Thanks I enjoyed the background. It was interesting to hear about how the takes are actually used.

Thanks this is one of my early videos and I still have a lot to learn. I was totally enthralled with turning something "big".

I took classes in a local adult school and much like you, if I had started machining when I was younger, I would likely have entered a different field as well. I really love machining, but I bet it is really hard to make a living at these days. Happy New Year to you too.

Thanks. I learned a lot about what not to do, but had a lot of fun in the process. Many of my choices were oriented towards interesting machining tasks rather than having a really nice sounding bell. As a result, I made some bad choices, resulting in poor bell quality. Thanks for the comment.

@@DudleyToolwright They were only "bad" choices if you didn't learn anything. My guess is that your thirst for knowledge will never be quenched!

Thanks for the feedback. I really appreciate hearing your thoughts.

Please note that I am a complete novice as well, so take my approaches with a grain of salt. I wish you the best of luck and perhaps you can make a video to show your projects. They sound interesting.

Thanks for the kind words. I am an amateur, just learning the trade, and really feel that I might have missed my calling, at least from an enjoyment standpoint. Please ask any questions you like. I will answer them to the best of my ability. Thanks.

Thanks. I have been a bit lazy. You tube lets you upload a specific thumbnail for each video. If you choose not to then they choose one for you. Alas, their choices are not always the best. Thanks for the comment.

Thanks. I see no point in cutting out my mistakes to make me appear to know what I am doing, when my approaches probably show how much of a novice I am already. Besides, I learn more from my mistakes than I do from my successes. Thanks for watching and for commenting.

That's a good attitude and approach. There are so many "perfect" experts on KZfaq its not even funny. And as a very amateur "machinist" that has done nothing but basic engine machining like installing valve seats and counterbore inserts in diesel engine blocks etc but one who is wanting to find a decent and relatively small and "affordable" lathe to "play with" as an even MORE amateur "gunsmith" (the only thing I'm a "professional" and "expert" at is diesel mechanics and after 25 years I still don't know shit and learn new things every time I pick up a wrench) I've been watching quite a few machining videos from "celebrity" KZfaq machinists, lol. I've noticed an interesting phenomenon where the supposedly most "experienced" and "best" machinists make ZERO mistakes but yet spend a lot of time explaining why things they do that look "questionable" even to a complete rookie like me aren't really "mistakes" at all. And that's when they're actually doing any real "machining", which is also fairly rare. Lots of talk, lots of "demonstrating", lots of "planning" and "setup" and lots of "projects" involving SURFACE GRINDERS and a little milling here or there and lots of "lathe talk" but damned little turning, drilling, etc. And lots of "fast forward" type videos where they spend 20 minutes talking about what they're going to do, why, how etc etc etc and all the set-up and such and then suddenly "in the interest of time" or for no apparent reason "skip" the actual machining. Makes me think the "experts" aren't so "expert" after all and they're only doing "flawless" work in the "edited" videos and not so much in the "real world". Why not show the WHOLE SHOW? Egos are fragile things and plenty of "experts" are counting on KZfaq or "sponsor" or "supporter" income or the "PR" benefits to their businesses that result from being an on-screen "expert" and "master machinist". Unfortunately, editing videos is easy and editing egos and expertise and experience themselves are not. And eventually every "celebrity" becomes yesterday's news.

Recently, my brother in law asked to hear what the bell would sound like without the threaded plug in the end and low and behold it rings really well and even sound nice.

@@DudleyToolwright that's great!I turn away aluminum dive tanks just because I've never heard one sound good,but I have never put one on the lathe either.Thought you made a great video,was a lot to learn there,and was very enjoyable as well!

Thanks for the feedback and the great ideas. Much appreciated.

Interesting. I noticed the tanks being submerged when being filled, but never though about the temperature differential that would result. Great observation. Thanks.

The rubber hose is a great idea, thanks. I appreciate you taking the time to share.

That's an excellent idea. Aluminum can work harden during machining operations. Some time spent in a heat treat oven might re-anneal the metal, as it were. I probably would need to know what alloy was used as well.

Thanks. Misery loves company. I really enjoyed the whole project. I just think the challenge of turning something that large was fun. Cheers.

I have taken so many steps...Cheers.

