I'm so thankful for my upbringing in South Africa where I was taught from a young age that the Bible is not a science textbook, and that it doesn't teach us How God made the earth, but That he made the earth.

“The gospel is that I am so sinful that Jesus had to die for me, yet so loved and valued that Jesus was glad to die for me. This leads to deep humility and deep confidence at the same time. I can’t feel superior to anyone, and yet I have nothing to prove to anyone.” - Tim Keller

God bless you, Gavin. I can’t even express to you how grateful I am for your videos. I am a newer Christian who is ravenously curious but also, admittedly, kind of gullible. I have gotten sucked into just about every single-issue sub sect of Christian internet culture over the last year and I have been in prayer about all of it. I believe God has heard my prayers and recognized my sincere confusion and has therefore led me to you. Your videos are so comforting and balanced. They always seem to ground me. You are also such a great example of how to disagree with grace. Thank you 🙏

Hey Gavin, I am someone who really struggles with this issue, and historically have felt firm in both camps. I am currently undecided. I feel a real pull in both ways. I am grateful for your voice in the conversation. I have a baby boy coming this next month and I have no idea what I'm going to tell him about dinosaurs! "They lived... a long time ago." :D

You are correct at the end of your video when you say that it can lead to a crisis of faith. It did lead to a crisis for me when I began studying anthropology in college. For two years I struggled, at times felt agnostic, especially because spiritual leaders that I asked my questions to again reaffirmed my greatest fears. That because I found evolution convincing, I had to leave my faith (my only hope in this world). I kept on researching, and it was William Lane Craig's book that helped me the most. I am so happy to see you making this video, because it will help so many people like me. My faith is stronger than ever now!

This is a fascinating conversation. I’ve always been more convinced by YEC personally, but I do like hearing other ideas about it. I hadn’t heard those things from Augustine before, but they’re very fascinating and make very good points. I think you’re right that this whole topic is a way more complicated subject that we often give it credit for.

I am a YEC guy and have never even come close to being persuaded otherwise, but I completely agree with your points here Gavin. Thanks for the video. Keep up the good work, brother!

I am a biochemist with a PhD. I am a scientist and a creationist who believes that God created the universe. However, I do believe that our creation debate has gone wrong and I do believe that Augustine’s view, as highlighted in Dr.Ortlund’s book, is a significant help in working through the the issue.

As a Protestant myself, one of the biggest pet-peeves I have is that other Protestants are so unwilling to read anything that disagrees with the Reformers and are so quick to call something heresy while demonstrating that they are way over their head on specific subjects but act like they are experts. What I so appreciate about Gavin is that he analyzes both sides of the debate and speaks on topics after studying what both sides say about the matter. Unfortunately, there are so many so-called Theologians on YT who almost seem like they’ve never read a single theological book on any topic they disagree with.

I am so thankful for this video. I too was taught YEC in high school and almost broke up with my boyfriend (now husband) because of his different views on the age of the earth and Genesis.

I get really uncomfortable arguing either side on this. Ken Ham absolutely drives me crazy with this though and I think it’s good that you are addressing it.

Im so grateful God led me to your channel, a lot of the time I've been feeling overwhelmed, exhausted and confused by all the unresolved questions I have. You have encouraged me to keep pursuing God through the questions. Thankyou for all you're doing!

Hey Gavin, just wanted to let you know that I have been working through some major health issues and along the way I’ve had some serious doubts about my faith, honestly, you and Sean McDowell have been the biggest influences on me, staying in the faith and developing a rational understanding of the Christian faith. Your videos on creation, and the trustworthiness of scripture have been so helpful to me, I also love your heart for people and your heart for unity. Keep up the great work. I am listening to evidence that demands a verdict right now and I am blown away by rigorous amount of evidence There is for the Christian faith, whether or not the evidence is valid, I’ll have to analyze it, and come to a conclusion. But I am very satisfied so far with reading through it.

Honestly, I don’t comment much on KZfaq channels but you have been a tremendous blessing to my faith. I pray that God continues to allow you time, space, and opportunity to continue on this platform and I pray that the Spirit continues to give you wisdom and direction.

