That darn down counter! Sorry.

Stereotypes aside, I am a librarian and I immediately recognized Hy'Rell as being a modern, enthusiastic, proper librarian. People who work in libraries have an enormous passion for what we do. We love to put the information in your hands. And that's what she does here. We're also committed to intellectual freedom, which is something else she demonstrates.

I’m pretty sure I just figured out how they’re gonna end this series. I think they’re gonna re-create books planet.

Michael Burnham has left the library. Michael Burnham has been saved.

I was really worried the librarian would be the "eccentric collector that's a bit shady" trope but was refreshed to see that she just really likes knowledge. That was lovely and very Trek.

Calling it now: Progenitor's technology + World Root = ♫♪ A Whole New World ♪♫

Am I the only one who was hoping, when Burnham opened her eyes in the archive to hear, "She is corporeal; linear; aggressive; adversarial." ?!?!

Oh so I'm not the only one who notices that discoveries walls turn into flamethrowers every time they get hit

In my experience, yet to really come across librarians in that stereotypical shushing thing -- most librarians I have met have been like the one in this episode, genuinely excited by books and by archiving, loving their time at the library, smiling, welcoming...

It's a little disappointing that when Burnham was reading up on the Dominion war, that Jake Sisco wasn't one of the authors.

My take on the test is: She was trying to take the test logically like a Vulcan, but she is human and once she becomes true to who she is, is when she passes the test by recognizing she is a flawed human and remembers who she is. By accepting herself with all the imperfections she would be more likely be able to understand life more.

THANKS for this!!! To answer Sean's challenge: one challenge was "Can we trust you?" This week's was, "Can you trust yourself?"

Im okay with the bucket having endless sand. It's metaphorical

You missed the one Labyrinth Film conection directly to Trek being that Gates McFadden was the Director of Choreography and Puppet Movement (as Cheryl McFadden) she was mainly involved with the ballroom sequance in the film.

I was sorely disappointed in how defenseless the library turned out to be. It was built-up that the library knew how to deal with disruptions. They even mention the oubliette as a veiled threat, and then when the crap hit the fan... they were actually completely helpless. That was a major down for me. They could still have had the Breen dreadnought emerge victorious but it should not have been so overwhelmingly one-sided.

Speaking as a librarian, a lot of us are more like Hy´Rell than the stereotype.

Burnham’s passing the test through dealing with failure was so impactful! Favorite scenes were seeing Rhys captain Discovery! I love those little glimpse we get to how others would command, and he seems so prepared!

High five on the Trilithium down. I spent the whole episode wondering where those 2 bridge crew were.

How did you not UP the opening sequence as the camera glides through the Breen ship! It was beautiful and very impressive!

Downs at 9:26 - primarch one note - missing characters Total downs: 1 Me thinks your math ain't mathing

I love the introspective episodes, and when Burnham mentions she's more afraid of failing than she is of death, that hit HARD.

It's not about being sure of oneself, but being honest with oneself to pass the test. If you cannot at least be honest with yourself about even the hardest parts of you that engender emotions like guilt, embarrassment, if you cannot be truthful to yourself about who you are, flaws and everything, the scientists think you cannot be trusted with that kind of power...

I love how Hyrel wasn't just delightful, but also so empathetic to Book about the cuttings. I feel like that was also a message about how cultural items are foremost still of the culture, and the culture has the right to it, even if the Curators are prepared to honor. it and the people. British Museums could learn a few things. But seriously how do we get more Hyrel...

I was disappointed that Deep Space Nine was not mentioned in this episode considering Discovery was very close to the station in this episode would of been cool to know if the station was still there or not in the 32nd century.

Really quite pleased with their take on the Test of the Spirit (Jinaal), Body (Whistlespeak) and Mind (Labyrinths) they have going on. Even at the end Burnham needed a bit of deconstruction.