Your criticisms are dead on. I was really looking for any excuse to turn something large. One of the people who inspired me to get into machining was Adam Booth, Abom79, and he is always turning something cool. Thanks for the comments. I really appreciate them.

Very True. I just was looking for any excuse to turn something large. Cheers.

Thanks. I have more coming.

Thanks. Did it just for the challenge. I had a lot of fun and learned a lot.

A great video to show how a lot of the stresses are introduced into the metal of the tank: kzfaq.info/get/bejne/f9WEfpSnyLaWYHk.html

I agree. I didn't have an easy way to do that and lived with the result. Thanks for the comment.

The easy and quick way to do that with ally, is to coat it with soap, then heat it with a large propane torch or kerosene powered weed burner till the soap turns black, which it does at about the right temp for way cheaper indication than temp sticks. For smaller bits a smaller torch will do obviously. For something that chimney shape with the base already cut off and an opening at the top standing it on a camping stove to heat it from the inside would likely work too but slower.

Thanks for taking the time to share a useful suggestion. Much appreciated.

Wow, what a thorough response. I really appreciate you taking the time to help me out. I really haven't a clue at bell or chime design, if that wasn't obvious enough already. I was attempting this project to turn something large, with all of the associated challenges, and the ringing quality was a distant afterthought. It would have been nice though. I put the cap in, because I wanted to try my hand at non-standard, large, threads, but my wife really wants something that rings. I will attempt some of your suggestions and see if I can recover from the multitude of mistakes I made. My wife thanks you as well. Again, I really appreciate the time you spent, sharing your knowledge. I think you have probably helped others as well. Cheers.

Thanks. There have been a few comments on things I could do to improve the sound. I was mostly looking for an excuse to turn something large. Cheers.

Dudley Toolwright yes, that was awesome turning!

Thanks for the suggestions. People have been so helpful with feedback on this project. I really appreciate you taking the time to share your thoughts.

I was wondering this. I think taking off the curved shoulder and specifically adding in the threaded plug may have introduced some odd harmonics. Also, I think a softer clapper is in order. Leather on wood, maybe. As for the tuner, any chromatic tuner ought to do, or you can use an app on your smartphone.

@@Zoidberg227 Yes but Snarks are just awesome. The plug would definitely introduce odd harmonics. I'm not a sound technician or anything but I did want to be a recording engineer at one point so I read some college textbooks on the subject. Modern Recording Techniques is a great one if you can find it at the library or whatever. You'll only need to read the first parts to learn everything you need to know about how sound moves through and bounces off of materials, including the equations. Welding would be preferred to threading but... oh, screw it. it's a long road for to explain all this and I'm too far detached from it to do it efficiently and possibly, effectively. You can still learn it all from the internet but that book I suggested has it all in one place.

Thanks for the suggestions. If I ever make another, I will defiantly use a different approach. You and so many others have been really helpful. I really appreciate it.

Thanks for the detailed suggestions. I really appreciate you taking the time to help me out.

Pretty impressive when you consider that a solid chuck of aluminum is heated and pressed into a die to for these tanks.

Thanks for the tips. The lathe is an ACRA.

That was my take when I saw it for the first time.

I didn't know that Keith had a video on making a steady rest. I'll check it out. Thanks for the suggestions. Another viewer suggested needle bearings for the same reasons.

I love the idea. Imagine what you could store in there. In addition you could fill it with dry nitrogen and preserve whatever was inside.

@@DudleyToolwright -- I wasn't talking about the pressure portion of it being able to be opened, just the extra area. If you wanted for it to hold pressure, you would probably have to do some sort of captured O-ring seal on the tank bottom, but it would be a bit dangerous trying to hold the full pressure that the tank had been originally rated for. I'm thinking just make the top portion where it can hold a few hundred psi so that if anyone was checking to see if there was pressure in the tank, it would *appear* to be a normal tank. Little would they know that in the hidden area, you have a 50 year old bottle of Scotch stored there... :)

I see. I was thinking just 20-30 PSI so that it would appear to have residual pressure inside, but your idea is better.

