Zan listens so attentively to Jordan so much so that his eyes shine like a proud brother/father

Consistency in producing these amazing podcasts is key to achieving viral success!

Amazing collaboration discussion. Thank you both good Sirs

So this just happened. I have a website that lists every science-fiction film ever. I built it on my own, mostly for my own use. I'm still working on it. Right now, I'm adding a poster for each film. At the very second you mentioned Journey to the Center of the Earth, the page for that movie loaded up. I was reading the title at the moment you were saying it. I feel, among many things, a quiet sense of awe.

These discussions leave me speechless. Very profound and fresh in a world full of recycled topics and viewpoints. Thank you gentlemen for taking your time to create this stellar content🙏

Excelent conversation and so necessary, as an an antidote to the mainstream narrative. I've had some incredible experiences and deep connection on dates with women- and also much improved relationships with fellow men- since attending a TFM workshop in Bucharest and later going on to find a mentor in my hometown London- a very masculine man who knows his own darkness, has lived an intense life and just 'gets it'. I agree with Jordan that facing our own darkness is damn scary and it needs to be prepared for and to 'be held', so to speak. For me, a phrase that has really helped is 'the shit that goes on in my head is worth its weight in gold when I speak it out' and stating my truth and intentions, however risky, from a place of awareness and caring, has paid off no end. Thanks both for all the top notch content

I missed you guys, Happy New Year🎉

There's a quote from a guy named Geoff Lawton I've always loved, "All the world's problems can be solved in the garden". This I believe is true on so many levels in ones life.

This was an absolutely brilliant conversation. You guys have hit on the pulse of what's going on with young men in the west. Thank you!

Thank you .

One thing I’ve always found interesting as a young man is looking at my holiday pictures. Whenever I leave London for an extended holiday to a beach country (at least 1 month), I always come back looking fitter, tanner healthier, better looking and so forth. It think is the fact that I am always walking around, exploring, swimming instead of sitting at a chair studying/working. Just a thought.

That was a great podcast. Jordan, I was wondering if you could put together a list of films that cover some of these topics. You mentioned a bunch of names but I didn't catch them, including the one by the feminist filmmaker (the #1 movie of all time).

1:17:39 Great point Jordan

This was helpful, thank you! You guys are so fucking smart!!!

That sounds like an interesting story the one that Apocalypse now is based on. I feel I relate to it aswell. I let go years ago and dove in on a journey to pierce the veil of Isis so to speak. In a way I did go crazy. Though I feel I have come out the other side in tact and quite content with what I discovered. Maybe one day we'll talk about it since I do believe people should be aware very much like the message that you guys are sharing. However I'm pretty broken atm. It's hard to explain depression but I'm proper done with it. I can't keep going on like this it's followed me around for most my life and ruined so many relationships and friendships.

Hey guys. I remember purchasing Zan’s DVD material from his site over 10 years ago. It appears to no longer be there. I was hoping to purchase it again. Did you guys remove it ? Regards