This would've been a great episode for Doug Jones to be in, taking the form of the interactive program in the mindscape. As for the Badlands, I can see how it could look different after several hundred years, gas clouds disperse so why wouldn't the plasma storms get more violent. I could tell that things were brewing on the Breen ship, whenever the Primarch ever did anything to Moll, the one Breen beside her was unlike the others and when he changed allegiances, it wasn't unexpected but damn the coup was quick.

The piece of Kweijan world root conveniently gifted to Book is 100% going to be combined with the progenitors' tech to resurrect Kweijan isn't it?

Please dont all take a visit to the library all at the same time. traffic is already at 2kph on spadina. :P

And not to mention the bridge is made of explodium

My latinum up for the episode is Rhys taking the chair!

I fully support that down because I miss the hell out of Owo and Detmer. they were the two characters I fell in love with immediately on the very first episode and it's sad that they're not there.

Raynor gets a pass. We got his backstory, his family was killed for, more or less, not being Breen; he can call them whatever he wants. Especially if they're trying to kill him

"Check in the Brandon Sanderson section"? Was that a Wheel of Time joke? Very nice 😂

I'm kinda hoping that at the final episode, when everything goesto Hell, the refitted USS Enterprise (former ISS Enterprise) will come to the rescue, cammanded by Detmer and Owo. One can hope.

Reno in renfair clothes is all I can think about.

Just because of the exchange between Burnham and mindscape Book, I think, this is probably the best episode of that season. It was refreshing to experience a lack of rushing and over-the-top excitement. Simply a deep talk between two people. An introspective while being inside your own mind. How fitting. Apart from that, the locations didn't change very much. That never-emptying bucket was funny.

I've only had the pleasure of visiting Toronto a few times, and just one of those times I was lucky enough to find myself exploring the University of Toronto libraries. Despite that, being in the Thomas Fisher Rare Book Library one time for a few minutes was enough to make it one of my favourite places in the world and stick with me over half a decade later. When the interior of the archives showed up on screen, I nearly jumped out of my seat in excitement. This DISCO reminder already has me planning another trip!

So, that one Breen that was backing up Moll this whole time... It occurred to my wife and I that perhaps this could be someone we know already somehow.

I so hope that Saru will join Star Trek Academy. He would be an amazing professor!

Commander Jemison may be in homage to Mae Jemison, but it could also be a double nod to Starfield in which the main starting city, New Atlantis, is on the planet Jemison (also named after Mae). Elias Toufexis (Lak) had a prominent part in Starfield voicing the player companion Sam Coe.

Glad you thought Book was a little camp. I thought it was just moi!

Couldn't help but laugh when the flame throwers went off. And boy did I love the new badlands. It makes sense it could have worse there there after nearly a thousand years. Also I loved how the bridge crew worked together, and I wish we could have a show where Rhys is in command of a ship. He did so well!

That oubliette comment was my favorite of the episode. The only way in or out is in the ceiling.

I have to say that I've really enjoyed this season so far, despite the "downs" and the usual style of Discovery focusing too much on Burnham. Rayner is well written and relevant to the story.

I had a problem that more Breen did NOT object when the Primarch threaten to fire on the Archive the first time. It had already been established that thoe Archive held several secred Breen objects. If they had, then we could have a scene with the Primarch stating, "if we do not get the Imperium, than those objects will become meaningless." That would also have intensified all that followed with him, and also Moll's speech would have made even more scense.

About Burnham knowing about the Breen - she spent just a lot of time ina library, reading about the Dominion war and other things, she would have picked up something.

Was anyone else hoping Pelia was going to show up on the Archive?