Another excellent video, Gavin! I thank God for the work you are doing on this channel. Your levelheaded, charitable, and thoughtful approach is like a breath of fresh air in a world full of smog. May the Lord guide you and bless you with wisdom as you continue to work for His Kingdom! 😊

Gavin, I really appreciate this video. In the past, I was taught 24 hour days as an essential of the faith but I have recently concluded that I don’t know how long it took, and I’m OK with that uncertainty. By focusing on the days, we miss the important points. I like to read Genesis 1 with the 2nd commandment in mind. The pagans worshipped the sun, moon and stars, the creatures above the earth, on the earth and below (in the water). The 2d C tells us not to worship those things and Gen 1 tells us why - because God made them. Genesis 1 is a slap in the face of pagan religion, showing how God is supreme and that none of the pagan gods would even exist apart from God’s choice to create. It may be that Gen 1 is written in a way to group creation into these categories (things above the earth, on the earth and below). And days and times could have been different before the flood, with people living hundreds of years. The point is that there is some mystery here, and we err when we try to pin everything down and end up speculating in the process. I wonder what you think about that. On the other hand, I think it’s necessary to have Adam specially created or else Romans 5 doesn’t make sense. Please keep up the good work.

It's really interesting that your pushback against Ham saying that Old Earth is a position that is imposed on the text because of influences by secular science is to argue that church fathers were willing to adjust their views because of what we'd now call science... Then you use Augustine, saying that his argument is from the text, while you've acknowledged in previous videos that Augustine originally thought the text taught something different and because of that he wandered from the faith. Unless Augustine found an interpretation of the text conformed to ideas he had outside the text, he wasnt willing to follow the text. I think it's clear that Ken Ham oversells the unanimity of church History on the subject, and I don't think he's charitable enough to those who disagree with him, but when he makes he point that views other than 24 hour days come from outside the text he's absolutely right. Now, if you want to argue for a different relationship between natural theology and reveletory theology than what Ken Ham holds to, fine, but he's absolutely right about the methodology being used to get to other interpretations on this issue. When I was in grad school, a philosophy professor told me that Calvinists had Biblical interpretation on their side, but non Calvinists had the "philosophy" on their side and therefore the Bible needed to be interpreted based on antecedent philosophical conclusions. Not only do I disagree with the philosophy but the theological methodology is dangerous. I really dont see any difference between that methodoloy and what you're promoting here, which is odd to me because you don't promote this sort of methodology in other areas. I get a ton out if your channel, and I appreciate your work. I think there are ways to push back on the tone that Ham takes, but it's very confusing when you push back on his comments about methodology and then go and defend the exact methodology that he's arguing against. It's not convincing.

Gavin, I'm firmly in the YEC camp, but I'm grateful for your voice in YT. One of the reasons I subscribe to you is because you push into impartiality, and reject being put into a box. Thank you. Let's kill modernism, liberalism, and idolatry but not each other.

I really like when you provide book recommendations. Please continue to provide them in your videos! Thank you for this one. I grew up in conservative Christian circles who would triage this issue exactly as Ken Ham does. I agree with you but I don't think I could have articulated my gut feeling about it without your video.

I’m a YEC, but I love Gavin’s humility, something believers on BOTH sides should take note of. Would love if he and Ham could sit down and have a conversation.

I rejected young Earth creationism primarily due to reading the text. The more I studied, the less it seemed plausible that it was meant to be literalistic history, but rather was telling the story of our first ancestors in such a way as to generate the themes of redemption for the rest of the biblical story.

LOVE this. Very well put together, Gavin. Also, very respectful, as always.

I LOVE all the Book suggestions you’ve been giving! Thank you for your work!

I fall in the YEC/anti-evolution camp bc of a mix of biblical, scientific, and philosophical reasons. However, the vitriolic, anti-Christlike nature of many popular YECs is really disturbing and makes me want to distance from the movement. Thank you for always approaching these topics with a genuine spirit of curiosity, grace, and humility.

