It really is for a doctor, no matter what their rank is

@@DoctorDevify … but not for an apprentice trainee.

@@taffyterrier get a life

thanks Veronica - means a lot to have you watch my content

​@@DoctorDevifyits okay ❤❤

Thank you Gary!

How come

thanks for your comment! it really is. It's such a low wage economy and needs a fix asap

NHS doctors are among the highest paid in Europe but provide one of the worst services in Europe. British taxpayers are getting poor value for money.

@@taffyterrier cry me a river

@@taffyterrier just be in our shoes and then speak. I challenge you to dedicate 6 yrs of life after which you will be paid 1950/month

@@drdecode4 an MB ChB degree should only take 5 years - not 6 years. A first year medical graduate trainee can make 3333/month with all the add-ons.

I try my best haha thanks

Hmm I see but yeah that 4-10x makes a lot of difference as consultants/attendings here make $110K - $150K

California nurses make more then your consultants at our private and state hospitals No doubt NHS doctors and nurses deserve better.

@@jb9201cali nurses don’t make that much . Those are highly experienced and highly trained nurses , NOT just nurses in cali

The NHS is corrupted and immoral Scrap the NHS

@@jb9201 Scrap the NHS

I plan on making a video on this fully but Index funds is the way to go for me (and most people)

"far more than any regular job" because saving lives is pretty regular😂

‘Far more than any other regular job’ Madness, ‘regular jobs’ need about two weeks training to get going, not six years. If he’d have been working in the city he’d be a few years onto the graduate train after only having to do a three year, much easier, degree. Had he done well he’d be on far north of £100k by now. To stare at some spreadsheets. This man’s a doctor. Dev great video mate, sorry you’re bent over so much in the early years pay wise, makes my blood boil,

@@DoctorDevify nice to see you are agreeing with his comment. Wasn't it just pointed out that for Junior Doctors, "Salary increments over the next 5 years + are quite generous. Far more than any other regular job". You seem to have got very triggered when he said "Junior Doctors get very good incremental pay when compared to a majority of other jobs".

@mickkelly8153 it doesn't matter if the progression is higher than any job lol when the starting salary of my non medical colleagues is already x2. Would take me 10 years to get to that. Stop comparing a doctors salary and worth to just any old job. Compare like for like what a highly skilled professional with top academics can get if they went to another sector. Rememember medics are some of the highest achievers.

@@DoctorDevify You seem to be the one comparing it continually, not me. If I do a genuine comparison then as usual you will state 'it is not a race to the bottom'. Like you did in a comment when someone compared it to the military. Fact - your package does not pay you £14 an hour. So be straight on that. When you are transparent on your actual starting salary package, then lets compare. We all know the starting is more than a 'normal' job and yearly pay increments out do these type of jobs, as it should in your profession. You start on more, and incrementally get a lot more year on year. Your non-medical friends who are your age (I assume) are on, according to you £70k plus. These must be the exception, in fact I know these are the exception. Outside of London, very few graduates with what is considered a good degree, Computer Science, Law for example start on even 35k a year. In fact Trainee Solicitors average 24k a year during a two year training contract having done a Law degree followed by the LPC (now the SQE). Before you say it, no I don't not want to have a race to the bottom, just pointing out that you believe it to be more unfair as you are in the medical profession but it is no more unfair than someone who has gone into Law. Just appears that your profession seems to be the only one making a song and dance about it. This is a fact, within 5 years you will have a very comfortable/lavish lifestyle, you will be very well off for the rest of your life and be able to retire comfortably at 55. If you know that already then why post these videos stating how hard done to you are. If you don't know this then, maybe you have learned something. One other thing, as I have read a number of your other comments. When answering comments don't assume, just because you are educated and a 'high achiever' that the person you are answering is below you. You never know, you may be talking to somebody who is as well educated as you, as smart as you and earning fours times as much as you.