I think she passed the test by overcoming her own personal delusions. She said she’s afraid of not being good enough, captain, partner, friend, etc. Fake Book says that sounds like a hard way to live. Burnham’s whole body language changes, she softens her stealy eyed tough guy look. I took that as the test was to know thy self. Even hearing Burnham say those emotions make her feel small and scared reminded me of the Klingon attack when she was a kid, she was small and afraid. If she would have been unable to know herself, her fears, insecurities, inadequacies, regrets etc, then she would eventually fail to protect the progenitors tech. Basically the test taught her to get out her own way… in my opinion

I think you missed a minor citation observation: the transmission buoy giving directions to the archive looked like the satellite from “The Inner Light” as well. This in the same episode with a nucleonic beam that our captain couldn’t be disconnected from. I think it was also part of the homage.

absolutely 10,000% agree with whats said about Detmer, Owo, and Saru...however, needed more of them throughout the whole series

I'm also totally ok with the infinite bucket of sand. It's a weird mind puzzle. Why not

I will never not smile at the "whoopsie daisy" 😊

Reece reminded me of Data taking command- he was a natural

Just here to say the "whoopsie-daisies" are making me LOL!

I believe what the program was getting at was the need for clear self reflection. The concept of morality and the lens we see ot through is most tied to our ability to be honest to ourselves and the mirror we hold up to ourselves. If you cant admit your failings, or strive to be better, the question stands how can you be trusted to at least try to safeguard and protect against horrors of such power? A clear moral lens and ability to see yourself within the context of life is the one of the Hallmarks of sentience.. without it qe consume, control and destroy..so thus the test.. To GREATLY simplify a philosophical concept lol

The reason the actors are missing is because the budget was downsized. They put more Canadian people on the bridge in order to get tax credits from Canada while filming.

Slightly off topic, but I love the Arrakis tourist t-shirt!

We don't get to see Reno being Reno in the library is a way down.

I really enjoyed this episode. I loved Hy'Rell's interaction with the Breen, denying them access to the archive. Just the right amount of librarian sass :)

I thought the self awareness test of Burnham echoed the "Absolute Candour" episode of season 3, and the two in tandem really show the growth of Burnham

The Primark had to be simplistic and blatantly unredeemable for it to make sense that the Breen soldiers would take Mols side over his at the end. If it was ambiguous at all, The end would have made no sense.

I loved all the great bits, they kept this ep going! The (real!) library & Hy’rel were standouts for sure. Agree Breen mustache twirling commander so annoying, but his team had to get to hate him a lot in order to support Moll, so. Big dumb boring baby though, & hard to watch. Can’t think of anyone to compare him to… Great review of a very decent ep, nicely done!

She passed the test by understanding her weaknesses. Without being able to identify her weaknesses, she might fall victim to them when having the kind of power the tech gives you. You need to know how your weaknesses affect your decision-making so you can factor them in and make the best decision possible.

I'm thrilled that you mentioned the "Labyrinth" movie call back!!!

I was hoping for a throwback "whoopsiedaisy" and you did not disappoint! 3 ups for that.

Ahhh, Sean your Ups & Downs are, as always, a genuine treat. God, I mean, Barnum is, often as naught, over the top, but I just love the story and visuals of Discovery. I mean, the CGI totally pushes the envelope. Excellent analysis. Lovely commentary. And, please make “whoopsadaise” a permanent meme! Love it!

Hysperia isn't the first lower decks reference in Discovery. Season 4 referenced the Spider cow from the series premier.

I am absolutly fine with the Primach being this comic super villain. Because well... we have 1 1/2 episode to establish this meta villain, not for Discovey, but for Maul to overcome. He basically just exist to give her more power, while also make us sympathize with her more. So from a narrative perspective, he does his job. If we still had 15-20 episodes per season, you could have fleshed him out more, but using this simlistic character to elevate Maul is fine.

I've always believed that battle scenes in Star Trek should look more like a KISS concert, so that's an up for me.

Let's hear it for the ouibliette!

If we don't get a "whoopsie daisies" we riot.

The book was called 'Labyrinth of the mind' for a reason.

The archive was giving Empress's glass sky castle in Never Ending Story. Loved it.

As soon as I saw the thing in the book I knew what was about to happen. I've played Myst enough to know a Linking Book when I see it!