I cannot tell you how much I loved this video. I tire of how many times Ken Ham gets to attack and destroy anyone who disagrees with him on the age of the earth. I do believe that there is room for disagreement on this issue. I am a pastor with the Conservative Congregational Christian Conference. I have been so blessed to be a part of a denominational fellowship that emphasizes unity on the essentials while lovingly disagreeing on non-essentials. I also have your book, "Finding the Right Hills To Die On." It should be required reading for every church. Please continue what you are doing. It is wonderful. I am now going to purchase your book, The Augustine Way. Blessings.

as a YEC i fond it very shameful that many of my fellow Christians are so unchariatble. I have seen how YEC christians tend to be demeaning, angry, rude and confrontational. All of these attitudes are not Christian. I would love to see other YEC be willing to admit there is flexibility in interpretation and be more humble in responding to fellow Christians we disagree with

Thank you for this, Gavin. Growing up amongst a super vocal, conservative, literal 6/24-creation, purity-culture extended family, my sons, now in their 30s, were mocked and criticized by their cousins and "corrected" by their aunts and uncles for believing whst my husband and I taught them. We believed then and now that our God's creation is vast and ancient, and that the "book" of Creation serves to confirm the truths God meant to convey in the Book of Genesis and beyond. This is one of your best. I am impressed by your generosity of spirit as well as your depth of intellect. They CAN go together -- who knew??!!!

Thank you so much for this video. This is a topic that has weighed heavily on me of late, and you laid this out better than I ever could.

Ken Ham won't care about this. He's already in conflict with other YEC's as well.

I am not settled on a specific earth creation date, but I dont think its a litmus test at all- I fail to see how it makes or breaks salvation.

Love it. A very timely and much needed video for me. Book recommendations are great too. Would love to see them mentioned in video descriptions too. Ready for the next video.

Great summary Gavin. Really like you providing summary of different beliefs. You and the remnant radio guys are needed! 👍 Let's have grace for different views that are within biblical orthodox Christianity. God will bless your approach, so keep going.

I highly recommend Creation Ministries International, they have publications both for casual and academic readers and their tone is much more delighted in the lord's creation and delivery is less condescending and aggressive than Ken Ham and AIG. I do appreciate Ken's work and ministry though they have lost their love towards the lost and are VERY quick to throw others under the bus than to call for discussion. BUT I will absolutely agree with them on the fundemental arguments they are making; Undermining the first few pages of scripture undermines the faith. If you open the bible and immediately liberalize it, where do you stop? You don't get long ages from plain reading of scripture, people are attempting to make the bible fit the world's view as they always have and that IS something we were warned about. I would expect most people raised in YEC aren't actually aware of the scientific basis for YEC, to be fair we shouldn't have to check that the bible fits contemporary scientific theory, or you would have to throw it out. We shouldn't be double-minded, as James warned. But people should be aware of the arguments that will be made and the evidence against those arguments. As you point out with Agustin and this is more a weakness, but if we look to men to verify what we can believe about God, who are we really trusting? The Sadducees thought everything was metaphorical and GOD (Christ) rebuked them for not knowing scripture. I appreciate your work and approach to this! I do think Ken needs to be willing to discuss rather than attempt to dominate. That doesn't mean he needs to compromise however, we can agree to disagree on this as an internal debate. P.S. Light prior to Luminaries means God created what we physically know as Light before he made sources of it. I had a "Eureka" moment when this clicked for me. A lot of people confuse sources of light as light itself. It's not, it's a physical/immaterial thing.

i really appreciate this video. I felt that Ken incorrectly represented old earth believers in the arguments that he made, and it bugged me. So, thank you for being more balanced.

Thank you so much for your approach on this issue. It's been a very important problem for my own life and it's amazing to see someone be very faithful in how they explain the topic.

I believe that young earth creationism is the view that most conforms with a natural interpretation of Genesis chapter 1 without allegorizing the text even though it is the view that most conflicts with modern science. For instance some Christians who accept an old earth or theistic evolution believe that the first eleven chapters of Genesis are not historical which would depart from biblical orthodoxy.

As someone who's suffered under abusive Christian fundamentalism, and have seen the damage it can do, I'm far less patient with people like Ken Ham. Not because we disagree, but because of how he frames his argument - it's not a matter of theological triage, as you put it, but an essential doctrine necessary for relationship w/God. People who disagree with Ham are not just wrong, they are heretics, unbelievers, and do not possess saving faith. He has put his own agenda above that of unity in Christ, sound hermeneutics, and the weight of historic Christian theology. I'm grateful for the graciousness and magnanimity in which you've presented your side of things.