Zan, anyone who has no pessimism _at all_ about men’s future cannot be taken seriously, in my opinion. You say that men need hope, and I agree. But anyone caught selling false hope will, eventually, go the way of the PUA “community” - men were rightfully angry at the cheerful lies they’d been sold. If you want men to respect your hopeful stance in life, then it is up to you to demonstrate that your optimism is based on something more solid than your own personal emotional effervescence. After all, previous iterations of the “men’s movement” were highly optimistic: it was just a matter of men getting back to basics, they told us, and right order would be restored in the universe. They failed to take into account the fact that the destruction of manhood was being undertaken deliberately and systematically, e.g. through the infiltration of all major social institutions by people whose _explicitly declared aims_ include the destruction of the family, the dismantling of all forms of male power, and the punishment of men, collectively, for their supposed historical sins of oppression. There is no conspiracy “theory” here (and I’m not saying women are the enemy, either). As a result of the failure of earlier forms of the men’s movement to grapple seriously with the reality of the social forces confronting them, the situation for men has steadily worsened, across the board - with results that are physically measurable, if one takes the decline in testosterone seriously (or increased suicide rates, unemployment, failure in education, and so on). As an artist, I sympathise with much of what you say about Beauty, and it makes natural sense to allow my life to be guided by that shining star. And of course, I would very much like to believe that “Beauty will save us all”. But for that very reason, I believe that some measure of skepticism is warranted. History is littered with the consequences of attractive ideas which proved catastrophically incorrect. Attractive ideas must be tested and vetted before one commits to them - just like women. ;) What I want to know is this: is there a viable philosophy of life underlying your optimism - one capable of reckoning with all the realities that men face nowadays? Or are your rose-coloured glasses are blinding you to the progressive butchering of masculinity that is happening all around you? The fact that young men are telling you that they can’t feel their own virility, are not motivated to go out and explore the world, and are barely even drawn to young women on a visceral level anymore, should elicit more than a chuckle and some puzzled head-scratching, I think. Will Beauty really save them? If so, how? I hope you will see that this comment is not intended as a personal attack, nor as a rejection of your philosophy. Both you and Jordan appear to have good intentions, your hearts seem to be in the right place, and quite frankly, I like your romantic attitude to life. That’s precisely why I’m challenging you to show that your optimism is rooted in something more substantial than a wilfully blind faith in the hearts of men, or bubbly frissons of delight skimmed off the intoxicating liquor of female beauty. The road to hell is paved with good intentions and signposted with pithy slogans, and I have no desire to join a group of romantic lemmings on that road, bumbling cheerfully off a cliff into the lake of fire, eyes fixed on an alabaster vision in the sky. I’m not suggesting that the best approach would be to engage in the kind of acrimonious sociopolitical debate that we see everywhere nowadays; that would most likely be counterproductive. It’s pretty obvious to any honest observer that the culture wars are not making life better for anyone. Focusing on the negative is a powerful way to motivate people, but it seldom produces positive results. And zero-sum games are _never_ viable when the “opposing sides” are inherently interdependent (as is the case with men and women, or humans in society, more generally). Rather, I think you’re onto something with your emphasis on beauty, aliveness, virility and authentic engagement with life. One of the major strengths of this approach is that it orients our attention toward that which should be embraced, rather than toward that which should be rejected. There is a great need in the world right now for more optimistic forms of activism, which motivate us through inspiration and love, rather than through hostility towards shared enemies. A great many obstacles in our path simply disappear when we make "the good" our primary focus. That said, it seems clear to me that for your movement to have any realistic chance of success, it must grapple honestly with the difficulties of men’s current predicament, rather than simply using sarcastic humour to deflect attention from negative facts about the world which you’d prefer not to acknowledge. Without that kind of sincere engagement, I expect that the gifts of wisdom that you are attempting to pass on to other men will - in spite of your best intentions - amount to little more than perfumed snake oil. And I’m assuming you’d agree with me that men deserve better than that. I want to leave you with this thought: surely it is possible to focus on Beauty and “move towards the Light”, without dismissing the truth of men’s suffering or foolishly ignoring the darkness (as the earlier men’s movement did)? Aggressive political activism may not be the way to go, but if you can connect the dots and build a bridge between your vital optimism and the grim realities that men are now facing, it is likely that you will strike a chord with a far wider audience of men than simply “the chosen ones”. Your philosophy is attractive, but that won’t be enough unless it is also sincerely compassionate - that is, it must be attuned to men’s suffering while simultaneously pointing the way out of that suffering. To put it differently: if, and only if, your encouragement to positivity is able to include a realistic understanding of the negative forces currently affecting men, will you be able to make a coherent and compelling claim that Beauty is the antidote to that which is poisoning them. This understanding or reckoning need not even be explicitly stated, but it must be present at a foundational level in any philosophical structure you attempt to build; otherwise, that structure will inevitably crumble when it collides with the realities of the modern world. Thanks again for asking these questions about masculinity and attempting to seek viable answers. All the best for your upcoming book and for the future of this podcast.

Thank you for a great conversation gentlemen 🙏🏼

Are there any online meetings or conventions that are held with the group anymore? Would love to come with a friend

Our testosterone has also dropped due to improper nutrition stemming from nutritional ignorance and a turning away from natural animal foods containing saturated fat that increases the cholesterol from which testosterone is made.

it's all about connecting with your sexual energy with love. it all takes place with the breath

To add, I'm definitely a man that needs the feminine as a muse to stay motivated and to get up and work each day (a big source of creative inspiration for me and turn on is a large part of that). A true appreciator of women. However if I hadn't made the harder, sobering decision to focus on my career and prioritise that over women, I might have gotten lost, used, abused and left by the wayside. If I hadn't set those boundaries early on, who knows where that would have landed me.

Zan, I invite you to Istanbul. If you can come, I would like you to be my guest.

Zan, I'm seeing you meeting with some of these near red pill, masculinity gurus, like the 21 summit- we both know it isn't a "strong masculine core" that gets women. If that were true, the drill sergeant from Full Metal Jacket would be every woman's wet dream- being light and playful (mischievous) and loving women... you taught me that man, and you were right. Red pill is a slippery slope to bitterness.

What is the book mentioned at 39:50?

Prolific philosopher Forrest Landry has stated that there are three instincts: social, survival and sexual. The social is more fundamental than the survival and/or the sexual instincts. Zan linked wisdom to the survival and sexual instinct. How is wisdom necessary to the social interaction of men?

Would love to hear a conversation between Zan and Uberboyo. I think that would be very interesting. You two are the only 2 in the "manosphere" that I find interesting anymore. Everyone else is too materialistic. Whether they talk about facial symmetry or artificial wombs and whatnot. All I can think of is Brave New World. And thats the more high brow content sadly. Thats what everyone is reducing relationships too. Nihilism and surface level Evo Psych, but I'm not on that train anymore. Uberboyo has some good material on Jung and Nietzsche which really taps into the virility thing. Unfortunately he is on this weird bend where he is doubling down on defending Andrew Tate which is a bit cringe, but maybe you could talk sense into him. Lol. I would also recommend Greta Aurora. She's critical of the me2 movement, and an anti-fem thats sex positive. A conversation between you two would be nice as well. Keep it up. The "manosphere" is definitely lacking in quality content, so this is refreshing. Cheers!

What's going on with Zan's voice or is he just using an Invisalign?

Men are not going their own way they're just sexually frustrated due to inaction, the proper tact and overall appreciation for women...

You guys should do the one chip challenge

so is he saying men have become weaker?

Discuss Andrew tate & the Russia-Ukraine war