balthazar’s actions when created Chronolopolis. Many questions from trigger are answered as well, like in the campfire scene who was the entity that wanted the cast to do what they did to stop Lavos it was Schala the whole time guiding them.

For me, FF8 is a game that had a lot of undeserved hate. To a lesser extent FFX. To me, along with FF6, FF8 and FFX are my favourite FF games. FF7 would definitely be on my list too (at least up to Costa Del Sol, and probably Rocket Town), but I find all the ancient ruins and livestream stuff in the later game to be excruciating. FF4 is a very important game to me from my childhood, but I find it difficult to get into, even compared to earlier games like Dragon Warrior 1-4 (well, not the original 2)-though, I still love the soundtrack.

Add Star Ocean 3 as honorable mention lol. Sadly the concept of Jupiter Brain was not that well known when the game was released.

What are the all games shown during the intro song?

Chrono Cross? SMT V? Valkyrie revolution? Grandia 3? Tales series? I can't believe, that those games are on this list! Those games are masterpices! Who could dislike them? Especially SMT V - WHO CAN HATE IT? It is one of the best games of the SMT franchise!

Smt 5 was the first one in the series i finished and its a great rpg

Tales of Legendia was my first Tales of and I would love to see a remaster of it with complete voice acting.

People may make fun of the voice acting in Arc Rise Fantasia but, for the main/major cast, it does mostly get a lot better as the game progresses. Niko and Dynos are really the only ones who don't improve. As for the list itself, I would add Final Fantasy XIII for the same reasons as Dawn of the New World.

Any time people attempt to rationalize why they dislike something, it’s usually just a wild stab and not any kind of objective standard they have.

I didn't enjoy Ar Tonelico 3 as much as I could because, they made an half-assed clunky mess of a battle system. Clearly, all the budgeting went to the heroine's models. I still wish they remade it with a proper fast paced real time Tales-like combat system; since they pretty much perfected melee and magic combat.

star ocean last hope was fantastic. legendia was awesome too

Can anyone tell me the names of the games in the intro? I recognize some but others im not so sure. games to look into if you will

What is the poster behind you from?

One can say the fans of Chrono Trigger got... Chrono Triggered... with Chrono Cross. I'll see myself out.

Sorry, have to disagree with Dawn of the New World. Yes, I am one of those people that adores Symphonia 1. My major issue with it is that while it was nice to have the original cast join you, they can't level up or be given equipment to make them useful. And you can only realistically have Emil or Marta in the first slot to play as. If you actually try to use any of the Symphonia 1 characters, they get taken out of the first slot after EVERY battle. Just why? I didn't mind Emil actually, but didn't like how fangirly Marta was with Emil, though I guess that does get better over time. Tenebie, Alice, and Decus were all fine characters imo. Also, it's a waste that they gave us monsters to be in our team but we can't control them in battle. Narikiri Dungeon X, a PSP game, has a monster tamer in class in it and when you tame a monster you can actually use the monster in combat. So why not let us do that in Dawn? Adding unplayable monsters and the Symphonia 1 cast was completely wasted potential.

Grandia 3 is my favorite jrpg of all time. Glad to see someone else defending it

Chaos Wars led to Cross Edge, which led to Trinity Universe, which led to....Hyperdimension Neptunia! It was a process, lol.

Knew Star Ocean 4 would be here. :) Of course there is ONE thing objectively wrong with it: The fact that the song you used, Edge's theme, only plays in that one scene and doesn't even carry over in the ensuing battle despite being one of the most awesome songs in the game! XD But in all seriousness, I agree, I didn't find much of anything to be any worse than just things typical of JRPGs. I'm also glad I played it with how much Diving Force feels like a follow-up to it, showing how the once struggling human race taking its first steps into the void has changed over time as they've gained traction. On that note, I really agree with what you said about games getting excessive flak for issues seen in many other games around the same time. I often find that what's frustrating about criticism people levy against games is how people treat a game they dislike as if its problems are truly isolated and unique, ignoring how easy it is to find some of the same issues in other games, and especially in games they DO like. Some missteps are easily forgiven in one game, yet another game gets constantly bludgeoned for them. Some characters get completely written off with zero thought, while others get every redeeming quality excavated from the writing. People assume that any plot that feels well done is good because it's completely original and free of tropes and familiar plot structures. There are so many comparable story elements out there that people will try to wall off from each other instead of recognizing that good and bad games can both share some of the same plot devices and flaws. Trying to force them to be separate just leads to a lot of pointless arguing trying to prove things the speakers know to be, realistically, false.

Played cross with my cousin and we needed grind material so lots of characters and multiple play Throughs was nice. I liked ff13 but I know everyone hated it lol

I would add Xenosaga episode 2, it's not perfect but the combat system is fun and has a lot of potential, also the game is not very long. I enjoyed it more than episode 1. Also, Smt v is also hated because it has level scaling.

Valkyria Revolution and Code Vein are a couple of my favorite games. Really a lot of undeserved hate. Also Dawn of the New World is one of my favorite Tales games and I love Emil as a character. He's adorable and you don't get many male protagonists in games who aren't loud and obnoxious. A breath of fresh air.

Necesito saber en dónde conseguiste esa camisa de edelgard T_T

I love most of these games! Especially Code Vein which I consider as a true hidden gem!

FF8 got a lot of the same hate as Chrono Cross. FF7 was the first JRPG for A LOT of people, and nobody wanted FF8 when it was released - everybody wanted a FF7-2.

Chaos Wars is not a grindfest. I got through the entire game without doing one single dungeon/battle other than necessary to advance the plot or recruit someone and the game was still a bit on the easy side instead of ever hitting a brick wall where I needed to go grind for stats/equips to be able to handle the plot battles. As for Qoga, I loathe it for the stripping mechanic.

The crafting system and endgame of Star Ocean 4 were absolutely superb, some of the most fun I have ever had in a RPG. It was just sad that the game got bogged down by terrible voice acting, a lackluster story, and disk swapping when changing areas (Xbox 360). The disk swapping was particularly egregious as they had quests that spanned disk boundaries that made you go back and forth multiple times... I would slap the design team that did that, but hey I found the game pretty fun all these years later.

Some people do really love code vain, not many does not like it, so the reputation of this one is not that bad compare to your other examples here.

Nice to see somebody else who likes Tales of Legendia. I would love to see it remade with Abyss-style gameplay, and maybe a different ending for a certain lady.

Grandia III will always be one of my fave jrpgs. The battle system was just so good!

I’m surprised Tales of Zestiria wasn’t mentioned. It was my introduction to the series, and I thought it was great. I get that the overall story is more simple compared to other games in the series, but that doesn’t mean it’s bad. I can’t really comment on gameplay changes though.

I'm going to find those games on this list and played them myself. I get that some games can be hated but none of this game deserve the hate so I agree with you.

I don't understand the hate of those either - especially Chrono Cross! Here's also 7 that could had been on the list: 7)Wild Arms 2 (I don't know if it's hated today, but critics, for some reason, were not kind to it when it was first released), 6) Pokémon Black/White, 5)Final Fantasy: Lighting Returns, 4)Final Fantasy 8, 3)Final Fantasy 12, 2)Suikoden 4, 1)Golden Sun 3

I don't understand the hate of SMT V too. It is the only game that I could play 24/7 without pause or loosing interesst.