This is a much needed perspective Gavin. Thank you, as always, for bringing clarity, historical perspective, and a gracious tone to an important discussion.

As per modern Creationism, Scripture is not Science. It’s Ancient literature teaching Theology. It’s a simple matter of genre. Ancient hearers would not have modern questions. Imposing our categories onto the text is a major problem w Creationists hermenuetics.

As always, very peaceful approach to this issue. While I don’t agree with Gavin on creation, I do appreciate what he brings to the conversation as a brother!

I love this topic and have been writing this out for why I am a YEC. So we know God can perform miracles. The way it describes Adam and Eve right after creation is as if they are young adults. I see no reason God couldn't have made an earth that looked older. God created natural processes to govern the universe and so for future people to reach the stature Adam and Eve were created with, they would have to grow up normally and not be instantly created by God. Now that said I believe the Earth is the same way. If a new planet was to start to be formed it might take billions of years to do so if that's how the natural laws God set up require it to go. But at the beginning God performed miracles and made everything so it may look older than it is, but just like Adam and Eve, I believe the universe younger than it looks. Most if not all other miracles break the laws of physics so I see no reason God creating the universe would be any different. In the New Testament when Jesus heals people, did he make medice and then take them through the process of treatment and only use normal physical means to heal said people? No, he instantly healed people. I am sure if a doctor who was an unbeliever had looked at them before and then after they would try to come up with an explaination as to how they were healed and that it wasn’t instant but that is not how he was healed so while the physical "evidence" may point to the long process of medical treatment [simply by ruling out an instantaneous healing miracle would lead to this] in fact the person was just healed instantly. So why can these miracles be instantaneous but creation can't? This combined with how many Bible verses in both the Old and New Testaments talk about the lineages as if they are literal shows support for YEC. Also Jesus being able to be traced back to Adam is important. If you try to say the super old people in the lineages are given those massive age number for honorary reasons or those are just metaphical and stand for months not years, how can you split the ages into metaphical and real when the genealogies just list them all there together and it suggests they are literal? If you try to say that Adam is a metaphor for all mankind and just a representative then why does the Bible say sin came through one man i.e. Adam and then the lineages treat Adam as an individual? I would say Adam was humanity's representative but also a real individual just like modern day republic government officials are. They are elected to represent a group of people but also are individuals themselves. Also the word day I am pretty sure usually means a literal day in Genesis and even if it didn't always mean a literal day, the word day combined with the phrase "there was evening then morning, the next day" definitely suggests literal days. Not only that but the Bible tells us God made the birds before the land animals, and that just goes counter to evolution. The argument that "the sun and moon were created on the 3rd day so the word day can't mean an actual day" is very weak. There are a couple of easier options than reading millions of years into the Bible: 1) God knew how long He was going to make a day. So He just did all the work within those time periods to begin with. 2) God could have come up with the word day after making the sun and moon and before relaying Genesis to Moses. God could have decided to make the rotation of the earth and thus the days line up with the time he had already spent on the first 2 days of creation. This is like someone doing some work over a consecutive time intervals that happen to be of the same length. Then later, they give that time period a name and tell others how long it took after the fact using the new time period in your retelling of the story. In either case, it seems God was not pressed on time. He finished before evening and then starts the next morning, so He was not working around the clock. God can create infinitely more than we can imagine and simultaneously because He is all powerful. The verses talking about a day being a thousand years and a thousand years being like a day to God is not meant to give us more context for Genesis. It is simply stating that God is outside time. Not only that but finding soft tissue and blood sample on creatures that supposedly died hundreds of thousands to millions of years ago is harder to believe than God made the earth and there was a global flood. We also have paintings/drawings from ancient people depicting dinosaurs. How is this possible if humans and dinosaurs didn’t live together since only somewhat recently have humans begun to dig up fossils and recognize what they are? [I have links below of this, some items may be fake but even if all were fake/misunderstood this is really only a minor point in my arguments] The world's oldest trees are also younger than a YEC view of the world. This suggest that the earth is younger than millions of years old as well. [Again linked below for those curious] Are we to believe God didn't care about who knows how many barely-not-humans before he revealed Himself to Adam? I don't think so. I also don't believe that it was only human death that came through Adam but all death. Population charts also indicate its very possible to get today's population from Noah's family. I would argue they also suggest that if a global flood didn’t happen then today's population should be much higher. [Again linked below for those curious] Also people saying the earth is billions of years old: How do you know the starting conditions of the universe? While we might know the decay rates of certain materials we have no idea of the starting conditions so you can't use any of those dating methods without some blind faith that you know the starting conditions. As for the Flood. I see Genesis as suggesting it is global and not local. Here are a few points: 1) Noah's ark is extremely oversized for a local flood. He would not need that many animals just for a localized flood. 2) If it was just local Noah could have just moved away in the 120 years God gave him instead of building the ark. 3) Are we to believe all of humanity could be killed by a local flood? The whole point of the flood was to kill all of humanity except for Noah and his family because of humanity's sin. 4) The bird Noah sent out would have been able to easily find land to make a new home at with a localized flood so the bird returning because it can't find land doesn't really make sense. 5) The duration of the flood is unbelievably long for just a local flood. *I won't ever say that someone isn't saved if they believe in an older earth, I just disagree on that point www.genesispark.com/exhibits/evidence/historical/ancient/dinosaur/ www.icr.org/article/why-arent-earths-oldest-trees-older creation.com/biblical-human-population-growth-model answersingenesis.org/evidence-for-creation/six-evidences-of-young-earth/