Thank you for clarifying that after 11 years of training (6 being in medical school) and then passing multiple exams (some costing thousands funded by ourselves) I can earn 50K, a salary which is often a graduate starter salary is other academic fields after only 3 years of uni. Plus ST3 is NOT guaranteed. You need to make sure you pass F1, F2, do exams and interviews to get into core training and then do exams and interviews and compete to get to ST3 which often has competition ratios of 1 in 5. It's not a race to the bottom to have us compared to another underpaid and sacrificial job. You selectively ignore fields like tech, computing, finance, engineering which have similar or have lower grades than us but have far higher graduating salaries (especially if they went to a university like Imperial which I did) You also ignore that i needed to start working towards getting into medical school while I was in year 11 in the year 2014 when the pay was X amount . I started med school in 2017 and ended in 2023 . It's been 9 years since then. The pay has eroded by over 20% since then and will keep getting eroded

@Devify Don't fool yourself about other's pay. Of course a few, very few, go into highly paid jobs in finance or consultancy in the City but the average salary for both engineers and computer scientists in the UK is just under £50,000. I am also very familiar with your career path as my son followed an identical one, including Imperial. Should you fail to make it on to specialty training of your choice, there are alternatives available, including general practice. Unless you are exceedingly poor at your job, which I doubt, you will soon be joining the ranks of the higher tax band.

@Devify The starting salary for an F1 doctor in 2012 was £22,400. The current offer on the table raises this to £32,300 in 2023, an increase of 44%. In comparison, the median salary in the UK in 2012 was £26,500. It has now risen to £31,876 in 2023, an increase of 20%. I accept that this has not kept pace with inflation but that applies to all workers; junior doctors have done rather better than most.

@@phoebus007i think you are the one fooling yourself about others pay. Doctors should not be compared to the national average. They are the top 1% of the country in terms of academic and mental toil and resilience. This kind of thinking is what brought us here. Not everyone is worth the same. And in your comment regarding pay, I suggest you read up on the BMA statistics. We received an approx. 30% pay cut from 2008. I work 60h weeks, surrounded by death and illness, making difficult choices and conversations regarding someones health every single minute of my working day. I deserve to be financially satisfied. Most of my friends from Uni who were in less competitive degrees and studied for three year (a lot of them not even having a master degree, which I do) have a starting salary of 40-50k and after 2-3 years, that skyrockets to 70-90k. Get a grip.

@@zingoid2710 There are lies, damned lies and ‘BMA statistics’. Anyone of average intelligence can become a doctor in dumbed down Britain. NHS doctors are among the highest paid in Europe but provide one of the worst services in Europe. British taxpayers are getting poor value for money.

I'm 24 years old. Started uni age 18 and finished at 24 so 6 years of med school

@@DoctorDevify did u go to college or sixth form and what did u study ?

@@DoctorDevify when u finish your foundation year programme would u like to be a specialist or generalist doctor ?

Feels like an interview lmao. I went to sixth form and studied maths, bio, chemistry

Not sure currently. Keeping my options open!

Let's gooo

I'd rather get paid double or triple as in other countries and have a smaller pension contribution. Regardless, right now they are thinking of increasing the retirement age to 71 and who knows what it'll be when I reach retirement. The average doctor also has a lower live expectancy due to being overworked so yeah enjoying a nice pension for a few years (if I'm lucky) is not worth being paid £14 an hour. Edit: to have this pension contribution we also put away 10-13% which is more than the private sector.

​@@DoctorDevify Other countries have nothing to do with this comment. Also, 'State retirement age' has nothing to do with it. You can claim your current private pension from age 55 (currently). Also, you said in this video, that you pay 7.7% into your pension, max is 12.5%. Your range 10-13% is exaggerated as most other things in this video are. The employers contribution is 23.7%, that's in addition to your contribution, that's a huge part of you salary package. Better than the private sector? A typical private pension, employer will pay 4% providing employee pays 3%. Far from your golden pension which is all part of your ' salary package'.