Loved this episode, and HyRell's enthusiasm reminded me of actual librarian colleagues. And that library is AWESOME!

the Primarch reminded me of Dark Helmet.

Don’t mind the one dimensional villainy of the Primarch; cause I think the goal was to mold Mull into the main villain from the go. And obviously she has more layers.

Did nobody else think that Burnham’s library holo map looked like a pac-man level?

You’ve clearly not been a modern library if you think of librarians that way, says a librarian.

For the giggles.... My interpretation of the Test is that the program actively scans the participants brain to learn who the person is and decide whether or not to tell them where the last piece is hidden. There's no test... if she chooses the place where she wants to be then the area she finds herself in is from her memories. Meaning they are being scanned... you are absolutely right about the Character of anyone is essentially built up and contained by walls. There's places we would never go in ourselves and thats essentially the trick... the program can't see anything you don't show yourself... you couldn't lie to it more than you could yourself. It however isn't you so it is aware how open you are actually being. The book that is being read when she awakens is carried throughout the journey and shown at the end of the path when it explains that her barriers prevented her from finding the answer... the program isn't for guiding someone to the piece its to tell them how to actually use the object to enter into the final resting place for this technology. I imagine it could tie to a Voyager episode where Janeway must save Kes from a psychic door. Its never revealed what exactly the door was about but the rituals and tests Janeway went through were equally meaningless not to say they didn't serve Janeway or Burnham in the purpose of understanding the whole thing. But to know yourself and to believe in anything takes a certain mindset that few actually accomplish. Both episodes are super similar in these regards and its linked at least in the narrative behind the Progenitors mission.

That “Whoopsie Daisy” just killed me. 🤣

OMG I would love that model. My oldest daughter's name is Kira, and yes, her character on DS9 was a big reason. One of my favorite series and feel grossly underrated.

I wish I could feel something about missing core members of the crew, but there's one thing discovery managed to do that no other series really did other than TOS: and that's fail to flesh out several main characters.

That DUNE t-shirt. Kudos Seán!

I loved Hy'Rell too, such a fun character.

Your reviews are just spot on. I love how you explain everything I was actually thinking and seeing and loving and finding challenging I live to wait for your reviews xx

You are so awesome I truly enjoy your up a downs I look forward to seeing them every week

I was glad it wasn't a labyrinth where she had to hop around singing "Alamaraine!" 😅

Book was dressed as a Time Lord! Just needs the headpiece!

Discovery has been such a revolving door with cast and supporting characters. Not saying that some characters shouldn't have been moved on (Georgiou) but that we don't quite have the found family aspect that we had in other shows (Picard kinda the same). Having seen Owo and Detmer get some spotlights in Season 3 and 4 made me want to see them even more.

"Whoopsie Daisy" needs to stick around in perpetuity

I think you missed an observation. When Michael was trying to pass the test and the lights were dimming representing her demise, it paralleled when Dr. Bashir entered into the mind of the Section 31 agent and his mind world was similarly dying.

9:10 I got that impression about Detmer and Owyo when it was stated they would be piloting the ISS Enterprise back. The view from the Discovery bridge made it seem like a last hurrah for those 2 as the ship flew off. Similar to Kirks final order on the A.

I can't believe that in CO you didn't mention that when Michael was mapping out the labyrinth on a screen, it was a Pacman maze.

Those flamethrowers on the bridge drive me nuts! It's like the bridge is a ride in an amusement park.

i finally remembered what the Breen remind me of. The aliens in Earth: Final Conflict

I miss Owo, Detmer, and Saru, too. Completely agree with you about the trilithium down.

I love Hyrell so unbelievably much and I'd gladly die for her ❤

I really thought when they asked for Book to come to the library, they were going to pull a switcheroo and keep him as him being the last of his race.

Possibly unpopular opinion, but the Book in Burnham's mind was better than the Book in real life. I loved the way Book was portrayed here.