You summarised some Augustine for us! Thank you! There's so much to read and so little time. Videos like this one are incredibly helpful.

Hi Gavin, found you through Andrew Wilson’s Think Theology and God bless you for making these videos. I struggled with these issues and didn’t have a place to turn to as a new Christian. God has been faithful and every time I said I am being swallowed up by doubt and darkness and fear, He shone His light. Praying for you.

Soooo great. Looking forward to Monday 🤩. Thank you for you work sir 🙏🏾

Thank you for this video. One of the issues I have with some old earth interpretations of Genesis is how proponents seem to deny a historical Adam. Would love to know your thoughts on this.

I have grown up YEC, but from a much more scientifically rooted and soft-spoken strain than perhaps some are (e.g. not just thumping on Bibles and saying that a literalistic reading of Genesis settles the matter). As such I appreciate and am trying to better understand the different strains of OEC thought, and definitely don't think it's an issue that should divide churches or be considered to affect ones salvation. Here are two thoughts I recently had that challenge each of these views. First, a challenge to YEC. We know that God is outside of time - that "a day is like a thousand years and a thousand years is like a day". So it stands to reason that the creation days, witnessed only by God are by definition outside of our current perception of time. This is not to say that they were conclusively millions or billions of years long, but just to say that until man was created, and specifically until man sinned in the fall, the passage of time was immaterial as death had not spoiled creation. Further, the time spent in the garden before the fall is unknown and may span days or eons. Thus there is ample room for the earth to actually be millions or billions of years old, even if the flow of time from the expulsion from the garden is literal. Second, a challenge to OEC. Again and again, I hear the claim that "the evidence is overwhelming" for the earth being old. To the best of my abilities, I'm assuming people who say this are referring to the the dates turned out by various techniques used to tell how old rocks and fossils are. However, this has two potential problems and the first is that the methods themselves are based on assumptions. These assumptions have at times proved to be totally false. Second, even if the dating methods are entirely accurate and honest, they forget this: surely a rock that was dated to being only 1 year old would be one that had just solidified from magma. Therefore if God created the earth in just a week - practically instantaneously - would we expect the rocks making up the surface of our planet to be magma or solid and fully formed? Obviously for God to create an earth that had a surface of molten magma would make life impossible so it can be safely assumed that he created the continents with fully formed and cooled rock. Thus a six day creation would inherently have the appearance of age because it could not function any other way in that regard.

Thank you for this. Mr. Hamm's position--and the way he argues it--has always troubled me. A little too triumphalist for my taste. Your defense of a *traditional* view of non-24 hour creation day, based on scripture and church history, is excellent.