@@DudleyToolwright -- Come to think of it, if you disassembled an AR-15, it might fit inside of a SCUBA tank. Just in case the leftists ever get control and try coming door-to-door to confiscate your guns (like Beto said he would do). Hide it in plain sight and quicker to access than digging up a PVC storage tube in the backyard. Just put the fake tank along with a few real tanks in your closet. I sometimes dove areas where there were not any local air fill locations, so I have probably 6-8 tanks. I'm not going to sacrifice a *good* tank for that though... :)

Neat analysis! I was aware of the overall concept of a screw as a lever to create a linear force, but had no idea how to solve this type of physics problem. I might have to dust off my old collage physics books and see if I can find the answer. Your analysis on the surface seems very reasonable. Thanks a ton for sharing. This was very interesting insight.

I never made it even close to collage so I would be very interested to hear another's analysis to disprove or validate my theory either one!

Thanks. I had not thought of either of those things. Thanks for the tips.

Thanks.

Thanks. I really appreciate the insight and you taking the time to help. I had no choice with the bottom as I received the tank with it already removed, But I like your thinking and the two bells idea is great. Thanks again.

Valuable insight, thanks. My wife shares your opinion about the round portion. I tend like rectilinear features, but what the heck. Thanks for the comments. I appreciate them.

I had no idea. Thanks. I'll look for them.

I think you are correct, but it would not fit in my kiln. Thanks for the suggestion.

Thanks. I never know what color text to choose. White seemed to wash out. I did use a black border to enhance contrast, but I guess I have to try something else. I really appreciate the feedback.

Maybe the lack of contrast between the turquoise of your lathe splash back and the yellow lettering? Anyhow, please keep making your project videos.

yikes. That is a literal sweat shop. It can get over 110F out here, but when it is the relative humidity is in the single digits percent. Most importantly is that low humidity helps me avoid rust on my tools. I feel for ya.

I would love to hear any suggestions you have. I am a rank novice and am pursuing these projects so that I can learn something new, especially this one. I did not really care if the tank rang at the end, I just wanted an excuse to try turning something large. The fact that is was hollow and probably highly stressed only made it more interesting. I was taught in school to always double check the threads, but I figure that if I double check the levers, that will be about the same. Thanks for the input.

I bought a large portable unit and it could not touch the large poorly insulated space. I have not looked into a split system. Perhaps I should. Sorry about the fan noise.

@@DudleyToolwright didnt realize your shop wasn't insulated.

Yea, it is an old house and I had to move in in a hurry 20 years ago. I threw up dry wall quickly and moved in a bunch of boxes. I regret the rush, but I still like the idea thanks.

There should be one in one of the videos I made on making it, But there might be better approaches than I took, certainly easier. Hope this helps.

Thanks for the suggestion. If I ever make another, I'll take your advise.

You were not the first to suggest this and I suspect that you are correct. I am fairly new to machining and I expect that an good understanding of metal movement only comes with experience. I am working on getting some and your suggestions are very helpful. Thanks.

I like the idea thanks and you are spot on about the sound. This projects was more about finding an excuse to turn a large cylinder...

Yes I would. I am always happy to get some constructive critisism.

Thanks. I really learned a lot and had a great time doing it.

Interesting. I had no idea. 1500 is the average times a tank can be refilled before retirement? Thanks.

Retirement is based on the results of the hydro test. If it fails the hydro test it can not be filled. It might fail after 500, 1000, 2000, or more fills. I do not know if it is still true but I was told by the rep of a tank manufacturer in the mid to late 80's that 1500 was average. I do not know what it is now, but you have made me curious...

Interesting. I was aware of the hydrotesting, but thought that it was possible that there was some sort of refill number cutoff regardless of test results. Thanks for the follow up.

@@DudleyToolwright - I'm pretty familiar with high pressure cylinders and have been working with them for years. The cylinders don't typically have a set number of times they can be filled. The hydrostatic test which I'm sure you're aware of now fills the tank with water at twice the rated pressure and measures the flexing of the cylinder walls. Aluminum while it can last long is not as robust in my opinion as the steel cylinders. I have steel ones that I fill that are over a hundred years old and still test out perfectly fine. The wall thickness of that scuba tank is definitely much thicker than aluminum 20 lbs and as others have pointed out the characteristics of aluminum change especially after you heat the material it'll soften it. The other thing to consider is the length and thickness of the aluminum will definitely change the tone. If you decide to try something like this again I would recommend 20# steel cylinder if you can come across one they aren't that expensive.. The aluminum has a much sharper tone where as the steel has a longer lasting deep sound. Great video btw.