Sure We've had a payrise since then to £15.50 an hour. As mentioned in this video, on my next jobs I will be getting more if I were to work weekends or nights. However, I do not get paid any extra for working overtime - just the usual base rate. 4 Months in Psychiatry -> 40 hour work week so I only got £15.50 an hour. Month's GROSS Pay £2800 4 Months in Gastroenterology -> 44 hour average weeks so £15.50 an hour. No extra enhancements for overtime. However, I worked 1 weekend a month which I got an extra £162 - so extra £6.25 for a weekend hour worked ie £22.75ish total an hour. Whenever I worked a night which was 4 a month on average - worked out to £21.2 an hour for those nights. Month's GROSS Pay £3200 4 months in Trauma & Orthopaedics -> 48 hour average weeks so again £15.5 an hour. I worked 1 in 3 weekends so I got an extra £269. Hourly rate for a weekend hour was approx £25 an hour. GROSS: £3250 Total Gross Yearly Pay approx £37,000 having worked on average 44 hour weeks across the year. It is not accurate to simply divide gross pay by my hours worked because it doesn't negate the fact that during the day I am earning £15 an hour. If I did a community/GP job that is all I would be getting. It is if I am contracted to work nights and weekends I get more just for those hours. The same way a warehouse worker would. We don't get any work benefits, we pay for parking at work, pay for a staff room, pay for indemnity, pay for gmc fees, pay for bma membership, pay for royal college membership, a few thousand for exams and courses, no canteen benefits etc etc My pension contributions across the year were around 9.8% and employer contribution was about 20% - this has gone up now I believe as you say to 23% but you can't really use these figures to calculate our hourly rate as its disingenuous and our pension is complex. It's a defined benefit scheme based on our base salary. It's complex to calculate. Me being trained on the job is broadly speaking inaccurate. As a newly qualified dr, on trauma and orthopedics we see our patients post op on our own, make our own management plans and carry out the jobs. If I finish my ward jobs earlier, then I can go to theatres to help out and it's then where i am learning on the job so to speak and getting "trained". A lot, if not most of NHS doctor work is pure service provision where you are not shadowing a senior and are left to do the job. If you need some help you can reach out to a senior for advice. Furthermore, on any out of hours shift, on T&O, I am the sole doctor looking after 2 wards of 50 patients. When I was on gastroenterology, I was the sole doctor looking after 270+ patients across 9 wards - half the hospital. So I would be the first person to be called in case of emergencies, access the patient and start life saving treatment if necessary, alone. Again, i reiterate, I did have one senior (who was still a junior doctor) who was managing all the wards who I could reach out for guidance and support if I felt necessary. This is what people refer to when they say we are supervised in what we do. We are absolutely not supervised. Help is there if I ask and deem it necessary. Moreover, why do you think it takes 5 years to become an orthopedic surgeon in the US but 10 years post med school in the UK, it's because most of the time we are not "training" or learning. We are carrying out NHS service provision.