I grew up watching Ken Ham and believing every word of what he said. I used to think that being a YEC was the only way to go. I still believe YEC is the correct interpretation but your videos and my own searching have helped me to see there are other reasonable interpretations. In that way, your mission for this channel has been a success!

Great video Gavin! I'd really appreciate a video that focuses on the textual arguments for a non 6-day reading of Genesis 1. Thanks again

Yeah, very timely brother!! God bless you. My brother is an atheist and when we would clash he would distory me and the last several months had been rough. You, inspiringPhilosophy and Jimmy akin really have been a guard rail against sever depression and anxiety. Thank you brother!!

Gavin - Thank you again and again for being the voice of reason clothed in the garment of humility. This is the best presentation on this topic that I've heard. Totally agree with you!

Thanks Gavin. Your voice on this subject (and other matters) needs to be heard. It saddens me that all too many "apologists" are more interested in winning arguments than seeing the lost understand the beauty of the Gospel.

Personally I'm an OEC but I could see YEC as well. It seems like most of the outrage towards this comes from the YEC side, but unfortunately I have seen some OEC belittle YEC believers as well. Even when I was a YEC I never saw this as some sort of compromise issue.

Great stuff. Really appreciate this gracious and well thought out response

Wonderful stuff as always, Gavin! Perfectly done.

When I stand before my Lord that question will be the farthest thing in my mind

Dr. Ortlund how would you respond to the claim that the statement made in Exodus 20:11 that God made the world in six days and rested on the seventh shows that the days in Genesis 1 are 24 hour days. I have been enjoying your videos. May God continue to bless you.

Gavin, it’s great that you do videos for your audience, but Ken can’t think on this level.

Thank you Gavin. Very clear presentation. I'm looking forward to next week

You did such a great job on this Gavin! Thanks for your work to help believers and the useful quotes. Again, you were irenic yet firm in stating the facts that needed to be discussed. This is extremely useful. The Lord bless you!

Excellent video! As a conservative evangelical pastor, I heartily appreciate both the truth and tone of Gavin's perspective on this.

I grew up Evangelical Protestant but was confirmed in the Roman Catholic Church 7 years ago. And I regularly connect with both a lot of Catholics and Protestants and am committed to Catholic/Protestant dialogue, partnership etc. And I greatly appreciate the spirit in which Gavin makes his points. It's very much in the spirit of humility and unity. He advocates for his position without making everybody who disagrees feel like you're either in or out. I love that. I know he deeply disagrees with the Roman Catholic position on a number of issues, but I feel like he'd be willing to have a good conversation about it if we sat next to each other on a plane or something :)

Love hearing about this topic from you! Really helpful video

I found Hugh Ross's writings on the topic extremely helpful.

Thanks for this video Gavin. I have been taught young earth creationism and even argued for it while attending public school but I'm glad to know that earlier church fathers had different views. I find the ongoing research by ICR very fascinating and the evidence for a whole earth flood seems to be almost obvious but I am interested to hear your well-educated conclusions as well.

Dr Ortlund Thank you for a very well-balanced video on the subject of the days of creation. As someone who is doing a lot of reading and research around the subject of creation and evolution, it was refreshing to approach it from a church history perspective. I will be intrigued to see your follow-up videos in that an old earth creationist view is generally rejected because of evolution's demand for long ages. I will be fascinated to see how you deal with macro-evolution and micro-evolution and how that fits with a biblical understanding of the gospel. I love your videos and have been blessed so much by them. Thank you, my brother.

This is exactly the kind of content I've been searching for in regard to Ken Ham and the young earth creationist viewpoint! You are a Christian who lovingly sweats the details and pinpoints the nuances of Ken's views, and that is so refreshing. I think I generally agree with Ken Ham and Answers in Genesis, but little logical missteps and arguments they make often rub me the wrong way and I appreciate you dissecting some of those in this video.