Sadly, I am on the opposite coast. You are a lot closer to Abom79 - Adam Booth. Cheers to anyone who trains the next generations. I thank you for your irreplaceable contribution to soceity.

@@DudleyToolwright thank you for working in such a much needed trade that needs to stay here. I miss being in the shops.

That is a good point. This is my first use ever of a steady rest. Thanks for the suggestion.

Thanks. You bring up a very good point and something I was a bit concerned about in the back of my mind for the entire project. To be completely honest, I was more interested in how to make the final shape than I was in the end product. Thanks a lot for sharing. I appreciate you taking the time to help a guy out.

Thanks.

Thanks. That was a very interesting insight. I will definitely look into that. I had originally added so many threads so that I could see if moving the top piece would change the notes. I figured that Iif I liked a particular sound, I would weld it in place. I appreciate you taking the time to help.

Thanks.

Thanks for the suggestions. I was and am really new to bell making and really appreciate the suggestions. Thanks for taking time to comment.

You should get some furnace bricks and make you a sand casting foundry. I love to make the bells. You can buy an iron bell like a small farm bell and use it for a pattern and cast in sand molds. Play sand and bentinite clay powder mix works well as a binder. You can also use a cast iron pot and the aluminum will melt inside the pot without melting the iron pot.

Thanks for the suggestions. While I know absolutely nothing about forging, I am really intrigued by it and might just give it a try. Thanks for the ideas and encouragement.

There are you tube videos of bronze bell castings but only ones i see in aluminum are small hand bell size. I cast a 16 inch farm bell last summer for a good friend. They do ring but not as much sustain as brass or bronze. It takes less heat to melt aluminum than the 2 metals i mentioned. Look on how they make the sand flask boxes to form the sand molds in That will help a lot. The Swiss bell makers use tound pipes gor the mold flasks and they work well. You would have to cut off 8 or 10 inche pipes taller than the bell itself by say....4 inches higher than the bell pattern for the flow of aluminum to fill the mold cavity. You make a core by pressing the sand inside to shape the inside and a cope (pipe) to pack sand around the outside of bell pattern. Weld dowel strips and drill holes after bending the ends in L shape. Then use steel rods for the dowels to slip through the holes. Set on rods and get a pipe about 1nch wide after hou packed sand around the outside of pattern and around the pipe on top of pattern Mke afunnel in the sand. Pull pipe out and lift the core from the dowels you drove in the ground. Remove the bell pattern but first tap it to loosen the sand inside. Put pipe flask back down as it slides down the dowels.Then you ready to pour the mold. An impty space shaped just like the bell shape will be the mold. The metal fills the empty space and forms the bell.

Good observation. I am sure that those issues played a part in the massive distortion I was seeing. Thanks for taking the time to let me know what you are thinking.

Thanks. I shall endeavor.

Vertical shear tools are on my list of things to try. They supposedly work on very difficult materials, but each pass, according to what research I have done, should be limited to a couple of thousandths max. This would make them great for the final passes in difficult to machine materials like cold rolled steel or 4140 CrMo in it's annealed state. Thanks for the ideas and the comments,. They are always appreciated.

robert weitkamp they are definitely worth a look

I wish I had thought of that. At a minimum, it would have been an interesting learning experience. Thanks.

Dying camel! I love that. It really did turn our poorly, acoustically that is. Thanks for the comments.

Yea, I really had no idea how to make a proper bell. I was mostly looking into having an excuse into turning a large (for me) diameter part. It was a lot of fun and I learned a lot. Thanks for the comment.

You're right. I did not make the connection. Thanks.

Could be. It was in really rough shape when I got it... Cheers.

Thanks. Useful suggestion. Heat to relive stress I presume?

@@DudleyToolwright ......Yes.......It is very angry....so....Distemper it......Lol !

I get better than 25x bogus calls on my home phone than I do real ones. Just the state of things these days...

True. I did take a full skinning pass off camera. Thanks for noticing and sharing.

Me either. When I got the tank from a friend, it was already cut open and I was blown away at how thick the walls were. The base he gave me to make into an ash tray for him and it was almost 2" thick. Those tanks are really something.