Just to be clear, before I respond, this is not done out of hate for you or anyone in your profession. Junior Doctors, keep striking due to pay and I have taken an interest as a tax payer. This is my opinion. Although you mention the pension and, like any young person would probably like the cash now as all young people generally do, including myself when I was your age. You will be glad of it when you are 55 and after a successful career you will have plenty to retire on if you wish to do so at that age. This is part of your salary package and cannot be ignored just because you don’t get it yet. A professional in the private sector when looking for a job will look at the package, salary, days holiday, benefits etc and will decide on whether to take the job based on these things. I expect you knew the package prior to joining the profession. ‘Yes the starting salary isn’t great but the incremental pay is very good and the pension is phenomenal, also could be a pain but the potential to earn more than the ‘standard salary’ is there but will require some work during unsociable hours’ These terms and conditions could be considered bad, but in my experience, in most professional jobs your salary is your salary and rely once a year on a review to increase this amount with no flexibility. If the company you work for says they have had a bad year, that is it for the next 12 months. This can happen even if you do 10 hours unpaid overtime weekly to try and further your career. I say this because many companies do not pay overtime but expect you to get your work done regardless of the additional free hours you put in. You compared your additional pay to that of a warehouse worker, you have suggested before like for like comparisons. If you are a professional, computer scientist, actuary and you have just started out on your career and want to get on, the majority of these professionals start early, stay late for no overtime or additional pay. It is expected that these ‘high achievers’ do this to get on. Overtime really isn’t common place for these sort of people, and these sort of people don’t expect it. They believe their hard work, ‘free time’ given to the company will be rewarded with pay rises and promotions over time. You mentioned training, I realise that training isn’t full time but gaining knowledge through much more experienced people than yourself is, in my experience the best training you can get. Nobody with a degree/ masters or phd gets employed and are expected to know everything, they all get ‘on the job training’ but are expected to work alone a majority of the time. My point is you get trained as part of your package. In five years when you are far more knowledgeable than now, a lot of that knowledge will be down to the experienced colleagues who ‘trained’ you on the job. Therefore, in my opinion… An actual salary of £37,000 for 44 hours work. Additional £7,500 paid into your pension for the year. Option to increase your salary monthly if you do more unsociable hours. 27 days annual leave a year. Good yearly incremental pay and regular promotion guaranteed with hard work. On the job continual training. …Is a very good package. Increasing this by 30% increases the starting package to over £48,000 with a pension of over £11,000. Which I believe is too much. I think it is very disingenuous for ‘junior doctors’ to claim they are only on £14 an hour and strike based on this. Especially when only 11% of junior doctors are in their first year of work the other 89% are on more, and in many cases, a lot more than the above. In comparison (cannot be disputed as it is a close family member). 3 years Law degree Employed at a law firm (22k a year) while studying the LPC over 2 years at a personal cost of £13,000. Contracted to work minimum 40hr per week with a clause stating ‘you must do as many hours as necessary’. Lectures every weekend for 2 years, required work 22 hours per week on the 2 year course. That’s a minimum of 62 hours a week. Once all exams passed, a further 18 months on a training contract (if you are lucky/good enough to get one) on 26k a year. 22 days holiday a year. Company pension conts. 4% providing you pay 3%. Six and a half years, fully qualified, expect salary of 35k outside of London. Believe it or not qualified solicitors generally have to work long hours with no overtime, that’s what comparable professions do. Your friends, at your age, who are on double your salary, 74k are the exception not the rule. Also, just to answer another one of your points, and I can send you links if you like, from accounts of consultants from the 70s and 80s. Doctors regularly work 90 to 110 hrs per week and had to sleep on the job. Restorations is also not a thing, in my opinion, if most professionals who have worked for the last 15 years looked at their pay rises and compared these to inflation we would all be owed 30%. It’s not a race to the bottom, but it is pie in the sky to believe that everyone should get this which you obviously do as this is the argument you use when your profession is compared to something comparable. If you believe it is only you who should get it, then I disagree completely based on all the above.

It's facts😂

yh its so sad - it's gone up now after the strikes to 15.5 an hour for my rank

Excellent basic hourly rate of pay for a first year medical graduate trainee fresh out of whatever passes for “university” these days taking their first tentative steps to learn the trade under strict supervision.

hahaha not even worth my time arguing with you you're too lost my guy@@taffyterrier

@@taffyterrier just because you didn’t get into medicine doesn’t mean you should cry this much

@@SA-zb2rm Anyone of average intelligence can get into medical school in dumbed down Britain.

It's sad😭

The NHS cannot afford these inflated doctors salaries.

@@taffyterrier that’s why the cost of the strikes has surpassed the cost of pay restoration right???