This is spot on, especially the point made at 23:24. I spent the first 34 years of my life immersed in and deeply committed to YEC for all the reasons referenced by Ken Ham. We were supporters and consumers of Answers in Genesis and Institute for Creation Research. When working on my undergrad at Liberty University, I wrote a paper, part of which referenced the physical impact of the fall. I confidently wrote about the world wide flood as evidenced by the Grand Canyon, Badlands etc, only to go after in search of citable sources. I had hints before that, but my search pulled up several peer reviewed articles, ALL debunking the idea in question. I never lost my faith, but it did suffer a crisis starting with the realization the earth might be older than 6,000 years. Your book Finding the Right Hills to Die On, which I was required to read for Village Institute prompted me to dig deeper in the topic. Your Augustine book, and Francis Collins book Language of God helped me reestablish what had been broken. In looking closer at the text, past the "science" I have found theological depth I never imagined before. There's a lot more I could say on this topic, suffice to say thank you for your unifying efforts. I'll be looking forward to the follow-up videos on this.

Fantastic video as always! Thanks for such a thorough yet understandable response.

I don't really have anything to add, but I simply must say, thank you! This was a very necessary video. Love your work, Gavin!

Gavin- I am so glad I watched your video. I’ve read books about this topic and heard both sides, and I just have so much trouble with grasping a young earth in the face of so much evidence against… Very encouraging

Looking forward to the follow-ups! Thanks for attempting to prune this thorny topic.

Love this video Dr. Ortlund, so looking forward to the follow up! Thank you for your bravery in putting this out. I’ve learned from experience it can be so hard & painful to challenge peoples’ established church culture. It’s like saying to a group of Holiness Pentecostals or I.F. Baptists, “It’s Biblically not a sin to consume alcohol, in fact Jesus did….” then experiencing the explosive rage & rejection they can hurl at you. You’re a strong man Gavin, my prayers are with you!

Brother, you are such a blessing.

Incredibly helpful. Thank you for parsing this out.

I watched that video you are referencing and it was so frustrating. Thank you for this video!

I've heard you mention the topic of public revelation in some of your videos. Would you ever consider making a video explaining what this term means and some further details? I actually had never heard that term before I heard you use it and now that I know a little bit of what it means, I realize that I really haven't heard many detailed arguments of whether it's active today or not.

Thanks Gavin I’m still a YEC but your points are very interesting and that leads to a more robust understanding! I am open to OEC perspectives. However the one perspective I cannot support is Theistic Evolution, this view places Science above Scripture.

Thanks, Gavin. Appreciate the spirit in which the video is given. Here are the 2 questions I have: At this time, I would consider myself a YEC (although the attitudes/methodology of the strongest YEC proponents give me pause). I am willing to grant that: a) the YEC position is not monolithically present in historical theology b) there are other potential reasons besides "modern science" to subscribe to non-literal readings of Gen 1-2 Question 1: Does Augustine ever show signs of what he was attempting to harmonize or engage? (i.e. pre-Darwinian origin theories popular at the time) You mention that his concern was apologetic, and I'm curious if his non-literal readings could be characterized as an attempt to harmonize the Biblical account with other origin theories extant during his time? ------------ Question 2: What would your response be in regard to the implications of a non-literal reading of Genesis for other areas of theology? ESCHATOLOGY: A view of the NH&E as a Restoration of all things would a) bode well for all created things, not just man (the liberation of creation to match the freedom of the sons of God) Does it bode well for animals if they are to continue to painfully die to satisfy the hunger of other animals? Does it allow the lion to lay down with the lamb? Does it allow the little child to place his hand on the den of the viper? b) make death a thing of the past But if this is true, then the NEW Creation seems to be an improvement on God’s original, not a restoration of it. (i.e. the lion did not originally lay down with the lamb) - Does Augustine comment on this aspect... will there be death in the New Creation as their was in the original which God declared "good?" ANTHROPOLOGY: In a non-literal reading of Genesis, was work cursed BEFORE sin, at least outside the confines of Eden? Before sin, Adam’s commission to Work to make the rest of the world like Eden would have been: > already difficult/improbable > already prone to death and struggle and sweat > already 'red in tooth and claw' This seems incongruous to me. Curious about your thoughts.