Firstly, I am a beginner as well, so take my recommendations with a grain of salt. To get some ideas about what you might need, check out Tom Lipton, at Oxtools. He is a superbly skilled machinist and a great teacher. I have watched all of his videos and I think you might be able to learn a lot. Also check out mrpete222, Joe Pieczynski, Stephen Gotteswinter, clickspring (he has a small mill and lathe), this old tony, and robrenz to name a few. These guys all really know their stuff, and more importantly can explain their thinking processes as they work. As to my recommendations, yikes. I have only used a few machines, between my own and the ones at the adult school where I took machining classes. I never recommend an all in one machine - you know jack of all trades and master of none. At your price point you might want to consider used. You might be able to get a whole lot more machine for the same money. If you decide to look at new, take a look at Grizzly. The owner of the company is a gunsmith and orients his machine choices to support that market. If you want to do only aluminum and brass you can get away with a lighter and smaller machine, but if steel is in your future, the extra mass will significantly reduce vibrations and make your finishes better. My machines were new from ACRA in Rancho Cucamonga, CA, but made in China (mill) and Tiawan (lathe). If you have to get a small mill, do not get a round column one. If you do, every time you adjust height, you will lose your x-y zeros, because the head can swing side to side. I had one of these before I knew any better. The lathe should be able to take care of all your planned threading needs. Some only have limited ranges and/or can't do metric threads at all. Mine will do metric, but you can't disengage the half nut unless you take special precautions. Both of my machines use 3-phase which I had to make with a rotary phase converter. I was initially able to use a variable frequency drive to power my mill, but was unable to do the same with the lathe. Lathes take massive start up current. I had to buy a heavy duty 10 Hp rotary converter to power my 5 Hp lathe - that was minimum. The 3 Hp mill would work fine off of a 3 Hp converter. If you get single phase motors that you will have to be content to take really light cuts and/or use only soft materials like aluminum, brass, and plastics, but will not have to worry about 3-phase power. If you are interested in accuracy to should try to find machines that actually list as a feature ABEC bearings. My mill spec'd ABEC 7 bearings. At some point you will probably want to consider Digital Read Outs (DRO) but you do not need them to begin with. Watch Adam Booth's videos, ABOM79. He is a professional machinist that spent most of his career using the hand wheel graduations combined with dial indicators. These are some of the things that come to mind. I hope it helps a little and check out those other guys, they have really inspired me, especially clickspring, he does fantastic work on a small mill and lathe.

I do. I often use cool tool 2, but the carbide manufacturers that I have spoken to have suggested that, especially for aluminum, if you use the correct insert, you should machine dry. With aluminum I use lube to thread or to cut with a tool that doesn't have an anti-weld coating. Finally, I am far from an expert, so my choices may not be the best ones. Thanks for the comment.

If you like to use the air tanks alot try and find someone to do a stress relieveing for you before you do your final machining. Cool Tool 2 is a good lube go ahead and use it when doing any machining. Tool vendors are full of alot of hot air when telling customers about their product.

Thanks. I really appreciate you taking the time to comment and I have a kiln that I use as a heat treat oven, it might be big enough. I wish I had thought of this before I started, it could of made a really interesting video and I would have learned a lot.

@@DudleyToolwright I follow a number of machining YT channels and most of them use WD-40 or similar for aluminum. Also Anchor Lube for drilling and threading.

Thanks. I was making this "bell" as an excuse to try and turn something large. I had hoped it would ring nicely, but that part didn't turn out too nicely, but I did learn a lot and the community was extremely helpful with suggestions, like yours. They are always appreciated.

Thanks for saying my suggestion was helpful if you look on amazon;-www.amazon.com/Extra-LARGE-Resonant-CHURCH-Windchime/dp/B00AOAC5C2/ref=sr_1_7?s=lawn-garden&ie=UTF8&qid=1515270960&sr=1-7&keywords=large+wind+chimes. The diameter of chime should be 10 feet long.

Very nice. Thanks. I am the one who should be appreciative, you took some personal time to help someone you have never met. Cheers.

You share your skill of machining, explaining how to do things.

It is. Making a "bell' was an excuse to try and turn something large. Thanks for the comment.

There are such things as tubular bells

Good point. Thanks. This is one of my first projects and had even more to learn then, than I do now. Say that fast 3x...

Thanks for all of the useful suggestions. This was definitely my first attempt and I am sure I made some significant mistakes. I really appreciate you taking the time to help me out.