@@DoctorDevify It is a pay rise - not pay restoration. No one has the right to have their pay linked to inflation at any time, let alone during an economic downturn or period of austerity. The ongoing costs of any “pay restoration” would exceed the cost of the strikes.

@@taffyterrier did you know that in Australia, doctors pay is linked to inflation so goes up at least as much as inflation and more. Did you know that UK MPs have always had a pay rise more than or in line with inflation?

Sack the striking doctors.

@@taffyterrier Agreed!

Yesss let’s do that!!!! Fire all 98% of all junior docs and 86% of consultants!!! You two would make excellent PMs!

@@DoctorDevify Replace them with highly educated, properly trained, competent foreign doctors who don’t have the entitled attitude of their dumbed down British counterparts.

@@DoctorDevify Yeah we would

A little bit worrying that you don't realise everyone in the UK has a tax free allowance of £12570. FYI after my tax code was corrected, they refunded me the income tax automatically thus proving I should've have been charged it in that paycheck.

@@DoctorDevify expected a 'smart comment' having seen some of the others. I am fully aware of most tax rules and am still surprised by your quote 'the fact that I have been taxed on it is wrong, I should have paid zero tax.' This is nonsense, if this is your first pay check (this tax year) and,it is for tax period 5 (End of August) which it clearly is. Then as your annual salary is > £12570, Which it will be, even if you are only getting 8 payments until the end of the tax year. HMRC have calculated your tax based on your annual salary and will start to take it monthly from your first pay check. Yes, at the end of the tax year you may have paid slightly more than you should have as they based it on £29384. You may have only earned 8/12 of this amount if you get paid exactly the same every month. Then you would be eligible for a tax rebate. LOL, what do you think is going to happen at the start of the next tax year, do you think you will pay nothing for the first 5 months as you haven't earned you 12.5k allowance yet in that tax year. Then they will start taking it for the last 7 months?

@@DoctorDevify I am fully aware that the tax free allowance is £12570. You stated that you should have paid zero tax. I believe I am correct in saying that this payslip is for tax period 5 (End of August). That being the case, of course you you should have paid tax on your first pay check. HMRC calculates your tax on your annual salary, as this is > £12570, you will get taxed based on that salary. Admittedly, if you earn this exact amount for eight months of the current tax year and have earned zero for the first four months, then you will expect a rebate at the end of the tax year. What do you think will happen next tax year? Do you think for the first 5 months, while you get to your tax allowance, there will be zero tax taken and then they will start taking it only for the last seven months?

@mickkelly8153 so HMRC refunded me income tax that I paid and I started paying it in month 5 because I had crossed that threshold. Not once did I say every year this will be the case. I referred to this paycheck alone

@@DoctorDevify ah, that's clear now. So you got all your your £272.80 back for August, didn't pay any tax in Sept, Oct and November and in the 5th month, December you started paying tax i.e. £560 each month until March to 'catch up'.

40 on this rotation but will become 48 hours in december onwards

@@DoctorDevify48 hours is a lot. Don’t know why the NHS don’t pay doctors (especially junior) more. There’s many other jobs (even part time ones too) which pay more than that. Are you going to get a part time job? It’ll be hard to do when you work 48 hours/week.

Yeah it's tough. I spend any spare time I have working on my KZfaq channel and its associated work and the gym so don't really have time for much else @@McFlashh

@@McFlashh Junior doctors used to work over 100 hours a week before Blair slashed them.

@@taffyterrier cry more Cry me a river

45% of the doctors in the hospital are "junior" docs

Says the guy with no debt and no work ethic for 6 years of medical school

@@SA-zb2rm Presumably junior doctors researched the projected cost of their tuition over the 5 year course before applying and realised the future financial rewards made it a good investment.

Not really a good investment Lool . Doctors are some of the most educated people in the world. If they went private or did another career path they could make x2-3 as much at a much earlier age

@@taffyterrier do you even hear yourself? You sound single and never touched by a woman

lool man's gonna have to start a part time job soon

Thank you