Thank you for the Augustine book recommendation. It's been really helpful and enjoyable. Thank you

Thanks for your video 😊. I'm curious about the line Mark 10:6 - "But from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female." (KJV) Can there be millions of years before Adam? How? Or is the time between Adam and the present way, way more than approx. 6000 years? You're right to recognise the importance of these topics for believers. Thanks again for your work. (edited for spelling)

This is excellent, Gavin! To be honest, I have really struggled with this. Particularly, as someone who has argued for a literal interpretation of Genesis 1, I could not understand how fellow brothers and sisters in Christ could not see it the same way. But I feel much more enlightened now from this video, and can now understand where those other views come from by other Christians. It is nice to see that even older Church fathers contemplated Genesis' meaning. What a neat debate! Thanks, Gavin! God bless you!

I grew up as an old earth Christian and I believed all that I was taught in school about the age of the Earth and Evolution and even that Adams parents were monkeys or apes or something. I was a very weak Christian at best or if at all. Back in 1996, a friend showed a few photographs to me that quickly destroyed my old earth view. One particularly stupefying photo was of a petrified tree passing vertically through layers of stone with the age difference from the top stones to the lower stones spanning thousands to millions of years. I could not accept that a tree could stand vertically for a million years while rock slowly formed around it. At that moment, I knew then that I had been duped by many people. I was immediately ashamed and embarrassed of how I had not believed the Word of God. I am still ashamed of that but it makes me so very grateful for grace and mercy. I cannot describe what a great blessing it was for me to have my eyes opened to just how accurate and true the Word of God is. Life has been so much easier and brighter since then. I am sure there are other poor souls out there lost in the darkness. I hope that God sends each of them a dozen of friends like the one that helped me. I think Ken is trying to be that friend to someone out there. I hope you will overlook Ken’s flaws and let God use him to help someone in the greatest need of their life.

Thank you so much Gavin, this is all so helpful.

Really appreciated this information, I wasn’t aware of most of it

Very sad to hear that someone would walk away from the LORD on this issue. We don't know HIS ways and there are many things in the Bible that can confuse people. However HIS love for us isn't one of them. Love your neighbor and don't argue things that would cause them to stumble. Thanks for the video

Nobody takes Ham seriously because his argumentation is arrogant and amounts to saying "If you disagree with my position, you don't believe in the authority of the Bible." You can't have a meaningful interaction with that kind of rhetoric.

This was very helpful! I'm looking forward to listening to parts 2 and 3.

Great video. I tend to agree with Ken Ham but I appreciate your point about historical Christian views on this issue and how it should not be considered a primary issue.

The problem with the old earth scenario is that sickness and death entered creation before Adam sinned and caused all creation to fall and death, "the day you eat of it you will surely die", it was Adam's disobedience that death entered the creation, not before.

It’s not a salvation issue. it’s OK to break bread with someone who disagrees with you on this topic

Ken Ham is a tough one for me. He may be a brother in Christ, but his arrogance and dismissive tone to any other view on this subject puts him in the "I may have to love him but i dont have to like him" category.

Yes, exactly Gavin, Thank you. The dogmatic approach itself from Ken Ham and many others is the truly objectionable part, especially since his genetic fallacy presupposition is historically inaccurate.

Well, do realize that Ham’s point was that the universal idea was that the world was young. What you just pointed out, respectfully, amounts to Augustine thinking the world is even younger than Ken Ham by about 7 days.

Separate from the Days of Creation debate, the question of Noah and the flood remains. Scripture very clearly says (and in great historical detail) eight survived, giving us the table of Nations. Noah is all humanity's common "Grandfather." That seems quite clear from a basic reading of the text. You don't buy yourself much by ditching a Young Earth view. The flood narrative and detailed generations account from end of Genesis on to Abraham is hard to square with modern so called "science". Got to choose.

This is possibly the best discussion yet. I've struggled with creation in the Bible, but I was never aware of these ideas from the early church. This is kind of game changing for me. Thanks so much for this!

I recently left a church I was considering joining because the pastor claimed believers in evolution are rebelling against God. I realized I couldn't meaningfully serve there. It is hard, because I really liked that church.

I cannot say thank you enough for making this video!

Very helpful! Thank you Gavin! You have a new subscription as a result!

How old was Adam the day after he was created? One day old right? How old did he appear to be? 18 years? 25 years?