Hmmm....Thanks? Definitely.

Thanks. One of my rules to myself is that I will never finish a project and leave my tools dirty. I am lucky to have them and attempt to treat them so. Cheers.

Sorry about that. I will see what I can do.

very . very nice and good pejman134869@gmail.com

I had the internal lap top volume set at 42%, and the youtube video volume set to about 33% and could here everything clearly. Check your settings. Hope it gets better for you.

I thought I sent you this info but apparently something went wrong. My apologies. I will get you this info as soon as I can.

The tools I use for chamfering are S08k-scxck2 for inside and mcmnn2020K for outside. The outside cutter come in two varieties with the same part number but use either the acute or obtuse angle of the insert. Useful if you have other tools that only use one side. I hope this helps.

Nice point, tanks (thanks).

I didn't know what to expect...

That's hilarious. Thanks. The intro is free music provided by musicians that donate to you tubers. Love the metal, in every form.

Yes ... metal is the best

Good idea thanks.

your welcome

I thought about that, but I do not yet have a horizontal adapter. ...but could have done either side with turning the part ate all. I just realized that. Another thing I was thinking about was is the slitting saw going to be wide enough to allow both sided to ring without interference. I do have some thicker ones, but have never used them. This might have been the perfect opportunity. Thanks for the insight.

You are absolutely correct and the community was very quick to set me straight. I told myself the chips are only aluminum, but there is little reason to be lazy and the penalty is severe. Thanks for letting me know.

I live in LA, more or less and 50% is nearly fatal. We expect hot days to be Santa Ana wind days with humidity in the single digits. I can take 115F if the humidity is low, 85F at 80% is brutal. Ok, I'm a wuss. I admit it.

@@DudleyToolwright I live in mid Michigan in the summertime it's 92 to 100 with 95 to 98% humidity most of the time. I had a friend move here from Arizona in the winter she literally thought she was going to die because it was 20 below zero and in the summer time she said the same thing she says Arizona ain't hot this place is fucking hot because it was 95% humidity and then the 90s. People don't realize how hot Michigan gets they think of Michigan and think of it is a northern State that always stays cool I've had many many many people tell me that. That's why I laughed at 50% humidity in the summertime we think it's beautiful

I had no idea it got that hot in Michigan. I though So. Cal. was one if the hotter places in the US during summer, but we don't hold a candle to that. Yuk!

Thanks, that guy does make really nice bells. Someone else pointed me there when I was complaining about the poor ringing sound from the aluminum bell. I appreciate the help.

I guess the thickness plays a part too. I've a largish store-bought wind chime made of aluminum tubing and they really ring nicely. I didn't realize the top of the 80 cube foot tanks were so thick, this one made into a bookend. I'd like to get one threaded with a 1.25 or 1.5 inch npt thread but I don't know how to go about it. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/atxxd9xnrNrcaWg.htmlm25s

This how it's made was somewhat illustrative around the 47 second mark .. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/f9WEfpSnyLaWYHk.html#t=47s

Thanks. Very informative.

Around the 4 minute mark there's a formation that may be of interest. kzfaq.info/get/bejne/m7OXoK12xr_XZ2Q.html

I think you are correct. Hindsight is always 20:20. Thanks for the comment.

Sorry about that. It can be difficult to get the balance right.

Too true. It was really about the journey on this project, but I get ya. Thanks for the comments.

I thought someone had to enter the closed captions. I had no idea they were generated on the fly. Apparently they are as accurate as autocorrect. Thanks for the funny comment.

I was just looking for an excuse to turn a large cylinder and was having fun in the experimentation. Getting a nice sounding bell was only a secondary goal, one that I had no idea would be so difficult. Thanks for the feed back. I also agree with your take. I screwed up.

Indeed! Did I ring that bell too many times?

sorry i meant too much out of roundness mentioned but i actually believe you should try to improve the bell on another video.

Again, you are spot on. I was reprimanded, quite reasonably by many, for the actions in this video. I have learned my lesson. Still, I appreciate the heads up and it is also useful for others to hear. I started making these videos right after I finished a machining course at the local adult school . Two years later, I am still quite the novice and appreciate those willing to take time to set me straight on the multitude of beginner mistakes I make. I appreciate the comments and hope your hand gets better soon.